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Big, Beautiful Boxes From Computer History

Slatterz writes "We might sometimes complain about the limitations of today's technology, but there's nothing like seeing photos of a 27Kg hard drive with a capacity of 5MB to put things into perspective. PC Authority has toured the Computer History Museum in California, and has posted these fascinating photos, including monster 27Kg and 60Kg drives, and a SAGE air-defense system. Each SAGE housed an A/N FSQ-7 computer, which had around 60,000 vacuum tubes. IBM constructed the hardware, and each computer occupied a huge amount of space. From its completion in 1954 it analyzed radar data in real-time, to provide a complete picture of US Airspace during the cold war. Other interesting photos and trivia include some giant early IBM disc platters, and pics of a curvaceous Cray-1 supercomputer, built in 1972. It was the fastest machine in the world until 1977 and an icon for decades. It cost a mere $6 million, and could perform at 160MFLOPS — which your phone can now comfortably manage."

238 comments

  1. Nice photos... by Archaemic · · Score: 5, Informative

    Although these photos don't include the functional replica of Babbage's Difference Engine #2 that's currently at the museum, and leaves in a few months. I was just at the museum two weeks ago. It was pretty interesting. There's also an exhibit about the history of chess computation. Apart from those two things though, most of the museum is a big room full of old computers. I wish there were more to see there, but what is there is pretty interesting. I recommend going before the Babbage Engine leaves in a few months if one gets a chance.

    1. Re:Nice photos... by Archaemic · · Score: 2, Informative

      Er, sorry, scratch that. There are a few photos of it. There was a repeat photo in the gallery and thought I had gone through all of the photos.

    2. Re:Nice photos... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Seems to be /.ed - I can't see anything past the difference engine.

    3. Re:Nice photos... by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 1

      Functional? The joke's on them. It seems that a vital gear was surreptitiously removed and placed "on display" by the Computer Museum's jealous curators.

    4. Re:Nice photos... by johnny+cashed · · Score: 1

      I thought the photos were really small, at 700x525. Thanks guys, for telling us about a museum filled with old non-working computers with knobs, switches, and dials and you give me tiny photos.

    5. Re:Nice photos... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They should have used an Apple QuickTake from 1994.

    6. Re:Nice photos... by Archaemic · · Score: 1

      Judging from the labeling, those parts are from the first replica, which is in London. This is the second replica. I saw them operate this one, so I'd hope it's functional.

    7. Re:Nice photos... by plisskin · · Score: 1

      Except for here and here.

      Going through these photo's make the equipment at my old job look hi-tech! They have a 10MB hard drive that must have weighed at least 20kg - although I only saw it used once to update some y2k code in 1999.

    8. Re:Nice photos... by Ksevio · · Score: 1

      It is a very impressive machine to see run, and would have been a great use in it's day.

      However, for something that was suppose to be a completely accurate machine and stop problems of errors, it didn't impress me as much since it got the results wrong. Guess it's pretty complicated to setup.

    9. Re:Nice photos... by macraig · · Score: 1

      Huh? There's no fewer than five: photos 30 through 34.

    10. Re:Nice photos... by niktesla · · Score: 1

      If you go to see the Babbage Difference Engine, make sure to go when they demo it. They only crank it a few cycles each day to keep from constantly having to oil it. There's just something beautify about that nice "chunk-clunk" sound that it makes as each column resets and the carry arms spiral around.

      --
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  2. ahh by Dyinobal · · Score: 4, Informative

    I love BBW errr I mean BBB.

    1. Re:ahh by AioKits · · Score: 1

      You have no idea how disappointed I was when I found out that the entire article was actually SFW. With the phrase 'big beautiful boxes' I was kind of hoping for some shots of Ada Lovelace someone just uncovered and released to the public.

      --
      "Quote me as saying I was mis-quoted." -Groucho Marx
    2. Re:ahh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      i think bbw is more pc. Usually calling a woman the b word doesnt go over very well.

    3. Re:ahh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Seems like more of a Mac thing to me, really.

  3. These photos... by Sawopox · · Score: 2, Insightful

    are pretty impressive. It is amazing how much smaller and faster the equipment has become. What is alarming is the rate at which the raw materials are being pulled from the Earth then discarded, usually right after the two year contract expires.

    --
    [http://it-tastes-so-good.blogspot.com] Are you hungry?
    1. Re:These photos... by moon3 · · Score: 1

      Thanks to Mr. Transistor.

    2. Re:These photos... by Culture20 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What is alarming is the rate at which the raw materials are being pulled from the Earth then discarded, usually right after the two year contract expires.

      Materials discarded, but a whole lot easier to acquire than via mining, smelting, etc.

  4. What kind of dumbass captions are these? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    " The Enigma machine was used during world War Two - it gives more than a trillion possible combinations for a single number, making it impossible to decrypt letters encoded with the Enigma. The big silver piece next to it is a part of the Colossus - a British code-breaking computer."

    The writer obviously doesn't know what he's talking about and didn't bother to read any text associated with that display, if he thinks Enigma was unbreakable. Especially since the parts of Colossus were specifically for breaking Enigma. Further, "more than a trillion" is a ludicrously imprecise figure, why couldn't he at least look up a more accurate figure (10^23 according to Wikipedia)?

    1. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by gregben · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Most of the captions are chock full of
      factual, grammatical, and spelling errors.
      Sad, because this sort of codswallop is
      propagated to the unknowing public and
      difficult to correct once "out of the bag".

    2. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by mwvdlee · · Score: 3, Informative

      As I understand it, a big reason why Enigma was succesfully broken is because some of it's users kept using the same "keys" for it.
      Had the germans used the Enigma how it was meant to be used, it might not have been broken at the time.

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    3. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by Hal_Porter · · Score: 1

      this is why the National Corpse of Pendants needs new recruits.

      If only there was a good way to attract the attention of pendants so that they could be recruited.

      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    4. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The writer obviously doesn't know what he's talking about and didn't bother to read any text associated with that display, if he thinks Enigma was unbreakable.

      IIRC, it was essentially unbreakable. The only way they doped it out was by capturing one, reverse engineering it. Only then, with that knowledge in hand, could they decode the messages.

      That's substantially different from "breaking" the raw code.

      OTOH, maybe that was the Japanese code machine I'm thinking of.

    5. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by Plunky · · Score: 3, Funny

      Just dangle a caret in front of them what have you got to loose?

    6. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by tomrud · · Score: 4, Informative

      As I understand it, a big reason why Enigma was succesfully broken is because some of it's users kept using the same "keys" for it.
      Had the germans used the Enigma how it was meant to be used, it might not have been broken at the time.

      They (the code breakers) could also use "known plain text" attacks quite a lot. Many operators tended to use the same greeting phrase over and over again. In addition, the Germans sent their weather reports encrypted. The British Navy could easily check the weather and get even more "known plain text".

      --
      For a nice date: Call strftime(3C)!
    7. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by Anti_Climax · · Score: 1

      Better still, they could rule out known plain texts if the message was created on an enigma with a reflector rotor as a letter could never be encoded as itself.

      --
      Even people that believe in pre-destiny look both ways before crossing the street.
    8. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by Ciggy · · Score: 5, Interesting

      A lot of work was done on breaking Enigma BEFORE WWII - by the Polish.

      The wheel wirings had been discovered (whether by fair means or foul - ie capturing the actual wheels - I can't remember). Enigma was basically hacked^Wcracked by using the fact that a lot of the German messages had key, crib phrases at the start or end of the messages, and that no letter could encrypt to itself. It was Bombes which were the set the task of finding the starting position of the wheels given a possible crib match.

      The German Navy used an enhanced enigma machine which used 4 instead of the normal 3 rotating wheels and so was harder to crack. That was helped by the capture of the settings books (about 2 years before the US entered the war).

      It was the Lorentz cypher, as used by Hitler and the high command, was the cypher that was decrypted with the aid of the Colossi. A Lorentz machine was bult at Bletchely Park by modifying a British cypher machine.

      Bletchley Park is well worth a visit to see the reconstructed Colossus and the computing museum - it was most odd to see the computers I used as a wee lad in the museum.

      --

      A rose by any other name would smell as sweet;
      A chrysanthemum by any other name would be easier to spell
    9. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by hughk · · Score: 4, Informative

      Noooo!!!!

      Colossus was developed for breaking cryptographic material (Fish) from Lorenz telex style stream ciphering machines (Tunny). Enigma was broken by the Bombes which were more mechanical in nature.

      All quite clear if you visit Bletchley Park in the UK, the rather lower budget British museum of cryptography and computing. Both the Colossus and Bombe reconstruction projects were run out of BP and if are lucky you can get a talk on their operation from Tony Sale or one of the other builders.

      --
      See my journal, I write things there
    10. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Soldiers tended to use obvious encryption keys like "HITLER" which made cracking Enigma even easier.

      --
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      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    11. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by commodore64_love · · Score: 2, Informative

      >>>if he thinks Enigma was unbreakable.

      Well let's look at history. Where the British able to break Enigma? NOPE. They had to literally steal a machine before they could read Germany's encrypted orders. So the author was correct when he said Enigma was an unbreakable code.

      --
      "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
    12. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by CnlPepper · · Score: 1

      mussstttt.....ressssiiisssstt.....

    13. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What the... what kind of poem is that? With your line breaks, I kept looking for some sort of cadence, a rhyme - hell, even a Burma Shave! What a disappointment.

    14. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by mcgrew · · Score: 2, Funny

      Ann ewe no your write, two. Owl wise ewes a spill chucker!

    15. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What the...where's the "-1 Made it up in their head" option? First of all Engima machines did not work that way, for a start. Second of all the sending & receiving end have to agree on the cypher, which is why the operators had cypher books which told you which keys to use for that particular task/day: the German high command certainly did not just throw a bunch of obvious cyphers into a book.

    16. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by Ciggy · · Score: 3, Informative

      IIRC the method to encrypt was to get the relevant wheels in the relevant order, set the key letters, insert into machine, use the initial setting, and plug up the letter swaps - these were changed on a daily basis. The operator then chose a 3 character key for his message and typed this in twice to create the first 6 characters of the encrypted message; finally, the wheels were reset to the operator's chosen key and the message encrypted.

      On receipt, the daily initial setting was set up and the first 6 characters of the message entered whereupon the key should come out twice (allowing transmission errors to be spotted...and also allowing a weak spot for breakers).

      The operators, having to send lots of messages tended to get lazy and use sequences on the keyboard, eg if they had been using the QWERTY keyboard, they would use keys like: QWE, QAZ, WSX, ZAQ, XSW, EWQ, etc.

      --

      A rose by any other name would smell as sweet;
      A chrysanthemum by any other name would be easier to spell
    17. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by R2.0 · · Score: 1

      " The card punch portion of the Hollerith Census Machine. For the 1990 census, there were slots to record what farm equipment was present, what lighting was used in the home, and the usual number of people in the household, among other piece of data. "

      1990? And there's no punch for Indoor Plumbing?

      That's our government - IT always a few decades behind the cutting edge.

      --
      "As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
    18. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by houghi · · Score: 1

      It proves that security is a process, not so much a technical solution

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    19. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by ncc74656 · · Score: 2, Informative

      The operators, having to send lots of messages tended to get lazy and use sequences on the keyboard, eg if they had been using the QWERTY keyboard, they would use keys like: QWE, QAZ, WSX, ZAQ, XSW, EWQ, etc.

      Since we're talking about Enigma, "QAZ" would've been "QAY." Enigma used the QWERTZ layout, which is fairly common in German-speaking countries. (It also moved P from the upper right to lower left, presumably to simplify the mechanical design.) A pretty good photo of an Enigma is here.

      --
      20 January 2017: the End of an Error.
    20. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by ncc74656 · · Score: 1

      Dammit.../. ate my link. Let's try again...Enigma photo here.

      --
      20 January 2017: the End of an Error.
    21. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by euxneks · · Score: 1

      Bletchley park was, in all senses of the the word, awesome. I truly and fully recommend going to see it. Being a computer scientist, I would have to say it was akin to visiting a holy place - very cool. The bombe machine was very photogenic and the collossus reproduction was fantastic.

      --
      in girum imus nocte et consumimur igni
    22. Re:What kind of dumbass captions are these? by hitmark · · Score: 1

      different branches of the german military had different routines, with the army being the worst, and the u-boat arm of the navy being the best, iirc...

      --
      comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
  5. Favorite quote by phantomfive · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Magnetic core memory came in a range of sizes. It replaced vacuum tubes entirely by about 1960, and was extremely cheap to produce - from $1 per bit initially, to 1c per bit by the mid-60s.

    Crazy, but in those days, no one ever used more than 640 bits of memory. True story.

    Direct link to photograph, in case you want to see a range of core memories, which, incidentally were great because they didn't lose their values in a power outage:

    http://www.pcauthority.com.au/Gallery/153867,computer-history-museum-photo-gallery-weird-fascinating-photos-including-a-giant-cray-and-a-60kg-hard-drive.aspx/40

    --
    Qxe4
    1. Re:Favorite quote by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Crazy, but in those days, no one ever used more than 640 bits of memory. True story.

      Do you want to say they did not solve differential equations that time?

    2. Re:Favorite quote by temcat · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure if you're joking or not (because I see some subtle reference to "640K ought to be enough for everybody" in your post,) but I know for a fact that at least Soviets did use larger volumes of magnetic memory. The design bureau that my dad still works at produced magnetic memory for Soviet strategic missile defense systems back then.

    3. Re:Favorite quote by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      Crazy, but in those days, no one ever used more than 640 bits of memory. True story.

      I have an instruction manual from a machine a few years more recent, describing the 'Simple Code' programming interface it had, which provided a restricted instruction set and a few limitations, including the limit of 150 instructions per program. The manual explains that this is unlikely to be a problem, because any program longer than 150 instructions would be impossible to debug.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    4. Re:Favorite quote by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The manual explains that this is unlikely to be a problem, because any program longer than 150 instructions would be impossible to debug.

      And they were right! Seriously, when was the last time you saw program that was both completely bug-free and signficantly longer than 150 instructions?

    5. Re:Favorite quote by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      Given that a C program that calls printf("hello world"); is more than 150 instructions if you include printf, every day? And what makes you think the programs under 150 instructions of Byzantine 'Simple' Code were 'bug free' as opposed to 'sufficiently bug free to work'?

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    6. Re:Favorite quote by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 1

      What makes you think that printf("hello world") is bug free? My version of libc is 6.2.7-10. As indicated by that huge revision number, your call is invoking code with a decades long history of bugs and fixes. There are certainly many more bugs to be discovered.

      At any rate, did you remember to check the return value?

    7. Re:Favorite quote by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Crazy, but in those days, no one ever used more than 640 bits of memory. True story.

      Around 1969, I was running an IBM 1460 with 4K of memory. A couple of years later, I remember seeing an IBM 360/65 upgraded from 128K to 256K. Parts all over the floor -- yellow tape around the area, the whole megilla.

      All of this was core memory, strung on yellow wires. I saw a neat movie (yeah, pre-video) of the threading operation. Somewhat like a loom, but the cores were portioned out onto white plastic trays which were mechanically jiggled until all the cores settled into their slots. Then a device came in from the side pushing a straight, insulated wire through a line of cores. then doubled back to pick up the next row. Same for the vertical columns, then a third time for the sense wires.

      Someone in the class asked if they ever missed a core. Yes, they sometimes did, so that core plane was no good.

  6. 5 meg @ 27 kilos by acehole · · Score: 2, Funny

    Going off of those standards, the thumbdrive sitting on my desk should weigh 22,118.4 kilos.

    Double that because i've got two.

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    Be you Admins? nay, we are but lusers!
    1. Re:5 meg @ 27 kilos by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      I wonder how long before MP3 players fit in your ear like a hearing aid? Probably not long, I'll guess.

    2. Re:5 meg @ 27 kilos by Mostly+a+lurker · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It is worth noting that the disk drives at the museum are not first generation. An original IBM 350 weighed over a ton! It had a capacity of about 4.4 MB and a peak transfer rate a little over 8KB per sec. It is amazing to realize that a modern consumer 2TB drive has the capacity of about 400,000 IBM 350 drives and a transfer rate over 10,000 times faster.

    3. Re:5 meg @ 27 kilos by ari_j · · Score: 1

      Yo momma so fat, the government uses her as a counterweight for the 2 megabits of memory in their new computer.

      R.I.P., Obsolete Yo Momma Joke of the Past.

    4. Re:5 meg @ 27 kilos by Pentium100 · · Score: 2, Informative

      You mean something like this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBwM2U77F2c

    5. Re:5 meg @ 27 kilos by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      I kinda doubt it, as the control interface would suck. It seems to me that thumbstick size seems to be most popular, now price is what it getting smaller. My first true MP3, as opposed to the MP3 CD player, was a 64Mb Lyra which IIRC cost me close to $70 bucks. Checking out at the Walgreen's yesterday they had 1Gb thumbdrive based MP3 players in a rainbow of colors for a whole $14. At the rate that flash capacity is going up I wouldn't be surprised to see 12-16Gb stick style MP3 players for the same price in 5 years or less.

      To me that is the amazing part, the price and not the size. My Commodore VIC20 with the extras cost me nearly $600,and took me all day to program a simply breakout style game, and just a few months back I built a really nice dual core with 8GB of RAM (which is 4 times the amount of HDD space on my first IBM compatible) for less than that. The way the power just keeps going up while the price just keeps getting cheaper is just nuts. lately I have been building bottom of the line dual and quad core PCs for my customers and all they can do is rave about how crazy fast the PCs are today when compared to the older single cores they are replacing. Computers really have past the "fast enough" aways back and now it looks like power and efficiency will be the next great leaps. It is just amazing how far we have come in such a short period of time.

      --
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    6. Re:5 meg @ 27 kilos by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      You could have the control in your pocket and wireless ear buds. Ot have it voie-activated.

    7. Re:5 meg @ 27 kilos by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      Yeah, that would be fun, having folks screaming out band names and looking like crazies in places with high noise. Kinda reminds me of that old joke though "We should be those wireless phone headsets for the crazy homeless guys that talk to themselves. It would seem less threatening and make them look normal!"

      But most tech has already reached the "too damned small" stage as it is, the last thing we need is MP3 players joining the list. Hell my GF can't find her cell half the time as it is, I can imagine everyone having to get on the floor and feel around like they do for a lost contact because someone's earbud popped out. And who actually WANTS shit to be that tiny anyway? I mean, is there anybody actually going "You know, this phone at a whole 3oz is just too big! Look, I can even use my fingers to push the buttons! What I need is a phone so damned small I have to use a pencil eraser just to dial a number, and that is so damned tiny that I'll never find it again if I lose it! Yeah, that'll be great!" because honestly that person ain't me.

      That is why I'm sticking to my nice boring Sandisk M260. 4Gb of flash storage, built like a tank, and only plays MP3s. Oh and runs for 27+ hours on a single triple A battery, so if I am walking down the street and the battery dies I can walk into any convenience store and be back on the road in under 2 minutes. With 64k encoding (which is about as good as I'm gonna hear on those little earbuds with traffic noise as I walk) I have something like 57 hours worth of tunes and haven't actually reached the halfway point on the storage yet. This thing is already just slightly bigger than a cigarette lighter and carries all these tunes, so honestly how small do we really need?

      --
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  7. Re:This stuff is so cool by Mr.+Roadkill · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...until you plug it in, at which point you'd better pray you've got adequate cooling.

  8. Spell check to the rescue by tyrione · · Score: 1
  9. From the advent of the personal computer by phantomfive · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Here was an interesting one, an old PC with a monitor in portrait format. It asks why they didn't catch on, and I'm not sure I know the answer. It seems like it WOULD be better, especially because you could look at an entire page on the thing. Now with 21 inch monitors I can do that anyway, but what was it that caused our landscape monitors to become standardized like they are?

    Also, check out the keyboard on this beast! Not QUERTY. Not DVORAK. Who thought that would be a good idea?

    --
    Qxe4
    1. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      The French.

    2. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by cowbutt · · Score: 3, Informative

      Here was an interesting one, an old PC with a monitor in portrait format. It asks why they didn't catch on, and I'm not sure I know the answer. It seems like it WOULD be better, especially because you could look at an entire page on the thing.

      Some contemporary monitors can be rotated between landscape and portrait orientations; the Lenovo L220x, for example. It's a feature that's more popular in pre-press organisations.

    3. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by rubies · · Score: 3, Interesting

      ...because in use they aren't terribly functional. One of the secretaries I used to work with back in the eighties had a Radius portrait display on a Mac II - it was awful as seeing the whole page at a time was far less important than seeing what was on the page clearly. Print Preview pretty much killed portrait monitors stone dead.

    4. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by KokorHekkus · · Score: 4, Informative

      Also, check out the keyboard on this beast! Not QUERTY. Not DVORAK. Who thought that would be a good idea?

      That's a french Minitel terminal (their videotex system, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel). The telephone company gave people free terminals if they would forgo printed telephone books. Remeber, this was the early 80:s so there must have been enough people with less than stellar keyboard skills who'd rather peck away on a ABC-keyboard than hunt around on a AZERTY-keyboard if given the choice. But I'm pretty certain that most terminals had the french standard AZERTY keyboard (here's the Minitel 1 http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6d/Minitel_1.JPG )

    5. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      Portrait monitors became popular when desktop publishing software first appeared. The high resolution monitors were pretty expensive and used non-standard resolutions and proprietary graphics adapters (back then VGA 640x480 16 color graphics was the standard), and the market was primarily publishing houses. Most of the portrait monitors were monochrome monitors with limited consumer appeal. When color desktop publishing took off most professionals got large landscape format color monitors and were able to view two pages simultaneously, side by side.

    6. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Jeff+DeMaagd · · Score: 1

      I really don't know, but there are several monitors that can pivot. If you have a VESA monitor, you can remove the stand and put it on a VESA arm in a portrait manner.

      I think I'd rather have more than one program side by side, monitors in portrait mode are a bit too narrow. I would like taller monitors though, 1.6:1 screens are a little too short for me in landscape. I dunno. Maybe some day I'll try two 24" screens in portrait mode, the screens are pretty cheap these days. That would be helpful since most web pages seem to require a lot of vertical scrolling, a taller screen should mean less scrolling.

    7. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      interestingly, there's a guy that sits two desks from me at work who has three monitors - one is portrait. you can still get 'em: http://www.compucon.com.au/lcd/AOC919Pwz.htm

    8. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by antifoidulus · · Score: 1

      Quite simply because being able to view portions of two pages simultaneously side by side is much more useful than viewing large portions of a single document.

    9. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Fred_A · · Score: 2, Informative

      Also, check out the keyboard on this beast! Not QUERTY. Not DVORAK. Who thought that would be a good idea?

      That's a french Minitel terminal (their videotex system, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel). The telephone company gave people free terminals if they would forgo printed telephone books. Remeber, this was the early 80:s so there must have been enough people with less than stellar keyboard skills who'd rather peck away on a ABC-keyboard than hunt around on a AZERTY-keyboard if given the choice. But I'm pretty certain that most terminals had the french standard AZERTY keyboard (here's the Minitel 1 http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6d/Minitel_1.JPG )

      I've seen pretty much every Minitel deployed including a number of those used in restricted releases prior to nationwide deployment and I don't remember ever seeing one with a non standard French keyboard.

      Those things were rather kludgy with their using an X25 network at a snail's pace (1200/75) which was more or less sufficient for "enriched" text, although watching pages being drawn was still painful.

      A number of people created BBS systems for them through the POTS, avoiding the (expensive) Minitel network altogether.

      Oddly enough, there apparently are some people that still use them. The train ticketing, phone book, and a number of other services are still up and in use.

      Alphabetical keyboards are evil. People who can't type will still hunt for keys, and people who can type no longer can. It's a stupid idea.

      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
    10. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Fred_A · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I really don't know, but there are several monitors that can pivot. If you have a VESA monitor, you can remove the stand and put it on a VESA arm in a portrait manner.

      Any monitor can do that as long as it has a VESA compliant attachment at the back. Then it's only a software issue.

      What's nice is a monitor that can pivot on its own stand (typically in that case it can also twist and swivel, be raised and lowered). Although to lower costs a lot of makers only offer crappy stands on all but the very high end models these days. My Dell 24" can pivot on its stand (it can mess the numerous connectors a bit though).

      It's less convenient if it's stuck in just one position. Although I don't pivot it all that often... 1200 vertical pixels is usually enough.

      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
    11. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by tsadi · · Score: 1

      I find this one very interesting also. However the caption lacks any information or keyword that might allow one to search for more information on what that device is.

      Or maybe my Google-fu just failed me? Any of the experts here know what that thing is?

    12. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Anti_Climax · · Score: 1

      It seems like it WOULD be better, especially because you could look at an entire page on the thing. Now with 21 inch monitors I can do that anyway, but what was it that caused our landscape monitors to become standardized like they are?

      It probably had to do with the desirability of reading fewer but full lines of output instead of reading additional lines that were truncated, wrapped or created with a smaller character set. Once we got to GUIs running on bitmapped monitors where portrait orientation was a useful feature for page layout, they started to come back in a niche fashion. There was at least one CRT I've seen that could rotate 90 degrees on its stand and there are several LCDs available right now that do the same.

      --
      Even people that believe in pre-destiny look both ways before crossing the street.
    13. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hmmmm.... Looks like it's a huge Whooosh going over most people's heads. Your humor is just a little too obtuse.

      I like it.

    14. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      a monitor in portrait format. It asks why they didn't catch on, and I'm not sure I know the answer

      Because they are designed for humans. Humans, baring injury, have two eyes next to each other, meaning that they see clearly in a region described by the overlap of two ellipses, which is a lot wider than it is tall. Putting a page in the middle of a wide monitor and floating palettes around the side is a much better use of the human visual system. You'll find a number of HCI papers from the '80s describing user studies related to this, if you look.

      The reason that monitors used 4:3 aspect ratios for so long is even simpler: TVs used a 4:3 aspect ratio and it was possible to build up economies of scale quickly by sharing components with TV set manufacture. A lot of the early computer monitors were lower resolution and not any higher refresh than a TV, although they quickly became non-interlaced, which is part of the reason eye strain was such a problem.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    15. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by jeffb+(2.718) · · Score: 3, Informative

      Here was an interesting one, an old PC with a monitor in portrait format. It asks why they didn't catch on, and I'm not sure I know the answer. It seems like it WOULD be better, especially because you could look at an entire page on the thing. Now with 21 inch monitors I can do that anyway, but what was it that caused our landscape monitors to become standardized like they are?

      Since the 1970's, and possibly earlier, computer monitors have piggybacked off TV technology, which first standardized on the 4:3 ratio and later moved to 16:9. The 4:3 ratio was a compromise between picture-tube technology, which wanted to present a circular face, and the material presented, which tended to be wider than it was tall.

      Why is that? Well, it's they way we're used to seeing our world and the things in it. The human visual field is wider than it is tall, because the things we're looking at tend to be spread out more horizontally than vertically. Your food and your enemies are likely to be at approximately the same level as you are (standing or growing on the ground), so it's better to be able to take in more information from the space "around" you than from the space "above" (which is likely to be empty) or "below" (which is likely to be close, and therefore smaller and less occupied).

      Printed matter in Western languages, though, especially code, tends to occupy a relatively narrow width and extend further in the vertical direction. That's why writers and coders want taller monitors, and that's why the relentless drive to "wider", that is, more squat aspect ratios is bad news for the computer field.

    16. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 1

      Alphabetical keyboards pop up from time to time. Incidentally, the French use Azerty keyboards. A keyboard that lacks accented keys is rather difficult to use in some countries.

    17. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 1

      The single page monitors were probably replaced by two page monitors, as those were more useful for designing page spreads. For a while, pivot monitors that could be changed from widescreen to full page mode were common.

    18. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 1

      Does 1152 * 870 count as landscape?

    19. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by eriks · · Score: 1

      That's the processor for a Cray-3 -- Cray's Last project before the company went bankrupt, not because the Cray-3 was a bad design (it wasn't) but because there was falling demand for supercomputers.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cray-3

    20. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Try using a portrait monitor sometime. For most things it's a pain. We're used to arranging things more or less horizontally in front of ourselves, not vertically.

      It IS handy for document editing though. My monitor rotates to either orientation. When not writing a long document, guess which one it stays in.

    21. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by DragonWriter · · Score: 1

      Here was an interesting one, [pcauthority.com.au] an old PC with a monitor in portrait format. It asks why they didn't catch on, and I'm not sure I know the answer. It seems like it WOULD be better, especially because you could look at an entire page on the thing. Now with 21 inch monitors I can do that anyway, but what was it that caused our landscape monitors to become standardized like they are?

      The answer is because while "portrait" is very good for print page design at common print page sizes and orientations, its not a real natural viewing size for most other things (your field of vision is wider than it is tall), which is why TVs and movie screens are wider than they are tall, and why 4:3 monitors were dominant and 16:9 are increasingly dominant. Monitors with dimensions ideal for full-size single-page portrait layour were, for a while, somewhat popular with people doing page layout -- though even pricier, larger monitors sized and dimensioned for two-page side-by-side layout (which wouldn't make the monitor a "portrait" shape), were also popular for that.

      Also, once LCD monitors became common with graphics drivers that support on-the-fly orientation changes, it was easy for people who would benefit from a dedicated portrait-orientation monitor to instead get a monitor which could be used in either the more typical landscape orientation or portrait orientation, and which could switch on the fly between them (I've actually got a 20.1" LCD that does this); since the essential hardware difference between these and an equivalent portrait-only device is a swivel on the stand, rather than a completely different, case--and because you can use them better for tasks where portrait orientation isn't convenient, broadening the appeal--they have a lot less of a relative cost premium vs. the dominant landscape or widescreen LCD devices than portrait-orientation CRTs did vs. the more common designs when CRTs ruled the earth. Also, now that really big screens are relatively inexpensive, there's less that portrait orientation is really a big benefit for, anyway.

    22. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 1

      Print Preview? If you had a large enough monitor, you wouldn't need to use "print preview". Besides, it's not exactly a new feature.

    23. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Oh no, the sad thing is that I actually took the time to check it before submitting, thinking, "I better check this to make sure no one makes fun of me if I make a stupid mistake." Thus once again proving that it does nothing to test your work. Release it the first time, don't worry about bugs.

      --
      Qxe4
    24. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by metalwheaties · · Score: 1

      Also, check out the keyboard on this beast! Not QUERTY. Not DVORAK. Who thought that would be a good idea?

      Having worked for Alcatel in the .COM boom time, I can tell you it's completely within character for them to build something cockamamie and then force it to be popular by dint of their market position. They're the French telecomm version of Microsoft, after all!

    25. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by jeffb+(2.718) · · Score: 1

      Try using a portrait monitor sometime. For most things it's a pain. We're used to arranging things more or less horizontally in front of ourselves, not vertically.

      For that matter, we now expect to be able to "arrange" more than one "thing" on our screen at once, and move between multiple applications/documents/etc. In the late 1980s, it was all most machines could do to let you edit one document at a time, and running more than one program at once was a stunt, not a workflow.

    26. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by bhtooefr · · Score: 1

      Because a landscape display is better for other types of document handling, for starters.

      Also, anything a portrait display can do, a landscape display can do two of. I have a 22.2" widescreen LCD, which was sized to show two letter or A4 documents side by side at 204 PPI. No good way to display two portrait letter or A4 documents side by side on a portrait display...

    27. Re:From the advent of the personal computer by Misagon · · Score: 1

      The 4:3 ratio precedes the television by far. It has been used for movies since Dickson, Edison and Eastman introduced the 35 mm film format in the 1890's.

      --
      "We mustn't be caught by surprise by our own advancing technology" -- Aldous Huxley
  10. Kg? by __aagctu1952 · · Score: 1, Funny

    including monster 27Kg and 60Kg drives

    So can anyone explain to me what exactly a Kelvin gram is, and how it relates to hard drives? I'm guessing something to do with heat capacity...
    Oh, you meant kilogram?
    k = kilo
    K = Kelvin
    It's not rocket surgery, people. And it's something that should be caught by Slashdot's "editors" before it goes up on the main page.

    1. Re:Kg? by Seth+Morabito · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Where the heck is the "-1: Pedantic" button when you need it?

    2. Re:Kg? by dbIII · · Score: 1

      So can anyone explain to me what exactly a Kelvin gram is

      Easy. A Volkswagen multiplied by a Library of Congress per football field.

    3. Re:Kg? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Obviously Kg=1024 grams.

      Don't you know anything about computing?

    4. Re:Kg? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fuck me. +5 Informative? There's some stupid mods around today.

    5. Re:Kg? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ummm, in Australia, where PC Authority would appear to be based, Kg refers to kilogram. Not that I'd rant at you for your misunderstanding.

    6. Re:Kg? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      I kindly suggest you go get laid.

    7. Re:Kg? by jimmydevice · · Score: 1

      Only an experiment in natural language processing on one of those early 60's machines would parse that like you did.
      This is of course, before the card that patched the bug was added to the deck.
      Are you running with a full deck?

    8. Re:Kg? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, what a cunt.

    9. Re:Kg? by noidentity · · Score: 1

      including monster 27Kg and 60Kg drives

      So can anyone explain to me what exactly a Kelvin gram is, and how it relates to hard drives? I'm guessing something to do with heat capacity...

      Well, since KB is a kibibyte, these are probably just measured in kibigrams (1024 grams = 1 kibigram). Remember, this was a long time ago before marketing got into the act. Ahh the good old days...

    10. Re:Kg? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      who the fuck modded this stupid comment informative? please Colonel Sponsz, do the rest of humanity a favor and kill yourself. or at the very least, don't EVER reproduce. make sure your stupid gene stops with you. it must really suck to be you.

    11. Re:Kg? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      -1 Troll at best.

      I agree with AC above me, it must really suck to be you.

    12. Re:Kg? by tehcyder · · Score: 4, Funny

      quit looking for petty little excuses to look like a fuckhead and look out of the window instead. see, it's pretty out there!

      You do know you're posting on slashdot? We hate Windows.

      * RIMSHOT *

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    13. Re:Kg? by Kjella · · Score: 1

      Well, since KB is a kibibyte

      Are you playing "taunt the pendant"? The buttugly kilo-binary-byte is abbriviated KiB, but yes it's with a capital K.

      kB, MB, GB, TB, PB... you can let the base 2 vs base 10 fans battle to the death but kilo is an odd exception to the rule.

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    14. Re:Kg? by bakes · · Score: 1

      There are times when a modicum of pedantry, politely applied, is useful in providing an important correction or 'tweak' to an otherwise accurate post.

      Of course, this is not one of those times. GP is a dick.

      --
      Ho! Haha! Guard! Turn! Parry! Dodge! Spin! Ha! Thrust!
    15. Re:Kg? by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      Gaven't you noticed that the "g" and "b" keys are pretty close together?

    16. Re:Kg? by noidentity · · Score: 1

      Yes, taunting the pedant (was trying to be funny, but oh well). And yes, I hate the kibbles-and-bits SI unit too. The way I like to resolve the issue in a formal way is to say that KB, MB, and GB are units in their own right, rather than a mere combination of a prefix and units of bytes. Thus KB is the name of a unit of measurement that denotes 1024 octets, MB denotes 1048576 octets, and GB denotes 1073741824 octets. These shouldn't be confused with kB, which is the prefix "kilo" and unit of bytes, which means 1000 bytes. kb of course means 1000 bits. This nicely resolves the issue for me, without any hand-waving, and without naming things after dog food. :)

    17. Re:Kg? by noidentity · · Score: 1

      Err, except that the mega and giga SI prefixes are capitalized as M and G, so MB and GB would be ambiguous under my explanation. Oh well.

  11. Re:This stuff is so cool by phantomfive · · Score: 1

    No kidding, did you check out this insane piece? It's like a rats nest but needs to be immersed in coolant to run. Smaller than a desktop computer, too.

    --
    Qxe4
  12. Leo, the tea-shop computer by mister_dave · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I recently read A Computer called Leo, which tells a story of post WW2 computer development in the UK.

    The thing that stuck me most was the long cylinders of mercury used as memory, (mercury delay lines).

    1. Re:Leo, the tea-shop computer by mbone · · Score: 1

      The thing that struck me the most was what they did to Alan Turing.

    2. Re:Leo, the tea-shop computer by TheRaven64 · · Score: 3, Informative

      Lots of machines from that era had strange ways of storing data. A few used flip-flops as registers a bit later, but for main storage (at least, until magnetic core memory came in) they typically used something like that. Another popular method, for example, was to display something on a CRT, which caused a change in charge on the screen, and then read back the charge. The charge only lasted a fraction of a second, but it was long enough to draw the entire contents of the screen and then redraw it by reading back the charge.

      If you visit Manchester University's computer science department then you'll see a 2KB magnetic core memory in one of the corridors. It's about the size of a wardrobe, and you can see how each individual bit was stored. The first computer my university bought used this kind of memory, and allocated 200 bytes to lookup tables for addition and multiplication. Neither of these were handled in hardware; if you wanted to add two numbers together, you looked up the address in the lookup table constructed by combining the two digits, read the result (if the overflow bit was set you then did the same process with a one and the result of the next digit) then moved on to the next digit. The machine used 6-bit bytes, each of which stored a decimal digit with some condition codes. Words were variable-length, with one of the values being reserved as an end-of-word marker. Everything was stored in little-endian format so that you could add arbitrary-length numbers by adding their digits together in pairs until you got to the end-of-word marker for one and then just copy the digits for the other. Adding two numbers together could take several hundred instructions; not an inconsiderable length of time given that this was an era when computer speeds were measured in thousands of instructions per second. Runtimes for nontrivial programs were measured in hours.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  13. It's sad that none of it works by Animats · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The sad thing about the Computer Museum is that almost nothing there works. The Difference Engine replica is about it, and that's entirely mechanical. Some people tried to restore an IBM 1620 back in 1999, but they never got it working.

    It's almost the last computer museum, too. The ones in Boston, San Diego, and Germany went bust. There's one still open in Bozeman, Montana. There are a few others which are just stuff in storage. That's about it.

    The history of this field disappears very fast.

    1. Re:It's sad that none of it works by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > It's almost the last computer museum, too. The ones in Boston, San Diego, and Germany went bust.

      What?

      http://en.hnf.de/

      Also, earlier this year I was in the Boston Museum of Science and they had quite a bit of old computer tech there (including a HUGE HDD platter like on the pics in TFA).

      (captcha: fetish)

    2. Re:It's sad that none of it works by Dadoo · · Score: 3, Interesting

      There's one still open in Bozeman, Montana.

      I've been to the one in Bozeman. It looks cheesy on the outside, since it's in a strip mall, but it's actually pretty cool. It's also more a museum of information technology, than a computer museum (since it starts out with stone tablets), though they do have a lot of old computer equipment.

      Surprisingly, the coolest part isn't the computer equipment; it's the Gutenburg press. They actually have original stock (paper) that, unlike most museums, they allow you to touch. Very cool.

      --
      Sit, Ubuntu, sit. Good dog.
    3. Re:It's sad that none of it works by hughk · · Score: 1

      Bletchley Park is still hanging there. It has bits of various machines such as Atlas onwards (sorry to say that I used the Atlas many, many years ago in its last year of operation). It even has a PDP-11/34 and a MicroVAX. The latter machines, I believe are complete and working.

      --
      See my journal, I write things there
    4. Re:It's sad that none of it works by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In Switzerland, there's a foundation comitted to bringing old computers back to life. Their collection is not as impressive as the CHS' but they still have machines from the sixties and an almost complete collection of Silicon graphics machines ! They show the machines up and running in public exhibitions.

      http://www.memoires-informatiques.org/?en&home&open=&closed=&sponsors=yes

    5. Re:It's sad that none of it works by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As odd as it sounds, it strikes me that computer museums and would-be computer restorers, could learn a lot from train enthusiasts. No, really. People have been rescuing, restoring & maintaining thousands of steam, diesel and electric trains for over fifty years now (at least here in the UK). They've developed processes and methods that allow them to strip a loco back to nuts & bolts and put it back together again, fully functional. They're also very good at attracting volunteers. I suspect that some of the methodologies may actually transfer across...

    6. Re:It's sad that none of it works by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      I know of two 1620s that have been restored to working condition, so there's hope for this one. We have the main control panel for the 1620 my university used to own (the machine was scrapped, but one of the technicians took the panel as a souvenir and then returned it when we started the history of computing collection). I'm hoping that we can get an undergrad project set up to wire it to a 1620 emulator and make it into a working museum exhibit.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    7. Re:It's sad that none of it works by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Huh? The Heins Nixdorf computer museum (which calls itself the biggest computer museum in the world) in germany is still around if you meant that:

      http://www.hnf.de/default.asp

    8. Re:It's sad that none of it works by Vidar+Leathershod · · Score: 1

      What's really sad is that they are nothing like a real museum, in that apparently they can not even afford to pay for shipping of computers to them. I was in possession of something of a classic piece of computer history. But spending my money to ship it to them after taking so much time to preserve it over the years did not appeal to me. Housing this thing had not exactly been a popular proposition. Also, they only wanted the computer itself, and not the display or keyboard. This told me they never intended for it to be a functioning unit, as it did not use common parts for these. Note that this was not a huge unit, it was about the size of a late 1980's or early 1990's workstation.

      Sad, really. The place must just be an old junkpile of computers, which is not really a museum.

      --
      The brains of a chicken, coupled with the claws of two eagles, may well hatch the eggs of our destruction.
    9. Re:It's sad that none of it works by cayle+clark · · Score: 1

      There are several working restorations at CHM. (1) That 1620 definitely works, I've seen it run. They interfaced a PC to replace the console typewriter, but otherwise it ran. (2) there is a complete, working PDP-1 that is demo'd every month, you can play the orignal spacewar game on its vector CRT, and last Christmas they had a carol sing with PDP-1 synthesizer accompaniment. (3) There is a complete 1950s-era machine room with raised floor containing two complete 1401 systems, along with working 026 keypunches, 085 sorter, and tape drives. These are demo'd monthly also. (4) The restoration of the IBM RAMAC, the original hard disk drive, is nearing completion and should be on display later this year.

      All the above proceed slowly because they are 100% volunteer-run. They get minimal funding from CHM and only minimal help from the small paid staff. It takes tens of thousands of donated hours to get one of those old machines running and debugged. There are a myriad of age-induced problems, for example dried-up electrolytic caps, corroded contacts, hardened bearing grease and cracked or flattened rubber rollers, which introduce hard-to-trace problems.

      If you live anywhere near Mountain View and know something about one of these machines, your help (or money) would be welcome.

    10. Re:It's sad that none of it works by cayle+clark · · Score: 1

      The CHM is very definitely a "real" museum. It takes as its purpose, the collection and preservation of artifacts and documents. Also as with most real museums, the part on display to the public is a tiny fraction of the whole collection, which comprises some 30,000 cataloged artifacts and even more documents. 99% of those are in a rather amazing warehouse in Milpitas, CA.

      Far from being a junkpile, every artifact from single vacuum tubes or circuit boards up to the massive cabinets of the Zuse, is photographed, cataloged and stored on shelving in a climate-controlled space.

      Most of the collection is pieces of computers because that's what people and companies donate, often discards and salvage.

      Like that 360/91 console that features in the photographs? There is only the console panel; you go around back of it, and see thick bundles of yellow wires that were hacked off with a bolt-cutter when the machine was scrapped. Those lights will never blink again. So, should it be thrown out, or is there some value in preserving and displaying the hacked-off panel?

    11. Re:It's sad that none of it works by sootman · · Score: 1

      Due to how technology advances, and the fact that most of what they have was not produced in huge quantities, it would be a HUGE undertaking to make any of it work and maintain them. Sure, it'd be nice if they ran*, but as it is the CHM is an incredible resource. It's an awesome place and there is great value even in just seeing the items and a brief writeup of them. Plus it's cool. Seeing truly iconic machines, like Crays, and giant computers that look like what you saw in the complex in War Games is truly geek nirvana. And the docents (museum guides) are great--without them it'd still be neat but they add SO much. It will be a real shame when these guys are gone. If you're ever in the Bay Area it's definitely worth a drive. It's like your grandparents--go see it (and them) before it's too late!

      * then again, the true legacy of these machines is that they all advanced the state of the art. As TFSlideshow says, the power of the Cray 1 can now be found in your cellphone. For most of them, I'd be happy a) to hear/see the mechanicals spin up in a realistic fashion and b) an emulator hooked up to a display to simulate it running.

      --
      Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
    12. Re:It's sad that none of it works by sootman · · Score: 1

      Not sure about that. Do diesel locomotives have wiring like this?

      --
      Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
    13. Re:It's sad that none of it works by Colin+Douglas+Howell · · Score: 1

      > It's almost the last computer museum, too. The ones in Boston, San Diego, and Germany went bust.

      Also, earlier this year I was in the Boston Museum of Science and they had quite a bit of old computer tech there (including a HUGE HDD platter like on the pics in TFA).

      He's thinking of the old Computer Museum in Boston. Actually, the Computer History Museum was created by people who were dissatisfied with the Computer Museum, after its focus had shifted from computer history to public education about computers. But since there's less of a compelling reason for that latter role to be filled by a museum, it's no surprise to me that the Boston museum went under.

    14. Re:It's sad that none of it works by Colin+Douglas+Howell · · Score: 1

      Most of the collection is pieces of computers because that's what people and companies donate, often discards and salvage.

      Like that 360/91 console that features in the photographs? There is only the console panel; you go around back of it, and see thick bundles of yellow wires that were hacked off with a bolt-cutter when the machine was scrapped. Those lights will never blink again. So, should it be thrown out, or is there some value in preserving and displaying the hacked-off panel?

      Indeed, for the Cray and Control Data supercomputers they have, there's no way you could hope to get a working machine. Those systems belonged to national defense labs, and when they were discarded, federal law required them to be disabled thoroughly enough to make it impractical to get them working again. Of course, I imagine that a group of dedicated people with enough time and resources could resurrect one, but it would be a huge task. Not to mention that the running and maintenance costs would be very high, worse than when the system was new. The Computer History Museum doesn't have the resources for that, and their focus is on preservation and documentation, not on reviving dead machines.

      To me it seems more practical to revive these systems through accurate simulation on modern hardware.

    15. Re:It's sad that none of it works by metalwheaties · · Score: 1

      The sad thing about the Computer Museum is that almost nothing there works.

      I work with the young man who shot holes in the first Amdahl prototype they have there. He was Gene Amdahl's grandson, and he used it for (.22?) target practice in the family basement according to the docent I was talking with. I have never asked Saxon about this, but I bet he did it.

    16. Re:It's sad that none of it works by vaporland · · Score: 1

      One of the first computers I ever saw up close was an IBM 1620 donated by Philip Morris to the Mathematics and Science Center in Glen Allen, Virginia. This was about 1970 - it had a clickety-clackety typewriter console and was attached to a rather large IBM punch card reader, and could print off cool Snoopy calendars on an IBM 1403 printer.

      Around the same time, I was in a group of fifth-graders on a field trip from the Math-Science Center that was given a tour of a SAGE computer located at Fort Lee, Virginia. The entire 3-story block concrete building WAS the computer. We saw the technicians monitoring East Coast air traffic in a dimly lit room, the giant drum storage unit, and a room filled with thousands of "radio tubes" - some as big as water cooler bottles.

      The technician giving the tour told us that more than a hundred tubes a day would blow, but that the technology was very reliable and this was why it was not replaced (at the time).

      We toured a nuclear power plant, a chemical research lab, even a water treatment plant. There was a big motor home with 12 GE Termi-Net printers that would visit local schools (the "Mathmobile") and dial into the HP 2000 Time Sharing minicomputer system to give math and BASIC programming instruction.

      For an 11 year old kid, it was all really amazing.

      --
      Ask Me About... The 80's!
    17. Re:It's sad that none of it works by Animats · · Score: 1

      Not sure about that. Do diesel locomotives have wiring like this?

      Yes. That's the power electronics for a 150 ton Diesel-electric mining truck. Modern locomotives have similar gear, but I can't find a picture quickly.

  14. You would think they could have gotten this right. by bezenek · · Score: 5, Informative
    The caption on one of the photos (Image 30) reads:

    The highlight and centrepiece of the Museum - The Babbage Engine. It's a replica, made in the British Museum using the original as a template.

    This is not a replica of an original. The machine in the British museum was built by a team using Babbage's note. No original was ever built, as Babbage could not get funding for the project. The machine at the Computer History Museum (as pictured) is the second built by the same British Museum team who built the first.

    If you want to see it, it will be at the CHM until December 2010, at which time it will be moved to the home of Nathan Myhrvold, the person who paid for its construction.

    -Todd

    --
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico.
  15. Re:This stuff is so cool by interkin3tic · · Score: 1

    Very cool indeed. Back in 3rd grade, I really wanted a Cray. I remember thinking when I grew up I could have a garage out back and fill it with the worlds MOST POWERFUL COMPUTER! I saw one up close and personal in a museum in france, had to tease it with my cell phone.

    Some of those machine calculators are pretty awesome, but I really like the fact that we have now come some type of odd circle, and now we have games where we can virtually build something similar.

    Also, I've seen this picture before. Two questions: one, is it real. Two: please tell me the steering wheel is to avoid computer crashes.

  16. Re:This stuff is so cool by El+Lobo · · Score: 4, Funny
    I can imagine, 15 years from now, an article showing "Big beautiful boxes from the 2000s" a big "portable" Acer Aspire 5536G which a weight of 1,2 Kg inclusive batteries (wow, would some users from the future scream in awe) (Oh, I remember THAT one, comments another). Oh, look at that iPhone: you needed A POCKET to carry that thing!...

    Oh well...

    --
    It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!!
  17. The CDC 6600 console by MacroRodent · · Score: 1

    That CDC 6600 console with the two round screens must be the weirdest-looking real-life terminal device ever built! The whole thing looks like a robot face. I wonder what the screen resolution was...

    1. Re:The CDC 6600 console by jimmydevice · · Score: 2, Informative

      The CDC display was vector, not raster and I'm thinking it was 10 bits in both axis.
      It was refreshed by the I/O processor.
      It had a great lunar lander game.

    2. Re:The CDC 6600 console by dbIII · · Score: 4, Funny

      I see what you mean:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:CDC_6600_console.JPG
      I think on first sight I would have to fight the urge to back away slowly out of the room.

    3. Re:The CDC 6600 console by toQDuj · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Also notes that it has a big red "emergency off" button in case it revolts against mankind.

      B.

      --
      Every experiment which ends in a big bang is a good experiment.
    4. Re:The CDC 6600 console by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You would have freaked even more if they were running the early version of a screensaver they used to have which drew "eyeballs" on each tube and moved them back and forth.

      I cut my programming teeth on 6400s in college and 6600s and Cyber 174s in my first couple of jobs.

    5. Re:The CDC 6600 console by ianmkz · · Score: 1

      The two circular displays suggest some bizarre colour organ interface. Alas no, just boring old monochrome text. http://www.mentallandscape.com/Computer_CDC.htm

    6. Re:The CDC 6600 console by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The CDC 7600 console had an ash tray built in.

    7. Re:The CDC 6600 console by jeffb+(2.718) · · Score: 1

      Yep. They were vector displays, and while they normally just displayed vector-sketched character data, they could show arbitrary vector graphics. As I recall, one of the eyes would wink.

  18. Good Ole Days by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That brings back a lot of memories. Back then, we used to put our desks on top of the computer.

  19. CDC by solanum · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Seeing that old gear is great. It's amazing the ingenuity used in the 40s and 50s.

    My mother-in-law used to program a CDC, which always seems quite crazy as she can't even use SMS on her phone! Of course in those days doing punch cards was so tedious men didn't want the jobs. It would be interesting to compare the ratios of female:male programmers and correlate it with the improvement in tech over time.

    --
    Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
    1. Re:CDC by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      and the erroding of programming skills

    2. Re:CDC by earlymon · · Score: 1

      Of course in those days doing punch cards was so tedious men didn't want the jobs. It would be interesting to compare the ratios of female:male programmers and correlate it with the improvement in tech over time.

      You bring up an interesting point.

      Moving forward in time from that point, we also had an era where women topped IT departments because the preponderance of males in business at the time understanding business machines were from accounting and considered IT beneath them for purposes of advancement - but it allowed levels up for women blocked by the glass ceiling (source: Datamation magazine from before 1984 per when my subscription ran out).

      After that, women were advancing in the military and were just as likely to be assigned to computer-related stuff (research as well as admin) - let's put that somewhere in late 80s (source: my life).

      After that, in the mid 90s, women were found to lead major software initiatives for government projects with practical applications for the DOE and DoD (source: my life - for several years, three full layers of supervision above me were all-female).

      After that - the big boom and the .dot com craze, where I experienced in life a sudden drop in women candidates for programming and IT jobs I've offered.

      Spin forward to the 2ks, (i.e., today) and now all I hear from women is that I'm an old dinosaur who has no idea of the barriers women face in marketplace and that I'm an obvious chauvinist because I choose to work in a male-dominated field (oh yes - we manly men of data analysis in the '70s, the scourge of college bullies everywhere! (And the possible beginning of the idea that a good paycheck buys many guns and martial arts lessons. OK, that part didn't work that way for me. I think I'm being funny/insightful on that last bit. Hey. I admitted it.)).

      So, personally, I've not seen tech changes that I can personally correlate to the female presence. What I did see with skirts in *some* work environments was a welcome reduction in immature language use (by the non-programmers, per usual) and at other work environments an unwelcome touchy-feely set of communication rules (no raising your voice when someone fucks up a program (programmer being male or female) because the women would tremble (weak women, there, specifically).

      So, women's participation in the biz has waxed and waned over time. So has tech, but in any way I can correlate.

      I can say this: in times with a commonality of women in our workplace, I've enjoyed being the guy that was smart, handsome, sensitive, witty and getting lots of work-related tail by accepting women as equals (I do).

      In times without that commonality, I'm the backwards geek, the older version of the guy living in his parent's basement who will never grow up and understand that women are equals.

      So - there you have it. Women programmers and IT types improve tech. No fucking question about it.

      --
      Pathological kinda promises Path + Logical - but instead, you get stuck with pathetic.
  20. I remember being inside a Sage by tinrobot · · Score: 3, Interesting

    When I was in high school, my computer class did a field trip to one of the sites. It was a two story building, with each floor the size of a department store and filled with aisles and aisle of racks filled with vacuum tube processing modules. The had disk had a drum the size of a small trash can. Even at the time (late 70's) the guy giving the tour said the computer could be replaced by one the size of a phone booth. These days, a few hundred of them could fit into something the size of a phone.

    1. Re:I remember being inside a Sage by vtcodger · · Score: 4, Informative

      ***Each SAGE housed an A/N FSQ-7 computer, which had around 60,000 vacuum tubes. IBM constructed the hardware, and each computer occupied a huge amount of space.***

      The sites had two computers, not one. The switched between them once a day so they could check all the vacuum tubes on the off line computer -- of which I'm pretty sure there were only about 6000. Mostly they were 6SN7 dual triodes so there were actually about 12000 switches in each computer. Memory was 68K by 32 bits wide, and software was continually swapped in from drums in the background. Instruction cycle time was 6 microseconds. The specs weren't vastly different from a 1980s IBM PC with 256K of memory.

      The software was written in assembler and was speced to accept digitized radar from 16 sites, support 40 or 80 (can't remember which) consoles, track up to 300 aircraft simultaneously, control dozens of manned interceptors plus unmanned Bomarc interceptors, communicate with four or five adjacent sites digitally, and some number of manual sites via teletype, and some other things. And it actually did most of that. (I think it maxed out a little below 200 simultaneous tracks). Try THAT on a 8088

      In general, the software -- which cost a fortune -- worked. Not perfectly, but better than Windows and Office.

      And, yes, SAGE needed a lot of air conditioning. The lights in parts of Santa Monica used to dim momentarily when the air conditioning at the RAND System Reseach labs development facility started up.

      *** It was a two story building***

      It was a four story building. And the computers were on the second floor only. Another floor held something like 40 (80?)desk sized consoles -- each with a fairly large display, a light gun (closest thing today would be a mouse), and a button panel. Other floors held offices, Telco equipment, etc. The consoles were used to monitor target tracking, control interceptors, etc. There were also a half dozen or so regional command centers -- also with AN/FSQ7s that were configured a bit differently.

      --
      You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
    2. Re:I remember being inside a Sage by Skweetis · · Score: 1

      ***Each SAGE housed an A/N FSQ-7 computer, which had around 60,000 vacuum tubes. IBM constructed the hardware, and each computer occupied a huge amount of space.***

      The sites had two computers, not one. The switched between them once a day so they could check all the vacuum tubes on the off line computer -- of which I'm pretty sure there were only about 6000. Mostly they were 6SN7 dual triodes so there were actually about 12000 switches in each computer. Memory was 68K by 32 bits wide, and software was continually swapped in from drums in the background. Instruction cycle time was 6 microseconds. The specs weren't vastly different from a 1980s IBM PC with 256K of memory.

      Great post! The article is sorely lacking in interesting details like these about the old computers pictured.

      I can imagine the power and cooling requirements for a computer like this; older octal-base dual-triode voltage amplifier tubes need a fair amount of heater current, as the heaters run at 6 volts. Those tubes also tend to be noisy and susceptible to mechanical interference (the newer 9-pin 12**7 dual-triodes are really much better, the more fragile connecting pins aside); I wonder if you could cause a processing error by tapping on the tubes with a pencil eraser? Maybe not, discrete components of digital computers operate in on/off states, so they handle external interference pretty well.

    3. Re:I remember being inside a Sage by cybergrue · · Score: 1

      The pictures of the SAGE doesn't do it justice. It had some really cutting edge features for the 1950s, including a GUI accessed via a light gun and an ashtray (both built in).

    4. Re:I remember being inside a Sage by Pentium100 · · Score: 1

      older octal-base dual-triode voltage amplifier tubes need a fair amount of heater current, as the heaters run at 6 volts.

      A lot of vacuum tubes use 6.3V for heater, probably because it was easier if all the tubes used the same voltage, so you didn't need separate windings on the power transformer to accommodate different tubes. A lot of high current diodes used 5V for heater, I don't know why, but since a lot of them had cathodes connected with the heater (for indirectly heated tubes), you still needed a separate winding, so it could be of different voltage.

    5. Re:I remember being inside a Sage by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I belive the tubes were specially designed computer valves.

      they are a little different to normal ones as...

      the mu curve does not matter as they are either on or off. mechanical noise is thus not a problem.

      they have to be able to stand being driven into saturation (digital 1) for weeks on end if required, so must have low anode emissions. As 'on' is saturated, electrical noise is minimal too.

      The biggest improvement to reliability, in common with all the old valve computers, is just to leave it on, so no problems with thermal cycles or cathode stripping.

      SAGE also had built in valve testers! I think the process was automated, so the computer could effectively check it's own valves. it would run them at a number of different voltages from their normal operating points for the test. this would reveal which ones were ageing and needed replacement.

    6. Re:I remember being inside a Sage by Skweetis · · Score: 1

      A lot of 5V rectifier diodes are that way because they were evolved from a 4-pin type 80 (a 5Y3 is actually pretty much a type 80 with an octal base), which had a 2.5V/10-watt heater. 4 amps was probably too much for an octal base, so the voltage was doubled. The 6.3V standard was developed initially for automotive applications; cars had 6V batteries at the time. I suspect that you're right; that since a directly-heated rectifer required a separate transformer winding anyway, nobody worried too much about having 5V and 6V secondaries, rather than two 6V secondaries. It wouldn't really change the manufacturing cost of a power transformer either way.

  21. Re:This stuff is so cool by Jurily · · Score: 3, Interesting

    15 years is not that much. We already had Pentiums in 1994. The article is about a time when CPU cycles were more expensive than programmer time and text data took a lot of space.

    The UI itself hasn't got significantly better since Windows 95. (Hands up if you would actually consider using a graphical interface without a task bar.)

  22. Re:You would think they could have gotten this rig by Jeff+DeMaagd · · Score: 1

    It is a tricky linguistic problem. This probably doesn't happen often, where the designer never gets to make one but someone makes long afterwards. It's not a replica in the conventional sense, but I don't know what other word would describe it better than that.

    Is there any information on what this thing cost to make? Was it in the millions? several tens or hundreds of thousands?

  23. Re:You would think they could have gotten this rig by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    Correct - but also note that it was the Science Museum in London that build the replica - not the British Museum (also in London). The British Museum houses collections of cultural artifact and history from around the globe (it's in Great Russell Street in the Bloomsbury area of London, and is well worth a visit if you ever get the chance). The Science Museum is in Cromwell Road in the Kensington area of London, and specialises, as you might guess, in the history of science and technology from the year dot to the present time - also well worth a visit.

  24. Wow by John+Pfeiffer · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I think I've seen one of those 27 kilo HDDs before. I volunteered at a local computer recycling program, and among many usable machines, they'd get old stuff that we were to dismantle, and separate into different kinds of materials for disposal. The one I saw was an IBM, and the outer housing for the HDD was roughly the shape and size of a washer or dryer. The host machine was similar but twice as long. It had an 8-inch floppy with what I think was some kind of auto-loader. I think, all told, it had hookups for THREE 220V circuits. (Two on the host, and one on the HDD) I wanted to get one of the drive platters for myself, but the best I could do was the 'Unit Emergency' killswitch off the host computer. (I had set aside the control panel from the host machine, but didn't have room to take it home that day, and someone tossed it.)

    Also, holy crap. I never knew silicon wafers came from hugeass things of silicon like that, I always assumed they were made more or less in their final wafer form artificially from smaller pieces. o_O I guess it makes more sense that they're cut from massive homogeneous chunks of solid silicon.

    I wish they had a better shot of the RCA tube memory. I've seen pictures of those before, the dies look cool in a vacuum tube like that. They look very intricate, like miniatures of space station solar panels or something, heh. (Like the die in an EPROM, but MUCH bigger)

    --

    Friend: "The NIC is misconfigured..." Me: "No prob, I'll just telnet in and fix it." *Silence*
    1. Re:Wow by smellsofbikes · · Score: 1
      >The one I saw was an IBM, and the outer housing for the HDD was roughly the shape and size of a washer or dryer.

      Old Hewlett Packard removable-media hard drives looked almost exactly like clothes washers. You swung the door open and removed the write medium, and replaced it with another. One interesting thing about them was the platters were so heavy the entire drive would jerk slightly when the disc was spun up, and those drives were *heavy*. A lot of momentum. Hewlett Packard Fort Collins Colorado had an entire room filled with them, like 50 of them, networked together to form some reasonable (gigabyte-ish) amount of storage for the facility. Some very bright engineer reasoned that if the whole drive assembly moved noticeably when spun up, it might be possible to repeatedly turn the drive off and on, at its mechanically resonant frequency, and get the whole drive to move, like a clothing washer with an out-of-round load. Then he networked the code. So for a couple of days, every morning people would come into the plant and the hard drive room door wouldn't open because several thousand pounds of hard drives were all jammed over in that corner of the room.

      >I never knew silicon wafers came from hugeass things of silicon like that, I always assumed they were made more or less in their final wafer form artificially from smaller pieces.

      Silicon wafers are getting larger, even as we're putting more stuff on them. Back in the day they were about 40mm in diameter (and several meters long, carefully sawn into discs.) Now I have a 200mm diameter wafer sitting on my desk, and it's old technology.

      --
      Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    2. Re:Wow by PhunkySchtuff · · Score: 1

      Completely off topic here...

      Friend: "The NIC is misconfigured..." Me: "No prob, I'll just telnet in and fix it." *Silence*

      I'm not sure if you're being ironic here or not, but that statement isn't as stupid as one might think. I've been admining Solaris systems for years and what you mention there is exactly what you would do. Telnet into the Remote System Console (RSC) and you are on the console of the machine (no fancy framebuffer here) where you can do everything you would were you sitting in front of the machine with a keyboard and a display. You can power it on and off. You can soft and hard boot it and you can definitely telnet in and sort out the settings on the NIC.

      The good old days of the Happy Meal Ethernet interface (hme)...

  25. Yeah, I programmed the SAGE ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    Yeah, I programmed the SAGE in the late 50's. It did crazy stuff: Imaging talking to remote radars connected via a phone line? You're kidding, no? Modems the size of a small bus.

    Got audio by monitoring the 1's and 0's cycling a particular register bit, and since the SAGE was a dual machine, some local talent had one playing right and left hand boogie-woogie.

  26. What would Jobs say? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Can you imagine the design meetings? "Good lord, who was it that decided 50 kilo chassis would be in vogue this year!?"

  27. Re:This stuff is so cool by Hal_Porter · · Score: 3, Informative

    Also, I've seen this picture before. Two questions: one, is it real. Two: please tell me the steering wheel is to avoid computer crashes.

    http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/hoaxes/computer.asp

    Although the photograph displayed could represent what some people in the early 1950s contemplated a "home computer" might look like (based on the technology of the day), it isn't, as the accompanying text claims, a RAND Corporation illustration from 1954 of a prototype "home computer." The picture is actually an entry submitted to a Fark.com image modification competition, taken from an original photo of a submarine maneuvering room console found on the U.S. Navy web site, converted to grayscale, and modified to replace a modern display panel and TV screen with pictures of a decades-old teletype/printer and television (as well as to add the gray-suited man to the left-hand side of the photo)

    --
    echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
  28. Re:This stuff is so cool by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    The article is about a time when CPU cycles were more expensive than programmer time and text data took a lot of space.

    That's about when I started -- punch cards and all. Maybe two or three turnarounds a day. Before sending a program in to run through the assembler, we were expected to sit there and "play computer", going through all the operations of all paths through the programs before "wasting time" on the big iron.

    Mind you, this was in the afternoon. The mornings were spent cutting down redwood trees, tapping rubber trees and mining graphite, copper and zinc so we could fabricate our own pencils for the afternoon's work. The real hotshots didn't make programming mistakes, so they could skip tapping the rubber trees for use in making pencil erasers.

  29. Re:You would think they could have gotten this rig by bezenek · · Score: 1

    Is there any information on what this thing cost to make? Was it in the millions? several tens or hundreds of thousands?

    I was at the talk which Nathan Myhrvold gave (he paid for it) at the opening ceremony for the exhibit. He did not give a figure, but my impression was $10 million (US) or more. Nathan did make a comment about the ridiculous cost of shipping it via air from the UK to the US. :-)

    -Todd

    --
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico.
  30. Re:This stuff is so cool by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Hands up if you would actually consider using a graphical interface without a task bar.

    You mean a wm/desktop environment?

    The application menu in System 7 was the evolution of the System 6 switcher and the OSX dock is an improvement the concept. Openbox and other lightweight WM's install without a taskbar. I have one machine where I've removed the xfce tasklist, relying on minimised application icons instead (Minimised apps icons are the only use I have for the desktop).

  31. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 4, Funny

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  32. Bad histor in there... by serviscope_minor · · Score: 3, Informative

    IBM did not invent pipelining as the captions suggest. It was invented by Zuse, 20 years earlier.

    --
    SJW n. One who posts facts.
  33. Re:This stuff is so cool by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    The UI itself hasn't got significantly better since Windows 95

    Windows 95 == Mac 85!

  34. Re:You would think they could have gotten this rig by tialaramex · · Score: 2, Informative

    It _is_ a replica, but just not in the way you imagined.

    The (British) _Science_ Museum has (or had) a workshop for building Difference Engine No. 2. This is the second one, built by replicating the first. They can't build one by following Babbage's plans, because his plans are wrong in subtle ways, and had to be corrected. One of the things the Science Museum gained by making the first one was a _correct_ set of plans for the machine. If you have a lot of money and want a Difference Engine, I have no doubt that the Science Museum would start up that workshop again and build another replica for you too.

  35. Re:This stuff is so cool by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Very cool indeed. Back in 3rd grade, I really wanted a Cray.

    The one at the CHM is neat. they let you look into the center of the circle. Pretty amazing -- the thing is a rat's nest of cables draped from one segment of the machine to the other segments. They're draped that way so that the electrical path from one place to the other is the same, to keep the signal timings right. If a signal went from one segment to an adjacent one, it draped in a loop that went nearly to the floor. But if a signal were going to a segment 180 degrees away, directly across the core, the ends were farther apart and the sagging part did not get as close to the floor. Kinda like holding a jump rope with your hands together, then moving them apart while keeping the same distance above the floor.

  36. Re:You would think they could have gotten this rig by bezenek · · Score: 1

    Good point. You are correct. Thank you for your comment.

    -Todd

    --
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico.
  37. Re:This stuff is so cool by Jurily · · Score: 1

    Windows 95 == Mac 85!

    You seem to think I'm talking about the graphical interface as a whole, but that's not the case. I'm talking about the task bar (as in, a convenient way to always see all your running programs and switch back and forth between them with a single click of the mouse). I've never used a Mac, and I'm not planning to start anytime soon, but from what I found, they didn't have anything like that before Win95, and afterwards they focused on starting new programs with a single click, not switch to running ones or even show them.

    Could you please tell me from each of the screenshots, if there is a text editor somewhere in the background with a file I want to edit? I wouldn't want to open the same file twice.

  38. Re:This stuff is so cool by X0563511 · · Score: 1

    Ah! Something was just bugging me about that display - it didn't 'fit' along the scene's perspective lines.

    --
    For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
  39. Amdahl 470 in 1980 by mbone · · Score: 1

    In 1980 I was programming on an Amdahl 470 with a whopping 1 Gigabyte of disk memory. This required a large room full of IBM Winchester drives, looking for all the world like some sort of high-tech laundromat. The computer itself was in another large room full of equipment, and a laser printer the size of a VW microbus (no kidding).

    This machine also came with not one, but two full time consulting engineers, one from Amdahl for hardware problems, and one from IBM for software problems. The Amdahl CE made $ 50K per year, which seemed like an impossibly high salary to us grunt programmers.

    The biggest game on this machine was a dungeons and dragons type game written in PL1. I have often wondered what that game really was and what its history was. ( I never played it since as a student I couldn't afford it - with the IBM mainframe philosophy, you were charged for everything, which came out of my grant, and machine time was not cheap. Logging in to check the status of my jobs and immediately logging out cost about $ 3.00, for example.)

  40. Re:You would think they could have gotten this rig by hughk · · Score: 1

    I think you'll find that this was probabaly down to the costs of having the parts made and the maybe one person who was officially on the project. A lot of skilled people gave some serious time to the project. If you included their time, it would be much more.

    --
    See my journal, I write things there
  41. Re:This stuff is so cool by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    you can't open the same file twice on a mac.

  42. Flamebait? by solanum · · Score: 1

    Yeah, thanks for that mod. I'd like to hear your reasoning for it. I think you'll find it's well documented that many of the early programmers were women and that women only make up a small proportion of programmers now.

    --
    Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
  43. Re:You would think they could have gotten this rig by bezenek · · Score: 1

    I think you'll find that this was probabaly down to the costs of having the parts made and the maybe one person who was officially on the project. A lot of skilled people gave some serious time to the project. If you included their time, it would be much more.

    I agree. I said $10 million (US) or more. I did not want to over-estimate. And, as you say, the machining of the parts was certainly expensive.

    -Todd

    --
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico.
  44. Display Card Packing by fatp · · Score: 1

    When I saw the title, I thought it mean the big, beautiful boxes of the > $500 display cards...

  45. Minitel won't die... by Anne+Honime · · Score: 4, Informative

    Oddly enough, there apparently are some people that still use them. The train ticketing, phone book, and a number of other services are still up and in use.

    Not odd at all considering the various threats of Internet, from spam to virus, credit cards frauds, DoS etc. Minitel pretty much insure that whomever you phone is legit provided you don't misstype the phone number. It's a very helpful and desirable feature for some sensitive businesses (chemist ordering prescription drugs, etc.)

    And thanks to being a passive terminal, Minitel is immune to virus and trojans by nature. Being so simple, there are no bugs either I'm aware off. And being text only makes for a great bonus to blinds who can plug whatever Braille device they want to use it.

  46. But imagine how much more raw material... by Viol8 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    ... would be used if all computers were still that big!

    1. Re:But imagine how much more raw material... by mcgrew · · Score: 2, Interesting

      What got me and should give everyone pause is the 1972 Cray, the fastest computer in the world at the time, was less powerful than your phone. That was only 35 years ago, for you young folks, what will computers be like when you're my age?

      My daughters grew up with computers, computers grew up with me.

      I remember my mom bringing an IBM luggable home from work back in the early eighties (I was in my early thirties and lived down the street from her, rather than in her basement like the stereotype would have it). She needed help turning it on. It was damned heavy, the size of a small suitcase, with a five inch monichrome CRT monitor and two five inch floppies and no hard drive.

      At the time I had a Timex-Sinclair 1000, 4k of ram with a 16k expansion pack and no drive at all, tape only. I learned to program the thing in assembly, because it was too slow for games written in BASIC.

    2. Re:But imagine how much more raw material... by kramulous · · Score: 1

      I think the amazing thing is that the phone is more powerful *and* only requires a battery with capacity measured in milliamps. That detail would knock an engineer from those days clean out of the ballpark.

      --
      .
  47. JOHNNIAC by ettlz · · Score: 1

    So, was this used to drive a very early model of EMH?

  48. Big beautiful boxes? by seeker_1us · · Score: 1

    So where's the Crushinator?

  49. Could you make a computer from scratch? by Richard+Kirk · · Score: 1

    Okay, suppose we are back in the forties. We have lots of sound and telephone technology. There are tape and wire recorders. We have some early TV technology. There are mechanical calculators and cash registers. You have Hollerith punched cards, Jacquard looms, and the Harringay Tote. How would you set about it? Telephone technology and mercury delay lines were used for early memory, but you had to wait for your bit to arrive back. TV read/write tubes were used to store a small 2D array of dots and re-sample them, but they weren't really RAM yet.

    For me, the big missed opportunity was the neon lamp. A neon lamp may take 20 volts to strike, but will run on 5 volts. A neon lamp would store a bit. You could even address a single bulb in a 2D array of them by X and Y buses, and query the state non-destructively, or change its state without affecting the others. Rather than having hundreds of little glass tubes, you might seal a 2D array into a single, flat tube. You would then have an early plasma display (remember the early orange ones in the eighties could store data?). There were calculating valves like the decatron (I remember using those) but, tantalizingly, no large-scale plasma arc logic.

    What would you do?

    1. Re:Could you make a computer from scratch? by tuffy · · Score: 1

      To make a computer from scratch, one must first create the universe.

      --

      Ita erat quando hic adveni.

    2. Re:Could you make a computer from scratch? by Alioth · · Score: 1

      All the neon lamps I've used take over 100v to strike, and at least 90 to maintain. Nixie tubes at least need 135v to maintain.

    3. Re:Could you make a computer from scratch? by Colin+Douglas+Howell · · Score: 1

      Okay, suppose we are back in the forties. We have lots of sound and telephone technology. There are tape and wire recorders. We have some early TV technology. There are mechanical calculators and cash registers. You have Hollerith punched cards, Jacquard looms, and the Harringay Tote. How would you set about it? Telephone technology and mercury delay lines were used for early memory, but you had to wait for your bit to arrive back. TV read/write tubes were used to store a small 2D array of dots and re-sample them, but they weren't really RAM yet.

      To me it sounds like you're asking "could you make a computer starting with 1940s technology?", but that's pretty much what actually happened, since the first computers were developed during the 1940s. So just look into how the early computers were built.

      For fundamental logic technology, I think the two main approaches were electromechanical relays, used by Howard Aiken at Harvard and Konrad Zuse in Germany, and vacuum tube triodes (or thermionic valves as the British called them), used by Eckert and Mauchly with ENIAC. Vacuum tubes won out for about the next decade, until transistors had matured enough to replace them.

      For memory, different techniques were used. Machine registers were usually built using flip-flops made from the same technology as the other logic circuits. Programming was often done by plugboard wiring or by punched cards on the earliest machines, which didn't use the stored-program concept. (This approach is sometimes called a "Harvard architecture" and was named for Aiken's machines at Harvard.) Later machines did use denser memory technologies like the ones you mentioned: delay lines, cathode ray tubes, or spinning magnetic drums. These weren't randomly addressable and did have long access times, but that was just something designers had to work with. Even though cathode ray tube memories weren't randomly addressable, they did share some traits with modern DRAMs, like destructive read-out and the need for constant refreshing.

      Secondary storage was on punched cards or magnetic tape; magnetic disks were still in the future.

      For me, the big missed opportunity was the neon lamp. A neon lamp may take 20 volts to strike, but will run on 5 volts. A neon lamp would store a bit. You could even address a single bulb in a 2D array of them by X and Y buses, and query the state non-destructively, or change its state without affecting the others. Rather than having hundreds of little glass tubes, you might seal a 2D array into a single, flat tube. You would then have an early plasma display (remember the early orange ones in the eighties could store data?). There were calculating valves like the decatron (I remember using those) but, tantalizingly, no large-scale plasma arc logic.

      It seems that some systems did use neons for some logic and memory (see here, here, and here), but they're kind of tricky and are slow to switch, which may be why they weren't used more widely.

    4. Re:Could you make a computer from scratch? by jeffb+(2.718) · · Score: 1

      The Difference Engine and the rest of steampunk aside, it's going to be hard to implement Moore's Law without something like semiconductor technology. You could certainly get there starting with 1940's technology, but it would probably take 20 or 30 years.

      That said, there were a few false starts that could have launched semiconductors a few decades earlier. So if you were starting in the teens or twenties, you could have made a significant difference.

      At the time semiconductors took off, I believe researchers were looking into vacuum-tube integration -- putting more than just one or two tubes into a single envelope. That could have helped things along, especially if we'd gotten a robust cold-cathode technology going, but I'm not sure how we could have scaled the mechanical grid and electrode structures down in a sustainable way.

  50. I've got a fan from one of those IBM drives by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I got it when a company I worked for replaced those huge drives with an EMC box. Exellent fan, it's silent and produces a lot of air flow, very nice to have in my bedroom during hot summer nights.

  51. Re:This stuff is so cool by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!

    OMFG, what retarded troll!

  52. Re:This stuff is so cool by mdwh2 · · Score: 1

    I'd happily not have a taskbar, if there were other ways to do it (e.g., workspaces). The UI hasn't really changed much since long before Windows 95 - in the 80s there were plenty of GUIs (AmigaOS, MacOS etc).

  53. Re:This stuff is so cool by FlyingBishop · · Score: 1

    The shiny hasn't got significantly better, but in areas which actually matter, the UI has actually improved significantly. Task switching is largely seamless. Granted, that's largely a hardware thing, but the fact that I can do several downloads while working on something else, while my computer does an antivirus scan (ok that last part might be a bad idea) is a significant UI improvement.

    Also, there are more subtle things. Have you used Windows 95 recently? I've used a few apps that were coded for 95, and you can see a lot of the usability gaps shining through from the less-mature APIs. Unable to properly minimize, hard to resize certain text boxes, crap that overflows off the edge of the screen when the text gets too large... Things have gotten better.

    And let's not even talk about stability.

  54. Re:This stuff is so cool by mdwh2 · · Score: 1

    I thought the meme was "Windows 95 == Mac 89" (I'm not sure why 89 was chosen in particlar)?

    Which we then pointed out in turn was equal to Amiga 85.

    (The claim for Mac OS might make sense for the UI alone, but in other areas, such as offering preemptive multitasking, it lagged behind Windows 95, and in fact it never got that feature.)

  55. This is wrong, plain wrong by Kupfernigk · · Score: 4, Informative
    Sorry, it was the Poles obtained German Enigmas and took them to the UK. The news that the Germans relied on Enigma was important, but the main reason the British were able to beat Enigma was that the Germans were insufficiently careful in its use. When the system changed later in the war, the Royal Navy (NOT the USN, contrary to the lies of Hollywood) acquired a naval Enigma machine from a sinking German submarine. (They also captured a German weather boat at one point.)

    It is simple fact that many cryptographic systems are uncrackable in the absence of all knowledge of how they work - but in the real world keys must be exchanged somehow, and encryption must always have a mechanism, and these are always potential vulnerabilities.

    --
    From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
    1. Re:This is wrong, plain wrong by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      Enigma would still have been unbreakable with the technology available at the time, were it not for operator error. The Germans did two stupid things. Firstly, they started every message from one station with the same plaintext every day. Once this was known, it became a lot easier to work out the day's code. Secondly, they decided to 'make it more secure' by saying that you couldn't have any of the wheels in the same position two days in a row, which reduced the search space considerably.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  56. Re:This stuff is so cool by temcat · · Score: 1

    I dunno, Windows 95 OSR2 was extremely stable for me on a 486dx2-66 with 8M RAM. Granted, I only used Word 97, and didn't have Internet connection until I think 2000 (I live in Russia.)

  57. Re:This stuff is so cool by TheRaven64 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Hands up if you would actually consider using a graphical interface without a task bar

    You mean 'hand up if you'd consider using Mac OS X or one of the many *NIX environments that doesn't try to copy Windows?'

    --
    I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  58. Re:This stuff is so cool by TheRaven64 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I was offered a Cray a few years ago - free if I paid delivery, ex-MoD. Unfortunately, it was about as big as my house and, if I wanted to turn it on then it cost something like 5K in liquid nitrogen to keep it cool per day.

    --
    I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  59. Big, beautiful, curvaceous? by Veggiesama · · Score: 1

    What part of "no fatties" didn't you understand?

  60. The RCA tube they show isn't a selectron at all... by Ellis+D.+Tripp · · Score: 1

    It appears to be an early prototype of a "graphecon", "radechon", or some other type of scan converter tube. The dual electron guns and image plate rule it out as a selectron.

    The selectron was a real neat piece of engineering, and must have been a beautiful sight to see in operation, with rows of blinking phosphor dots, one for each stored bit.

    A comprehensive page on the selectron tube here, with LOTS of pictures and technical data:

    http://home.att.net/~thercaselectron/index1.html

    Run your mouse over the tube pins on the front page to see a simulation of the tube in operation.

    --
    Remember "News for Nerds, Stuff that Matters"? Help make it a reality again! http://soylentnews.org
  61. Gin should have been used by Kupfernigk · · Score: 1

    Alan Turing (genuflect three times) calculated that gin (i.e. 60% water/40% ethanol) was as good as mercury. But it wasn't "exotic" enough to be approved for use.

    --
    From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
    1. Re:Gin should have been used by mister_dave · · Score: 1

      Alan Turing (genuflect three times) calculated that gin (i.e. 60% water/40% ethanol) was as good as mercury. But it wasn't "exotic" enough to be approved for use.

      First time round, they were just trying to get a working machine, as quickly as possible, so they used tried and tested solutions where-ever they could.

      Perhaps mercury was just a proven solution, so they didn't faff about looking for a better one?

  62. Re:This stuff is so cool by CoderDevo · · Score: 2, Informative

    That is a mess of wires obscuring the Cray 3 CPUs to which they are connected. It cost $300 million to develop the first functional system for NCAR before Cray Computer Corp, Seymore Cray's last start-up company, folded. (Not to be confused with Cray Inc. which is still producing new systems.)

    This machine required 90,000 watts of power and gave off 310,000 British thermal units of heat per hour â" enough to warm six 2,000-square-foot homes. Getting the heat out of the data center would have been a serious problem. I'm sure the whole NCAR building was designed to do just that.

    DigiBarn has more pictures of the Cray 3 CPUs.

  63. 160MFLOPS in a phone? by FormerComposer · · Score: 2

    I've been away from the scene from awhile but can someone tell me which phone is capable of performing 160 million Floating Point Operations per second? At 6 clock cycles per Floating Point Instruction (which I really doubt), that would be running at a clock rate of 1GHz. I recall that even NOP (No Operation) instructions take a clock or two to execute which is why they used to be (still are?) used in some timing loops. Even with pipelining that advances every clock cycle, I find it hard to believe that 355.0/113.0 done out to 6 or 10 digits of (equivalent) precision can be done 160 Million times per second. I can see a phone micro maybe handling 160MIPS (Instructions Per Second), but not floating point.

    --
    For most purposes, 355/113 is close enough.
    1. Re:160MFLOPS in a phone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, doing a bit of digging, the latest iphone model has a powervr GPU in it. It's hard to find its exact floating point performance, but it's supposedly 128 bit floating point. And I'd assume that, as with most modern GPUs, it does a whole bunch of calculations in parallel. I found a site that tested its performance doing some general purpose number crunching; they were getting 6-ish mflops, but I don't know if that was doing the kind of parallelism that would happen when playing a 3D game. But if 6 was the single-thread performance, then it could be doing 160 if it's able to do 30 or so calculations at once...

      For comparison, I know my current desktop video card, which came out in 2007, has 32 shaders and can supposedly do about 110 gflops, so it seems at least plausible that a newer but lower powered equivalent could handle 160mflops...

    2. Re:160MFLOPS in a phone? by FormerComposer · · Score: 1

      As I said, I've been out of the loop awhile so thanks for the update. I still think, however, that general number-crunching is probably a better description of what was being done back then rather the very specialized parallel processing that GPUs are used for nowadays. But think of the GUI they could have had with 2 machines -- one for the content and one for the presentation.

      --
      For most purposes, 355/113 is close enough.
    3. Re:160MFLOPS in a phone? by Shinobi · · Score: 1

      Check out the ARM11 cores with floating point co-processor. You'll be quite surprised.

  64. Vintage Computer Fair - East 6.0 by tekrat · · Score: 1

    If you want to see some big boxes, VCF East is being held Sept 12-13th, at INFOAGE in Wall NJ.
    Check out http://www.vintage.org/ for more information.

    --
    If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
  65. Wow, we areally are spoiled today. by Magreger_V · · Score: 1

    very few people realize the power that sits in the palm of their hands these days. The computational power of a cell phone is vastly superior to that of computers that used to fill entire rooms! More people need to appreciate whats really going on here. It's not just a computer, it's a calculator. A very fast calculator crunching huge amounts of numbers for YOU. There is a machine in your pocket flipping trillions of 1's and 0's! It's nothing short of a miracle that we have learned to harness electricity in this way and on such a small scale.

  66. Idiot editors by wcrowe · · Score: 2, Informative

    From TFA: The card punch portion of the Hollerith Census Machine. For the 1990 census, there were slots to record what farm equipment was present, what lighting was used in the home, and the usual number of people in the household, among other piece of data.

    I think they mean 1890 not 1990.

    --
    Proverbs 21:19
  67. "More power in your mobile phone" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I always see this comparison and wonder if it is really true.

    In the article they compare a phone to a Cray1.
    Isn't the Cray massively parallel and always working on 64bit words?
    Would it really be possible to do the *same* calculations as fast on a contemporary phone?

    With mainframes, the attraction is the fast IO. The computer is not just the processor, but has processing power spread about to all the external tape and disk drives, io processing boxes etc, each with their own memory channels.
    I wonder if a modern ARM 200Mhz or so in a phone could keep up?

  68. Even your mice... by argent · · Score: 1

    I suspect the DSP in your optical mouse has more CPU power than a mainframe of the '60s or '70s.

    Google says a typical optical mouse has a DSP rated at 18 MIPs. However they define a MIP, that's a lot of VAXes in the palm of your hand.

  69. There is more to it by cybergrue · · Score: 4, Informative
    Enigma started out as a commercial product marketed to commercial entities (mid 1930's) and early versions were sold to the public. IIRC, technical details were published (patents, etc) and it was from these commercial models that the Poles did a lot of their work. When Poland was invaded, the Polish cryptography team made its way to England and helped kickstart the Allied effort.

    After figuring out how the machines worked, it became a simple matter to brute force the machines (try every combination) using mechanical means, ie the Bombes. This was simpler then it sounds because of some exploitable weaknesses (the same letter will never encryt to itself, the wiring in the disks wasn't changed, etc) The Bombes tried every possible combination of settings of an encoded message looking for the string "EIN" (German for one, Turring himself was said to have come up with this neat little hack) These possible decrypts were passed on to a human to check if the made sense. Remember that this was all done with a mechanical system. Late in the war, when the Germans were changing their codes every hour, this system was able to keep up.

  70. Does This Mean I'm Old????? by gpronger · · Score: 1

    OK, if I recognize this stuff (and likely still could run), do I need to worry I'll be next to be crated up and carried off to a museum?

    Greg

  71. Re:This stuff is so cool by H0p313ss · · Score: 1

    Mind you, this was in the afternoon. The mornings were spent cutting down redwood trees, tapping rubber trees and mining graphite, copper and zinc so we could fabricate our own pencils for the afternoon's work. The real hotshots didn't make programming mistakes, so they could skip tapping the rubber trees for use in making pencil erasers.

    ... and if you tell that to kids these days they won't believe you.

    --
    XML is a known as a key material required to create SMD: Software of Mass Destruction
  72. Re:This stuff is so cool by mcgrew · · Score: 1

    *raises hand*

    I'd like a GUI/Text interface. Right click anywhere, and a menu (a task bar is only a sort of menu) comes up. You could enter text commands at the desktop, which could still have icons.

    I have the design in my head, I've thought about modifying KDE to a desktop like that, but somehow I've never gotten around to it. Plus, I hate C.

  73. There, isn't that better by The+Cisco+Kid · · Score: 1

    #!/bin/sh

    # Everyone seems to forget that browsers can SCROLL - no need to
    # break ONE ARTICLE into dozens of separate pages that need to be
    # loaded one at time, forcing you to wait for for it to load each tiny bit
    # over the net - if its all one scrollable page, all the rest of it loads while
    # you are reading the first part, then all one has to do is scroll the page.
    # If you really need an ad impression for each photo, put them all on the same page too.

    BASE1=http://www.pcauthority.com.au/
    BASE2=Gallery/153867,computer-history-museum-photo-gallery-weird-fascinating-photos-including-a-giant-cray-and-a-60kg-hard-drive.aspx/

    BASE=${BASE1}${BASE2}

    (
    x=1
    while ( test $x -lt 58); do

    echo "<P>"
    wget  ${1}.htf ${BASE}${x} | grep ImageGallery_CurrentImage | sed 's/</<br></g'
    echo "<P>"
    x=$(($x+1))

    done
    ) > file.html

  74. Re:This stuff is so cool by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 1

    I have the design in my head, I've thought about modifying KDE to a desktop like that, but somehow I've never gotten around to it. Plus, I hate C.

    You're in luck! KDE doesn't use C. It uses a modified version of C++.

  75. Re:This stuff is so cool by Bent+Mind · · Score: 1

    The first concept of a task bar (dock) was created in England, in 1987. The OS was called Arthur and it included the Iconbar. In 1989, this OS was renamed RISC OS. Also in 1989, NeXTSTEP was released and included a dock. Later versions of Amiga OS had it as an add-on. And the interface I was using when Windows 95 first came out, the Common Desktop Environment under SunOS also had it. Microsoft was a bit late to the game.

    Here is an article with some screen-shots and descriptions of functionality: http://www.osnews.com/story/18941/pt_VI_the_Dock

    --
    Request a Linux Shockwave player here: http://www.macromedia.com/support/email/wishform/
  76. My adviser in college had some sage goodies by pinguwin · · Score: 1

    He had a 1 kb. magnetic core memory module, maybe 6-8" cubed and heavy as all get up in his office. They had shepherd crooks to pull someone out of the machinery if they touched something they shouldn't have but he was unable to procure one of those.

  77. Old gear could be dangerous to work on. by nuckfuts · · Score: 1

    I started out with a company that sold removable-platter hard drives. We had 75MB and 150MB versions, both about the size a dishwasher. Computer parts weren't expendable back then; we repaired everything.

    Since the platters were removable, the read/write heads were prone to damage from dust and such, despite significant airflow and filtering when the lid was locked down. Heads had to be replaced regularly.

    It takes considerable physical force to drive a stack of read/write heads back and forth across large (approx. 16") platters in a matter of milliseconds. This was accomplished by means of large electromagnetic coils. The head assembly was built as light as possible. To keep the whole machine from jumping across the floor, the moving coil pushed and pulled against a piece of thick, heavy steel that looked like a short, stocky cannon.

    Aligning a replacement head had to be done live. To prevent catastrophic disk damage, however, these devices had an "emergency retract" system that would yank the heads back off the platters if the power failed, platters lost speed or something similar. Imagine a large but light-weight head assembly attached to a huge coil, pulsed by a large capacitive discharge, anchored to a small steel cannon. If you were aligning a head and had your fingers in the way of that, it would easily take them off. It was necessary to insert a special safety pin to prevent this from happening.

  78. Re:This stuff is so cool by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 2, Informative

    Pentiums? I'm not sure how reliable benchmarks are these days, but here's a table of dhrystones.

    Pentium 75 achieves 87.1 VAX MIPS (Dhry2); Core 2 Duo 2.4 Ghz, 6248. 32 times the clockspeed, 70 times the performance. And well short of Moore's law.

  79. Stringing memory by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ah, memory planes.

    In the late 50's/early 60's my sister-in-law's aunt had a thriving home business employing neighbor ladies to string memory in her garage. Yes, they sat around with needles stringing those little loops on very thin wires by hand.

  80. Re:This stuff is so cool by chunk08 · · Score: 1

    (Hands up if you would actually consider using a graphical interface without a task bar.)

    Posts using ratpoison. (Before everyone starts screaming, yes, I'm an efficiency nerd, I do a lot of things reflexively, and I cannot imagine trying to teach a high percentage normal lusers to use this.)

    --
    Do away with our corrupt tax code. Support the Fair Tax
  81. Where is PARC? by spaceyhackerlady · · Score: 1

    I was expecting to see something from Xerox in there, considering that they invented so much of present-day computing.

    The IBM 360/91 was an interesting computer. It tried to re-order instructions for maximum performance. It didn't do it very well. It was infamous for its "imprecise interrrupts".

    ...laura

  82. Re:This stuff is so cool by Anonym1ty · · Score: 1

    Oops bad mod - sorry

  83. Re:This stuff is so cool by KillerBob · · Score: 1

    Even Apple OS had a simple listing of windows under the Apple menu. The menu bar at the top of the screen had the program's menu (file, edit, view, etc.), and still does for most Apple software, but the Apple menu is the OS menu and has always been there. You could use it to choose between different programs were open if you couldn't see the window you wanted to switch to and click on it directly.

    Apple had that in 1986 with OS 1.0.

    To be fair, Microsoft had very similar functionality with alt-tab, which was present in Windows 2.1 and above, from about the same time frame. (well, it was in earlier versions of the operating system, but prior to 386 mode Windows, it wasn't a multi-tasking operating system, so I don't really count it). Also, when you minimized a program, it disappeared to the bottom of the screen as an icon. Unless you were running full screen, you could always click on that icon to change to a different program that was open.

    There have been *many* ways to manage different programs open which don't rely on having a taskbar. When I am running a Linux system, I use the lil star icon box, which is part of XFCE (which itself is related to the CDE that the parent was using). Many of them are very functional. And honestly, with a sufficiently big/high resolution screen, you don't even need a taskbar, as you rarely run with windows running full screen. Right now, I've got Firefox running in a portrait-format window, and next to it I've got a couple of MSN windows running, slightly cascaded, with Thunderbird off in the corner, beeping at me if I get any e-mail. The last time I clicked on the taskbar was to open the programs in the first place. And that's under Windows 7 (RTM version, MSDN).

    So in response to the GP, when asking whether I'd even consider running an OS that didn't have a task bar? Absolutely. If somebody found a way to do everything I wanted to do without the need of one, then I'd certainly consider using it... as it is now, it's a bit of a waste of space most of the time.

    --
    If you believe everything you read, you'd better not read. - Japanese proverb
  84. Re:This stuff is so cool by KillerBob · · Score: 1

    Why bother modifying KDE to do that when you can already do it with some very basic tweaks in XFCE, which uses less memory than KDE in the first place?

    --
    If you believe everything you read, you'd better not read. - Japanese proverb
  85. Re:This stuff is so cool by KillerBob · · Score: 1

    Pentium 75 achieves 87.1 VAX MIPS (Dhry2); Core 2 Duo 2.4 Ghz, 6248. 32 times the clockspeed, 70 times the performance. And well short of Moore's law.

    Not really. The raw performance that a CPU can provide hasn't really increased at all in the last 7 years. We're running with basically the same clock speeds, and all other things being equal, the performance of the CPUs hasn't improved that much. What performance improvement we've seen in that time has been from improvements to chipset architecture, memory speed, bus speed, and data transfer rates between different buses.

    The single biggest improvement your computer has seen in the last decade has been the GPU performance, which is on track with Moore's Law and then some, because that's where you, the user, will actually see the difference. Try running Farcry at 1920x1080 resolution with all effects turned on using a GeForce3 Ti500 w/ 64MB of RAM.

    But the thing is... the reason the average clock speed has actually gone down in the last 5 years isn't because they aren't capable of making faster chips. It's because they don't really have a reason to make faster chips. Data crunched by the CPU can only be received by the user so fast, and the CPU is much faster than it needs to be. So it's cheaper to make slower chips using older, more refined technologies, and they had/have reached a plateau where the CPU is far more powerful than the rest of the computer, and the user, can handle. Who cares if your CPU can clock to 10GHz or more if it won't be used? Heck, Civilization IV is the only game I play that actually manages to cap out even one of the cores on my 2-year old Core2 Duo laptop, and that's only because of the raw number crunching it does between turns.

    And what improvements we *have* seen on the CPU haven't been limited by the inability to cram more transistors into a die. They've been focusing on streamlining processes (a war that AMD started with Intel, when they put out a 1GHz Athlon that outperformed a 3GHz Pentium), and most importantly, they've been focusing on improving power and heat efficiency. CPU power hasn't improved much in the last 5 years, but the amount of power a CPU requires is a fraction of what it was back then. I can remember when you were a fool to build an AMD-based system with less than 350W of power running through it, and it was strongly recommended that you have more than 500W. The last computer I bult is a Core2Duo 2.4GHz with a 120GB hard drive and 4GB of RAM, and it's powered by an 80W brick. It could get by with a 60W brick, but the 80W gives me more play room.

    --
    If you believe everything you read, you'd better not read. - Japanese proverb
  86. Re:The RCA tube they show isn't a selectron at all by jeffb+(2.718) · · Score: 1

    A comprehensive page on the selectron tube here, with LOTS of pictures and technical data:

    http://home.att.net/~thercaselectron/index1.html

    Run your mouse over the tube pins on the front page to see a simulation of the tube in operation.

    I see what they did there, with a glider going down the bottom panel as you sweep from left to right. Life is good. :-)

  87. Re:This stuff is so cool by ps2os2 · · Score: 0

    Well that is starting to become true these days as well for PC's. I am hearing reasonable people talking about water to cool down PC's so the more things change the more the its constant.

    Although I do remember one company up in St Paul that built a lake to get their cooling water from and they only thing the lake did was attract geese:)

  88. Re:This stuff is so cool by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    http://wmstandart.ru/ WMSTANDART.RU - WebMoney Transfer Official exchange office in Kazan. We offer You easily put or take out Your money in WebMoney Transfer system.

  89. Re:This stuff is so cool by twosat · · Score: 1

    I find it amazing that computers generally stay about the same size. In the 80's when I got my first computer, I imagined that computers in the future would get smaller and slimmer as well as faster. Well, they are a lot faster but the specifications keep being increased so that most computers are still more or less the same size as many years ago. Back then I thought that ALL computers would have ended up like modern notebook or laptop computers!

  90. Re:This stuff is so cool by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The ability to run multiple applications at once was added to MacOS with MulitFinder. It was release for MacOS System 5 in 1988.

    (MacOS has always had limited multitasking - 'desk accessories' could always be launched from the Apple menu. But these were like TSRs in DOS - they were never (and couldn't be) fully fledged applications.)

    Although this screenshot set disproves WP saying MultiFinder did exist for system 4.2. (Look at the "Desktop with Applications shot). As you can see, though, switching between applications was done by selecting the desired target application from the Apple menu.

    Anyway, prior to MultiFinder (or its predecessor program, Switcher), it was a non-issue. You couldn't run more than one program at the same time. (Excluding Desk Accessories as mentioned)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Mac_OS#System_1.2C_2.2C_3_.26_4

  91. A/N FSQ-7-AN/FSQ-7 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AN/FSQ-7

  92. Re:This stuff is so cool by mcgrew · · Score: 1

    XFCE

    Thanks, hadn't heard of it, I'll do a little research.