Piracy and the Nintendo DS

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Posted by Soulskill on Tuesday January 13, 2009 @06:28PM from the portable-but-not-too-portable dept.

Graffitiwriter writes "With the average DS game weighing in at about 30-60MB (well within the reach of anyone with a half-decent broadband connection) gamers now have an alarmingly easy route to free games — a fact that Nintendo is all too aware of. Pocket Gamer takes a look at how piracy affects the Nintendo DS console, along with the reasons so many gamers turn to piracy to play their games — including the slew of inferior games, availability of flash carts and industry greed."

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well it is expected... by powerspike · 2009-01-13 18:31 · Score: 5, Informative

People are going to pirate your software, no matter how hard you try to protect it, there was even devices for the original gameboy.

People are going to copy software, and find an excuse for it, they always have, and always will.
company X is bad, Company x charge to much...
1. Re:well it is expected... by AKAImBatman · 2009-01-13 19:07 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  People are going to pirate your software, no matter how hard you try to protect it, there was even devices for the original gameboy.
  Thus the release of the DSi. Not only will it lock out R4 cards for classic DS games, but Nintendo has added significant upgrades to the protection on DSi games. They've even added region coding to round out the new protection bundle. (Thanks a lump, ya bunch of pirates!)
  I doubt these changes will completely eliminate piracy. As you said, there are always those who will make the effort. However, it may stem the rather rampant degree of DS piracy and bring it back down to reasonable levels.
  I imagine these protections are particularly important for the DSi since it has downloadable titles that can be saved to an SDCard. If Nintendo failed to encrypt these games like they did with the Wii, everyone could give their friends copies just by swapping SD Cards.
  
  --
  Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
2. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 19:14 · Score: 0
  
  (Thanks a lump, ya bunch of pirates!)
  Don't thank the pirates, thank Nintendo.
  That said, I'm still looking forward to the DSi, as much as I loathe white plastics and the lowercase "i" in my consumer electronics device. Digital distribution is the way of the future, and I, for one, am looking forward to it.
3. Re:well it is expected... by calmofthestorm · 2009-01-13 19:45 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  It's kind of naive the way you blame pirates for the excesses of the industry. As if any kind of "lock out" can stop people in it for the thrill combined with nearly endless freetime, or an audicence of many people who are willing to pirate because they just want nice things for free.
  On the other hand, such lock out can easily prevent honest customers from exercising their rights (first sale), and create difficulties for them that they just won't easily resolve. May even drive some to piracy to avoid all the headaches.
  Region codes have nothing to do with piracy, they exist solely to support price discrimination by region and prevent first sale doctrine. There's a reason Australia's otherwise-draconian DMCA-equivalent explicitly allows disabling DRM to eliminate such structures.
  My solution to the crap the industry pulls is more on the stop playing games side than the piracy side, but it's pretty easy to see how this goes.
  Way to drink the flavor-aid.
  
  --
  93rd rule of Slashdot: No matter how obvious my sarcasm is, my comment will be taken seriously by someone.
4. Re:well it is expected... by rm999 · 2009-01-13 19:48 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Its a very wide spectrum. I know very few people who modded their Xbox 360s, because if they get caught MSFT disables them from playing online - a pretty severe punishment. Most consoles are similar - they require you to hack hardware (i.e. soldering) with expensive mod chips that void the warranty.
  The DS, on the other hand, is ridiculously easy to pirate. A 15 dollar cart from dealextreme, a 10 dollar microsd card, and a 1 hour bit torrent download can get you 50 of the most popular DS games - built into your DS. It's more convenient, far cheaper, and you can play games even before they come out. It doesn't void your warranty and isn't traceable.
  I personally bought the DS because of its ability to be hacked, but not for pirating. I run a lot of homebrew on my DS, including a very capable Nintendo emulator, an e-book reader, and a few open source games.
5. Re:well it is expected... by AKAImBatman · 2009-01-13 20:04 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  It's kind of naive the way you blame pirates for the excesses of the industry.
  Excesses of the industry? We're talking about Nintendo handhelds here. You're probably the only one in history who has considered that market "excessive". (Whatever that's supposed to mean.)
  
  On the other hand, such lock out can easily prevent honest customers from exercising their rights (first sale), and create difficulties for them that they just won't easily resolve. May even drive some to piracy to avoid all the headaches.
  Did you miss the part where we were talking about a handheld console? Right of first sale is NOT impeded by encryption of DS game cards any more than the NES lockout chip impeded the right of first sale. And you're going to have to backup your comment about "headaches" with some solid data here. We're not talking about PCs. We're talking about a ROM-based handheld game console. You know, the things where you plug the game in and it works right the first time, every time?
  
  Region codes have nothing to do with piracy
  Normally they don't. But in this case, they do. Nintendo has produced seven generations or so of handheld game consoles. Not a single one supported region codes until the DSi. It stands to reason that if Nintendo wasn't trying to lock out pirates with new protection technology, there's a good chance the region codes never would have made it into this system.
  
  Way to drink the flavor-aid.
  Way to stick your head up your ass. If we were talking about PC games you might have a point. But not a single comment you made applies to this particular market. Which means that you've just gone from having a potentially reasonable point to becoming an apologist for illegal and immoral behavior.
  
  --
  Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
6. Re:well it is expected... by NorQue · 2009-01-13 21:00 · Score: 1
  
  People are going to pirate your software, no matter how hard you try to protect it, there was even devices for the original gameboy.
  These devices cost a hell of a lot more back then, though. *cough*Someone I know*cough* bought his first flashkit for the GBC for more then 200 EUR. And those devices weren't exactly easy to use, parallel port introduced a lot problems and they were quite picky on the power supply. Today you shell out 5 EUR and you get a device that plays nearly all games without any effort from your side, any idiot can use that.
7. Re:well it is expected... by __aatgod8309 · 2009-01-13 21:17 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  Well, the card developers have already come up with a working flashcard for the DSi, so Nintendo has lost that battle. http://www.dsfanboy.com/2008/12/02/acekard-produces-first-dsi-flash-cart/
8. Re:well it is expected... by __aatgod8309 · 2009-01-13 21:19 · Score: 1
  
  People tend to forget that emulation, possibly even if you own copies of the software you're using, can still count as piracy. Just because the platform's obsolete, and the games are no longer sold by your average retailer, doesn't mean the roms are in the public domain.
9. Re:well it is expected... by Roland+Piquepaille · 2009-01-13 21:26 · Score: 1
  
  They've even added region coding to round out the new protection bundle.
  Gee great, like this wasn't already a needless PITA with DVDs - needless because de-zoning happens anyway, so in the end it's just there to piss off people who aren't tech savvy.
10. Re:well it is expected... by calmofthestorm · 2009-01-13 23:14 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  True. But morality and legality never have been identical and never will be. One more case study of how the best we can only hope for is a crude approximation.
  But then again, pretty much everybody is committing hundreds of "crimes" per day, the justice is all in the enforcement.
  There's nothing immoral with ROM dumping a game YOU own and playing it on your computer, no matter what industry propaganda may claim otherwise.
  
  --
  93rd rule of Slashdot: No matter how obvious my sarcasm is, my comment will be taken seriously by someone.
11. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 23:26 · Score: 0
  
  Perhaps they can prevent people from pirating games for use on their DS but they will never be able to stop piracy by people who use emulators. The PSP is powerful enough to emulate a Sony Playstation, Nintendo 64 and most likely the Nintendo DS so that would be the logical choice for pirates who still want the portability.
12. Re:well it is expected... by AvitarX · 2009-01-14 00:45 · Score: 1
  
  Except they region locked the honest people.
  
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  Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
13. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 01:02 · Score: 0
  
  Actually The region codes are for piracy. Nintendo never had region codes on their handhelds until the Dsi and that's probably because it's so easy for anyone to produce something, like the R4, and it can be used across the globe and cause more damage.
  Nintendo has always been very fair about handhelds and teh fact y ou can take them on travel and might buy a foreign game. So yes pirates did ruin that for the rest of us.
14. Re:well it is expected... by Goaway · 2009-01-14 01:21 · Score: 1
  
  As if any kind of "lock out" can stop people in it for the thrill combined with nearly endless freetime
  Stopped them pretty well on the PS3.
15. Re:well it is expected... by Goaway · 2009-01-14 01:22 · Score: 1
  
  Somehow, I don't really think anybody will be playing DS games on the PSP any time soon. Can you guess why?
16. Re:well it is expected... by Goaway · 2009-01-14 01:27 · Score: 1
  
  There's nothing immoral with ROM dumping a game YOU own and playing it on your computer
  Are you actually claiming any measurable number of people do this?
17. Re:well it is expected... by bryansj · 2009-01-14 01:54 · Score: 1
  
  Its a very wide spectrum. I know very few people who modded their Xbox 360s, because if they get caught MSFT disables them from playing online - a pretty severe punishment.
  Not that big of a deal since the ban only bans the console and not the account. You can replace it now for $200. I'd say the biggest drawback to modding a 360 is the fact that you have to void your warranty by breaking the seal and opening the box. Then again, now it is only a $200 cost to replace. Pirate 4 games and you've already more than covered the cost of getting banned or a RROD failure. Also, who cares about being online in single player games such as Fallout3, Mass Effect, Bioshock...?
18. Re:well it is expected... by Lumpy · 2009-01-14 02:14 · Score: 1
  
  how about the fact that over 75%... yes 75% for the nintendo DS games sold are utter and complete crap.
  Then add in that some Japanese games that are incredibly good, NEVER get sold here in the states.
  Nintendo is further causing the problem by not reducing the price on older but good games. Mariokart DS is over 2 years old, and still sells for full retail price it released at.
  Finally, it's not like it's new. I had a Gameboy advance flash cart, this is not new.
  P.S. it's not limited to the DS. the PSP has a huge swath of utter crap games.
  
  --
  Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
19. Re:well it is expected... by SpinningCone · 2009-01-14 02:31 · Score: 1
  
  Kinda http://episteme.arstechnica.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=50009562&f=174096756&m=9770920395&r=9770920395
  there are exceptions
  "(3) Computer programs and video games distributed in formats that have become obsolete and which require the original media or hardware as a condition of access. A format shall be considered obsolete if the machine or system necessary to render perceptible a work stored in that format is no longer manufactured or is no longer reasonably available in the commercial marketplace."
  if you don't consider NES machines on ebay "reasonably available" then those carts are obsolete and you can circumvent copyright protections. which could be construed as "i have this NES cart but no hardware i am circumventing that via emulation" however this is all DMCA, copyright law should still prohibit getting games you don't own.
  in the end its all very grey and that's why it persists
20. Re:well it is expected... by hansamurai · 2009-01-14 02:32 · Score: 1
  
  Nintendo did that, not the card developers.
  
  --
  Reviewing just the first hour of video games.
21. Re:well it is expected... by LWATCDR · 2009-01-14 03:06 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  "People tend to forget that emulation, possibly even if you own copies of the software you're using, can still count as piracy."
  I have never heard that. Breaking copy protection under the DMCA is but even then I think you would be hard pressed to convict someone playing games they own on an emulator.
  I have been meaning to pick up a flash cart for my DS. I do not want to pirate any games. What I want is to not have to carry around a bunch of carts with me every where I take my DS! If I can carry all my games on one microsd cards then I will be happy. I am also looking to try out some homebrew software. I admit I am probably a small a member of a small minority of potental fashcart users.
  Here is a question, what is the best best flashcart for the DS and where can you get one?
  
  --
  See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
22. Re:well it is expected... by el3mentary · 2009-01-14 03:10 · Score: 1
  
  I do.
  
  --
  I reject your reality and substitute my own.
23. Re:well it is expected... by 10101001+10101001 · 2009-01-14 03:40 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  There's nothing immoral with ROM dumping a game YOU own and playing it on your computer
  Are you actually claiming any measurable number of people do this?
  That all depends on whether you believe all game developers either never dump their own bought games or are hypocritical pirates. We could also pretend that things like the Wii Virtual Console aren't a big financial hit, when certainly piracy is a significantly cheaper (although a more complex) option.
  Perhaps the answer is more along the times of, if it's trivial enough, even average Joe will do it. But, average Joe doesn't buy many games anyways. And as trivial as DS flashcarts are to use, it's not like you can buy them at the corner stop or that there's zero risk. The Wii Virtual Console succeeds because it's easy enough. The Nintendo DS succeeds inspite of piracy because honest people already pretty well put all their money their entertainment money into the same entertainment, regardless of their piracy of that entertainment.
  Now, perhaps that removes the motivation to work harder, find a second job, etc to feed one's entertainment addiction. But, given copyright is a governmental monopoly intended to better the public at large, and it seems very clear that copyright holders can thrive even with extensive piracy (although probably not with 30%+ population piracy), I'm inclined to believe that work should be done to decriminalize/de-law-suitize many current practices of the populace at large since punishment would be arbitrary and non-constructive.
  
  --
  Eurohacker European paranoia, gun rights, and h
24. Re:well it is expected... by Goaway · 2009-01-14 03:46 · Score: 1
  
  That all depends on whether you believe all game developers either never dump their own bought games or are hypocritical pirates. We could also pretend that things like the Wii Virtual Console aren't a big financial hit, when certainly piracy is a significantly cheaper (although a more complex) option.
  I'm not sure what you are trying to say here, or what any of the rest of the post has to do with what I said.
25. Re:well it is expected... by Sancho · 2009-01-14 03:57 · Score: 1
  
  It's kind of naive the way you blame pirates for the excesses of the industry.
  Excesses of the industry? We're talking about Nintendo handhelds here. You're probably the only one in history who has considered that market "excessive". (Whatever that's supposed to mean.)
  http://www.thefreedictionary.com/excesses
  He's referring to the fourth definition. The implication is that Nintendo is greedy and trying to make as much money as possible at the expense of its customers.
  
  Did you miss the part where we were talking about a handheld console? Right of first sale is NOT impeded by encryption of DS game cards any more than the NES lockout chip impeded the right of first sale.
  But first sale rights are impeded by region locking. In this global market, I ought to be able to sell my DSi cartridge to someone in Europe. Unfortunately, they won't be able to play it.
  
  Normally they don't. But in this case, they do. Nintendo has produced seven generations or so of handheld game consoles. Not a single one supported region codes until the DSi. It stands to reason that if Nintendo wasn't trying to lock out pirates with new protection technology, there's a good chance the region codes never would have made it into this system.
  Why does this stand to reason? You're begging the question here--presupposing the conclusion as its own explanation. Critically thinking, what on earth does region coding have to do with piracy? Why have others in the industry embraced region coding? Did it have to do with piracy then?
26. Re:well it is expected... by 10101001+10101001 · 2009-01-14 04:11 · Score: 1
  
  I'm not sure what you are trying to say here, or what any of the rest of the post has to do with what I said.
  That depends on what you were trying to say. It sounded like you were asking a generic question on whether there existed a population of people who dumped games they bought to play on their computer. If you were asking a more specific question, about whether anyone has done an actual survey to ascertain an exact measure of that population, then my post wasn't relevant, and I apologize. If, on the other hand, your question was more or less what I restated, then game developers are clearly a population of people with many with the expertise to dump games and a vested interest and aversion to piracy. So, it seems very probable that that population would be a great source for measurement.
  The rest of my post, though, was mainly a counter to the generic question. That is, the idea that you and the original grandparent seem to possess that the questionable legitimate uses today of flashcarts somehow have any real consequence to the underlying funding for copyrighted works so that such entertainment can continue to be produced is generally a red herring because piracy itself is generally a red herring. Copyright law of today is far from perfect in fulfilling its underlying purpose. The discussion is about as absurd as people calmly discussing the best method of execution during the French Revolution.
  
  --
  Eurohacker European paranoia, gun rights, and h
27. Re:well it is expected... by Goaway · 2009-01-14 04:37 · Score: 1
  
  game developers are clearly a population of people with many with the expertise to dump games and a vested interest and aversion to piracy
  Game developers are not only a vanishingly small group, and they presumably already have the binaries for the games. They wrote them, after all.
  As for the rest, I'd agree copyright as it stands is in many cases bullshit, but what I posted I posted because it does nobody any good to obscure the issues by making up ridiculous rationalizations. If you want to argue copyrights, first admit that copyright violations are widespread and common, and then argue that this means the law should change.
  Don't try to weasel out with arguments like "but people might be dumping their legal ROM" or "but people just use them for homebrew" or anything else.
28. Re:well it is expected... by Kimos · 2009-01-14 05:19 · Score: 1
  
  Lots of info on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_DS_storage_devices
  
  Either the CycloDS or Acekard seem to be best. Your best bet would be an Acekard 2i, which will work on the new DSi hardware. Not having to carry around carts pretty much makes the console for me. There's no good reason to for everyone to be carrying around the little plastic boxes other than copy protection. Not to mention being able to audit games. There is an overwhelming amount of terrible games for the DS, even with first party and reliable franchises.
29. Re:well it is expected... by Fallingcow · 2009-01-14 05:22 · Score: 1
  
  Actually The region codes are for piracy. Nintendo never had region codes on their handhelds until the Dsi and that's probably because it's so easy for anyone to produce something, like the R4, and it can be used across the globe and cause more damage.
  This makes no sense at all.
30. Re:well it is expected... by Golddess · 2009-01-14 05:26 · Score: 1
  
  But first sale rights are impeded by region locking. In this global market, I ought to be able to sell my DSi cartridge to someone in Europe. Unfortunately, they won't be able to play it.
  Interesting. Do you consider your right of first sale impeded because you cannot sell a Windows game to an OSX user?
  
  --
  "I'm not sure I like the fugnutish tone you used in your post!" -RogL (608926)-
31. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 05:35 · Score: 0
  
  I agree, and that's why I picked up my Edge Card (I could send you to a site that sells 'em, but really, how far does one need to go beyond "Google for 'edge card ds'" )
  I've got a 6 year old, who has a series of DS games. Three of them are "worn out" and don't work anymore, they hang any DS after 5 minutes of play and resetting the card. Instead of lugging around her games, plus the ones I'll get for myself when stuck on a train / plane, I keep one card in and have directory navigation for all her games + mine... add the homebrew software, the text-readers, and I've got pretty much what I was looking for.
  Believe it or not, the most used software on it? Text-reader. Recipes mainly - usable in kitchen, don't need or want a big clunky laptop, just flip through the DS for simplicity. And makes a great bathroom reader.
32. Re:well it is expected... by Sancho · 2009-01-14 05:38 · Score: 1
  
  That's not an artificial control placed by the company, so no.
33. Re:well it is expected... by LWATCDR · 2009-01-14 05:53 · Score: 1
  
  Yea I saw that list a while ago. The thing is that it doesn't provide anything like which one is best or which one works best for you.
  That isn't really Wikipedia's function.
  
  --
  See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
34. Re:well it is expected... by 10101001+10101001 · 2009-01-14 06:52 · Score: 1
  
  Just three small points.
  One, when I mentioned games in relationship to video game developers, I clearly specified games they bought (ie, not merely those games they worked on). Outside the function of their job, video game developers rarely have any rights to the games they make except through purchasing a copy. The exceptions, of course, are when the video game developer in question owns the company or has special provisions under contract (which, interestingly, is rather a point of the absurdity of copyright law).
  Two, I agree that including rationales does indeed dilute the discussion; but, then you yourself engaged in that discussion as well (as did I, truthfully, although I did try to segue into my point about copyright).
  Three, I don't think it necessarily appropriate to mention how widespread piracy is because that very quickly falls into the trap of discussing piracy instead of discussing copyright law. Beyond that, arguing purely for the ulitarian position of copyright creates the problem that not everyone seems to agree with what the actual purpose of copyright is. That is to say, many people seem to believe that copyright was created to reward authors. But, that is merely a means to an end. So long as people are stuck with the notion that the purpose of copyright is to reward authors, then *any* author whose work is pirated becomes a victim. Obviously that's absurd because copyright law isn't meant to be a way of being magical fair towards authors while ignore the unfairness of every other industry in existance. So, it would seem best to only mention the piracy rates as an asside and not focus on it or let it dominate the discussion. And that means not arguing over how big or small the legitimate users are today since that's not the underlying problem with the system.
  
  --
  Eurohacker European paranoia, gun rights, and h
35. Re:well it is expected... by Golddess · 2009-01-14 07:00 · Score: 1
  
  It would be clunky, but I'm sure some sort of side-by-side thing could be arranged for the dual-screen part (or maybe you play it with the PSP rotated 90 degrees), with the analog nub used for moving a stylus on the touchscreen portion, and one of the buttons not mapped to a DS button to indicate when you are pressing down with the stylus.
  
  It's certainly not something I'd ever use, but it can be done.
  
  --
  "I'm not sure I like the fugnutish tone you used in your post!" -RogL (608926)-
36. Re:well it is expected... by Golddess · 2009-01-14 07:06 · Score: 1
  
  As do I. I love having only a single cartridge to lug around with my DS.
  
  --
  "I'm not sure I like the fugnutish tone you used in your post!" -RogL (608926)-
37. Re:well it is expected... by skulgnome · 2009-01-14 07:11 · Score: 1
  
  Yeah, well. A mod card for the DSi was being sold in Akihabara like weeks ago. So much for the "increased protection", eh.
  You should remember that purchasing software is a choice as much as warezing is. You can stop making that choice any time you want, if the region-coding bothers you so much. It's not like a gun is being held to your head, is it?
38. Re:well it is expected... by Kimos · 2009-01-14 07:13 · Score: 1
  
  Well I have an R4. It's amazing, but there are a few games that don't run or lock up because of speed issues. The two above mentioned have apparently fixed that.
  
  It's really by far the most elegant piracy/hacking/homebrew/etc. tool that I have ever used.
39. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 07:14 · Score: 0
  
  The fact that a company tries to prevent you from doing something on hardware they sell you, is motivation enough for people looking for a challenge to try to bypass it.
  If protection gets bypassed some people will swipe games, and other people will write homebrew.
  The mere fact that the new protection on the DSi exists, means someone will sit down and break it to see if they can.
40. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 07:30 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  Nooo...
  It's because Chinese/Hong Kong sellers tend to sell NDS with 60+ GBA games on the flash carts which in turn undermines the entire South east asia market as well as Australia and Europe.
  The sooner Nintendo phases out the regular DS/DS Lite, the sooner they can regularly lockout flash carts with firmware updates.
41. Re:well it is expected... by Golddess · 2009-01-14 07:35 · Score: 1
  
  I'm afraid I don't see the difference. For all intents and purposes, they are releasing two different devices (lets just stick to two regions for this discussion). Why does it matter whether the difference is a bit in software (flip the bit to toggle regions), or a different set of hardware? Would you consider your right of first sale impeded if Nintendo released a new handheld using, say, a Motorola chipset for the US but an Intel chipset for Europe (I'm not an electrical engineer, so maybe those two are compatible, but for this argument lets say they aren't), and games had to be compiled specifically for that region's hardware?
  
  What about if Europe had never received a single Nintendo handheld before the DSi, would your right of first sale be impeded because you couldn't sell them GBA games? What if the DSi was released just for Europe? Is their right of first sale impeded because they can't sell you DSi games?
  
  Don't get me wrong, I don't like the lockout. I just fail to see why there is a difference in how the lockout is achieved.
  
  --
  "I'm not sure I like the fugnutish tone you used in your post!" -RogL (608926)-
42. Re:well it is expected... by Nick+Ives · 2009-01-14 07:48 · Score: 1
  
  I got myself a CycloDS after I lost three carts whilst travelling. I didn't touch my DS for ages after that because I'm just so scatty when I'm moving around and I didn't fancy losing more games.
  After I downloaded all the games I lost I've started doing the piracy as demo thing which is kinda cool; I'm building a collection of unopened NDS games!
  If Nintendo bring out an official download store and charge a little bit less than the boxed edition I'd probably start using that instead though.
  
  --
  Nick
43. Re:well it is expected... by Sancho · 2009-01-14 07:58 · Score: 1
  
  Let me try this tack.
  For all intents and purposes, the DSi in Europe and the DSi in America are the same unit. They use the same hardware, the same software. The programs that run on them are compiled from the same code.
  Nintendo put extra money and time into R&D for region locking. The sole purpose of region locking is the prevention interoperability between devices sold in different regions. One of the effects of this is that I can't sell a used game to someone in Europe.
  See, I'm not asking for Nintendo to go to extra effort to include interoperability. I'm asking that they not explicitly deny it by adding in code which makes it impossible. By their taking an action that prevents my sale, they are impeding first sale rights.
44. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 08:06 · Score: 0
  
  Mariokart DS is over 2 years old, and still sells for full retail price it released at.
  That's one of my big gripes... I kept waiting for the price to drop on mario kart, it never did, so I got a flash cart for 1/3 the price of mario kart and loaded it right up. Works great!
  Oh, and all those handy kanji apps for the DS in japan... Quite useful! Thanks for the lockout on future stuff!
45. Re:well it is expected... by KDR_11k · 2009-01-14 08:30 · Score: 1
  
  Let's not forget that the Doctrine of First Sale is a national law while you're talking about international sales. Plus the doctrine only guarantees that you can sell it legally, it does not guarantee that it will be of any use to other people or that you can find a buyer. That a European DSi won't be able to play a US cart is not related to first sale since 1. nothing prevents you from selling it to a European, he just wouldn't want it and 2. you can always sell to a US buyer.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
46. Re:well it is expected... by KDR_11k · 2009-01-14 08:33 · Score: 1
  
  I really doubt that, these carts would get coded to whatever region they are meant to be sold in. The lock is usually about licensing or stuff like that. Piracy has nothing to do with it (and e.g. Australian courts have ruled that region locks are not copy protection mechanisms).
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
47. Re:well it is expected... by KDR_11k · 2009-01-14 08:35 · Score: 1
  
  75%? Wow, that's a good rate. Sturgeon's Law would put it at 90%.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
48. Re:well it is expected... by mgblst · 2009-01-14 08:44 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, this comment always gets made. The thing is to make it hard enough so that it is not easily uptaken by the majority. Making people go through some hoops is enough of a deterent for most people. Even the r4 card at the moment is enough to stop most people, since they haven't heard about it.
49. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 09:21 · Score: 0
  
  Region codes [...] exist solely to support price discrimination by region and prevent first sale doctrine.
  
  Regional Codes have no effect on first sale doctrine because such laws cannot be enforced outside of the country that wrote them and no country that I know of crosses regional code boundaries.
  Also, I can easily buy a movie in one regional country and resell it in another. It simply has a lot less value, unless someone has a player that can play that region. In the case of movies, it's not that hard. In the case of Video Games, it's a bit harder.
  It also exists for reasons outside price discrimination, such as licensing enforcement. Ergo, your statement is a little excessive, but your attempt to point out it does nothing but boost companies and hurt consumers is very true.
50. Re:well it is expected... by owyn999 · 2009-01-14 09:26 · Score: 1
  
  Actually they are dead wrong... as with anything that has the ability to use an SD card this will probably make the piracy even easier, heck look at the Wii, sure once a month or every two months those that want to use "home brew software" have to update their "Modified Save Game" but everyone knows that there are those out there that are using this to play Pirated games. As for the DSi this just means that now people can cut out the middle man of it being a Passthrough Flash to it being all directly on a Flash Card itself.
  
  The DSi will have a hacked OS within the year I can tell you that because people who manage to get Linux onto a DSi will have a bounty set by the homebrew community...
  
  --
  Where's that cap to the Decanter of Endless water???
51. Re:well it is expected... by EvolutionsPeak · 2009-01-14 09:47 · Score: 1
  
  Such protections will not make the tiniest dent in piracy. All it takes is for 1 guy to break the scheme and upload the fixed version to piratebay or something and users will continue pirating just as they did before. The people doing the downloading don't even have to be aware that the protection scheme was ever even there.
52. Re:well it is expected... by gameboyhippo · 2009-01-14 10:55 · Score: 1
  
  If what you're wanting to do is homebrew, pick up a Datel "Games 'n Music" card at your local Wal-Mart for $20. It does homebrew, emulation, etc... It does not play commercial games, though.
53. Re:well it is expected... by rm999 · 2009-01-14 11:28 · Score: 1
  
  I remember reading somewhere you can just replace the hard drive, not the whole xbox.
54. Re:well it is expected... by rm999 · 2009-01-14 11:33 · Score: 1
  
  If you're cheap and willing to wait a couple of weeks, this one's supposed to be decent:
  http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.15947
55. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 13:33 · Score: 0
  
  The Dsi was cracked within 2 weeks. See
  www.ndstt.com
56. Re:well it is expected... by Golddess · 2009-01-14 14:17 · Score: 1
  
  I think I'm beginning to understand your point of view.
  
  Nintendo deliberately making a difference to the devices between regions to ensure one region cannot play another region's games is not the same thing as Nintendo designing a system for the standards of the region (think PAL vs NTSC in the home consoles, probably should have used that example originally), which due to the required differences, games in one region cannot play on a system in another.
  
  --
  "I'm not sure I like the fugnutish tone you used in your post!" -RogL (608926)-
57. Re:well it is expected... by Sancho · 2009-01-14 15:51 · Score: 1
  
  Exactly.
  Truthfully, I can understand where you're coming from. It's a fine line between different devices which are incompatible, and similar devices which are intentionally made incompatible. I personally believe that on one side of the line, Nintendo is impeding my rights.
58. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 19:19 · Score: 0
  
  I play SNES games under emulation all of the time. I've dumped my own ROMs using my Super Wild Card so exactly what law am I breaking?
59. Re:well it is expected... by bryansj · 2009-01-15 00:47 · Score: 1
  
  That's not true. If that was the case then they could not ban the Arcade/Core consoles.
60. Re:well it is expected... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-15 04:04 · Score: 0
  
  Because Nintendo only caters to children and gay people?
its not the same by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:31 · Score: 0

I find that the portability as well as the look and feel of the DS make it a more fun experience than sitting at a computer playing games of the DS level.
I mean, sure netbooks work too - but you can't stick them in your pocket quite yet.
1. Re:its not the same by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:35 · Score: 0
  
  Is that a netbook in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?
2. Re:its not the same by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:47 · Score: 0
  
  People can store backups of DS games on flash cards and play them on their DS. I understand that this is most often done for the purpose of piracy, but I do it just because I don't like to have to carry around 50 cartridges with me everywhere. Also, homebrew is pretty sweet.
3. Re:its not the same by KDR_11k · 2009-01-13 18:58 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  You actually use all 50 carts? I've got enough room for 12 in my bag and rarely ever use more than 1-2 of them.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
4. Re:its not the same by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:59 · Score: 0
  
  50 carts takes up about the same amount of room as 12 of them. Honestly, DS carts are small.
5. Re:its not the same by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 19:02 · Score: 0
  
  You actually use all 50 carts?
  No, who told you that? I just like to have my collection with me. When I wake up in the morning, there's no way for me to know if I'll feel like playing Brain Age or Mario at any given point during the day. It's also nice not needing a bag.
6. Re:its not the same by powerspike · 2009-01-14 01:08 · Score: 1
  
  They are useful for building a house to put your ds into, didn't you know it's the new "in thing" to do...
7. Re:its not the same by spyrochaete · 2009-01-14 01:33 · Score: 1
  
  You actually use all 50 carts? I've got enough room for 12 in my bag and rarely ever use more than 1-2 of them.
  You think people with 40GB iPods actually listen to all that music before their battery needs to be charged again? Or would a better solution be to throw 30 CDs in your bag and lug those around with you?
  
  Physical media is a burden, plain and simple.
8. Re:its not the same by mindwhip · 2009-01-14 02:06 · Score: 1
  
  The big advantage I can see would be this...
  
  From personal experience, the carts are so small they are practically designed to be lost. In chosing to carry even a couple around, you are probably going to misplace one every so often (even more so if the DS owner is a young child).
  
  Having only one cart, which you never have to remove from the DS and keeping the originals safe at home seems like a good idea. At least for the customer... the manufacturers may have other ideas.
  
  --
  [The Universe] has gone offline.
Size doesn't matter... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:33 · Score: 1, Insightful

A hacked PSP with LARGE ISO's, some up to 1GB, is just as common as someone with a Nintendo DS and an R4.
1. Re:Size doesn't matter... by Paradigm_Complex · 2009-01-14 01:50 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  I would have thought the hacked PSPs would be more common based on my own experiences. It's a lot more appealing because it doesn't require any extra hardware beyond the little SONY proprietary flash drive it supports normally anyways.
  
  Except for the "LARGE ISO's". IMO there aren't any pirate-worthy games for the PSP; I use it entirely for homebrew. It's a wonderful little machine, if a tad uncomfortable.
  
  --
  "A witty saying proves nothing." - Voltaire
2. Re:Size doesn't matter... by sandmaninator · 2009-01-14 03:35 · Score: 1
  
  I'd hack my PSP to be able to play the games I've bought without having to use those stupid UMD disks. But then (I assume) I'd lose the ability to download game demos from Sony which I find quite handy.
  Actually, another reason not to hack it is that using the UMD disks saves me from having to buy more of those damned memory sticks. Once I can get 8gb for $15, I'll consider hacking again.
3. Re:Size doesn't matter... by NorQue · 2009-01-14 07:56 · Score: 1
  
  I'd hack my PSP to be able to play the games I've bought without having to use those stupid UMD disks. But then (I assume) I'd lose the ability to download game demos from Sony which I find quite handy.
  Oh, you'll still have that ability... they're just not called "demos" anymore. ;)
4. Re:Size doesn't matter... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 08:16 · Score: 0
  
  And carrying around 8 UMD disks is easier than carrying around 1 8gb microSD card in a memory stick adapter? (Yes, they do have those, and yes they work quite well in my PSP),
Nitendo DS by DreamsAreOkToo · 2009-01-13 18:33 · Score: 1

Recently, I was going on a road trip and was looking for somethings to keep myself and others entertained. I borrowed a friend's DS and bought a couple games for it. I ended up dropping about $60 on 4-5 games that I had heard of or seen commercials for.
Afterwards, I wished I had skipped it. Only one of the games was played to any degree by anyone. The others were trash/shovelware that got old after 15 minutes. Also, it frustrated the hell out of me that the games featured only 1 save slot, prohibiting anyone from starting new games.
I thought I was back in the stone age of gaming. Until they get with the program, they've lost me as a portable gamer.
1. Re:Nitendo DS by rolfwind · 2009-01-13 18:45 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Or, you could actually take a few minutes to look up online what the good games are which aren't. Or just grab a top 10 list from someplace. Just the same concept of using rotten tomatoes to avoid dropping money on bad movies.
  I don't think ignorance is really a valid excuse anymore. At least 90% of any media has always been crap.
2. Re:Nitendo DS by MrMista_B · 2009-01-13 18:53 · Score: 1
  
  So, you didn't do any reasearch or look at any reviews whatsoever, just bought the cheapest ('about $60 on 4-5 games is about $7 a game) games you could find?
  And then, you're going to blame Nintendo for games made by /other companies/?
  Are you for real?
3. Re:Nitendo DS by Toonol · 2009-01-13 20:17 · Score: 1
  
  Yeah, all he really needed to do was just buy one game... ChronoTrigger for the DS. He would have come back from his trip thinking the DS was the best thing ever.
4. Re:Nitendo DS by AstrumPreliator · 2009-01-13 21:23 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  If you're going to look for game reviews I suggest metacritic and only look at the user ratings. I've noticed a lot of game review sites and magazines consistently give big release titles a much higher score than they deserve. Just look at the average critic score given to Far Cry 2 versus the average user score on metacritic. I think hundreds if not thousands of user scores coming from people who play games for fun are a better indication of a games worth than a handful of people who are paid to review them.
  
  Just my opinion though.
5. Re:Nitendo DS by Racemaniac · 2009-01-14 00:26 · Score: 1
  
  yeah, then he would have had 1 or 2 games for that amount of money -_-
  maybe i'm the only one who finds it ridiculous, but here in europe, the ds games are prices 40â new (some even 45)...
  wtf -_-, for a handheld game, that obviously didn't cost as much to develop as a pc game, that get sold at 45-50â....
6. Re:Nitendo DS by spyrochaete · 2009-01-14 01:42 · Score: 1
  
  I'm with you on this one. My wife and I bought a DS and a few games before our honeymoon last year and all but one were awful. DS games are ridiculously expensive for what you get. I would have written off the DS entirely if not for a little miracle - one charge of the battery lasted our entire 11-day vacation!
  
  Since then we've gotten an R4 and we preview games before buying. We've gone on to buy some really great games that take good advantage of the DS - Warioware, Phoenix Wright, Cooking Mama, Spelling Challenge, Korg DS-10, and Chrono Trigger to name a few.
  
  At least Nintendo has started releasing demos for DS games which you can access if you have a Wii. That's a start. Still, I've been burned for about $300 on shamefully terrible games and the R4 is the only reason I'm not completely disgruntled with the entire DS platform. 99% of DS games are worthless, and if Nintendo isn't going to enforce some kind of quality control then it's their own fault if the end-users take matters into their own hands.
7. Re:Nitendo DS by spyrochaete · 2009-01-14 01:47 · Score: 1
  
  Or, you could actually take a few minutes to look up online what the good games are which aren't.
  That's what I did when I bought Mario Kart and Zelda for DS. They were rated very highly so I dropped $100 on them and I thought they were derivative tripe that I'd already played 5 times before. Reviews are subjective.
8. Re:Nitendo DS by Paradigm_Complex · 2009-01-14 01:55 · Score: 1
  
  4-5 games that I had heard of or seen commercials for
  *gasp* Did a commercial mislead you? That's horrible! It's also a horrible way to shop for ANYTHING. It's not really Nintendo's fault that third party developers have been using both their current platforms to shovel off crap for - as many developers have been doing for pretty much every platform ever.
  
  Do about half an hour of research 'round the web (ign, gamespot, et al) and get a feel for what the best games are for the platform for the genres your interested in. If after that you find that all the games are crap you may be in a position to complain.
  
  Nintendo has been extremely successful with the DS - there's a reason for it, and it's not the cute little styluses.
  
  --
  "A witty saying proves nothing." - Voltaire
9. Re:Nitendo DS by mindwhip · 2009-01-14 02:14 · Score: 1
  
  I would have thought that you wouldn't have had any time to play computer games on your honeymoon... Or maybe the battery lasted 11 days because you never played it once.
  
  --
  [The Universe] has gone offline.
10. Re:Nitendo DS by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 02:36 · Score: 0
  
  Mario Kart is nice, but nothing out of the ordinary. If you've played Mario Kart 64, you should know what to expect. Not exactly sure how they could produce a kart racing game without it being "derivative." It seems pretty fresh as far as racing games go.
  I kinda see your point with Zelda, though. It did seem pretty fresh compared to the series' usual standards, but that's not to say that I didn't get bored and stop playing half-way through.
11. Re:Nitendo DS by spyrochaete · 2009-01-14 02:51 · Score: 1
  
  You underestimate our nerdiness!
  
  We probably got about 14 hours of game time over those 11 days. Between travel and lounging in the hotel after an exhausting day it was nice to unwind with some games. I was really astounded that we squeezed so much battery life out of our DS.
12. Re:Nitendo DS by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 03:21 · Score: 0
  
  gamespot? you mean the magazine and website owned and operated by gamestop?
  Pity, you have fallen prey...
13. Re:Nitendo DS by neumayr · 2009-01-14 04:47 · Score: 1
  
  And then, you're going to blame Nintendo for games made by /other companies/?
  Are you for real?
  Seems he's blaming portable gaming as such, and gives valid reasons. The one save slot thing is extremely annoying, and at least on the DS can (afaik) only be circumvented by piracy (by temporarily copying the savegame elsewhere).
  The people that decide that one save game should be enough for everyone are a significant part of the portable gaming industry, and imho a good reason to condemn the whole thing.
  
  --
  Truth arises more readily from error than from confusion. -Francis Bacon
14. Re:Nitendo DS by default+luser · 2009-01-14 06:51 · Score: 1
  
  I do the same thing as you: I find the incredible mass of games available for the DS confusing, and I find that reviews often don't reflect my personal tasts.
  I like having the R4 because I can download copies of the games I am interested in, and check if the game is good before I toss-in my money. I've already bought one game this way, and have another on my list to buy (the new Castlevania), because it's an awesome game. I then continue to play the copies on my R4 because it's convenient to never have to switch cartridges.
  In addition, the documentation and toolset are so fleshed-out that I'm also programming some of my own homebrew. The R4 is the best $20 I've ever spent.
  
  --
  Man is the animal that laughs.
  And occasionally whores for Karma.
15. Re:Nitendo DS by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 08:37 · Score: 0
  
  You really need to give a platform. The FarCry 2 user scores on the console are pretty close to the critic's scores. The PC review, on the other hand, has a score of 86 from critics and 56 from users.
  Another good example is LittleBigPlanet, which pulled a 95 from critics - but only a 63 from users!
  Although you still have to be careful when using user reviews - Gears of War 2 got 93 from critics but only 63 from users. The low user score is mostly due to people whining about cheaters online - which, while a problem, is one that the developer can fix, versus a simply bad game.
16. Re:Nitendo DS by KDR_11k · 2009-01-14 08:45 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  A problem with user scores is that many will just vote 10 or 0 purely on the hype they feel for a game (or even vote for/against it purely out of console fanboyism).
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
17. Re:Nitendo DS by KDR_11k · 2009-01-14 08:48 · Score: 1
  
  But since he only liked one of the games anyway that wouldn't have been a loss.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
R4 cards by ilovegeorgebush · 2009-01-13 18:35 · Score: 2, Informative

It's called an R4 card, though there are others too.

--
ilovegeorgebush
1. Re:R4 cards by Bios_Hakr · 2009-01-13 19:09 · Score: 1
  
  I got tired of carrying around 10+ individual carts. Last time I was in Tokyo, I stopped by Akihabara and grabbed a R4DS card and 8gb micro-SD card.
  Now I can consolidate all my games and, just as importantly, try new games before I buy them. Works great. The only down side is that you have to download the firmware from the site and copy that to all the MicroSD cards. I wish they'd burned it onto the R4 itself.
  Also, I sometimes have to try the card 3 or 4 times to get it to read properly. This is only an issue if I remove the card to play a normal cart and then swap back.
  
  --
  I'd rather you do it wrong, than for me to have to do it at all.
2. Re:R4 cards by rsmith-mac · 2009-01-13 19:19 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  It's worth noting that the original R4 is no longer sold, and the company that made it is long gone. The R4's sold now are all poor knock-offs with no support. If you're a pirate they won't work with future games, and if you're a homebrewer the compatibility is absolutely terrible thanks in part to shoddy DLDI patching. There are other, better flash carts (AceKart, CycloDS, M3, etc) that can meet your needs, whichever side of the spectrum you may go.
3. Re:R4 cards by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 23:15 · Score: 0
  
  I know a parent who bought the R4 because the kid was traveling around with US$400 of original games, and it's hard to tell a 12 year old the value of something that is so small and portable.
4. Re:R4 cards by spyrochaete · 2009-01-14 01:52 · Score: 1
  
  I sometimes have to try the card 3 or 4 times to get it to read properly. This is only an issue if I remove the card to play a normal cart and then swap back.
  I have the same trouble with my R4 which is a few months old, but my wife has no such trouble with hers which is about 18 months old. We showed our R4 cards to someone who told us that mine was a cheap knockoff and hers was original. Mine still works but it's a little sensitive - if I accidentally jostle the card my game freezes and I lose my progress. It works great otherwise, and the only other difference is that my wife's SD slot is springloaded while mine just slides relatively uninhibited.
5. Re:R4 cards by spyrochaete · 2009-01-14 01:59 · Score: 1
  
  I've got a knockoff R4 and not only does it work fine, it also gets occasional firmware updates which enable it to work on the newest games. For example I was curious about the new Chrono Trigger game but wasn't sure whether it was worth buying once again so I tried it on my R4 but it didn't work. I found a recent firmware update and installed it, and then the game worked. I thought the new Chrono Trigger was a far better reinterpretation of the original than the lame Playstation version so I bought it.
  
  I admit I have trouble running about 50% of homebrew, though, and that's a huge shame. I'll probably try a different flashcart next time because I'm disappointed to be missing out on some really cool indie games and utilities.
6. Re:R4 cards by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 03:11 · Score: 0
  
  I bought the original R4 card from gameyeeaaah (don't remember the exact name of the site) three days ago and every single DS game I've tried works (around 20). DLDI patching is automatic now and snes,nes, and genesis all work (nes and genesis flawlessly as far as I've tested: another 20-30 games each).
  On the contrary, sir. I highly recommend it.
7. Re:R4 cards by KDR_11k · 2009-01-14 08:52 · Score: 1
  
  If the kid had paid for it himself then he'd know the value. I know I considered my games valuable because I couldn't afford many.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
8. Re:R4 cards by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-16 09:15 · Score: 0
  
  A little OT but which one would you recommend for homebrew? I picked up an old DS lately to play around with and was looking into which card to get, I pretty much have no interest in the actual games for the system.
Free mod points! by DreamsAreOkToo · 2009-01-13 18:35 · Score: 2, Insightful

flash carts

/standard rant about Slashdot editors
1. Re:Free mod points! by daath93 · 2009-01-13 19:04 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Mario Flash Carts i presume.
2. Re:Free mod points! by rm999 · 2009-01-13 19:51 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  Nothing wrong with that.
  A flash cart, short for flash cartridge, is a device you place in your DS. The flash cart contains a flash card, which stores the games/data. This is (was?) the most popular flash cartridge when I got my DS: http://r4ds.cn/
3. Re:Free mod points! by LocalH · 2009-01-13 20:45 · Score: 1
  
  This got modded up as insightful? Jesus Christ. /standard rant about Slashdot moderators
  
  --
  FC Closer
4. Re:Free mod points! by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 22:34 · Score: 0
  
  insightful? wtf!!!!
5. Re:Free mod points! by fbjon · 2009-01-13 23:44 · Score: 1
  
  It's a holdover from the days of cartridges, still used sometimes.
  
  --
  True confidence comes not from realising you are as good as your peers, but that your peers are as bad as you are.
6. Re:Free mod points! by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 05:21 · Score: 0
  
  THIS post should be modded up. Not GP. GP was just uninformed and modders were fast triggers
As a CycloDS owner by Duradin · 2009-01-13 18:36 · Score: 5, Interesting

As a CycloDS owner, I can say that exactly zero (0) of the roms I have are pirated.
Why did I get a flash card if not to pirate?
Primarily, my upgrade to the lite left the gba cart sticking out, which made it less than convenient to carry with anything but the plug in the gba slot. Next was the convenience of not having to bring anything more then the DS itself while still having access to all my carts. Also some used games can't easily be restored to a clean state. The ripping process and separate save files solves that problem.
1. Re:As a CycloDS owner by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:48 · Score: 0
  
  Multiple save files, RTS, Cheats, Homebrew.. Many other reasons legitimately for using a flashcart.
2. Re:As a CycloDS owner by pembo13 · 2009-01-13 20:08 · Score: 1
  
  Good for you, as I get older, and FOSS meets more and more of my needs, I am finding my self decreasingly impartial to software piracy.
  
  --
  "Thanks for all the money you paid to us. We've used it to buy off ISO among other things" -Microsoft
3. Re:As a CycloDS owner by Alarindris · 2009-01-13 20:45 · Score: 1
  
  Does the DS run off of USB sticks, CD's or DVD's?
  
  If not, I don't think they have too much to worry about.
4. Re:As a CycloDS owner by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 03:44 · Score: 0
  
  I was under the impression that the CycloDS didn't play GBA games, is this no longer the case or have emulators come along a long way?
5. Re:As a CycloDS owner by Duradin · 2009-01-14 04:15 · Score: 1
  
  I ordered the combo pack that has the CycloDS Evolution and a GBA flash cart. The CycloDS will load up a gba rom from its micro SD card to the gba flash cart and boots the game.
  So it can't run them on its own but it can store the files and be the interface for the gba flash cart. I never tried the R4 but I'd have to say the user interface on the CycloDS is pretty slick.
6. Re:As a CycloDS owner by Snodgrass · 2009-01-14 04:44 · Score: 1
  
  Also a CycloDS owner. I own bunches of games and they all sit in their cases in the closet, but I can play any of them any time I want.
  So nice.
  Also, the Realtime Save feature alone is almost worth the cost.
I do it. by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:38 · Score: 0

A quality mod cartridge and a MicroSD card cost no more than three or four games, so it really pays for itself.
Plus, I can now play NES, SNES, and GameBoy games in emulators. I can also listen to music, look at pictures, watch videos, and even chat over IRC and AIM with my DS.
I would never be able to afford my collection of DS games if I went legit.
1. Re:I do it. by hesiod · 2009-01-14 02:08 · Score: 1
  
  A quality mod cartridge and a MicroSD card cost no more than three or four games
  I bought one with a 4GB MicroSD for about $16. That's less than most single DS games.
I can get free games? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:38 · Score: 0

I did not know you could get free games, thanks for the info.
Missed one by dexmachina · 2009-01-13 18:45 · Score: 5, Insightful

Pocket Gamer takes a look at how piracy affects the Nintendo DS console, along with the reasons so many gamers turn to piracy to play their games â" including the slew of inferior games, availability of flash carts and industry greed."
Which sort of leaves out the obvious. People are cheap, and given the choice between having something for money or for free, many opt for free.
1. Re:Missed one by calmofthestorm · 2009-01-13 19:47 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Yes. But rather than focusing on the needs, wants, and desires of those who would never give you money and will get it for free no matter what you do, the companies would do better to make better products.
  Though I've always wondered how even the most pro-piracy people could claim 'slew of inferior games' is a justification to pirate...if it sucks, wouldn't you /not/ want to waste time playing it?
  
  --
  93rd rule of Slashdot: No matter how obvious my sarcasm is, my comment will be taken seriously by someone.
2. Re:Missed one by MobileTatsu-NJG · 2009-01-13 19:48 · Score: 1
  
  Which sort of leaves out the obvious. People are cheap, and given the choice between having something for money or for free, many opt for free.
  Okay. So let's see the income graph that is the inverse of the piracy graph.
  
  --
  
  "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
3. Re:Missed one by dexmachina · 2009-01-13 20:06 · Score: 1
  
  That's kind of a non sequitur. I didn't say people pirate because they don't have money. I said people just don't like spending money, and so there will always be people in every income bracket who will go to any length to avoid doing so.
4. Re:Missed one by dexmachina · 2009-01-13 20:10 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  I agree with you, I just get a little annoyed when people say things that make it sound like piracy is a natural and defendable consequence of the actions of the industry, ie "industry greed". It's true, there are definitely measures companies could take to try to minimize piracy, ie making great products that people will think are worth the cost. But at the end of the day, there's no reason why anyone has to have (insert hot name game title here), and so citing industry greed is just dumb.
5. Re:Missed one by dexmachina · 2009-01-13 20:11 · Score: 1
  
  err...(insert end of italics tag after "has"...)
6. Re:Missed one by calmofthestorm · 2009-01-13 20:21 · Score: 1
  
  Naah, I don't intend to /justify/ it. I just object to claiming piracy is no different from theft (deprivation of sale/versus deprivation of a good AND a sale). Most of my objections are on a PC market, where you have to worry about tons of viri on legally purchased games. I usually "justify" my own piracy, when I do it (not common) by spending an equal amount of money on DRM-free companies' products, and playing both. This way I can protect myself from dangerous malware, ensure I can always play the game in the future even if they decide to turn off the DRM, and still support the industry. I know this doesn't make it right, but it's the best compromise I can find in my moral principles.
  I do like that console games are a physical dongle, so they really can't stop you from reselling it and the like, though with the new switch to DLC I'm afraid that first sale might go right out the window.
  
  --
  93rd rule of Slashdot: No matter how obvious my sarcasm is, my comment will be taken seriously by someone.
7. Re:Missed one by MobileTatsu-NJG · 2009-01-13 21:43 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  I hear ya. The question isn't about whether or not there are people who will go out of their way to avoid spending money, it's whether or not the number of people is very big. There's this industry-wide suggestion that a downloaded game equals a lost sale. I've yet to see anything that actually supports that. Well, I take that back. There was one number that I thought raised a few eyebrows. This isn't exact, mind you, but it was something like 800,000 DS's were sold in Korea and 200,000 units of software. Piracy? Even I'd admit that's a strong possibility. So why don't we have a number like that in the US?
  Well, I'll tell you this: We wouldn't be in this economic problem right now if large numbers of people were penny pinchers. Heck, look at the success of Starbucks. $3 for a cup of coffee that even the place that changes my oil gives away for free? Oil changes!! I actually know how to change my oil, but I never do. It's just $20 away! Okay okay, I'm getting anecdotal here, but hopefully you catch my meaning. For all we know lots of people pirate games, that keeps them excited about playing, so they go buy other games. Provable? No. But consider how singles were popular for a long time, singles of songs played all the time on the radio. This is, mind you, after it became trivial to record radio transmissions.
  I may be thinking on larger scale than you are, and I apologize if that's creating some unnecessary drama for you. The FA basically says that Nintendo launched the DSi to fight piracy. Frankly, I do not believe that. I think they released it because of virtual console sales on the Wii. That's the whole BFD of that system and why the lack of a GBA port isn't causing a frantic waving of torches and pitchforks.
  
  --
  
  "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
8. Re:Missed one by sleeponthemic · 2009-01-13 22:56 · Score: 1
  
  Though I've always wondered how even the most pro-piracy people could claim 'slew of inferior games' is a justification to pirate...if it sucks, wouldn't you /not/ want to waste time playing it?
  Assuming there is no option to try before you buy, I guess the piracy has already occurred as a precaution, prior to discovering aforementioned suckage. Money saved.
  
  That is the justification. Obviously, the bit where they realise the game is good and still don't actually buy it (in most cases, I'd imagine) is the actual contradiction to the idea.
  
  --
  I record my sleeptalking
9. Re:Missed one by calmofthestorm · 2009-01-13 23:10 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  It's when, in addition to your condition, you remove from someone else the good.
  Consider: when you steal a stick of gum from a store, you are both obtaining something for free AND depriving the store of the good. Essentially, you are committing two crimes. Suppose you merely copied the gum. You still didn't buy it, but the store can sell it to someone else.
  An alternate argument: If you weren't going to buy it, how is the seller actually harmed?*
  They're definitely related, but it's a gross oversimplification to claim it's the same thing.
  * Personally I'd argue you always "were" going to buy some portion of the number of media you pirate, and hence it's still wrong. But assuming you *actually* wouldn't have taken it if you couldn't have it for free, then I fail to see any direct harm the same way stealing a car from a dealership is. You have a car that isn't yours AND the dealership is out one.
  
  --
  93rd rule of Slashdot: No matter how obvious my sarcasm is, my comment will be taken seriously by someone.
10. Re:Missed one by VShael · 2009-01-13 23:41 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Though I've always wondered how even the most pro-piracy people could claim 'slew of inferior games' is a justification to pirate...if it sucks, wouldn't you /not/ want to waste time playing it?
  Come on, you're just deliberately misunderstanding the situation there.
  A slew of inferior games on the market, implies a few good ones at least. And if the only way to tell is to play, then you're going to statistically spend a fortune on duds, before you get a gem.
  Why can't the people who buy games just read review magazines? Try it some time. I remember seeing positive reviews for some truly shitty games. And when some clueless well-meaning relative buys a game as a present, are they first supposed to have checked out what's hot and not online?
11. Re:Missed one by pipatron · 2009-01-14 00:00 · Score: 1
  
  Luck?
  
  --
  c++; /* this makes c bigger but returns the old value */
12. Re:Missed one by Opportunist · 2009-01-14 01:10 · Score: 4, Interesting
  
  Why can't the people who buy games just read review magazines?
  I stopped taking reviews serious when I started working for a computer magazine. Take a wild guess why.
  It's not so much that you're outright "bought" to write a good review for a shitty product. It's more the psychological pressure. After all, you get nice stuff from them, ya know? You get all those "test samples" and other goodies. They sit down with you for a lenghty interview. And you got to fill those pages, you really, really have to, because first of all, you're paid by the page and you have to provide some content for your reader or they'll wonder why they should drop their five or even more bucks on a mag that's more the thickness of a leaflet and contains a few full page ads with little in between them.
  And then there's this super-nice company that gives you all that for free. Free! You don't have to go out and buy their crap to write a review, no, they hand you a ton of pics and even an interview that's good for a page or even two, and they also give you those test samples so you can easily (and cost free!) write a couple more pages.
  And then you should go and call it a stinker? Where do you think you'll get your next test sample from? Certainly not from those guys, that much I can tell you!
  
  --
  We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
13. Re:Missed one by geminidomino · 2009-01-14 01:22 · Score: 1
  
  Though I've always wondered how even the most pro-piracy people could claim 'slew of inferior games' is a justification to pirate...if it sucks, wouldn't you /not/ want to waste time playing it?
  I don't try to justify it that way, but considering that that is EXACTLY the case...
  The baaaaad eeeevil way:
  See game advertised
  Read glowing review of game
  Steep in game hype for two weeks.
  Bittorrent Game onto Flash cart.
  Fire up DS
  Game Sucks after 10 minutes.
  Delete Game
  The good little consumer way:
  See game advertised
  Read glowing review of game
  Steep in game hype for two weeks.
  Drive to gamestop
  Shell out $40 for game
  Game sucks after 10 minutes
  Drive back to gamestop
  Attempt to return game
  Be laughed at by smarmy little shit behind counter
  Go home.
  Put game in drawer never to be played again.
  The trick being that in these days of reviews-as-advertisements and non-returnable-for-shittiness products, you can't really know if a game sucks before you buy it. Particularly new ones, before Metacritic et al have had a chance to build up a collection of reviews.
14. Re:Missed one by pla · 2009-01-14 01:34 · Score: 1
  
  Okay. So let's see the income graph that is the inverse of the piracy graph.
  
  Inverse? No.
  
  I would predict such a graph would look like a flat line, with little or no correlation whatsoever between income and piracy - I have X dollars of disposable income to use on entertainment. I will spend those X dollars. I will also do as I damned well please and not let such details as "physical possession" limit my choice of what games I play.
  
  The key point here - Whether or not I have the ability to play more games (or music, or movies, etc) than I actually buy has no impact on my spending of X dollars. My income may cause X to shift up or down, but unless I make so much that I can afford a significant fraction of all available games, the correlation with piracy remains almost zero.
15. Re:Missed one by poot_rootbeer · 2009-01-14 02:47 · Score: 1
  
  I've always wondered how even the most pro-piracy people could claim 'slew of inferior games' is a justification to pirate...if it sucks, wouldn't you /not/ want to waste time playing it?
  I assume there is a "try before you buy" reasoning here. Nobody wants to drop $35 on a new DS game only to find out it's a piece of crap, and be left with no recourse but to sell it back to GameStop for a quarter of its price as a 'used' game.
  If the consumer can instead download a ROM image and spend a few days playing it that way, he can either (a) decide the game is worth $35 after all, and make plans to buy a legit copy that will never be carried out, or (b) decide the game is junk, and delete the game, by which I mean drag the file into the 'archived ROMS' folder but not keep it on the flash card.
16. Re:Missed one by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 03:11 · Score: 0
  
  Though I've always wondered how even the most pro-piracy people could claim 'slew of inferior games' is a justification to pirate...if it sucks, wouldn't you /not/ want to waste time playing it?
  I don't know about others but the only time I pirate a game is if I am on the fence between buying it or not. There are so many BAD games out there that if I cannot try it first, I will not buy it. There are very few exceptions to this rule.
  You don't waste your time playing it once you realize how inferior it is.
17. Re:Missed one by MindlessAutomata · 2009-01-14 03:20 · Score: 1
  
  I believe that the media is also run that way, which explains why one's national media outlets tend to be overly patriotic and a bit uncritical of politicians. It's why the debates are softballs and why the only time tough questions are asked is when it's the more fringe candidates running.
  When they need you to make content, they're nice because they know that if you're hard on them they'll never come back.
18. Re:Missed one by Duds · 2009-01-14 04:21 · Score: 1
  
  Or in the case of Slitherlink, and the other excellent games they NEVER F'ING RELEASE in Europe, given the choice between not playing a game and playing a game...
19. Re:Missed one by Opportunist · 2009-01-14 05:00 · Score: 1
  
  The worst is when you see the press statement being verbatim copied and sold as "news". Those press statements get more insidious and more tempting, too. Just recently I got one that was written like an article, complete with questions and answers, just like a real interview. How much more tempting can it be to just do the good ol' copy/paste routine and you fill another 2-3 pages without work (but for good money)? No research necessary, no digging for information necessary, hell, you don't even have to write a single word!
  Yes, that's basically shameless advertising in the editorial parts of the paper. But it seems nobody cares. The editor is happy because he gets free money. The advertiser is happy because he plugged a free ad that most of all looks like an article rather than an ad. Your head ed guy is happy because you're delivering a ton of material he can shuffle around at will and toss in a few more ads because the paper's so think you can kill a dog with it. Yes, the reader gets the shaft. But who cares about the reader?
  
  --
  We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
20. Re:Missed one by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 07:24 · Score: 0
  
  Your handle is strangely appropriate for your post.
21. Re:Missed one by Fallingcow · 2009-01-14 08:07 · Score: 1
  
  IIRC, that's pretty much the picture painted by Herman and Chomsky in Manufacturing Consent.
  Basically, the news sucks and serves the interests of powerful people not out of some sort of conspiracy, but because it's way, way cheaper than doing real journalism.
  Ask a tough question at a press conference? You won't be allowed in next time. Got an exclusive interview aboard Air Force One, but used it in a negative article? You won't be invited aboard again.
  Gotta get a story out? Well, here's this handy press release that you can slightly reword (or not) and get on to the next job! As a bonus, it only takes one person a few minutes to do that, while writing a meaningful story to fill the same space might require several people and way more time.
22. Re:Missed one by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 08:13 · Score: 0
  
  Been there, done that.
  It gets a lot more fun when a PR house wants to cut their relation with you.
  I can't remember which studio it was, but we reviewed a fishing or rodeo game -- something silly like that.
  We gave it an honest 12%, stating in the review that 3% of that was including a Lynyrd Skynyrd song in the soundtrack.
  Funnily enough, that was one of our most read reviews.
  Then there was the time we wrote an article calling Diablo II Diablo 1.5.. you should've seen the comments we got on that one.
23. Re:Missed one by mgblst · 2009-01-14 08:49 · Score: 1
  
  the companies would do better to make better products.
  Sounds good doesn't it, but the real world doesn't work like that. Look at Vista, it is certainly not a better product that Ubuntu or Mac OS. Being a better product rarely has anything to do with making it in the real world.
24. Re:Missed one by Duffy13 · 2009-01-14 09:00 · Score: 1
  
  Another way of looking at it is that you are stealing time from the developers. With most media you do not buy a product that has a higher inherent value then another product (after all most games are the same price for each particular system; a game's value is not proportional to it's quality) you are paying for the effort someone else put into it. Therefore using someone's hard work without repaying them for the effort they put forth is essentially stealing time. (Which is what most modern abstract monetary systems represent anyways)
  
  --
  "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle!"
25. Re:Missed one by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 09:02 · Score: 0
  
  > Though I've always wondered how even the most pro-piracy people could claim 'slew of inferior games' is a justification to pirate...if it sucks, wouldn't you /not/ want to waste time playing it?
  Because having lots of crappy games doesn't preclude them from having a few good ones, though it does make it hard to know which is which before you buy them.
  Does that help?
26. Re:Missed one by calmofthestorm · 2009-01-14 10:15 · Score: 1
  
  It still seems to me this model breaks down completely unless the publishers declare there are X copies of the game when they make it, and once that many are sold/pirated they can't sell it any more. Computers mean that information can be copied without cost, and traditional property law simply doesn't work here. The sooner we realize this and update the law, the better off everyone involved will be.
  
  --
  93rd rule of Slashdot: No matter how obvious my sarcasm is, my comment will be taken seriously by someone.
'Industry Greed' by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:48 · Score: 1, Insightful

Ah yes, that old yarn never gets old. Whenever we want to justify our theft we don the Robin Hood costume.
1. Re:'Industry Greed' by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 18:52 · Score: 1, Funny
  
  Yeah, ripping people off is only okay when a multi-billion dollar corporation does it.
Learn and evolve by Thanshin · 2009-01-13 18:51 · Score: 2, Interesting

It won't help much, but it would be a step in the right direction to offer the comodity of having all games in a single cartidge (or simply to a static internal memory).
Maye a system like Steam that downloads any game you own to your DS from any computer with internet access.
Just an idea.
1. Re:Learn and evolve by erwanl · 2009-01-13 19:19 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  You should give your idea to Nintendo, I'm sure they will love it. Unless they already had the same idea...
2. Re:Learn and evolve by KDR_11k · 2009-01-13 21:13 · Score: 1
  
  The DSi (next hardware revision) will already have a software download service. I'm not sure how many games it has since it seems to be aimed at productivity applications mostly but I think I did hear about some games.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
3. Re:Learn and evolve by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 02:15 · Score: 0
  
  Maye a system like Steam that downloads any game you own to your DS from any computer with internet access.
  That's a great suggestion, and I understand the DSi is going to have a service kind of like this. Steam is a huge reason why I don't feel the need to pirate games on PC nowadays. Sure Steam is DRM but it adds more value than it removes - I don't need a disc in the drive, my games are patched automatically, and I can redownload all my games for free at any time.
  
  Unfortunately, 9 times out of 10 Nintendo proves itself to have its head stuck up its ass so I have zero faith in its online initiatives. That's my impression from my experience with the Wii, anyway. I don't appreciate having to spend $10 denominations on Nintendo Points or whatever the currency is, and then the game I want uses only $6.50 worth of points. I grew out of that when I stopped going to Chuck-E-Cheese, and a more mature company like Steam knows its customers respond better to good will than chintzy tricks to sucker us out of a few pennies.
Re:Nintendo DS by Kryptonian+Jor-El · 2009-01-13 18:58 · Score: 5, Funny

('about $60 on 4-5 games is about $7 a game)

Where did you learn math?

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I know I'm not supposed to say this, but... by TheVelvetFlamebait · 2009-01-13 19:04 · Score: 3, Funny

along with the reasons so many gamers turn to piracy to play their games -- including the slew of inferior games, availability of flash carts and industry greed.
Not to mention consumer greed. It's all the industry's fault, or at least those damn flash cart manufacturers. They provide a product like that, how could we possibly have the free will to say no?

--
You know, there is a difference between trolling and pointing out the flaws in your reasoning. Just saying.
Industry greed vs consumer greed? by ChienAndalu · 2009-01-13 19:14 · Score: 4, Interesting

If someone wants more games than he or she can pay for, isn't it fair to call that consumer is greedy?
1. Re:Industry greed vs consumer greed? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 19:22 · Score: 0
  
  It's fair to call that consumer human. If a consumer resorts to piracy, then it's fair to call that consumer poor or greedy, but only one of the two.
2. Re:Industry greed vs consumer greed? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 21:33 · Score: 0
  
  Yeah because software is such a rare commodity that is expensive to duplicate... oh, wait.. what?
3. Re:Industry greed vs consumer greed? by PixetaledPikachu · 2009-01-13 22:26 · Score: 1
  
  It's fair to call that consumer human. If a consumer resorts to piracy, then it's fair to call that consumer poor or greedy, but only one of the two.
  So, is it okay for a poor consumer to resort to piracy? or is there no such thing as poor *and* greedy consumer?
4. Re:Industry greed vs consumer greed? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 00:27 · Score: 1, Interesting
  
  If I can afford 5 games and pirate the rest, is that any worse than if I only buy 5 games? How is it not a victimless crime?
5. Re:Industry greed vs consumer greed? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 11:58 · Score: 0
  
  Is it okay for the industry to resort to copyright monopolies? Seems no one ever asks that seriosly.
Is there anything actually worth pirating? by Plazmid · 2009-01-13 19:19 · Score: 3, Funny

Do I really want to download "Strawberry Shortcake: The Four Seasons Cake?" I think not.
1. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 19:28 · Score: 0
  
  Probably not, but you might want to download the multitude of good games on the DS.
2. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by andi75 · 2009-01-13 20:19 · Score: 2, Funny
  
  What about American McGee's Strawberry Shortcake?
3. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by xtracto · 2009-01-13 20:29 · Score: 1
  
  Or what about "Let's play Mums".
  Seriously, the number of crap "games" for the Nintendo DS is astounding... whatever happened to the Nintendo Seal of Quality.
  OTOH, I do have a CycloDS. That combined with Visual C++ Express and GCC toolchain has been a godsend for me to play (yes, programming games is like playing for me). Right now I am doing a port of the dual n-task game.
  There is one very simple reason to get a flash cart. After you have more than 10 games it becomes unpractical to take all of them wherever you go. Instead, you just upload them to your flash memory and now you have all your games in there.
  
  --
  Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
4. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by MemoryDragon · 2009-01-13 20:37 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  The problem persists with every Nintendo console. The DS had amazing two years. Nintendo brought out quality games, third party developers were toying around with the new input controls and brought ought amazing games. Year three. Nintendo reduces a lot of its output down to the usual annual pokemon shit... Third party developers flock onto other consoles with their better developers, the rest is up to Disney and Co... That means 1-2 excellent quality titles per year which are drowned in a flood of my horse farm, cook yourself a bread, pink pony games...
  If you look at the shelves you will only see the cheap cash in games, because they flood the games, the 1-2 excellent games drown and often do not even reach the shelves anymore.
  It was like that with the Gameboy, the GBA, it is like that with the DS and to some smaller extent with the Wii.
  But the situation still is better than on the PSP, the PSP currently only gets 5 shovelware games per year and not even a single good one, or one if at all.
  For me I am rather sick of this entire situation I reverted back to PC gaming, the situation on the PC has changed a lot, you do not have to do yearly upgrades, and a mid range card does it mostly!Also the games are way cheaper than on the consoles. Also the games are not abandonware once the next upgrade cycle comes, like it was with the case PS2->PS3
5. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 01:20 · Score: 0
  
  That's completely false.
  The start of the DS was slow and most games were rubbish until everyone got used to making games with the new controls.
  This last year has had some of the best gaming output with the Final Fantasy remakes, Contra 4, Ninja Gaiden, the new Advance Wars title, Castlevania etc.
  Next year will be equally good with titles like Grand Theft Auto.
  Sure there are a lot of rubbish games but that's because there are a lot of games full stop. In fact the DS is the only system that actually caters to every spectrum of gamer with a decent collection of titles for both hardcore and casual gamers.
6. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by MindlessAutomata · 2009-01-14 03:28 · Score: 1
  
  Nintendo Seal of Quality? It was just a badge that cost money. It never meant anything and given some of the crap games on the SNES I'm not sure how you can even say that.
  Note, I do think the SNES era was the golden age of gaming, but meh. I think the for the crapification of video games is how mainstream they've become, the fact that quality 2D games aren't made as much anymore (it's gotta be 3D!!!), and of course the paradigm set out by Donkey Kong Country 64.
7. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by hypergreatthing · 2009-01-14 04:41 · Score: 1
  
  pata-pata-pata-pon!
  How about this general rule, portable systems are usually rife with crap games, consoles only slightly better.
8. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by SuiteSisterMary · 2009-01-14 05:05 · Score: 1
  
  Sort of true, but you miss the point.
  Back in the day of the NES, you could become an NES developer. You were allowed, I believe, five titles per year. Period. No exceptions.
  There were other onerous requirements, such as needing to pre-order your carts, to be manufactured by Nintendo, with lead times measured in the months. Turns out your game is a hit? Hope you ordered enough, or the shelves will be empty for three months. Overestimated your game's appeal? You're left with a pile of carts you paid something like $30 each for.
  Nintendo also reserved the right to approve or not a game. But when you only have five chances a year, you tend to make sure your games are good, so it did have a positive effect on game quality.
  One of the ways Sony ate Nintendo's lunch with the PS1 was getting rid of those requirements. "Hey, make all the games you want! Throw it all out there and see what sticks!" Also, CDs are cents to duplicate, and you can churn out hundreds of thousands in a weekend. Had Nintendo not tried to force carts onto devs with the N64, the playing field in the middle 90s would have looked a *lot* different.
  Note that this is why Microsoft was more-or-less destined to win when they decided to go into consoles; a console lives or dies by it's software, and therefore by developer support. Microsoft knows this; has for decades. The Dreamcast died because developers feared Sega's history with hardware. Nintendo has virtually no third-party blockbusters because developers all farked off to Sony. There are tons of PS1 and PS2 games with sequal numbers on the end that started on the Nintendo or the SNES. And now they're moving to the Xbox. Say, Star Ocean: 1 was an SNES game. 2 and 3 where PS2. And 4 is a 360 exclusive. Metal Gear? Originally an NES franchise. Final Fantasy? The first six were NES and SNES games. Seven through Twelve were PS1 or PS2 games. And Thirteen will be out on the 360.
  
  --
  Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
9. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by Bossk-Office · 2009-01-14 05:07 · Score: 0
  
  What I do is stay behind the console cycle. When the PS3 had been out for a while, I bought a second-hand PS2 for next to nothing and started buying cheap, good second-hand games. And since I'm always behind the cycle, I never feel like I'm missing out.
10. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 05:49 · Score: 0
  
  Here's a great example of recursive wrongness:
  Running, on a cart, homebrew software which runs a SNES / NES emulator to play NES / SNES games.
  Emulator on an Emulator to play games (the legality of the emulator is questionable, the SNES/NES emulator questionable, and the origin of NES / SNES Roms even more questionable). This way I can play portable games no longer accessible, such as the "missing" puzzle games from way back.
  Tetris, Dr. Mario, Klax, Pipe Dream, several others... I can't find QUALITY puzzle games anymore. They're all "Enhanced" (AKA FUBAR) versions of classics, or blatent copies.
11. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by vux984 · 2009-01-14 06:56 · Score: 1
  
  Where does the iphone/Touch fit into this now that apple is hyping it as a games platform?
  Stuff that would be be shovelware on the DS is considered 'innovative' on the iPhone/Touch.
12. Re:Is there anything actually worth pirating? by MemoryDragon · 2009-01-15 00:36 · Score: 1
  
  Actually, the strong year was year 2, the first year developers grasped how to deal with the controls, but there was a load of good games nevertheless. The first castlevania came out year1, advanced wars as well, or rub rabbits.
  Btw. the titles you mentioned are just sequels to titles of year 2 :-)
Gentlemen, by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 19:25 · Score: 0

Welcome to 2005.
http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.m3adapter.com/
This says something about any digital media by isaacklinger · 2009-01-13 19:52 · Score: 1

Now that consumers can get pretty much any digital media without compensating the copyright holder -- films, music, videogames -- what is a copyright holder to do?
Right now they've found they can use cryptographically signed copies on a closed system. That evens the playing field for pirates and content providers for now, because people find it unappealing to hack their hardware and risk loss of support. That's what's happening in consoles through their virtual shops, and that's what'll happen with the DS.
Small game size does not mean piracy... by VinylRecords · 2009-01-13 20:13 · Score: 2, Insightful

People pirate X-Box 360 games, PS2 and Dreamcast games, and emulate Game Boy Advance and Super Nintendo games. From a 750kb ROM to a full 4.9 gig ISO file.
Anyone with a 'decent' broadband connection can leave a torrent or PSP program on overnights and grab any game they want relatively easily.
Size has never stopped most people from pirating games before who want to pirate.
People segmented PC games into .rar/.zip files and shared them on IRC or USENET well over a decade ago. Those games were ten times the size of a single DS game and that was then.
I purchased Golden Sun I and II for my Game Boy Advance when they came out but only opened them for the manual, the games are sitting in a box never used. I downloaded the ROMS that same week and played them off of an emulator. Full screen, my own controller, save states, etc.
Yes piracy sucks for game companies but for keeping old cartridge games alive I use ROMS always. And I own the original game at least.
1. Re:Small game size does not mean piracy... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 22:39 · Score: 0
  
  Dear brothers. How many games are in the market and how many games can you buy legally and. I think peoples have no choice but to use pirated software. I give a example of Microsoft who is not ready to lower his operating system price in developing countries and happy with the piracy. This is surely a greed.
2. Re:Small game size does not mean piracy... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 00:59 · Score: 0
  
  If NDS games weren't so easily available and the NDS as trivial to "crack" as inserting a mod-card, do you really think it would have had such huge sales? If pretty obvious Nintendo want their devices to be simple to run pirate software, they make plenty of money on the hardware. That said, like the Wii, the NDS is largely crapware, so does anyone actually play games on it?
3. Re:Small game size does not mean piracy... by spyrochaete · 2009-01-14 02:21 · Score: 1
  
  Size has never stopped most people from pirating games before who want to pirate.
  Well, that was the rationale of the first CDROM games for PC. The copy protection was the fact that one would have to pay exorbitant sums in order to duplicate CDs. It worked for a short while.
  
  Today, you have to admit it's pretty compelling to be able to start downloading a handheld RPG that takes 30 hours to complete and have it downloaded and ready to play before you're even finished reading the review.
4. Re:Small game size does not mean piracy... by VinylRecords · 2009-01-14 02:38 · Score: 1
  
  Well, that was the rationale of the first CDROM games for PC. The copy protection was the fact that one would have to pay exorbitant sums in order to duplicate CDs. It worked for a short while.
  CD-ROMs really had the 'CD Key' as their main form of copy protection. No one had to pay any amount get a pirated CD if they couldn't download it. You could even purchase a CDR for pennies and burn a copy if there was no CD Key. That's hardly exorbitant amounts of money. My friend lived in Turkey for five years from 1997 to 2001, and he would send me pirated PC games on CD every other month. All of those CDs came with hacks and custom patches that disabled or overwrote the CD Key check. The bootleg CDs even had custom color artwork printed onto the CDRs. I had a pirated copy of Starcraft I used for LAN parties that had Protoss and Terran artwork and my friends asked me where I got the 'limited edition' Starcraft CD. I just laughed. I own three legit copies of the SC and Brood War bundle though.
  Size was never a legitimate deterrent for piracy. If you lacked a good internet connection you could go into IRC or USENET and find someone to trade you a burned copy of a game or you could purchase a burned copy from the internet very easily. CD Keys were cracked mere hours after games were released. And CD Keys were meant to stop piracy of gaming software.
  
  Today, you have to admit it's pretty compelling to be able to start downloading a handheld RPG that takes 30 hours to complete and have it downloaded and ready to play before you're even finished reading the review.
  I never pirate games. Most movies and music I have no problem with 'pirating'. But even the $60 I spent for Metal Gear Solid 4 (and $30 on the expansion packs) has provided me with over 400 hours of solid (pun intended) entertainment.
  I could understand hating the MPAA and RIAA and pirating them. But when it comes to independent movies and music I never pirate.
  But for games as a hardcore gamer I will pay for everything from Virtua Fighter to Mario Kart.
5. Re:Small game size does not mean piracy... by spyrochaete · 2009-01-14 02:48 · Score: 1
  
  CD-ROMs really had the 'CD Key' as their main form of copy protection. No one had to pay any amount get a pirated CD if they couldn't download it. You could even purchase a CDR for pennies and burn a copy if there was no CD Key. That's hardly exorbitant amounts of money.
  CD games didn't always have CD keys. The earlier games like Myst and The 7th Guest had no product key or copy protection at all. That's because CD burners cost over $1000 for a 2x burner and blank media cost $15/disk. This was back in 1993, mind you, and obviously prices plummeted before long. At the time this seemed like the perfect copy protection, and it was a welcome change for end users who had to endure manual lookups, code wheels, and other obnoxious activities before they could play floppy-based games.
6. Re:Small game size does not mean piracy... by ravenshrike · 2009-01-14 06:54 · Score: 1
  
  Actually, it's called stamping out market share. If they cracked down hard on it, people would turn to linux, thereby creating a larger *nix market, and possibly creating interest for companies to develop more for *nix instead of concentrating on windows.
7. Re:Small game size does not mean piracy... by Nick+Ives · 2009-01-14 07:37 · Score: 1
  
  The comparatively small size of NDS ROMs means it's easy to download every single game ever released for the NDS in a single weekend on a decent home broadband connection.
  Size has been a primary concern for people downloading unautherised copies of games - the scene used to have all sorts of rules about what was OK to rip and what wasn't, rules regarding transcoding of in-game media (cutscenes, sound effects, etc) and size limits, all because of limited bandwidth.
  The point stands. I can't recall of any other console where it was possible to download its entire library in a single weekend whilst said console was at the peak of its popularity. It doesn't seem to be hurting things too badly though!
  
  --
  Nick
Re:Nintendo DS by Bozzio · 2009-01-13 20:16 · Score: 4, Funny

I was thinking the same thing!
His Brain Age must be, like, a MILLION!

--
I just pooped your party.
Hypothetical case by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 20:32 · Score: 1, Interesting

What Nintendo should do is find a way to meet the demand and profit from it. They should put out their own flash cartridge and set up an online downloading service to allow customers to download games at a reduced cost, like what Amazon did with MP3's.
Amazon's DRM-free service has taught me that I really don't mind paying a dollar to own the right to play a song I like, in a format I prefer. I'm simply unwilling to pay $15+ for a CD that probably only has a couple of songs I want. Similarly for DS games, I'm simply not willing to pay $20 to $30 for a hard copy of a game, if the hard copy is less "functional" and more inconvenient to obtain and own than the pirated ROM version of it. Give me a $5 to $10 downloadable version of DS games I want, and it's a no brainer.
1. Re:Hypothetical case by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 21:03 · Score: 0
  
  The transition to downloaded content across the board is probably inevitable at this point. Companies can get product to market faster. Products no longer have to be "out-of-print", so retailers can offer a huge selection. Customers can get nearly instant gratification. Sales can be reclaimed from the used market.
  It's always seemed a shame to me that companies let a concern like piracy stand in the way of all that. Piracy is already rampant, odds are good it will be in the future too, so I wonder if there'd be more profit for big companies to set that issue aside for now and readdress it in a time when they've maximized their own potential for content distribution?
2. Re:Hypothetical case by hanako · 2009-01-14 08:28 · Score: 1
  
  How is the hard copy of a DS game less functional? UNLIKE pc games and their stupid DRM, DS cartridges just plain WORK! They don't require that you enter stupid serial codes. They don't require that you connect to Nintendo servers to verify that you're allowed to play. They don't (until the DSi) refuse to work because you bought your console in the US and your game in Japan.
  
  --
  I've gotcher 'Women In Gaming' RIGHT HERE!
Escapist just covered this topic--and better by muel · 2009-01-13 21:51 · Score: 2, Informative

The Slot-1 Secret -- this piece from early December '08 looks not only into rampant DS game piracy but how Nintendo rendered this piracy moot by shifting toward new audiences. The latter point is far more interesting, as the R4 topic is otherwise old hat.
1. Re:Escapist just covered this topic--and better by AvitarX · 2009-01-14 01:45 · Score: 1
  
  I have to call shenanigans on that article.
  The Contra 4 example they pulled out in support brings the logic of the entire article into question.
  And with only 1 in 4 hard core gamers having flash-carts (using the assumption PAX is hard core gamers only), blaming sales for Contra 4 being 1/5th of expectations is pretty week.
  I am going to go out on a limb and say that the reason games like Contra 4 don't sell well on the DS is that mine-game style games are better suited for getting a quick 5-10 minutes in and feeling as you have accomplished something. This would go hand in hand with portable gaming.
  I personally like more in-depth games on my DS, but lean towards strategy and RPG, since I play as I watch the TV and talk to people. I couldn't keep up with what I imagine is the awesome twitch action of Contra 4 (or even Meteos or Geometry wars which I own).
  Now, in Korea the attach rate of less than one, and the availability of flash-carts in legit stores makes a compelling case there. This is probably the reason for region locking in the DSi (the hope to sell there for half price).
  Sorry to rant, I just hate reading 5 page articles that construct arguments on facts that do not support the conclusion.
  There was no mention even of what the Hard-Core gamers were playing at PAX, or if the cart owners did it for portability (I bet a few did at least).
  
  --
  Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
My piracy by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 22:07 · Score: 1, Interesting

Im not saying that it justifies piracy, but the only reason that i bought my ds was knowing that i could drop around 60$ and hold all of my games on one cartridge. If Nintendo simply dropped the cartridge and added a micro-SD slot with an xbox live/steam download system it would be great. My Greatest pain with portables is that once you begin carrying multiple games they are suddenly less portable due to needing a case or holder for the games
1. Re:My piracy by Paralizer · 2009-01-14 01:34 · Score: 1
  
  I own a bunch of games and a DS lite. When traveling, I have to take whatever games I want with me. Well now I have a DS plus a bunch of carts, any one of which I could easily lose and I juggle them back and forth the whole trip. On top of that suppose I didn't bring a game and now I want to play it? So I bought an R4. Now I put all of my games on a single microSD card and never have to switch the cart out of the DS. So now I only have the DS to keep track of, and the possibility of losing any of those carts is nil. It's so much more convenient, especially since it's supposed to be a portable device.
  
  You're right that Nintendo needs to (re)visit this concept.
2. Re:My piracy by Zerth · 2009-01-14 03:30 · Score: 1
  
  Ditto, I have about 30 DS games and it was worth it to not have to carry them around.
  I'm not completely clean, though, I have pirated some games that never made it to my country. If you could apply language patches to actual carts, I'd probably buy those too.
A bit OT... NDS USB charger cable by xtracto · 2009-01-13 22:18 · Score: 1

I will take advantage of this post to ask a question I have been asking myself, has anyone done a USB cable charger for the NDS? I travel a lot in and out of Europe and hate to take the European, American, English converters (not to mention the difference in voltage).
Last time I looked in Google there was one page with a DIY project mentioned , however the page was not available any more (and archive.org did not got it)...
I have also looked for it on stores without success...

--
Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
1. Re:A bit OT... NDS USB charger cable by MykeBNY · 2009-01-14 01:36 · Score: 1
  
  I had one for my GBA SP that worked on the original 'heavy' DS. The one end looked like a normal USB A-type connector, and the other end just plugged into the DS. It did have a slightly larger plug than my charger, which leads me to believe there's probably a resistor or fuse in there too, and not just wired straight in.
  A quick bit of googling turns up these:
  For the DS lite: http://www.thegametrain.com/ds-lite-usb-power-charge-cable-p-192.html
  For the GBA SP / DS original: http://www.thegametrain.com/gba-sp-usb-power-charger-p-351.html
  Hop on Google some more, there's a bunch out there. The magic keywords seem to be 'ds usb power'.
2. Re:A bit OT... NDS USB charger cable by geminidomino · 2009-01-14 01:37 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, but you will have a hard time finding one in stores. Gamestop occasionally has them in. I got a DS/GBA/PSP "USB" charger (with iPod AC/Adapter style wall plug) from "Maximo."
  Haven't been able to find another one since, but on dealextreme.com, they have a squid cable that will do iPod, GBA/DS, DSL, PSP, and Motorola phones. Costs about 8 bucks. Add in an ipod wall charger (from them) for about 6. Free shipping. Kind of slow to ship, but they haven't ripped me off yet.
3. Re:A bit OT... NDS USB charger cable by spyrochaete · 2009-01-14 02:25 · Score: 1
  
  Sorry that I don't have an answer for you, but rather a question. Do voltage adapters work on the DS? My wife and I bought a voltage adapter specifically for our DS before traveling to Europe but decided not to use it because the box warned that it was only to be used on high output machines like hair dryers. Have you had any problems with your voltage converter?
4. Re:A bit OT... NDS USB charger cable by radish · 2009-01-14 04:08 · Score: 1
  
  I have one which I got from eBay. Looks like they're still on there, something like this should work.
  
  --
  ---- Den ene knappen er powerknapp, den andre er Bender voice knapp "Bite My Shiny Metal Ass"
5. Re:A bit OT... NDS USB charger cable by ParodyMan · 2009-01-14 07:03 · Score: 1
  
  Look for DS car chargers that are two parts, car->USB and USB->DS. I bought one when I got my DS Lite that has the above plus a DS->GBA plug. I haven't been able to find the exact one, but Amazon does list a few that are set up this way.
  Hope this helps.
6. Re:A bit OT... NDS USB charger cable by kookiboy · 2009-01-14 09:23 · Score: 1
  
  I have one which I hardly used, grabbed it from the shop for a few bucks some time ago. Does anyone want it? Shipping would be quite troublesome though (I'm in singapore).
  
  Or as the above poster said, you could simply purchase one for cheap from dealextreme. I'd bought many items from them and never got ripped off, although shipping time is terribly slow.
7. Re:A bit OT... NDS USB charger cable by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-15 03:47 · Score: 0
  
  That's a tough questions, because you're right. Normal voltage converters are designed to work with resistive/inductive loads like hair driers and shavers. There are heavy transformers that work for everything. The DS has a switching power supply. Those aren't helped by those light weight voltage converters. The strange thing is, switching power supplies are trivially easy to make run on a wide range of voltages. There's no technical reason why the DS charger doesn't handle 110-240V and 50-60Hz. I suspect it's a marketing decision.
  
  I didn't have the guts to try 220 on my recent travels, so it ran dead. Just now I popped my open. Too much surface mount stuff to be sure, but I didn't say anything that would have a problem with 220.
It's obviously hitting them hard by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 22:26 · Score: 0

Yes, obviously piracy has been a massive problem for the Nintendo DS.
No, wait, the other thing: http://www.vgchartz.com/
1. Re:It's obviously hitting them hard by BarneyL · 2009-01-14 01:12 · Score: 1
  
  Thanks for the info which shows that despite the DS massively outselling all other consoles it doesn't have a single game in the top five software sales.
  Remember easy piracy may be a good selling point for hardware the same may not be true for software.
2. Re:It's obviously hitting them hard by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 06:03 · Score: 0
  
  Yes, you're quite right - not a single one in the top five. Going to the games list and sorting by number of sales, there are indeed six entries that have sold more than the first listed DS game. That one of those comes with the hardware it runs on (Wii Sports), two are for the ancient NES and the rest are from the notoriously hard to pirate Gameboy platform completely supports your point.
  And even just for the last listed week it didn't hit the top 5! The first DS game was at a pitiful number 6. We'll just ignore the fact that three (four if you count the wheel in Mario Kart Wii) of the titles above it came with hardware.
3. Re:It's obviously hitting them hard by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 20:00 · Score: 0
  
  I do not agree with the article here, the chart problem stems from the fact that outside of inspector layton and a few ports of pc adventure games there has not been a single game released for the platform in the last months which was not shovelware and quick cash in games.
  Also the article stated nintendo moved onto shovelware due to the rampant piracy on the platform, while i agree with the piracy, i doubt it. The value output of nintendo stopped shortly before the wii was released, their developers simply were bound by the wii and now nintendos overall strategy on the wii itself also is shovelware because it sells.
  Third party developers never have been strong on ninty consoles, they are the ones responsible for 99% of quick shovelware, just look at the shelves!
I wonder what RSA has to say about this by joeflies · 2009-01-13 23:42 · Score: 2, Interesting

When the Nintendo DS came out, RSA made it well known that its code protected the games Now I don't hear so much from them about this. Maybe it's not their best example of protecting data?
1. Re:I wonder what RSA has to say about this by nate_in_ME · 2009-01-14 02:19 · Score: 1
  
  This being /. and all, I understand people not RTFA. However, I would think it would still be assumed that if someone posted a link supporting their comment. From the parent post's link text..."These solutions provide protection for games as they are played and shared across wireless links between Nintendo DS devices." So, the RSA protection only applies to games and connections over the DS wireless capabilities, i.e. the "single cartridge" multiplayer or the download stations available at Gamestop, Toys 'R Us, etc... And before anyone says it, yes I know that those demos are available for download online just as much as the regular game images. However, once the game is on the DS, it is only protected as much as any other game in the system, as it needs to be decrypted to be played. So, essentially, the RSA protection is only for "over-the-air" situations, and most likely for in-game communications such as playing multiplayer online, to prevent hacking the wireless connection to cheat.
2. Re:I wonder what RSA has to say about this by joeflies · 2009-01-14 05:46 · Score: 1
  
  It's completely subject to your interpretation of the conjunction.
  It could mean either
  (as they are played) and (shared across wireless links between Nintendo DS devices)
  or it could mean
  (as they are played and shared) across wireless links between Nintendo DS devices
  The latter supports your assertion, the former doesn't.
3. Re:I wonder what RSA has to say about this by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 07:15 · Score: 0
  
  From your link:
  "These solutions provide protection for games as they are played and shared across wireless links between Nintendo DS devices."
  This has nothing to do with getting ripped code to play on the legit hardware.
4. Re:I wonder what RSA has to say about this by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 07:26 · Score: 0
  
  It's not an issue of semantics, it's an issue of what the protection actually does.
  hint: it's the latter.
5. Re:I wonder what RSA has to say about this by Dwedit · 2009-01-14 16:12 · Score: 1
  
  RSA doesn't protect the cartridge games, only games which boot via Wi-fi. The cartridge encryption is done with a completely different method. It uses a random number generator with predefined 40-bit seeds combined with data from the cartridge, go read GBATEK for details. After the BIOS got dumped, it didn't take very long to figure out the process.
the price of DS games is ridiculous by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 23:43 · Score: 0

thats mostly why i dont own a DS
1. Re:the price of DS games is ridiculous by skulgnome · 2009-01-14 07:23 · Score: 1
  
  This hits the nail on the head. I already paid 200 euros for my DS lite, and now these people have the fucking gall to say that I should pay 30 euros for each game too?
  If it weren't for being able to warez, I wouldn't have got myself a DS. I'd be a person who doesn't have a DS, and doesn't pay for games -- compared to what I am now, a person who has a DS and doesn't pay for games. Since Nintendo is making money from each DS sold (4 megs of asymmetric memory and otherwise veeeerrrry limited hardware tends to do that), I hardly see myself being a serious wrongdoer here.
2. Re:the price of DS games is ridiculous by bigstrat2003 · 2009-01-14 10:08 · Score: 1
  
  and now these people have the fucking gall to say that I should pay 30 euros for each game too?
  I know! Paying for the fruits of people's labors... what a concept!
  
  --
  "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
3. Re:the price of DS games is ridiculous by tietokone-olmi · 2009-01-17 15:20 · Score: 1
  
  The company pays its employees. I have no obligation to pay the company, either as a player of a game they made or as a non-player of that same game.
4. Re:the price of DS games is ridiculous by bigstrat2003 · 2009-01-18 05:23 · Score: 1
  
  You have an obligation to pay them to obtain the fruit of their labor for yourself, unless someone else paid them for you. This is not a new concept. The lengths to which people will go to justify stealing software confound me.
  
  --
  "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
5. Re:the price of DS games is ridiculous by tietokone-olmi · 2009-01-18 13:59 · Score: 1
  
  I do not. This obligation is utterly misguided. Do you pay those who make roads each time you drive on those roads they made? Aren't you obligated to, in order to access the fruits of their labour? Road stealer.
  As you should know, theft is a distinct thing entirely, distinguished by its bereavement aspect. Copyright infringement is, economically speaking, no worse than ignoring the game altogether. "The lengths to which people will go to justify their protestant self-whipping and catholic guilt confound me."
6. Re:the price of DS games is ridiculous by bigstrat2003 · 2009-01-19 01:11 · Score: 1
  
  I do not. This obligation is utterly misguided. Do you pay those who make roads each time you drive on those roads they made?
  Oh, please. If you really wish to justify your desire to steal games, you need to come up with an analogy that actually works. I do, in fact, pay the people who make roads on a regular basis, in the form of taxes. I pay for upkeep on existing roads, new roads, all that. Furthermore, your analogy suggests that I claim you should continue to pay for games after you own a copy, which is false. You'd better damn well pay for it the first time, though, much like you have to pay your share if you wish to drive on the road. After that, it's been paid for once, so you don't continue paying for it in either case.
  
  --
  "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
My Nintendo DS games were Pirated last week by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-13 23:46 · Score: 0

I encountered a software pirate just the other day, he boarded my ship, blade drawn, and killed everyone onboard, he stole ALL my Nintendo DS games and put a ransom on my head.
Let's please stop using terms like "piracy" to describe what is really just unauthorized copying and sharing, all you're doing is playing into the propaganda.
Playboy by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 00:17 · Score: 0

Buying DS flash cards for development is like saying I buy playboy magazines for the articles!
1. Re:Playboy by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 11:14 · Score: 0
  
  But... but... I did!
  Buy the cart to develop, that is. Obviously playboy isn't worth buying for any reason.
DSi's effect on homebrew by tepples · 2009-01-14 00:25 · Score: 1

Thus the release of the DSi. Not only will it lock out R4 cards for classic DS games
Locking out R4 cards and comparable cards locks out amateur developers. From the article:

(let's not forget that many people who use pass-through carts are actually doing so because they wish to experiment with the system and not play pirated games)
What handheld platform should homebrewers be developing for instead?
1. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by NinjaPablo · 2009-01-14 01:22 · Score: 1
  
  What handheld platform should homebrewers be developing for instead?
  Perhaps the GP2X or one of its related devices?
  
  --
  SmashTech - No smashing of tech involved
2. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by Goaway · 2009-01-14 01:25 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  The vast majority of people who use flash carts use it for piracy, plain and simple. Trying to deny this is just naÃve. They may also try a homebrew app or two, but they would never have bought the thing if it wasn't for piracy.
  Furhtermore, Nintendo has absolutely no obligation to support homebrewers.
  And I say this as a homebrew developer myself.
3. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by tepples · 2009-01-14 02:06 · Score: 1
  
  Perhaps the GP2X or one of its related devices?
  That would work in countries where GPH has a distribution agreement. But which handheld platform marketed in the United States should homebrewers who live in the United States be developing for instead?
4. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by cgenman · 2009-01-14 03:37 · Score: 1
  
  What handheld platform should homebrewers be developing for instead?
  GP32 and the GP2x. They are korean handheld consoles running linux specifically developed for homebrew. There is an american version in development with keyboard and joysticks, but I can't seem to find any links online.
  Alternatively, develop for the iPhone or Android. They're both perfect systems for home development.
  As another alternative, the XGameStation is a game console they can develop on from soldering the chipsets to implementing the software. Or sign up for XNA and make Xbox 360 games.
  As a side note, why is Homebrew DS suddenly something amazing to be protected, especially with the multitude of alternatives? One or two neat things have come out of it, but it pales compared to the amazing works that have come out of independent flash development in rescent years.
  
  --
  The ______ Agenda
5. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by gauauu · 2009-01-14 03:57 · Score: 1
  
  But which handheld platform marketed in the United States should homebrewers who live in the United States be developing for instead?
  Alas, there isn't one.
6. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 04:21 · Score: 0
  
  You're entitled to release games on a handheld game console? Which constitutional amendment was that again?
  The GP2X is open. Use it, or quit whining. No one cares what you think; unemployed babysitters aren't driving the electronics market.
7. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 04:58 · Score: 0
  
  reverse engineering for compatibility is protected by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clean_room_design#Case_law
  they couldn't stop emulating their platform.
8. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by Dopefish_1 · 2009-01-14 08:11 · Score: 1
  
  As a side note, why is Homebrew DS suddenly something amazing to be protected, especially with the multitude of alternatives? One or two neat things have come out of it, but it pales compared to the amazing works that have come out of independent flash development in rescent years.
  Well for one thing, I can easily take my DS with me and have access to homebrew. That's not an option for flash applications (neither my DS, nor my iPhone, nor my old Treo support Flash).
  
  --
  
  #include <sig.h>
9. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by KDR_11k · 2009-01-14 08:37 · Score: 1
  
  I don't know... Windows Mobile devices? iPhone? gPhone or whatever that's called? Netbook? Plenty of choice.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
10. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 09:38 · Score: 0
  
  The vast majority of people who use flash carts use it for piracy, plain and simple. Trying to deny this is just naÃfve. They may also try a homebrew app or two, but they would never have bought the thing if it wasn't for piracy.
  I bought my son an R4 for Christmas so he could use his DS for watching movies as well as playing games.
  By Christmas afternoon, we had downloaded about half a dozen games because it was so ridiculously easy. And just like the article said, he didn't play any of them for more than 10 minutes before getting bored.
  My plan now is to just slow down and use the R4 as a backup for all the games we've bought over the years, but it takes some pretty strong morals to go out and spend $30 when you know you could get the same thing for free in less than 2 minutes.
11. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by theheadlessrabbit · 2009-01-14 11:25 · Score: 1
  
  it may be true for many, but not all flash cart users are in it for the piracy.
  i have an M3DS simply card. and i will admit, i have pirated several games to try them out, but my DS gets far more use as a day planner and MP3 player, thanks to this card. As a visual artist, people often ask to see my work, so i have JPEGs of my work on my card as well, so if someone wants to see what i do, i can pull out my DS and show them. these cards turn the DS into a very useful tool.
  On the rare occasion where I have downloaded a game, It is one i already own. While i do have legitimate copies of these games, I still use the ROMS loaded on my M3, because I can't be bothered to carry around 10 different game cartridges when I can have all of my games on one card, along with my MP3 and photo collection.
  and there are some great homebrew games out there. i used to play 'a touch of war' quite often. its a shame nintendo hasn't put out a RTS of its own.
  
  --
  -I only code in BASIC.-
12. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 11:41 · Score: 0
  
  The vast majority of people who use flash carts use it for piracy, plain and simple. Trying to deny this is just naÃve. They may also try a homebrew app or two, but they would never have bought the thing if it wasn't for piracy.
  It's naive so long as you supply some meaningful quantitative data to support your statement. Until then, watch this:
  No they don't!
13. Re:DSi's effect on homebrew by Zeroko · 2009-01-14 15:23 · Score: 1
  
  I suppose the GBA Movie Player is not just a flash cart (well, not at all, but it uses CompactFlash for storage), but I got it so I could play media I own (DVDs & NES cartridges) in a more portable manner. (Ever try carrying around a toaster NES with 6 D-cells & a portable TV? It works, but it is too heavy & awkward to be considered portable.) I also got a GB flash cart a while back purely for homebrew stuff.
  But yeah, it unfortunately seems most people want them for piracy. Perhaps if Nintendo made an official homebrew development cart & made the PC-side software reject commercial games they would make people like me happy & have a stronger case against flash carts, but that would be very un-Nintendo-like.
"Rated E" is meaningless in Europe by tepples · 2009-01-14 00:30 · Score: 2, Informative

Nintendo has produced seven generations or so of handheld game consoles. Not a single one supported region codes until the DSi. It stands to reason that if Nintendo wasn't trying to lock out pirates with new protection technology, there's a good chance the region codes never would have made it into this system.
DSi is also the first Nintendo handheld to enforce parental controls based on a rating system, and each region has a different rating system. For instance, ESRB ratings are meaningless in the European market, which largely uses PEGI.
Laptop gaming by tepples · 2009-01-14 00:41 · Score: 1

For me I am rather sick of [shovelware after the first two years of a Nintendo handheld, so] I reverted back to PC gaming, [...] a mid range card does it mostly!
The topic of the article is handheld video game systems, and the closest counterpart to those in the PC gaming world is a laptop. Unless the situation has changed dramatically since I bought my laptop, laptops don't have video "cards" that the end user can easily replace. What price range of laptops would you say come with "a mid range card"?
Out of Print by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 00:50 · Score: 0

These are also a great way to play games that you can't reasonably buy anymore. I have varied tastes and spend A LOT on games every month. But I don't have enough disposable income to buy everything I want at full price.
Maybe this is just a problem in the UK, but if I have £40 to spend, that usually will only get me 1 brand new game (not DS) and as I stand looking at the boxes, I have no idea which one is going to be £10 in the bargain bucket in a few months time and which is going to be the next Panzer Dragoon Saga, selling for £100+ on ebay.
I buy what I can and pirate what I can't. The publishers have been complaining about the second hand market lately so it's not like it's any different to them whether I download it or make some ebay trader slightly richer.
Re:Nintendo DS by powerspike · 2009-01-14 01:07 · Score: 0, Troll

The Americian schewl system, the war hasn't affected us at all.
We never really needed that funding .. really...
We don't just mod to pirate by module0000 · 2009-01-14 01:17 · Score: 1

I modded my xbox (250gb hd, xeniumgold chip), and it doesn't even HAVE an xbox game on it. I did it to put on all my emus and about 300-350 DivX movies I ftp to it over from my PC. Also, the controller and such is so easy that my girlfriend and house guests can figure out how to watch movies, or play old emu games without me having to walk them through installing ZSNES and using bittorrent on a pc.

--
Trackball users will be first against the wall.
1. Re:We don't just mod to pirate by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 03:26 · Score: 0
  
  And you don't consider having 300-350 DivX movies or SNES roms piracy? Did you buy all of those movies and convert them yourself? Did you buy all of your SNES games and then rip the roms yourself? Admit it matey... You be a pirrrrate!
Re:As a DS-X owner by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 01:31 · Score: 0

As a DS-Xtreme owner (2Gb card), I can tell you every game I have is pirated, except a few (the FUN games (Metroid/Mario)... and guess what... since I have it I don't play anymore... 95% of the games out there for DS is garbage and aren't worth buying...
I'm not trying to troll here -> I tryed many games but after playing something like hundreds of them for less than 2-3 minutes each I stopped playing... so I used my card as a way to have a DEMO before buying... :D and I'm happy with this. Now the card is empty, sitting in a box with the DS...
And it doesn't work for every games... sometimes you'll need to unlock the game, somes games won't work (Ex: MegaMan or lastest Zelda). Sure they're a way to make them work, but it's a lot of work that the average user won't be able to accomplish.
Piracy? by ZekoMal · 2009-01-14 01:43 · Score: 1

I own an SNES, GBA, and Gamecube emulator. I'm not ashamed of it, because I own the games that I play on them.
On the GBA, I play the pokemon games from time to time. My pokemon cartridges are so worn from overuse that they often just reset if I shake them a little. They weren't meant to last, that much is certain.
On the SNES, I play two games, a Fire Emblem game and the Clocktower game. These two I do -not- own, but this is partly because the games were never sold in America (my Japanese is not very good, which would lead to ultimate frustruation in playing a game, while I can get English translated ROMs), and partly because my SNES no longer works.
The Gamecube emulator I only have for Animal Crossing. I purchased Animal Crossing when it first came out, and once we moved, I lost it. I kept looking, until I found out my friend had my copy at her house...which is about 12 hours away. So, until she can come visit, I play it on my computer.
I am, therefore, a horrible thieving pirate, because I did not buy new pokemon cartridges (actually I did, for the older games, and then they wore out too), did not purchase a new SNES and import two Japanese games, and did not buy a new Animal Crossing disk.
Biggest problem is cheaters. by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 02:04 · Score: 0

Everyone forgot to mention the biggest problem of having available DS games on a flash card...it is CHEATING. The flash cards is destroying the DS market because it allows people to have power ups/items that are 1: unavailable to the rest of the games or 2: possible only after many hours of game time.
Some examples: I play Ultimate Jump Stars game that I imported from Japan. It took me over a month time *on and off* to unlock ALL 870 komas (characters +variations). Yet when I go on line, obvious cheaters (wins:99999/99999) have 1: all the characters 2: UNLIMITED SUPERS (hacked code). It is not EVEN FUN-- you just disconnect. THAT KILLS the game/industry because you cant play on line anymore - biggest selling point. it is not fun to play against someone who constantly can do super dooper moves-- all the time.
Example 2: I got Phantasy Star 0, and it is a RPG with online aspect. Where after beating different quests, you can unlock special stages, weapons etc. Online you connect, and you have levels 99 with super dooper weapons and maxed out magic/hit that kills everything in one hit! WTF...you just quit, because one person is a killing machine, it ruins the game.
So the BIGGEST PROBLEM IS CHEATING-- FOR EVERY GAME. And anti cheating stuff, gets hacked within a week, because ROMs are hackable. PS0 suppose to stop people from playing romed games, but it too failed. ruins the whole online experience.
EVERY SINGLE GAME is hacked. unlimited health, money, power --- people who buy games are now getting screwed by this --
http://cheats.gbatemp.net/
I wish you can ban people by placing their ips on "do not want" to play list on DS's game.
Not only for free games by unrealmp3 · 2009-01-14 02:28 · Score: 1

I admit that I find it a bit sad that everybody think that flashcart owners use it solely for game piracy. I agree that piracy is attractive when you get one, but the fact that you don't have to swap and carry all your legitimate games cartridges (I have about 12 games) when travelling is very convenient. At least Nintendo is going through Digital Distribution with the DSi with the help of an SD card, so this is a good step in the right direction. Let's just see if they will do it right once it comes to America.
Piracy HELPS the DS by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 02:40 · Score: 0

why buy a machine for 200 when you have to keep forking out cash for games? I'm going out to buy a DS instead of a PSP BECAUSE I can get pirated games.
The thing about piracy by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 03:45 · Score: 0

Hi everyone! I'm a DS pirate. Now, I'm not everyone, but I would say that piracy is responsible for my buying a lot of games. It's a way for me to get demos. I've made the mistake of buying games without playing demos before, and it's really stabbed me in the back.
Let's give an example. A few years back I downloaded Elite Beat Agents. I played it for an hour and then rushed to the nearest Gamestop to buy this masterpiece of a game. A year later I bought the two Japanese versions (Ouendan 1 & 2) in Akihabara. By downloading EBA, I gave Nintendo $100. That is the power of a demo.
So why did I buy a cart in the first place? Metroid Prime Hunters. It got fantastic reviews, but I think it may be the worst $40 I've ever spent. If a demo were available I wouldn't have bought it.
I'm well aware that there are tons of people who pirate because they're cheap, but I'm saying that it's not all that. Nintendo has taken a step in the right direction with the DSi, which I'm sure will have support for demo games.
Wait, what? by R3 · 2009-01-14 04:14 · Score: 1

Second paragraph of the TFA: "It's a sad fact of human nature that people tend to want things for as low a price as possible."
Huh?
Why would that be sad part of human nature?
Aren't all living organisms essentially opportunistic?
I know this is not really live or die kind of situation, but.....
Imports and Undubs by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 04:37 · Score: 0

I own one of the more high-end flash carts and this is what I have on it (besides Moonshell)
1. Ouendan 1
2. Ouendan 2
3. Final Fantasy IV UNDUB variant where some enterprising romhackers have taken the Japanese vocals and put them over a US version of the game, basically creating a subtitled game.
4. Its a Wonderful World/The World Ends With You UNDUB
5. Luminous Arc UNDUB
The first two are Japanese Only releases, which are not for sale in the USA. I actually bought these two from an import gaming shop, for a ton of money compared to a regular DS game.
The final three simply don't exist anywhere. I prefer the Japanese voice acting, and since game companies seem bound and determined (with a few exceptions) to stick US releases ONLY with english vocals, there's no way I can get this experience except with a flash cart.
Nintendo is going the wrong direction with this - go ahead, lock your system down even more. Don't give the customers what they want. See how much that helps. I can guarantee that I'll be finding the first DSi firmware/flashcart hack that will allow me to play import games and Undubs.
Yarr, mates! Yet another case study... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 05:04 · Score: 0

I live in a country far from the USA, and the only games that Nintendo ever brings into here are the most popular and the ones based on popular cartoons and films. I bought my R4 in order to be able to play Harvest Moon, Rune Factory, FInal Fantasy, and other rare games. I looked everywhere for most of those games, but the dealers kept making excuses, like "no one even plays RPGs anymore", or to "check back later, and we MAY get it".
Not only did I get fed up of waiting 3 years for the Harvest Moon that never came, also, I am somewhat relieved that I no longer have to pay half a week's salary for a single game, like I did with the 7 games I did not pirate ( quality games I found in 2 years of DS ownership, all bought within a six-month time frame!!! I'm not counting the 5 I ended up trading for yet crappier games).
In the end, I thought, "screw it", if there's no legal way to get the games, might as well pirate. As an added bonus, my DS has become my main Comic Book reader. I would pay for games, because I believe they are worth it, if whoever is in charge of importing would grow enough brains to bring quality over quantity. Not that it'll happen anytime soon...
Good online place 2 buy flash carts? by UnknownSoldier · 2009-01-14 05:58 · Score: 1

I have a DS Dev Kit at home (I'm a DS developer :-), but I want a flash cart to put the main DS games I play on one card.
Where's a good online place to order from?
Thx
sshhhh...don't tell them about the Wii softmod by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 06:10 · Score: 0

being able to mod the Wii without hardware (unless you count an SD card and a rented Legend of Zelda game)is awesome. Playing backups isn't even the coolest thing though, emulators and homebrew are. Well, getting all the Wiiware and VC games for free was cool. I payed for World of Goo though because it kicks major butt.
Re:Nintendo DS by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 06:14 · Score: 0

It's the new math, where children aren't wrong, they're just differently correct. An A for effort and a gold star for trying.
industry greed by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 06:23 · Score: 0

And if the industry want more power than they are allowed, aren't THEY being greedy.
So why whinge when BOTH sides are being greedy.
The industry wants change, the pirates don't care. Therefore the industry should stop the power grab. Copyright only on expressive items (not on binary code), copyright only protects commercial copying, copyright only lasts 10 years and copyright only controls those actions which aren't required for normal use.
Even if all they did was remove the extention of copyright, I bet a lot more people would be accepting of copyright controls.
more than that by Anonymous Coward · 2009-01-14 06:30 · Score: 0

The entire rationale for modern capitalism is people wanting the most for the least cost.
When it outsources, they defend it with "we must reduce costs". They want labour as low a price as possible.
When it cuts back, they defend it with "we must reduce costs".
When they sell up and run off with the money, they defend it with "we want it because we risked for it" (wanting the most for the least work).
But when *consumers* do it...!
As a parent of a DS owner... by Sabalon · 2009-01-14 08:21 · Score: 1

I'm sure I could easily download games, etc... however the real value I'm taking away from this is people that have bought the microsd cards and have backed up their roms onto them. I don't know how many times I've had to scour through my wife's van to find a DS game that is just tiny and falls into all sorts of areas.
It'd be nice to be able and the the kids games, consolidate and not have to worry about that.
The geek in me says it'd be cool to develop for the DS, but the realist says I'm too damn lazy!
Slashdot's bias by bonch · 2009-01-14 10:55 · Score: 1

Summary:
Pocket Gamer takes a look at how piracy affects the Nintendo DS console, along with the reasons so many gamers turn to piracy to play their games â" including the slew of inferior games, availability of flash carts and industry greed.
Why is the pirate's greed not mentioned as the #1 reason? Inferior games and industry greed don't force people to pirate games. Pirates just want something without having to pay for it. Simple and selfish.
Region Locking and Localization by Bones3D_mac · 2009-01-14 13:03 · Score: 1

While there may be some truth to region locking on games being done for the sake of price discrimination, the situation is nowhere near as severe as it is for DVDs (at least, outside of the anime industry).
In a lot of cases though, there are legitimate reasons for region locking games. Mostly due to the additional work involved in localization. This includes not only translations of text and audio, but also making sure the context of these translations are both kosher within the cultural values of a particular region and make sense to the end consumer. This can include not only altering onscreen text or spoken words, but also body movement, scene layout and even background props. (This is a common issue when attempting to localize certain kinds of content between countries like the US and Japan, where context of words and actions are translated versus what's actually being said and done.)
The process of localization in this manner can often be time consuming and costly to do adequately. The quality of a title's localization efforts can mean the difference between the success or failure of the title itself within a given region.
It's not a huge stretch to suggest that mass importing of a foreign title could potentially prevent future out of region titles from being localized if that title's localized counterpart doesn't sell well. At best, a future title might still be localized, but at a far lower quality due to budget concerns.
Personally, I like my games to be localized at the best quality possible.

--

8==8 Bones 8==8
Some reasons by jgoemat · 2009-01-14 16:38 · Score: 1
In order:
1. Most games are utter crap. You can download them to check them out and then only buy them if you like them
2. It's convenient to have one 2GB cart you can leave in with 50 games on it than take all of your games around and swap them out
3. Most now have the ability to use game cheats
4. You can backup your saved games
5. It saves wear and tear on your carts