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Weapon Found in Whale Dated From the 1800s
LABarr writes "AP and CNN are carrying a story that has forced scientists to re-evaluate the longevity of mammals. A bowhead whale caught off the Alaskan coast last month had a weapon fragment embedded in its neck that showed it survived a similar hunt over a century ago. 'Embedded deep under its blubber was a 3½-inch arrow-shaped projectile that has given researchers insight into the whale's age, estimated between 115 and 130 years old. The bomb lance fragment, lodged in a bone between the whale's neck and shoulder blade, was likely manufactured in New Bedford, on the southeast coast of Massachusetts, a major whaling center at that time. It was probably shot at the whale from a heavy shoulder gun around 1890.' "
Captain Ahab ALWAYS gets his whale... Eventually.
This isn't the first time this has happened. I believe in one of Bill Bryson's books - probably 'A Short History of Nearly Everything' - he mentions a whale being found with a hand-thrown inuit spearhead embedded in its blubber. Or something along those lines... Anyway, it put the age of the animal well over 100 years.
A-Bomb
Nothing proves that man is who rules the Earth like taking animals that are 130 years old, killing them, and then hacking them up with a chainsaw. Keep showin' them animals who's boss, oh brave hunters.
YOU'RE NEXT, TURTLES
My very first thought when I read the headline was, 'If whales live so long, we should not be hunting them. They probably have a very finite rate of reproduction, their numbers are low and getting lower, and we're even killing the old ones.' I wish we would stop killing whales.
Ships injure and kill whales, whalers kill whales, sonar from U.S. Navy submarines kill whales and ruin their hearing. What we're doing is unforgivable.
Is anybody else alarmed about the news that we just killed an old whale?
Best regards.
Whales live indefinitely, and their master race 'swims' the universe in large cylinders. Everyone has known this since the historical documents were released in 1986.
Click here or here.
When reached for additional comment the scientists replied "Hey, I call 'em like I see 'em. I'm a whale biologist."
It probably felt just fine. I imagine being cut up by chainsaw recently felt much worse.
Developers: We can use your help.
Every time it would rain, the poor whale can be heard for miles singing the complaining song of old whales. Roughly translated from whale song as he was talking to younger whales, "Aye! My neck is killing me! Years ago, some son of a bitch human shot me right in me neck! Yarrr. It 'urts every time a storm is ah brew'n. Yarrr. Take note young'ns"
I prefer Flambe as apposed flamebait.
If whales are livening longer than we thought and yet their numbers are still lower than they should be Who knows what the reproductive life of a whale is and it could mean many of the living adults dont breed anymore
The whale wasn't "caught", it was killed. It's really disappointing to think that people still killing rare, intelligent mammals that can live to over 150 years old.
And before people start telling me that whale hunting is part of Inuit tradition, I'd like to point out that TFA mentions that this whale was killed with an mechanically-launched explosive projectile. That's about as traditional as a Lakota shooting a buffalo with an AK-47.
How did it taste?
Deleted
I dunno, but if your whole argument for whale killing is that its preserving an ancient tradition, don't you think that arguments starts to look a little silly when you go out and do it with machine guns and sonar.
Whaling is supposed to permitted by the IWC for traditional hunts by certain indigenous peoples. Perhaps you'd like to tell us what part of using a sophisticated modern projectile weapon is traditional?
The tragedy and travesty is that most of these so-called "traditional" hunts are bogus. Rather than using traditional means and rituals these "natives" are using modern weapons, sonar and a variety of other means to find and kill whales. The catch being often turned over to the Japanese for profit.
There is as much "tradition" in this type of whaling as there is "science" in Japanese scientific whaling. It's all a smokescreen for profit.
So, I agree with the original poster, although "yayhoos" is a very generous word.
I'm willing to bet that their lives have less of a negative global impact than your life.
It's like sex, except I'm having it!
How are they to change? The regions these people live in are too cold to support enough land based agriculture to survive, and shippping food up from warmer climates is terribly expensive. Without a local export economy, the people there can't AFFORD food grown elsewhere. No company is going to relocate its manufacturing base north of the Arctic Circle, so these people either have to exist as hunters, or exist as welfare recipients. They choose to maintain some dignity and keep their native culture operating.
The Intuit whale take is below the species replacement rate, so they aren't putting the bowheads survival in any danger.
There is nothing so pathetic as seeing a beautiful young theory roughed up by a tough gang of facts.
I am sorry, but I cannot agree.
Although the general argument goes along the lines that allowing indigenous people to hunt whales makes it harder to put pressure on Asians, I think that this argument is deeply flawed. We have stopped hunting whales with modern weapons because we realize the harm we are doing to the environment. Unless the Japanese and others come to a similar realization, we will not be able to stop them.
One important (even priceless) posession is that of cultural heritage and living tradition. I recognize that many in the world today, having lost a sense of heritage and tradition, fail to appreciate its value, but telling native peoples which traditions they can or cannot do (or even should or should not do) is simple imperialism and tramples on this priceless posession.
The danger of extinction for a species due to traditional practices only comes from two sources. If we recognize this, we can allow people to continue with their heritage and still avoid damage to the environment.
The first is due to technological advancement. This is what lead to the extinction of the Aurochs in Europe (the development of firearms used in hunting wiped out this animal very quickly. Arguably, the rise in higher technology weaponry nearly caused the extinction of many species of whales as well.
The second is due to explosion of demand. This is usually linked to either population increase or more likely more efficient methods of hunting (see the previous paragraph).
Before people suggest that it is still immoral to hunt whales just because they are whales (and absent from sustainability issues), let me say one thing. Every time you eat the standard chicken you get at the supermarket, every time you eat a hamburger, and every time you eat a boiled egg, unless you go out of your way to do otherwise, you are contributing to a system which imprisons animals in ways which are far more unethical.
Personally, I try my best to eat only free range or organically raised meat wherever I can. I go to the length of buying a side of beef once a year from a farmer who raises the cattle locally and humanely. But to suggest that it is unethical for Native Americans to hunt whales while contributing to this gross mistreatment of livestock is not only imperialist, it is also hypocritical.
LedgerSMB: Open source Accounting/ERP
People have been assholes for a long time!
Why don't you post from an account instead of posting as an AC?
I am aware that Inuit were doing the hunting. So what? Inuit have other choices. Fishing for salmon would be a good example.
I do value the Inuit culture, but at a certain point clinging to old ways becomes a Luddite reaction to change. They don't need to hunt whale, and their continuing hunts of whales endanger their future ability to hunt whales.
Mankind needs to move on. Lingering in old ways does not exalt the past, it mocks the past.
Best regards.
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Aging Whales: Evidence of Age
Marine researchers now believe that the Arctic Bowhead whale may live 180 years or longer making it the longest lived mammal on earth. Back in the early 1990's, biologists weren't sure whether to trust these estimates, that is, until they stumbled on an important clue. I'm Jim Metzner, and this is the Pulse of the Planet, presented by DuPont. Jeffery Bada is a Professor of Marine Chemistry at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography at La Jolla, California.
"During the annual harvest by the local Inuit hunters, the biologists that were observing this found that there were stone harpoons imbedded in some of these whales. And these stone harpoons were no longer used by the local hunters after about 1870. Stone harpoons in a whale that was killed in the 90's implies that it is over a hundred years old, and this provided independent confirmation that we indeed were onto something really interesting."
What proved equally as interesting to Jeffrey Bada and the other researchers, was the fact that the oldest whales taken during the harvest were all males.
"I don't think it necessarily implies that the males of the species live longer than the females. It has more to do with their behavior. These hundred year plus old whales were survivors of the great slaughter of whales that took place in the late nineteenth century. And males in this species of Bowheads, tend to be solitary animals, where as the females group together in these big pods of whales, and as a result, they were probably more easily hunted. It may be that the solitary males survived, whereas the females were more heavily exploited."
We'll hear more about the long-lived Bowhead whales in a future programs. Pulse of the Planet is presented by DuPont, bringing you the miracles of science for 200 years, with additional support provided by the National Science Foundation.
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[ above from: http://pulseplanet.com/archive/Feb02/2602.html ]
I should point out - their 'heritage' now apparently includes rocket-propelled harpoons and chainsaws.
If they want to preserve their ancient ways, fine. Hunt whales from small canoes with bone spears. But don't use a chainsaw and claim you're 'preserving your heritage'. Heritage is not a buffet. Either do it as your ancestors did to keep in touch with your past, or man up and move on.
-EvilMagnus
The whales are not getting extinct because 'nature does not need them anymore' but because some greedy humans earn money with killing them. The same goes for rhinos, elephants, tigers etc. Their place in the ecosystem has not been filled by other species, they are just slaughtered on behalf of a few boneheaded egocentric idiots who think it's cool to have a tigerskin or who don't care about the consequences of eating whale-meat.
It's not just about saving a species, it's about the whole ecosystem a species fits in that is destroyed because of the actions of forementioned idiots.
What person will donate an airborne act of love?
One important (even priceless) posession is that of cultural heritage and living tradition.
This is always brought up, implying that human tradition is so sacrosanct. Subsistence hunting is one thing, but many traditions and heritages are steeped in ridiculous mysticism, bigotry, and pseudoscience.
I mean, I know that I wholeheartedly support movements that seek to stop equality for the sexes, because it's so important to my culture to treat women like shit. Or how about those traditions of imperialism, wanton slaughter of natives, poisoning the environment.
The greater whole of humanity and the environment should always trump any cultural tradition. The real reason small indigenous groups can continue their subsistence hunting is because their impact is negligible.
Talking about culture as if it is some static thing is ridiculous in of itself. Culture changes as science progresses and social revolutions occur. Once the majority of whites realized that colored people weren't a bunch of savage slightly intelligent monkeys, most of them woke up and started treating them with some modicum of dignity. The only "culture" true to humans is that we adapt and change. Everything else is aesthetics (the clothes we wear, art we fashion, things we pray to, dreams we have).
The speartip recovered from the 1890s was an explosive harpoon too. ;) There's pretty much no 'humane' way of killing a whale - they're too big to kill quick unless you blow them up with a depth charge. The basic method of modern whale hunting hasn't changed in over 100 years. You harpoon 'em with something big and explosive, then let them drag themselves to exhaustion and death. It usually takes a few hours. That's one of the reasons why whale hunting is in a special category all by itself.
-EvilMagnus
I should point out - their 'heritage' now apparently includes rocket-propelled harpoons and chainsaws.
If they want to preserve their ancient ways, fine. Hunt whales from small canoes with bone spears. But don't use a chainsaw and claim you're 'preserving your heritage'. Heritage is not a buffet. Either do it as your ancestors did to keep in touch with your past, or man up and move on.
Yeah, and at some point in the past they upgraded from bone to stone hewn tools to metal. At some point in the past they have made improvements to the designs of their boats. Exactly which revision of their "heritage" are you saying they have to stick to for it to satisfy you?
Unless one of their cultural traditions is "technological statism" then I don't see the problem. They didn't "man up and move on" when they invented a better harpoon; it was considered the natural continuation of the same heritage. Because there's a lot more to the underlying cultural heritage than a specific hunting technique.
Or do you think the plains natives should have stopped their traditional bison hunts after they aquired the horse from European settlers? I think in both cases the spiritual and cultural significance of the hunt was not fundamentally erased just because they figured out a new and better way to do it.
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I got hit by a 1957 Chevy, therefore I must be at least 50 years old.
word.