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NASA's LRO Captures High-Res Pics of Apollo Landing Sites

The Bad Astronomer is one of many readers who wrote to tell us about NASA's release of high-res photos showing the Apollo landing sites. The photos were taken from the Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter and show the traces of earlier visits to the Moon. "The satellite reached lunar orbit June 23 and captured the Apollo sites between July 11 and 15. Though it had been expected that LRO would be able to resolve the remnants of the Apollo mission, these first images came before the spacecraft reached its final mapping orbit. Future LROC images from these sites will have two to three times greater resolution."

197 comments

  1. First fake by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

    First fake

  2. The way I see it... by cmowire · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'm sure at least once, somebody in the team asked "Now, you guys do know that this will show the landing sight. We really didn't fake the landing, right?"

    1. Re:The way I see it... by e9th · · Score: 2, Funny

      More experienced members of the team were asking, "Are we sure we can get good pictures of the New Mexico desert from way up there?"

    2. Re:The way I see it... by amRadioHed · · Score: 1

      Hey now, NASA engineers may not always know the difference between metric and imperial units but they aren't that stupid.

      --
      We hope your rules and wisdom choke you / Now we are one in everlasting peace
    3. Re:The way I see it... by cmowire · · Score: 1

      Well, if I were a NASA engineer working on the LRO (sometimes I kinda wish I were, being the nerd I am) I'd probably ask the question to get a cheap laugh.

    4. Re:The way I see it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So they are taking pictures of the sound stage?

    5. Re:The way I see it... by Amiralul · · Score: 1

      Just look at the shadows in these HiRes pictures! They are all wrong! Clearly, that've faked the Moon surface somewhere in New Mexico...

  3. Nice by Kell+Bengal · · Score: 4, Funny

    Neat shots. I'm just waiting for someone to 'CSI enhance' this so that we can see Neil's bootprints.

    --
    Scientists point out problems, engineers fix them
    altslashdot.org: The future of slashdot.
    1. Re:Nice by MyLongNickName · · Score: 4, Informative

      Actually, I took a webcam shot of the moon from my back yard.. That should be good enough for the CSI team.

      --
      See my journal for slashdot ID's by year. Mine created in 2005. http://slashdot.org/journal/289875/slashdot-ids-by-year
    2. Re:Nice by Kufat · · Score: 1

      Won't work. "Walking on the Moon" is a Police song, not a Who song.

    3. Re:Nice by The_mad_linguist · · Score: 4, Funny

      Nah, too high res - no challenge. You should have taken a webcam shot through a window and aim it at a crushed soda can.

    4. Re:Nice by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      I saw this on Star Trek, I believe they called it "the Nyquist compensator".

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    5. Re:Nice by Cl1mh4224rd · · Score: 2, Funny

      I'm just waiting for someone to 'CSI enhance' this so that we can see Neil's bootprints.

      On it. :oP

      --
      People will pass up steak once a week, for crap every day.
    6. Re:Nice by thewils · · Score: 1

      It's good how they can resolve 2 pixels into a VIN :)

      --
      Once I was a four stone apology. Now I am two separate gorillas.
    7. Re:Nice by Amazing+Quantum+Man · · Score: 1

      One of the shots showed Shepard and Mitchell's trail.

      --
      Fascism starts when the efficiency of the government becomes more important than the rights of the people.
    8. Re:Nice by Chris+Burke · · Score: 1

      Sure, that would give a good enough image of the moon landing site to identify Neil's footprints, but it wouldn't give a good enough image to prove paternity of Neil's kids like the LRO images are! Come on people, "CSI enhancement" isn't magic!

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    9. Re:Nice by Snarf+You · · Score: 1

      Let me fire up Visual Basic and I'll get back to you.

    10. Re:Nice by Hurricane78 · · Score: 1

      Hey, does this mean they could play Crysis in HD on a Smartbook with an ARM cpu and 2 watts of power usage? Sweet!

      --
      Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
    11. Re:Nice by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

      In case anyone missed that, here's what the parent poster is referring to.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    12. Re:Nice by BobNET · · Score: 1

      A Moon belonged to the Who, though...

    13. Re:Nice by kheldan · · Score: 1

      Screw CSI, give 'em to Abby on NCIS. XD

      --
      Are YOU using the TOOL, or is the TOOL using YOU? Think about it!
    14. Re:Nice by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm waiting for 'Cold Case' to enhance the moon rise photo to solve a case ...

  4. Awesome! Beautiful desolation. Cheap prices. by itsybitsy · · Score: 4, Funny

    Awesome place. Beautiful desolation. Cheap prices. Vacant land. Good views of Earth. Historic properties. Once in a lifetime chance to own a piece of history.

    1. Re:Awesome! Beautiful desolation. Cheap prices. by Kell+Bengal · · Score: 1

      No way! Never buy any property listed as 'historic' - the council will never let you change or fix anything. I can't imagine the paperwork you'd have to go through to get clearance to reshingle your geodesic dome near Tranquility Base for fear of upsetting historic mounds of moon dust.

      --
      Scientists point out problems, engineers fix them
      altslashdot.org: The future of slashdot.
    2. Re:Awesome! Beautiful desolation. Cheap prices. by itsybitsy · · Score: 1

      The best part is that it's unincorporated so there are no taxes, nor neighbors to speak of.

    3. Re:Awesome! Beautiful desolation. Cheap prices. by ctmurray · · Score: 1

      It cost about 2.3 Billion per launch in 1970 dollars for the Saturn V rocket . And I think you could only get two people down to the moon at a shot. So the land is not that cheap.

    4. Re:Awesome! Beautiful desolation. Cheap prices. by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

      But that includes research costs. Now that they already know how to build the thing, it would probably only cost 10% of that to do it all over again.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    5. Re:Awesome! Beautiful desolation. Cheap prices. by ctmurray · · Score: 1

      We lost the ability to make a Saturn V and have substituted the Ares V rocket, which is under development, so we still have those up-front costs.

    6. Re:Awesome! Beautiful desolation. Cheap prices. by Nethead · · Score: 1

      D.D. Harriman, is that you?

      --
      -- I have a private email server in my basement.
  5. More Lost Photos by DieByWire · · Score: 4, Funny

    Sheesh. These pics are just a few days old and they've already lost the images of the Apollo 13 landing sight.

    --
    Never shake hands with a man you meet in a fertility clinic.
  6. fake pictures? by veci · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Crazy people claim that NASA forged all those moon landing videos and photos (missing stars etc.) They have to refine their theory now it seems (maybe NASA forged these pictures as well)...

    1. Re:fake pictures? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      The key flaw in their argument is that the USSR would have been tracking each and every apollo mission. if they hadn't been real you can be damned sure that the russians would have been shouting it from the rooftops. The deniers are crazy - a bit like religious fruitcakes!

    2. Re:fake pictures? by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      The deniers are crazy - a bit like religious fruitcakes!

      The funny part is that the Apollo deniers can't even agree on what happened: some claim that the astronauts never left the Earth, others that they went into space but not to the Moon, and at least one that they landed on the Moon but it had an atmosphere and inhabitants.

      So we can safely say that at least 90% of the deniers are wrong, which makes the assumption that the other 10% are wrong pretty easy to justify.

    3. Re:fake pictures? by Sockatume · · Score: 1

      Of course they'll say NASA forged these photos. Or that the landers were placed by robots, which is already their excuse for the langer range-finders the Apollo missions placed on the moon. There's no conceivable evidence, even in principle, which could disprove their conspiracy theory. It's a matter of faith. The interpretation of the evidence must bend to that belief, no matter how implausible the leaps involved, to vindicate it.

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    4. Re:fake pictures? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's the bit that undoes most conspiracy theories. Ask a moon denier about the moon landings, and something like "look at the rooster tails on the rover, that's dust in air"... and then ask about the hammer and feather dropping experiment, and "They're in a vacuum container!". Then remind them that the rooster tails on the rover weren't created by rubber tyres on sand, rather the equivalent of a cloth flicking talcum powder, and they claim "But then the dust would hang in the air".

      For a conspiracy theory to make sense *as* an explanation of a whole series of events, it needs to explain them ALL, not just one part of it.

      Same with 9/11

    5. Re:fake pictures? by j-turkey · · Score: 1

      Crazy people claim that NASA forged all those moon landing videos and photos (missing stars etc.) They have to refine their theory now it seems (maybe NASA forged these pictures as well)...

      Pssh. NASA put the landers on the moon after they faked the manned landings. To further the incredibly elaborate hoax, NASA obviously developed the technology to put unmanned crafts on the moon well after the landings. The current LRO was designed to photograph these unmanned crafts to further the fraud. The footprints were made by a rover. To top it all off, Netcraft confirms all of my findings.

      There are so many questions about the moon landings that the only scientific conclusion is that the manned landings starting in 1969 were an obviously elaborate hoax. The logic is so simple:

      1. Ask a couple of questions that don't have an immediately apparent answer
      2. ???
      3. Proof of a wildly elaborate hoax. To hell with Occum's razor.

      Anyone who disagrees with me is either crazy, ignorant, or a NASA co-conspirator.

      (Disclaimer, if you need a disclaimer to know that I'm being sarcastic, you're a putz.)

      --

      -Turkey

    6. Re:fake pictures? by j-turkey · · Score: 1

      (Yes, I am replying to my own post.) Here is clear evidence that the moon landings were a hoax. ;)

      --

      -Turkey

    7. Re:fake pictures? by 4D6963 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yeah, but who fucking cares? I mean seriously, everytime the Apollo program comes up on Slashdot half of the discussion is about how hoax theorists won't shut up about it. How about we shut up about them, no one else cares about their ridiculous opinions, and if anything it'd be better to ignore such silly ideas.

      Same thing for flat Earth theorists, creationists, holocaust deniers, global warming deniers and so on. If we stopped caring about what any looney/troll says we wouldn't even hear of those stupid ideas, cause we're the ones who do the best job at repeating and spreading those ideas.

      --
      You just got troll'd!
    8. Re:fake pictures? by fedxone-v86 · · Score: 1

      If we stopped caring about what any looney/troll says we wouldn't even hear of those stupid ideas

      Did you move to a suburb because inner city housing is too depressing? Have you stopped watching world news because it depresses you, too? Did your children's education become better when you stopped caring about it and pushed all responsibility onto the teachers?

      Just because people stop caring, the problem won't suddenly disappear. If you don't educate the stupid, their ideas will become the foundation of their culture.

      --
      (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
    9. Re:fake pictures? by Alsee · · Score: 1

      The moon-hoax thing and flat-earthism are indeed repeatedly raised in endless gag posts, but only because it is such desperately needed comic relief from the fact of the all-too-common all-too-relevant creationists, holocaust deniers, global warming deniers.

      While holocaust denialism is almost as irrelevant as moon-hoaxists here within the US, I would hardly call the President of Iran insignificant.

      As far as global warming denialists, I would hardly consider a sizable minority of the population and a fair chunk of congress to be insignificant.

      As far as creationism, I would hardly consider nearly half the population and a chunk of congress and many state board of education officials and countless principals and teachers and three of the candidates for the Republican nomination to president in the last election, to be insignificant.

      So yes, people will continue to make flat earth and moon landing comments, if only for desperately needed comic relief from sick sad reality.

      So in conclusion, on this story and the photos, I have to say it's good we can now put all the speculation to rest. We now no longer have to wonder if some Nixon plot faked moon landings or if NASA is part of some huge ongoing conspiracy to manufacture evidence. With these photos we finally have proof it's the latter.

      -

      --
      - - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
    10. Re:fake pictures? by 4D6963 · · Score: 1

      I'm afraid you missed my point. What I'm saying is that talking about it is the best vector for these ideas. That's like free advertisement, and it only gives it legitimacy as "the other side of the story". If you want to "help", don't acknowledge the looney "theories" and debate them, just dismiss them.

      --
      You just got troll'd!
    11. Re:fake pictures? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This guy should get Modded Troll. Comparing the pictures in the linked video with video and pictures from NASA show some very big differences with the suit from the link. The most obvious is the backpack in j-turkey's link is noticeably smaller (both in height and width) from the NASA multimedia. I can't help it if people want to propagate these wild theories but they should at least hold themselves to the same analytical standards as they claim NASA fails!

    12. Re:fake pictures? by fedxone-v86 · · Score: 1

      I still don't agree. Many great articles and documentaries have been produced in the last decades just to tackle these theories. Even people who had no doubt there was a moon landing could get insight into subjects they would never have touched by themselves. And I'm sure some of the loonies also learned that their doubts were just silly.

      If everybody had just taken the fact for what it is, all of that would have been lost. Worst of all the moon landing itself, after all this time, would have become just another chapter in a history book. It all would have vanished if people hadn't kept on nagging us about it.

      And yeah I know that was not really your point. I agree that there are crazy people who will never learn. The problem is sometimes you can't tell the crazy and uneducated apart. And when you dismiss them all, you're making a mistake.

      --
      (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
  7. Anonymous Coward by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Wow, those are some really good pictures of the old sound stage.

  8. Re:The way I *sigh*(t) it... by Xtifr · · Score: 2, Informative

    Actually, to show the landing sight, I think they'd actually have to land again. To show the landing site, however, simply requires a sufficiently high-resolution camera.

  9. yes, I know that you are joking by portforward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It does always bug me that the people who are so mistrustful that they refuse to accept that US astronauts did in fact land on the moon. One of them even harassed Buzz Aldrin to the point that Buzz (in his late 70s) dropped the guy with one punch to the face. CNN just had a front page article where they stated that around 25% of 18-25 year olds doubted the truth of the landing. That is utterly depressing, showing the current level of science education.

    Honestly, I think the best argument is that the Soviets would definitely have called us out on not landing. They would have had the technology to disprove us, and don't tell me that they wouldn't have called us out.

    Someday I hope that we as a species will go back.

    1. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by clarkkent09 · · Score: 4, Funny

      Honestly, I think the best argument is that the Soviets would definitely have called us out on not landing. They would have had the technology to disprove us, and don't tell me that they wouldn't have called us out.

      That's easy, I have reliable evidence from the voices inside my head that we just exchanged some alien technology from the Roswell UFO crash for their silence.

      --
      Negative moral value of force outweighs the positive value of good intentions.
    2. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by girlintraining · · Score: 5, Interesting

      CNN just had a front page article where they stated that around 25% of 18-25 year olds doubted the truth of the landing. That is utterly depressing, showing the current level of science education.

      They must have done the survey south of the mason-dixon line, because up here in Minnesota, I have yet to meet anyone who believes that garbage. I still remember when Fox News aired their little "moon hoax" series what NASA's response was. It was, in my opinion, the best headline I will ever read in my life. It read, in giant lettering across its homepage;

      Yes, We Did.

      Don't think that just because we have slathering idiots in the streets that America as a whole has become uneducated. I assure you, idiots breed in larger numbers than smart people in every country.

      --
      #fuckbeta #iamslashdot #dicemustdie
    3. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Sockatume · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It was about 6% of the whole American population, IIRC, in a Gallup poll. About the sort of percentage you'll get as a minimum for any claim, because people tend to agree to statements in surveys to get the surveyors to leave them alone.

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    4. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      CNN just had a front page article where they stated that around 25% of 18-25 year olds doubted the truth of the landing.

      25% of any random sampling of people are either stupid and/or maliciously answer questions wrong.

      How many 18-25 year-olds:
      --can list more than 2 constitutional amendments?
      --can point to Brazil on a map?
      --believe in evolution?
      --can list the last 5 presidents?
      --can list all 50 states?
      --know what state Obama was a senator for?
      --know that Obama was a senator?

    5. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by spaceyhackerlady · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It wasn't just the Soviet Union listening in. Ham radio folks listened in too. Check QST for reception reports for Apollo 10 onwards.

      I think it's interesting to compare how well we can fake it now (Apollo 13, From the Earth to the Moon, etc.) with real Apollo footage. Even today, we can't get it quite right.

      ...laura who has been comparing LRO pictures with the pictures taken by the astronauts

    6. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The only plausible way to fake a lunar landing would have been to land an unmanned lander on the surface of the Moon and use that as a relay for fake radio telemetry, video and audio. The signals to the lander relay would have to be sent sent in narrow beams from a number of antennas around the Earth, in order to fake all the transmissions while avoiding detection. Any other fake would probably have been discovered by professionals and amateurs all over the globe, not just in Russia.

    7. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Amazing+Quantum+Man · · Score: 1

      in my opinion, the best headline I will ever read in my life. It read, in giant lettering across its homepage;

      Yes, We Did.

      Best. Headline. Ever.

      --
      Fascism starts when the efficiency of the government becomes more important than the rights of the people.
    8. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LIES: You say that only for the purpose of plausable deniability; NASA shill.

    9. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Shadow+Wrought · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately the folks obsessed with "disproving" the Moon landings are doing on the premise that NASA faked the whole thing. So any evidence in support coming from NASA would of course be expected. Logic, reason, and facts are not exactly these peoples strong points, so this will do nothing to curtail their wailings. Indeed, this will just be added to the list of things, "faked."

      --
      If brevity is the soul of wit, then how does one explain Twitter?
    10. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Hadlock · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Considering the lack of moon-based science we've done since the 70's, that number doesn't really surprise me. I grew up in the 80's, and when I found out as a kid that we'd not just sent one group of men to the moon, but several, I got excited wanting to know how I could go visit the moon myself. I was crushed, upon learning that less than 30 people had ever been to the moon, and nobody ever planned to go back again. It's been almost 20 years since I learned the awful truth, and nobody still yet has a firm launch date for sending a manned orbiter to the moon, let alone an idea of what it would look like. If you're under 30 - the idea of putting a man on the moon sounds damn cool - but it might as well be Arthurian Legend or a story out of an H.G. Wells book written long before you were born. I think people under 30 are highly supportive of putting a man on the moon, and a man on the mars (seriously, what government agency do I write a check to?) but they're skeptical of it ever happening in our lifetime.

      --
      moox. for a new generation.
    11. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Tomfrh · · Score: 5, Funny

      Honestly, I think the best argument is that the Soviets would definitely have called us out on not landing.

      The top tiers of the Soviet machine were in on the hoax. It was excellent propaganda. It generated fear in their people, and fearful people are more easily herded.

      Instead of "Iraq has WMDs" it was "America has moon rockets".

    12. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Hurricane78 · · Score: 1

      I agree. But your problem is that you are trying to attack schizophrenia with logic. I recommend trying to argue about something with someone with schizophrenia for an hour. Then you see that logic does not help here. My brother worked with a guy, who insisted that he was able to control the whole world. He ran on the highway, stating that nothing would hit him, because he would control everything. He got hit by a car. He landed in a hospital. And the first discussion when he could talk again, was that this happened, because he *wanted* it to happen. Then he did make up a story about why he wanted that.

      The good thing is, that if you know this, you can create scenes where he has to argue that he wanted things, that you want him to want. So usually (because you want to help him), you change him in a way that he wants do to what is really good to him. But this is long, hard, and will not even really cure his dis-association from reality. (For that you need a lot more than a simple therapy!)

      --
      Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
    13. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by zaivala · · Score: 1

      That's not so bad, considering that upwards of 40% are still being taught "Intelligent Design" as "real science" in their school systems.

    14. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by blahplusplus · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      " assure you, idiots breed in larger numbers than smart people in every country."

      But america seems to be special in that it prides itself on it's ignorance, try having an intelligent discussion about ideology with many Americans to see what I mean. It often times seems even the most educated there are also as dumb as rocks in that they will never allow other points of view to penetrate their enormous ideological pride.

    15. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Swizec · · Score: 2, Funny

      " assure you, idiots breed in larger numbers than smart people in every country."

      But america seems to be special in that it prides itself on it's ignorance, try having an intelligent discussion about ideology with many Americans to see what I mean. It often times seems even the most educated there are also as dumb as rocks in that they will never allow other points of view to penetrate their enormous ideological pride.

      I mean seriously, most Americans still fail to realise the difference between it's and its even though most of us nonnative speakers are quite fluent with it. We can even tell the difference between you're and your, often even their, there and they're!

      It just bugs me that there are so few Americans out there today who can actually use their native tongue. Horrible isn't it?

    16. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      Wow. The President got hit by a car? I hadn't heard about that.

      --
      You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
    17. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Pentium100 · · Score: 1

      Why send a relay then send the signal to be repeated from the Earth to be bounced back? Video recorders were available in 1969 (or we wouldn't have the recordings of the landing), so they could just send a VTR and a transmitter.

      Not that I believe they did.

    18. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ha! I still have to think about it every time I write its or it's. Going through the process of thinking that contractions usually have an apostrophe is too much for many. Then again, it's not entirely intuitive. In most cases, a singular possessive has an apostrophe before the s - the confusion in this case may be warranted.

      Besides, if we invented English, we'd probably get it right.

      For some reason, it reminds me of the old joke: People who speak two languages are called bi-lingual. People who speak three languages are called tri-lingual. People who speak one language are called Americans. :)

    19. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Dadoo · · Score: 1

      Darn it! My mod points just expired.

      --
      Sit, Ubuntu, sit. Good dog.
    20. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Foobar+of+Borg · · Score: 4, Informative

      One of them even harassed Buzz Aldrin to the point that Buzz (in his late 70s) dropped the guy with one punch to the face.

      Since you brought it up, I thought I'd link to the video on YouTube. One of my all-time favorites!

    21. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by blahplusplus · · Score: 1

      Unconscious neurological errors are common take some courses in neurology, many people (including myself) cannot help those mistakes.

    22. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Swizec · · Score: 1

      It's called proof reading. Learn it, that's why the "preview" button is there instead of a "submit" button :)

    23. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by deathguppie · · Score: 2, Interesting

      It's simple to understand why some people question it really. If Spain had sent explorers to the new world, and then no one had repeated the journey for say 40 years, many people would have questioned it's existence. The fact that we propose to have done something in the 60's that we are incapable of doing today leads to the questions.

      --
      once more into the breach
    24. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Concerned+Onlooker · · Score: 1

      "Someday I hope that we as a species will go back."

      Back to the ocean?

      --
      http://www.rootstrikers.org/
    25. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by abigor · · Score: 1

      Nearly as horrible as people who don't hyphenate words correctly - there is no such word as "nonnative". Rather, it's "non-native".

    26. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by blahplusplus · · Score: 1

      Form is irrelevant to the substance of what I was saying though, if I say the earth is round and I spell round as roudn, and everyone still understands what it was that I said, and that is what matters.

      Although I have thought about using such grammar software like the following:

      http://www.whitesmoke.com/

      On places like slashdot I like the more relaxed atmosphere and I'm not going to proofread and re-read everything I write, otherwise it would consume way too much time. I can live with people poking at my grammar and other errors.

    27. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by tylerni7 · · Score: 1

      A singular possessive usually has an apostrophe before the s? Like hers and his? Or theirs?
      Possessive pronouns do not have an apostrophe, so its fits in just fine. I agree that it isn't that intuitive for some strange reason, but it's not so bad to remember.

    28. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Dragonslicer · · Score: 1

      A singular possessive usually has an apostrophe before the s? Like hers and his? Or theirs?

      Those are poor examples. The normal possessive adjective forms are "her" and "their". You only use "hers" and "theirs" in sentences like "It is hers" (unfortunately I'm only above average in grammar, not a real expert, so I don't know the correct technical term). In the case of "his", you aren't just adding an "s" to the normal form of the word. I could be wrong, and I'm sure someone will correct me if I am, but "its" is the only case I can think of where the possessive adjective is formed only by adding an "s" (no apostrophe or otherwise changing the word, as in "his", "your", or "their").

    29. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by drsmithy · · Score: 1

      I mean seriously, most Americans still fail to realise the difference between it's and its even though most of us nonnative speakers are quite fluent with it. We can even tell the difference between you're and your, often even their, there and they're!

      Non-native speakers are generally advantaged by having actually been taught English properly, whereas pretty much all native speakers under the age of 30 or so typically have not.

      It's hard for people who have spent most of their life being told that "correctness isn't important, so long as you're understood" to have proper spelling and grammar. ;)

    30. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by c6gunner · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It often times seems even the most educated there are also as dumb as rocks in that they will never allow other points of view to penetrate their enormous ideological pride.

      I take it you've never had a conversation with someone who grew up behind the iron curtain, and didn't defect. I once had one such guy physically attack me because I kept shooting down all his theories about how the moon landing was faked. In his eyes, everything in recent history was either done by Russia, was stolen from the Russians, or is a big capitalist lie meant to malign the Russians. You want to talk about ideological blindness, I think Europe has the Yanks beat.

    31. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by c6gunner · · Score: 1

      It's a lot simpler to understand - there are a lot of crazy people around, and even more ignorant people, and conspiracy theories pop up about every major event. Look at how many people believe the "alternate theories" about the JFK assassination.

    32. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by MaWeiTao · · Score: 1

      I think people under 30 are highly supportive of putting a man on the moon

      Well, amongst the people I know in that age group there while there are some who are highly enthusiastic about the idea I also know far too many who don't have the foresight to see the benefit such a venture would provide humanity. They see landing on the moon, or anywhere else as a complete waste of money. Every last one of them already thinks too much is spent on NASA and would rather see the money spent on social programs instead. I always feel like they expect the government to shield them from the hardships of life, but that's a whole other discussion.

      I think if Americans had a real desire to return to the moon we'd be there already.

    33. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by IntlHarvester · · Score: 1

      At least as far as I can tell, Moon Hoaxers are considered to be fringe nutters even within conspiracy theory circles. Their theories are so shoddy that even the folks who believe firmly in in little green men at Area 51 want nothing to do with it.

      --
      Business. Numbers. Money. People. Computer World.
    34. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by TyIzaeL · · Score: 2, Funny

      You must be one of those creative types...

    35. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Cstryon · · Score: 1

      Citation please? I am religious, my God IS a scientist :P. But I agree with the parent of your post, it's incredible. My in-laws (Mostly my Mother-in-law) have a close family friend that is into just about every conspiracy theory in the book. Although recently he is starting to step away from the 9/11 mumbo jumbo, or he just doesn't think he can convince me anymore. I have never heard him speak of the moon landing, but I have heard him talk about some "Leaked" photos of a supposedly scorpion like life-form on mars. -_-

      --
      Indoctrinate : to instruct especially in fundamentals or rudiments Educate : to develop mentally, morally, or aestheti
    36. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by sysrammer · · Score: 1

      I'll 2nd that. I've yet to find any special fx that can fool me into thinking that their rendition of low gravity movement is real. Rarely is it even attempted, no gravity is easier. Even null/micro grav is only convincing for the short cut shots normally seen...what they can patch together from the Vomit Comet & artful film-making. "Apollo 13" did a great job of the latter.

      sr
      ----
      There is more stupidity then hydrogen in the universe and it has a longer shelf life.
      Frank Zappa (1940 - 1993)

      --
      His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
    37. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They must have done the survey south of the mason-dixon line, because up here in Minnesota, I have yet to meet anyone who believes that garbage.

      Similarly, I don't know a single person who voted for Bush, yet my state ended up noticeably republican.

      Weird how such things happen...

      But that doesn't mean there was or was not a conspiracy.
      To know that, you need to look for evidence of such a conspiracy.

      Likewise, just because one can't prove man landed on the moon with their built in senses, there is significant proof it happened.
      If someone wants to claim it did not, it is up to them to provide the proof it was a fake. Or to somehow prove a negative.

      On one hand they call it 'thinking what they want', but in the real world it is simply 'being wrong'
      Just believing 2+2=5 does not make it so.

    38. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by igny · · Score: 2, Funny

      It is not as bad as me signing a present (a book) "To inteligent sister from intelectual brother"

      --
      In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is. - Yogi Berra
    39. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Careful, most of Russia is not even in Europe ... :)

      For the record, I am not Russian, but indeed from Europe. I must say that I want to believe that we (as a species) landed on the moon. I don't care about all that capitalism vs. communism crap. Not my generation. But one can have doubts, can't I? Such things can be fabricated and the soviets might as well not have caught it. Hell, American presidents have lied again and again to be able to go to war. Why not here?

      No reason to physically attack anyone though.

    40. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by zaivala · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I don't have a problem with an intelligent God, or an intelligent Universe (which to me are the same thing). My problem is teaching as Science a set of (not-that-well translated) metaphors written by a seer thousands of years ago, seen through the lens of many other seers and then taken as religious dogma as "inerrant". I would say the Hindu scriptures are quite a bit more in keeping with "modern science" -- note the discovery of Calculus and most other mathematical theorems far prior to the Greek, and the scientists of the Renaissance being censured, even tortured, by the official Church. I can read Genesis and see that it happens roughly the same as evolution; most who teach "Creation Science" would call me a heretic for even pointing out the similarity. I'm sorry that I am not providing the citation you requested. I'm sure the records are readily available. Nearly all Midwestern states and many others teach Creation Science, as though Gov. Huckabee were the Prophet of God. True spiritual people, in my experience, don't sweat the details.

    41. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Citizen+of+Earth · · Score: 1

      They would have had the technology to disprove us, and don't tell me that they wouldn't have called us out.

      Also, the rabble-rousing conspiracy nuts would all have been assassinated.

    42. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by mcrbids · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What amazes me is that you use the confusion of "it's" and "its" as a sign of actual education. Actual knowledge, instead of (ahem) actual knowledge, like understanding the scientific process, or mathematics, or how to balance a checkbook.

      No, the average person gets to spend about a man-year over the 12 years focusing on things like spelling, because... ? The only thing that makes spelling important is that people who know how to spell use that to insult those of us who don't. It's largely an utter waste of time.

      I'm a natural-born good speller, I haven't used a spell-check in at least a year, and manage to communicate quite effectively via the written word. Yet I think that spelling is a waste of intellectual energy that we could all well do without.

      When you think about it, the confusion is natural. The apostrophe is commonly used to show possession. EG: "That is Bob's shovel.". Yet, as soon as you replace "Bob" with "it" - the apostrophe suddenly disappears. "Don't bother its shovel.". WTF?

      But, just to add confusion, "It's" isn't a possessive "his" it is instead an abbreviation of "it is" which are two words and for which the apostrophe adds very little value intellectually. (Ohz noez! - there's a missing "i"!) The only thing saved is a space. w00t! And there's plenty of evidence that even extreme examples of mis-spelling have virtually no impact on our ability to comprehend the material.

      Personally, I'd like to see spelling dropped entirely - let's just learn the vowel and consonant SOUNDS, and let's use the 1 or 2 man-years saved on REAL education like Science, Mathematics, or how to balance your check book.

      I wud be haapy tu adopt pyerly fohnetik speling.

      --
      I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
    43. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by R3d+M3rcury · · Score: 1

      Actually, the people who would have had to be convinced would be NASA--they would be the hard ones to fake out. All the Soviet Union had was the voice signals to the moon, which could easily be faked.

      As I've said before, the conspiracists I've read about say we didn't land people on the moon. There's nothing mentioned about our ability to land hardware on the moon. I've never heard anybody say the Surveyor probes were faked. So it's not impossible that NASA landed a transmitter on the moon that would receive signals from Earth and broadcast them back to the Earth, making it look like the signals came from the moon.

    44. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by bensafrickingenius · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      "On places like slashdot I like the more relaxed atmosphere and I'm not going to proofread and re-read everything I write, otherwise it would consume way too much time. I can live with people poking at my grammar and other errors."

      Uh uh, no fucking way, asshole. YOU are the one who wanted to jump down America's throat for being "ignorant." Fine, do so. But, in your first sentence, try not to make at least 3 errors. First, you did not capitalize "America." Second, "it's" instead of "its," as already mentioned. Third, you used a comma after "ignorance" when the appropriate punctuation mark would have been a semicolon. By the way, asshole, I'm a math major, not an English major. And I'm drunk.

      "But america seems to be special in that it prides itself on it's ignorance, try having an intelligent discussion about ideology with many Americans to see what I mean. "

      --
      I am not left-handed, either!
    45. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I know! They're almost as ridiculous as "global warming" whackos! lol!

    46. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by liquibyte · · Score: 1

      They must have done the survey south of the mason-dixon line,

      If I ever meet you in person I'm going to slap you in the mouth. I'm seriously getting tired of people thinking that just because I have a southern accent I'm stupid/ignorant/retarted/racist/superstitious/(insert southern moniker here). The funny thing is that I have yet to meet someone from Minnesota that is friendly, I suppose it's the cold even though I lived in Maine for a bit. It seems a bit odd to me that you folks like to come down here and buy up property like there's no tomorrow and take over the local government to implement you're "it's for the children" laws and yet you can't stand us here dumb rednecks. As an aside, there are several posters from other countries below saying:

      But america seems to be special in that it prides itself on it's ignorance, try having an intelligent discussion about ideology with many Americans to see what I mean. It often times seems even the most educated there are also as dumb as rocks in that they will never allow other points of view to penetrate their enormous ideological pride.

      Yet we tend to bail out the rest of you when you get into trouble. See World War Two history for references. Thank you and have a nice day.

      I mean seriously, most Americans still fail to realise the difference between it's and its even though most of us nonnative speakers are quite fluent with it. We can even tell the difference between you're and your, often even their, there and they're! It just bugs me that there are so few Americans out there today who can actually use their native tongue. Horrible isn't it?

      It's non-native by the way. Oh, and have fun while they take away your liberties. Did I use your right? By the way, literacy has little to do with speech. Being able to say your, you're and their, there and they're have relatively little to do with being able to correctly spell out the same thing. On second thought, I'll slap the Minnesotan and shoot the other two! At least we're Americans. Asshats!!!

    47. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by RichiH · · Score: 1

      Because clearly, all of Europe was behind the iron curtain.

    48. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I know 2 science majors who do not believe in the landing. One of them has a PhD in astronomy.
      It's not all about lack of education...

    49. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by TheLink · · Score: 1

      Spelling is not a waste of intellectual energy.

      Proper spelling and grammar is not a waste of time. Poor spelling and bad grammar wastes other people's time (since it can be harder for them to understand you) and often wastes your own time when you have to spend more time explaining what you actually meant.

      Taking the effort and time to communicate properly is not a waste of time as long as you have something useful or interesting to say.

      FWIW if enough people start using "it's" to convey a "possessive" meaning, then it'll be the correct spelling. The various factions are casting their votes accordingly ;).

      --
    50. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by grumbel · · Score: 1

      CNN just had a front page article where they stated that around 25% of 18-25 year olds doubted the truth of the landing. That is utterly depressing, showing the current level of science education.

      I wouldn't read to much into that. It's really not that far fetched to have some doubt into the moon landing when you look at the facts (not the hard scientific ones, just the very basic stuff):

      a) in 1969 we have the tech to land on the moon
      b) in 2008 we don't even have the tech to make pictures of the landing sites, let alone land there with people
      c) we have very nice pictures of the Mars landing sites

      Yes, there are perfectly good explanation for everything there (budget cuts, focus shifted away from the moon, etc.), but not having the technology today to do something that was done 40 years ago just doesn't sound all that plausible from far away.

      In addition to that it annoys me a lot that the moon hoax debunker like to point to the retro reflectors so much. Yes, having them there shows that something landed on the moon, but it doesn't demonstrate that we landed there with people, that stuff that could have been done with simple automatic probes.

    51. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by generic.individual · · Score: 1

      You can make that check out to me... I will see it makes it to the right hands.

    52. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Restil · · Score: 3, Insightful

      What schools did you go to?? 20+ years ago when I was in school, Intelligent design had no place... in fact, the only religious references I can even remember were the secular Xmas parties and my senior year when we studied Dante for a few weeks.

      Science was science. Evolution as a concept was pretty much a fully agreed upon fact even back then. So we want to have an argument whether the first amino acids came together as random chance, or if some higher power had something to do with it. WHO CARES!

      -Restil

      --
      Play with my webcams and lights here
    53. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Scannerman · · Score: 1

      perhaps even more than the soviets, there were a whole host of amateur radio enthusiasts monitoring the lunar transmissions, so at the very least the Americans were relaying the pictures from the New Mexico desert via a transponder on the moon.

    54. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by c6gunner · · Score: 1

      I'm originally from Europe too. You should care about that "capitalism vs. communism crap" since the debate/fight is still very much alive and the result could be very important to your future quality of life (and that of your children).

      As for the moon landing ... there's nothing wrong with doubting something, as long as your doubt is based on rational objections. Unfortunately, as you've clearly demonstrated, your doubt is entirely irrational. You have no evidence to substantiate the idea that the moon landing was faked. Instead you fall back on an argument from ignorance followed by an ad-hominem attack aimed at an entire nation. That speaks volumes about why you have "doubts". You need to have a good look at your ideological biases and then try to look at the evidence from an impartial perspective.

    55. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by fedxone-v86 · · Score: 1

      I think if Americans had a real desire to return to the moon we'd be there already.

      The problem is, every single American could start a "social program" on their own or, even more effectively, with the help of their peers - if they really desired... The advancement of humanity on the other hand can never be done by a single person. No matter how much he or she desired.

      The next time you see those people from that age group, tell them they're all selfish pricks. The only reason they favour "social programs" is because that's what the cool kids do now.

      --
      (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
    56. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by mark-t · · Score: 2, Informative

      It's not so much that we are incapable of doing it... it's that a straightforward and practical cost-benefit analysis doesn't really show up any reasons why we ought to continue doing it.... or for that matter, why we ought to have done it in the first place, beyond perhaps just being able to say that we did. Since there's no point in continually throwing good money after bad, we stopped going to the moon.

    57. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by amiga3D · · Score: 1

      And now I have a headache. Thanks so much.

    58. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      O they just asked normal people in the street who are fedup of clipboards.

      Had they asked me I could have told them the real truth. The only person ever to go to the moon was Elvis, and that he is still living their happily to this day. But that may just be a tenet of my Jedi faith.

    59. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by SpeZek · · Score: 1

      Somehow I doubt they would have questioned its existence if he'd brought back geological evidence, videos, and photographs,

    60. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't know, this is a pretty good headline too: http://store.theonion.com/holy-shit-man-walks-on-fucking-moon-1969-p-332.html

    61. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well in that sense, yes I "care" about it. I just don't like all that ideological crap in the first place. I see how that can split even a single nation (East/West Germany) and even 20 years after the reunion things are not back to normal.

      As for the moon landing again: Rationally, there are many, many good arguments for believing it. Believe me, I have seen them and I do believe them. Everything sounds very, very plausible and we have video footage etc.

      Unfortunately circumstantial evidence suggests, that "the Americans" might have lied and fabricated the moon landing (the latest example being the Iraq war. Don't tell me the weapons of mass destruction "found" were not a lie). And that makes me be torn between believing and not believing in it. If you feel attacked by that as a nation, please turn around and take an impartial look at that. Did your government fabricate "evidence" for weapons of mass destruction?

      Btw, if "the Russians" had landed first on the moon, I would probably have the same problems with it, as "the Russians" are not really better in the deception department, as we all know from the Cold War era.

    62. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I am under 30 and I see it happening in our lifetime, in fact, I see it happening within 10 years...

    63. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by tuxgeek · · Score: 1

      I remember the day that Apollo 11 landed on the moon. I remember running home from the community swimming pool to watch Neil Armstrong take the first step onto the lunar surface. That was a very impressive event indeed.

      I was fascinated with the technology of the time. Following all the missions intently, watching the big Saturn 5 launches. Very impressive considering how primitive the computers were then, by today's standards. The near disaster of Apollo 13 and how ingenious the crew were to improvise what they had on hand to survive the 2 week trip to the moon and back with crippled life support systems. Impressive!

      It made me very sad years later to hear younger people in the 90's repeating the retarded bad science theories doubting the accomplishments of the day.

      As another posted above:

      I still remember when Fox News aired their little "moon hoax" series what NASA's response was
      Yes, We Did.
      Don't think that just because we have slathering idiots in the streets that America as a whole has become uneducated. I assure you, idiots breed in larger numbers than smart people in every country.

      So very true

      --
      "Suppose you were an idiot...and suppose you were a member of Congress...but I repeat myself." Mark Twain
    64. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yet we tend to bail out the rest of you when you get into trouble.

      This is generally used as the "USA are the good ones" argument. It has been said so many times, but is simply bogus: 1st, "bailing out" was a side effect when the US protected their own interests - "helping Europe" definitley was nowhere an any agenda; 2nd, they came late and did 1/3 of the anti-Nazi work; 3rd, if anyone bailed out someone, it was not "we", but soldiers 60 years ago who had no idea what was going on; 4th, the US does not "tend to bail out", but sure does tend to start wars and get others in trouble during the last 6 decades; and 5th, taking WWII as grounds for arguing is useless at its circumstances were unique and are not repeatable.

      I'll slap the Minnesotan and shoot the other two! At least we're Americans. Asshats!!!

      Americaaaahhh! Fuck Yeahhh!

      You failed so hard it's sad.

    65. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > and don't tell me that they wouldn't have called us out.

      They wouldn't have called us out, but used it as a pawn in behind the scenes political negotiations.

    66. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      An ad hominem attack?

      The American leadership (like practically every other government) has shown that it is willing to lie to its public in order to achieve military and political goals.

      The moon landings were a huge political victory over the Soviet Union, the foremost enemy of America at that time.

      This isn't an ad hominem attack, it's a perfectly valid demonstration of motive and character. There are many very good logical reasons why you might doubt the conspiracy, but calling this an ad hominem is not one of them.

    67. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Nethead · · Score: 1

      Agree. Back 30 years ago I was only taught evolution in science class... at my Catholic high school.

      --
      -- I have a private email server in my basement.
    68. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by AliasMarlowe · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately the folks obsessed with "disproving" the Moon landings are doing on the premise that NASA faked the whole thing. So any evidence in support coming from NASA would of course be expected.

      As some NASA bigwig said: "In 1969, we didn't have the technology to fake it."

      --
      Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. - Voltaire
    69. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by tcolberg · · Score: 1

      One of my favorite videos as well. Buzz did what we all wish we could do, punch a conspiracy theorist in the face. Also: "Lasers can't even penetrate our navigation shields. Don't they know that?"

    70. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by mi · · Score: 1

      They [the Soviets] would have had the technology to disprove us, and don't tell me that they wouldn't have called us out.

      The only thing, that the Soviets could've done, was to send a Lunokhod to the supposed landing site. But they had enough problems with the program, that aiming it at a particular spot (the range of the Lunokhod proved to be under 40 kilometers/25 miles) would've been a rather unwelcome complication...

      Seriously, why would the no more advanced Soviets have a better technology to disprove what we can't reliably prove? That NASA has lost the original recordings is astoundingly suspicious — had a prosecutor, for example, admitted losing the original evidence and offer the court (easily faked — indeed, embellished in a place well known for some amazing computer-generated imagery) copies instead, the accused would've walked free. Because in courts we apply the reasonable doubt standard, yet, when the same is applied to government's statements, we are full of indignation...

      And I do believe NASA, but I must admit, it smells awful.

      --
      In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
    71. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by CptPicard · · Score: 1

      Europe != Russians.

      Russians really are special, they can often be a rather ultranationalist bunch that feel victimized whenever they don't get to bully others like they would like to.

      --
      I want to play Free Market with a drowning Libertarian.
    72. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by zaivala · · Score: 1

      20+ years ago, "Intelligent Design" HAD no place in the public schools. It has mostly been these last 10-15 years that certain fundamentalist groups have managed to get it added to curriculum, often as favored over natural science.

    73. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by zaivala · · Score: 1

      and it's starting to bug me that my posts gets ratings of 1 or occasionally 2, but everyone who comments on them gets 4s and 5s... LOL if my comments are not that provocative, why are they provoking such good responses?

    74. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Russia=!Europe
      Russi=!Europ
      Russ=!Euro
      Rus=!Eur
      Ru=!Eu
      R=!E

      Got it? Jesus! I tough it was a joke but for Americans every other part of the world can be anything. I wonder if when You all see the earth globe you think "oh America! so blue so beautiful!" MENTAL FAP @ IT'S FINEST (note that being a thirdworld monkey-stole-my-job I know when to use ' maybe thats why they hired me XD)

    75. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      short version of you post:

      "USA!USA!USA! RUMSFELD!!!!"

      This just in! America is becoming the laughing stock for the world to amuse themselves. *facepalm* WWII history rewriting by the history channel is only believed by Americans void of something to make them feel proud LIKE IN THE 2009, THE NAO.

      Now that you have you con ass handed have a nice day :)

    76. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Phase+Shifter · · Score: 1

      They must have done the survey south of the mason-dixon line, because up here in Minnesota, I have yet to meet anyone who believes that garbage.

      About 1/3 of NASA's facilities are south of the Mason-Dixon line. Some of us southerners periodically meet people who walked on the moon.
      Try blaming it on the northwest.

    77. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by tkw954 · · Score: 1

      Wow. The President got hit by a car? I hadn't heard about that.

      No, the president was eaten by wolves. He was delicious.

    78. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dude, 25% of all 18-25 year-olds are fucking moron losers It's been that way for at least 300 years.

      Yes kids, look at you and 3 of your friends. One of you is a loser moron.

    79. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Cstryon · · Score: 1

      You are absolutely right that truly faithful people don't sweat the details. You would think, if they believed so much that God made this universe, or that an Intelligent being of some kind did it, they would give some credit to that being for making life so complex. Making a set of rules, and laws, that all matter and energy follow, so that life and the universe as we know it could exist. I don't need a citation, I do believe you that a lot of schools in the Bible belt do have Creation Science as a class. But it really doesn't belong in the Science class. (If any class, it should be a philosophy class.) Because faith is supposed to be knowing something is true by the spirit of that something, which can't be proven, and shouldn't be physically proven, or else faith is not needed. Science is physical proof. And any sensible person can appreciate that these are very separate schools of thought. To me, if we evolved from apes, fine, in no way is it up to me to say that God didn't plan it that way. Could we have evolved this way, with out a god? Sure! But that doesn't mean we did. I still have faith in my God, so does my family. But we know that we can't ignore that there are laws to nature that have been proven, and theories with very compelling evidence. And those laws and Theories are SO COOL!

      --
      Indoctrinate : to instruct especially in fundamentals or rudiments Educate : to develop mentally, morally, or aestheti
    80. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      CNN just had a front page article where they stated that around 25% of 18-25 year olds doubted the truth of the landing.

      It gets worse: those 25% include 100% of swing-voters.

    81. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by TheTurtlesMoves · · Score: 1

      I know lots of people who grew up on the "wrong" side of the iron curtain and defected. All of them believe in the moon landing. Also I know a lot that came here (Vienna) after the wall came down and also believe in the moon landings.. Sounds like you just meet a crackpot.

      --
      The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
    82. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Kagura · · Score: 1

      It wouldn't have been so bad if Jack Ruby hadn't shot the assassin.

    83. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Chewbacon · · Score: 1

      What do you expect from Fox? You really think they'd present an unbiased piece of shit they call programming (aside the Simpsons, Family Guy and Futurama)? I remember that show and they made some good arguments, but didn't offer any counter arguments against their "hard evidence" that was mostly speculation. And thus FOX NEWS was born!

      --
      Chewbacon
      The Bible is like Wikipedia: written by a bunch of people and verifiable by questionable sources.
    84. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by isaac338 · · Score: 1

      It's hard for people who have spent most of their life being told that "correctness isn't important, so long as you're understood" to have proper spelling and grammar. ;)

      That's what bugs me - correctness is CRUCIAL to being understood. If you use properly-spelled words in correct grammatical syntax the likeliness of you successfully communicating your message goes way, way up. If I have to read it five times to figure out what you're trying to say, it's WRONG.

      Proper spelling isn't that hard, anyways. People are just lazy fuckers.

    85. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by isaac338 · · Score: 1

      What amazes me is that you use the confusion of "it's" and "its" as a sign of actual education. Actual knowledge, instead of (ahem) actual knowledge, like understanding the scientific process, or mathematics, or how to balance a checkbook.

      No, the average person gets to spend about a man-year over the 12 years focusing on things like spelling, because... ? The only thing that makes spelling important is that people who know how to spell use that to insult those of us who don't. It's largely an utter waste of time.

      I'm a natural-born good speller, I haven't used a spell-check in at least a year, and manage to communicate quite effectively via the written word. Yet I think that spelling is a waste of intellectual energy that we could all well do without.

      When you think about it, the confusion is natural. The apostrophe is commonly used to show possession. EG: "That is Bob's shovel.". Yet, as soon as you replace "Bob" with "it" - the apostrophe suddenly disappears. "Don't bother its shovel.". WTF?

      But, just to add confusion, "It's" isn't a possessive "his" it is instead an abbreviation of "it is" which are two words and for which the apostrophe adds very little value intellectually. (Ohz noez! - there's a missing "i"!) The only thing saved is a space. w00t! And there's plenty of evidence that even extreme examples of mis-spelling have virtually no impact on our ability to comprehend the material.

      Personally, I'd like to see spelling dropped entirely - let's just learn the vowel and consonant SOUNDS, and let's use the 1 or 2 man-years saved on REAL education like Science, Mathematics, or how to balance your check book.

      I wud be haapy tu adopt pyerly fohnetik speling.

      Don't be ignorant. In the overall picture, the inability of someone to differ between two similar (but distinctly different) words is a clear sign of their general intelligence.

      Sending people off to a math or science education without giving them a solid foundation in communication is doomed to fail.

    86. Re:yes, I know that you are joking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wud be haapy tu adopt pyerly fohnetik speling.

      Ouch. Thaht mayd meye brayn ihtch.

      Funny enough, though, you just illustrated exactly why phonetic spelling is a bad idea: what is phonetically obvious to you will be opaque to others. Phonetic spelling would have to be standardized, which means it would have to be taught, which kinda puts the kibosh on the whole point.

      And then, of course, there's that little bit about regional dialects...

      I got over spelling reform in my early college years. Learning to spell correctly really isn't that hard--it's just that lamentably few people give a damn.

  10. Is it just me or... by jernejk · · Score: 0, Troll

    did somebody draw the shadows in the wrong direction!?

    1. Re:Is it just me or... by br4nd0nh3at · · Score: 0

      no that is just what photoshop does sometimes, oh wait I mean......

  11. Apollo 16 by somenickname · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Looking at the Apollo 16 landing site, I bet they had a very real "Oh Shit!" moment just before landing...

    1. Re:Apollo 16 by Concerned+Onlooker · · Score: 3, Informative

      Maybe. But if you look at pictures taken towards all four directions from the landing site it doesn't appear to have landed all that close to the edge of the crater.

      --
      http://www.rootstrikers.org/
    2. Re:Apollo 16 by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      Looking at the Apollo 16 landing site, I bet they had a very real "Oh Shit!" moment just before landing...

      You can see the shadow of the lander inside the crater wall. Great landing site though to be so close to a crater.

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    3. Re:Apollo 16 by Attila+the+Bun · · Score: 2, Interesting

      If you've got balls enough to be a NASA astronaut, you don't have "oh shit" moments. Armstrong famously took manual control of the Eagle and landed with just 45 seconds of fuel remaining.

    4. Re:Apollo 16 by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      I was just looking at these pictures and I suddenly got slightly dizzy and started thinking "Holy Shit! We've been to the moon!" I saw the landing when I was very young, and while it was exciting I can't even imagine what older adults were thinking at the time.

      Ok, maybe I need some medicine...

    5. Re:Apollo 16 by mSparks43 · · Score: 1

      Are you trying to say one of these photos is a fake? because these high res images are 1m per pixel, and Apollo 16 is clearly no more than 3 meters away from the edge of that crater. Of course, just because they faked the photos doesn't mean they faked the landings, it just means they spent a shed load of money doing something absolutely amazing, and forgot to wind the camera. It happens.

    6. Re:Apollo 16 by burning-toast · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I imagine it may have been a little bit more tense. (From: http://history.nasa.gov/ap16fj/a16summary.htm)
      (They had other issues before this excerpt too):
      "The descent propulsion system throttle down occurred on time, and at 2200 metres the LM pitched forward into its landing attitude. At this point it became clear that Orion would land approximately 600 metres north and 400 metres west of its target, unless corrective action was taken. Using the guidance computer, John Young redesignated the landing target, effectively telling the landing computer to offset where it was guiding the spacecraft to land. Despite this, it became clear that Orion was going to end up slightly north-west of its intended location. At about 140 metres above the Moon, Charlie Duke saw the shadow of the Lunar Module appear on the surface. As Orion descended below 60 metres, John Young yawed the spacecraft right, allowing him to see the shadow also. This then allowed both the crew to estimate their altitude above the surface and their descent rate. John Young flew the LM slowly forward as the lunar module descent rate reduced from eleven to five feet per second. As a LM descended below 25 metres, small traces of dust were blown across the surface by the engine. This increased as the LM descended to surface but John Young was still able to see craters and small boulders on the surface despite this. Orion landed at ( time), only 270 metres north and 60 metres west of its original target. Charlie Duke greeted their success with an exuberant "Wow! Wild man! Look at that!". John Young was more laconic - "Well, we don't have to walk far to pick up rocks, Houston. We're among them!" "

    7. Re:Apollo 16 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Coming up onto "meteor crater", until you are literally on top of it, you can't see that it's a crater. It just looks like a shallow undulation/hill. Once you breach that, then you see the massive hole in the ground. I suspect the surface shots are suffering from this.

  12. Time to update Google Moon? by FeriteCore · · Score: 2, Interesting
    It may be time to update Google moon soon. It is interesting to compare the quality of the images.

    Come to think of it, it would probably be harder to produce an Apollo-quality fake moon landing than do it for real given 1960 era technology.

  13. Eerie Moon Orbits by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I don't know what the final orbit will be but what I find eerie about lunar orbits is that you should be able to insert something into orbit that is only say 10 miles above the highest peaks, possibly even less, and that would be amazing to watch fly over if one was in the position to be there.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
    1. Re:Eerie Moon Orbits by Will_Malverson · · Score: 5, Informative

      Actually, no.

      The moon is lumpy and thus doesn't have a uniform gravity field. Objects in low orbits are slightly perturbed and don't take very long to hit the surface.

      An object high enough to make the Mascons not matter is also high enough that Earth perturbs its orbit, and again, takes a short time (months, usually) to either get pulled completely out of orbit or hit the surface.

      There are no stable orbits around the moon.

    2. Re:Eerie Moon Orbits by robinesque · · Score: 4, Interesting
    3. Re:Eerie Moon Orbits by Tablizer · · Score: 1

      The article generally suggests that one *could* do what the original post suggested: "cruise" close to mountain tops. However, you need to calculate your orbit carefully, know where the density anomalies are, and have plenty of course-correction fuel.
           

    4. Re:Eerie Moon Orbits by Lumpy · · Score: 3, Funny

      The moon is lumpy and thus doesn't have a uniform gravity field.

      Um NO It's not.

      and I have a very uniform gravity field thank you. Plus I have lost quite a bit of weight. I have not been mistaken for a large moon since high school.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
  14. To update a meme... ;-) by ghostis · · Score: 0, Redundant

    THOSE ARE FAKES!!111 NASA has secret contract with ILM to render hirez MOON photos! I saw it on teh Intarw3bs!

    --


    Computer Science is all about trying to find the right wrench to bang in the right screw. -T.Cumbo?
  15. Photoshopped! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Footpaths? _please_. And the shadow is all wrong.

  16. NASA is the coolest... by tjstork · · Score: 1

    government agency in any civilization, ever.

    Everything they do is cool.

    --
    This is my sig.
    1. Re:NASA is the coolest... by dissy · · Score: 1

      Everything they do is cool.

      In fact, everything they do is about -455 degrees Fahrenheit (-270 C) cool!

  17. Before you look by TheModelEskimo · · Score: 0

    The "Apollo 14," etc. images are not old versions of the new high-res pics, like you might think. Those are the new, "high-res" pictures of the old sites.

    I feel guilty saying this, but a) high-res apparently means two different things depending on which (mars/moon) team you work for at NASA, and 2) for heaven's sakes, the actually low-resolution imagery of the landers themselves is just going to make conspiracy theorists go nuts. It looks like the result of about 5 minutes in GrafX2 and a basic knowledge of the gradient tool...

    1. Re:Before you look by Rebelgecko · · Score: 4, Informative

      The conspiracy theorists won't have too much time to try and explain away the photos because of their resolution; according to the article the LRO isn't in it's final orbit yet so "Future LROC images from these sites will have two to three times greater resolution."

      --
      CATS/Diebold '08- All your vote are belong to us!
    2. Re:Before you look by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      still the landers will be pretty tiny in the photos.

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
    3. Re:Before you look by MrKaos · · Score: 1

      It looks like the result of about 5 minutes in GrafX2 and a basic knowledge of the gradient tool...

      So you admit it's a fake then...

      --
      My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    4. Re:Before you look by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yay. The lander might be two or THREE pixels big.

  18. Religious Right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't those percentages correlate to the same percent of stout Bush supporters? As in the far religious right?

    Flat 6000 year old earth and all....

  19. Oblig by fiannaFailMan · · Score: 4, Interesting

    "As I take man's last step from the surface, back home for some time to come â" but we believe not too long into the future â" I'd like to just [say] what I believe history will record â" that America's challenge of today has forged man's destiny of tomorrow. And, as we leave the Moon at Taurus-Littrow, we leave as we came and, God willing, as we shall return, with peace and hope for all mankind. Godspeed the crew of Apollo 17."

            â" Eugene A. Cernan, Apollo 17 Commander. Last man to walk on the moon, December 14, 1972.

    --
    Drill baby drill - on Mars
    1. Re:Oblig by a09bdb811a · · Score: 1

      Shame about the God talk. Wonder what they'll think of that in a thousand years.

    2. Re:Oblig by Dash-o-Salt · · Score: 1

      Probably about the same they thought about it a thousand years ago, perhaps?

    3. Re:Oblig by CopaceticOpus · · Score: 1

      The tokens "Godspeed" and "God willing" have become generic to the point that they are often used without any religious intent. They can simply mean "good fortune" and "in all humility."

      I enjoyed seeing this quote, as a fan of space travel, and as a borderline athiest. It didn't even occur to me to read it with religious connotations until I saw your reply.

  20. Couldn't they by SnarfQuest · · Score: 2, Funny

    Couldn't they have faked up higher resolution images? Everyone knows that they created all the moon landings on a sound stage. I mean, rockets making it all the way to the moon? Get real! I've played with Estes rockets, and they can't can't go anywhere near that high. If my 1 foot tall rocket could go a thousand feet up, you'd need a rocket several miles high to get anywhere close to the moon. And where are you going to find a rubber band large enough to attach the parachute?

    --
    Who would win this election: Andrew Weiner vs Andrew Weiner's weiner.
  21. Disappointed! by owlnation · · Score: 1

    I can't see any Whalers in the pics! Maybe the Whalers live on the dark side?

    1. Re:Disappointed! by wooferhound · · Score: 1

      Pink Floyd is on the Dark Side of the Moon

      --
      We are Dead Stars looking back Up at the Sky
  22. Is this a joke by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Seriously. Is this a joke? Those pictures are blurred beyond the any recognizability. This is beyond worthless!

    1. Re:Is this a joke by 4D6963 · · Score: 1

      Obvious troll is obvious.

      --
      You just got troll'd!
  23. Big tracks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Aren't they moon buggie tracks and not foot prints?

  24. Re:The way I *sigh*(t) it... by Brian+Gordon · · Score: 1

    Which we apparently don't have. I could take a better picture of the moon with a telescope and a camera.

  25. What, no 12?!? by redirect+'slash'+nil · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I know that 12 is no stranger to coverage troubles, but this had to be one of the most exciting sites, with Pete Conrad and his team gratifying us all with the very first precision landing on the Moon, right next to the good old Surveyor III probe. With a LEM descent stage and a probe sitting close-by on the same picture, it's bound to be a winner.

    Come on NASA; we have now come to accept that the good 11 footage has been destroyed forever - don't deprive us of 12 too!

    --
    Looks like these truths are not so self-evident after all...
  26. Finally, by Attila+the+Bun · · Score: 4, Informative

    that'll shut-up the conspiracy theorists.

    OK, so maybe not. One of the best, and least-quoted reasons to believe that the moon landings were genuine, is the way the dust was kicked up by the astronauts and the lunar rover. It follows a perfect parabola -- something dust in an atmosphere never does. So, NASA might have built a humongous vacuum chamber, big enough to contain a studio... But eventually it becomes simpler to go to the moon for real.

    1. Re:Finally, by Alsee · · Score: 1

      But eventually it becomes simpler to go to the moon for real

      Remember Kennedy's famous speech about the moon program?

      We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy - but because they are hard

      A clear Freudian slip, they planned right from the beginning to fake the moon landings.

      -

      --
      - - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
    2. Re:Finally, by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But eventually it becomes simpler to go to the moon for real

      Remember Kennedy's famous speech about the moon program?

      We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy - but because they are hard

      A clear Freudian slip, they planned right from the beginning to fake the moon landings.

      -

      It wasn't any such thing! He was referring to other science and exploration programs, like the Mariner Program, that while unmanned were challenging and ambitious in their own right.

  27. worst...evidence...ever! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is by far the worst evidence of actual moon landings yet. If anything this will give the naysayers more reason to think the Gov is continuing to pull the wool over everyone's eyes. Come on, a little dot in a grayscale image? I've done more convincing composites of GW's face on a monkey.

    1. Re:worst...evidence...ever! by bmo · · Score: 1

      And this post is the worst evidence that you exist.

      Prove to me that you're not a perl script.

      As a matter of fact, I believe I can replace all anonymous cowards in this topic with a perl script channeling art bell quotes.

      Come on, people can't be this dumb.

      --
      BMO

  28. Shadow Messed Up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The shadow is on the wrong side of the lunar lander.

  29. Re:The way I *sigh*(t) it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    To show the landing sight, would require an observer with very powerful optics imaging the site from forty light years away.
    That sight of the site would then be able to show the landing.

    The best we can hope for is a sight of the landing site as it is now.

  30. And on a related note... by bmo · · Score: 2, Interesting

    40 years after Apollo 11...

    Walter Cronkite is dead.

    And that's the way it was. :-(

    http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2009/07/17/cronkite/

    --
    BMO

  31. Curse you moon crater illusion by AsmordeanX · · Score: 1

    I can never seem to see lunar craters correctly. They always look like domes to me.

    1. Re:Curse you moon crater illusion by haifastudent · · Score: 2, Informative

      Try looking from the side next time.

      --
      Thank for reading to the sig. You may stop reading now. It is safe. There is no more content. Why are you still reading?
  32. Re:The way I *sigh*(t) it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Which we apparently don't have. I could take a better picture of the moon with a telescope and a camera.

    Better than the recent orbiters that have and will be sent up? No. Good enough to see the landing sites? Also no.

  33. I hope... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    they aren't expecting to budge the conspiracy nuts. One thing people need to understand about a TRUE 24k nut - they are starting from an axiomatic position that there is a conspiracy and $EVENT never happened. Any "evidence" to the contrary - such as high resolution images of the landing sites - only serves to illustrate what lengths the conspirators are willing to go to to continue the conspiracy.

    It's like people who don't buy evolution, and view fossils as being there simply "to test our faith." There is no way to convince these people. If they ever get brain scanning down I'll bet they would see that a challenge to a conspiracy nut's fixed ideas would be handled by his/her brain almost exactly the same way most people's brains handle an assertion like "black and white are the same color!"

  34. Who stole the rovers? by aauu · · Score: 1

    Leave a vehicle unattended anywhere in the solar system and it is stolen. We should be able to see the rovers if we can see the footprints.

    --
    When I was young, I had to rub sticks together to compute.
    1. Re:Who stole the rovers? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Leave a vehicle unattended anywhere in the solar system and it is stolen. We should be able to see the rovers if we can see the footprints.

      Of course we aren't able to see individual footprints in these images, just the trails that appear to be hundreds of yards long between the LEM and the site of scientific equipment.

  35. Greatness Questioned by BrightSpark · · Score: 1

    You just have to see how hopeless the great movie houses are when it comes to replicating the moon environment to know it was no hoax. With all the millions at their disposal just watch as TV churns through Moonshot and Apollo hysteria this week and get not even close to it. Plus the eyewitness testimony of thirty people, scientists among them not to mention the unique moonrock samples with mineral forms you don't get on earth, which I have personally seen under microscope. It seems to be a condition of elements of the American public to disbelieve their own government, even when they acheive one of the greatest accomplishments of our or possibly any generation. The vision, tenacity and bravery of those people in your nation is something best not forgotten or questioned.

  36. Lost Tapes Not Lost by wooferhound · · Score: 2, Insightful

    So . . . The lost tapes aren't really lost, they are up on the moon waiting to be rewound and copied to a DVD disc.

    --
    We are Dead Stars looking back Up at the Sky
  37. Six Landing sites by MrKaos · · Score: 1

    I can't understand how anyone at the time could look at all six landing on the moon as anything short of amazing as opposed to mundane. It sure says a lot about the differences of the times. I look at the landing sites and think that everyone of those is as important as the first moon landing. I wonder if the attitude towards the moon program would have been then if they'd have known how complacent and cynical people would become.

    Back then they had all the promise of what the future would be like. Who knows maybe in another forty years time the world will be they way the thought it would be forty years ago.

    How sad that we have wasted so much on petty struggles.

    --
    My ism, it's full of beliefs.
    1. Re:Six Landing sites by Scutter · · Score: 1

      I can't understand how anyone at the time could look at all six landing on the moon as anything short of amazing as opposed to mundane.

      I wonder if they would have felt the same if they had known there would only be six and then at LEAST another 40 years before the next one. I suspect it became "routine" because everyone just assumed we'd have vast moon bases by now.

      --

      "Tell me doctor, with all of your defenses, are there any provisions for an attack by killer bees?"
  38. Re:The way I *sigh*(t) it... by bytesex · · Score: 1

    Well, let's quickly send one out, then !

    --
    Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
  39. H3h3 by Amiralul · · Score: 1

    Should dis b3 a prooof? Everybodi knowz pics can be easily faked than acshual moonlandingz. NASA used Photoshopped, wtf, peoaple, can you see it!!?11?!

  40. For a second I thought I'd have to believe... by Cur8or · · Score: 0

    the landing was real. A few smudges on a jpg isnt going to change my mind anytime soon. I'll believe when I get to visit the moon (when it isnt full). By then they'll be able to virtual reality/Matrix me into believing I am on the moon(or earth).

    --
    Winkey shortcut mapping for 64bit windows. WinKeyPlus
  41. KennJohnsen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The delay in communication is far to short, to be between the Moon and the Earth........so there is your prove that they were not on the Moon.....simple as that.

  42. Shadows by shafty023 · · Score: 1

    Anyone else notice in the Apollo 11 image the shadow from the lander is going in the wrong direction? WTF. It just makes you wonder if their photoshop experts have a freakin brain inside their skulls

  43. The best explanation I've found so far... by avhell · · Score: 1

    is that the landing was faked by a studio on the moon