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Microsoft to Buy DoubleClick?

roscoetoon writes to tell us Bloomberg is reporting that Microsoft is in talks to buy DoubleClick. Seen as a move to compete against the Google advertising engine Double Click owners Hellman & Friedman are seeking a $2 billion payday. "The purchase would give Microsoft tools to battle Google Inc. for ads that appear on Web sites. DoubleClick works with advertisers to create online campaigns, such as streaming video clips to promote New Line Cinema's movie "The Number 23." The New York-based company's Dart technology monitors the performance of Internet ads for marketing companies."

195 comments

  1. Micosoft? by jamesl · · Score: 2, Informative

    Edit please.

    1. Re:Micosoft? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      No, it's correct. My company (named after me, Mico) is in talks to buy DoubleClick.

    2. Re:Micosoft? by Goaway · · Score: 3, Funny

      Slashdot "editors" do not "edit" submissions. This makes Slashdot "more real", according to CmdrTaco.

      http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=174297&thresho ld=0&commentsort=0&mode=thread&pid=14502339#145024 84

    3. Re:Micosoft? by 313373_bot · · Score: 4, Funny

      No, Mycosoft is better: from the greek mycos, for fungus, and soft, for software. Virus infections, DRM infections and now ad infections? It surely resembles a nasty case of mycosis.

      --
      ^[:q!
    4. Re:Micosoft? by sfled · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      That cracks me up. Someone please mod parent as funny.

      --
      I'm not really a web designer, I just play one on the Internet.
    5. Re:Micosoft? by Larry+Lightbulb · · Score: 1

      I thought you were in talks with DoobleClick.

    6. Re:Micosoft? by StikyPad · · Score: 1

      Maybe, but at least their dupes aren't usually word-for-word.

    7. Re:Micosoft? by Goaway · · Score: 2, Informative

      You expect me to actually put in any more effort than copypaste when telling people this?

    8. Re:Micosoft? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      MSFT would get another huge advantage from buying DCLK - their headquarters in NYC are in the Port Authority building. The very same building where GOOG just moved into with THEIR huge NYC headquarters. Industrial espoinage, anyone?? Woo!

    9. Re:Micosoft? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm half way through the comments and CmdrTaco's responses are driving me up a wall.

      I listened to the episode on FLOSS weekly (or flippin' yearly now) where they interviewed him, and I was thinking "ok, a billion posts, no time and wanting to go home is a serious recipe for errors". But no, he (they) actually _choose_ to "ignore" these errors!

      I'm not a native English speaker, but by god I know the difference between to/two and too, or there/they're/their, etc.

      If you think that incorrect spelling/grammar makes you look bad to native speakers, try non-native speakers.
      I personally think that any native English speaker who genuinely makes those mistakes should not .. should ... UGH!!!!

      I mean that's "probably" the "only" language you speak, your parents spoke it and you said nothing else since you were born. If you can't see the difference between those words nor know how to spell, I seriously suggest shooting yourself in the face ASAP.

      Back to CmdrTaco's postings.

      I refuse to read Digg because of the quality of the submissions over there. If slashdot maintains this attitude, it will turn into another Digg (if it hasn't already).

      Now before you flame me, I'm talking about stupid grammar mistakes (not typos), that basically underline the IQ of the poster/writer/whatever.

      And I'm not going to proof read this post because I'm halfway drunk, and if I don't post this right now I probably never will.

    10. Re:Micosoft? by th0ma5 · · Score: 1

      True story,

      Just yesterday I had a meeting with our Micro$oft Account Manager.

      He suggested we didn't shake his hand as had some kind of virus...

    11. Re:Micosoft? by Goaway · · Score: 0, Troll

      Here, have a phrase for future use:

      "I know English is only your first language, and I'm sure you'll do better on your next, but..."

  2. Valuations by Mateo_LeFou · · Score: 2, Funny

    Youtube = 1.6 billion
    DoubleClick = 2?

    Your thoughts?

    --
    My turnips listen for the soft cry of your love
    1. Re:Valuations by mpapet · · Score: 2, Informative

      If the two were in the exact same segments, this is kind of how acquisitions go. The first one goes relatively cheap and the price of acquisitions rise in a given segment while the last few acquisitions are astronomically priced.

      But they aren't the same sort of acquisitions so I think it's a coincidence.

      --
      http://www.maxineudall.com/2010/02/should-economists-be-sued-for-malpractice.html
    2. Re:Valuations by grub · · Score: 5, Insightful


      Youtube = 1.6 billion DoubleClick = 2? Your thoughts?

      My copies of AdBlock don't block YouTube.

      --
      Trolling is a art,
    3. Re:Valuations by yo_tuco · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "Your thoughts?"

      Is this the same doublclick that gets special treatment in my /etc/hosts file?

      $ sudo cat /etc/hosts |grep doubleclick
      127.0.0.1 www.doubleclick.com
      127.0.0.1 www2.doubleclick.com
      127.0.0.1 ww3.doubleclick.com
      127.0.0.1 www.doubleclick.net
      127.0.0.1 doubleclick.com
      127.0.0.1 ad.us..doubleclick.com ...

    4. Re:Valuations by cheater512 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Nor do my squid filter rules.

      I wonder if Doubleclick would get the prize for being the most blocked internet domain.

    5. Re:Valuations by 228e2 · · Score: 1

      why doesnt adding a site manually block it? It works on my servers . . . .

      --
      Since when does being a Socialist mean 'someone who has a different opinion than me'?
    6. Re:Valuations by geekoid · · Score: 1

      umm, I can think of 2 Billion prizes they may be getting!

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    7. Re:Valuations by flyingfsck · · Score: 1

      Oh, just put this in your hosts file:
      127.0.0.1 www.youtube.com

      There, fixed it for you.

      --
      Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
    8. Re:Valuations by grub · · Score: 1


      Most (all?) youtube videos don't source from "www.youtube.com". Best to use a squid proxy with an ACL.

      --
      Trolling is a art,
    9. Re:Valuations by dscruggs · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I know some folks that work at DoubleClick. The difference between it and YouTube is that DoubleClick actually makes money. I'm not sure it's worth $2 billion, but it's definitely profitable.

    10. Re:Valuations by wordsnyc · · Score: 1

      use flashblock and they'll never bother you.

      --
      Sent from the iPad I found in your car.
    11. Re:Valuations by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      sudo cat /etc/hosts |grep doubleclick

      Today's "worst use of cat" award. Don't know what's weirder, the fact that the cat|grep combo can be replaced with "grep doubleclick /etc/hosts" or the fact that your /etc/hosts contains so terrifying secrets that it can only be read by root =)

    12. Re:Valuations by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He's a Ubuntu linux nub, trained to use a wide open sudo for everything. Just smile and nod your head, and then run at the first opportunity.

    13. Re:Valuations by yo_tuco · · Score: 1

      Actually, that was OSX.

    14. Re:Valuations by yo_tuco · · Score: 1

      You're right. But it's a habit.

  3. Just one more reason for people to hate MS by 517714 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    DoubleClick is not accessible from any computer I use. I don't believe a change in its ownership will change that

    --
    The US government have made it clear that we have no inalienable rights; any we do not defend vigorously will be taken.
    1. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by krbvroc1 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Perhaps the next IE update will add a new 'feature' to detect if ads are blocked/domains are localhosted and deny access to the webpage?

    2. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by ReverendLoki · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I too have just about every Doubleclick server blocked on my browsers. I'm just hoping that they keep the Doubleclick functions separate from MS servers. Unfortunately, I have legitimate needs to visit MS sites, and it would be a pain if I had to go and start blocking various MS subdomains just to keep some of the more nefarious pop-ups at bay.

      --
      09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
    3. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by daeg · · Score: 4, Informative

      Which makes them a perfect advertiser in my books. They are easy to block. Their ad spaces on client websites generally collapse very neatly, too.

      That said, I wonder what Microsoft could bring to DoubleClick. I'd hate to see Microsoft add various "stealth" techniques that other advertisers use, e.g., frequently rotating hostnames, formats, etc.

      If customers are going to block your ads, at least make it easy. They're going to do it either way. The easier you make it, the more those people will remain on those websites, which at least brings you minimal value as an advertiser. When I worked in media, we typically gave clients two different sets of stats for this exact purpose. You don't disclose your traffic count based on your advertising banners/etc, instead you tell them your server stats traffic, which is always higher. Of course, you're selling impressions/clicks/referrals, so the advertiser doesn't actually care if the site users are blocking their ad as long as they get what they paid for. The website, of course, may or may not care, depending on who they are.

    4. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by Intron · · Score: 1

      Then it better learn to bypass the hosts file.

      --
      Intron: the portion of DNA which expresses nothing useful.
    5. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by Yurka · · Score: 2, Interesting

      This statement (about change of ownership not affecting accessibility) is clearly wrong for those people who use Windows. I am predicting a networking patch through WindowsUpdate soon after the deal is completed which, among other effects, suddenly makes the computer fail to acknowledge your "127.0.0.1 www.doubleclick.com" entry in hosts.

      --
      I can assure you, the best way to get rid of dragons is to have one of your own.
    6. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      but you're just a jerkoff so who cares what you do?

    7. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by krbvroc1 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      That is what I meant. If MS owns both the browser and the server, it could track whether pages visited also hit the real doubleclick servers and take 'appropriate' action. IE 7 already has 'Phishing' filter technology which sends your URL to a central server. Combine that technology with the doubleclick server and viola...

    8. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by rucs_hack · · Score: 1
      DoubleClick is not accessible from any computer I use. I don't believe a change in its ownership will change that

      This just in,
      • Microsoft announce plans to buy AddBlock!!!
    9. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by rbochan · · Score: 1

      Yeah, and will Microsoft's anti-spyware detect doubleclick?

      --
      ...Rob
      The American Dream isn't an SUV and a house in the suburbs; it's Don't Tread On Me.
    10. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by FLEB · · Score: 1

      I don't follow you as to the "value". If ads are blocked, there's not even an "impression" made. The goodwill and pulling in other unblocking viewers might bring in some new revenue, but I doubt that would counteract the server usage from the lost hits.

      --
      Information wants to be free.
      Entertainment wants to be paid.
      You just want to be cheap.
    11. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by rucs_hack · · Score: 1

      probably not, after all, it will become a 'valuable tool for the customer' or some such crap.

    12. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by AndroidCat · · Score: 1

      And the router.

      --
      One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
    13. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by AndroidCat · · Score: 1

      I'm sure that I turned that off completely, but thanks for the reminder to do a quick check with Tcpview. The next time I run IE7, that is.

      --
      One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
    14. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by daeg · · Score: 1

      It won't make up all the lost value, no. However, your site traffic can be a powerful bargaining chip, particularly in local markets, e.g., local television o local newspapers. While your paper may be selling the same 300,000 impressions for about the same cost as local competitors, you can use your higher server traffic as a "wow" factor. As in, "Wow, you guys get how many millions of hits a month? That's three times as many as the other paper...".

    15. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you are implying that a MS box will soon circumvent that, then this just in... I don't use Windows!

    16. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by Rick17JJ · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I use Mike's add blocking hosts files on my three computers that blocks advertising related communication with DoubleClick and other similar advertising related URL's. The modified hosts file takes the attempts to communicate with them and diverts them to the 127.0.0.1 loop back address on my computers. I use one of their modified hosts files on all three of my computers. One of the computers is a Windows 2000, another runs Windows XP and the third runs Ubuntu Linux. The modified hosts file trick works on all three computers and I update the modified hosts file regularly.

      Before doing that, I used to go directly to the DoubleClick webpage and choose the opt-out option from the DoubleClick website. That would let them know that I did not wish to be tracked by them and a special cookie would be downloaded that would stop them from tracking me on-line.

    17. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by flyingfsck · · Score: 1

      "I don't believe a change in its ownership will change that"

      Really? Just wait for the next Patch Tuesday... ;)

      --
      Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
    18. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by flyingfsck · · Score: 1

      What MS can bring? Three hundred million users that suddenly cannot block DoubleCluck no matter what they do.

      The added readership should raise the valuation of the company very nicely.

      --
      Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
    19. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by toddhunter · · Score: 2, Informative

      Then it better learn to bypass the hosts file. umm
      http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/04/16/13 51217&from=rss

    20. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by angulion · · Score: 1

      It already does for some domains (www.microsoft.com amongst them).

    21. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by StringBlade · · Score: 1

      I don't believe a change in its ownership will change that

      Sure it will! Now I've got two reasons to block those ads if I wasn't blocking them before.

      --
      ...and that's the way the cookie crumbles.
    22. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by Robocoastie · · Score: 1

      we've long known MSFT was a spyware company; now it's official.

    23. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by Miseph · · Score: 1

      "Combine that technology with the doubleclick server and viola..."

      I don't see what a mid-ranged string instrument has to do with anything...

      --
      Try not to take me more seriously than I take myself.
    24. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Never heard of this viola 2.0? Hehe, I meant voila.

    25. Re:Just one more reason for people to hate MS by FLEB · · Score: 1

      I see what you're saying, although that's only true as long as ad-blocking software doesn't become commonplace enough to taint server-hit numbers in common perception.

      --
      Information wants to be free.
      Entertainment wants to be paid.
      You just want to be cheap.
  4. Execellent! One less advertiser... by jhfry · · Score: 1

    once MS gets through with them!

    --
    Sometimes the best solution is to stop wasting time looking for an easy solution.
  5. Perfect match by Spazmania · · Score: 5, Funny

    The company that does bloated and hated software buys the company that does bloated and hated internet ads. Its a perfect match.

    --
    Moderating "-1, Disagree" is simple censorship. Have the guts to post your opinion.
    1. Re:Perfect match by rebootconrad · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I don't care what they do as long as they don't change the name... then I'd have to change all my doubleclick filters

  6. MS should know when to give up by EmbeddedJanitor · · Score: 4, Insightful
    MS have a very poor history of taking away market share from others, especially on a playing field that is stacked against them.

    Their roaring success: DOS + Windows was not achieved by taking away market share from others (ie. Apple etc), but by going into a new market. They used illegal means to get Office in place.

    Whenever they have tried to eat into an existing market where they cannot leverage Windows they have failed miserably: Zune, MSN, .... Their aquisitions are much the same: hotmail...

    Doubleclick is likely to end up on the junk pile too.

    --
    Engineering is the art of compromise.
    1. Re:MS should know when to give up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What about the Xbox? Who would've thought 10 years ago that a Microsoft-produced videogame console would someday be the console to beat? "Leveraging Windows" had very little to do with that success.

    2. Re:MS should know when to give up by dedazo · · Score: 1

      They used illegal means to get Office in place.

      They did? And what would those be?

      --
      Web2.0: I love when people Flickr my cuil and digg my boingboing until my google is reddit and I start to yahoo
    3. Re:MS should know when to give up by Tony+Hoyle · · Score: 1

      Whenever they have tried to eat into an existing market where they cannot leverage Windows they have failed miserably: Zune, MSN, ..xbox 360

      Oh wait.

    4. Re:MS should know when to give up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Undocumented API calls in Windows that Office uses not shared with competitors.
      Undocumented OS flaw workarounds used in Office and not shared with competitors.
      Subtle changes to the OS to make rival applications run slower and with less reliability.
      Lots of other stuff too. Here's a nice reference for you.

    5. Re:MS should know when to give up by RobertM1968 · · Score: 1

      Let's see... adding incompatibilities into the OS that affected WordPerfect and SmartSuite in the last few RCs or in the GA copies of various versions of Windows... and taken to court for it.

    6. Re:MS should know when to give up by Blahbooboo3 · · Score: 1

      MS have a very poor history of taking away market share from others, especially on a playing field that is stacked against them.
      [sarcasm] Yes, exactly! As illustrated by Microsoft never achieving the dominant browser after Netscape's early lead...[/sarcasm] oh wait...
    7. Re:MS should know when to give up by dedazo · · Score: 1

      incompatibilities into the OS that affected WordPerfect and SmartSuite

      Cite? And I don't mean Novell suing Microsoft for their inability to prop up a product that fell behind Word in the early 90s - I mean one of these "incompatibilities" or mythic "hidden APIs" that actually caused WP to stop working on a given version of Windows.

      --
      Web2.0: I love when people Flickr my cuil and digg my boingboing until my google is reddit and I start to yahoo
    8. Re:MS should know when to give up by RobertM1968 · · Score: 1

      DOJ against MS? How's that... read through the numerous depositions and you'll find tons of claims relating to previous complaints and previous actions.

    9. Re:MS should know when to give up by dedazo · · Score: 1
      No, what I mean is that in the past 15 years of hearing about these "intentional incompatibilities" and "hidden APIs" I've yet to see one that actually is meaningful enough to prevent a company like WordPerfect (or Corel or Novell or Adobe or Aldus or AutoDesk or CA or IBM or Oracle) to produce a working piece of software for Windows. It was the "hidden scheduler" or something like that in the Excel 3.x days, which was ridiculous. And the "settlement APIs" that were mostly useless shell-level wrappers. And so on.

      The DOJ case was based on Netscape's whining about how they were being victimized by Microsoft's bundling of IE into Windows, and about the Java VM problems, so I don't see how that fits in here?

      I keep hoping someone will show me some real proof instead of just FUD "well Microsoft did X and Y and so they're evil" claims without basis.

      --
      Web2.0: I love when people Flickr my cuil and digg my boingboing until my google is reddit and I start to yahoo
    10. Re:MS should know when to give up by clontzman · · Score: 2, Informative

      It's just a bunch of hoo-hah, dedazo. There's no magic APIs in Windows that magically make Word run better than WordPerfect or Excel run better than 1-2-3. It's just FUD that doesn't ever seem to die. I mean, seriously, do people believe that there are APIs in Windows that make Office run better than, say, SmartSuite? It's wishful thinking. If that was the case, MS would have crippled Adobe and Macromedia (yeah, yeah, they're the same company now) long ago so that Photoshop and Dreamweaver don't lead their very lucrative markets. MS had tried to unseat them many times and failed because -- get this -- their products haven't been as compelling.

      Office won because it had a coherent (and, at the time, new) concept: all of your office applications in a single box with a common and comprehensible brand and interface. They've always -- except for XP -- launched major new versions of Windows (95, 2000, Vista) with a new version, and they've kept adding functionality that makes their big business customer base happy.

      The whole "hidden API" thing is just kerfluffle. WordPerfect runs fine, as do any number of other third party office products. People just don't spend money on them.

    11. Re:MS should know when to give up by RobertM1968 · · Score: 1

      Oh... sorry, I misunderstood. The "hidden API" issue isnt I think so much hidden APIs, but undocumented ones that give MS an edge in developing software... an issue MS lost in the EU where they were required to make that information available. Compatibility issues... as an example I was a part of, when Win95 was in beta, the RC versions ran many pieces of software that then suddenly didnt run in the GA due to last second code changes (well over a few day period) in the GA. This gave many developers no time to revise their software - after being promised compatibility (how many times has MS touted, "the most compatible version, the most..."?) This definitely affected WordPerfect and SmartSuite to name 2. These same issues happened again with later Windows releases. The issues were documented in the DOJ case, and many experts couldnt find the reason for some of the code changes except to introduce incompatibility with other vendors' apps. And by DOJ case, I mean the antitrust case that got "essentially dropped" with the equivalent being the EU case that MS lost.

    12. Re:MS should know when to give up by dedazo · · Score: 1

      an issue MS lost in the EU where they were required to make that information available.

      Protocols != APIs. Not to mention the fact that it was RealNetworks that pushed for the EU to force Microsoft to remove WMP from Windows.

      This definitely affected WordPerfect and SmartSuite to name 2.

      OK, aside from the obvious problem here with whining about how Microsoft should not be allowed to change a beta, how did these changes not affect anyone else again?

      No, the problem is that like Microsoft and the internet, WordPerfect groked UI computing until it was too late. The first graphical versions of WP were a complete and utter unusable mess, which of course gave the advantage to Microsoft. WP was like Netscape, whining about how they could not compete with software that was substandard to say the least and no one wanted.

      The issues were documented in the DOJ case

      You mean they were used as non-sequiturs to prop up the idea that Netscape was the victim.

      --
      Web2.0: I love when people Flickr my cuil and digg my boingboing until my google is reddit and I start to yahoo
    13. Re:MS should know when to give up by Dan_Bercell · · Score: 1

      You fail to see reasons why they enter the market: To make money

      You dont have to be #1 in a market to make a decent buck. Sure each company tries to become #1 in each market they compete in, however just because you are not doesnt mean you are not making a difference (competition is very good for innovation) and money.

      Look at Linux and Apple desktops, they have a very low market share but they still make a decent buck for the companies that push their solutions.

    14. Re:MS should know when to give up by cyphercell · · Score: 1

      Oh wait what? The Xbox 360 leverages the PC market in offering compatible games and the ability to talk/play together whether you're on Xbox or PC. Most gamers simply consider a PC a DIY console and that's the market MS doesn't want to lose. Sony recognizes this and we have things like Java incorporated in Blue Ray and Playstation Linux operating systems. I think Nintendo recognized this years ago with the game cube and chose a different direction when MS entered the market.

      --
      Under the influence of Post-Cyberpunk Gonzo Journalism
    15. Re:MS should know when to give up by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      I mean, seriously, do people believe that there are APIs in Windows that make Office run better
      I do. Microsoft Office tends to have it's UIs written from scratch using things like undocumented NativeAPIs to improve speed performance.

      This way, even small things like even file->open dialogs are so much faster/better than what other applications have available to them.

      If that was the case, MS would have crippled Adobe and Macromedia (yeah, yeah, they're the same company now) long ago so that Photoshop and Dreamweaver don't lead their very lucrative markets.
      Heres one for you. I'm not impressed with the file->open/save dialogs, they seem slow etc.

      Perhaps it's not so important now, but I still get really irritated over these things.

      Office won because it had a coherent (and, at the time, new) concept: all of your office applications in a single box with a common and comprehensible brand and interface.
      Office barely ever uses win32 if it can, it's UIs are mostly written from scratch using alternative reimplementations. So now, I don't agree that it was a common interface, Office tends to even look and behave somewhat different from most normal win32 applications.
      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
    16. Re:MS should know when to give up by clontzman · · Score: 1

      Heres one for you. I'm not impressed with the file->open/save dialogs, they seem slow etc.

      Perhaps it's not so important now, but I still get really irritated over these things.


      I hear what you're saying, but are you honestly suggesting that people buy Office because of the speed of the Open/Save dialogs? There's nothing wrong with MS writing custom Open/Save dialogs for Office if there's functionality they want to add. Adobe does the same thing with Photoshop (though, oddly, they give you the option of using the MS or the Adobe dialog, which I think is kind of dumb).

      I just invoked the "Open..." dialog in Dreamweaver. It's the standard MS dialog and it took maybe half a second to load and populate.

      Office barely ever uses win32 if it can, it's UIs are mostly written from scratch using alternative reimplementations. So now, I don't agree that it was a common interface, Office tends to even look and behave somewhat different from most normal win32 applications.

      There's a big difference between saying that "MS custom-codes its UIs for its apps" and "MS codes its apps in a way that other apps can't replicate." The first is certainly true, though it's true of many applications. Roxio apps, for example, use very few native controls. The common controls are there for a baseline level of functionality. If you need something better, write it. Other people are doing it. There's no undocumented makeUIWorkFaster() function that's holding you back.

      To my last point, the original versions of Office were the first place that you could get a suite of related desktop business products that used a common installer and a similar (to each other) interface. SmartSuite and the WordPerfect Suite came much later and were much less integrated. I was an Ami Pro user at the time, but the Office package was really compelling and novel -- all of the applications worked together fairly seamlessly. Again, I think that has a lot more to do with the success of Office than any "hidden" functionality.

    17. Re:MS should know when to give up by Ilgaz · · Score: 1

      Here is a recent example. Go to news.yahoo.com with a Mac based browser and click "Apple Macintosh News", you see a completely rude, stupid "become giant when mouse touches and make 3/1 of page unreadable" flash ad.

      The ad? You would guess: MS Windows Vista!

      If these idiots will run Doubleclick too, God help them.

      (Wanted to take screenshot but either Yahoo removed the ad or my getting tortured by MS ad counter is finished)

    18. Re:MS should know when to give up by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      It's the standard MS dialog and it took maybe half a second to load and populate.
      That entirely depends on the hardware, state of the OS installation. I often encounter issues where I am waiting over a entire minute for the dialog to actually display content (usually on 2ghz proc systems with 512MB RAM -- even happens when there is no anti-virus software installed).

      There's a big difference between saying that "MS custom-codes its UIs for its apps" and "MS codes its apps in a way that other apps can't replicate."
      Microsoft are using undocumented features and undocumented APIs in these alternative UIs they are making. I know this just from looking at debugging outputs in Wine, notifying me whenever a NativeAPI is called.

      There's no undocumented makeUIWorkFaster() function that's holding you back.
      Not exactly. Writing a application that relies ontop of win32 functions that are more limited in functionality than their NativeAPI equivalents can cause a lot of mucking about to get around the lack of functionality additionally there is some execution cost for the extra layer of code to pass data through, you cannot deny that.
      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
    19. Re:MS should know when to give up by clontzman · · Score: 1

      That entirely depends on the hardware, state of the OS installation. I often encounter issues where I am waiting over a entire minute for the dialog to actually display content (usually on 2ghz proc systems with 512MB RAM -- even happens when there is no anti-virus software installed).

      This is not normal behavior. I've run XP in many different states on significantly lesser hardware, and dialogs that take an entire minute to open are indicative of something borked in the system (trying to access a dodgy network volume, maybe?). This is by no means typical behavior.

      Microsoft are using undocumented features and undocumented APIs in these alternative UIs they are making. I know this just from looking at debugging outputs in Wine, notifying me whenever a NativeAPI is called.

      I'm not denying that they may be doing so, but my point was that they're not doing anything that other application authors couldn't replicate. Dreamweaver uses common controls, Office 2007 uses custom -- they both present the "Open" dialog box in a comparable amount of time.

      Writing a application that relies ontop of win32 functions that are more limited in functionality than their NativeAPI equivalents can cause a lot of mucking about to get around the lack of functionality additionally there is some execution cost for the extra layer of code to pass data through, you cannot deny that.

      I think we're down to talking angels on the head of a pin here. There will be execution cost no matter what you're doing. Sure, it's easier to use the common controls -- that's why they're there. Sure, writing your own controls will be more complicated and potentially will have an execution cost. What I'm not convinced of is that any of it will actually be noticable to the user.

      Besides, the original point of this thread was whether "hidden APIs" were responsible for the success of Office and the failure of its competitors, which I think is patently false. It was an original concept that saved businesses a bunch of headaches and money (from buying individual apps and hoping they worked together), and I think that has a lot more to do with why Office took over the market.

    20. Re:MS should know when to give up by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      This is not normal behavior. I've run XP in many different states on significantly lesser hardware, and dialogs that take an entire minute to open are indicative of something borked in the system (trying to access a dodgy network volume, maybe?). This is by no means typical behavior.
      *Shrugs* Stopped using Windows as my main desktop over it.

      I'm not denying that they may be doing so, but my point was that they're not doing anything that other application authors couldn't replicate. Dreamweaver uses common controls, Office 2007 uses custom -- they both present the "Open" dialog box in a comparable amount of time.
      It was a example of how win32 itself was less than adequate and Microsoft doesn't even use it but they write their own from scratch with the help of NativeAPIs.

      There will be execution cost no matter what you're doing. Sure, it's easier to use the common controls -- that's why they're there. Sure, writing your own controls will be more complicated and potentially will have an execution cost. What I'm not convinced of is that any of it will actually be noticable to the user.
      With undocumented tricks like DUser, Direct UI being used by MSN messenger, IE and Microsoft Office, yes, I do think (and have seen) there are noticeable things for the user when compared against code that works on documented functionality.
      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
  7. follows the MS motto by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Do be evil.

    1. Re:follows the MS motto by jrockway · · Score: 2, Informative

      What exactly is evil about DoubleClick? If you don't want the cookie, you can either not visit sites that use DoubleClick, or you can opt out of the tracking cookie:

      http://www.doubleclick.com/us/about_doubleclick/pr ivacy/dart_adserving.asp

      DoubleClick is pretty darn non-evil, unless you hate advertising for some reason.

      --
      My other car is first.
    2. Re:follows the MS motto by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Cookies? Ads? The internet still has such things? Fancy that.

    3. Re:follows the MS motto by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I believe their motto is more along the lines of:
      "Be Evil! MwahahahaHAHAHAHAAAAA!!!"

    4. Re:follows the MS motto by geekoid · · Score: 1

      And how, exactly, are people supposed to know which sights have double click before they go there?
      http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=00/01/25/23 56236
      http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/03/28/12 46200
      http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=02/02/25/17 49232
      http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=02/08/27/12 21252

      They claime to ahve turned over a new leaf, but I doubt MS has.
      MS whose plan is to track you whenever you log into any system.
      Seriously, that's one of there plans. SO no mattter what computer you log into you, it will find you personal settings and files for you.
      Which, on one hand is cool, but on the other hand it is easily abused.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    5. Re:follows the MS motto by iminplaya · · Score: 1

      ...unless you hate advertising for some reason.

      Eats up too much bandwidth. Really nasty on dial-up. If you pay per byte or if your ISP has download limits before they charge extra, you're being robbed. I had to block them here because the main page wouldn't download before the ads, and sometimes the ad page wouldn't respond. There are plenty of reasons not to like ads, especially when they get obnoxious and interfere with what you're trying to do.

      --
      What?
    6. Re:follows the MS motto by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Please keep in mind that each of those articles is from 2001 and 2002...a lot has changed since then. DoubleClick has sold off their Abacus business, the e-mail business and seems to be more focused on the ad-serving and seach business.

  8. Good! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    KDE users won't have to pay royalties to Microsoft for launching applications on the desktop!

  9. Micosoft.com is under construction by Mateo_LeFou · · Score: 3, Funny

    "and coming soon"

    I can't wait!

    --
    My turnips listen for the soft cry of your love
  10. Feel free, MS... by mdm-adph · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...I've had doubleclick's servers blocked in my HOSTS file for ages now.

    --
    It is by my will alone my thoughts acquire motion; it is by the juice of the coffee bean that the thoughts acquire speed
    1. Re:Feel free, MS... by biocute · · Score: 1

      Maybe it's time then to find a way to secure your HOSTS file, for the next Windows Update might kindly remove any hostile addition to it.

    2. Re:Feel free, MS... by penix1 · · Score: 1

      I've had both doubleclick and google-syndication blocked in mine for some time as well. Sure speeds up my web browsing experience.

      --
      This is a sig. This is only a sig. Had this been an actual sig you would have been informed where to tune for more sigs.
    3. Re:Feel free, MS... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What do we need to add to our Hosts list?
      Please Lettuce
      Lettuce Know!

    4. Re:Feel free, MS... by Taelron · · Score: 3, Interesting

      lol I blocked Doubleclick at home and on everyone of my client sites ever since they came out...

      The only thing that concerns me is as someone else has said, they start rotating the hosts or even outright dropping "doubleclick" anywhere in the domain name so those filters no longer work.

      If the ads suddenly start coming from Microsoft.com servers suddenly trying to block them would cause issues getting updates and patches.

      I can see it now, the new Eula and Verification tool, in order to access MS Updates you must all access to our advertising service.

      Opps we see your system blocks Microsoft Advertisement, sending a message with your information to our legal department, contact your administrator to unblock our messages in order to receive your free critical updates.

      And then I'm sure that MS will try to sue people for blocking their advertisements just like they try to sue you for getting a computer without their software...

    5. Re:Feel free, MS... by CodeBuster · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yeah, but they keep changing their domains from ad1.doubleclick to ad2.doubleclick or some such combinations to try and stay one step ahead of the host file blockers. This would not get by a regular expression of course, but the windows hosts system does not support regular expression based filtering. Fortunately, AdBlock does support regular expression based filtering and it manages to keep double click out despite the games they try to play.

    6. Re:Feel free, MS... by AndroidCat · · Score: 2, Informative

      Get a cheap router, then throw all the DoubleClick domains into the "parental blocking" filter.

      --
      One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
    7. Re:Feel free, MS... by gertam · · Score: 1

      So now you can block all of microsofts servers too, because doubleclick will have access to all of them.

    8. Re:Feel free, MS... by iminplaya · · Score: 1

      Doubleclick will require access to your machine if you want to download updates, just like WGA.

      --
      What?
    9. Re:Feel free, MS... by flyingfsck · · Score: 2

      "...I've had doubleclick's servers blocked in my HOSTS file for ages now."

      Don't worry, next Patch Tuesday will restore your full internet experience for you...

      "Where do you want to click today?"

      --
      Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
    10. Re:Feel free, MS... by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

      Didn't I read somewhere how Vista will ignore the hosts file when it came to microsoft.com. I'm sure that will be changed to microsoft.com and doubleclick.microsoft.com or whatever they deem it to be. One more reason not to get Vista.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    11. Re:Feel free, MS... by harry666t · · Score: 1

      > lol I blocked Doubleclick at home
      > and on everyone of my client sites
      > ever since they came out...

      Lol I blocked Doubleclick BEFORE they came out :D

  11. Re:Execellent! One less advertiser... by Dark+Kenshin · · Score: 1

    Yeah, it helps to read TFA, I first thought the term was literal, but the company paints a different picture on the title.

    --
    "I only know 2 things: The love for me, and the fear of me."
  12. like google by mastershake_phd · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Will it be as repressive as google? Read their terms of service. There is a whole list of things you cant discuss on an adsence page. Guns and drugs to name two.

    1. Re:like google by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Help, help! I'm being repressed!

    2. Re:like google by Spazntwich · · Score: 1

      As much as you love to make fun of those "conservative bastards" who love guns, who besides them is going to come to your defense when your right to do anything you can think of makes it onto the controlling party's "bad list?"

    3. Re:like google by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes - but you'll be in the shit when they are the controlling party and you're on their bad list. It's very romantic to make out that these are the same liberty-loving people persecuted by the British in the 1700's, but they aren't.

    4. Re:like google by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hey now, I'm about as politically liberal as you get (anarcho-syndicalist) and I'm rather a fan of guns.

    5. Re:like google by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't have the right to do "anything I can think of." Thankfully, neither do the gun nuts.

  13. Me too. Plus a question by Mateo_LeFou · · Score: 1

    Wouldn't it be cool if a distro shipped an "ad-free" version of firefox, i.e. it comes with a hosts file of good repute and just asks you for root password to install it?

    I think that should be an installation option on the new generation (Cf. ubuntu) of desktop distros.

    --
    My turnips listen for the soft cry of your love
    1. Re:Me too. Plus a question by mdm-adph · · Score: 1

      The closest I've been able to come is by creating a "blacklist" in the NoScript extension, and by allowing all root-level JS to run by default.

      --
      It is by my will alone my thoughts acquire motion; it is by the juice of the coffee bean that the thoughts acquire speed
    2. Re:Me too. Plus a question by Handover+Phist · · Score: 1

      Because the moment someone asks me for the root password I stop doing business with them until i know them. Give it about two years or so.

      Then they'll get a restricted sudo if I like them...

  14. Just what we need by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    Oh boy, the Zune of internet advertising. I'm sure the Google people are really worried.

  15. did... by cosmocain · · Score: 0

    ...microsoft patent the use of commas and other punctuation marks - and i just didn't notice?
     
    duh.

  16. Just so long... by tverbeek · · Score: 5, Funny

    Just so long as they don't patent the double-click.

    --
    http://alternatives.rzero.com/
    1. Re:Just so long... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  17. Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by KingSkippus · · Score: 4, Informative

    If you use Firefox, snag Adblock Plus and the Filterset.G Updater. If you're using Internet Destr-- Er, I mean Internet Explorer, woe is you, but at least snag the Google Toolbar, which I think blocks DoubleClick ads.

    1. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Doctor+Memory · · Score: 5, Funny

      snag the Google Toolbar, which I think blocks DoubleClick ads If it doesn't now, it will after the acquisition!
      --
      Just junk food for thought...
    2. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by ZiZ · · Score: 3, Informative

      Or you could use the EasyList and EasyElement filter subscriptions with Adblock Plus - no extra extension needed, and they're simpler and easier to maintain (and, at least subjectively, faster) than the Filterset.G is. I was a huge fan of Filterset.G for a long time, but I've been even happier with Easy*.

      --
      This flies in the face of science.
    3. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting
      Yay, I finally get to tell my awesome Doubleclick story.

      To back up all the way to the beginning, a couple of years ago, I got a call from a recruiter about a job with a small local company that was writing some software that would allow people to track advertising campaigns. I interviewed, and felt rather ambivalent about them... they seemed like they were writing decent software, but I'm over the whole startup thing, and spending 80 hours in the office. They passed on me. At the time I was a little upset, even though I wasn't all that interested in them. As my neighbor put it, "It's like when the ugly girl doesn't want to dance with you."

      A while later, I saw some of the guys who interviewed me walking around the building I worked in. I checked the building directory, but the company wasn't on the list. So I hit their website, and lo and behold, they'd been bought by Doubleclick.

      Whew. Dodged a bullet. I mean, Doubleclick. Yikes. I'm past the point in my life where I can walk out of a job on principle without another job already lined up, and I'm still paranoid from the bust.

      So I tell the recruiter all this, and I don't really mince words about my opinion concerning Doubleclick.

      He submitted me anyway.

      I got a call a couple days later from someone. It was outside normal business hours, and I normally don't answer numbers I don't recognize during my off time, but a good friend of mine was expecting the birth of his son any day, so I answered just in case. I was in a guitar shop at the time, and couldn't hear too well, but they were talking about the opportunity at Doubleclick. I assumed it was another recruiter, so I went into my whole spiel about my history with the other company, how glad I wasn't working for them when they were acquired, and how distasteful I found Doubleclick.

      I guess there's really no suspense here. Naturally, the guy I was talking to was the hiring manager over at Doubleclick, and I had just unloaded on him. In fact, I do believe I mentioned being "glad I don't have that stain on my resume."

      I felt pretty horrible. It was an accident, and I'm sure the poor guy didn't want to work at Doubleclick any more than I did. But still... in retrospect, it was pretty funny.

      Even funnier was the fact that Doubleclick had an office in our building. When I told a coworker the story the following day, she pointed out that, undoubtedly, someone on the second floor was telling the exact same story :)

    4. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by yoyhed · · Score: 2, Informative

      Thanks for the tip, it was encouraging to hear that from someone who actually used Filterset.G.

      I've been using Filterset.G for a long time too, but I just switched to EasyList and EasyElement. This part of the Adblock Plus FAQ helped me make that decision (in summary, Filterset.G sometimes whitelists ads, and it uses complicated regexes that slow down browsing).

      --
      WHO NEEDS SHIFT WHEN YOU HAVE CAPSLOCK/ DAMN1
    5. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is hardly an awesome story. This is some idiot, that doesn't understand what Doubleclick does railing mindlessly on without a clue what he is talking about. Tell me what exactly Doubleclick does that is offensive to you? Serve up ads? Tell me how does Google get most of their money. Serving up ads.

    6. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by sconeu · · Score: 1

      If you're using Internet Destr-- Er, I mean Internet Explorer,

      You mean Insecure Exploder?

      --
      General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
    7. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by rainman_bc · · Score: 2, Informative

      If you use Firefox, snag Adblock Plus [mozilla.org] and the Filterset.G Updater [mozilla.org

      FYI, Adblock Plus advises against Filterset.G - they have their own sets of filters that work better.

      I still use it out of ignorance because it works just fine for me TYVM.

      --
      09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
    8. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by gertam · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Have you thought about the fact that Microsoft doesn't just get access to the doubleclick domains, but doubleclick gets access to the microsoft domains. You gonna block all them, go ahead. Not many companies will.

    9. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Technician · · Score: 2

      f you use Firefox, snag Adblock Plus and the Filterset.G Updater. If you're using Internet Destr-- Er, I mean Internet Explorer, woe is you, but at least snag the Google Toolbar, which I think blocks DoubleClick ads.

      Try one of the easy to get hosts files. Not only does it getting ads from doubleclick, it also prevents software on your machine from calling home from an app other than the browser. The hosts file is compatible Windows and Linux systems. Google toolbar works in the browser. A hosts file works for IM clients, P-P, email, etc all at once. If we knew the IP domain, we could even block Media Sentry from your KaZaA connections.

      --
      The truth shall set you free!
    10. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      Tell me what exactly Doubleclick does that is offensive to you?

      Three words: Punch. The. Monkey.

      When Google carries a flash ad campaign that obnoxious, I'll block them too.

    11. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by CodeBuster · · Score: 1

      Mod the parent up...this is a good point. If Microsoft starts serving all of the doubleclick ads from their domains then it will become more difficult to filter them, although AdBlock could probably still do it using regular expressions on the http elements in the pages, but they could always randomize those if they haven't already. This could be a very bad day for ad filtering admins and their users.

    12. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by matts-reign · · Score: 1

      I took their advice and used their filterset, but I find it just doesn't block as much crap as filterset.g, so I went back to that.

      --
      Waffles rock.
    13. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, no, no. Do not use Filterset.G Updater. From the Adblock Plus FAQ:

      Do I need to install Filterset.G Updater?

      No. Actually, it is recommended not to use Filterset.G with Adblock Plus. There are several reasons for this:

              * Filterset.G has been intentionally made incompatible with the built-in subscriptions feature in Adblock Plus, updating Filterset.G requires a separate extension which basically duplicates existing functionality.
              * Filterset.G is not optimized for use with Adblock Plus, it will slow down your browsing considerably more than any other filter list.
              * Filterset.G makes heavy use of very complicated regular expressions with the consequence that finding the source of problems is difficult and fixing those problems is even more so. In fact, Filterset.G is fixing most problems with exception rules which creates a problem on its own (see next point).
              * Filterset.G contains a considerable number of exception rules. This is a big problem because exception rules cannot be overridden. It happened on several occasions that exception rules from Filterset.G whitelisted actual ads making these ads unblockable -- something users usually blamed Adblock Plus for.

      While Filterset.G has had its uses in the past, nowadays other filter lists are certainly a better choice. If you already have Filterset.G Updater installed, you can uninstall the extension and remove the Filterset.G subscription in the Adblock Plus Preferences dialog. Feel free to choose any subscription from the list then.

    14. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      I have no problem at all blocking Microsoft domains too. Especially since I use Firefox on my Mac. In fact I'll do that now and see what if anything I miss...

    15. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by toddhunter · · Score: 1

      The hosts file in windows will *not* block certain micosoft sites. Guess how long before double click is added to that list?

    16. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by cyclomedia · · Score: 1

      >snag the Google Toolbar, which I think blocks DoubleClick ads

      Suddenly a thousand monopoly/competition lawyers start rubbing their hands in glee: MS IE allows by default Google's adSense scripts to run unhindered but Google's Toolbar blocks MS-DoublClick's scripts.

      --
      If you don't risk failure you don't risk success.
    17. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Jaseoldboss · · Score: 1

      Or, if your router has a content filter (like my Draytek) you can block it at that level too.

      Tip; block rad.msn.com and that gets rid of all those MSN Messenger ads without breaking the MSN license agreement like using the ad-free hacked version does.

    18. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you're using Internet Destr-- Er, I mean Internet Explorer, woe is you, but at least snag the Google Toolbar, which I think blocks DoubleClick ads.

      If you're downloading and installing stuff, why not just use Firefox as well and be done with it? The only reason anybody at all uses Internet Exploiter is because they're too stupid or lazy to download a better browser.

    19. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by KingSkippus · · Score: 1

      Sounds good, I'll give it a shot. Thanks for the tip!

    20. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Technician · · Score: 1

      The hosts file in windows will *not* block certain micosoft sites. Guess how long before double click is added to that list?

      Thanks for pointing out another application where linux users have full control of their PC instead of someone else.

      --
      The truth shall set you free!
    21. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Ilgaz · · Score: 1

      I have like 3 different sofware layers which enables me to block ads but I choose not to block them. If site is too stupid with ads and tries to show popups in 2007, I never visit that site again.

    22. Re:Seriously, who doesn't filter DoubleClick? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is hardly an awesome story. This is some idiot, that doesn't understand what Doubleclick does railing mindlessly on without a clue what he is talking about. Tell me what exactly Doubleclick does that is offensive to you? Serve up ads? Tell me how does Google get most of their money. Serving up ads.

      Whoah, man... are you the guy that called me? Sorry about slamming your company on the phone, dude. If it's any consolation, I did learn my lesson. Although I still try to be pretty honest, I edit myself to be much more polite about it now, just in case. :)

  18. Where did you go yesterday? by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Doubleclick is likely to end up on the junk pile too.
    Looks to me like Microsoft has just decided to stop asking, "Where do you want to go today?" and decided to buy the company that has already harvested the answer. They now have access to a huge database of cross-site cookies tracking where people have gone on the web.
    --
    Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
  19. What is Doubleclick? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yours faithfully,

    Joe (Firefox + AdBlock Plus) User.

  20. Nonsense by mccalli · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Windows wasn't a foregone conclusion - in the early days there was GEM, and during Windows' development there was also OS/2. Office didn't just materialise either, there was Lotus 1-2-3 and WordPerfect/WordStar/DBase III. Then there's Netscape - they killed Netscape-the-company completely by, despite the many myths, simply being better than Netscape v4.

    Tried to eat into an existing market with Hotmail? Hotmail was the market - it's all the others that are the followers here. Some did it better of course, but MS were not trying to take away market share from others. They were trying to prevent losing users to web-based interfaces which they did not own.

    Zune and MSN...yep, agreed. Doubleclick - different class. It's not an end-user product, and due to this I rather suspect they'll do well with it. MS do cater to developers and API users pretty well, and that's what you're talking about when it comes to an advert site. In the end it can only be good to have two vast firms competing for your site's space and offering you cash accordingly.

    Well, good for the site creator of course. For me, I mutter a few words of gratitude for AdBlock and Pithhelmet and then carry on regardless.

    Cheers,
    Ian

    1. Re:Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Tried to eat into an existing market with Hotmail? Hotmail was the market - it's all the others that are the followers here. Some did it better of course, but MS were not trying to take away market share from others. They were trying to prevent losing users to web-based interfaces which they did not own.

      Hotmail was the market before they were bought by Microsoft. I don't think this example fits with the point you're trying to make. OTOH, it is somewhat similar to the doubleclick purchase.

    2. Re:Nonsense by rucs_hack · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You know what, as unfashionable as it is, you're right about netscape 4 and IE.

      At the time I had no idea what Microsoft were doing. I just got so utterly sick of trying to use Netscape that I started casting about for any alternative. IE wasn't great, but it was faster. In 33/56k modem days the speed of IE was an awesome advantage, even if it didn't have the features. I didn't care about what was happening to Netscape, but at that point I had only just got back into computing after an eight year break.

      I didn't change from IE until the first version of Firefox came out, or Firebird as it was then. Since that time I have never willingly used IE. If any site requires it I just stop using that site.

    3. Re:Nonsense by geekoid · · Score: 1, Interesting

      " they killed Netscape-the-company completely by, despite the many myths, simply being better than Netscape v4"

      no, the FACT of the matters is, they beat them by leveraging there vast fortune to give away, and later include IE into the OS. IE was no better the Netscape.

      This is not a myth, there was some sort of court case about it. It might have been mentioned on /.

      Of course, MS bought Hotmail, and with that purchase, all smart innovation with Hotmail came to a halt.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    4. Re:Nonsense by geekoid · · Score: 0

      I used both, and in fact tested both many times, overall Netscape and MS faired the same.
      Then sites started being made, not to srandars, but to fit IE. Which was stupid and short sighted.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  21. Let's see... by Wireless+Joe · · Score: 2, Insightful

    AdBlock Plus filter set to *doubleclick.net*? Yes. Purchase away Microsoft.

  22. Privacy Issues? by transporter_ii · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Yeah, a bloated and hated company that has a huge amount of computers going to its site every day buys a company that has a huge amount of cookies on everybody's computers. Match the two together somehow and you probably have more of an issue than searching on google and using gmail at the same time...at least this would probably be able to tie a much lager portion of users to their surfing habits.

    What could only add to the mix would be Microsoft + Double Click + Homeland Security (and maybe throw AT&T into the mix as well)

    Transporter_ii

    --
    Doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy knowledge, religion destroys spirituality
  23. Internet Bubble Mk.II by rve · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Yet again, insane amounts of money are spent on things with very little substance but a high internet buzzword count.

    Like last time, eventually investors will panic when they contemplate the very expensive pile of hot air they will have accumulated, and yet again the bubble will burst dramatically, sucking up billions of dollars that could have been invested in companies that actually make something and / or actually provide a service, and causing another European and North American recession.

    Meanwhile, I'm investing all of my money in tulip bulbs.

    1. Re:Internet Bubble Mk.II by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 2, Insightful

      eventually investors will panic when they contemplate the very expensive pile of hot air they will have accumulated, and yet again the bubble will burst dramatically In the mean time the people who orchestrated the event, having named themselves the execs and CEOs of both the investment firms and the hot air companies, will have portioned out to themselves a majority of the billions of dollars. The money doesn't just get sucked up--it gets laundered and funnelled back to the top of the pyramid.
      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
    2. Re:Internet Bubble Mk.II by Dragonslicer · · Score: 1

      The difference in this case is that (in theory) DoubleClick actually has an income right now, so Microsoft (in theory) knows about how much money they'll make from DoubleClick.

    3. Re:Internet Bubble Mk.II by geekoid · · Score: 1

      this time of year?

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    4. Re:Internet Bubble Mk.II by rtb61 · · Score: 1
      I see you fail to understand the intricacies of the modern stock market. Stock brokers make money when stock prices go up and they make just as much money when stock prices go down. The only time they don't make much money is when stock prices stay stable.

      Stock Brokers drive the stock market to suit their needs, not that of the investors or the companies that form the stock market, or a countries economy.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
  24. Not so bloated any more! by taniwha · · Score: 1

    apparently they've done away with an "r" ....

  25. don't forget by Phu5ion · · Score: 1

    *doubleclick.microsoft.com*
    *doubleclick.msn.com*
    etc.

    --
    Slashdot is kind of like Playboy; we aren't here to read the articles.
    1. Re:don't forget by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      *doubleclick*

  26. Can msft "fix" the filtering? by walterbyrd · · Score: 1

    Couldn't msft set it up so that the page won't load if filtering is enabled, or something?

    1. Re:Can msft "fix" the filtering? by SlowMovingTarget · · Score: 1

      What they could do is make it so that Windows itself tracks every single site you visit, and have the OS transmit that information back to HQ. Will they do this? I certainly hope not, especially since the vector of Microsoft software design aims more and more at restricting end users' control over their own hardware. Savvy users will run hardware firewalls, or pipe their net connection through a machine that doesn't run an MS OS. The real question is: Will MS avoid the bad will engendered by making it difficult to prevent this kind of information from leaving one's PC?

  27. I won't notice.... by skogs · · Score: 1

    SmoothWall Firewall
    DansGuardian Content Filter
    Domain Block of Ad-Servers.


    Nope...I won't notice at all.

    --
    Who is this that even the wind and the waves obey Him? Surely this computer must submit also!
    1. Re:I won't notice.... by Verunks · · Score: 1

      me too, i'm just plugging off the ac cab...

  28. completely OT but by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    I'm curious and eager to learn


    stab_val(stab)->str_nok = 1; /* what a wonderful hack! */ -- Larry Wall in stab.c from the perl source code

    (Quote from the /. footer.) Would someone care to explain?

  29. This could be dangerous, actually by tacokill · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Imagine what you could do - if you were not limited - with all of the data MSFT could gather and combine it with the marketing/advertising data of DoubleClick.

    Think operating systems, browser, and office "features" here, people. The features gather more and more information as time goes on. Its already been happening over the last 5-10 years so the trend is certainly in that direction. I mean, thus far, Mr. Softie has been pretty easy (all things considered) on how much data he sends back home but I am sure things could be configured differently to gather a whole new set of information. A much larger, complex, and more intrusive set of information. And then they can market based on that data (DoubleClick). Like Google, cept Google doesn't have an operating system sitting on every damn computer in the world.

    It could get very very ugly. I can envision several nasty things that I would do and thats only thinking about it 5 min.

    Access to customers (data) + Marketing/advertising = big revenues for the seller of marketing and advertising products. That's what we are talking about here -- selling ads.

    1. Re:This could be dangerous, actually by HomelessInLaJolla · · Score: 1

      thus far, Mr. Softie has been pretty easy (all things considered) on how much data he sends back home My hypothesis is that Mr. Softie has been pretty comprehensive--and sneaky--about the data which is sent back home. With the extraordinary ease with which databases can be transferred, assimilated, indexed, combined, and mined, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a service out there which can correlate your Windows key with every cookie which has ever been on your system, every IP address you've ever had, every browser you've ever used, and every bit of personal information which can be gleaned from public tax records, DOT records, or lists available from insurance carriers.
      --
      the NPG electrode was replaced with carbon blac
  30. Yawn by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 1

    I already block them in my hosts file. This changes nothing.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
    1. Re:Yawn by SeaFox · · Score: 3, Informative

      I already block them in my hosts file. This changes nothing.

      If you're using Windows and blocked Microsoft sites on your hosts file, Windows will ignore it and still connect to them. If they get DoubleClick, I wont be surprised if the same thing happens with their servers.
    2. Re:Yawn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, this could be a blessing in disguise. If Microsoft does with DoubleClick what they've done with everything else, ads will be Windows only before long...

  31. Ads on Web pages? by frdmfghtr · · Score: 1

    Really? There's advertising on web pages? I hadn't noticed.

    --
    Government's idea of a balanced budget: take money from the right pocket to balance...oh who am I kidding?
  32. 23! Ah-ah-ah... by StikyPad · · Score: 1

    to promote New Line Cinema's movie ``The Number 23.''
    Brought to you by the letter Q, and the letter E.
  33. Obligatory add-on: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Like Google, cept Google doesn't have an operating system sitting on every damn computer in the world. Yet.
  34. Wrong Half, M$ by AnonymousRobin · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Nobody goes to Google Whatever for the ads. They go there because they want to use a useful, well-made service. You don't compete by making better ads. Nobody likes ads. Google gets away with it because their ads are unobtrusive, and nobody minds seeing (occasionally useful) ads on the side of their Gmail inbox. People are going to mind seeing giant streaming videos playing at full volume when they're trying to read an e-mail from their niece. If Microsoft wants to compete, they're going to have to spend a little less time trying to think about how to steal money from you by annoying you enough, and a bit more on making applications good enough that people won't mind ads.

    1. Re:Wrong Half, M$ by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For the love of god, mark the parent up insightful.

    2. Re:Wrong Half, M$ by CF4L · · Score: 1

      Google gets away with it because their ads are unobtrusive, and nobody minds seeing (occasionally useful) ads on the side of their Gmail inbox.

      Or people use Firefox and get plugins that allow them to remove the ads like Customize Google, https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/743

  35. M$ to BUY doubleclick?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I thought they invented it...

  36. doubleclick ?? by Archfeld · · Score: 1

    oh yeah ad.doublick.* I vaguely remember them...I added a 127.0.0.1 dns entry for them loooong ago. That would probably explain the broken link on the ad-box on THIS VERY PAGE, now wouldn't it :)

    --
    errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?
  37. Micosoft? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    Micosoft? Mi_c_o_soft?

    Who the hell are they?

  38. Shouldn't that be.. by geekoid · · Score: 1

    Btought to you by the letter F, and the letter U.

    --
    The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  39. In other news... by mobby_6kl · · Score: 2, Funny

    Apple (NASDAQ: AAPL) to buy RightClick.

  40. My /etc/hosts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    127.0.0.100 doubleclick.net

  41. This is good! by Groo+Wanderer · · Score: 4, Funny

    You guys don't get it. Hopefully MS will buy doubleclick and make them THE source for all MS based adds. Instead of the boring old flash, or worse yet, non-interactive dull jpegs, you can now get ads enhanced with all sorts of advanced features. Instead of plain old JPEGs, you can see the glory of the new MS format. You can protect your video ads so they will only play in WiMP11 with DRM user enhancements. Flash? Yestertech, MS has their newer better version.

    This will be absolute nirvana! Why? Because they sure as hell won't put out those bullshit DRM infected formats for linux, and I will never have to see their ads again. I won't even have to install a plugin to avoid them. Oh happy day.

              -Charlie

  42. DoubleCluck the most blocked ad server? by flyingfsck · · Score: 1

    Is there anybody left on the planet that isn't blocking DoubleCluck? How on earth can they be viable?

    --
    Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
    1. Re:DoubleCluck the most blocked ad server? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL.. how naive slashdotters are. The techie types that block doubleclick ads (like those of us that read /.) are a _tiny_ percentage of all web users.

    2. Re:DoubleCluck the most blocked ad server? by freaked · · Score: 1

      the net u use is driven thru major revenue from online advertising & is turned up as because of serving ads.. Well the site/Forum you are in uses doubleclick to serve it ads.. I really can't understand why to block doubleclick wht harm does it do.. I too get annoyed with lots of popups..but those are adware ne ways..???

  43. IE7pro extension for IE7 has an Ad blocker by Vandil+X · · Score: 1

    And it's pretty damn good at it. Spread the word.

    --
    Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, START
  44. Re:Execellent! One less advertiser... by jZnat · · Score: 1

    Dude, Microsoft bought them, not Best Buy. ;)

    --
    'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'
  45. Oscar Wilde had it right... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "The unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible."

  46. Almost Had heart Attack by Lord+Flipper · · Score: 1

    I thought it said, "Microsoft in Talks to by DoubleCrick"

    Everybody know, DoubleCrick my company takeover target!


    - Wun Hung Low
    Shanghai
  47. Yes, but, fear the other possibilities by oGMo · · Score: 2, Informative

    I totally agree with what you said. However, there is another angle. People are going to mind seeing all of these things in a web browser, and they're going to use firefox and various plugins to get around them. Yes.

    But my guess is Microsoft has more insidious plans. (Don't they always?) They control your desktop, remember? Now imagine instead of those ads popping up in the browser you can pick and control, they pop up on your desktop. They become part of the OS, such that you can't remove them without breaking the system (MS has never claimed this before, right?).

    Sure, corporate desktop licenses won't have these; high-dollar corporate licenses will be ad-free. Home desktops, however, will. But just use the corporate desktop, you ask? Except that one won't play games... and will only run Microsoft-signed code, or maybe even code signed with a special corporate key you'd have to buy. Expect to see similar ads appear on XBOX Live! as well.

    I encourage Microsoft to do this. They should go all-out and control the desktop experience. It should become like television, where consumers are the product, and getting their eyeballs is the goal. Let them play games or type a letter, but make sure those ads appear everywhere.

    That way everyone may finally hate it enough to switch.

    --

    Don't think of it as a flame---it's more like an argument that does 3d6 fire damage

  48. Doubleclick? I've heard that name before.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Doubleclick? Doubleclick, it seems I've heard that before. Where could I have...wait! Got it.

    It is in my adblock list, right next to atdmt, linksynergy, and other vile purveyors of loose green baby crap. Boy, that takes me back in time, back to when the Spice Girls were popular and 127.0.0.1 was the prefered route for undesirables.

  49. Attention Windows Clickarounds by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yeah i'm talking to you. The wannabe computer programmer who thinks they are good at computers because they can click around the computer enough times and find the reboot button and 'fix' an inherently flawed windows system. You think you're cool because you can pirate photoshop but not know anything about it, get Microsoft Office for free but have the literacy of a 1st grader when writing a paper, and get a copy of Norton Anti-virus because your inherently flawed system is useless without Administrative privileges. Get a clue, you are not smart, you are just a corporate sheep for a company that will bury you if you ever tried to write any software that did anything remotely useful. You are a clickaround and all you know if your ugly gray existence that is Windows.

    Want the sourcecode to windows vista?

    head -n 1000000 /dev/random > Windows.com

  50. Two great evils . . . by SgtSnorkel · · Score: 1

    Hey! Two great evils that go great together!

  51. Like Yahoo and Overture. by seanyboy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Considering the balls-up made when Yahoo bought Overture, I'm really suprised Microsoft are trying this. This is a bad, stupid idea.

    --
    Training monkeys for world domination since 1439
  52. credit where credit is due by lingoman · · Score: 0

    Or why blogs are not journalism:

    Bloomberg says the Wall Street Journal says.

    Don't you guys see that there is a difference between reading a newspaper and writing one?

  53. It's the age-old tale... by core_dump_0 · · Score: 1

    ..of evil teaming up with evil and working together against good.

  54. In any case... by BrokenHalo · · Score: 1

    ...It's going to make absolutely no difference to me. I have every doubleclick server known to mankind blocked in my hosts file. I don't want to know them, and I don't care who buys them.

  55. Dirty spammers! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Everything related to DoubleClick (the click-tracking, spamming bastards), domains, IP ranges, affiliates (MailDart, Dartmail, etc), everything is blocked on every single system I have under my control. And it will never be any different.

  56. DoubleClick Double sold. by jerryodom · · Score: 1
    When I saw this I thought for a moment I remembered seeing someone else had purchased DoubleClick. I was wrong though.

    A while back Aprimo snatched up DoubleClick's Enterprise Marketing Solution parts. Aprimo is the top dog in their niche of Enterprise Marketing Management solutions.

    Definitely some mad money being thrown around with the selling off of DoubleClick.

    --
    For some reason I refuse to use either spell check or the spacebar properly.