Slashdot Mirror
Safari on Windows, Leopard Debut at WWDC
comm2k writes to mention that Apple has announced a Windows version of Safari along with Leopard, the new version of Mac OS X at this years World Wide Developers Conference in San Francisco. "He said Safari was 'the fastest browser on Windows', saying it was twice as fast as Internet Explorer. A test version of Safari for Windows XP and for Vista is available for download from the Apple website. Apple is hoping to replicate the success of iTunes, which has proved enormously popular on both Macs and Windows machines."
* Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard) - ...of course. This was the main focus of the keynote. A "feature complete" version of Leopard was demonstrated, and all WWDC attendees receive the current, feature complete beta of Leopard and Leopard Server. Demos, movies, and more information about all of the many new features are available here. No one outside of the conference will receive these builds (but can be expected to receive later seeds). Leopard is still on track to ship in October. Leopard is $129, or $69 edu/govt (as usual). Free/cheap upgrades to Leopard will likely only for hardware purchased within month prior to its release (also as usual). (See also Leopard Server).
Mac OS X and Mac OS X Server press releases with more info.
* iPhone third party development - iPhone, previously thought to be completely closed, will have development possible via rich "Web 2.0" applications. Details on this are a little sketchy, and it's not what some hoping for a full iPhone SDK wanted, but it appears that all external app development will happen via web apps. However, it also appears such apps will appear as and have the look and feel of other iPhone apps. While this is news, it appears analysts are interpreting this as "new bad news", even though there was no expectation previously that iPhone would be an open platform, since it appeared that it would be closed, and this announcement is actually a positive development over the previous situation. iPhone is also still in schedule to ship on June 29 at 6pm via Apple retail stores and AT&T corporate stores. Still no news on specifics for online sales, preordering, etc.
Press release with more info.
* Safari Mac OS X and Windows - Safari is now available, in its 3.0 beta form, on Mac OS X 10.4.9 and Windows XP/Vista. At first glance, Safari is much, much faster than it was previously on Mac OS X, and includes a range of new features. This is the same version of Safari that will ship on Leopard and (essentially) iPhone. Safari is now also available on Windows; this is obviously going to be used as a channel of development for iPhone, since all external iPhone apps will essentially be Safari web apps.
Press release with more info.
* No new hardware, but the Apple Store and the rest of the Apple web site has a new look (which was why the Apple Store was down, which some see as an indication of new hardware announcements).
* Keynote summary
* Keynote archive will be available later today here.
I've already crashed Safari on Windows three times, but I was being pretty hard on it. You have to remember that this is still beta before you start bashing it, though.
Your tongues can't repel flavor of that magnitude!
Safari has always been based on KDE's KHTML, and they do contribute back to the community via the WebKit project.
See also:
KDE adds Safari feel to desktop Linux - The KDE Project has released a significant update to its K Desktop Environment software that includes refinements to the Konqueror Web browser derived from collaboration with Apple's Safari browser team.
KDE's Konqueror Browser Reaps Safari Benefits - In a perfect example of how open source and proprietary software can benefit each other, Apple got a significant headstart by basing Safari on established technologies like KHTML & Konqueror. And in return, Apple's contributions back to the open source community have benefitted Konqueror.
...RLY?
in a Terminal window. Obviously that command does not work on Windows.
Instead, open %APPDATA%\Apple Computer\Safari\Preferences.plist in your favorite text editor. Add:
and save it. Restart Safari. You now have a nifty "Debug" menu in the top menu bar, complete with the Javascript Console.
I wouldn't necessarily call it "hacking" for Safari, considering that Safari's KHTML-based rendering engine is more standards compliant than either Firefox or IE.
It's locked up (CPU consumption at 95%+ for a long time with nothing to show) on me a few times already and that's without stress testing.
I'm behind a corporate firewall, and while I can browse external sites I can't get to any internal servers. Sounds like a bug in the proxy handling.
Also, the edge window size controls don't show up.
- Jasen.
That's because instead of using the built-in Windows font smoothing (eg. ClearType) they decided to implement some bastardized version of the OSX font smoothing. The font smoothing on OSX is very nice, but Safari on Windows looks like crap! I would much prefer to use the built in font smoothing on Windows (like Firefox does).
I'm out of my mind right now, but feel free to leave a message.....
It's been based on KHTML/Konq since conception. If you want to use Safari (or its equivalence in Linux), just use Konq.
The only reason it runs on Windows now is because Adobe put a shit-ton of work into WebKit/WebCore to make their Apollo product, and now Apple's using the benefit of their partial-Carbon port to port Safari over and use the Win32-ized WebKit to power it.
The real good thing that's happening in WebKit/WebCore right now is the work going on to make it work with GTK+/GDK. Once that happens we'll have a web browser that looks and feels native to every major UI toolkit out there.
"Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is." G.W.Bush
This is WWDC. It is a developer conference, not a consumer conference. Its focus has always been software (although WWDC has occasionally been the forum for hardware announcements). Apple is doing more and more product introductions as they're ready (e.g., like last week's new MacBook Pro introduction), and less and less product introductions at conferences and "special events".
Everyone expecting brushed aluminum iMacs and new Cinema Displays shouldn't have expected that in the first place. And an Apple-branded virtualization solution? It's been known since last WWDC that Leopard wouldn't have integrated virtualization. With three different solutions already existing, plus Boot Camp, why would you even expect that, no matter how nice it would be?
And who would care about this announcement? This isn't just "Safari for Windows". Jeez. It's the channel for development for iPhone, since all of iPhone's third-party development will be as Safari web apps.
You have to "hack" to get IE to work. If you code to standards, generally Safari, Firefox, Opera, Konquerer, etc. all just work. We've found a few Safari specific bugs here, but all of them turned out to be bugs in our HTML, which were just handled a little better by Firefox.
Safari renders just fine –it's certainly more in line with the official specs than any other browser out there, with the possible exception of Opera. The problem is simply that Safari doesn't have Firefox's market share yet, so web developers who code all their sites with Firefox and IE in mind don't necessarily check to make sure they work well in Safari too.
It's the same problem that we used to have with the old Mozilla Suite. Gecko has, for the most part, always been great; but it wasn't until more developers got on board that using Mozilla or Firefox as a daily web browser became a pleasant experience. If anything, the problem that Safari currently faces in this regard is much less significant than the hurdle Mozilla originally had to jump.
No, Apple is not trying to replicate iTunes' success.
Agreed - the browser marketshare thing is just a front for getting millions of people to beta test their application development framework - YellowBox for Windows is back. Next year you can have real applications on the iPhone (and Mac, and Windows).
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
I think you're more right than you know. I think Apple is trying to replicate the iPod's success. They used iTunes to help sell the iPod to Windows users. I think they're porting Safari to try to help sell the iPhone to Windows users. The iPhone is running OS X and a version of Safari. It runs Web 2.0 applications in Safari. This release means Windows developers don't need OS X in order to develop and test for the iPhone. It also makes testing for Safari easier for Windows only Web developers.
Personally, I bounce back and forth between Firefox and Safari. Safari is faster and has some really nice features (support for services). Safari 3 has some things to offer too. I'm using it right now and the ability to just resize this text field kicks ass. I hope every other browser steals the idea. The Web inspector is nice too.
To be fair, Firefox renders text like shit on OS X, compared with Safari or any native Mac application.
Make Slashdot readable! See journal.
BTW, Google apps already work with Safari 3 (well, there probably are bugs and glitches, but they generally work).
I've just finished playing with both betas and here are the differences I've seen so far.
.Mac. I'm actually surprised at the lack of this option.
General Preferences: New default search engine option. It does not have the Open "safe" files after downloading option found in the OSX version..
Appearance Preferences: Font smoothing option. (This option is a standard system preference under OSX)
Bookmarks Preferences: Non of the "Address Book" bookmark options are available. No option to synchronize bookmarks using
Tab preferences: The same except for the key names. Ctrl instead of command. Alt instead of option.
Advanced preferences: Proxies option is grayed out.
No Safari application menu. "Quit" moved to File Menu and renamed "Exit"; "Private Browsing...", "Reset Safari...", "Empty Cache...", "Block Pop-Up Windows", and "Preferences..." moved to Edit menu; "About Safari", and "Report Bugs to Apple..." moved to the Help menu.
File Menu: Missing "Mail Contents of This Page", new "Print Preview" option (in OSX this is part of the Print dialog.), "Save As..." does not have a shortcut key.
Edit Menu: Shortcut added to "Delete"; Shortcuts changed for '"Find Again", "Find Previous" and "Hide Find Banner".
View Menu: Many of the Text Encodings available in the OS X are not included. 25 under Windows, 37 under OSX.
History: Not sure if this is changed or not. OSX Window offers date sub menus such as "Earlier today...". Have not used the Windows version long enough to see if they appear.
Help: Shortcut for help changed to F1
User Agent under Windows beta: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en) AppleWebKit/522.11.3 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Safari/522.11.3
User Agent under OS X beta: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/522.10.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Safari/522.11
Agreed. I messed around with SVG about 5 years ago. I keep hoping it'll break into the mainstream. Maybe Safari 3.0 and the iPhone can help make that happen.
- Jasen.
- Nice smooth interface, takes up less space than Firefox.
- Definitely beta software. I get occasional and sporadic crashes. These are not currently consistently repeatable.
- Font rendering is nice, including Unicode characters.
- Unicode characters that I have fonts for no longer display as boxes in the title bar (they still do in Firefox).
- Transitioning to pages sometimes takes significantly longer than it should. It will stall before loading the page.
Integrate Keynote and LaTeX
I’d definitely have to disagree with the assessment that Microsoft apps for the Mac are “the best;” that may well have been true in the past, but the current incarnation of Office for Mac is, without a doubt, the most bloated and ridiculously clunky ‘productivity suite’ I’ve ever had the misfortune of trying to use. Besides sucking memory like a hungry newborn, it has consistantly shown buggy formatting both in Word and in Excel.
@yg
It's in svn, check it out, read through it, commit some code. It's getting further and further along every single time I check up on it.
The GTK+ bindings for WebKit will enable WebKit to run in GNOME; of course you'd need to write a complete browser (or find a way to hack it into Galeon or Epiphany), but because the generic widget-set in WebKit can be re-implemented with just about any widget toolkit you want (WxWidgets, GTK+, Qt, etc), it makes the engine extremely generic (which is the greatest thing about WebKit).
The Carbon port is what allows Safari (a Carbonized app) to run in Windows. Think Safari:Firefox::WebKit:Gecko.
"Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is." G.W.Bush
....the part where Steve said that Safari is the SDK for iPhone apps didn't you?
(^_^)
Mac OS X and Windows XP working side by side to fight back the night.
Actually, they will have at least 3 seperate versions not even including the educational discounts or other such promotions. This is based on the current 10.4 prices.
OS X Leopard 10.5 - $129
OS X Leopard 10.5 Family Pack - $199
OS X Server 10.5 - $499 and up
They could prove me wrong and implement all of the server niceities into the consumer version and grant a new license that allows you to install on any systems you own but I seriously doubt that will happen. I'm fairly certain that when I upgrade to the Ultimate version that it will cost more than $129.
Despite what Apple's Web site says, it installs on Windows 2000 just fine.
Hell, I'm typing this response in Safari 3 on Windows 2000.
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
Point me to the place on Apple's Developer Connection where I can download the Cocoa Frameworks for Win32... He was talking about the win32 Carbon port because that's what they probably used to make Safari for windows, rather than port all of Carbon to Win32. It makes the most sense.
Now I know that they have stated in the past that they want to bring things like CoreFoundation and the Cocoa frameworks to all platforms (e.g. Linux and Windows at least, maybe BSD), but unless you have inside knowledge that they are complete/stable enough to port a production app on, then I would rather believe that they ported Safari to Carbon for the Windows XP/Vista versions.
Works in IE, Firefox, Safari...L as in Location.
Command-L on the Mac.
The US free market: two halves of a government-granted duopoly are free to set the market price.
You can't get iTunes without QuickTime because iTunes uses QuickTime to play files. You can, however, get QuickTime without iTunes. It's really easy. There's a big radio button that says "QuickTime 7.1.6 with iTunes for Windows 2000/XP" and a second that says "QuickTime 7.1.6 for Windows 2000/XP". Before that, there was a big link that said "QuickTime Standalone Player" to download QuickTime without iTunes.
Don't blame Apple just because you can't be bothered to read.
In Safari, you don't type ctrl-enter to type www.*.com. You just type the name of the website and Safari is smart enough to figure out that you wanted .com on it's own.
You think Office 98 was bad? You must have not been old enough to suffer Word/Excel 6 for the Mac.
Apple implemented a wrapper around the original qt/kde code when they ported khtml to the Mac. Who's to say they didn't do the same with the Windows version? Besides, if you install WebObjects 5.2 on Windows, you'll see that there is a lot of supporting crap for that old stuff. I don't see that stuff in the Safari install.
.NET and Java already. They don't need anything else. Plus, if they really want to use cocoa like code, they can always run GNUstep.
If you are correct, then Apple is ready to give up on the computer business. Windows developers have
MidnightBSD: The BSD for Everyone
For adblocking on Safari have a look at the free add-on SafariBlock http://fsbsoftware.com/SafariBlock.html
Performance measured in seconds. Testing conducted by Apple in June 2007 on a 2.16GHz Intel Core 2 Duo-based iMac system running Windows XP Professional SP2, configured with 1GB of RAM and an ATI Radeon X1600 with 128MB of VRAM. HTML and JavaScript benchmarks based on VeriTest's iBench Version 5.0 using default settings.
Webkit started on KHTML, but they've changed it a LOT.
You can check the CSS selectors test.
Safari passes 299/513 tests, firefox passes 314/513, konqueror passes 508/513.
That shows you how far Apple has drifted from KHTML.