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NASA Spends $25M On Unmanned Planes, Awards Aviation Prizes

An anonymous reader points out a NetworkWorld story about NASA's purchase of two unmanned aircraft for use in "observing remote locations of Earth not feasible or practical with piloted aircraft." The planes are Northrop Grumman Global Hawks, and NASA selected them for their extreme range and the fact that most other unmanned vehicles don't have the FAA's approval for regular use over the US. NASA also distributed prizes for its General Aviation Challenge this weekend. The goals of the challenge include improving fuel efficiency in aviation, reducing emissions, and aircraft safety. None of the teams were able to achieve the $50,000 prize for managing 30 miles per gallon, but the top team was able to complete the 400-mile course at 28.8 miles per gallon.

49 comments

  1. Oil independence by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 2, Insightful

    In order to achive independence on foreign oil, we in the U.S. will not just need to get cars that use less (or no) oil, but aerospace vehicles as well. Even 30 MPG for an unmanned plane isn't going to be nearly enough.

    1. Re:Oil independence by rossdee · · Score: 5, Insightful

      MPG doesn't really matter if you're not going anywhere. The Global Hawk is a loitering type of reconnaissance plane, not a fly-over-as-fast-as-you-can type like the SR71. What matters is the gallons per hour, not the miles per gallon.

    2. Re:Oil independence by utnapistim · · Score: 1, Offtopic

      Fuel consumption efficiency is not the answer here.

      It's of course better to be efficient than not, but consuming less oil doesn't move you to independence of foreign sources; it is moving you to less dependency, but not to independence.

      The answer (as I see it) is not to impose cheap oil prices (being outside the US this is what I get the feeling the US are doing.
      Instead, let the price go up, and more than that, impose a task on oil consumption. That should encourage people to actively seek alternate fuel sources.

      Unfortunately, such a measure would make whoever takes it, terribly unpopular with the American public and is a sure way of ending a political career.
      The current direction in the US, is like seeing you have tooth aches and continuously taking pain-killers and hoping the problem will auto-magically disappear (without going to the dentist). I did that for half a year and the result is not pretty (in the end it affected my health, did more damage and cost me more than simply addressing the actual problem in the first place).

      --
      Tie two birds together: although they have four wings, they cannot fly. (The blind man)
    3. Re:Oil independence by s2jcpete · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      The US does produce oil. I would think if we can knock off 70% of our oil consumption we should be able to cover our own demand till we find a more suitable fuel source for aircraft.

    4. Re:Oil independence by BrotherBeal · · Score: 1

      ...impose a task on oil consumption...

      Damn straight! No more of this lollygagging around, burning barrels of crude in our spare time! What we need is a disciplined, goal-oriented approach to our oil consumption!

      --
      I'm disabling ads until because I choose not to reward redesigns that are less usable than "view source".
    5. Re:Oil independence by pxlmusic · · Score: 2, Insightful

      i agree with you on that, however...

      the problem with that is that america's economy is predicated on cheap fuel. take that away, and everything begins to slowly collapse.

      i'm not saying that alternative fuels aren't needed, but the rest of us who are actively trying to consume less end up being punished for the overconsumption of others. i'm not saying i'm "carbon neutral" or anything, but if i'm cutting back, and my neighbors aren't -- well, i end up starving because joe bob next door won't give up his fucking Yukon XL or Excursion to cart his fat ass and his coffee 30 miles to work every day.

      OTOH, i think that although raising prices to discourage consumption is hard, it doesn't work as well in America as it might elsewhere because we were accustomed to cheap gas for so long. old habits and all that...

      --
      "If for any reason you're not satisfied with our service, I hate you."
    6. Re:Oil independence by pxlmusic · · Score: 2, Insightful

      people keep thinking this "magic bullet" is going to come along and save us from oil. but, i don't tihnk that's going to happen.

      upping the prices to discourage consumption works to a point -- and then you start killing off those who are unable to keep up financially. you have people just trying to get by who may be using public transport, don't have a car, and are getting killed on the cost of basic necessities driven up by high fuel prices.

      --
      "If for any reason you're not satisfied with our service, I hate you."
    7. Re:Oil independence by MadnessASAP · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Oh it's that simple then is it? Only 70% and the USA can be free of foreign oil, well christ boy I bet if you took that extra little step and knocked off %100 you could be completely free of or dependency on oil.

      -1 Stating the stupidly obvious.

      --
      I may agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to face the consequences of saying it.
    8. Re:Oil independence by s2jcpete · · Score: 1

      And plastics are made from? Lubricants? Its going to be a really REALLY long time before oil is no longer in use.

    9. Re:Oil independence by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Increasingly from plants, to answer your question.

    10. Re:Oil independence by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 1

      You laugh, but you may be right. We could do a 'Boston Oil Party'. Just start destroying every barrel of oil in sight. That would probably do it.

    11. Re:Oil independence by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes it does; MPG reflects efficiency, bulk fuel consumption reflects scale. The scale is already decided (payload, speed, range requirements).

    12. Re:Oil independence by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      GPH only matters when you care how long you can stay in the air. For pretty much everyone except for the military and communication companies, which do have loitering requirements, MPG is all that matters.

      Creating an aircraft with a low GPH rating is trivial but will have zero value to the traveling public. In other words, speed is what the traveling public wants which directly translates into non-linear energy requirements. As such, expecting passengers to be happy paying ten dollars to travel one hundred miles while taking 24 hours is not going to excite someone.

  2. Hyper mailing and tailgating by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 4, Funny

    Wait until the drones start hypermiling and catching the draft of passing jets.
    Then we will see MPG figures increase.

    Of course someone with a honda will just tape wings onto their car and beat it hands down, but they tend to be frowned upon.

    --
    liqbase :: faster than paper
    1. Re:Hyper mailing and tailgating by Fumus · · Score: 3, Funny

      Why not just use imperial gallons and watch as the MPG skyrockets.

    2. Re:Hyper mailing and tailgating by Poorcku · · Score: 1

      Yeah, you don't even need gas if you catch the draft of passing jets since the only direction you are going is down. :)

      --
      I take my children to see Madonna(..), but I never for once ever thought I was in the same business.Chris Rea.
    3. Re:Hyper mailing and tailgating by gnick · · Score: 1

      Wait until the drones start hypermiling and catching the draft of passing jets.
      Then we will see MPG figures increase.

      That would actually use more fuel overall - Try it you'll see.

      The drone may save a little bit of fuel, but you also have to factor in the fuel consumed by the fighter jets that get scrambled when the 747 pilot radios in to report the unmanned craft tailing him.

      --
      He's getting rather old, but he's a good mouse.
    4. Re:Hyper mailing and tailgating by Deadstick · · Score: 1

      It's possible in theory, but next to impossible in practice. You would have to stay in the part of the wingtip vortex that's moving upward, and have enough maneuvering power to deal with a frightful amount of curl (in the mathematical sense of "del cross V") at jet speeds.

      Migrating ducks and geese do it. Each bird rides one of the tip vortices from the guy in front of him -- that's why they fly in a V formation. It reduces their induced drag by about ten percent, and the strongest flyers take turns flying lead.

      rj

    5. Re:Hyper mailing and tailgating by dotgain · · Score: 1

      Parent really should be modded 'Informative' - there's probably even a patent for doing that.

  3. Needs better diet. by BitterOldGUy · · Score: 2, Funny
    The shoe-in to win the green prize--a team with a novel "omnivore" biodiesel engine capable of flying on french fry oil--pulled out of the race at the last minute because of a mechanical problem.

    No wonder! We all know that french-fry oil clogs up arteries. That plane needs to be put on an engine healthy fuel. Lower saturated fats should be used. Otherwise, on take-off and landing - high stress parts of flight - that poor plane will put a wing up to its fuselage and just die.

  4. Units? by Bazman · · Score: 1, Offtopic

    Gallons? US or Imperial? NASA has gone metric anyway, so it should be litres. NASA know what happens when you mix your units up...

    http://www.cnn.com/TECH/space/9909/30/mars.metric.02/

    1. Re:Units? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Obviously US gallons. On the aeronautics side of NASA it's better to use the units that are common in aviation. The customer wants to know the MPG.

      In this case, using SI would cause the units to get mixed up.

    2. Re:Units? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      US or Imperial liters?

    3. Re:Units? by Tubal-Cain · · Score: 1

      Don't you mean to ask: African or European liters?

  5. Odd by hcdejong · · Score: 3, Interesting

    None of the four planes entered won the $50,000 prize; the best attempt achieved 28.8 miles per gallon.

    versus

    The "Prius of airplanes," the 100-horsepower-engine Pipistrel typically can go as fast as 170 mph and get 50 miles to the gallon.

    So wasn't the Pipistrel Viper entered in the mileage competition, and why not if it'd have easily won?

    1. Re:Odd by SimonGhent · · Score: 4, Informative

      The Pipistrel won $250,000 from NASA last year http://news.cnet.com/8301-10784_3-9758741-7.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-20/

      And in TFA:

      One of the biggest prizes it granted was $50,000 for aircraft safety to the lone returning competitor, the Slovenian-built Pipistrel known as Virus. The plane, which was the big winner at the 2007 event, had added such precautions as a cabin integrated with Kevlar and an installed ballistic parachute system, or a deployable rocket that would launch a parachute 100 feet above the plane in the event of an emergency

      But in answer to your question (again from TFA!):

      The Pipistrel, for example, used a carbon-fiber propeller on its aircraft this year to reduce its noise by at least 10 percent, but that shift cut the plane's fuel-efficiency by as much as 50 percent.

      --
      simon
    2. Re:Odd by cpricejones · · Score: 1

      the competition was organized by OPEC?

    3. Re:Odd by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      From TFA, that challenge also required flying 400 miles. Simplest explanation is the Pipistrel doesn't have enough range to fly that far with that kind of efficiency.

  6. Will these innovations ever be adopted? by hcdejong · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The general aviation industry has advanced at a glacial pace ever since WW2, and it got worse with the excesses of litigation that almost put the GA manufacturers out of business. Electronic fuel injection is still regarded as newfangled and unproven, for instance.
    I know there are reasons for this (basically, developing an all-new engine that conforms to the safety standards can't be afforded the industry), but the end result is that any innovation seen in this competition will be viewed with deep distrust by the GA industry, and in 10 years, non-experimental GA planes will still be no more advanced than they are today.

    1. Re:Will these innovations ever be adopted? by MadnessASAP · · Score: 2, Informative

      Well there's a damned good reason for that too. When your cars computer dies or a fuel injector clogs you pull over to the side of the road. In an airplane you can also pull over to the side of the road, unfortunately that road happens to be 5000' below you. Pilots don't WANT to fly in anything that hasn't been tested and proven again and again and again.

      --
      I may agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to face the consequences of saying it.
    2. Re:Will these innovations ever be adopted? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Of course the majority of the population appears to be willing to walk on board a massive big metal tube with wings run by lots and lots of computer systems...

    3. Re:Will these innovations ever be adopted? by SunBug · · Score: 3, Informative

      I'm a general aviation pilot and would LOVE to have a fuel-injected engine. More power, better reliability, better fuel economy, smoother running, and one less control to monitor.

      One big problem with EFI is how to handle total loss of the electrical system. As it stands now, you can lose the alternator, the battery, and one magneto and still fly. Same with mechanical (Bendix systems) injection. However, with the mechanical systems, you don't gain a whole lot. There is still a mixture control- they basically act as a glorified carburetor.

      With EFI, if you lose the alternator and the battery goes dead, the engine stops. An additional alternator and battery could be installed to mitigate most of the risk. Same for the coils. You could even keep a magneto as a fallback if the coil dies.

      Really, the biggest opposition to modernizing GA is the government and all the red tape involved. It would fairly easily cost millions of dollars to just get an EFI system certified on ONE make/model. Even if you targeted the Cessna 172 with the Lycoming O320, the cost would be prohibitive. As just a guess, it would cost $30-45 thousand per installation- close to the cost of a complete new engine with mechanical fuel injection. Not really a viable option.

      There was a program a few years ago call the General Aviation Propulsion engine (GAP). It was supposed to reduce the cost and increase the reliability of GA propulsion. Last I read the project was "considered a success" and disappeared. Seems like a shame, really.

    4. Re:Will these innovations ever be adopted? by BBandCMKRNL · · Score: 1

      When your cars computer dies or a fuel injector clogs you pull over to the side of the road. In an airplane you can also pull over to the side of the road, unfortunately that road happens to be 5000' below you. Pilots don't WANT to fly in anything that hasn't been tested and proven again and again and again.

      As a pilot who has made an emergency no-power landing, I will disagree with you. I want advances that decrease my workload, especially during critical phases of flight or during an emergency.

      High performance piston powered aircraft have three engine controls; The throttle - controls engine rpm, the mixture control - controls the fuel/air ratio of fuel and air going into the engine, and the prop control - controls the pitch of the propellor which allows the pilot to optimize the propellor performance for rate of climb vs. aircraft speed. In addition, because these engines are air cooled, the pilot has to be careful not to allow the engine to cool too quickly or overheat, especially during takeoff and landing.

      About 20 years ago, Porsche teamed up with aircraft maker Mooney to produce a Porsche engine powered aircraft that combined the throttle, mixture, and prop controls into one lever. It was amazingly simple: Push the lever in to go faster, pull it back to go slower. The engine took care of making sure the throttle was set to give the appropriate amount of power, the mixture was set to make sure the engine didn't cool too quickly or overheat, and the propellor pitch was adjusted for optimum power, speed, and noise. You'd think that pilots would love something like this that. I sure would. Nope. Many pilots wrote Letters-To-The-Editor of all the flying magazines complaining that the manufacturer was taking away their control of the aircraft. The Porsche aircraft engine was withdrawn from the market after a few years and very few aircraft sales.

      --
      Without the 2nd Amendment, the others are just suggestions.
    5. Re:Will these innovations ever be adopted? by rcw-work · · Score: 1

      The engine took care of making sure the throttle was set to give the appropriate amount of power, the mixture was set to make sure the engine didn't cool too quickly or overheat, and the propellor pitch was adjusted for optimum power, speed, and noise. You'd think that pilots would love something like this that. I sure would. Nope. Many pilots wrote Letters-To-The-Editor of all the flying magazines complaining that the manufacturer was taking away their control of the aircraft. The Porsche aircraft engine was withdrawn from the market after a few years and very few aircraft sales.

      At least part of this, the constant speed propeller is in widespread use. Although, especially in a multi-engine config, I'd want one with the ability to feather the propeller in case of an engine out (to lower Vmc). I'd also want to make sure the one I used allowed me to dive-start an engine.

      General aviation's biggest problem has been total technical stagnation which the manufacturers have regularly blamed on lawsuits (when they improve something and it ends up killing someone, they can expect a lawsuit from that improvement). The only noticeable R&D has been from the uncertified Experimental category (although occasionally someone will take an experimental design and push it through certification so they can manufacture it).

    6. Re:Will these innovations ever be adopted? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Electronic fuel injection is still regarded as newfangled and unproven, for instance.

      New fangled? Sort of. Unproven? No. Fuel injection is considered proven and reliable. In fact, when manufacturers can actually create injectors which meet their own published specifications (which is questionable), LOP (Lean of Peak) becomes readily feasible. Yes, it can be done without FI, but becomes more difficult to do without modern technology. As a side, I looked, wikipedia does not have a LOP article. Basically, LOP operation allows for an engine to consume less fuel which creating only slightly less power when compared to ROP (Rich of Peak). And for the nay-sayers, LOP was pretty well proven during WWII, if not earlier.

      What is considered unproven is FADEC for GA. Such technology is still rare and very costly. The vast majority of piston aircraft still have to manually adjust their air-fuel ratios and constantly readjust based on current weather and altitudes flown. In fact, this simple adjustment (or lack thereof) actually accounts for a large number of high altitude accidents.

      For those that don't know, lawyers are the reason GA costs 2x as much as it does. The FAA is said to create an additional 2x cost. The combination effectively prevent GA from market competition as it drastically limits those that can participate. If it were not for ridicules liabilities (e.g. pilot runs into tower and falls on house - engine, tire, prop, and airplane manufacturer all get sued; and that is the VERY short list) manufacturers face, you could purchase a brand new, real plane (not a light sport) roughly in the $40,000 - $150,000 range. While that sounds expensive, keep in mind that plane will last you a life time while delivering you at 175-250MPH to your destination on roughly 15-25 MPG.

    7. Re:Will these innovations ever be adopted? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      and one less control to monitor.

      Ignoring carb-heat, FI does not reduce work load.

    8. Re:Will these innovations ever be adopted? by BBandCMKRNL · · Score: 1

      At least part of this, the constant speed propeller [wikipedia.org] is in widespread use. Although, especially in a multi-engine config, I'd want one with the ability to feather the propeller in case of an engine out (to lower Vmc). I'd also want to make sure the one I used allowed me to dive-start an engine.

      When the Porsche-engined Mooney was produced, a constant speed prop was not common in light singles, such as the Mooney M-2x, Piper Arrow, and Cessna 182.

      I agree that in a multi-engine configuration the pilot needs to be able to feather the prop on a dead engine.

      --
      Without the 2nd Amendment, the others are just suggestions.
  7. Loss of Direction? by LifesABeach · · Score: 1

    Kinda cool, but this looks more like a DARPA project. Maybe if NASA could concentrate on the 'S' part of their charter, this project would make more sense. How about re-doing the project, (and get more budget), but apply it to motors that could lift a 40 foot cargo container to maybe 60 miles up? Using less fuel? Using a more efficient lift body? Now Shippers would start to listen. Shippers would start to consider less Ships, and Trains; and MORE aviation solutions in their Logistics.

    1. Re:Loss of Direction? by N!k0N · · Score: 1

      ...40 foot cargo container to maybe 60 miles up? Using less fuel? Using a more efficient lift body? Now Shippers would start to listen. Shippers would start to consider less Ships, and Trains; and MORE aviation solutions in their Logistics.

      I'm no expert in the matter, but isn't it (somewhat) of a waste of fuel/energy to lift something 60 miles up, then move it towards the intended destination? For comparison - would you climb the Grand Canyon, walk across it (say on a bridge), and climb back down just to be on the other side; or would you just take a bridge over the river at the *bottom* of the canyon? I'm sure that where *speed* is of the upmost importance, a plane is used - but from a logistics standpoint 3-5 modern locomotives hauling a 100 car train (which can be a few thousand tons) is still the more economical choice. I believe that the average fuel consumption is something like 1 gal per 100 loaded tons per mile (excluding the locomotives...)

    2. Re:Loss of Direction? by LifesABeach · · Score: 1

      I work alot with shipping; and the average cargo container is 40 feet long. These metal crates get banged around a lot but for contemporary cargo hauling, they handle pretty good. I know the time is going to come when something is manufactured in California and, (hopefully), is delivered to the space port in Arizona. Most likely, it will be in a cargo container. I see these containers, routinely stacked 5, and 6 high, and at our dock port, there are hundreds of them waiting to be picked up, or waiting to go out to sea. The reason the containers are built the way they are is because of the hauling conditions, and, well, lets just say I don't expect to see any Long Shore Men being invited to Stockholm to collect their prize money in Theoretical Physics anytime to soon. From a cargo handlers point of view, unloading, and reloading a container means more money. From a shippers point of view, keeping the contents in the container means less expense. So, from a shippers point of view, offloading the container from the truck to the rocket should have only one fee for offloading the container from the truck, and one fee for onloading on to the rocket. The long shoreman gives the shipping papers to the pilot, and the rocket takes off. Until the Space Elevator, or "Transporting" is invented, I don't see anyother way to get the cargo from earth to space. And the 'S' in NASA does stand for "Space", as in that blie-ish-orange stuff over my head right now. Maybe using a Balloon assist would help get the cargo up higher, but as things go, I don't know of any other way to get the cargo into space.

    3. Re:Loss of Direction? by hcdejong · · Score: 1

      You're forgetting the A part is just as much part of their charter as the S part. DARPA is a defence agency, so commercial and general aviation isn't part of their charter.

      There's almost never a need to transport cargo through space. The stuff that gets packed in 40-ft containers usually isn't so time-critical that it needs transportation faster than is available now.
      Sending anything 60 miles up and giving it enough speed to get the correct ballistic trajectory (remember, no air to speak of at 60 miles) inevitably uses gigantic amounts of fuel.
      There is no way you can make airborne transport price-competitive with rail and water transport, so your suggestion would be pointless. The gains are to be had in making passenger transport more efficient.

  8. Re:They killed Chef !! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Shaft!

    Who's the black private dick
    That's a sex machine to all the chicks?
    (Shaft!)
    You're damn right

    Who is the man
    That would risk his neck for his brother man?
    (Shaft!)
    Can ya dig it?

    Who's the cat that won't cop out
    When there's danger all about
    (Shaft!)
    Right on

    You see this cat Shaft is a bad mother--
    (Shut your mouth)
    But I'm talkin' about Shaft
    (Then we can dig it)

    He's a complicated man
    But no one understands him but his woman
    (John Shaft)

  9. $25m for 2 by DustyShadow · · Score: 1

    Well this sure puts an end to General Atomics's claim that one Global Hawk costs over $100m.

    1. Re:$25m for 2 by SpyPlane · · Score: 1

      Well this sure puts an end to General Atomics's claim that one Global Hawk costs over $100m.

      They didn't buy new ones. They bought the old test ones not used for production.

      Plus they didn't have to buy all the sensors. You can really save money when you don't need to buy a SAR (just like holding off on that NAV unit for your Escalade).

      --
      "We need a fourth law of Robotics: Stop Fingering My Wife"
  10. Not really by WindBourne · · Score: 1

    even now, the commercial jets are testing bio-fuels. They will certainly switch to these.

    But what I find interesting, is that Boeing has the ability to raise millage by 30-50%. The x-48 Blended Wing Body does that. But ppl are fighting against sitting in a theater. I suspect that if Boeing had that aircraft coming right this instant, they would have won the DOD tanker contract, all freighters companies, and most likely a NUMBER of airlines would be buying these as well.Simply put, if Boeing AND the feds were smart, they would push this aircraft hard and fast.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
  11. For comparison by jbeaupre · · Score: 1

    More than a few people have flown over 1000 km (620 mi) with no fuel. Ok, the launch requires some energy, but some don't need fuel: http://www.glider-one.si/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=28&Itemid=1

    This can't be easily adapted to un-manned flight, but it's still interesting for comparison.

    --
    The world is made by those who show up for the job.
  12. And What's New? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are already thousands of general aviation aircraft out there flying with a diesel engine.

    Very Light Aircraft have had built-in parachute devices (yes, rocket launched) for years. Kevlar cockpits? Been there, done that.

    As others have mentioned, 30 mpg is a low yardstick by itself. It's easily achieved for light loads or when you don't mind (or even enjoy) riding thermals along the way. They should at least require a minimum useful payload and minimum speed to have any meaning at all.

    I don't see any progress. And NASA gives its name and prizes for that?