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Google Earth Used To Predict Electrical Problems

Posted by samzenpus on from the what-can't-it-do dept.

coondoggie writes "What do you get when you combine images from Google Earth and the brainpower from researchers at Oak Ridge National Labs? Well in this case you get a tool that enables real-time status of the national electric grid that federal state and local agencies can use to coordinate and respond to major problems such as wide-area power outages, natural disasters and other catastrophic events. The Visualizing Energy Resources Dynamically on Earth (VERDE) system, announced this week, mashes together images and stats of everything from real-time status of the electric grid and weather information to power grid behavior modeling and simulation."

91 comments

  1. I predict... by gardyloo · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...that posting such a story will inspire lots of slashdotters to go download or access Google Earth, and cause electrical problems.

    1. Re:I predict... by davester666 · · Score: 5, Funny

      that Google Earth will be declared a threat to Homeland Security, and taken offline. :-(

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
    2. Re:I predict... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hope medibuntu repos are ready for us!

    3. Re:I predict... by Xupa · · Score: 1

      DING!

    4. Re:I predict... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      *cough* GCCS-I3 Uses Google Earth *cough*

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Command_and_Control_System

    5. Re:I predict... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... Google will use this application to help justify a redundant power grid feed for one of the mega-centers.

  2. Next project? by VoltageX · · Score: 5, Funny

    Managing Energy Resources Dynamically on Earth (MERDE).

    Oui oui!

    --
    "Anonymous could not immediately be reached for further comment." - International Business Times
    1. Re:Next project? by drseuk · · Score: 1

      Tracking Unplanned Redmond Downtime in Seattle (TURDS)

    2. Re:Next project? by aproposofwhat · · Score: 2, Funny

      Something Happening In The Electrics (SHITE)

      --
      One swallow does not a fellatrix make
  3. CHILE VERDE, much better acronym by Misanthrope · · Score: 1

    Computer Heuristic Internet Longitudinal Environment for VERDE

  4. Wha? by ejdmoo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    How exactly does Google Earth predict *anything* at all?

    What it seems is someone wrote software to analyze the electrical grid, and they use the Google Maps API to visualize the geographic data.

    Yay.

    1. Re:Wha? by Amorymeltzer · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It's definitely a dubious title, especially since TFA says almost nothing about Google. I suppose, though, that they are technically using Google Earth in their predictions, because without it they'd have to write their own/use Mapquest. I'm sure a big part of it is getting to attach Google's name to something no one outside the department and government is really interested by, and I bet Google's happy to step in. Besides, GE is probably really nice to visualize their data with. Distance from major cities or energy producers, weather, temperature, terrain, etc.

      --
      I live in constant fear of the Coming of the Red Spiders.
    2. Re:Wha? by Atario · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Where does anything say Google Earth is predicting anything? All I see is "...used to predict...".

      Don't let that stop you from ostentatiously acting bored, though.

      --
      "A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
    3. Re:Wha? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm sure a fortune teller uses a table to lay tarot cards on, but that doesn't mean that the table "is used to predict" the future; foo.

    4. Re:Wha? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I concur. It's a sensationalist headline. Out of date photos from above don't even allow YOU to predict things...

    5. Re:Wha? by houghi · · Score: 4, Funny

      It sounds less sexy then Maps used to show location

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    6. Re:Wha? by ozphx · · Score: 1

      Google: "We are going to put a huge datacenter down.... mmmm..here. We predict electrical problems in...mmm.. this 50 mile radius.. mmm.. here."

      Google, sucking up all your electricity with their huge horse nostrils.

      --
      3laws: No freebies, no backsies, GTFO.
    7. Re:Wha? by ASBands · · Score: 1

      You're absolutely right. My company uses Google Earth to manage the construction of transmission lines, which lets people know when and where the towers are going to be put up and helps our clients keep track of how close we are to schedule.

      • Google Earth Used to Construct Power Lines
      • Google Earth Used to Cure Cancer
      • Google Earth Used to Find the Closest White Castle
      --
      My UID is a prime number. Yeah, I planned that.
    8. Re:Wha? by PPH · · Score: 1

      I can see Google Earth photos used to evaluate the condition of overhead lines, the amount of encroachment by trees, etc. But, as someone pointed out, G.E. can be years out of date. So the 'latest' photos will show you where you should have concentrated tree trimming efforts years ago.

      I was involved in a project that used aerial photography to evaluate power line right-of-way conditions. Up to date satellite photography could be used as well. In fact, some good multi-spectral imaging can tell quite a bit about foliage conditions. But to get the good stuff, you've got to pay. G.E. may be OK for some R&D proof of concept work, but probably not in production.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
  5. shoulv'e called it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    the Macroscopic Energy Resources Dynamic Earth system. Then it'd be the shit.

  6. simple google by twotailakitsune · · Score: 4, Insightful
    This is what, the 100th idea using Google Maps/Earth? they are just using the Google Maps API. Google is more open with people using Maps without paying some big Usage fee.

    What this is really about is the VERDE program. Now if Google was doing a real time status program I would have it sit on my screen all day.

    1. Re:simple google by jaminJay · · Score: 5, Funny

      Now if Google was doing a real time status program I would have it sit on my screen all day.

      That way, when the screen goes black, you'd know the power went out?

      --
      Leela: "Is all the work done by children?" Alien: "No, not the whipping."
    2. Re:simple google by SimonGhent · · Score: 4, Funny

      That way, when the screen goes black, you'd know the power went out?

      Or that the sun went down. There's just no way to tell.

      --
      simon
    3. Re:simple google by ericspinder · · Score: 1

      What this is really about is the VERDE program.

      But if the subject didn't mention Google and the article didn't feature the maps, would it be news worth distributing?

      Certainly Google maps and it's API is one of the best internet tools of this decade, but I suspect that the database work and real time collection and analysis of this data, must have taken a tremendous effort. It's too bad that the pretty picture generated from the end result seems to get top billing.

      --
      The grass is only greener, if you don't take care of your own lawn.
    4. Re:simple google by nospam007 · · Score: 1

      >This is what, the 100th idea using Google Maps/Earth? they are just using the Google Maps API.

      Real time data with 10 year old satellite photos, what could possibly go wrong.

    5. Re:simple google by silentsteel · · Score: 1

      What many seem to forget is that the entity using this is a part of the U. S. Government. Should they need anything newer than a 10 year old satellite photo, they can have them, easily. Given the people working at Oak Ridge, it should not be that difficult to incorporate the newer imagery. Of course, you and I will not see it. If something requires posting images publicly they will revert to those 10 year old photos.

      --
      I cut it three times, and it's still too short.
    6. Re:simple google by Homer's+Donuts · · Score: 2, Insightful

      When the lights get dimmer, the voltage is going down.

      They watch meters real time, predict load based on averages. This weeks load, time of day, last years load,etc. Oh, and they watch the Weather Channel.

      Failure prediction? They know what loads have caused failure before. Believe it or not, higher temps and loads (i squared r) cause the wires to stretch. They fail when they come in contact with earth(tree branches,etc) that causes a huge load swing. At 345,000 volts, wood is a conductor.

      So a prediction model is new. That is if someone buys and uses it. I've seen multi-floor knife switches that look like they belong in a Frankenstein movie, and an operating turbine with a swastika on the cover.

      So this should be in widespread use by what? 2020? Or about a month after someone in Illinois sells power to someone in New Jersey and puts his generator online even though the system operator tells him not to. And the grid goes down. Again.

      So I have a prediction: The utilities will fail to fix what is really wrong, a lack of infrastructure to deliver power, until the grid fails again.

      I can also predict who is going to pay for it.

  7. just a question by silentphate · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If this is such a major development, why is it just now being created? Haven't we had the technology to do something like this for decades?

    1. Re:just a question by moteyalpha · · Score: 1

      The concept of a simple common way to deal with data models is a process that seems to be heading towards standards which would be nice. Something like the openGL standards or blender file formats. If there were a standard way to represent complex interactive systems as even a bot script for a 3D world that could easily be shared like a language of systems interaction. I have been looking at littleb and that may evolve into a standard which can represent systems so that problems and solutions drift to the top so they can be dealt with. The vast amount of data available seems to be the problem today. There is more information than there are people trained to interpret it.

  8. I am skeptical... by bogaboga · · Score: 3, Insightful

    You know why? It is because data and images from Google Earth are not that up-to-date. In fact, several [new] roads in my county are not shown on Google Earth and Google Maps! So I am skeptical. Am I alone?

    1. Re:I am skeptical... by cencithomas · · Score: 4, Funny

      I believe you can get more up-to-date information by purchasing Google Earth Plus or Google Earth Pro. Not positive though and the comparison page doesn't seem to specify.

      ...in retrospect, this comment is not nearly as helpful as I'd hoped.

      --
      ...'tis easier to blame than to improve.
    2. Re:I am skeptical... by alextmqazwsx · · Score: 5, Informative
      Referenced from here: Google Earth

      *Note: While Google Earth Plus has additional capabilities, the underlying imagery is the same for all versions of Google Earth.

    3. Re:I am skeptical... by DerekLyons · · Score: 0, Redundant

      I believe you can get more up-to-date information by purchasing Google Earth Plus or Google Earth Pro.

      You can't.

    4. Re:I am skeptical... by hcdejong · · Score: 2, Insightful

      For this application, I suspect it doesn't need to be. They want to have a general idea of which area an event takes place in. Full accuracy (e.g. the street address of the affected transformer) is only needed at lower level, and they should have mechanisms in place for that already.

  9. Sim City Stats by neostorm · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I am still waiting for Google Earth to fully encompass the feedback offered in games like Sim City, where I can search regions around the world for such things as Crime Statistics, Pollution, Economy, etc.

    There are plenty of other areas we can display information as well. They've already got traffic, terrain and now this. I am currently relocating to a new area as well, and actually tried to get crime stats on potential areas I'd be living in (thinking they may have already achieved that ability), they haven't got them yet, but I hope my wish list is not too far away.

    1. Re:Sim City Stats by littlerubberfeet · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I was researching crime before a move as well. I was stuck using an absolutely horrible web-enabled wannabe GIS thing. Having used ArcGIS, I know what a decent GIS is capable of. Google Earth is well on its way to being able to display information the way ArcView does. A buffer wizard type tool would be a wonderful thing in Google Earth...The analytical side of things is not really suitable for the Google Earth architecture though.

      Yeah, Google would do well to integrate even census data (which includes some crime, pollution and economic data) into Google Earth.

      --
      Sig (appended to the end of comments you post, 120 chars)
    2. Re:Sim City Stats by Amorymeltzer · · Score: 1

      I haven't updated Google Earth in a while, mostly because I haven't used it in a while, but last I saw it definitely had Crime Statistics. Pollution and Economy are both a little more ethereal, but moreover, they're for a much broader locale. I may wonder the crime stats in Manhattan versus Brooklyn, but what's it gonna say for Pollution, or Economy? Good and good? Corporate and yuppie? Those terms really apply to large areas, much greater than cities. As far as small towns are concerned, all the cities have the same economy and pollution. You're just more likely to get killed in NYC than Seattle.

      --
      I live in constant fear of the Coming of the Red Spiders.
    3. Re:Sim City Stats by SimonGhent · · Score: 1

      I am still waiting for Google Earth to fully encompass the feedback offered in games like Sim City

      Sod that!

      I am still waiting for Google Earth to fully encompass the natural disasters offered in games like Sim City.

      Go Godzilla!

      --
      simon
    4. Re:Sim City Stats by Comtraya · · Score: 1

      Then you can also have x-ray vision and see the status of the water main infrastructure.

    5. Re:Sim City Stats by MartinB · · Score: 1

      I am currently relocating to a new area as well, and actually tried to get crime stats on potential areas I'd be living in (thinking they may have already achieved that ability), they haven't got them yet, but I hope my wish list is not too far away.

      If you're moving to the UK, then go take a look at these guys, who have bought CACI's ACORN geodemographic dataset, and combined with publically available datasets on education, crime etc, to produce a view on what that area is like.

      Example (where I used to live)

      Other than that, you're calling 1-800-CACI and asking for their geodemographic solutions.

      --

      The only thing you can accurately describe as "Scotch" is a sticky tape made by 3M. And it's

  10. HUH??? by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 3, Informative

    Okay, I can see "recent" data... but anybody who really thinks that Google Earth is "realtime" is a serious candidate for the Happy Home.

    Some of the pictures are over 6 YEARS old...

    1. Re:HUH??? by kerashi · · Score: 5, Informative

      The google earth maps may not be updated, but the maps are just a backdrop upon which the data is displayed.

    2. Re:HUH??? by powermacx · · Score: 2, Funny

      Do you *want* realtime Google Earth?

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPgV6-gnQaE

      ;-)

    3. Re:HUH??? by DerekLyons · · Score: 0

      Which accomplishes what beyond looking kewl and l33t? Seriously, if you are looking at a display showing the status of the power system background images are just noise that add nothing useful.

    4. Re:HUH??? by SeaFox · · Score: 1

      Maybe that's how the "prediction" part works. They'll overlay the current electrical power grid and status over maps showing no development to account for the power usage displayed.

    5. Re:HUH??? by brunokummel · · Score: 1

      Some of the pictures are over 6 YEARS old...

      You can say that again...My etire neighboorhood seen through Google Earth is nothing but a huge construction site...

      --
      What is best in life? To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you and to hear the lamentations of their women.
    6. Re:HUH??? by edsousa · · Score: 1

      While the images may be outdated, Google Earth used to show a road that is yet to be built. I think that after all Google Earth can do predictions.

  11. Google Used To... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    Google Earth Used To Predict Electrical Problems

    Too bad they don't anymore!

  12. Google Earth Used To Predict Electrical Problems.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...but not anymore.

  13. How do I view it without electricity? by Xoc-S · · Score: 4, Funny

    If there is a power outage, how am I going to fire up my desktop machine and view Google Earth?

    1. Re:How do I view it without electricity? by tubapro12 · · Score: 1

      Use your wireless laptop on a UPS'ed network, and pray your ISP has UPS/backup power plans.

    2. Re:How do I view it without electricity? by freakxx · · Score: 1

      Listen, I suggest you something logical. Forget that Oak-people. They are simply misleading people by creating false sensations in media.

      Ask google to display real-time usage statistics on GoogleEarth in different regions (more usage = brighter area). In this way, you just have to look for dark regions in the GUI to locate where the power outage is actually taking place. So simple.

      To Google People: If you are going to implement this idea in ur product, you must mention my name. Otherwise, I am going to save URL of this particular post as a reference if I need it in future sometime in court.

    3. Re:How do I view it without electricity? by afidel · · Score: 1

      If you have DSL or a T-* line you are basically guaranteed to have a UPS'd and generator powered internet connection since the telco's are required to have emergency power. Sure if you use an ilec they may not have an agreement to hook their DSLAM to the telco power plant and remote shelfs don't all have generators, but the chances are pretty good. The cable companies are also pretty good about it since they are now offering voice service (though it's definitely not to the level of the telco's).

      --
      There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
    4. Re:How do I view it without electricity? by Idbar · · Score: 1

      Now, wasn't that a good enough prediction then? It's in fact a "real-time prediction system".

  14. Dr Shaffer by ThorGod · · Score: 1

    Somewhere my alma mater's Dr Shaffer's enjoying this :)

    --
    PS: I don't reply to ACs.
  15. too late by Digitus1337 · · Score: 3, Funny

    The LHC goes online in just under a day; Google Earth is going to be obsolete, so how is this newsworthy?

    1. Re:too late by Whiney+Mac+Fanboy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The LHC goes online in just under a day; Google Earth is going to be obsolete

      Google Earth is an interactive map & the LHC is a particle accelerator. Frankly, I don't see wtf one has to do with the other (or how one could obsolete the other)...

      --
      There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
    2. Re:too late by rubycodez · · Score: 1

      no problem, they'll just change the name to Google Strangelet-Star

    3. Re:too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      The LHC goes online in just under a day; Google Earth is going to be obsolete

      Google Earth is an interactive map & the LHC is a particle accelerator. Frankly, I don't see wtf one has to do with the other (or how one could obsolete the other)...

      *whoosh*

    4. Re:too late by Whiney+Mac+Fanboy · · Score: 1

      Wooosh indeed.

      Clearly my joke-a-meter needs recalibrating.

      Oh well, I am a mac fanboy - we're renowned for our humourlessness & obliviousness in the face of sarcasm ;-)

      --
      There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
    5. Re:too late by initialE · · Score: 1

      Just to be pedantic, some people believe that the startup of the LHC will be a universe-ending event. Or in any case, something that will make a huge dent in the european part of the globe.

      --
      Starbucks, Harbuckle of Breath.
    6. Re:too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not to spoil the joke or anything, but the LHC goes on line, sucks up all the power everywhere, therefore no need for Google Earth to predict the rampaging power outage...

    7. Re:too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's when the LHC turns the Earth into a black hole that Google Earth becomes obsolete.

  16. SPOF by richardtallent · · Score: 1

    So what happens when said outages or disasters take out ORNL's Internet access or Google's servers?

    Corporate-enabled mash-ups are *SO* 2007. Time to focus on open clouds of massively-distributed computing resources and cached storage. /soapbox

    1. Re:SPOF by Jellybob · · Score: 1

      Something tells me the agency responsible for monitoring power outages might (and I'm just guessing here) have backup power and connectivity.

  17. Anyone else misread the title as by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    Google Earth Used To Predict Electoral Problems?

    And I'm not even American...

  18. You can't, but.... by gbutler69 · · Score: 1

    You can if you are the U.S. government.

    --
    Over-the-top Response Guy! Giving "Over-the-Top Responses" since 1970.
  19. VERDE by amnezick · · Score: 1

    VERDE == green  (in Romanian)

    --
    mov ax,4c00h
    int 21h
    1. Re:VERDE by rampant+poodle · · Score: 1

      De asemenea, în spaniola.

  20. The real news by hcdejong · · Score: 3, Insightful

    is that this is news at all:

    Major power outages in the United States over the past decade have a recurring theme - the lack of wide-area situational understanding was a key factor that contributed to blackouts.

    (emphasis mine)

    How can you expect to manage something as complex as a continental power grid without having the data you need? It's not like this capability has only recently become available.

    1. Re:The real news by PPH · · Score: 1

      You send someone out in a truck with a spotlight when the lights go out.

      Anecdote:

      Many years ago (~20) I worked for a local utility. Back then, we started a program that involved locating all of the system's facilities with a GPS grid position, tied together in a database. The idea was that a customer id was tied to a transformer, which was connected to a particular lateral, fed by a feeder, from a substation. Trouble calls from customers or interrogation of the automated metering grid would reveal the geographic area and circuit location of the problem. Except that the field engineers who were responsible for entering the data just typed in any old crap, so as not to get a bad performance score on their data entry duties. The data entered was useless.

      About 20 years later, I had the opportunity to call in and report a problem in that utilities service area. The clerk (probably in a call center overseas) informed me that my location, based upon their database, was many miles from where I was, thereby crediting my outage call to the wrong circuit. In 20 years, nothing had improved.

      Oak Ridge might have a neato idea. But if it costs any money, the utilities aren't going to buy it. Until regulators hold their feet to the fire w.r.t. maintenance. There's also a culture of the heroic lineman showing up after a week without power to put the wires back up. Nobody wants to spend money (or trim any precious trees) after the lights are back on.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
  21. what machine is it running on? by tatermonkey · · Score: 1

    ORNL is just down the road from me. Actually one of my neighbors is a programmer there. Are they running it on a pc or thier Cray XT3 system?

    1. Re:what machine is it running on? by tatermonkey · · Score: 1

      My bad. Its an XT4 now.

    2. Re:what machine is it running on? by Jellybob · · Score: 1

      Why don't you ask your neighbour?

  22. Homeland Security by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 1

    I wonder how long it will take Homeland Security to pay these guys a visit to discuss classification of their work?

    --
    If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    1. Re:Homeland Security by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oak Ridge is basically a Department of Energy lab. I think Homeland already knows about the project.

  23. Links, video, and a follow-up program? by martyb · · Score: 2, Funny

    Here's a bit more detail from the ORNL web site: http://www.ornl.gov/info/ornlreview/v40_3_07/article13.shtml and http://www.ornl.gov/sci/electricdelivery/vis_VERDE.html where there are links to: VERDE video (WMV 81.2MB) (13m 54s)

    In the first-listed link above, I found this:

    "Major power outages in the United States over the past decade have a recurring theme--the lack of wide-area situational understanding," says Tom King, manager of electric transmission and distribution technologies for ORNL's Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy Program. (emphasis added)

    As a follow-up, I hear they are planning a "Wide-Area Situational Understanding Program", aka WASUP! :)

    1. Re:Links, video, and a follow-up program? by PPH · · Score: 1

      "Wide Area System Situational Understanding Program"

      Wassup!

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
  24. VERDE equals GREEN Power by codemaster2b · · Score: 1

    Man, that is one bad pun. I mean, everybody wants green energy, right? You think it coincidence that they used the Spanish word for green (Verde) to describe the power grid???

    Alternatively, if anyone has had the opportunity to sing or hear the performance of Verde's Requiem, you may "rest" knowing that in the event of a disaster, the internet will still be working and that power problems can be diagnosed quickly and efficiently.

    --
    And over there we have the labyrinth guards. One always lies, one always tells the truth, and one stabs people who ask t
  25. Two years behind the DOE and NASA WorldWind.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    (Posting Anon as I helped on the project) The DOE has been using WorldWind Java for over a year to already do this and a lot more. But of course, that is not public use. This could easily have been done with any web based map or any virtual globe.

  26. should have a different acronym by swschrad · · Score: 1

    I might suggest Managing Energy Resources Dynamically on Earth (MERDE,) because as soon as somebody starts relying on that system, we're going to be deep in it.

    --
    if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
  27. Crime stat methodologies vary ... by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 2, Informative

    I am still waiting for Google Earth to fully encompass the feedback offered in games like Sim City, where I can search regions around the world for such things as Crime Statistics, Pollution, Economy, etc.

    The method of collection of such statistics varies by country, so they are not easily comparable.

    One that I'm familiar with (from activism related to gun laws): Murder, accident, and suicide statistics. For instance:

      - Britain counts it as a murder when they have a conviction. US when they have a body in suspicious circumstances.

      - Father kills his three kids, wife, and himself: US: Four murders one suicide. Japan: Five suicides.

      - In many places in the US a suicide, especially of a youth, will usually be reported as an accident (to avoid placing a stigma on the bereaved family).

    I could go on. (Especially about Japan and variations on so-called "family suicide".) But I think the above examples show how directly comparing published rates for the US, England, and Japan can yield some very bogus impressions.

    --
    Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
  28. There are google overlays for hurricanes hitting by nutznboltz · · Score: 1

    oil fields too now.

    http://hurricane.methaz.org/tracking/

  29. I don't get it by DrChandra · · Score: 1

    So I can use google earth to find out why my power is out?

    --
    Words, words, words ... Buz, buz! - Hamlet, Act II, Scene II