Slashdot Mirror
Does the UK iPhone Plan Add Up?
An anonymous reader writes "Is it just me or is the UK iPhone deal seriously more expensive than the US deal? If you look at what AT&T offers compared to what O2 offers, you get significantly less for your money in the UK than you do in the States. It's also significantly more expensive than other non-iPhone deals in the UK, which offer similar services. Steve Jobs response to the more expensive UK iPhone is that 'it's more expensive to do business in the UK', but what does that mean? As a UK resident I'm disappointed that we didn't get the same plan as the AT&T plan, particularly the free mobile-to-mobile calls. Is there some element of the UK iPhone service that I'm missing here?"
In the US, we pay for incoming calls.
In other words, our minutes are eaten in half if we make as many calls as we receive. That's probably one aspect right there.
GPL Deconstructed
I'm un the US and with my provider/plan I don't get free mobile-to-mobile calls. Moreover, I have to pay for incoming calls and messages. This all depends on the particular provider/plan. It's about O2, not about Apple.
Alas, the tax rates are dramatically higher there and they probably sock it to the cell phone folks. There are many things to love about Britain, but it's not known for selling stuff on the cheap. Practically everything costs more there except, perhaps, for warm beer. And if memory serves me right, there was a raft of regulations that kept prices of beer cheap. That's a simple way to buy off the masses.
You're lucky to have the iPhone with inexpensive unlimited data. In canada, we have rogers wireless. You can get 500 MB of data for "only" $210.00/month + $7 system access fee!
"As a UK resident I'm disappointed that we didn't get the same plan as the AT&T plan, particularly the free mobile-to-mobile calls." This has nothing to do with the iPhone and everything to do with your carrier. Virtually all U.S. carriers include unlimited mobile to mobile, iPhone or not.
The free WiFi via TheCloud makes the wifi portion of the iPhone actually useful, as there are thousands of TheCloud WiFi networks around the country. I don't think that there is anything similar for the US iPhone.
Also the unlimited data usage is probably underestimated. Sure, they say 1400 pages a day, but how big is a web page these days (excluding Flash)? 100KB? That's 140MB a day, which would cost a tonne over here with many other deals.
The talk and text limits are rather poor of course. I pay £10 a month for 500 minutes and 100 texts with Three, so when £35 only has 200 minutes and 200 texts and no phone subsidy you have to worry.
It's about Apple because they force you to use O2...
Then you can expect similar iTunes store or iPhone pricing as in US. Long-established british companies have probably learned on how not too pay the tax as many times on the same item as a foreigner new to the area would.
Apple pushing a product that's more expensive than competitors and expecting people to flock over and buy it just because of they style and hype surrounding it? Why that would NEVER work!
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is kinky.
I was given this rule prior to my first overseas trip, and I've found it to be generally accurate for the UK:
Take an item in the US, and it will probably cost the same in GBP in the UK as it does in USD in the US. With the current exchange rate, this means that most items cost a little over twice as much in the UK vis-a-vis the US.
iThink my money will stay in my pocket. After all, someone's got to have money to bail our banks out.
I know the truth and I know what you're thinking
Everything is more expensive in the UK than in the States, even though wages are lower on average. Why do companies charge more for the same product over here?
Because they can.
British consumers have become numbed to paying more for less over the years, so companies clap their hands with glee at the thought of increasing their profit margins by 50% or more over the US for exactly the same product. "Oh, but you use PAL." "Oh, but you use 240 volts AC with three-prong plugs." "Oh, but you have VAT." Always the same excuses, and they're pretty much bullshit - but nobody questions them any more. We've been ground down by decades of being ripped off.
You must think in Russian.
If I had to guess, I would bet it has something to do with the fact that the UK has these things called "laws" that protect consumer rights. In the long run, that costs corporations money that would otherwise be acquired through shafting the consumer.
I'm American but have lived in London for ten years. Yes, (some) things are more expensive here. I was curious and looked into it. Excepted from the above link:
When you buy goods from a trader, such as a shop, market stall, garage, etc, you enter into a contract, which is controlled by many laws including, the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended by the Sale & Supply of Goods Act 1994 and the Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002). The law gives you certain implied, or automatic, statutory rights, under this contract.
The Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended) says that goods should be :
Store policies don't matter; this is the law and retailers must incorporate this cost into selling prices.
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You must be either on a lowend pay-as-you-go plan or on a VERY old plan and are avoiding contract renewal.
Unlimited M2M within your carrier has basically been standard in the U.S. for a few years. (Note to Europeans: ONLY applies to mobile-to-mobile on the same carrier, not to others in the U.S.)
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
It's not called Rip Off Britain for nothing you know.
Seriously though, yes our prices include VAT at 17.5% which people often forget to take into account but, even so, there are plenty of products which have such a colossal additional mark-up on them (Windows Vista is twice as expensive which tax and shipping costs cannot explain away) compared to our European and American counterparts that it is hard not to feel cheated.
The Wikipedia article on it is worth reading and notes that these items cost significantly more in the UK:
Unfortunately as we put up with paying those prices, we allow companies to continually screw us.
Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
In the US, a call to a cell is the same as a call to a fix, so cell to cell calling is "inexpensive", whatever the operator. In the UK I presume (like in France), it does cost a lot more to call a cell than a fix, so naturally no cheap plan will have that.
If your complaint is with the monthly pricing plan, it probably has more to do with the provider than Apple, if my AT&T experience is any indication.
I have no idea if the parent is correct or not but I'm British, God damn it, and I demand the right to go red in the face and get outraged about being ripped off.
Come on, don't you guys know how this works by now? You wait on line for hours to get your hands on one of the very first UK iPhones with an overly expensive 2 year agreement, then two months later new "improved" (cheaper) service plans are offered and you get a gift certificate as a consolation prize for being a sucker.
Apparently, brits make many more dental claims.
that UK pays ~.7-.8 pounds what US pays in dollars? I mean isn't an itunes track in UK 79pence (~$1.60)
Looking at O2's website, we see this breakdown in plans: 200min plus 400 text: 25pounds 750min plus 100 text: 35pounds 1350min plus 100 text: 50pounds http://shop.o2.co.uk/tariffs/18_months/Talker http://shop.o2.co.uk/tariffs THESE ARE ONLINE-ONLY SPECIALS. One has to assume that the iPhone will cost 10pounds more per month than the normal plans (since they cost an extra $20 more per month over here). So, the iPhone charges 10pounds more at the 200min level (but you loose half the texts), 10 pounds more at the 750 minute level (loosing 150 minutes, but gaining 400 texts), and 5pounds more at the 1350 minute level (again loosing 150 minutes and gaining 400 texts). They MIGHT be a worse deal than the AT&T plans over here, but not by much. They're pretty much standard O2 rates plus 10 pounds. Since the AT&T plans are the standard AT&T plans plus $20, that's pretty equivalent. NOTE: In both cases, the premium you're paying for an iPhone plan is getting you unlimited data and so if you're already paying for that, you might not consider it an increase in fee at all.
It's hard to imagine how a country that pays more for everything is surprised that the iPhone's service plan isn't the same price as the US version. Of course, that gives the ignorant shills an opportunity to spew such silliness as "Apple takes 40% of O2's revenues!!!" and other made up factoids.
BBC Prints Irresponsible Rubbish on Apple
The BBC has joined the London tabloid press in printing a series of articles skewering Apple over invented suppositions based entirely upon misinformed speculation and some outright lies. The worst part is that the BBC is being grossly hypocritical in its misinformation campaign against Apple, because the company is up to its eyeballs in the Microsoft-encrusted scandal surrounding its proprietary, Windows-only iPlayer imbroglio.
UK Tabloids Pick Up Zoon Awards
It's not just the American media that is desperate to publish misleading or downright false information in attempts to prevent the erosion of existing barriers to innovation. The release of the iPhone in the UK touched off a flurry of snide reporting worthy of being Zooned.
Steve Jobs is still mad at Gordon Brown because of that incident last month.
Nothing for 6-digit uids?
UCC Article 2 unifies contract law for the sales of goods across all states with the exception, as always, of Louisiana. (In this case, Louisiana's hybrid French/English system already had statutes on the books governing contracts.)
If it's for-profit but free, you're not the customer -- you're the product (e.g., the Slashdot Beta's "audience").
There is nothing special about a Mac or iPhone or iPod. The Mac provides me a great deal of value, so I buy it. The iPhone does not provide the value that the additional costs would warrant, so I won't buy one. I think people miss this simple point when they complain about the price drop of the iPhone. Current users effectively spent $2000 for the phone. This amount of money meant that the phone must have had some significant value to them, especially those that bought the first week. The $200 discount then represents a mere 10% discount, and 10% is an exceptional price to become an early adopter. I was not an early adopter my normal tolarance for contracted costs is about a third of what Apple and ATT wanted.
I hope we don't have to endure another year of moaning about the cost of the phone, or the cost of the plan, or the cost of early adoption. Those who have it find some value in it, and that is really all there is to it. Apple sells expensive machines, and those that need or want them buy them. Those that do not don't. If one needs or wants an iPhone, the costs will be worth it. Otherwise buy something else and apple will out the costs until it is low enough to attract the expected number of consumers.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
I'm sure the European commission will LOVE apple locking the iPhone to O2, and I'm sure they will LOVE how it will operate together with iTunes. I'm also sure the European market will LOVE that it has shoddy 3G support. Also, I'm sure the lack of big Telecom monopolies in most EU countries will make it just as successful to do this over here as in the US. Don't get me wrong. Apple will make money here. It just won't be because the iPhone or the price plan, or service, or provider will be any good, but rather because the marketing and the hype will be. In short, they are going to offer a very sucky deal combined with a massive marketing campaign, and a lot of idiots will think the iPhone is actually remarkably innovative, when it really isn't even equal to a lot of phones already on the European market.
Then, if it actually does become a large success the EC will want to have something to say about the relationship between the iPhone, iTunes and the iPod, and also the deal with O2. If they actually decide to do something about it then a bunch of people who can barely find Europe on the map, let alone know anything about its legal history, will moan and accuse the EU of being partial against US companies, and as a result get flamed on slashdot [for great justice]. Politics at its finest...
You're the douche who bought an iPhone.
There is, of course, the translations part.. translating Windows can't be cheap; though it surely can't be -that- expensive either.
Note that Adobe and Autodesk also have vast price increases up to well over 2x as expensive; not including the 17.5% / 19% VAT that gets added on top. With the sucking U.S. dollar, that's only getting worse and worse. It'll be interesting to see if Adobe / Autodesk / etc. will adjust their non-U.S. pricing to adjust for this, as currently it is much cheaper to import from the U.S. -and- risk any import duty fees.
You guys get free access to a nationwide wifi network! We here in the USA wish our iPhone plans included such a bonus.
Viper is the preferred editor of the Emacs operating system.
The stated 'fair usage' limit in the article is a tiny 200Mb a month. It's possible to exceed that by downloading just 4 albums of music from the iTunes store!
I can't see O2 being able to enforce such a ridiculous limit, it clearly falls foul of the UK's law that states unfair contract terms cannot be enforced.
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
Bollocks, you septics know nothing...... Buying a phone in the UK is nowt like buying a television. Twat. Watch NBC? - I'd rather pluck my nose-hair.
If I had an Ass, I'd call it Fanny Bottom, then I could slap my Ass; Fanny Bottom, on the Arse.
Aren`t Apple fans used to paying for more and getting less ?
At the very top of the Wikipedia link:
This article does not cite any references or sources.
Shock, horror - some things are more expensive in some locales and cheaper in others. If you don't like it, put down the Daily Mail, stop whinging, and move.
There are significant differences in prices and wages across the UK (and of course across the US and other countries as well). There are no inverse price restrictions ensuring that "iTunes Store songs" (there's a staple, obviously...) are priced as they are in the UK - they're priced in accordance with what the market will bear. If you think something is too expensive, don't buy it.
I feel qualified to discuss this since i'm British but currently live and work in the USA, in New York.
I work as a Project Manager and get paid $40k, i'm 23 years old. For someone with my background and education, if I was working in London, i'd probably get £30k, ie 60k dollars!
It makes no sense to compare prices and say "omg macs are like twice the price!!!!". Yes but those cheeky Brits are being paid more too! They also pay a lot less in healthcare (nothing).
I recently signed up in the UK to a 12 month contract with a new free Nokia 6300, 400 mins 400 texts (including mobile to mobile), with 100% (yes you read it right) cashback. Ok, the phone isn't great (but then i just sold it for £130 and kept my sony walkman phone that i got free last year) - but the comparable deal with the iphone is just laughably expensive. The iPhone looks like a great product but I can't see it being long before the other phone manufacturers bring out products that are of similar quality for a fraction of the price. The mobile market is one area where there is pretty much cut-throat competition in the UK and if you know where to look you can get some scarily impressive deals.
Various retailers used to call the UK "Treasure Island", because they could pretty well charge what they like, and the Brit public would willingly pay.
http://www.rip-off.co.uk/island.htm
And I guess Apple are playing the same tune.
In GB, The median gross household income in 2004/05 was £24,700 per year. ... so no, I don't think he was.
and they'll line up for the street-cams with a smile. Charge'em a little extra for a phone, AND HOLY SHIT, OH WHAT A WORLD!
If you compare the tariffs for O2 service (12 month contract) before the iPhone, you could get 200 min and 400 texts for 30 pounds/month http://shop.o2.co.uk/tariffs/12_months or 500 min/100 texts on an 18-month contract. For 5 pounds more, you get unlimited data access with the iPhone. While there may be cheaper ways to get cell phone service in the UK, if you want O2, the rates for the iPhone are not much higher than pre-iPhone.
What's not great about the 6300?
Sorry, average wage is £447 a week in 2006, from http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=285. That's just over £23k. So I was off by a couple of grand, less considering pay went up 3.5% in the year since.
"...or their equivalent of craigslist."
It's called Craiglist.
The sooner October 1993 arrives the better.
A carrier having an exclusive handset is hardly big news.
I mean seriously, compare it against the competition which are offering the same speeds as my ADSL line onto your phone, who wants to use an iPhone in the UK other than fashion victims?
In the UK, you pay more for music from iTunes, you pay more for audio CDs, and you pay more for electronics. You also pay per minute for phone calls on your landline telephones (WTF?!?!). So, yes, you're getting ripped off, but not just on the iPhone.
"If it's real, then it gets more interesting the closer you examine it. If it's not real, just the opposite is true." -
UK citizens know how to compare. Why is this being compared against AT&T plan? This is a different carrier with different plans. Apples to Oranges, grown in different orchards. We US mobile phone owners have enough problems here figuring one plan against another (from carrier to carrier); I wouldn't want to spend my minutes (pun intended) opining on the differences in rate structures/model between the US carriers and non-US carriers, unless of course I traveled there often. A simple question to anyone that knows... can you pop out the AT&T SIM and pop in the O2 SIM if you have both plans?
- Sammy iPhone
OT: Michigan is considering extending the sales tax to services because it is facing a 1.75 billion dollar budget deficit.
Forget age - getting things done is what counts. Are you PMP certified? PMP is sorta like the old Netware certification - read a book, memorize it, take a test - get paid more.
... $2231. So exactly who pays less? My health insurance is called a PPO - I select my doctors and pay a co-pay for every visit, then I pay 20% of the total cost until my annual out of pocket limit, $1K, is reached. So for covered costs, my upper limit is $3350 even if I'm really sick. That's a fairly minor cost to my family.
Where I live in Atlanta, much less costly than NYC, Project Managers with PMPs routinely earn $100K+/yr.
Heck, at age 23 about 20 years ago, I earned $32K/yr as a starting salary. 15 years ago I was making $42K/yr and these were government jobs, but I had an engineering degree from a name-brand top 10 program.
The good news is that more money doesn't really make you any happier once you're above $50K/yr. Read that somewhere that I can't find now. There is a UK study that showed different results http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/news/article.html?in_article_id=421202&in_page_id=2 that must be a cultural difference.
So, either you are unbelievably underpaid, working here illegally or you really suck!
I understand that our tax rate is significantly lower here http://www.worldwide-tax.com/ in the States too. According to the link, around 22% less. Only someone very naive would think that in the UK health care is free. My personal health care/insurance costs for 2006 were less than $2350 annually according to Quicken, but I'm not sick. This page http://www.abpi.org.uk/statistics/section.asp?sect=4 shows that in 2005, the estimated cost per person in the UK was 1,562 - converting that to USD
In Hong Kong, I pay $6.50 USD for 500 minutes and $0.002 per minute after that. Seems like a pretty huge difference to the rest of the world. Although I guess they only have 1000sqkm to cover.
and you also get a 300 page bill here if you have an iphone but I'm guessing not over there. You'd think the lack of massive printing fees would make them lower it some more but hey lol
Google's Super Secret Search Algorithm: SELECT @search_results FROM internet WHERE @search_results = 'good'
Not I, there are better phones and much cheaper.
I'm sure it'll sell to morons, but not that many folks will care to pay that much for this crippled piece of arse.
...if it turns out that mobile 'phone use does give you brain cancer, at least you will not have to pay for the treatment here.
First of all, you have to make a decision not just on price, but on usability. 200 minutes in a plan is just not useable, infact, anything under 500 minutes in rubbish, especially if you project your needs over the next 18 - 24 months. So, I made the decision that any plan for the iPhone HAD to have over 500 minutes as a minimum requirement. Based on that here are my findings, the results might surprise you:
;-)
:-)
(Note: All the £UK prices include 17.5% tax)
I now have my iPhone running on T-Mobile in the UK. I bought the plan last week, so was pissed when O2 announced their packages, but got a lot happier when I looked into it.
On the face of it, the O2 plan gives you one thing T-Mobile does not, Free WiFi.
Now, I am on an 18 month contract (Flext 35 + web'n'walk (18 months)), paying £37.50 a month for "Use your allowance on any mix of UK calls, voicemail, texts & picture messages. £180 allowance gets you up to 900 minutes or 1800 texts. Don't decide in advance, just use your phone and use it up." Treat that £180 allowance as 1800 credits, where 2 credits gets me 1 minute of voice time and a text message costs 1 credit (say 650 minutes 500 texts).I get unlimited (* fair use policy yada yada) data access. I also get free weekend calls.
To get the same Voice/Text/Data package on O2, you need to go for the £45 per month plan. 600 minutes and 500 texts, unlimited data. However, it DOES give you free access to TheCloud Wifi service (I'll come back to TheCloud in a moment).
The AT&T equivalent plan is $79.99 a month, approximately £40. That gets you 900 minutes, 200 texts, unlimited data, no WiFi (my T-Mobile plan by comparison would give me 800 minutes and 200 texts). The the AT&T plan is more expensive because there is a $36 activation fee, $1.75 a month "Regulatory Cost Recovery Charge" AND the prices do not include Tax.
So, in short, based upon Voice/Text and Data, AT&T in the USA and T-Mobile in the UK are no different and O2 is a bit pricey, but it does have that free WiFi, so lets look at that.
The Cloud has two types of plans, pay as you go (extortionate prices, so we won't even go there) and monthly. The two monthly plan are either £9.99 for unlimited access to all your devices (i.e. your phone, your laptop etc) or £6.99 a month for a single device.
So, if I were to really, really want TheCloud, then I could have my T-Mobile plan + TheCloud for £44.49, a whopping saving of 51 pence. I guess that 51 pence is the cost of the visual voice mail that I don't get
If you want roaming Wifi access with your iPhone, then T-Mobile+TheCloud is about the same as O2, otherwise, get the iPhone, don't activate it, hack it and put your own SIM in. T-Mobile is currently the best, but that might change in the future. Also, don't fret that USA users are getting a better Voice/Text/Data deal because they are not, it is almost exactly the same
I just purchased an iPhone here in the United States. There is a possibility I might get transfered to our London office. Will I be able to use my same iPhone in Europe simply with a different carrier? Or will I have to buy a UK iPhone?
I like the comparison in the article with T-mobile, 3X and Vodaphone. As it shows that not only are the numbers higher as in the USA, which could be explained by difference in pay structures (pay for incoming calls etc.), but they are clearly having an inferior offering to the competition, even if you would get the phone for free.
I was considering buying an iPhone, when they would introduce them in the Netherlands, but with these prices it looks a lot less likely. The T-mobils web-n-walk offering looks a lot better at the moment.
To be successful in Europe, I would think an iPhone deal should have:
- UMTS
- free phone
- free internet (with a fair use policy)
- free voicemail
- 500 minutes, 250 SMS
Total for about 45-50 euro/month, I think this would be about 45-50 pounds/month, as it seems that for telecom prices when comparing UK-Netherlands, 1 pound == 1 euro in what gets offered. (T-Mobile Flext 30 + Web 'n' Walk is about 39 euro/month vs. 32,50 pound/month)
If they could have made a deal with one of the big boys, that are present in most of the EU, then having some kind of roaming service across most of the EU would be a big seller.
I don't think the iPhone will sell overhere, unless you get it free with a 24 month plan, and it has UMTS.
I think that the trouble Apple has had in finding a european partner, is probably also because of the lack of UMTS. Most telecom companies would love a killer application that makes their UMTS offerings popular. They have all invested heavily in it. Apple offering an EDGE phone will have resulted in luke-warm responses at most. I think they've had a lot of "no thanks" and "only if you have an UMTS model" responses.
RogerWilco the Adventurous Janitor
Anything Mac/Apple is more expensive in Europe, full stop. Look at UK proces on MacBooks or iMacs -- they're not explainable by just exchange rate risks and what not. In Russia, a MacBookPro will cost you 30-40% more than in US, and that's Apple's suggested retail price.
--AP
USA Population density: 31/km^2
UK Population density: 246/km^2
Just another reason why it's so difficult to compare pricing plans from across the pond - UK providers must need a lot less phone masts per person than in the USA.
Apple do seriously overcharge here in the UK. A quick check of their websites shows that iMacs in the US start at $1200, and at £800 the UK. This would be expected if 3$ = £2, but that hasn't been true since 2002. Now $2 = £1, and as a result components (esp memory) are cheap here, and desktop computers can be found very cheap from some sources (you can't compete building your own, even saving on not buying Windows). While Mac have dropped iPod prices to undercut other mp3 players, their computers have been stationary. This means that an iMac now costs double the price of the equivalent PC machine here, which seems ludicrous to me.
Here, the iPod pervades all, and Apple are wisely using it as a tool to sell their other products. The consumer culture is not 'should I buy an iPod?' but 'which iPod should I buy?'. Now three of my friends own expensive Macs, and I bought a dual core 64 bit mini PC for £350 and feel rather pleased.
Source http://www.miketodd.net/encyc/dollhist-graph3.htm
Apple product costs more in UK than in US: news at 11.
As long as we keep buying, they'll keep the price where it is. Instead of whining, simply spend your money elsewhere. That's capitalism.
- wages & employment level strong
- credit readily available
- rampant materialism & hunger for exclusivity
Perhaps not the only reasons. But if I were a supplier looking at these market conditions I'd be thinking "how HIGH can we go?"
In financial circles the UK is also often called "Treasure Island" because somehow everything can be sold at a higher price there than on the continent. Even products that are the same as on the continent are more expensive there (and no it's not the VAT)
Pricing-schmicing. Launching an EDGE-only device in a country where people who have any interest in mobile Interwebs have already experienced 3G is frankly barking. It's barely a step up from launching a dial-up ISP at this point in the game.
The tarrifs aren't really the issue, its that apple/o2 want 270 for the phone, and they want you pay 55 a month.
The Nokia n95, which is a high end phone, you can get it for free on all monthly plans cept for the very chepeast 24/20!
So you've got a massive upfront expense, on top of your usual tarrif.
Then you've got the missing 3g, lack of 3rd party software, double charges for ringtones etc etc.
----- I refuse to have an argument with an unarmed person
Did anyone notice that this comparison of the tariff pointed to here:
http://crave.cnet.co.uk/mobiles/0,39029453,49292876-1,00.htm
is purposely misleading?
It says up front that the article is about tariff comparison and that comparing the prices of the handsets are not fair because "you can't get an iPhone on the other networks." Yet each comparison ends up with a "total price" for each tariff where the O2 one includes the retail price of the iPhone and the other one does not. Either they are comparing tariff and handset cost together or they are not. Which is it?
In the three comparisons, it's 585, 360, or 585 pounds for the non-iPhone tariffs vs. 899 for the iPhone one.
It should be 630 for the O2 iPhone tariff not 899.
The price is exactly the same. They just changed the currency symbol :)
I mod down anyone who says "I will be modded down for this", regardless of the rest of their comment
-- I'm old enough to have lived through six different meanings of the word "hacker."
Check the exchange rates, the pound is killing the dollar. Compare AT&T plans with O2 plans. AT&T costs $80 for 900 minutes and 200 sms, but with unlimited nights/weekends and mobile to mobile AT&T customers. O2 costs 55 pounds for 1200 minutes and 500 sms. For one thing, if you use 500 SMS, you can increase the AT&T plan by $30, equalizing the plans if you convert currency. The problem is you can't convert currency as the O2 plan is available in the UK and the AT&T plan is avialable in the US. Everything costs more in the UK. Get a pint of beer in a pub and you'll probably spend 3 pounds. Get a pint of beer in the US and you'll probably spend $3. Buy a coffee at Starbucks in the UK and you'll spend 4 pounds. Buy one in the US and you'll spend $4. I think the O2 plan is actually quite a deal...