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Coming Soon, 250 DVDs In a Quarter-Sized Device

Several readers have remarked on a new technique developed by scientists at UC Berkeley and University of Massachusetts Amherst that has the promise of achieving storage densities of 10 terabits per square inch. "The method lets microscopic nanoscale elements precisely assemble themselves over large surfaces. ... Xu explained that the molecules in the thin film of block copolymers — two or more chemically dissimilar polymer chains linked together — self-assemble into an extremely precise, equidistant pattern when spread out on a surface... Russell and Xu conceived of the elegantly simple solution of layering the film of block copolymers onto the surface of a commercially available sapphire crystal. When the crystal is cut at an angle... and heated to 1,300 to 1,500 degrees Centigrade... for 24 hours, its surface reorganizes into a highly ordered pattern of sawtooth ridges that can then be used to guide the self-assembly of the block polymers."

50 of 209 comments (clear)

  1. DVDs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Who cares how many DVDs? How many Libraries of Congress is it, that's what I want to know.

    1. Re:DVDs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Doesn't google provide a conversion between DVDs and Libraries of Congress?

    2. Re:DVDs by CRCulver · · Score: 5, Interesting

      We're living in the future. The thought of a library fit onto a quarter-sized device makes me think of that scene from Gene Wolfe's science fiction masterwork The Book of the New Sun where the curator of the Earth's largest and most ancient library says:

      There is a cube of crystal here --- though I can no longer tell you where --- no larger than the ball of your thumb that contains more books than the library itself does. Though a harlot might dangle it from one ear for an ornament, there are not volumes enough in the world to counterweight the other.

      The development of such small memory is a significant step forward. Just think about how the writings of the human race can be better preserved if it all fits on a small, lightweight and easily duplicated device. It could be spread all over the solar system as protection against all manner of cataclysms. I wonder how long it stays readable though, before it succumbs to some kind of rot.

    3. Re:DVDs by allawalla · · Score: 3, Informative

      Seems like 500 TB in the library of congress, At 10Tb an inch -- About 400 square inches for the library of congress.

    4. Re:DVDs by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 5, Funny

      I wonder how long it stays readable though, before it succumbs to some kind of rot.

      I imagine the future after mankind has passed away, where some alien race stumbles upon one of these libraries with the collective wisdom of humanity preserved on it, and upon trying to make sense of the contents, instead see a message: "We cannot verify you rights to access this material; the DRM server that can validate your license appears to be down. Please try again later".

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    5. Re:DVDs by Botia · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Yes, we are living in the future. I am reminded of that every time I have to reboot my toaster.

    6. Re:DVDs by Albanach · · Score: 3, Funny

      Seems like 500 TB in the library of congress

      What size is that in a useful unit, like Olympic swimming pools or double-decker buses?

    7. Re:DVDs by von_rick · · Score: 3, Funny

      Your toasting partitions must be terribly fragmented, and you must have tons of redundant and archaic bits of crumb affecting your performance.

      --

      Face your daemons!

    8. Re:DVDs by CecilPL · · Score: 2, Funny

      What they really mean is, "We're living in the past's future."

    9. Re:DVDs by creepynut · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Funny? Maybe. Unfortunately, I think it's more accurate (and sad) than funny.

    10. Re:DVDs by SharpFang · · Score: 3, Funny

      Seems like its data density is 200 miliOlympicPools per kiloLibraryOfCongress.

      --
      45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
    11. Re:DVDs by llZENll · · Score: 4, Insightful

      More than likely no one will ever know of anything we did if humans are extinct. If you read up on time capsules, data retention, and info on what would happen to the earth if mankind disappeared it is an sobering realization that after only 50,000 years most traces of humanity will be gone. And after only a few million years, which is minuscule on a galactic time frame, every trace will have vanished, even our weapons grade plutonium will have decayed to its normal state, and all of this long before the sun will obliterate our solar system.

      http://images.thetimes.co.uk/TGD/picture/0,,351113,00.jpg
      http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/channel/videos/player.html?channel=1797&category=5487&title=05068_00

    12. Re:DVDs by davester666 · · Score: 4, Funny

      The size of the LOC is constantly changing. You need to specify the date/time to be used to determine the size of the LOC before you can do the conversion.

      Sure, you can use the default of 'right now', but if everybody does this, it makes comparisons useless, as everybodies 'LOC' constant is different.

      We must push for an international standard for the amount of data in a single 'Library of Congress'.

      Once this is done, we can discuss whether we should enforce this value on the real Library of Congress, so it's contents match the size of the international standard.

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
  2. Nice, hopefully coming soon by foxalopex · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This seems like it has some potential. Hopefully it will make it out of the lab considering how many times I've seen the promise of amazing technology only to find that eventually it isn't practical or has some sort of manufacturing limitation. Oh, and while you're at it, when you do create this "new technology" don't riddle it with DRM issues.

    1. Re:Nice, hopefully coming soon by reashlin · · Score: 4, Funny

      > This seems like it has some potential. Yup, it'll be good for storing your router logs http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/09/02/20/131224.shtml?from=rss [slashdot.org]

    2. Re:Nice, hopefully coming soon by knarfling · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Sorry, probably not any time soon.

      Not because of the tech or DRM or anything, but because this is not a new storage medium as most of the comments below seem to indicate, but because it is a new METHOD of creating storage.

      From TA (Yes, I actually RTFA [sometimes, but I don't make it a habit]), it appears to be a new way to create semiconductors. This process would be used to create RAM, microprocessors, or other semiconductor manufacturing. Think of it as being able to create a 10 TerraByte RAM stick the same size as a 8 GigaByte ram stick now.

      Furthermore, the heating process is not used for each set of RAM chips created. I heat up one huge crystal and then use it as a bed to create a large plate of semiconductor material which I can cut multiple RAM chips. I no longer have to use the expensive nano lithography to create chips. I only need one bed to make many, many plates. By changing the heating process, I can create one bed for RAM chips, another for microprocessors and another for a custom chip.

      Why won't we see it soon, then? Because chip manufacturers already have tons of money invested in nano lithography and won't be willing to just drop it. The author seems to think that since it only replaces the nano lithography and harsh chemical processes that everyone will jump at it in order to make cheaper chips. I am not so optimistic, but would love to see it.

      --
      Great civilizations have lived and died on false theories. Don't mess up mine with a few facts.
  3. Art Immitates Life by chill · · Score: 4, Informative

    "This fascinating little gadget is supposed to replace the CD; guess I'll have to buy the White Album again." - Agent K, Men In Black

    --
    Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
  4. coming soon? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    f- coming soon
    coming soon should be only be able to be used if it in on shelves in 90 days or less.

  5. Portable music players with huge capacities? by MtViewGuy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    If they can make this technology work with solid-state re-writable memory, I can see huge leaps forward in storage for portable music player solid state memory. The possibility of storing 250 to 500 GB of media files on a portable music player the size of the current 4G iPod nano is very enticing, to say the least.

    And it may finally spell the end of the hard drive, replaced by a solid-state "drive" in the 750 GB to 1.5 TB range.

    1. Re:Portable music players with huge capacities? by zappepcs · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yes, and a mirrored RAID-5 stack would fit inside a pack of cigarettes. A 3.5 inch bay with a little drawer that pulls out with 16 slots in it for these devices.

      I wish we'd just get on with using crystals so when the aliens come we'll be able to use their technology. Of course, the down side to using the new alien technology would be all the ads for 250 DVD sized ZIP drives, and cheap home video recording equipment from X10.

  6. real vs. vaporware by rubycodez · · Score: 5, Funny

    my mini-van full of 9-track can hold 3 TB, and is real. don't bother me with this vaporware speculation!

    1. Re:real vs. vaporware by Roland+Piquepaille · · Score: 3, Funny

      my mini-van full of 9-track can hold 3 TB

      Is that 8-track + parity?

  7. Heated for HOW Long?! by Logical+Zebra · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...and heated to 1,300 to 1,500 degrees Centigrade... for 24 hours...

    I certainly hope they can improve those figures. From a manufacturing standpoint, that sounds very expensive.

    --
    I have a bad feeling about this...
    1. Re:Heated for HOW Long?! by lucifig · · Score: 2, Funny

      I don't know, my MacBook certainly gets close. At least it feels like it on my lap.

    2. Re:Heated for HOW Long?! by Firethorn · · Score: 2, Informative

      Well, consider that Steel, which is used in construction left and right, is made from Iron with a melting point of 1538C

      Also, Silicon is 1414C, and yes they melt the silicon to make the wafers. Don't forget that we also melt a lot of silicon for windows.

      As for keeping the temperature up for 24 hours, well, the vast amount of the cost is getting the temperature that hot, after that it just depends on how well insulated your oven is.

      --
      I don't read AC A human right
  8. all your music lost down the back of the sofa by petes_PoV · · Score: 2, Insightful
    If the device is really as small as they say, it will be extremely easy to lose every digital thing you value in one careless moment.

    This technology should kick-start the backup market as people will have to continually restore all their photos, music and movies every time they leave the last chip somewhere they forget about.

    Hopefully the backup/restore device will be bigger (and static) so that it, too, doesn't get easily lost.

    --
    politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
  9. Re:But.. by Kamots · · Score: 3, Informative

    Considering that we've been able to artificially make sapphires for over 100 years now... and that things like the glass on your grocery-store's barcode scanner is probably made from sapphire glass (a thin wafer of cut sapphire)...

    Well, I'm thinking that it's not that large of a problem.

  10. we need a new term for press release science by cats-paw · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This growing trend of announcing lab discoveries which _might_ hold commercial promise _sometime_ in the future, _maybe_, are really kind of annoying.

    What do these accomplish ? Do they show the people supplying the research $ that something is being accomplished and that the researches aren't just sitting around the lab smoking fatties ?

    Vaporware just doesn't do these "discovery" press releases enough justice.

    Could some clever person out there think of a nice derogatory term for them ?

    Something to do with flying cars, maybe.

    --
    Absolute statements are never true
  11. Let me explain it in slashdot terms by SmallFurryCreature · · Score: 4, Funny

    They mean "soon" as in the sentence "you will be having sex soon".

    == never

    --

    MMO Quests are like orgasms:

    You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

    1. Re:Let me explain it in slashdot terms by Jason+Levine · · Score: 2, Funny

      You know, not all of us Slashdotters are virgins living in mom and dad's basement. Some of us are married with a few kids. Of course, then we're back to your original definition of "soon." Carry on.

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
  12. Re:Poor math by Albanach · · Score: 5, Informative

    but they're off by an order of magnitude.

    8.4GB * 250 = 2.1TB, not 10TB.

    Perhaps they were looking at single layer DVD

    4.7GB * 250 = 1.175TB

    1.175 * 8 = 9.400 Terabits

    Since, the summary points out it's 10 terabits per square inch, not terabytes as you seem to be using.

  13. Re:uncompressed by Firethorn · · Score: 2, Interesting

    better yet, using a display that operates in multiples of 24 (72Hz and 120Hz work quite well)

    It's an LCD monitor. There's no particular reason it needs to refresh at 60htz or faster.

    My LCD TV is perfectly happy operating at 24hz when that's the media it's presented. I imagine that, given the right hardware and programming, the thing would be perfectly happy refreshing at any given interval between 1 and 60hz, only limited by whatever scheme is telling it the resolution and refresh rates it's supposed to be displaying.

    Still - I think it'd be best for movie makers to switch from filming in 24fps to 60 or even 72fps. There's not many movie theaters left with actual film projectors; even if you have to run off some reels of film, it's easy enough to downsample 60/72 fps to 24.

    Hmmm... One thing I'm thinking of is quality - while I am very annoyed by 'mere' 60hz on a crt, I've never really had a problem with televisions, and have to really concentrate to see any jumping with film. Remember, each cell in 24fps film is displayed *twice*, so you get 48 flashes a second, 24 cells. Increasing the number of frames by a factor of 3, while with any decent compression alogorithm it wouldn't increase the size of the video by a factor of 3, is still increasing the quality of video by an almost imperceptible amount, for a very real increase in size. How much, I don't really know. There's a LOT of variables.

    Now I almost want to conduct some tests... Find some 'true' 120fps video, reencode at 24fps and 60fps, see how much the file size ends up. You'd want Low motion and High motion test sections as well.

    --
    I don't read AC A human right
  14. Re:uncompressed by Firethorn · · Score: 2, Informative

    Sapphire can be created artificially

    Compared to the cost of silicon wafers of sufficient quality the price isn't even that bad.

    --
    I don't read AC A human right
  15. Coming next by halber_mensch · · Score: 2, Insightful

    MPAA/RIAA lawsuits against anyone who buys these devices, because obviously you can't afford to fill that device with legitimately purchased content or you'd be as bankrupt as they're going to make you with the lawsuit.

    --
    perl -e "eval pack(q{H*},join q{},qw{70 72696e74207061636b28717b482a7d2c717b343 637323635363534323533343430617d293b})"
  16. Re:Do the calculations :P by Overzeetop · · Score: 2, Informative

    Man, I'd hate to see your change purse. The quarters in my pocket are just under an inch in diameter, or about 0.7in^2 per side. Allowing for a hub and spindle opening, maybe 1/3 to 1/2 of that is available for data, which would be closer to 2.3-3.5Tb. Surprisingly close to the article claims (others above have posted 2.1Tb values; I didn't do the math).

    --
    Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
  17. Hmm... by kabocox · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I wonder how long it'll take us to invent genetic memory. Let's think of what it'd really require. It requires encoding memory into your reproductive packages. How many generations back would you include? Most likely as many as possible.

    Thinking about it, we've got 9 months to grow and develop inside another human. I wonder how much/little engineering that it would take to have neural downloads straight into the kid's memory right up until birth. Of course you could always run into the Dune problem where past personalities want to take control of the new generation. That's one of the reasons that the memories might be useful, but entire personalities would be dangerous.

    Who needs history education if you could remember it happening through your relative's view point?

    Of course some things folks might want to forget or try to force future generations not to remember.

    1. Re:Hmm... by Eli+Gottlieb · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Take a long-standing conflict like, say, Israel and Palestine. Do we really want it to be possible to pre-program the next generation with vivid memories of all of the perceived injustices and wrongs committed over the last 50/100/1000 years?

      Once again, Dune dealt with this problem. The idea is that you leave the genetic memories latent within the person until they reach adulthood, have a well-formed psyche, and are prepared for it, then let them remember their ancestors' lives. This prevents memories of events that happened 1000 years ago from traumatizing a person or becoming to integrated into their identity.

      Of course, in the Israel-Palestine case you still run into the problem that the settlers and the Arabs already define themselves by supposed atrocities perpetrated against them anywhere from 50 to 2000 years ago without any genetic memories at all. Letting them remember that the XYZ Massacre was actually faked (yeah, some have been in that area) or that the ABC Conquest wasn't as violent as the stories and histories say might actually be beneficial, now that I think of it.

  18. Re:When I get... by LUH+3418 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    But of course... This is why we now have 32GB+ USB keys... Because the RIAA/MPAA would never allow devices with this kind of capacity and read/write access to fall into our hands! Seriously... Why don't you take off that tinfoil hat?

    The reason we're not seeing any of those insanely dense holographic storage technologies and other forms of vaporware is because right now, it doesn't work. The huge claims in this article are either the result of journalists not understanding what's going on, or researchers trying to get funding.

  19. Coming soon! by Lucas123 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I hate it when someone uses "coming soon" in the title of a story when production of the technology is at least 10 years off and industry adoption isn't even in sight. Oh, and don't forget there are a half dozen other nanotechnologies promising the same thing as this one, such carbon nanotubes and scanning tunneling microscopy, atomic force microscopy, holographic storage, heat-assisted magnetic recording, and quantum dot technology.

  20. Re:Wow by FishAdmin · · Score: 2, Funny

    I can fit my entire porn collection on just 4 discs

    Pfft, amateur.

    No, no; I think he meant the professional videos, too, not just the amateur stuff.

    --
    Last night I played a blank tape at full volume. The mime next door went nuts.
  21. A horse in my wallet. by SharpFang · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Well, say what you want, right here with me, in my wallet, I have a horse. Smaller than a quarter.
    Precisely, the complete genome sequenced and sorted. On a 2GB MicroSD card.

    "A lot of books" is an odd abstract that doesn't really impress me. But the idea of a full, unabridged, complete set of information which describes a real lifeform in full, contains the program of all the life functions, all the complexity of neural system, all the mysteries of instincts and social behaviors, the complexity of senses, the strength, immunity, lifeforce of a powerful creature - all this potential, described as a bunch of files consisting of rows upon rows of letters AGCT (gzipped).

    Sure we have no technology to reproduce a living creature from this data alone. But that looks like a really small problem compared to all the incredible knowledge achieved through billions of years of evolution, to solve all these problems of creating a standalone, self-repairing, self-replicating, self-defending, and quite pretty to that, piece of "biotechnology" - actually, the solution to re-creating it from that data (only on different media) is right in that data. We just can't really use it.

    250 high quality movies, in some future? blah.
    A horse in my wallet, now and today, that is what impresses me, really.

    --
    45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
    1. Re:A horse in my wallet. by Your+Pal+Dave · · Score: 4, Funny

      A horse in my wallet, now and today, that is what impresses me, really.

      I dunno, any horse manages to keep a copy in the nucleus of each of its cells.

    2. Re:A horse in my wallet. by HiThere · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That's probably about 1/2 of the information required to reproduce a horse. The genome isn't everything, even if it were complete (which I doubt, because repetitive segment of codons are beyond what I believe is our current ability to sequence).

      But *if* you had the complete genome, including the mitochondiral sequences, etc. it still wouldn't be enough. You also need the environment to raise the genome, which includes not only mechanisms for feeding it, but an unknown but large number of prions which are required for proteins to fold correctly. Not all proteins require such assistance, but many do, and without them you can't create a live horse...or any other mammal, probably any other chordate.

      I'm guessing that the genome is half the information needed. It could be considerably less than half. (Or, of course, more. I can't even tell if I'm being conservative.)

      Note that the genome carries practically all the information for the variation between horses...or between horses and zebras. But this isn't at all the same as half the information.

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    3. Re:A horse in my wallet. by smallfries · · Score: 3, Informative

      It's a nice idea, but not actually true.

      There is enough information on that card to create a horse within the environment of a horse. There is nowhere near enough information to create a horse from scratch.

      Look at the new cloning projects trying to bring back extinct animals from the dead. The first step is to find a living species that is genetically close enough to act as a surrogate host.

      --
      Slashdot: where don knuth is an idiot because he cant grasp the awesome power of php
    4. Re:A horse in my wallet. by MobyDisk · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Actually, that 2GB MicroSD card is very inefficient as far as nature is concerned. That same amount of DNA exists in genetic material a million times smaller. We have a long way to go.

    5. Re:A horse in my wallet. by Yetihehe · · Score: 3, Funny

      But the idea of a full, unabridged, complete set of information which describes a real lifeform in full, contains the program of all the life functions, all the complexity of neural system, all the mysteries of instincts and social behaviors, the complexity of senses, the strength, immunity, lifeforce of a powerful creature - all this potential, described as a bunch of files consisting of rows upon rows of letters AGCT (gzipped).

      Yeah, but it takes YEARS to compile! Also if you don't compile it in a networked environment with some of the same nodes, --social-behaviors option is often ignored.

      --
      Extreme Programming - Redundant Array of Inexpensive Developers
    6. Re:A horse in my wallet. by jedidiah · · Score: 2, Insightful

      > 250 high quality movies, in some future? blah.

      Those movies can be anything. They don't necessarily have to be formula Action movies.

      They could be the history of the world from the Learning Company.

      They could be any other set of subjects from the Learning Company.

      They could be that same content in audio form (times 10) rather than video form.

      They could be the entire Project Gutenberg collection.

      They could be history recorded as it was happening.

      The genome of a horse is a little less useful. Hell, we don't even have a "decoder" for it yet.

      Keep your horse. I would rather have Plato.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
  22. How many Humans? by WED+Fan · · Score: 2, Interesting

    LOC is a nice measurement, I want the technology to progress to the point we can digitize an entire colonization team, load them onto a ship with equipment necessary to reconstruct them and then send that ship to the farthest reaches. It's all about saving the evils of man so we can propagate.

    --
    Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong fix.
    1. Re:How many Humans? by PalmHair · · Score: 4, Funny

      Does 1 KLOC = 1024 or 1000 LOCs? Also, how does that translate to metric units - GBs. (GB - Gutenberg Library)

    2. Re:How many Humans? by jshackney · · Score: 3, Funny

      1 KLOC = 1024
      1 KLoC = 1000