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RIAA Seeks Royalties From Radio

SierraPete writes "First it was Napster; then it was Internet radio; then it was little girls, grandmothers, and dead people. But now our friends at the RIAA are going decidedly low-tech. The LA Times reports that the RIAA wants royalties from radio stations. 70 years ago Congress exempted radio stations from paying royalties to performers and labels because radio helps sell music. But since the labels that make up the RIAA are not getting the cash they desire through sales of CDs, and since Internet and satellite broadcasters are forced to cough up cash to their racket, now the RIAA wants terrestrial radio to pay up as well."

105 of 555 comments (clear)

  1. Give them what they want! by tehwebguy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I truly hope they get what they want, it seems like the only thing that could possibly take down Clear Channel.

    This would basically ruin both CC and the RIAA. Without the radio telling the masses what to like, CD sales are doomed.

    --
    -- lol pwned
    1. Re:Give them what they want! by aussie_a · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Actually the radio will be telling people who to like. It will be people they can afford (most likely free people in many cases). Sounds like a win for me if the RIAA gets what they want.

    2. Re:Give them what they want! by Wansu · · Score: 2, Insightful


        This would basically ruin both CC and the RIAA.

      Yeah. Let them eat their seed corn. Gobble it up boys.
       

      --
      Wansu, th' chinese sailor
    3. Re:Give them what they want! by empaler · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Actually the radio will be telling people who to like. It will be people they can afford (most likely free people in many cases). Sounds like a win for me if the RIAA gets what they want. Actually, that could just imply that the ones who make it affordable for radio stations make it less affordable to the consumer. That gives more airtime and more profit...
    4. Re:Give them what they want! by mibalzonya · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It may also mean less music. Instead of the same 8 songs. We will now have the same six songs.

    5. Re:Give them what they want! by Knight+Thrasher · · Score: 3, Insightful
      What about MTV? Arn't they telling people what music to like?

      No? What? What's "reality TV" got to do with music television? Nothing?... =V

    6. Re:Give them what they want! by toleraen · · Score: 5, Funny

      If I may quote Lewis Black...

      MTV is to music as KFC is to chicken.

    7. Re:Give them what they want! by hal2814 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You get 8 songs?! I just get DJs who think they're a lot more amusing than they really are and commercials. I'd love to have a radio station that actually played music.

    8. Re:Give them what they want! by dotfile · · Score: 5, Interesting
      You'd love to think that, but it's not what would happen. Let's follow the money for a moment...

      Clear Channel and the other huge companies could and would pay without even flinching, and just jack up their ad rates to cover the increased costs (and then some, since they can now blame RIAA for pretty much ANY amount of rate increase). Big Media wins, makes more money, gets bigger.

      Advertisers now have Big Media sucking up a larger chunk of their advertising budgets, so they have to make cuts somewhere. Since the smaller, independent stations (are there any left?) have to pay RIAA too, their costs go up. With smaller audience shares, they are now even less cost effective than before. Advertisers pull ads from small stations to pay for the ads on big stations, small stations are now in an even bigger hurt than before.

      Because the FCC has been spreading its legs for media companies for so long - and Congress is too clueless to notice or care -- Big Media is now able to suck up even more smaller stations as their financial position becomes untenable. Big Media wins again, makes even MORE money, gets even bigger. Talk radio and NPR survive as the only alternative to what Clear Channel, Journal Broadcast and the other handful of winners want you to hear.

      This would be a huge long term win for the handful of huge media companies that now control most of the market anyway. Unfortunately, I suspect it would be a Pyrrhic vistory. They've alreay driven millions to satellite radio, and this would probably drive nails into terrestrial broadcast radio's coffin at an even faster rate.

      Once the sattelite channels are devoting as much time to advertising as they are to music, we're right back to where we started - buy now you're PAYING to listen to it, which works out far better for the media companies. You're not naieve enough to think THAT won't happen, are you?

    9. Re:Give them what they want! by WhatAmIDoingHere · · Score: 5, Funny

      A delicious mix of herbs and spices that makes music better?

      I don't get it.

      --
      Not a Twitter sockpuppet... but I wish I was.
    10. Re:Give them what they want! by jae471 · · Score: 2, Funny
      MTV is to music as KFC is to chicken.

      True. Both make me vomit.

    11. Re:Give them what they want! by Mr2cents · · Score: 2, Funny

      Are you talking about weed?

      --
      "It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful." - Anton LaVey
    12. Re:Give them what they want! by Aladrin · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Because radio stations, if they have to pay more money, will need more income.

      I see 2 ways to get more income:

      1) More ads.
      2) Charge the content producers to air their music.

      2 sounds stupid at first, but if the options are 'massive advertising' or 'pay the radio a few cents to play your song', I know which would be cheaper and better. The consumer (that's us) loses either way, and the RIAA is the only one who gains.

      'Overpaid Shock Jocks' exist because they bring in listeners, no matter how stupid any single individual may think them. If they didn't, they wouldn't exist.

      'Indie music' doesn't get much airplay because radio stations don't think it'll bring in listeners and because it is so hard/expensive to find good stuff. Music producers sift through the cruft and find the money music, and radio stations take advantage of that currently. The only way for a radio station to afford that sifting process would be to have 1 company (or a very few) sort for many radio stations. That's basically what we have right now.

      --
      "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    13. Re:Give them what they want! by utopianfiat · · Score: 2, Funny

      hah! Ben Folds? TALENT?

      In other news, this article gave me the feeling of the fresh sound of .45 being cocked and pointed at a certain music industry organization's foot.

      --
      +5, Truth
    14. Re:Give them what they want! by jZnat · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Once the sattelite channels are devoting as much time to advertising as they are to music, we're right back to where we started - buy now you're PAYING to listen to it, which works out far better for the media companies. You're not naieve enough to think THAT won't happen, are you? Considering how many people dropped XM over the suspension of Opie and Anthony, I can safely say that I wouldn't be alone in dropping satellite radio due to ads on the music channels. XM and Sirius aren't just competition with each other and terresticle radio, but also with iPods and other media jukeboxes. You don't have ads on your own MP3 player, and you control the music on there, so these broadcasters can't really turn to commercials. Of course, they could increase the subscription rate, and I'd rather they did that than resort to ads if it were really necessary.
      --
      'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'
    15. Re:Give them what they want! by Hoi+Polloi · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I assume this would apply to all of those nice indie college stations too. Be careful what you wish for.

      --
      It is by the juice of the coffee bean that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains. The stains become a warning
    16. Re:Give them what they want! by veganboyjosh · · Score: 2, Insightful

      while this doesn't necessarily require more money, there is an option you've overlooked:

      public radio. member owned/sponsored. the listeners give money to the local station to cover expenses, and the station has a duty to/they're-paying-our-bills-so-we-better play what they want.

      i'm not necessarily talking about national public radio, either; as that comes with quite a bit of politicing, and while generally something i enjoy listening to, tends to run somewhat less controversial/edgy type content. in the town where i live, we have at least two local public radio stations. one is run by the local college, the other turns 29 years old today, and is in no danger of going away. when either one of them says they play a mix of eclectic music, there's no telling what you'll get. folky guitar song followed by peruvian flute music followed by swedish black metal. none of which is owned by the riaa, so they don't have to worry. the artists are happy to get airplay on a station the listeners of which have brains of their own.

    17. Re:Give them what they want! by AnalogDiehard · · Score: 2, Funny

      A delicious mix of herbs and spices that makes music better?

      I don't get it.

      Think Spice Girls.

      --
      Eternity: will that be smoking, or non-smoking? I Corinthians 6:9-10
    18. Re:Give them what they want! by Aladrin · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Okay, you have an edge case.

      But that doesn't mean anything other than that your money will go more directly from your pocket to the RIAA's than before.

      Before: You -> Radio ~> CD sales -> RIAA
      After: You -> Radio -> RIAA

      Radio music causes people to want to buy CDs of music they like. Previously your money funded advertising which provided money for the RIAA in the form of CD sales.

      I'd like to think that your option would be the one chosen, and that radio stations would listen to those who pay them money directly... But XM and Sirius take money directly from their consumers and they seem to ignore their customers as much or more than regular stations, so I don't have much faith in companies doing the 'right thing' for their customers in this case. (And most others, anymore.)

      Enjoy your radio station. It may end up being the last decent one in this country.

      --
      "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    19. Re:Give them what they want! by illeism · · Score: 2, Funny

      They sent NPR to war.

      --
      Help test the /. effect at my min
    20. Re:Give them what they want! by EdelFactor19 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I disagree with that quote... its too insulting to KFC, and I'm by no means a fan

      KFC actually is at least mainly comprised of chicken (or chicken like substances).. Albeit fried and of questionable quality
      where as MTV is not really comprised of music at all anymore.. Unless you count the background music in the shows... It's mostly comprised of crap, propaganda, stupidity and teeny-boppers mixed in with thugs.

      better one:

      MTV is to music as astronomy is to science
      I would have used "tampa bay devil rays are to baseball" as in the simpson's except they are having a better year than the yankees.

      --
      "Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" ~Frank Zappa
      EdelFactor
    21. Re:Give them what they want! by SmittyTheBold · · Score: 3, Insightful

      ...and both feature breasts prominently.

      --
      ± 29 dB
  2. From the article... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "Mary Wilson, who with Diana Ross and Florence Ballard formed the original Supremes, said the exemption was unfair and forced older musicians to continue touring to pay their bills."

    Yeah because they should be allowed to sit around all day earning money just because they are so great.

    1. Re:From the article... by weorthe · · Score: 5, Funny

      Remember kids, listening to the radio is STEALING!!!

      --
      cat * >> sig
    2. Re:From the article... by The+Ultimate+Fartkno · · Score: 3, Funny

      If the radio stations are making money by playing the Supremes' music, I can see why she might say that.

    3. Re:From the article... by 605dave · · Score: 5, Insightful

      That's funny, because the radio station owners are sitting around making money because of how great she was...

      --
      Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a difficult battle. - Plato
    4. Re:From the article... by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 2, Insightful
      From her point of view, she wants to retire. She has had a long and successful career, and is now ready to relax (with select appearances here and there). To her, the royalties are like a social security check ...

      Whatever happened to the good, old-fashioned concept of SAVING money while the going is good? Save a few $100,000, invest it, and let the money work for you. Why expect a free ride when you've blown all your money?

      -b.

    5. Re:From the article... by Applekid · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If she's living on royalties then she got shafted by her financial advisor. She's got no investments? No diversification? No income but a piddling royalty check? It's not the radio station's fault.

      Sure the radio stations are making money. If they didn't play Supremes they'd play something else. I remember a buddy who had a show on the campus radio station and often he'd get requests for songs they can't play and he'd tell the callers "yeah, sure, I'll play it, keep listening." I've never felt the need to call a corp radio station but it's probably the same way.

      The stuff they play is just a commodity. At least the smaller costs of running internet radio stations had the semblance of caring about actual music and content.

      For the behemoth MAFIAA every win, every law, every take in their favor is never independant and always a stepping stone to even greater reaches. Next thing you'll know the public will need to pay a fee simply to remember how great a particular song goes.

      If denying Mary Wilson name-brand bon-bons in favor of the off-brand ones keeps them from taking advantage of ANOTHER stepping stone towards the continued bilking of the public at large, I'm all for it.

      --
      More Twoson than Cupertino
    6. Re:From the article... by honkycat · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Right, it's not like they're continuing to provide a service, pay their power bills, employ staff to keep the transmitters working, etc. They're just collecting a paycheck by trampling on her rights. Those millions she already made were not nearly enough compensation for those few hours of music she put on records. Why should she have to continue to be productive to put food on the table? Why can't she just sit and reap the rewards of her creativity the same way the rest of us do?

      Oh... wait...

    7. Re:From the article... by R2.0 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      "Not that I support her claim, but none the less ... think about the social security system. In my opinion, I believe it is there for the simple fact that the government is "rewarding" tax payers for so many years of paying taxes. Along with retirement funds, this lets the older generation live (sometimes) comfortably in their later years."

      And thereby perpetuating a misconception. Social Security was conceived as a means of alleviating poverty among the elderly, which was widespread. It is a wealth transfer. Period. It is not a reward, nor an investment. It is taking money from my paycheck (and yours, assuming you are employed), and giving it to someone else.

      As a social program, it has been very successful - poverty among the elderly has been drastically reduced. Fiscally, it is a disaster, as lifespans increase and the working population decreases. Politically, it is a paralytic, causing a lockup whenever politicians even think about changing the system.

      If the performer in question feels that SS and the money she has squirreled away isn't enough for her to live in the lifestyle to which she has become accustomed, she needs to do what everybody else does - keep working. If she didn't put money away? More reason to keep working. No one owes her a comfortable retirement.

      --
      "As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
    8. Re:From the article... by honkycat · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Seriously... excuse me if I have no sympathy for someone who has an extremely lucrative career for a few years, spends their millions, and doesn't know where to turn for more... I seem to recall a story about a cricket and an ant...

    9. Re:From the article... by ajs318 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Absolutely. Every time I turn on a hot tap, I have to pay a fee to the plumber who installed my combi-boiler. Every time I switch on my computer, I have to pay a fee to the electrician who wired up my house. Every time I read a book, I have to pay a fee to the author. Every time my ex-girlfriend places something on the shelves I put up for her, she has to pay a fee to me.

      Oh, wait, that's bollocks. Sorry. You do the work once, you get paid once -- iff you're lucky. That's how it works in The Real World.

      --
      Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
    10. Re:From the article... by *weasel · · Score: 5, Insightful

      it's totally unfair that the guy who bought the house I built sold it for a profit a few years later.
      I mean, I should totally get a cut of absolutely any profit derived from my work at any point in the future!

      Otherwise I'd have to plan for retirement or continue building houses.
      And that doesn't sound fair. Not while people are out there profitting off my work.

      --
      // "Can't clowns and pirates just -try- to get along?"
    11. Re:From the article... by CyberSnyder · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Of course if the RIAA were to collest money from the radio stations, they would gladly give the artists their fair share of the royalties. Sure.

    12. Re:From the article... by negated · · Score: 2, Funny

      Mary Wilson, who with Diana Ross and Florence Ballard formed the original Supremes, said the exemption was unfair and forced older musicians to continue touring to pay their bills.
      In defense of Diana Ross, she definitely needs all the money she can get to pay for her liquor. Plus she wants everyone's handicap spaces too. I just hope someone else is driving if she is forced to go on tour!
    13. Re:From the article... by lysse · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The irony being that when her records are played in the UK, where you (and I) are commenting from, she does get a royalty...

    14. Re:From the article... by teh_chrizzle · · Score: 2, Funny

      Those millions she already made were not nearly enough compensation for those few hours of music she put on records.

      what the hell is wrong with you? do you think that cars, mansions, designer clothes, and heroin pays for itself? what about rehab? what about agent fees? what about lawyers and accountants? these are all very expensive things that help starts live their expensive lives. who's going to pay for all of that stuff?

      you think that because you go to work every day that everyone has to work every day as well and simply pay their own way. well, i'm here to tell you that simply isn't true. just like the french aristocracy, some people have to pay for others to enjoy the good life. stars need more money than regular people and so regular people need to share the wealth. regular people have jobs and families... they can clearly afford to pay celebrities so that they can maintain their celebrity lifestyles.

      --
      sarcasm:
      -noun
      1. harsh or bitter derision or irony.
    15. Re:From the article... by barefoothannibal · · Score: 2, Funny

      I'm merely a slashdot reader, can someone PLEASE put this into a car analogy so I can understand!?!?

  3. Pipe Dream by Mercedes308 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Pfff, it won't fly. The radio industry is too strong collectively for this to work. Plus also how could they even get close to having this accepted internationally?

    --
    And no, I couldn't give a shit what my karma is.
    1. Re:Pipe Dream by mbone · · Score: 4, Informative

      It may or may not work here, but in most of the world radio pays a performance right, so it is very well accepted internationally.

    2. Re:Pipe Dream by Andy_R · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Well we've always had this here in Britain, and it seems to work. If the RIAA do manage to pass this in the US, I think their main problem will be explaining to artists why they don't get any of the new revenue.

      --
      A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
    3. Re:Pipe Dream by drsquare · · Score: 2, Funny

      Well we've always had this here in Britain, and it seems to work.
      The same British radio that plays the same half dozen songs over and over again?
  4. Excellent! by Algorithmnast · · Score: 5, Interesting

    One of 2 things will probably happen:

        1) RIAA offends the courts by trying to reverse Congress and fails, and loses some steam and (more) public credibility (with those who think they have any).

        2) RIAA bribes the right people and that law gets reversed, which then costs our country its music-playing radio stations and the music industry loses the majority of its sales.

    I'm failing to see a down side....

    1. Re:Excellent! by montyzooooma · · Score: 5, Insightful
      "2) RIAA bribes the right people and that law gets reversed, which then costs our country its music-playing radio stations and the music industry loses the majority of its sales."

      As somebody already pointed out the rest of the world gets by paying a fee for radio play. What this WILL mean is that you'll end up with the bland "selection" of national radio that other Western countries have. I was always surprised at how diverse the US music industry was but I didn't realise your radio stations got a free ride. Now it makes sense and I'm sure this would mean less exposure for niche artistes. Gotta love an industry that's trying to hammer nails in its own coffin.

    2. Re:Excellent! by Mr2001 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      What this WILL mean is that you'll end up with the bland "selection" of national radio that other Western countries have. I was always surprised at how diverse the US music industry was but I didn't realise your radio stations got a free ride. We already have a bland "selection" of mostly-national radio. The stations are nominally "local", but by some miraculous coincidence, they all play the same music and the DJs all sound the same. I pay $12.95 a month so I don't have to listen to our "diverse" FM radio.
      --
      Visual IRC: Fast. Powerful. Free.
    3. Re:Excellent! by the_humeister · · Score: 2, Interesting

      What this WILL mean is that you'll end up with the bland "selection" of national radio that other Western countries have.


      We already have that. Practically all rock, adult contemporary, etc. stations play the same thing...
    4. Re:Excellent! by maniac/dev/null · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I was always surprised at how diverse the US music industry was but I didn't realise your radio stations got a free ride.

      You mean its somehow WORSE in Europe? How is that even possible? Every FM station in my area plays the same 20 songs that have been approved for that genre. Radio stinks.

      Europe... maybe this is The Final Countdown for decent radio? I hope this doesnt spread to Asia, or Africa, or even Kansas or Chicago.

      Hehe... Battle of the Bands Geography Bee.

    5. Re:Excellent! by zappepcs · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I think you missed an option:

      3) The RIAA pulls this one off. Member labels get fewer artists signing with them so they can participate in the new wave of music production, allowing them to garner air time on net radio stations. Additionally net radio stations outside the U.S. will continue to grow like some kind of pirate radio. The world (and especially the U.S.) will be exposed to artists that they never would have been exposed to via the current radio setup.

      In this situation, the RIAA loses, corporate radio loses, but the people and the artists win. If the RIAA keeps this up, they will destroy their own industry by making online-music the new on-line gambling. It will be legal everywhere but in the U.S.

      yeaaahhh RIAA

      May I suggest a few tracks for theme music to their new program:

      1) RIAA killed the radio star
      2) Hey man, nice shot!
      3) Suicide is painless

  5. Nice idea for a protest? by irexe · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I'd like to see all radio stations play only independent music for one day. See how the RIAA likes that..

  6. I don't think this would go over well..... by ZiakII · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I'm just hoping maybe.... the judges will know what the hell radio is and realize and understand exactly what the RIAA is doing and not get confused/persuaded other ways by some techno-speak in the past.

  7. I always find it unnerving... by dbolger · · Score: 5, Interesting

    ...when reality and The Onion collide: http://www.theonion.com/content/node/27696

    1. Re:I always find it unnerving... by Bogtha · · Score: 5, Funny

      Sometimes it's just downright hilarious.

      The Onion, February 2004:

      Stop. I just had a stroke of genius. Are you ready? Open your mouth, baby birds, cause Mama's about to drop you one sweet, fat nightcrawler. Here she comes: Put another aloe strip on that fucker, too. That's right. Five blades, two strips, and make the second one lather. You heard me--the second strip lathers. It's a whole new way to think about shaving. Don't question it. Don't say a word. Just key the music, and call the chorus girls, because we're on the edge--the razor's edge--and I feel like dancing.

      CNN, September 2005:

      Gillette has escalated the razor wars yet again, unveiling a new line of razors on Wednesday with five blades and a lubricating strip on both the front and back.

      --
      Bogtha Bogtha Bogtha
    2. Re:I always find it unnerving... by Goldarn · · Score: 2, Interesting

      And, once again, art pre-imitates reality: http://www.improveverywhere.com/2002/01/19/writers -against-piracy/

  8. This is going to backfire.... by RenegadeTempest · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This is great news. There are only like 2 big radio conglomerates out there. They typically replay the same crap that the labels spoon feed them over and over again. Now, let's say they have to PAY to play that crap. Wouldn't it make sense to maybe play local stuff that doesn't cost a dime? Maybe it makes sense to play those albums that are not covered by the RIAA?

    The best part is that if this is instituted it must be instituted across the board. They can't give radio stations breaks on a specific song over another. If they do, then this is payola. You can't pay radio stations to play your song. A discount on royalties is the same as paying them. Maybe we might hear some variety on the radio.

    Again, another strategy not thought out to the logical conclusion.

    1. Re:This is going to backfire.... by CmdrGravy · · Score: 4, Informative

      Nice idea in theory but in practice I just don't think it will work like that. Here in the UK Radio Stations already pay the record companies for what they play and you will find that most of them do exactly what you describe above, i.e play the same crap the labels spoon feed them over and over again.

      There are maybe a couple of hours each week when it possible to hear some decent music on the radio here but other than that you may as well forget it.

    2. Re:This is going to backfire.... by ribuck · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Unfortunately, it won't backfire. The same thing happened in 1969/1970 in Australia. The main radio stations stopped playing the big-label records that they would have had to start paying for. Instead, they played music from the independent labels, who were happy to not demand a royalty.

      It lasted about six weeks before the radio stations capitulated. Their listeners wanted music from the big names.

    3. Re:This is going to backfire.... by DriveDog · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Good point, but... this isn't the same world that it was 37 years ago. Spreading music person-to-person is so much easier now, for example; it wasn't even cheap to copy an album to tape back then, cassettes not having taken hold, most 8-track machines not being recorders, and open-reel machines not found so often in teenagers' bedrooms. So even though the Clear Channel et al play the same 13 songs from the same 6 "artists," people are (or at least can easily be) exposed to a much wider range today without any trouble on their part. I just don't see that kind of demand from listeners happening now, though I expect there'll be plenty of shady deals between promoters and station/network personnel.

  9. Sounds fair to me by grimJester · · Score: 5, Insightful

    From TFA:

    Mary Wilson, who with Diana Ross and Florence Ballard formed the original Supremes, said the exemption was unfair and forced older musicians to continue touring to pay their bills.

    Yes, it's unfair that people are forced to work to pay their bills. There should be free money for all with no incentive to work. In a perfect world, congress should force everyone to pay record companies money, so record companies could distribute the wealth in whatever way they see fit.

  10. Awww, diddums by larien · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Mary Wilson, who with Diana Ross and Florence Ballard formed the original Supremes, said the exemption was unfair and forced older musicians to continue touring to pay their bills.
    So you have to keep working to get money? What a novel concept. No-one else in the population has to work until retirement age, do they?

    "The creation of music is suffering because of declining sales," said RIAA Chief Executive Mitch Bainwol.
    The implication is that people aren't writing music because they're not getting enough money and no-one will ever want to be in a band because of it. I'll take that with a large pinch of salt. However, the next line really clarifies his position:

    "We clearly have a more difficult time tolerating gaps in revenues that should be there."
    Translation: we're not making enough money.
    1. Re:Awww, diddums by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 2, Informative

      The implication is that people aren't writing music because they're not getting enough money and no-one will ever want to be in a band because of it. I'll take that with a large pinch of salt. However, the next line really clarifies his position:


      Really? Wow. That's strange. I personally know at least 10 people who are all either part of various bands, work solo, or collaborate with several different bands and artists who write, perform and record music and, for the most part, don't make enough money from this work to even cover the costs of doing said work. While all of these people hope one day to get a recording deal, none of them do it for the money. They do it because it's what they do and they love to do it. Most figure if they pursue it long enough that eventually they make some money. But if they don't, oh well, at least they had fun doing it.

      My guess is that these people are hardly unique or rare in those aspects.

    2. Re:Awww, diddums by Goldarn · · Score: 3, Funny

      So you have to keep working to get money? What a novel concept. No-one else in the population has to work until retirement age, do they? What makes you think you get to stop working when you hit retirement age, slacker? Lazy people like you are the reason we can't privatize social security!
  11. Double standard by aussie_a · · Score: 3, Insightful

    So wait, the law acknowledges that radio infringing on the rights of musicians is okay because it encourages people to buy the music. However illegally downloading it doesn't do this? WTF? How are the two different. I understand the RIAA's logic here. If one has a particular rule then the other should as well. Now having said that, I think the RIAA and I differ on which rule should be moved to which system ;)

  12. Re:Paul Harvey all day by Schlemphfer · · Score: 2, Funny
    Relax, man, there's always Dr. Laura.

    --
    I'm generally "Interesting," "Insightful," and even "Funny" here. What the hell happens to me at parties?
  13. What the RIAA doesn't realize by starX · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Is that Clear Channel has lots of expensive lawyers, too. Also, even if this does work, it would be like taking a sawed off shotgun to their one remaining foot. When are these guys going to figure out that their business model just doesn't work anymore and will likely never work again?

  14. Silly RIAA... by beerdini · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They are attacking their own advertisers now. Most people purchase music after hearing it, which they usually hear it on the radio. Lets fast forward 5 years pretending this is successful. Radio stations are now put out of business because of lawsuits or refusal to pay the RIAA's ransom so as CD sales continue to fall; that will leave the RIAA scratching their heads wondering why, when they just killed their most wide spread advertising tool.

    Whats next? Suing stores that play music inside for shoppers?

  15. Idiots by aysa · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This will be the last nail in their coffins. I do not need to explain why, it is abvious for any person with a little sence.
    Of course, RIAA has bacome senceless long ago and its own worse enemy.

    Like the old fable of the scorpion and the frog.

    A scorpion asks a frog for help crossing a river. Intimidated by the scorpion's prominent stinger, the frog demurs.
    ``Don't be scared,'' the scorpion says. ``If something happens to you, I'll drown.'' Moved by this logic, the frog puts the scorpion on his back and wades into the river. Half way across, the scorpion stings the frog.

    The dying frog croaks, ``How could you -- you know that you'll drown?''
    ``It's my nature,'' gasps the sinking scorpion.

    Sting the radios, RIAA, and sink alone. They will start promoting indie labels.

  16. The operation was a success, but the patient died. by Nefarious+Wheel · · Score: 5, Informative
    I agree, it's going to backfire big time.

    A long time ago my father (a construction worker) told me why you didn't see many houses made out of brick in California. Seems the bricklayer's union became way, way too successful and powerful, demanding more and more pay up to the point where people couldn't afford brick construction any more and moved to frame and plasterboard houses with tar shingle roofs (this was back in the early 50's). Basically they priced themselves out of the market, but they couldn't roll back their demands due to the nature of the organisation, and their leaders chose economic death over political death as an organisation because people are funny that way.

    As Hawkeye once said, the operation was a success but the patient died.

    Funny thing though, the frame houses seemed to flex a bit but the brick houses tended to rubble during earthquakes, lovely Aesopian message there.

    Off-topic? No, just a very extended metaphor. The RIAA will eventually have absolute control over a commodity that absolutely nobody will buy. And when they start annoying Congressmen more than their lobbyists are worth by stepping outside the bounds of their anointed playing field, they're going to get slapped down hard. Nobody has a right to make money, the market has to be there, and RIAA is killing the goose.

    --
    Do not mock my vision of impractical footwear
  17. At the risk of being very unpopular... by zuki · · Score: 3, Interesting

    ....and although I am usually in a particularly bad disposition against most anything the RIAA has been doing recently.

    I think that at the very least there is something to be said for this. If anything, the radio stations are racking up
    income hand over fist from all of those insipid commercials we are forced to listen to, and it would only seem fair
    that besides the songwriters and publishers (who are justly being compensated), the owners of the sound recordings
    also get a piece of that income, which wouldn't affect talk radio, news and sports stations, but mostly for those stations
    who have a 'music format', said music being the main reason they are able to remain in business.

    This exemption business was something that was passed more than a half-century ago, originally allowed to support the massive investment
    buildout in infrastructure which radio had to go through, long since recouped, and the fact that it still stands today shows the colossal power
    of the lobby behind the stations/conglomerates such as Clear Channel.

    This makes the RIAA's position that Internet broadcasters have to pay a bit more sensible, although totally irrelevant to the reality of the Internet.
    Being that records are not selling that much anymore, and that people still listen to terrestrial radio quite a bit, it would make sense that some
    of the income stream commercial radio is deriving from music should be used to give people an incentive to create more of the same material
    the stations are using to earn income with.

    I really don't see what's far-fetched or ludicrous about this; there should however be exemptions for not-for-profit, college radios, and low-power transmitters.

    Z.

  18. is this about money? by hackstraw · · Score: 5, Insightful

    From the summary: But since the labels that make up the RIAA are not getting the cash they desire through sales of CDs, and since Internet and satellite broadcasters are forced to cough up cash to their racket.

    I mean seriously. Are these people hungry? Are they homeless? Are they unable to pay their bills? Is their mansion really too small?

    I ran into a former owner of a CD store in a college town a few years ago, and she said that she had to close down because CDs were not selling, so she sold the business, and started another one. She said explicitly that downloads hurt her bottom line, but oh well, times change, and she had to change with the times.

    I mean, how many steam engine engineers are trying to sue these new fangled gasoline, oil, diesel, electric, fuel cell, etc engineers? Or their customers, or their kids, or dead people?

    To me, this is some kind of psychological or socioligical problem that is not properly addressed as such, and the bottom line is that _everybody_ is losing because of it. The real problem is that the government is an accessory to their psychological/sociological problems, because I guess they have the same issues.

    Why isn't the government or anybody concerned about real issues like national debt, health care (oxymoron) reform, energy costs, housing costs, and the stuff that actually affects real people that are real problems. I mean, if nobody bought a 1970s technology like a CD is ever again, would it really be a big deal?

    Is this kind of sociopathy just "normal" when a society is collapsing on itself? Does anybody know what the real issues are here? This is a control/powertrip thing that makes no sense.

  19. Wonderful! by evilviper · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I haven't heard a better idea in a long time.

    RIAA has to fight it out with Clear Channel, which definitely has the resources to fight them.

    This will finally get public attention on copyright, royalties, and how aggressively the RIAA has been acting for the past several years. Most people don't know much about internet radio, but they know plenty about the noise box that keeps them entertained as they drive to and from work.

    Then, if the RIAA are successful, they'll be making unsigned and non-RIAA artists who will happily sign royalty-free contracts, far more attractive to radio stations. More radio play, means more sales, which means real competition with RIAA.

    I see a huge upside, and very little downside, for the public.

    --
    Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
  20. New Rules Charge Free Music Too! by twitter · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You won't be able to give your music away in the future. Giving the MAFIAA a new revenue stream only gives them more money to do more harm. The only place to stop them is at the voting booth.

    --

    Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.

    1. Re:New Rules Charge Free Music Too! by networkBoy · · Score: 2, Funny

      or the shooting range...

      --
      whois gawk date unzip strip find touch finger mount join nice man top fsck grep eject more yes exit umount sleep dump
    2. Re:New Rules Charge Free Music Too! by Grishnakh · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Just don't screw it up and use birdshot, which barely penetrates human skin at a distance. Make sure your shotgun is loaded with #00 buckshot instead.

  21. Re:Absolutely! Strong support! by mysidia · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It may not be suicide when they'll be able to point to the effect on the sales, and lie about it, say "Ahah! Piracy!" Despite the fact everyone (other than them and the legislators) will know darn well they are bringing it upon themselves.

    ...And they get retaliatory legislation from their lobbyists (using extreme drop in sales as justification) that makes electronic sharing punishable by death, imposes a mandatory computer and CD-tax whose proceeds will be paid to the RIAA, and permits the RIAA to force spyware, cameras, and listening stations to be installed, wherever computers are used.

    Appearing to commit suicide in the short term may be the way to get some RIAA-preserving legislation in the long term. I don't know if it turns out to work or not, but it's a possibility.

  22. Irony, +1 (-1 for the rest of us) by argStyopa · · Score: 2, Interesting
    It's sad that after so many predictions by the RIAA of the demise of commercial radio...

    The recordable tape cassette? People will just record what they want and never listen, it will be the END OF RADIO!
    DAT? People will just record what they want and never listen, it will be the END OF RADIO!
    Burnable CDs? People will just record what they want and never listen, it will be the END OF RADIO!
    MP3s over the internet? People will just record what they want and never listen, it will be the END OF RADIO!
    ...the ones ACTUALLY killing radio are the RIAA themselves. Sad, predictable, and ironic all at once.
    --
    -Styopa
  23. One step ahead of you, I'm afraid. by twitter · · Score: 2, Informative

    I'd like to see all radio stations play only independent music for one day. See how the RIAA likes that.

    Do you really think the MAFIAA and US government would tolerate such disrespect? They want to be able to charge against the will of the artist and publisher and may already have it. Something needs to change.

    --

    Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.

  24. RIAA Doublecharges to Fund their Political Control by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 4, Informative

    The RIAA's member labels already collect royalties for songs played on the radio. Radio is not exempt from those royalties - in fact, they usually make up the majority of the income a recording produces, now that songs get played over and over, forever, in our pop/classic corporate "rock" broadcast culture.

    Those "performance" royalties are collected by whichever agency represents an artist who wrote the songs: BMI, ASCAP are the biggest, the remaining <10% of artists are represented by a couple of "big little" agencies, and then a bunch of really little ones. But those agencies are at least as corrupt as the record labels which collect sales income, then find every excuse to count "expenses" before returning the minimum (if any) share of "profit" to the artists who made the record. Very little of the performance royalty is paid to the artists, and the return to them is pretty random.

    This formula is also worked against the rounding effect of the sampling for determining royalty payments: either one "representative" hour a day, or one "representative" day a week is usually used, which of course means only the most popular artists have a chance of registering in a sample and getting paid. Since the most popular artists get played so much more (the same goddamn song, year after year, too), only the biggest artists get cut in. To make it even worse, the distribution of top artists in the "random" sample is used to divide the royalty collected from radio stations which pay a subscription fee as if they're playing every artist. So in effect those biggest artists are collecting the share of the littler artists who do get played, but who get rounded down. Those "rarities" and "from the vault's back wall" bands they're playing to keep you listening to the classic rock station so it sounds "fresh", with occasional "new" (30 year old) songs, all get lost in the rounding down of the sampling process. So their most valuable songs return the least share of the royalties to their artists.

    And of course the BMI/ASCAP/etc collection agencies just underreport plays and percentages to the artists. I have friends in bands which registered half their artists with BMI, the other half with ASCAP, to see which paid better. For some bands BMI paid their half more, for other bands ASCAP paid their half more, sometimes 5-10x different, when they should all have paid the same. Then, since artists are flaky and move around & disappear on benders (or OD), the agencies often collect money they "don't know how to pay", so they just keep it. This also happens whenever there's the slightest possibility that a contract disagreement or unknown might allow different interpretations of how much should go in the check.

    All of those scams are also fed back into the radio station's decicisions of how much to play (and promote) which songs. Since there's money attached, money gets spent on those deciders to influence which songs are played when. And to influence which "random" hour/day is picked to report who gets how much.

    So now the RIAA wants to get in on the act. And of course they'll charge (mostly independent) streaming radio station even more than they charge (nearly all corporate) broadcast radio stations. Right when the Copyright Office has just rocketed already insane streaming royalties through the roof, threatening the entire noncommercial and small webcaster industry segments.

    Broadcast radio already sucks worse than ever. Streaming was the only hope for people to escape the corporate noose in realtime and archived media delivery. Right as streaming was starting to get a hold in video, presenting an on-demand P2P (or communities small to large) world of all media, both kinds of royalties got jacked up to destroy the free publishers. Right as cameraphones also have the bandwidth (and caches) to play streaming radio, and even upload "news from the street", the media mainstream corporate got yet another life extension from the government, killing

    --

    --
    make install -not war

  25. Indirect Payola by sam_handelman · · Score: 4, Insightful

    My guess would be that the RIAA is actually trying to *control* what radio stations play, since that annoying "law enforcement" stuff is getting in the way of payola.

      A major record label can create a list of songs they want played, and offer special royalty-free licenses to broadcast them as a promotion. Independent artists, bands that the RIAA's members just doesn't feel like promoting for whatever commercial reason, etc., won't have the beureucratic infrastructure to *offer* such an arrangement, even if they wished to do so.

      And, of course, if they don't like particular *stations*, for whatever reason, they can refuse to cut deals with them.

      It's the same story as with internet radio - it's all about control.

    --
    The good and new comes from no quarter where it is looked for, and is always something different from what is expected.
  26. Re:Absolutely! Strong support! by walt-sjc · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Oh this has nothing to do with music sales and traditional broadcast radio. This is still about internet "radio".

    Internet "radio" is going back to congress asking to be treated like a real radio station and get back to a zero royalty rate. The RIAA wants to head this off and say that real radio needs to pay too. It won't work, but they are going to give it a go...

  27. The key phrase here is 'mutually beneficial' by simong · · Score: 2, Interesting

    which is a concept that the RIAA seems not to understand. Radio and TV airplay are what drives sales and in turn what attracts listeners to listen to the radio. If radio and TV thought for a while and bypassed the RIAA, music radio would probably survive, but for how long would the RIAA survive without this free promotion? Let them cut off their nose and see how many copies the new Madonna LP sells without the radio.

  28. More independent/ local Artists on the Radio by Maximum+Prophet · · Score: 2, Interesting

    If the excemption is passed, *all* radio stations will be more like college radio. The record companies will have to give the little know stuff away just to get air time. This could concievably level the playing field so that small bands could actually compete with "Madonna".

    Radio Stations will adapt, and only play the expensive stuff during peak times when it will get them the most listens for their advertisers. During most of the day, and the evening hours they'll be able to play the free stuff from independent artists. It might even mean that stations will have to hire an actual program director to seek out local artists that appeal to locals.

    Like any change, some stations won't be able to adapt and will wither and die, but there will be a bunch of kids with a vision to take their place. Imagine a station that only played music licensed by a creative commons license that allowed unlimited radio play.

    --
    All ideas^H^H^H^H^Hprocesses in this post are Patent Pending. (as well as the process of patenting all postings)
  29. killing radio by phrostie · · Score: 2

    so after they kill radio and there is no way for people to hear the new songs i guess they will be attaching the undrground/indie music scene. after all it must be their fault that no one buys any new music.

  30. Boss, we've a problem: by Psicopatico · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Marketeer: "Boss, we have a problem here: RIAA wants us to pay another 3% of our revenues."
    Boss: "Right. Fire up another 3% broadcast time in commercials."
    Marketeer: "But Boss, this will shrink by another 3% our music broadcasting time. Listeners will not appreciate."
    Boss: "Who fu**ing cares?"

    --
    Mastering the English language is fucking easy: all you have to do is to put an f* word in every fucking sentence.
  31. Terrestrial radio? by joeyblades · · Score: 2, Funny

    I'm confused... Do they still broadcast using radio waves?

  32. Re:When does it end? by HikingStick · · Score: 3, Informative

    Actually, grocery stores do pay (or I should say are required to pay). As are most businesses. They usually contract a service to pipe in music and the fees are built into the subscription fees.

    I don't know where the law comes down on small mom and pop outfits that have the radio on in the background, but anyplace that has piped in music is paying.

    A final note: if the stores are part of a chain, there is a good chance that all the stores get the same music, since the chain can use that in-house channel to play not just light-jazzed-pop-songs, but in-store specials and other internal marketing pieces.

    --
    I use irony whenever I can, but my shirts are still wrinkled...
  33. The record companies... by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 2, Insightful
    should pay radio stations for playing their music. After all, the radio stations are providing a service in advertising a lot of crappy but popular bands that wouldn't otherwise be popular.

    -b.

  34. Because the public owns it. by twitter · · Score: 2, Informative

    Why is broadcast getting the special treatment?

    Because broadcast spectrum was once a scarce, expensive and regulated resource owned by the public. The rules were made to insure that resource was well used and include the forced licensing terms you mention for the composer. The original goal of copyright law is to distribute culture and advance the state of the art and those rules can be interpreted that way. If the goal had been to support publishers and artists, they would be paid a stipend without further obligation.

    The new rules look more like a prop for a dying industry than ever before. They allow the RIAA to collect fees on all music with or without the artist and publisher's consent.

    --

    Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.

  35. The Uk by Virgil+Tibbs · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I would say what you have is amazing in the US - practically anyone can set up a radio station...
    It costs so much here to operate a radio staation that they are all shite because they all cover 'mainstream' things...
    sure the BBC is good in many respects, I'm all for the BBC, but unless you plan on listing to stations devoted to:

    8 songs of pop
    #(radio 1)
    anything from 30's to now which includes just about everything
    #(radio 2)
    classical music
    #(radio 3)
    news, radio plays, and unfunny radio comedy
    #(radio 4)
    sport
    #(radio five [live])
    -
    on DAB digital radio and on the internet there is
    There is also 6music (which is alternative / 'indie'[guitar-pop])
    and several others which no-one listens to...

    so what does this mean:
    well think what stations you have in the US?
    country, hiphop, rock, community, that crazy Evangelist who always seems to be there etc
    We don't have any of that.
    there are NO terrestrial community radio stations.
    There are no terrestrial folk music stations

    Compared to you we have nothing

    Now I'm not pointing the blame some-one else can do that.
    But you Americans are LUCKY

    [I'm sticking to last.fm anyway]

    --
    www.tdobson.net #### Dare to Dream #### blog.tdobson.net
  36. Playing two parties against each other by ZorbaTHut · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Does this remind anyone of how copyright law gets legislated?

    "Hey, you Internet radio people! The normal radio people are paying $$. You should pay $$$$ because it's New and Different and it can be copied all over the place. And now we're getting a law passed for it."
    "Okay, okay, here you go."
    "Hey, normal radio people! Internet radio people are paying $$$$. You guys should be paying $$$$$$, I mean we can't even measure how many people you reach! And now we're getting a law passed for it."
    "Okay, okay, here you go."
    "Hey, Internet radio people! Normal radio people pay $$$$$$, why are you only paying $$$$?"

    --
    Breaking Into the Industry - A development log about starting a game studio.
  37. Everyone calm down, I think this is the onion by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    http://www.theonion.com/content/node/27696

    I bet you someone reported the onion as fact again... everyone just calm down.

  38. Look at the dates on your sources by raddan · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Have you looked at the date on that link? 1940. Good job with the karma-whoring, buddy. You might also want plagarizing an article that actually uses dated language.

    For the record, BMI was not founded last fall. It's been around since 1939, which is an eternity in radio. ASCAP currently claims to have 275,000 members! In fact, being a member of ASCAP or BMI is virtually a requirement if you are a professional musician, as is being a member of a professional union.

    But I'd like to also point out, having worked in radio, that ASCAP and BMI fees can be huge for small stations. The radio station I belonged to was owned by a university, and as a result, the university was able to negotiate a blanket contract for all peformances, radio stations, and jukeboxes operated on the campus (excluding the big performance venue, which was actually subcontracted to an outside vendor). We could have paid this fee ourselves, but it would have been a huge chunk of our operating costs.

    This is greed, plain and simple. The reason why the RIAA wants a cut is because ASCAP and BMI (and SESAC, if you count Europe) fees do not go back to the labels, unless the label owns the copyright on the score (contrasted with owning the copyright on the recording). ASCAP and BMI fees are generally regarded as a good thing, because this is money that artists actually see. When a radio station plays a Nirvana cover of a Meat Puppets tune, the Meat Puppets get the dough. This is a good thing for small artists.

    But there is a downside: ASCAP and BMI reporting is, at best, wildly inaccurate. "Charting" happens infrequently, and relies on stations actually taking the time to report this information correctly. Often it is not. I've heard rumors that SoundScan also has a service that scans the airwaves using a detection heuristic, but I can't find any information about that service, so maybe it was just speculation on the part of one of my coworkers.

    Anyway, labels send radio stations boxes and boxes of free music. We're supposed to pay them now for playing their crap? I thought that's what all the coke and blowjobs were for ;^)

  39. Top Ten "What's next"... by The_REAL_DZA · · Score: 4, Funny
    From the riaa (they don't deserve capitals) home office deep in side the Twilight Zone, the top ten upcoming attempted revenue sources/potential targets for their harassment:

    • 10. Marching bands
    • 9. Wedding singers
    • 8. Kindergarten classes (they see a veritable MINT in The Hokey Pokey alone!)
    • 7. "Hold-Music"
    • 6. "Elevator-Music"
    • 5. Doorbells (esp. the kind like at the Clampett mansion on The Beverly Hillbillies)
    • 4. Ambulance sirens (their lawyers are nostalgic about chasing them anyway...)
    • 3. Organ grinders
    • 2. Merry-go-rounds
    And the #1 next target for their evil attentions:
    • 1. Jingles you get stuck in your head on the way to work and hum the same three bars of all day long (not that that ever happens to me, but a pox on The Astelins on that stupid antihistimine commercial!!!)
    --


    This space intentionally left (almost) blank.
  40. Re:The operation was a success, but the patient di by hmbcarol · · Score: 2, Informative

    Great metaphor, but California doesn't have many brick houses because we have earthquakes and masonry construction is far more dangerous in those cases.

    Wood "gives" and flexes during minor earthquakes, often with little or no damage. If the house "breaks" wood is relatively light, you will likely walk away from the disaster. Brick cracks if the house is even slightly flexed and a brick wall falling on you is ill-advised.

    I'm not even sure traditional masonry is allowable in new construction here.

  41. Payola by *weasel · · Score: 4, Insightful


    The RIAA already pays the radio stations to tell people what to like. They have all but admitted to manipulating playlists via bribes because they acknowledge that radio play == sales. So I'm not entirely sure how they are now going to argue that radio play is suddenly detrimental. Particularly not when they're still actively engaged in it. (though now via a corporate shell-game to side-step the FCC)

    My guess, is that the RIAAs is trying to put an end to payola. If the stations legally 'owe' the RIAA money for broadcasting, then they can negotiate airplay without having to write checks. They'll just grant the broadcasters performance rights 'coupons' for certain artists/tracks. Nothing really changes, the labels cut down some of the cost-of-doing business.

    --
    // "Can't clowns and pirates just -try- to get along?"
    1. Re:Payola by MrMarket · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So I wonder if its really worth it for the RIAA?
      It gives the labels a payola workaround.

      PROGRAM MANAGER: We really want to give this awesome song some airplay, but it costs too much; can you give us a break on the air-time fee?

      LABEL: Sure, but you'll have to play this list of 10 crappy songs for every time you play awesome song.
    2. Re:Payola by hedwards · · Score: 2, Interesting

      It'll be interesting to see how ASCAP reacts to this development. The argument that the RIAA has any sort of write to royalties on performances is tenuous at best. Radio stations already pay licensing fees as do restaurants, elevator companies and others that play recorded music. Expecting them to pay another set of licensing fees to cover the incompetent management of the CD industry is egregious.

      Of course, this is the RIAA so egregious is the silent e.

  42. so why then do broadcasters have licenses? by swschrad · · Score: 2, Informative

    yes, indeed, they do have blanket BMI and ASCAP licenses to allow them to play recorded music. they don't have to log the songs and pay by play, but there is a pool of broadcast money that the agencies divvy up. kind of like Macy's had better have their blanket license, or the Tone Police can come in and take them by the lawyers for the background music.

    kind of like you can take out a blanket license for your website, go see bmi.com for details.

    what congress did in the copyright law in the 30s was write a law that, in one section, required the music folks to license their music for broadcast and other public purposes. not create a free ride.

    --
    if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
  43. Wait just a damned minute! by ericrost · · Score: 4, Informative

    They already pay fees to play this music. Ever heard of ASCAP and BMI? That's why indie radio stations can't play commercial artists. Radio stations already pay to play, and now the RIAA wants royalties on top of licensing fees?

    What's the difference, someone point it out to me, please!

  44. Re:Absolutely! Strong support! by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This would drive radio stations to playing non-RIAA music...

    No, no it wouldn't. Don't fool yourself. People who listen to radio, for the most part listen to music the RIAA controls because they like the music. That's why people pirate the music the RIAA controls. Clear Channel exists because there are lots of people that like its product. Sad? Perhaps, but no less true.

    --
    If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
  45. They'll never get what they desire. by erroneus · · Score: 2, Insightful

    But since the labels that make up the RIAA are not getting the cash they desire ...

    Uhm... they'll never get what they desire. They desire "all of it" + 1.

    In this world where "success" is measured by growth and accelleration, a culture of cannibalism. If you have read [or heard] "From Good to Great" you would understand that good is the enemy of great, not a step below. It's that mentality that really seems to be causing this chaotic and carnivorous meltdown in business and culture.

    For me, in my mind, I think it's perfectly apparent that there are limits to one's ability to accellerate. There are limits to growth capacity. In both cases, when limits are exceeded, bad things happen. We live in a finite world with finite reasources. If "success" is measured by how something approaches something "infinite" I'd have to say there's a flaw in the logic.

  46. They can all burn together for all I care. by seanyboy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Given the amount of support given from the National Assn. of Broadcasters to Internet radio stations over royalty payments (ermm, none), I'm pretty happy for Radio stations to start paying royalties.

    To paraphrase:
    Hey, First they came for the music file sharers and you did nothing.
    And then they went for Internet Radio Stations and still you did nothing.
    And then they got the Satellite broadcasters and you didn't do anything then.
    And now they're coming for you.

    The radio stations can complain as much as they like, but in this situation, I can't be fucking bothered.

    --
    Training monkeys for world domination since 1439
  47. Missing the point by CodeShark · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Sure, music stations play a lot of RIAA related songs, and currently many stations are owned by one entity (Clear Channel). But there are still many small stations that realistically can't afford to dish out money to the RIAA that also provide a lot better news coverage and more musical variety (including local talent) than the Clear Channel/RIAA dominated stations.


    Unless we consider this a "freedom of expression" versus "corporate interests" battle for control of a major block of frequency ranges, we all lose because if the RIAA wins (i.e. the mammoth music production companies such as EMI, Sony, etc.) ), the little guys automatically lose, and we get more of the corporate fodder-crap music, etc. and NO outlets for true expression.

    --
    ...Open Source isn't the only answer -- but it's almost always a better value than the alternatives...
  48. Actually... by alexandreracine · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ...when you go to other country, radio stations do pay royalties.

    --
    No sig for now.
  49. So Let's Not Listen To Commercial Music by airship · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Commercial music was once one of the great joys of my life. I loved mainstream rock'n'roll, high-profile jazz artists, famous classical artists; in fact, I loved just about everything except country. I spent a lot of money on vinyl, then tape, then CDs, often re-buying the same music when a new format came along. You wouldn't believe how much I've spent over the years.

    I loved Napster and Kazaa when they came along because they allowed me to sample a lot of music I wouldn't have heard otherwise. When I found something I liked, I'd go out and buy a CD. You know, to 'support the band'. Only it turns out the bands didn't get much (if any) of the money, anyway; it went to the record companies and stopped there. Didn't matter, because the RIAA shut the download sites down. No more music sampling for me.

    Then the RIAA went on a rampage and started dragging grannies and gradeschoolers into court. That's when I stopped buying music. I just quit completely. I haven't bought a new CD in over four years.

    I began listening to Internet-streamed radio and loved it. Then the RIAA began trying to shut that down. Now they're going after commercial radio.

    Well, screw them. I'm done. No more commercial, big-record-company music for me. The RIAA can kiss my shiny metal ass.

    In the process of listening to streaming music, I've discovered some great independent music. I don't need the craptactular garbage the record companies dish out anymore. Especially not if they're going to try to fine me or send me to jail if I don't listen to it on their terms.

    Screw them. I hope they all starve, and their children, too.

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    Serving your airship needs since 1995.
  50. Proof that musicians are deluded by seanonymous · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "Mary Wilson, who with Diana Ross and Florence Ballard formed the original Supremes, said the exemption was unfair and forced older musicians to continue touring to pay their bills."

    Oh no! You mean those poor musicians have to keep working, just like the rest of us!? What is this world coming to!?

    Does an older assembly line worker at Ford continue to get paid every time someone drives a classic Mustang? Does an Amish quilt maker get a nickel every time someone gets cold and covers up? Of course not! Then what makes musicians so special?

    Idiots. Get back to work!