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Antitrust Case Against RIAA Reinstated

NewYorkCountryLawyer writes "After Starr v. SONY BMG Music Entertainment was dismissed at the District Court level, the antitrust class action against the RIAA has been reinstated by the US Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit. In its 25-page opinion (PDF), the Appeals court held the following allegations sufficiently allege antitrust violations: 'First, defendants agreed to launch MusicNet and pressplay, both of which charged unreasonably high prices and contained similar DRMs. Second, none of the defendants dramatically reduced their prices for Internet Music (as compared to CDs), despite the fact that all defendants experienced dramatic cost reductions in producing Internet Music. Third, when defendants began to sell Internet Music through entities they did not own or control, they maintained the same unreasonably high prices and DRMs as MusicNet itself. Fourth, defendants used MFNs [most favored nation clauses] in their licenses that had the effect of guaranteeing that the licensor who signed the MFN received terms no less favorable than terms offered to other licensors. For example, both EMI and UMG used MFN clauses in their licensing agreements with MusicNet. Fifth, defendants used the MFNs to enforce a wholesale price floor of about 70 cents per song. Sixth, all defendants refuse to do business with eMusic, the #2 Internet Music retailer. Seventh, in or about May 2005, all defendants raised wholesale prices from about $0.65 per song to $0.70 per song. This price increase was enforced by MFNs.'"

163 comments

  1. MFN? by orta · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Its not exactly most favored nation, if there's no advantage to being so.

    --
    my band is more brutal techno punk than yours
    1. Re:MFN? by isThisNameAvailable · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The advantage is that you don't get screwed. It's not that you're going to be homecoming queen, it's just that you get to sit at the cool kids' table and no one shoves you in a locker.

    2. Re:MFN? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      First corporations claim to be people, and now they claim to be nations. WTF? SFYs.

    3. Re:MFN? by Winckle · · Score: 1

      Isn't that rather the crux of the argument in TFA?

    4. Re:MFN? by sixteenbitsamurai · · Score: 1

      We were warned it would be this way... soon you will be a SINless mercenary making a living by being Mr. Johnson's bitch.

      --
      Yeah, that just happened.
    5. Re:MFN? by halltk1983 · · Score: 1

      As long as I can get my stuffers.

      --
      Watch for Penguins, they eat Apples and throw rocks at Windows.
  2. Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Good

  3. Echo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Echo

    1. Re:Echo by Runaway1956 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Ditto. Yes, this story makes me so happy, I'm willing to be a dittohead for awhile. Enjoy while you can! ;^)

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
  4. What about my stress level by colin_n · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Who is going to compensate me for my increased stress level from living in fear of being sued by the RIAA? If I had kids and I wanted them to behave, I'd just tell them stories about the RIAA coming to get them and financially ruin them.

    Don't jaywalk kids because the RIAA will come get you.
    Eat your vegetables so you can be strong to fight the riaa.

    Seriously though, I hate those guys.

    --

    --------- I have no signature
    1. Re:What about my stress level by ari_j · · Score: 1, Informative

      For your kids: Don't download this song!

    2. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They have become the modern Keyser Söze of the US...

    3. Re:What about my stress level by ByOhTek · · Score: 2, Funny

      The point about boogy men is they aren't supposed to be real, that way once the kids get old enough, they don't have to live their lives in fear.

      Obviously the **AA groups are not suitable for this, because they are real!

      --
      Self proclaimed typo king, and inventor of the bear destroying coffee table (patent not pending).
    4. Re:What about my stress level by Quantumstate · · Score: 5, Informative

      "This video contains content from Vevo, who has decided to block it in your country. "

    5. Re:What about my stress level by Snotboble_ · · Score: 5, Interesting

      "This video contains content from Vevo, who has decided to block it in your country.". FYI, I live in a pinko commie 3rd world country called "Denmark" :P Gotta love the "rights protecton" - whose rights..?

      --
      Q: How does a Unix guru have sex? A: unzip;strip;touch;finger;mount;fsck;more;yes;umount;sleep
    6. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Same here in the Netherlands...

      Apparently it's not allowed to watch the same music-video's through the internet that are broadcast on just about every channel on TV - I'm getting the "This video contains content from Vevo, who has decided to block it in your country." all the time, and I think it's a bit ludicrous to go out and buy a television just so that I can watch the same music-vids that all them old fashioned TV-huggers get to see.

    7. Re:What about my stress level by prcko · · Score: 1

      This video contains content from Vevo, who has decided to block it in your country.

      Apparently, not available in ALL countries... :)

    8. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      why would you have an increased stress level due to the RIAA? Only people who are violating copyright on music would need to worry about that. If you've violated copyright then the stress is induced by you - so sue yourself. If you haven't violated copyright than any stress you are feeling due to the RIAA is a symptom of insanity.

    9. Re:What about my stress level by shaka · · Score: 1

      Well, I guess we are living in a "Least Favored Nation"... (Sweden here!)

      --
      :wq!
    10. Re:What about my stress level by Dishevel · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Rights are easy. It is always about the rights of the politicians in power to get more power. Every country is the same in that. The only difference is in how they approach their goals.

      --
      Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
    11. Re:What about my stress level by icannotthinkofaname · · Score: 4, Interesting

      When you're 5: "Sharing is a nice thing to do, kids. Don't be selfish! Hoarding your stuff makes you look like a huge jerk."

      When you're 25: "Sharing is an evil thing to do, citizen. It's not selfish! Letting other people use your stuff is illegal because it means I make less money. Pay no attention to the fact that my salary is an order of magnitude higher than yours!"

      WTF world! If sharing is evil, don't tell me when I'm 5 that it's nice!

      If I ever manage to have kids, I want to raise them to believe that sharing is evil. I will then note other people's reactions to the idea. If people are generally shocked and appalled that people could actually believe this, then I will use that as an argument to show why this BS that the RIAA believes in must be outlawed.

      --
      Let q be a radix > 1. I am in ur base-q, killing 10 d00ds.
    12. Re:What about my stress level by Tanktalus · · Score: 1

      Right. Because the RIAA never goes after people who haven't pirated. They don't send nasty letters to printers or 7-year-old girls.

      The stress of living in a police state (and that's what RIAA has proclaimed themselves to be, not in word but in deed) is not whether you did something wrong or not, it's whether you're accused (and thus nearly automatically convicted) of doing something wrong, regardless of whether you actually did it or not.

    13. Re:What about my stress level by Kierthos · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      Well, there is a difference between "share your toys" wherein the act of sharing does not create an exact duplicate of the toys and "share your digital music" where the act of sharing does create an exact digital duplicate.

      Honestly, people.

      --
      Mr. Hu is not a ninja.
    14. Re:What about my stress level by g0bshiTe · · Score: 1

      It's called TOR, embrace the onion!

      --
      I am Bennett Haselton! I am Bennett Haselton!
    15. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fuck that. Download this Song.

    16. Re:What about my stress level by g0bshiTe · · Score: 1

      is not whether you did something wrong or not,

      More to the point that you can prove you didn't.

      --
      I am Bennett Haselton! I am Bennett Haselton!
    17. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Being stupid to prove your point merely proves you are stupid.

      sharing music!=sharing toys.

      Your inability to comprehend this is not the failure of the industry or your parents, merely the failure of your ability to apply common sense.

      If you ever manage to have kids, please refrain from teaching them anything. Do us all a favor and let people who actually have a clue do that.

    18. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      The onion cries...

      First: you don't know where you are going to "exit" from, and you'd have to manually change the exit node until you reach an "allowed" one, which puts a certain strain on the network.
      Second: using TOR for such a lame purpose is, guess what, lame.
      Third: using TOR with to watch streaming videos is simply a suicide.

    19. Re:What about my stress level by mrrudge · · Score: 1

      and remember kids, when you're throwing unnecessary vitriol and vain assumptions of your own prowess at strangers on the Internet, always tick the 'I am a coward' box.

      (c) 2010 The better parents shout 'stupid stupid' association.

    20. Re:What about my stress level by interkin3tic · · Score: 1

      If you teach your kids to emulate the most corrupt douchebags right from the start, may I suggest that you also teach your kids that drinking and driving or abusing prescription drugs are cool?

    21. Re:What about my stress level by Gilandune · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I think all nations except one are "Least Favoured Nations" in their eyes... (Mexico blocked too)

    22. Re:What about my stress level by flatrock · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Wether you are 5 or 25 sharing things that are yours is nice, sharing things that belong to others is not.

      If another kid lets you play with his toy in kindergarden you don't give that toy to a third kid and say they can do whatever they want with it.

      When you "buy" music you are buying a license to use that music in a limited fashion. The person who owns the rights to the music is the real owner, you more or less have it on loan under specific circumstances.

      That's the nature of copyright.

    23. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      whose rights..?

      The rights of the people who made the video. You have zero rights to the video except what those people choose to allow you, in case you are unclear on the topic.

      That's whose rights are being protected.

    24. Re:What about my stress level by Whorhay · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Whether or not you are buying a license to listen to music or not is variously debateable depending on how you procured it. For instance if you go to any music store and purchase a CD album no where does it state that you are agree'ing to a license.

      Copyright is necessary in some ways to advance our culture and society, but the current state of copyright law is completely out of line with it's orignal intent.

    25. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sharing things that belong to you = nice
      Sharing things that belong to other people = evil

      I hope this clarifies things for the morally-retarded.

    26. Re:What about my stress level by Retric · · Score: 1

      True when you share your physical toys you can't use them. But, when you share your digital toys nobody loses anything.

    27. Re:What about my stress level by BJ_Covert_Action · · Score: 1

      When you "buy" music you are buying a license to use that music in a limited fashion.

      Really? I don't remember signing any license agreements when I purchased my last CD. I don't recall signing any license agreements before entering the local venue for a show. I also don't recall signing any license agreements when I e-mailed my favorite bands and asked for a burned copy of their singles that I couldn't find on albums.

      In fact, I would assert that I don't license a damn thing when I access music. I purchase it. I purchase the physical media. I purchase the song. I purchase the album artwork. If I am buyging music, (ie giving money to someone else in exchange for something I can listen to) that is my copy of the damn music. If I decide to burn that copy to my computer so that I can recut the cd after I scratch it, that's my right, because it is my damn copy.

      Or are you saying that when I buy my jeans from Wal-Mart I am licensing those too? What about buying my tools at Sears, did I license those? What about my DVD player? Come to think of it, have I just been shopping at a Rent-A-Center my whole life and not realized it? Bullshit.

    28. Re:What about my stress level by BobMcD · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      Sharing your own toys is not evil. "Sharing" toys that belong to someone else is. Particularly when you have agreed not to do it.

      The rest is detail.

    29. Re:What about my stress level by BobMcD · · Score: 1

      Whether or not you are buying a license to listen to music or not is variously debateable depending on how you procured it. For instance if you go to any music store and purchase a CD album no where does it state that you are agree'ing to a license.

      Contracts exist to represent agreements that are different from the law of the land.

      If you wish to opt out of the default law, the onus is on you to either change them or change your nationality. Until you do, you're expected to comply without the need for explicit, shrink-wrapped reminders. (Though notably, you DO tend to get those anyway.)

      Copyright is necessary in some ways to advance our culture and society, but the current state of copyright law is completely out of line with it's orignal intent.

      I agree completely. So your choices and duties are clear: Comply, change the law, or leave.

      I do, conveniently, recognize whining about it on an online forum as an adjunct to getting the law changed...

    30. Re:What about my stress level by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      Funny it's blocked for me and I'm in Canada too. Might be because my address was a bogon but I can't be sure.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    31. Re:What about my stress level by LanMan04 · · Score: 1

      Well, there is a difference between "share your toys" wherein the act of sharing does not create an exact duplicate of the toys and "share your digital music" where the act of sharing does create an exact digital duplicate.

      It's physics that keeps people from cloning plastic toys. If they could, they would, ignoring the Plastic Toy Association of America just like they do the RIAA.

      Digital media just happens to be the first thing that came along that makes copying really, REALLY easy.

      --
      With the first link, the chain is forged.
    32. Re:What about my stress level by Omestes · · Score: 1

      Sharing things that belong to other people = evil

      I buy an album full of music, the album belongs to me, I bought it (at least I never signed or agreed a license), so I can share it? I bought a DRM free mp3, I own it (at least I never signed or agreed a license), so I can share it? I bought a book, or ebook, the book or ebook belongs to me (at least I never signed or agreed a license), can I share it?

      --
      A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government. -edward abbey
    33. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or, you could ignore the law. You're only limited to the choices you list if you're a pussy.

    34. Re:What about my stress level by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      From weirdal.com try :
      Don't download this song

      Sorry if it doesn't work, it's just what I found from Mr. Yankovic's own postings:
      Al News Feed

    35. Re:What about my stress level by blackest_k · · Score: 2, Informative

      same here in ireland

      but lets get it clear who's blocking us
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vevo

      Vevo is a music video and entertainment website. It is owned by Sony Music Entertainment, Universal Music Group and Abu Dhabi Media Company.[1] The service was launched officially on 8 December 2009.[2] The video hosting for Vevo is provided by YouTube, with Google and Vevo sharing the advertising revenue.[3] Vevo offers music videos from three of the four major record labels, Universal Music Group, Sony Music Entertainment and EMI.[4]

      One of the reasons cited for the launch of Vevo is the competition that music videos have on YouTube. Warner Music Group apparently removed its content from YouTube in March 2009 for this reason, but is said to be considering hosting its content on Vevo.[5]

  5. Thanks again NYCL by zerocool^ · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Thanks for keeping us in the loop NYCL.

    These seem to be serious allegations. I hope there's action taken this time.

    These deserve to be kept in mind:
    http://archive.salon.com/tech/feature/2000/06/14/love/ (Courtney Love Does the Math, from 2000 - looking at it now, oddly prophetic)
    http://www.negativland.com/albini.html (The Problem with Music, by Producer Steve Albini - great insight into the process of Major Label music)

    This is why we should care. I know that it's clichéd, but these companies care nothing about you, or about music, or about the well-being of the world in which they operate. They are wholly evil, in a way that almost no other business is.

    --
    sig?
    1. Re:Thanks again NYCL by unixfan · · Score: 5, Informative

      At one point they also lobbied to get a law that would allow them to hack your computer and wipe out the content if they suspected you of having illegal music. Fortunately Congress did not agree.

    2. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Hurricane78 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I remember when I worked with a guy with good connections to all (then five) big music companies (who did all the deals for us, because he was an insider). He usually was on the phone with these big music managers, loudly joking, and setting up meetings of talking about deals.

      In the industry, it’s all about connections. A small group of people who know each other.

      And this was, how he once described the typical “business meeting” to me: (I think in this example it was the EMI boss.)
      He took the elevator to the top floor. The guy greeted him and offered him lines of coke as thick as your finger, on a mirror.
      Then he ordered some hookers. And then it was time for business.
      According to him, that was rather normal, and in no way an exception.

      --
      Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
    3. Re:Thanks again NYCL by DJRumpy · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I wasn't aware of the Courtney Love letter. That was an amazing read (many thanks). That begs the second question. Why haven't I heard of this letter before? The RIAA is an evil beyond typical corporate scams and money making. They have fingers in world wide political pies, and money to literally burn. The fact that a single group can exert so much power in political circles should be a huge wake up call to everyone, yet year by year goes by and only the 'geeks' and those affected voice their concerns. I think what's even more frightening is that they now do these things opening for the most part, and again no one pays attention.

      Slavery was abolished in the US, yet I don't see how these contracts differ in any significant way from slavery and servitude.

      Why is this allowed to go on?

    4. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Tim+C · · Score: 4, Insightful

      These seem to be serious allegations. I hope there's action taken this time.

      You mean you hope there's action taken if they are proven to be true, right?

      Due process applies to everyone, not just the people we like.

    5. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Oh FFS calm down - and look in the dictionary for "evil".

      There's nothing evil about not caring about music, or about you, or about the "well-being" of a bunch of self-entitled middle-class pricks. No-one in Ethopia is starving because of the RIAA cartel overpricing the latest fucking Jonah Bros CD. Villagers haven't been raped and murdered for being in the way of a new CD pressing plant in Nigeria. And 20,000 people per year aren't dying from lung cancer because they got hooked on Eminem.

      Please get some fucking perspective on this. These companies deal in *entertainment*. Look at oil and diamonds and drink and tobacco and firearms if you want to talk about "evil".

    6. Re:Thanks again NYCL by bratloaf · · Score: 1

      Wow, how did I not see that Courtney Love letter before. From 2000! I think I just gained a pile of respect for her, that was quite forward looking for 10 years ago.

    7. Re:Thanks again NYCL by DJRumpy · · Score: 2, Interesting

      And when the organization being sued is writing the very legislation that allows their actions? What then?

    8. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "hey are wholly evil, in a way that almost no other business is."?

      I beg to differ. One word "Monsanto". You think excessive intellectual property entitlements and DRM harm the public good of our shared culture?

      Imagine DRM on the global food supply.
      Imagine feeding poison to billions for profit and hiding the evidence.
      Imagine being sued because the contents of your genetic material infringe on their IP.
      Congratulations, your imagination is now up to speed with reality.

    9. Re:Thanks again NYCL by shaka · · Score: 2, Informative

      This! Kudos to Ray Beckerman for your tireless work, and everybody:

      Read Courtney Love's article! It's an amazing read!

      http://archive.salon.com/tech/feature/2000/06/14/love/ (Courtney Love Does the Math, from 2000 - looking at it now, oddly prophetic)

      --
      :wq!
    10. Re:Thanks again NYCL by csmass · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why are banks allowed to keep you in debt for the rest of your life? The answer to both questions are almost the same, US citizens all suffer from some form of memory loss, that or the like to be lubed up and penetrated. You could argue, banks and RIAA both only serve to entrap people and take control of their lives financially, yet it would fall upon deaf ears.

    11. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then We Shall Shoot Them Until They Reverse That Legislation!
      (mega-corps have plenty of cannon fodder to shoot to scare high-ups)

    12. Re:Thanks again NYCL by TubeSteak · · Score: 1

      You mean you hope there's action taken if they are proven to be true, right?

      Due process applies to everyone, not just the people we like.

      I'd hope there is action taken even if collusion can't be proven in a court of law.
      Legal, but anti-competitive trade practices are just as damaging to the markets as illegal ones.

      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
    13. Re:Thanks again NYCL by DJRumpy · · Score: 1

      Considering you can easily pay off a card if you simply pay more than the minimum, or pay early, it's not nearly the same situation. These folks are legally bound to produce for the recording industry, and everything they produce that's worth anything is owned forever by the same industry.

      How does that compare?

    14. Re:Thanks again NYCL by russotto · · Score: 4, Insightful

      No-one in Ethopia is starving because of the RIAA cartel overpricing the latest fucking Jonah Bros CD.

      Yawn. The old "if it ain't as bad as the worst evil I can think of, you're just whining about it" argument. It remains invalid.

      Sure, these guys aren't murderers, most of them. They're still thieves on a massive scale (mostly from the "talent" they claim to be protecting). They're still willing to sue people into bankruptcy for bucking them. They'd still like to put people in jail for writing computer programs they don't like. They'd still like to ban entire classes of technology to maintain their profits. They're still evil, even if Idi Amin makes them look like pikers.

    15. Re:Thanks again NYCL by svick · · Score: 0, Redundant

      [citation needed]

    16. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Ian+Alexander · · Score: 1

      This is why we should care. I know that it's clichéd, but these companies care nothing about you, or about music, or about the well-being of the world in which they operate. They are wholly evil, in a way that almost no other business is.

      What other companies _actually_ care about the consumer, the product they sell, or the world in which they operate? Modern society boils all of business down to a search for short-term profit. Consumers only matter because they have wallets, products only matter because they need to open the consumer's wallets somehow, and the world at large only matters when it begins being bad for business.

    17. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Ltap · · Score: 1

      That's a complete fallacy. The thing that makes the labels/**AAs (you can't really talk about one without the other) is not what they do but how they do it.

      Most firearms companies are small and operate through defense contracts with governments. Most of the knockoff weapons that rather unsavoury people are armed with were produced by gunsmiths working with gangs. The fact that the weapons kill is irrelevant - the weapons exist, so they would be used, which necessitates producing more to defend yourself with, etc., etc.

      --
      Yet Another Tech Blog
      (but so much more, including game and movie reviews)
      http://yanteb.peasantoid.org
    18. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Croakus · · Score: 1

      One word. Monsanto.

    19. Re:Thanks again NYCL by VShael · · Score: 1

      He took the elevator to the top floor. The guy greeted him and offered him lines of coke as thick as your finger, on a mirror.
      Then he ordered some hookers. And then it was time for business.

      I think you'll find that the *top* floor is like this in a lot of companies, not just members of the RIAA.

    20. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      WP:GOOGLEIT

    21. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/2001/10/47552

      1st hit on google "RIAA wants to hack computers". Stop being so lazy :p

    22. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You cannot forget the Janis Ian letter. She certainly comes off as the one that should be listened to most. Plus, she's awesome.

      http://www.janisian.com/article-internet_debacle.html

    23. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Croakus · · Score: 1

      So your opinion is based on a ten year old letter from a rich pop star who suffers from clinical depression and heroin addiction?

      I did read it BTW I’m not impressed. She rambles aimlessly from one point to another and doesn’t seem to realize she’s contradicting herself. She says that she would be the first person to file a lawsuit against Napster for infringing her Copyright, then she says that illegal distribution is helping her sell more albums ... huh?

      Not that I’m disagreeing with your point. Lots of artists sign stupid contracts, and I agree that the record companies should be taken to task for offering those contracts. They do in fact take advantage of young artists and their naive dreams. Record companies do in fact often operate as con men.

      So I agree with your fundamental point but

    24. Re:Thanks again NYCL by CaptainSpankOMax · · Score: 3, Informative
    25. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Just+Some+Guy · · Score: 3, Funny

      I am officially quitting my job today. I am in the wrong line of work and am fixing that starting now.

      --
      Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
    26. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Bengie · · Score: 1

      I remember that. Never got too far though, but it's still an ass move to even attempt.

    27. Re:Thanks again NYCL by NewYorkCountryLawyer · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Thanks for keeping us in the loop NYCL. These seem to be serious allegations. I hope there's action taken this time.

      I don't have the slightest doubt that the allegations

      are true, and
      can easily be proven.

      If I were a betting man, I'd be betting..... settlement.

      --
      Ray Beckerman +5 Insightful
    28. Re:Thanks again NYCL by PitaBred · · Score: 1

      There's more than enough evidence that is public to make a decision. If I see someone slit the throat of someone else, I'm not going to wait until he is proven to be a murderer in a court of law to call him that.

    29. Re:Thanks again NYCL by SydShamino · · Score: 1

      http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/2001/10/47552

      1st hit on google "RIAA wants to hack computers". Stop being so lazy :p

      Careful, Wired wants to steal your copy buffer.

      Be sure to use safe browsing practices.

      --
      It doesn't hurt to be nice.
    30. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      OP said the RIAA members are "wholly evil, in a way that almost no other business is". You're defending this statement as true?

      Your come-back is a strawman anyway. I'm not saying that. What I am saying is that the actions of the RIAA do not fall into the category of "evil" at all. The RIAA do not cause significant suffering in this world and cannot even be compared (by use of the word "evil") to the truly evil acts which are performed by other businesses.

      To answer your specific whines:

      They do not "thieve" from their talent. Their talent signs contracts with them voluntarily. Sure, 0.1% of that talent might then turn around and bitch about the terms, but this is just sour grapes from a group of people who are exceptionally priviledged in the first place. If you don't like the terms, don't sign the contract. It's really that simple. And I'd like to see these people stop exploiting their fame, which was bought for them, before they start asking for their money back.

      Suing someone for harming you is not usually considered evil, unless you have a particularly warped and one-sided sense of justice.

      And campaigning for something is not usually considered evil, even if you disagree with what is being campaigned for.

      You, too, need to gain a little perspective here.

    31. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Aphoxema · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Better than thieves, I'd compare them to child extortionists. They seduce young musicians with dreams of fame and money, make promises they'll never keep, then they bleed them dry of their efforts then cast them away when they are too frail too lift a finger. All the while, these people are kept illusioned that it is all to their benefit so that they never have the opportunity to learn a lesson from the experience.

      The cocaine off of strippers' asses isn't recreation, it's medicinal.

      --
      "Most people, I think, don't even know what a rootkit is, so why should they care about it?"
    32. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He took the elevator to the top floor. The guy greeted him and offered him lines of coke as thick as your finger, on a mirror.
      Then he ordered some hookers. And then it was time for business.

      I think you'll find that the *top* floor is like this in a lot of companies, not just members of the RIAA.

      I think you'll find that few people here know what the *top* floor is like here. No executive is going to be offering hookers & blow at meetings. That immediately gives leverage to others that will hurt the bottom line and the individual. Why risk getting fired (without a parachute due to overtly criminal behavior) and prison time? Why risk having executives that can cause huge legal headaches for the company? I think your friend may have just wanted to feel cool and either outright lied or liberally embellished (Coca cola brought by a hot secretary perhaps?). These people are bastards but they are not stupid bastards.

    33. Re:Thanks again NYCL by sdstuart · · Score: 5, Funny

      You may want to rethink that. Becoming a hooker just to sleep with music executives isn't as glamorous as it sounds.

      --
      My SIG is a P220.
    34. Re:Thanks again NYCL by selven · · Score: 1

      Action taken as in "people actually acting on the allegation and investigating it".

    35. Re:Thanks again NYCL by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I don't have the slightest doubt that the allegations are true, and can easily be proven. If I were a betting man, I'd be betting..... settlement.

      The question of if the RIAA loses and if they make a settlement and on how favorable of terms probably has less to do with their guilt and the law than it has to do with who is running the show. The justice department is loaded with ex-employees of RIAA at the highest levels. Maybe that means they will know how to deal with these guys or maybe it means their buddies will get off with a slap on the wrist. Much of that may depend upon if Obama keeps his promises about not letting industry insiders provide favoritism to their friends from within his administration.

    36. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      At least 1 congressman would have voted in favour:
      http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/2003/06/59305

    37. Re:Thanks again NYCL by interkin3tic · · Score: 1

      You mean you hope there's action taken if they are proven to be true, right?

      Due process applies to everyone, not just the people we like.

      Wait, when did our hopes have to include due process? Does this mean I can no longer hope that certain American citizens who annoy me on a daily basis get tortured for all eternity by the devil himself? Can I still hope it if I also hope they go through a sham trial in some south american junta first and are convicted on grounds of "being fucking annoying?"

      I'm a little unclear as to how the extradition would work there...

    38. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some (I hope many) are already acting upon the idea, legally.

      We're not buying their shitty products.

    39. Re:Thanks again NYCL by rcharbon · · Score: 1

      The industry types wanted the rock star lifestyle without, y'know, the need to actually learn music or have any artistic talent. Unfortunately, they had all the money.

    40. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Action taken can be the investigation that proves or disproves, unfortunately these bastards have friends like Orrin Hatch that will whitewash for them with no investigation.

    41. Re:Thanks again NYCL by alvinrod · · Score: 1

      I think your company isn't one that's overly chummy with the government. The RIAA is already buying politicians and writing copyright legislation. If they're already doing that, I don't think they have to worry too much about the law coming down on them for something as minor as whores and blow. You're really underestimating the industry if you don't think that this goes on behind closed doors. After all, this is the same industry that would buy drugs for the big-name bands that were working on new albums.

      Just because a story seems incredulous doesn't necessarily make it untrue. I imagine there are still a few executives in the recording industry who like to party like rock stars.

    42. Re:Thanks again NYCL by 2PAIRofACES · · Score: 1

      You mean you hope there's action taken if they are proven to be true, right?

      Due process applies to everyone, not just the people we like.

      Corporations, and therefor cartel's of corporations are legal fictions. They deserve no more due process than Goldilocks for stealing all that porridge.

      --
      "you know why? Because we got the bomb, thats why" -Dennis Leary
    43. Re:Thanks again NYCL by BobMcD · · Score: 1

      No-one in Ethopia is starving because of the RIAA cartel overpricing the latest fucking Jonah Bros CD. Villagers haven't been raped and murdered for being in the way of a new CD pressing plant in Nigeria. And 20,000 people per year aren't dying from lung cancer because they got hooked on Eminem.

      I'm only saying this for argument's sake, but:

      What if songs only cost what they really were worth, and the money that goes to support the RIAA were still in the pockets of the consumers and the artists instead? What, then, if more of them donated time and money to humanitarian aid, sane foreign policy, and smoking cessation campaigns?

      There's a thin possibility that, by stopping this one evil that we do know and care about, people and resources could be reallocated in ways that do wind up impacting the greater good.

      How's that for a perspective?

    44. Re:Thanks again NYCL by BobMcD · · Score: 1

      She says that she would be the first person to file a lawsuit against Napster for infringing her Copyright, then she says that illegal distribution is helping her sell more albums ... huh?

      First and foremost, I think Ms Love is a tool. So I'm not defending her. However...

      If you've never found yourself enforcing a rule or restriction even though it will also do you harm, you soon will.

      I still remember the day I wrote the web proxy rule that cut me off from several websites I enjoy. It 'harmed' me, but rules are rules and some things happen for a good reason even when they don't have an immediate personal benefit.

      In the musician's case, 'free music' is an end-game proposition. It only helps artists now because it is the exception, rather than the rule. Some people still do give them money. However, I see a legitimate fear that once it becomes socially acceptable to reward artists with 'nothing', then there will be no professional artists. It is a classic 'slippery slope' argument, but short of a working crystal ball you'd be hard pressed to prove it wrong enough to alleviate the fear.

    45. Re:Thanks again NYCL by NewYorkCountryLawyer · · Score: 4, Informative

      I don't have the slightest doubt that the allegations are true, and can easily be proven. If I were a betting man, I'd be betting..... settlement.

      The question of if the RIAA loses and if they make a settlement and on how favorable of terms probably has less to do with their guilt and the law than it has to do with who is running the show. The justice department is loaded with ex-employees of RIAA at the highest levels.

      This is a private class action; it has nothing to do with the justice department. It would have to do with what the lawyers work out, whether class members object, and whether the judge approves of the deal.

      --
      Ray Beckerman +5 Insightful
    46. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Just+Some+Guy · · Score: 2

      Yeah, but it carries more respect than becoming a senator to do the same thing.

      --
      Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
    47. Re:Thanks again NYCL by Croakus · · Score: 1

      I still remember the day I wrote the web proxy rule that cut me off from several websites I enjoy.

      Wow! You gonna be OK?

      J/K

      Something does need to be done about the fact that illegal distribution is becoming the norm. Someone has to pay for the music to be produced and if the consumer refuses to do so then the only thing available will be corporate sponsored jingles and free music made at home by hobbyists.

      The irony of the "free music" push is that it's actually making the big record companies more powerful while at the same time making it harder for the independent artists it claims to support to make a buck.

      I was simply agreeing with the statement that big record companies treat artists like cattle. They always have unfortunately. And as long as there's good looking naive kids out there who can sing, they will continue to do so.

    48. Re:Thanks again NYCL by ignavus · · Score: 1

      These seem to be serious allegations. I hope there's action taken this time.

      You mean you hope there's action taken if they are proven to be true, right?

      Due process applies to everyone, not just the people we like.

      No. The mere existence of an association of so-called "competitors", like the RIAA, should be very worrying to anyone who wants a free, competitive market.

      --
      I am anarch of all I survey.
    49. Re:Thanks again NYCL by zerocool^ · · Score: 1

      Service companies. Value-added resellers.

      Case in point: me. I work for Rackspace. We are NOT the cheapest in the business. But - we hire better, more knowledgeable people (largest private sector employer of RHCE's), and we support and treat our customers better.

      If you want a server, you can go anywhere. We know that. We know that we have to come through for the end user in order to stay relevant. It's what makes this a great job, that atmosphere, that dedication to the customer.

      --
      sig?
    50. Re:Thanks again NYCL by zerocool^ · · Score: 1

      Great find, thanks.

      --
      sig?
  6. Interesting Points by Tisha_AH · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It is interesting to read the opinion. Conspiracy to fix prices, agreements to not compete against each other, all record companies refusing to do any business with certain companies.

    They are acting like a monopoly. This is what led to the breakup of Standard Oil back in the early part of the 20th century and the breakup of the Bell System into Baby Bells.

    This most favored nation (MFN) deal they have going and how all prices change in lockstep.

    Wow, it reminds me of how they eventually caught Al Capone. Not on running a crime syndicate but on tax evasion.

    --
    Tisha Hayes
    1. Re:Interesting Points by DragonTHC · · Score: 4, Interesting

      yet they were all found guilty of price fixing during the height of the CD era.

      Nothing has changed. They should be fined doubly for continuing this behavior.

      --
      They're using their grammar skills there.
    2. Re:Interesting Points by AmonRa1979 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I think the difference is that Al Capone DIDN'T pay off the right government officials. That's probably not the case here.

    3. Re:Interesting Points by castironpigeon · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'd mod up parent post if I had the points. It's great seeing a case like this take one small step forward, but unfortunately it's a bit like skipping through a minefield where the mines are politicians and public officials whose pockets are lined with MAFIAA money and the minefield ends miles away. I don't think we're gonna make it.

      --
      mmmm...forbidden donut
    4. Re:Interesting Points by TheDukePatio · · Score: 1

      Ever wonder why the Mob doesn't get into pirating music? The RIAA, that's why. It's far more risky than armed hold-ups, protection schemes, drugs, hookers, murder-for-hire, etc. Find me a 'Made Man' who's pirating music, and I'll find you a man who's closer to jail than he thought he was.

      --
      To Alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems.
  7. From the IRAA's point of view. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    Speaking as someone who's very close to the RiAA this is what I have to say:

    You people have no chance! We own the Congress, we have more lawyers and eventually, NYCL WILL come over to the Darkside - it's only a matter of time.

    You little thieves just need to stop stealing our music!

    We now have factories in Malaysia, Indonesia, and Africa that produce music - all run by small children that are paid with barely enough food to live. We just hire good looking people to lip synch in videos and "live" shows. And then when they can't work anymore, we sell the little girls into prostitution and the boys are then trained to be our stormtroopers.

    So just shut up! I have to go. My stupid idiotic maid made my afternoon cocktail with the blood of kittens when I especially ordered her to make it with the blood of puppies!

    Courtney!

    1. Re:From the IRAA's point of view. by gink1 · · Score: 1

      We own the Congress ... and Obama who is championing the super secret ACTA treaty.

      Soon we will fine you to oblivion AND kick you of the net!

      And your ISP will be required to spy on you and enforce copyright.

      We are the RIAA - bow before your new Overlords!

    2. Re:From the IRAA's point of view. by troll8901 · · Score: 1

      ... eventually, NYCL WILL come over to the Darkside - it's only a matter of time.

      Someone put a transponder inside NYCL and keep a lock on it at all times! Be sure that he's accompanied by 10 bodyguards at all times, and beam him back if he's alone for more than 2 minutes.

      Most importantly, make sure the bodyguards do not wear red!

    3. Re:From the IRAA's point of view. by NewYorkCountryLawyer · · Score: 1

      ... eventually, NYCL WILL come over to the Darkside - it's only a matter of time.

      Someone put a transponder inside NYCL and keep a lock on it at all times! Be sure that he's accompanied by 10 bodyguards at all times, and beam him back if he's alone for more than 2 minutes.

      Ye of little faith.

      --
      Ray Beckerman +5 Insightful
  8. RIAA has stopped Sueing by rwv · · Score: 0, Troll

    Don't jaywalk kids because the RIAA will come get you.

    The RIAA announced that they were terminating their practices of filing hundreds of civil lawsuits so your jaywalking children should be okay.

    Is this article the evolved version of the RIAA's anti-consumer tactics? It's not clear from the summary, but the way I read this is that the RIAA is evil because mimimium song prices are being raised from $0.65 to $0.70. Can't this increase (approximately 7%) be explained by typical inflation and justifiably be expected every two years? I'm not sure why this story is so evil.

    1. Re:RIAA has stopped Sueing by rootofevil · · Score: 5, Informative

      i think the point is that 1) all the record companies set the same price and 2) they all raised their prices together. these two facts seem to demonstrate collusion in the market. that being the case or not is up to the courts.

      --
      turn up the jukebox and tell me a lie
    2. Re:RIAA has stopped Sueing by T+Murphy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Is there any means for artists to claim the companies colluded on contracts, royalties, etc.? I don't know any information there so it may be they were competitive enough to avoid any claims being able to stick, but knowing how bad it is for the artist I'm more concerned about fixing that before we make things better for the consumer.

    3. Re:RIAA has stopped Sueing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      You win either way - making things better for the consumer means the consumer will start buying music again, which automatically makes things better for the musician, and the market as a whole. Bottom line, we need to get rid of Sony and all the other crap companies belonging to RIAA so the organization disappears.

    4. Re:RIAA has stopped Sueing by c · · Score: 1

      Actually, no. The appeal decision makes it clear that setting a price and everyone raising it at the same time isn't the issue so much as there being no good reason for raising the price.

      If a major resource for an industry goes up in price (i.e. oil) then it's perfectly normal that the entire industry is going to adjust prices to compensate, probably at around the same time, and just knowing that everyone else is going to do it doesn't make it collusion. But in this case, it's been clearly pointed out that costs were decreasing significantly, but they still all jacked the price at the same time. That's the collusion part. Well, that and the part about industry insiders being on record as saying their contract procedures were intended to avoid anti-trust scrutiny. That's pretty bad, too.

      c.

      --
      Log in or piss off.
    5. Re:RIAA has stopped Sueing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      he RIAA announced that they were terminating their practices of filing hundreds of civil lawsuits [google.com] so your jaywalking children should be okay.

      And then they proceeded to continue filing lawsuits like they never said that: http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/03/hypocrisy-or-necessity-riaa-continues-filing-lawsuits.ars

    6. Re:RIAA has stopped Sueing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So would this also apply to the Video Game Console market, where every game is the exact same price on release and whenever that price changes, the change is reflected by every company producing the games?

  9. Price fixing on CDs by locallyunscene · · Score: 4, Funny

    So they're finally calling them on the price fixing of CDs?

    I wonder if Hollywood Accounting could save them.

    1. Re:Price fixing on CDs by Sockatume · · Score: 2, Interesting

      They don't need Hollywood Accounting. Ask any musician how much money a record release actually makes them these days. It's clearly not a profitable business!

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
  10. Huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Huh?

  11. Why not pass along cost savings? by tepples · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Can't [all major labels' simultaneous royalty] increase (approximately 7%) be explained by typical inflation and justifiably be expected every two years?

    Why doesn't it decrease as the cost of producing music decreases? Look at how much it cost to record an album in 1980 vs. now.

    1. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by Znork · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Because with monopoly pricing, the price isn't set in relation to the cost to produce but in relation to the consumers disposable income. You don't lower prices unless the cost of lost sales exceed the revenue lost by lower per-unit price (and sometimes not even then; costs seem to be notoriously difficult for companies to get rid of, basically only competitors undercutting them seem to get it done).

      So until copyright is replaced with a system working as a competitive market, you're simply not going to see any cost savings passed along; it would be economically incompatible with the fundamental structure of monopoly rights.

    2. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by Nazlfrag · · Score: 1

      The only reason it cost so much in 1980 is that the studios were owned and staffed by the record companies resulting in ridiculously inflated prices to take advantage of naive musicians. Doing it yourself has never cost the fortune they charge, it's just pointless trying to compete on their turf.

    3. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by tepples · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I seem to remember that the DIY recording equipment available in 1980 was far lower fidelity and far lower capability than Apple GarageBand of 2010.

    4. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      It's interesting to note the different trends here.

      Over time, the actual cost of making recordings comparable to those made by major recording companies has dropped, and the quality level you can expect has increased. You don't really need that much in the way of specialist hardware these days, since most of it can be done with inexpensive (sometimes free) software. High-end consumer sound cards are probably good enough, when paired with decent microphones, but even professional low-latency sound recording hardware isn't that expensive. The only thing that's even slightly expensive is studio time, but it's not really that difficult or expensive to adequately soundproof a room if you're going to be needing it often.

      You can certainly match the quality of professional recordings from the early '90s without too much trouble or expense.

      On the flip side, "professional" recording has become more expensive, rather than less expensive. They use an insane amount of specialist hardware and software, specially built recording studios, and small armies of people

      The difference is probably something like a 5 or 10% quality improvement, while costing 1000 times as much (note - numbers made up on the spot). The quality improvement hardly matters anyway - it's barely noticeable with CD quality output, it's certainly not noticeable once it's been run through a lossy audio codec, and they tend to wipe out any quality improvement they may have had by mixing everything far too loud, resulting in horrible distortion.

      My guess is that they're just carrying on doing things they way they used to. I don't doubt that, in the '80s, producing a sound recording to go on a CD would have been incredibly difficult, and required a great deal of expensive hardware. Since they've had no real incentive to reduce costs, they've just kept on doing things the same way.

    5. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why doesn't it decrease as the cost of producing music decreases?

      It did. Unfortunately the decrease was offset by the increase in legal fees due to all of the lawsuits they have to file to try to keep you from stealing their shit. Hey, they have to pass along the costs, don't they?

    6. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by Phairdon · · Score: 1

      Why doesn't it decrease as the cost of producing music decreases? Look at how much it cost to record an album in 1980 vs. now.

      This reminded me of a commercial I saw over 10 years ago. It was a guy in a corporation staring at a bottle of olives, trying to figure out how to save money for the company. He runs into his boss's (bosses?) office and tells him that if they just remove 1 olive from each bottle, it will save them such and such millions of dollars.

      So they lowered the quantity of olives that you would buy in the bottle, but kept the sale price the same.

      That's what almost every single company does. When cost goes down, it's just profit for them.

    7. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by aztracker1 · · Score: 1

      The price outside of a monopoly isn't set in relation to the cost to produce. It's a relation of the cost to produce vs. demand at a given cost and production level. Though I agree that there should be saner copyright laws in place.

      --
      Michael J. Ryan - tracker1.info
    8. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by MacWiz · · Score: 1

      Look at how much it cost to record an album in 1980 vs. now.

      Even if that factor remained constant, the savings in distribution are more significant -- No factory, wages or raw materials for duplication, no packaging, no shipping costs, no returns. And they still get to deduct from the artists' royalties for returns and packaging, as far as I know.

      And it's not so much what any label did, it's that they got together to create all of the "joint ventures" which not only allow them to collude, but make it completely unavoidable in order to run the company. As soon as Warner joins in, Vevo will be another one of those.

      I think the biggest problem is the total absence of competition. They think they're competing with iTunes and e-music, two of the largest digital retailers -- because neither will let the labels dictate the retail price.

      But before we cheer too loudly over this, keep in mind that the DOJ is still top-heavy with RIAA attorneys. On the other hand, a) this is the umpteenth time the RIAA has gotten busted for price fixing and b) New York's Attorney General has the evidence this time instead of the FTC.

      All in all, this looks promising. However, the RIAA has always behaved as if antitrust laws do not apply to it -- that's usually when they point out that they're foreign-owned. Usually they get away with it. If not, it's settled out of court with no admission of guilt. This pre-empts future cases from pointing back at their repeated violations -- technically, there are none.

    9. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by NewYorkCountryLawyer · · Score: 1

      before we cheer too loudly over this, keep in mind that the DOJ is still top-heavy with RIAA attorneys

      The DOJ has nothing to do with this case; it's a private class action.

      --
      Ray Beckerman +5 Insightful
    10. Re:Why not pass along cost savings? by MacWiz · · Score: 1

      The DOJ has nothing to do with this case; it's a private class action.

      Well, they weighed in on the Tenenbaum case. That was a civil suit that had nothing to do with the DOJ but they interjected their opinion anyway.

      Not arguing with you, it just seems that they are capable of effecting the outcome, whether they have anything to do with the case or not.

  12. Why was I modded Troll? by rwv · · Score: 1

    I don't support the RIAA, but I also don't support anti-RIAA propaganda that I don't understand. The summary was not as clear about why this trial represents the evil motives of the RIAA. I simply asked for clarification of this fact from somebody who might be more knowledgeable.

    1. Re:Why was I modded Troll? by Runaway1956 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's not the price, it's the collusion. The labels are supposed to be in competition with each other. Slashdot has repeatedly recognized that the business of a business is to make money - by whatever means possible. Without collusion and general agreement in the backrooms and lounges, one or more labels might actually become convinced that giving away lots and lots of music is the true route to fortune. Baen Books has learned that lesson - especially with older books. They release an out of print book, FOR FREE, and people not only start asking for that book, but they purchase even more books by the same author, and/or in the same genre.

      In the case of the labels represented by RIAA, everyone is part of the Good Old Boy's club, everyone is in lockstep, with the same program, same menu, same tactics. They have a happy status quo, and no one is about to rock the boat with anything so barbaric as COMPETITION!!

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    2. Re:Why was I modded Troll? by genmax · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It is also collusion that lets stuff like DRM live on. I think the comment about eMusic in the summary is telling. If the record labels had in reality been competing with each other, DRM would be history by now. It would just take one label to start selling music as mp3s, and customers would flock to them.

    3. Re:Why was I modded Troll? by Runaway1956 · · Score: 1

      Very good point - one I probably should have made. Second to price in importance is CONVENIENCE. Ask any customer. We tech literate bemoan the fact that computer users in general don't want to think about ANYTHING - they expect the computer to read their minds, then lead them by the hands.

      DRM is an inconvenience at some point to EVERYONE! Many posts have been made in the gaming section of slashdot, pointing out that even honest players who wish to obey the rules find games unplayable, so they download the pirated version of the game they just paid $50+ for. The pirate version JUST WORKS!!

      With the entire industry conspiring to make the populace believe that this inconvenience is "necessary", the DOJ has a good case, without ever considering the price of music/games/software.

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    4. Re:Why was I modded Troll? by Dr_Art · · Score: 4, Informative

      The summary was entirely factual, and didn't contain any "anti-RIAA propaganda". Your quote was for a reader comment, not from the original summary.

      Read the Starr vs Sony decision linked in the summary and you'll discover that the appeals judges found the evidence is strong that RIAA members have been colluding using illegal (under antitrust law) methods such as price fixing. E.g., they ask why RIAA members raised the wholesale price from $0.65/song to $0.70/song while the second largest distributor of music, eMusic, was wholesaling at $0.25/song. In the stereotypical "normal free market", competition as well as decreased production costs would lead to lower prices.

    5. Re:Why was I modded Troll? by NewYorkCountryLawyer · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The summary was entirely factual, and didn't contain any "anti-RIAA propaganda". Your quote was for a reader comment, not from the original summary. Read the Starr vs Sony decision linked in the summary and you'll discover that the appeals judges found the evidence is strong that RIAA members have been colluding using illegal (under antitrust law) methods such as price fixing [wikipedia.org]. E.g., they ask why RIAA members raised the wholesale price from $0.65/song to $0.70/song while the second largest distributor of music, eMusic, was wholesaling at $0.25/song. In the stereotypical "normal free market", competition as well as decreased production costs would lead to lower prices.

      I love people who actually read the stuff. Thank you.

      --
      Ray Beckerman +5 Insightful
    6. Re:Why was I modded Troll? by ethorad · · Score: 1

      For me, convenience is more important than price. Since leaving university and starting work I've moved from time rich / cash poor to being cash rich / time poor (relatively speaking ...). I'm more than willing to pay more for something if it's convenient.

      Plus I won't pay *anything* for something if it's inconvenient. I haven't ever "bought" DRMed music, and never will. No matter how cheap they make it - even free - it's not worth my time to deal with issues when I want to move the file onto a different music player, or upgrade my computer. Until recently when DRM free tracks became available CDs were still the way to go as I could rip them easily without worrying about DRM and authentication servers going dark.

  13. payback tag change by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    playback?

  14. Preventing oneself from stealing? by tepples · · Score: 4, Interesting

    You little thieves just need to stop stealing our music!

    Your labels also own music publishers, the companies that own copyright in the music and lyrics apart from the recording. If you provide us indie songwriters with an automated way to check any song we've written against these music publishers' catalogs to make sure we didn't screw up like George Harrison ("My Sweet Lord") or Michael Bolton ("Love Is a Wonderful Thing"), we might take you up on this offer.

  15. What will I get? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I've bought hundreds of dollars in music (mostly online) over the last 5 years. If in fact the court rules that they have been fixing prices will I get any of that money back?

  16. rightly named clause by slashdime · · Score: 3, Funny

    Screw these MF's and their MFN's!

  17. Anyone know any truly independent labels? by JSBiff · · Score: 2, Interesting

    It occurs to me that all it takes to break up a 'cartel' like this is one or two successful publishers who are not owned or controlled in any way by the existing publishers, and that such independent publishers are willing to really compete with the other labels to sign talent and publish music. The question is, are there any independent labels right now? I remember seeing a chart sometime ago which showed how a lot of 'independent labels' are really owned by the big music publishers, who just use those other labels to either serve niche markets, or create the illusion of having alternatives to dealing with them.

    Anyone know of any labels which really, truly, are independent, with which bands and music lovers might do business?

    1. Re:Anyone know any truly independent labels? by Nakor+BlueRider · · Score: 1

      Off the top of my head, DFTBA Records is truly independant afaik. They're rather small of course.

    2. Re:Anyone know any truly independent labels? by Trev311 · · Score: 1

      <quote><p>It occurs to me that all it takes to break up a 'cartel' like this is one or two successful publishers who are not owned or controlled in any way by the existing publishers, and that such independent publishers are willing to really compete with the other labels to sign talent and publish music. The question is, are there any independent labels right now? I remember seeing a chart sometime ago which showed how a lot of 'independent labels' are really owned by the big music publishers, who just use those other labels to either serve niche markets, or create the illusion of having alternatives to dealing with them.</p><p>Anyone know of any labels which really, truly, are independent, with which bands and music lovers might do business?</p></quote>

      riaaradar.com might be of some use to you. It will give you if a particular album was released by a label associated with the RIAA. They have a disputes page too which will help for questionable labels.

      Other than that, Dischord (started by Ian MacKaye of Minor Threat and Fugazi fame) and Ipecac (started by Mike Patton of Faith No More and Tomahawk fame) both come to mind as "independent". They might have some distribution deal, but other than that I don't know of either having any ownership ties to the "major" labels

    3. Re:Anyone know any truly independent labels? by zerocool^ · · Score: 1

      I know it's late replying. There are lots of independent labels, and the cost of recording and producing music is dropping significantly every year. 20 years ago, digital recording used to take $500,000 worth of equipment (racks full of DATs), 10 years ago it took $5000 (several echo laylas with preamps, hardware compressor, mixing board/preamp), now it takes $500 (two M-Audio Delta 1010LT and CEPro will give you simultaneous 20 track recording).

      The problem is distribution. A lot of indie labels still have distribution deals with the big guys, which, to me, just perpetuates the system. Bands jump ship from indie to major label in order to get their records into walmart/bestbuy.

      Don't worry. The internet is changing that. Soon that piece of the puzzle will fall off of the map, and at that point, there won't be any need for a record label. Bands will pay a recording studio to perform work, take the masters to a producer to perform the mix, get the album, sell it online. They'll have a management staff to coordinate merchandise and touring.

      After recording, touring support, merch support, and distribution, the only reason labels exist is to loan a band money. As the price comes down, this will continue to fall away.

      30 years, and we will have witnessed the death of the Major record label. We live in exciting times.

      ~X

      --
      sig?
  18. How Will Judgements be Paid? by CodeBuster · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Thanks for bringing this to our attention NYC, but if you'll excuse the pun, we've heard this tune before. Suppose that the RIAA loses and is ordered to pay restitution, but instead of cash the court allows the RIAA and its members to "pay" by donating a selection of CDs or downloads of their choice (i.e. their choice of the worst selling items) while valuing them, for the purposes of the settlement, at "full retail" (even though almost none of them actually sell at that price in the real world). What will prevent them from offering an equally "useless" settlement payment, as they have been allowed to do in the past, again this time?

    1. Re:How Will Judgements be Paid? by L4t3r4lu5 · · Score: 1

      Don't be daft, they'll value them at the same as used in their court cases and release one Britney Spears and one S-Club-7 track to Creative Commons.

      --
      Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
    2. Re:How Will Judgements be Paid? by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Suppose that the RIAA loses and is ordered to pay restitution, but instead of cash the court allows the RIAA and its members to "pay" by donating a selection of CDs or downloads of their choice (i.e. their choice of the worst selling items)

      Don't bet on it. They can only get away with that shit once. It isn't the court that decided that last time, it was a negotiated settlement between the various state DAs offices and the RIAA. The DAs just didn't realize what sharks they were dealing with. I know this because an ex of mine was a junior DA from one of the smaller states on that case and she even got herself quoted in their local paper saying something to the effect of, "I'm sure the senior DAs from around the country will not allow the RIAA to wiggle out of this settlement." Its about 10 years later and that newspaper interview is still one of the funniest things I have to give her shit about.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
  19. Don't miss out kids! by Nazlfrag · · Score: 3, Informative
    1. Re:Don't miss out kids! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The whole process of watching the internet route around content protection in a matter of minutes, in an article about the RIAA getting sued.

      It's like my birthday suddenly was Christmas, and then suddenly both were today.

      I love you slashdot.

    2. Re:Don't miss out kids! by biryokumaru · · Score: 2, Informative

      "This video contains content from Sony Music Entertainment, who has decided to block it in your country."

      --
      When you're afraid to download music illegally in your own home, then the terrorists have won!
    3. Re:Don't miss out kids! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      I like how this works in the US (but aparently nowhere else), but the same video by Sony is blocked in the US. At least, I am assuming that is the same video.

  20. The irony is overwhelming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I assume that your link is to this song, "Don't download this song" by Weird Al.. The song is quite heavy and very obvious critic against RIAA and it's scare tactics of destroying lives because of a few downloaded songs and about how they have the whole legal system (lawyers, judges the police) under their control. The irony of not being able to legally watch the video outside USA is overwhelming.

    That is very common, however. For example many TV shows can't be watched online from Europe anymore. Southpark and The Daily Show being two of the many series that you used to be able to watch online for free (and see some commercials) but now need to download from bittorrent. I could of course just use VPN to some host in USA but really... If I need to go through the trouble of circumventing the protections anyway, my interest to pay for a good VPN and watch the ads isn't that high.

    1. Re:The irony is overwhelming by Jedi+Alec · · Score: 1

      Here in the Netherlands I can still watch all of the content on the Comedy Central site. I *do* get ads for dutch companies however. And since they only seem to have been able to attract 2 advertisers so far...

      --

      People replying to my sig annoy me. That's why I change it all the time.
  21. Wonder if the 6 billion lawsuit will be mentioned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    that is the fact that the canadian arm of the R.I.A.A. up here called the CRIA hasnt paid 300,000 artists since 1980.

    BOY oh boy thats a bomb to say in court eh?
    if they are commercially pirating up in canada , are they doing it in the USA and other countries and does that mean that record breaking profit year really mean profit to the riaa OR is it fraudulently stolen monies.

  22. The REAL pdf link by ansak · · Score: 1

    The link in the article points to a framed view of the PDF. The PDF itself is here. Let's post bare links please? ...ank

    --
    Still hoping for Gentle Treatment...
  23. Re:Exactly... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Its not "MFN" any more than buying protection from gangsters is "Insurance". It is akin to extortion.

  24. cartel by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Considering you can probably make a duplicate copy and deliver it for like a penny or so, some very small figure like that, plus the lock step price increases, this shows blatant price gouging plus cartel collusion to maintain universal high level price gouging for digital "products".

  25. Competition or lack thereof by tepples · · Score: 1

    When cost goes down, it's just profit for them.

    Until competition for customers pushes the price down. Ideally, for a customer A seeking service, multiple providers P1, P2, and P3 compete over providing a better service at a better price. In the case of publishing contracts, A is the artist and P1, P2, and P3 are labels, who compete over providing production, distribution, and promotion to recording artists at a better royalty rate. So why doesn't this competition happen in practice?

  26. I can think of one evil by zogger · · Score: 1

    They've gone way out of their way to destroy ubiquitous use of replicator technology, lobbying and working for a legal precedent to enshrine on purpose artificial scarcity as akin to or equal to natural scarcity.

        Digital copies are our first credible true replicator tech. Part of the 24th century got here early. The actual true cost of copies of digital products has dropped to almost zero. Instead of being hailed as one of mankind's greatest achievements, and extended across the globe so that all of humanity may share in bounty, they want to restrict, make illegal, hinder, repress and demonize this amazing scientific and engineering breakthrough. This is a hideous blow to the future, a simply terrible legal and societal precedent, for when we have tangible replicators.

    What they have so far succeeded in doing is similar to if after Gutenberg's contributions, that all copies of books had to still reflect in price and access at the previous cost and access of hand scribed copies.

    That would have been a terrible legal precedent..I think we are all glad it didn't happen.

    We have a much more profound situation today, a total game changer, modern tech has made "expensive" copies of digital products obsolete, but the laws have carved in stone much earlier tech's pricing and access structures.

    Why? How long will the hand scribers labors and prices be maintained, when there simply is no need, and they, in fact, no longer scribe? Why restrict it artificially that way, just because the older tech existed? Doesn't time move forward? Where is the endgame there? This is the clichéd buggywhip industry made to be supreme law, it must be maintained? Again, why?

    I call that artificial restriction evil, basically a crime against future humanity, a serious crime against our progeny, we are inflicting this on them, to restrict simply wonderful tech advances like that, not only for now, but in the future when we have much better tangible replicators.

    We already have some good beginnings in that field, but what happens when we really can eliminate "want" in a number of tangible areas technically, but legally restrict it? If this legal precedent is allowed to stand..eventually our progress as a technological civilization will slow to a crawl and then become locked in a "legal" time frame limbo, that every year thereafter falls further and further behind reality.

    Evolution is very popular on this site. Shouldn't we be embracing societal and legal evolution to reflect and harmonize more with modern scientific and engineering advances? Shouldn't there be more of a balance?

        The only change we have had is a change to make it *worse*, to go back in time, to make restrictions on digital copies be of much longer duration, and to be more onerous, and to devote more of our legal system in maintaining this "artificial scarcity" model, to maintain the holy guild of the hand scribers even when they no longer scribe, to maintain the illusion that this is somehow still hard or expensive, instead of just naturally embracing it and evolving along with it.

    1. Re:I can think of one evil by zerocool^ · · Score: 1

      I love you.

      --
      sig?
  27. Well, thanks, new friend by zogger · · Score: 1

    Ha! At least some one read it! Had some more pieces over the weekend that I think are still virgins. I am afflicted with a bad case of "amateur futurist" with a side dressing of keyboard sadism, I love to write, which means type, and suck really bad at the typing part, I demolish the poor things. I even killed a Model M. So I appreciate it when I get read, it gets to be a lot like work for me...luckily this past weekend was cold wet and rainy so I had some spare time inside where I could write. I do farming, and this time of year just isn't all that much work for me besides getting in the firewood for next year and taking care of some beefers. Spring/summer/fall though..a lot more work.

    I checked out your journals, you need to catch up some!