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PS2, DS Real Console War Winners
Paradox writes in with a link to an MSNBC article that shouldn't be too surprising for anyone: the real winners of the console war are the DS and the PS2. Boasting numbers unmatchable by the johnny-come-lately next-gen consoles, the PS2 and Nintendo DS each sold about 1.5 Million units last December. Article author Kristin Kalning points out the reality: given the high quality of gaming in general nowadays, the low prices and rich libraries of these 'venerable' systems will see them in circulation for some time to come. Given the success of last-gen consoles, what are your plans regarding gaming systems? Are you holding out for price drops, or considering buying one of the older systems now that they're considerably less expensive?
That's just painful!
my current console is a game cube. my console before that was a sega genesis (which i still play on occasion). i'm guessing my next console will be whatever is after the wii - or possibly whatever comes after that. by then my kids will be old enough that i'll probably be more motivated to 'keep up'.
It's hard to believe that's how Micronians are made. Why don't we see it right now by having you both kiss one another?
I'll admit that Halo 2 sucked me in for way too long, to the exclusion of other titles. But now there's so many original XBox games turning up in the used market I've more than doubled my game library on the cheap! Keep up those trade-ins next-geners, those of us who don't ride the bleeding edge are still getting plenty of use out of these games. :)
-- I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist. It's not my fault that life sucks so much. --
The DS is still going strong. There's enough titles from square-enix alone to make a fanboy salivate. This isn't surprising news as many people are content with the previous generation of systems and titles available for it. I know plenty of games from the last generation that i haven't even gotten around to playing yet.
You constantly struggle for self improvement - and it shows.
Hooray for bad Engrish on fortune cookies
We already got a Wii (which is a very cool system) and I'll likely get a 360 this coming Christmas when they cut the price and bundle it with Halo 3. I didn't like the PS2 and have even less interest in the PS3.
If brevity is the soul of wit, then how does one explain Twitter?
Yeah, the PS2 sold so many because it has serious reading issues with its discs. Of course everyone with a PS2 game library had to go out and buy a new one... or get a PS3.
Buckle your ROFL belt, we're in for some LOLs.
I'm not buying either of the two big expensive consoles this time around. If we eventually get Linux on the Xbox 360, then I'll buy one used a ways down the line. I'll probably be looking to buy a used PS3 by the time no one cares about them any more, which will be a generation or two away yet. I don't want to be depriving the market of a used PS3 and leading someone to buy a new one, because that supports Sony.
Basically choosing between Microsoft and Sony is like choosing between Democrats and Republicans. The lesser of prime evils. I'll go with Nintendo, the least of the three evils anyway :) But I won't do that until the price of the Wii drops. It's not that I can't afford one now, it's that I'd rather not spend that much money. Besides, could I even find one? I doubt it. But even if I could, I wouldn't be buying one now.
Absolutely the only thing that could get me to buy an Xbox 360 would be Linux running on it. That, or an included holiday in Hugh Hefner's life.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Past a certain point, though, graphics really don't matter. Sure, the N64 was grainy and the Gamecube is easier to see (and thus play). Now that we have the current level of graphics, scaling more and more textures and pixels until you can see the warts on the orc's nose is foolhardy and wasteful. I'd like to see more attention paid to AI and gameplay elements in the future.
I used to carry a bottle of whiskey for snake bite. And two snakes. -Nefarious Wheel
This is a shocker, inexpensive systems with lots of reasonable quality games released for them outsell expensive systems with no games ...
In general, the number of people who are willing to spend more than $200 on a gaming system is small and the number of people who are willing to spend that much money without (at least) a handful of games they want being readily available is tiny. The PS2 is still attractive to people because you can (essentially) spend $100 on the system, and $20 per game, and have access to more entertainment then you could on your $400 XBox 360 or $500/$600 PS3.
The DS isn't a home console and the PS1 outsold the PS2 when it first came out.
I'm not sure the point the article is trying to make... new console adoption is always slow going despite launch day sales numbers... the NES outsold the SNES for a while, the SNES outsold the N64 and PS1 for a while, the PS1 outsold the PS2 for a while, and **SHOCK*** the PS2 is outselling it's replacements... say it aint so!
The DS IS a next gen hand held... it's outselling it's last gen counterpart the GBA... but it's also not a recently released console... when it was it was being outsold by it's cheaper last gen cousin. Even still the DS while a game machine is a completely different market then home consoles. That's like being surprised that the iPod is outselling BluRay players... no really?
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Why do people care so much about having Linux installed on their console? Does it make or break your decision that much? It should be the selection of games and the price point that matters.
Personally, I'm outright shocked that it's February and it's still incredibly difficult to get a Wii. With Nintendo's sizable shipments of the console, I would have thought that they would have been available from day one. Instead, demand seems to be increasing before Nintendo has a chance to catch up with the current demand. It's scary to think what will happen when Nintendo actually starts advertising this thing.
BTW, if you do plan on getting a Wii, I highly recommend shopping the Gamecube deals now. There have been a lot of great clearance sales of both used and new games for the system. One of these days, however, retailers are going to figure out that demand for the old GCN stuff isn't tappering off with the sales of the Wii. So start stocking up while you can still get the games for under $10.
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
I can't use news and weather, I don't have broadband internet nor am I using ICS to let my Wii talk to the world.
In fact I tried to finally get broadband from hughes satellite, but their credit check system is very stupid and it said there was "not enough information" to grant my lady credit, even though her score is excellent. I may cry. Dialup is just, well, it's NOT OK. NOT OK AT ALL.
Anyway I don't think we'll ever see Linux, and the price drop will be a long time coming since they're already producing more consoles than anyone else and still can't keep up with demand. So you're quite right. But I'm willing to wait. I don't need a Wii.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I bought a DS:Lite in September for my wife and a Wii at launch for the two of us. I was never really interested in the PS2 since I had a Cube and PC to keep me occupied. I may look at the PS2 now that it is priced to sell and there are an abundance of cheap titles. I'll probably hold off though since the DS is really coming into its prime with games like Phoenix Wright and Hotel Dusk.
The original plan was to pick up a Wii for Christmas and get a 360 whenever the price dropped. Since we still can't find a Wii, we ended up getting a 360 on sale. The 360 has a decent library of games and has the added bonus of acting as a Media Center Extender so that we can stream video from our computers. We're probably going to skip HD-DVD/Blu-Ray entirely. The upscaling DVD player is quite as good, but it should be good enough to last until digital delivery becomes a compelling alternative.
...were purchased by exasperated grandparents who gave up trying to find a PS3?
You, sir, are not the target audience for this article, or this technology generation.
I always wait for a price break on the video game equipment. Hell, any electronics for that matter. Early adoption is both expensive and often a bit of a gamble. Might as well wait a year or two and get more for your money.
No sig for you. YOU GET NO SIG!
can I toot my own horn (I don't do it often). I predicted this.
http://games.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=213180&
PS2 is cheap, the games are cheaper. The games still lookspretty good. Did I mention its cheap and fun.
The new systems are pretty much a rehash of the old, with better graphics. (excepting the wii)
The Wii isn't worth the money if you game seriously at all. $5 per virtual console game? I can download and emulate them for free...
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
With that said, it's silly to say that the PS2's continued success can be attributed to this to any significant degree. Price and quantity factors of both hardware and software would surely be a stronger conclusion.
Graphics may not matter to you, but would the average consumer say the same thing?
Certainly as far as I am concerned the PS3 and probably the 360 are "next gen" as they leverage technologies that aren't in the average home yet (eg HDTV). I think this is why the Wii will do well, at least in the short term. There is little point in paying so much for a PS3 or 360 when you don't have a TV to support them, While such TVs are still in "early adopter" style price ranges and still undergoing rapid improvement I think that considering them "next gen" is reasonable.
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You are absolutely correct. People have managed to get linux running on the original Xbox and it does so much more than Microsoft ever intended it for. Xbox Media Center (XBMC) is by far one of the best applications I've seen run on any console, EVER. If I had to choose between all the consoles, I'd pick the original xbox just because of it. Not only can you play any (and I mean ANY) media, there's so much homebrew that you can play any original NES os SNES or Sega or ... (the list is too long) game.
Let's also not forget what has been done as far as homebrew is concerned in regards to the PSP, and even the PS2.
Programmers want complete control of their own devices. Not what's being force fed by some big corporation.
Part of the data is problematic as the Wii is still selling very strongly. Months after launch and while PS3s are starting to pile up and reach the level where you can just go into a store and buy one, the Wii is still a mixture of luck and/or staking out the store.
Given this information many people are waiting for a price drop on the PS3 and some good games to come out (I know I have an interest in it, but it's definitely a secondary console to me and the price will have to come waaay down), but most people with an interest in a Wii simply haven't been able to buy one yet making sales figures largely meaningless at this point in time. A better idea would be to chart the number produced along with the number sold-through to consumers and fill in the intermedian space. Graphing this since release date would begin to show which system is holding up in available sales.
That game is the biggest crossover game since the original super mario bros.
And the DS - well, it's just awesome.
In other words, demand is constant and the supplier can sell every single unit shipped at maximum efficiency. In fact, even with more factories every day, demand is still high.
... um ... not good.
Hmmm. Sure sounds like winning to me - especially if you track the game units sold - most Wii console buyers are buying a lot of games for their consoles, and continuing to do so, whereas the demand for PS3 games is
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
I thought the same thing, but there's one thing that makes VC much better than emulation: multiplayer games.
you can't (easily) get four people around a PC playing mario kart or whatever. And if you do, it's just not as good as having them sitting around the couch yelling and having some room. For most single player games it's probably no better than emulation, but for multiplayer the VC can't be beat.
being vague is almost as cool as doing that other thing...
Both the DS and PS2 sold great but how much profit does Nintendo and Sony make from each sold?
The PS2 is probably old enough technology that it's very cheap to make nowadays. DS came out later but Nintendo is known for making a profit right out of the gate on units. It'd be interesting to hear the actual numbers.
Lucked into a Wii on Dec. 28 (thank you EB employee who sent me to Wal-Mart - I know, I don't beleive it either).
Anyways - this is the first console I've owned since my Intellivision. I bought Excite Truck, Rayman and Zelda to start. The next game I get is going to be WiiPlay and SSX Blur.
All in all, the options are still pretty slim for the Wii.
So why should we be surprised when people choose to put their $300 towards a console, extra controller and two handfuls of "previously loved" games or $20 bestsellers?
Yes, but also the problem in asking "Why haven't you bought a next-gen system?" isn't a valid question yet. Sure people want to say that last-gen systems are the real winners here, but until everyone who wants a Wii can get one, the lack of supply is a valid impediment to learning anything from the question. One which really wants to hear: "The PS3 is unreasonably expensive/has no good games." or "Microsoft sucks and it'll be a cold day in hell before I give them any cash for that damn 360 (even if it finally has managed to secure some decent games, unlike the original which was mainly a place for PC ports, among which Halo was a notable example of a PC game that was only good enough for console gamers ;) ).
Much like the PS2, I'll wait a year or two for prices to drop. By that time, it should also have a decent catalog of games. ;-)
I just must ask: are you a sub-30 something self-important twerp?
I got a GameCube last Christmas (I'd been coasting on my SNES for a decade). This year I got a DS (used red one, not a Lite). I'm currently thinking PS2 next year, Wii in 2008. Although I don't know if I can wait that long for a Wii... But it would be so unlike me to pay more than $100 for a console. I'm torn.
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What do you mean by HDTV? I'm buying a 23" Samsung this year (most likely), and it's certainly not in the "early adopter" price range (700 euros / 900 dollars). HDTVs are not expensive.
Someone working 40 hour weeks at $8 an hour makes $1280 in a month. $900 is very expensive to that person, and $8 is higher than minimum wage in a very large number of states.
It is important to remember that expensive is a relative term, applied either to other items in the same category or to the availible funds of a potential consumer. I believe the latter is more important to the adoption rate of HDTV than the former.
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I've played the Wii a bit, and while I did find it to be very entertaining I can't say the games are any more enjoyable than anything else I've played. I've had at least as much fun gaming with friends on the Gamecube. So ultimately, while I could appreciate the unique control scheme I don't think it was compelling enough for me to decide to spend the money on a Wii. I'd say a DS, which offers similar gameplay albeit with a different, but still unique control scheme provides more value for the dollar.
We've seen the thinking for a while that advanced graphics somehow translate to superior gameplay. But there's this expectation now that somehow a unique controller is somehow going to spur new unheard levels of gameplay. Playing with the Wii I was already seeing limitations with the controller. What it does it does amazingly well and it does make for games that are undeniably fun. But the game has to be built around the controller. A regular controller still makes for a better general device. I'd say the functionality that will provide the most benefit will be the targeting feature, being able to point at something on the screen and not fiddle with an analog stick.
Being a PC gamer I've never spent money on a new console. What I have gotten was used, so my console experience has all come from gaming at a friend's house or more recently, via emulation. However, it has crossed my mind to go out and get a PS2. Although I tend to favor Nintendo for gaming, I'd get a PS2 over a Gamecube because of variety. And some of the most unique or compelling games out there haven't been released on Nintendo's console. Look at Katamari Damacy, Shadow of the Colossus, God of War, Okami, and Guitar Hero among others. And these are all recent games. The other console I'd seriously consider is the Nintendo DS. It already has a strong library, it's portable and being able to play other people online is great.
Even with the Wii's strong sales it's still far too early to tell who's going to win in this generation. But last generation consoles offer a massive library of proven games, they're inexpensive and by this point any reliability issues have long since been worked out. When looking at gameplay it quickly becomes apparent that the new consoles are all over-rated in their own ways.
You can save money, which is what I'm doing. I only get 650 euros a month ($840), and it'll take me about four or five months to save up. The TV I'm buying is in the lower end of the price spectrum, most people seem to go for at least 32".
Also, a $900 HDTV is no more expensive than a new display adapter or high-end CPU or some other expensive piece of computer equipment.
Why are you "most likely" buying it "this year" rather than buying it tomorrow? That sure sounds like a lot of money for a relatively small TV to me.
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