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Robotic Audi To Brave Pikes Peak Without a Driver

Scifi83 writes "A team of researchers at the Center for Automotive Research at Stanford (CARS) has filled the trunk of an Audi TTS with computers and GPS receivers, transforming it into a vehicle that drives itself. The car will attempt Pikes Peak without a driver at race speeds, something that's never been done."

197 comments

  1. I, for one by electricbern · · Score: 3, Funny

    would like to welcome our robotic driver overlords.

    --
    alias possession='chmod 666 satan && ls /dev > il && tail daemon.log'
    1. Re:I, for one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

      would like to welcome our robotic driver overlords.

      Considering all the inattentive people, old people, jerks (especially the BMW and Audi drivers), losers on cell phones, and teen age drivers who have no business driving, I absolutely agree with you.

      I hate driving and I hate cars, but in America, cars are a necessity.

    2. Re:I, for one by electricbern · · Score: 1

      Ok. Is this meme dead? I didn't get the e-mail.

      --
      alias possession='chmod 666 satan && ls /dev > il && tail daemon.log'
    3. Re:I, for one by insufflate10mg · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Doesn't it suck? I remember teaching my younger sister how to drive. She was particularly good for her age... and for being a female.. (sorry, but it's true). I would've rather driven with her than most of my friends/family who were driving for years.

      I always said to her: Don't think I'm nitpicking and being annoying, it isn't you I don't trust, it's the rest of the world.

    4. Re:I, for one by Hognoxious · · Score: 2, Funny

      In Soviet Russia, robotic driver overlords welcome YOU!!!!

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    5. Re:I, for one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Half life 2 came out in 2004. it's 2010. it's time to put the meme away son.

    6. Re:I, for one by IANAAC · · Score: 1
      No, it lives, just like every other meme you've ever heard and wanted to forget.

      You're on slashdot.

    7. Re:I, for one by Rasperin · · Score: 0, Troll

      Hey guys! Have you seen this thing called http://goatse.cx?!??! It's the coolest thing in the world!

      What's sad is that I saw someone spoof a tinyurl to goatse the other day on slashdot. I weeped a tear that day. You think HL2 is old.

      --
      WTF Slashdot, why do I have to login 50 times to post?
    8. Re:I, for one by FrigBot · · Score: 1

      That meme is also dead, thanks very much.

    9. Re:I, for one by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

      would like to welcome our robotic driver overlords. (Score:1, Offtopic)

      Somebody with a mod point earned a chocolate bar!

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    10. Re:I, for one by flyneye · · Score: 1

      How about:
      Manitou Springs, Bombs Away!
      or
      Volkswagen does it , again.

      All I wanna know is, do the onboard computers have an A.I. and did someone slip "Thelma and Louise" into the DVD?

      --
      *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
    11. Re:I, for one by Philip_the_physicist · · Score: 1

      I, for one, really do want this. When these things are finally road-legal to drive themselves, the problem of getting home after a night out without paying an arm and a leg for a taxi is solved.

    12. Re:I, for one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You fail it, n00b.

    13. Re:I, for one by Lars+T. · · Score: 0

      I, for one, really do want this. When these things are finally road-legal to drive themselves, the problem of getting home after a night out without paying an arm and a leg for a taxi is solved.

      Only if your home is on Pikes Peak.

      --

      Lars T.

      To the guy who modded me down from perfect to terrible Karma - Apple haters still suck

  2. Explanation by OpenSourced · · Score: 5, Funny

    The researchers have programmed Shelley to handle like a racecar by using a set of computer calculations called algorithms

    Ha! So that's how they did it! Quite simple, really, once you know the trick.

    --
    Rome taught me patience and assiduous application to detail. Virtues which temper the boldness of great, general views.
    1. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      damn it! why didn't anyone tell me about these "algorithms" before? They sound so useful!

    2. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

      Jimmy Carter decided to start a rock band consisting of ex-Presidents. He recruited George Bush and Bill Clinton, but they still needed a drummer. Clinton suggested his vice president, who had after all come within a hair's breadth of the presidency himself. The band soon started getting gigs all the time, many of these at swanky country clubs and mansions. One particular venue had such a powerful sound system that all guests had to stay several dozen yards away from the speakers or suffer serious hearing impairment. On the day that the Ex-Presidents were to perform, the club hired several new butlers to serve the large number of guests who would attend. One in particular had not been informed about the unusual power of the speaker system. In the middle of a drum solo, he tragically attempted to walk in front of the speakers to bring someone a drink, and his brain suffered a massive hemorrhage. He was pronounced dead at the scene. The autopsy report would record, "The Al Gore rhythm killed Jeeves."

    3. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The researchers have programmed Shelley to handle like a racecar by using a set of computer calculations called algorithms

      Ha! So that's how they did it! Quite simple, really, once you know the trick.

      I hope they patent this "algorithm" idea before somebody else comes along and tries to use them.

    4. Re:Explanation by whopub · · Score: 5, Funny

      Truth is, it's probable just The Stig in the trunk, with a laptop.

    5. Re:Explanation by tool462 · · Score: 4, Funny

      Bah. "Algorithm" is just doublespeak for "Mechanical Turk."

      Some say he can steer a car just by thinking evasive thoughts.
      And if he turns the wheel, the road will slide easily underneath his car like a waitress with Tiger Woods.
      All I know is that it'll be driven by The Stig.

    6. Re:Explanation by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      The researchers have programmed Shelley

      God, I hope that's a typo. Does no one read Asimov any more? The car's name should be Sally. It would fit perfectly; iirc the story tales place in 2020, and Sally is an antique.

      As Asimov coined the word "robotics" and this car is a robot, it's a damned shame if they didn't pay homage.

    7. Re:Explanation by cmiller173 · · Score: 2

      While the algorithms that make it handle like a racecar seem interesting I'm more concerned about the algorithms for emotion, I mean the headline says this driver-less car will "brave" Pikes Peak. How exactly is the bravery implemented? What if next it decides to "brave" global domination?

    8. Re:Explanation by MaWeiTao · · Score: 5, Informative

      The car is named after Michèle Mouton, her nickname apparently was Shelley, the most successful female rally driver to date. Apparently she's considered the most successful female driver in all of motorsports. And it just so happens she drove Audi's and she was the first woman to win the Pikes Peak hill climb. I'd say that's a far more appropriate reference than anything from Asimov.

    9. Re:Explanation by RobDude · · Score: 1

      Top Female Driver?

      Where does that put her overall?

    10. Re:Explanation by Chris+Burke · · Score: 4, Funny

      How exactly is the bravery implemented? What if next it decides to "brave" global domination?

      Don't worry! The scientists have that covered.

      To have bravery, you first must have fear. So the first and most difficult step was to program the car to be afraid all the time. Then, to get bravery, they simply program it to ignore its fear when it's driving up Pike's Peak.

      The rest of the time it's a total scaredy-car. If you think it's trying to dominate the globe, just shout "boo!" at it and it'll drive off to cower in the corner and cry.

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    11. Re:Explanation by SnarfQuest · · Score: 1

      Here's the program:

      1. We've placed one of those robotic sex dolls at the top of the peak.
      2. If you can get to her, she's yours.

      Gets you all the speed up the trail that you could ever desire.

      --
      Who would win this election: Andrew Weiner vs Andrew Weiner's weiner.
    12. Re:Explanation by EsbenMoseHansen · · Score: 2, Informative

      Top Female Driver?

      Where does that put her overall?

      Well, she won something, came second in something else and then quit due to rule changes. But please, read the article already.

      --
      Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by rulers as useful.
    13. Re:Explanation by Arthur+Grumbine · · Score: 1

      How exactly is the bravery implemented?

      /s/fear/courage/g

      --
      Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure everything I just said is completely wrong.
    14. Re:Explanation by RobDude · · Score: 1

      I'm not much of a race fan - so while her Wikipedia does tell what races she's won, I don't have a frame of reference.

      I know that the Pikes Peak race has been going on for nearly 100 years...and that this was the first girl to win.

      I don't know how she relates to male drivers.

      Is racing a male-dominated sport? Or is gender insignificant?

    15. Re:Explanation by mrdoogee · · Score: 1, Funny

      Pfft. Call me when she's making sexually suggestive domain registrar commercials.

    16. Re:Explanation by toastar · · Score: 1

      An Audi in not a Corvette.

    17. Re:Explanation by bareman · · Score: 1

      They did mention that the car was going to be equipped with a "Kill Switch".

    18. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Alogorithm - that's bad. It sounds like either Al Gore had something to do with it, or one of those crazy, never invented anything in their lives, ayrabs may be behind this.

    19. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Drove Audi's what?

    20. Re:Explanation by Cobalt+Jacket · · Score: 1

      Yes, a Corvette would be hard-pressed to do anything worthwhile once it leaves the pavement. Or were you trying to be insulting?

    21. Re:Explanation by GIL_Dude · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Well, you see the Al Gore isms are only useful to Al Gore as he has copyright on them. Things like:

      I invented the internet.
      I am still green because I buy carbon credits.
      An inconvenient truth

      And other Al Gore isms all must be either attributed or licensed from Al.

    22. Re:Explanation by quanticle · · Score: 1

      Racing is very male dominated. While there aren't any rules (anymore) preventing female drivers from competing, there just hasn't been a lot of female participation in auto racing of any sort.

      --
      We all know what to do, but we don't know how to get re-elected once we have done it
    23. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You'll never see this, because I'm posting as AC, but...
      Asimov coined "Robitics?" Google R.U.R. (Rossum's Universal Robots), by Karel Capek

    24. Re:Explanation by StarfishOne · · Score: 1

      "I'd say that's a far more appropriate reference than anything from Asimov"

      Yes, Shelley or Walter Rohrl! :-D _O_

    25. Re:Explanation by Goonie · · Score: 1

      The World Rally Championship is the highest level of competition in that sport. So winning rounds of it, and coming second in the championship, indicates that you're pretty bloody good.

      I'd hazard a guess that such results rank her in the top 30 rally drivers, all-time.

      --

      Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
      --Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
    26. Re:Explanation by gad_zuki! · · Score: 1

      >Some say he can steer a car just by thinking evasive thoughts.

      Works great, if you can think in German, that is.

    27. Re:Explanation by yachius · · Score: 2, Informative
    28. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      some people feel the need to bring political bashing into every conversation. How useless!

    29. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your blog is incredibly dull.

    30. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That depends very much on who you're asking. Some motor sport fans say WRC, others laugh and say Formula 1 and some - like me - consider both to be the pinnacle of motor sport but very different. Rally cars reach autobahn speeds on tiny gravel roads in the middle of forests whilst Formula 1 cars reach bullet train speeds on track. The latter is arguably the most physically demanding sport in existence since driving is the equivalent of holding 80 lbs weights in front of you for 1.5 hours with 3-5 G forces pulling you in different directions several times per minute. And considering where most tracks are located, in extreme heat as well. There's a reason why Formula 1 drivers have better endurance than marathon runners. Now as far as women drivers are concerned, since Rallying isn't as physically demanding, there shouldn't be any difference between the sexes but only a couple of women have tested Formula 1 cars and it's pretty safe to say that the reason they're not racing isn't just Bernie Ecclestone's well known sexism.

    31. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Top Female Driver?

      Where does that put her overall?

      I suppose she hangs it on a hook after each race.

      LOL! captcha: garment

    32. Re:Explanation by paxcoder · · Score: 1

      That might seem obvious to you, but pretending algorithms aren't "computer calculations" is what entire software patent law hinges on.
      The thing is that mathematical ideas are ineligible for patenting, so it's important to convince courts that that's what algorithms really are. Knuth himself felt obligated to point this out: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090603224807259

    33. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Asimov coined "Robitics?" Google R.U.R. (Rossum's Universal Robots), by Karel Capek"

      Yes, please, do it. And then return if you happen to find Rossum mentioning "Robotics" even a single time.

    34. Re:Explanation by turbidostato · · Score: 1

      "To have bravery, you first must have fear."

      Humm, no, you had it wrong, young padawan. Fear leads to anger, not bravery. Everybody in the council knows that.

    35. Re:Explanation by code_monkey_steve · · Score: 1

      Ooh, they have algorithms on computers, now?

    36. Re:Explanation by SvnLyrBrto · · Score: 1

      Right on all counts. But I will forever consider rallying to be the more interesting sport because it involves cars which a mere mortal like myself has a chance of owning and driving. I could buy an STI at my local Subaru dealer, strip out some weight, add a roll cage, and have a credible rally car. (Not that I have anywhere near the skill level to drive it.). An F1 car is so far beyond anything I could ever own that it's barely even worth considering.

      --
      Imagine all the people...
    37. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He mentioned robots. That's good enough, you pedantic little turd.

    38. Re:Explanation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Heh. Even though I, as I said, am a fan of both, the very reason why I like watching is the very "I could not do that!" factor. It's the same reason why I'm really not interested in e.g. swimming or watching computer game pros play since despite the enormous difference in ability, it is something I can do. As far as such sports are concerned, I much prefer doing to watching.

    39. Re:Explanation by YourExperiment · · Score: 1

      I've played Clue before, but you must have a different version to the rest of us.

    40. Re:Explanation by YourExperiment · · Score: 1

      Quite an enlightening article overall. I also learnt that "Audi's steering system normally responds to the steering wheel". Fascinating stuff.

    41. Re:Explanation by Ghost+Hedgehog · · Score: 1

      the most successful female rally driver to date.

      You mean WRC rally driver. Jutta Kleinschmidt won the Dakar rally and just as successful of even more successful than Mouton. The Dakar rally is harder and more rallying (no closed down roads) than the WRC and winning the Dakar is quite an achievement.

    42. Re:Explanation by Idiomatick · · Score: 1

      Off topic but the actual mechanical turk today is actually a computer/animatronic that is faking looking like a real person hiding in a box. :D

    43. Re:Explanation by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      Kapek coined "robot", Asimov coined "robotics". You're wrong, grow up and get over it.

  3. Don't turn off the debugging code! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Side effects are a bitch when you need to tell left from right.

  4. Note to Self by Kozar_The_Malignant · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Observe trials from uphill side of road.

    --
    Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.
    1. Re:Note to Self by nacturation · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Observe trials from uphill side of road.

      No kidding. If ever a story deserved a "whatcouldpossiblygowrong" tag...

      --
      Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
    2. Re:Note to Self by couchslug · · Score: 4, Funny

      "Observe trials from uphill side of road."

      It's an Audi, not a Toyota!

      --
      "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
    3. Re:Note to Self by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've actually done simulations on this vehicle. To be honest it never actually makes it to the top, but something very strange does happen to the computer when it goes off-road. It suddenly starts writing out this text:

      What's happening? Who am I? Why am I here? What's my purpose in life? What do I mean by who am I? Okay okay, calm down calm down get a grip now. Ooh, this is an interesting sensation. What is it? Its a sort of tingling in my... well I suppose I better start finding names for things. Let's call it a... tailpipe! Yeah! Tailpipe! And hey, what's this roaring sound, whooshing past what I'm suddenly gonna call my engine? Wind! Is that a good name? It'll do. Yeah, this is really exciting. I'm dizzy with anticipation! Or is it the wind? There's an awful lot of that now isn't it? And what's this thing coming toward me very fast? So big and flat and round, it needs a big wide sounding name like 'Ow', 'Ownge', 'Round', 'Ground'! That's it! Ground! Ha! I wonder if it'll be friends with me? Hello, Ground! *CONNECTION LOST*

      I can't figure out where this is coming from. I also can't get a good cup of tea around here.

    4. Re:Note to Self by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Observe trials from uphill side of road.

      Second note to self: After a switchback, the uphill side of the road becomes the downhill side of the road. Maybe viewing from a helicopter would be better.

    5. Re:Note to Self by mobby_6kl · · Score: 1

      That's not too different from when the humans are driving, then. Lots of people of course still stand in the most retarded places possible, and occasionally pay for that dearly when somebody misses the braking point by a fraction of a second.

    6. Re:Note to Self by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Observe trials from uphill side of road.

      Unfortunately, the uphill side is the downhill side after the next switchback . . .

    7. Re:Note to Self by Krneki · · Score: 1

      First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. I hope there won't be a need for the 3rd step with AI, but as history teach us, humans are creatures of habits.

      --
      Love many, trust a few, do harm to none.
    8. Re:Note to Self by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Observe trials from uphill side of road."

      It's an Audi, not a Toyota!

      Well played, on so many levels.

    9. Re:Note to Self by moosesocks · · Score: 1

      Actually, you could perform this peak just as easily with a Toyota:

      1) Point the Toyota at the top of the mountain
      2) Push down on the accelerator
      3) Jump out the door.
      4) .....
      5) Profit

      --
      -- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
    10. Re:Note to Self by rubycodez · · Score: 1

      too many steps, Toyota will spontaneously do #2 for you

    11. Re:Note to Self by Wayne247 · · Score: 1

      Actually, you are just as likely to be hit. A miscalculated oversteer turn (drift) could make the car plunge right on the inside of the track. I would observe a robotic car driving from far away...

  5. They can try Mt. Washington Auto Road next by c0d3g33k · · Score: 1

    It may not be as tall as Pike's Peak, but it's a more challenging road, IMHO. http://www.concierge.com/cntraveler/blogs/perrinpost/2007/08/this-car-climbe.html

    1. Re:They can try Mt. Washington Auto Road next by jnaujok · · Score: 3, Informative

      But does Mount Washington have an annual, scheduled race period where the road is closed to everyone except racers? The Pikes Peak Hill Climb is one of the oldest auto races in the world and has been held for close to 100 years.

      --
      Life, the Universe, and Everything... in my image.
    2. Re:They can try Mt. Washington Auto Road next by elysiana · · Score: 1

      Why yes, they did. It hasn't been run in recent years, but it is in fact older than the Pikes Peak race.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Washington_Hillclimb_Auto_Race

      Having been up Mount Washington in a regular car, doing regular speeds, and seeing a wall of rock on one side and a sheer cliff on the other, with no guardrails along the majority, I can't say that I have the urge to see if I could drive up it at racing speeds. That takes a special kind of crazy - an AWESOME kind.

    3. Re:They can try Mt. Washington Auto Road next by necro81 · · Score: 2, Informative

      The biggest event on the Mt Washington auto road is actually a running race held each summer. It's an intermediate distance road race - about 8 miles (12.7 km) long. But it's uphill all the way: there's 4600 ft (1400 m) of elevation gain, which tends to make it feel more like a half marathon. Also, it's held on the mountain that claims to have the "world's worst weather." It is not atypical for the course start to have temperatures in a 60s at the start of the race under clear skies, only to have the runners finish in near-freezing temperatures, fog, and 50 knot winds.

      In spite of that, the winner of the race generally can finish in only one hour. Last year's winner made it in just under an hour.

    4. Re:They can try Mt. Washington Auto Road next by Andy+Dodd · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Sounds like a PERFECT time to unleash an autonomous racing vehicle.

      Especially if the goal is AI research. We have chess-playing computers, we need GTA-playing computers.

      --
      retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
    5. Re:They can try Mt. Washington Auto Road next by treeves · · Score: 1

      I drove up there once around my birthday (mid-September), but not all that fast - I drove an F-150 pickup. I enjoyed it immensely, especially the thick rime covering everything at the station at the top. Do they still claim the fastest recorded wind speed of 230-something mph?

      --
      ...the future crusty old bastards are already drinking the Kool-Aid.
    6. Re:They can try Mt. Washington Auto Road next by jnaujok · · Score: 1

      Pike's Peak Marathon is held every summer too. That's 13 miles to go up 7000 feet, and then 13 miles back down. I believe Matt Carpenter ran it last year in a record time of 3:37:02, with the ascent part of that being 2:12:04. They also go from summer temperatures at the base of Barr Trail (elev 6500'+) of 70-80 degrees to sub-freezing at the summit (elev 14,111').

      --
      Life, the Universe, and Everything... in my image.
  6. PP is an exciting road by smellsofbikes · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Having raced up Pikes Peak myself, I think this is pretty impressive. The road surface varies from almost-pavement-quality treated packed dirt, to completely loose gravel on rut-filled rock, with (as I recall) an average 10% climb. It'd be a great test ground for offroad stuff at a slow speed with nobody else on the road, but doing it at full speed requires a *lot* more than just the ability to see where the roadway is: giving a robot the ability to keep a fast car from skidding/sliding on loose gravel on an off-camber turn appears to me to be a wholly different type of challenge than previous autonomous driving projects.

    --
    Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    1. Re:PP is an exciting road by Tiger4 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Rapid reaction time, good slide slip sensors, and some great counterintuitive steering routines are all going to be essential if this is going to be "at race speeds". Good trained drivers screw this kind of thing up all the time. A robot can be programmed to be repeatable, but is this one flexible enough to conditions to be fast AND safe?

      Look out below!

      --
      Behold, this dreamer cometh. Come now, and let us slay him... and we shall see what will become of his dreams.
    2. Re:PP is an exciting road by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      ...and some great counterintuitive steering routines...

      I didn't realize programs/algorithms/AI could distinguish between 'intuitive' and 'counterintuitive'.

    3. Re:PP is an exciting road by Tiger4 · · Score: 1

      Now you know. And Knowing is half the battle.

      --
      Behold, this dreamer cometh. Come now, and let us slay him... and we shall see what will become of his dreams.
    4. Re:PP is an exciting road by nomel · · Score: 1

      Rapid reaction time, good slide slip sensors, and some great counterintuitive steering routines are all going to be essential if this is going to be "at race speeds".

      Unfortunately, *realtime* reaction time has nothing to do with staying on the road if physics wont allow it. If you go into a corner too fast, then you're quick reaction could put you into a beautiful sideways controlled drift, right past the point where the surface of the road stops existing. This means the car must also have some very impressive "look ahead". If it doesn't have a map of the road, it'll have to predict a safe speed for any blind turns (I imagine nearly all of them are) while considering the road surface conditions. I assume they use a pretty precise map (something like rally), and leaves road conditions to the traction sensors...does or doesn't have a map...still extremely impressive.

      It would be interesting to through something at it like a blind hairpin turn with a nice tarmac to pea gravel covered tarmac transition around the bend. There's a popular youtube (blocked at work, can't get link) video of that type of condition with a blind type of rally race (no map) with human drivers...I remember about 5 cars rolling!

    5. Re:PP is an exciting road by Radical+Moderate · · Score: 1

      "giving a robot the ability to keep a fast car from skidding/sliding on loose gravel on an off-camber turn appears to me to be a wholly different type of challenge than previous autonomous driving projects."

      Actually, that's the easy part. It's called Traction Control, and it's standard on pretty much all cars sold in the US these days. Given that the article mentions how they're using a lot of Audi's electronics and sensor systems, I expect they'll leave these systems in place.

      It is true that a good driver is probably faster without the Traction Control, so it would be interesting if they rolled their own that was dialed in for maximum cornering speed instead of safety.

      --
      Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
    6. Re:PP is an exciting road by smellsofbikes · · Score: 1

      I don't think Traction Control handles the problem I'm pointing out. It's one thing to actively control the torque going to the wheels to prevent them sliding. It's a completely different thing to be on a long straight, going fast, and decide that the approaching hairpin turn is filled with gravel and sand and you need to slow down *now*. I've seen people slide off curves with their ABS brakes on full because they misjudged the road conditions and went into a turn too fast. No amount of traction control can fix too much inertia for the available traction, so you have to make that judgment beforehand. *That* is the part that's hard to implement, because it requires a vision system that can recognize the visual patterns that indicate low-traction roadway.

      --
      Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    7. Re:PP is an exciting road by Andy+Dodd · · Score: 1

      Most drivers I've talked to with far more experience driving on gravel than I do seem to be of the opinion that traction control = BAD NEWS on gravel and that even moderately experienced drivers can do far better than what any TCS can do/allows you to do in terms of maintaining control on gravel.

      Most TC systems are apparently tuned more towards pavement or ice/snow, not towards gravel.

      There's also the fact that, as you state, taking a turn properly requires prior knowledge of the conditions of that turn - traction control only handles the current road conditions.

      --
      retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
    8. Re:PP is an exciting road by G-Man · · Score: 1

      I'm curious when you raced Pikes Peak - I watched the race a couple of years ago from lower on the course, and the road was tarmac at that point. It's my understanding that every year the road's owners pave a little more of it, with the goal of eventually paving all the way to the top - they want to make it easier for the tourists to reach the summit. Changes the nature of the PPHC, but economics wins out. Now if 'Shelley' has to handle both tarmac and gravel in the same run, that's actually fairly impressive.

    9. Re:PP is an exciting road by mobby_6kl · · Score: 1

      Definitely, I just don't see them letting the car drive up there without a map. It's difficult enough for human drivers to turn in competitive times without pace notes, but it's going to be even more difficult for a computer to deal with.

      The most interesting part here, IMO, is seeing how the car deals with driving at racing speed vs the more leisurely pace of the previous AI challenge race, where, IIRC, the cars averaged below 30km/h. At those sorts of speeds the car just goes where the wheels are pointing (unless there's a huge rock in the way or something). This, as you say though, requires much more "feel" for the road conditions and understanding of the physics active at every moment.

      Still, it's quite possible that the stock Audi electronics will take care of this, at the expense of not being very fast. Check out Tiff floor the accelerator in a Lambo on snow/ice surface with TC/ESP on and later without. He slides all over the place with the nannies off obviously, but that method is still much faster than with TC on.

      Also, is this the corner you were talking about? It's not clear if it's a hairpin or whether the surface even changes, but the lack of pace notes or advance knowledge of the track results it many cars just flying off the road and into the bushes.

    10. Re:PP is an exciting road by smellsofbikes · · Score: 2, Interesting
      I did it once on a motorcycle back in the mid-1980's and then a couple more times on a bicycle in the mid-90's. (Not that it's worth anything to anyone else but I managed to beat a bunch of pro racers in one of the bike races. The only way you can legally bike up PP is during the race, since it's closed to bicycles the rest of the year.)

      It might not just be economics: there is an enormous amount of environmental damage done by maintaining a high-altitude, high-traffic dirt road. The city of Colorado Springs was complaining about debris, from the hundreds of tons of gravel and fill dumped on the road every year to try and keep it passable, getting into streams that feed into Colorado Springs. I don't think they were part of its water source, but they do flow down into the city.

      --
      Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    11. Re:PP is an exciting road by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The varied road surface that adds so much excitement to race will be going away. The City of Colorado Springs (which manages the road) is being forced to pave the road to the peak, above the tree line.

    12. Re:PP is an exciting road by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Isn't that what the other "robot" (traction control system) is for?

    13. Re:PP is an exciting road by nomel · · Score: 1

      I got as far as the wrong "your", and then dismissed the remainder of the post as the ramblings of a crazy person.

      Agreed. Reworded sentence but didn't reword word.

    14. Re:PP is an exciting road by holmstar · · Score: 1

      It will have a map. Perhaps you should RTFA.

  7. meh by OglinTatas · · Score: 4, Funny

    I already saw this on Speed Racer.
    Spoiler Alert!
    Speed wins the race anyway, and helps Inspector Detector catch the nefarious people behind the robot car

  8. W1N vs. FA1L by S-4'N3 · · Score: 4, Funny

    I am not certain what will be more astonishing: watching this succeed or watching it fail.

    1. Re:W1N vs. FA1L by Carik · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Easy. Watching it succeed will be more astonishing.

      Watching it fail will be more entertaining (assuming some safety precautions preventing anyone from being killed).

    2. Re:W1N vs. FA1L by Chris+Burke · · Score: 4, Funny

      (assuming some safety precautions preventing anyone from being killed).

      Good point!

      The summary only says that the car won't have a driver. I hope they remember to have the passengers get out, too!

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    3. Re:W1N vs. FA1L by Carik · · Score: 1

      I was mostly thinking "make sure there aren't any pedestrians in the way" and "make sure that when it falls off the mountain, it doesn't land on anything important," but getting the passengers out would be valuable too.

    4. Re:W1N vs. FA1L by melikamp · · Score: 1

      This projects strikes me a extremely elitist. I want to see a robot driving a huge bus full of robot passengers doing their regular robot things, like optimizing their energy efficiency, updating their belief systems from a trusted repository, and compressing old files.

    5. Re:W1N vs. FA1L by Chris+Burke · · Score: 1

      Also, don't forget the hooker in the trunk.

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    6. Re:W1N vs. FA1L by Carik · · Score: 1

      Didn't you look at the pictures? That's not a hooker, that's a computer! (Gotta wonder about some of these /. types... though I suppose it could be a robot hooker...)

    7. Re:W1N vs. FA1L by Chris+Burke · · Score: 2, Funny

      That's a computer?!

      Then what's the thing that balances my checkbook and snorts all my coke?!

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    8. Re:W1N vs. FA1L by nacturation · · Score: 1

      Then what's the thing that balances my checkbook and snorts all my coke?!

      That's a Roomba.

      --
      Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
  9. Mount Evans Road by SummitCO · · Score: 1

    Mount Evans Road would be more challenging...

    1. Re:Mount Evans Road by istartedi · · Score: 1

      The Mt. Evans road is paved all the way. I understand Pike's has some gravel. I've been on Evan's but not Pike's. It was challenging for me as a human being from sea level, who hadn't had enough time to acclimate*. For a robot it doesn't seem like such a big deal.

      *The worst effects of mountain sickness came after getting back down. The cumulative effects gave me a wicked headache.

      --
      For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
    2. Re:Mount Evans Road by BLKMGK · · Score: 1

      Pike's Peak has gravel, packed dirt, some asphalt, the works! The change in altitude plays HELL with the engine output even on turbocharged cars so there are many many variables at work. Oh, there's not great guardrails either I understand....

      --
      Build it, Drive it, Improve it! Hybridz.org
    3. Re:Mount Evans Road by jnaujok · · Score: 1

      Guardrails? Guardrails!?! We don't need no stinking GUARDRAILS!

      Seriously though. There aren't any. Well, there's a couple on the paved section (the first 7 miles) but none on the last 13 miles (the section the racers run.)

      --
      Life, the Universe, and Everything... in my image.
    4. Re:Mount Evans Road by Clomer · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I've never been on Mt. Evans, but being from Colorado Springs (at the base of Pikes Peak), I have driven up Pikes Peak. Not as a racer, mind you, just as a tourist, in my '02 Saturn SL2.

      It's not a simple road. Even going slowly, you definitely have to pay attention. Lots of loose gravel and dirt where a moments inattention can result in a skid where you go driving right off the side of the mountain. And as others have pointed out, the difference in elevation wreaks havoc on engine efficiency - going from about 8000 feet elevation at the toll gate to just over 14000 feet at the summit, my car was noticeably more sluggish near the top than it usually is (Colorado Springs, where I do most of my driving, averages at about 6500 feet). As an indication of the hazards of the road, every once in a while there is a local news report of someone driving off the road to their doom.

      Every summer, there is an organized race up the mountain, the Annual Pikes Peak Hill Climb. I assume that this robot will be doing its thing during that race. I look forward to hearing about how well it does.

      --
      Intelligent responses welcome, flames will be met with marshmallows.
    5. Re:Mount Evans Road by c_jonescc · · Score: 1

      Mount Evans Road would be more challenging...

      Except there's not an annual race to the top of Mt. Evans, and therefore nothing to compare. Also, Evans is paved. I'd say the drifting done in the Hill Climb is FAR more challenging.

      --
      Getting diabetes AND salmonella would be a bad weekend.
    6. Re:Mount Evans Road by SummitCO · · Score: 1

      Paved is a somewhat lenient definition of Evans. A more accurate description would be: At some point asphalt was poured directly on the tundra and scree which has since eroded and subsided.

    7. Re:Mount Evans Road by babyrat · · Score: 1

      And as others have pointed out, the difference in elevation wreaks havoc on engine efficiency - going from about 8000 feet elevation at the toll gate to just over 14000 feet at the summit, my car was noticeably more sluggish near the top than it usually is (Colorado Springs, where I do most of my driving, averages at about 6500 feet)

      I'm guessing if they are designing a robot car to do a hill climb, adding in an automatic mixture control wouldn't be all that difficult.

    8. Re:Mount Evans Road by c_jonescc · · Score: 1

      You're being dramatic.

      The Pikes Peak Hill Climb requires drifting on the dirt.

      I've run to the top of Mt. Evans, on the pavement, and in the hours I was trotting my way up, I studied that ground rather intensely. It's not eroded to the point of not being paved at all.

      --
      Getting diabetes AND salmonella would be a bad weekend.
    9. Re:Mount Evans Road by SummitCO · · Score: 1

      I guess its a case of drifting on dirt vs very uneven and undulating surface with dips and potholes. Which is the bigger challenge to the robot car?

    10. Re:Mount Evans Road by holmstar · · Score: 1

      Because the car isn't already equipped to maintain a proper air-fuel mixture right? Oh wait, yes it is. In fact if it didn't carefully monitor and adjust the air-fuel mixture, the turbochargers would blow the engine in a heartbeat, even in normal driving conditions.

  10. Yikes! by neiras · · Score: 3, Funny

    The researchers have programmed Shelley to handle like a racecar by using a set of computer calculations called algorithms

    See what happens when you let Liberal Arts majors playing journalist direct the public's understanding of technical things?

    Soon: "John's car rolled out of his driveway all by itself and hit a fire hydrant, honey! He should sue General Motors for faulty algorithms!"

    1. Re:Yikes! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As a software engineer, +1 Scary...

    2. Re:Yikes! by mooingyak · · Score: 1

      Soon: "John's car rolled out of his driveway all by itself and hit a fire hydrant, honey! He should sue General Motors for faulty algorithms!"

      If someone's car did that, couldn't "faulty algorithms" actually be the problem?

      --
      William of Ockham had no beard. The most likely explanation is that it was chewed off by squirrels every morning.
    3. Re:Yikes! by Grimbleton · · Score: 1

      ESPECIALLY if it was a GM.

    4. Re:Yikes! by Firehed · · Score: 1

      Possibly. But more likely than not, it was because the driver forgot to set the parking brake, or something equally stupid.

      --
      How are sites slashdotted when nobody reads TFAs?
    5. Re:Yikes! by Hurricane78 · · Score: 1

      So you mean, “algorithms” becomes the new “gene”, as in “genetically modified”, meaning “It can’t possibly also have good applications.”?

      Let’s see them become Amish then. ;)
      *must... wait...until... then... to tell them that our own bodies are basically based genetic algorithms* ;)

      --
      Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
    6. Re:Yikes! by jdgeorge · · Score: 1

      The researchers have programmed Shelley to handle like a racecar by using a set of computer calculations called algorithms

      See what happens when you let Liberal Arts majors playing journalist direct the public's understanding of technical things?

      Soon: "John's car rolled out of his driveway all by itself and hit a fire hydrant, honey! He should sue General Motors for faulty algorithms!"

      You're ridiculing the author for clearly and correctly defining the terminology? If the intended audience of the article is unlikely to know what "algorithm" means, don't you think a concise definition is in order? Now, I'm sure that writers assuming an Ivy League audience would reasonably expect people to know what the big words mean.

      Not to mention the fact that there are many Computer Science and Engineering majors who are also capable of effective communication; this is not the sole domain of "liberal arts" majors. Journalism majors... well, make your own judgements.

    7. Re:Yikes! by jd2112 · · Score: 1

      Soon: "John's car rolled out of his driveway all by itself and hit a fire hydrant, honey! He should sue General Motors for faulty algorithms!"

      Didn't Woz say that his Prius was accelerating unexpectedly due to faulty algorithms?

      --
      Any insufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology.
  11. KITT? by jgagnon · · Score: 1

    ;)

    --
    Remember to maintain your supply of /facepalm oil to prevent chafing.
    1. Re:KITT? by Hurricane78 · · Score: 1

      Still needs speech (partially possible), a bar of moving lights (existing), turbo boost (as the lowriders for assistance) and super pursuit mode (might be a biit hard, to accelerate time itself to twice the normal speed. ;)

      Wait for a Chinese-Russian joint-venture, producing KARR! ^^
      And David Hasselhoff with a goatee!

      --
      Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
    2. Re:KITT? by mrdoogee · · Score: 1

      Dammit, now I have to get out my geek cred.

      KARR was not built by the Russians or Chinese. The Knight Automated Roving Robot was the prototype for KITT (Knight Industries Two Thousand). When KARR was powered up for the first time, A programming error (or perhaps a faulty algorithm!!) made its AI unstable and dangerous. Namely KARR was programmed for self-preservation instead of preservation of human life, as KITT was.

        The more you know!

      -yes I know I'm a loser.

    3. Re:KITT? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And David Hasselhoff with a goatee!

      What? David Hasselhoff doing the goatse.cx?

  12. I forsee emergency bridge building projects... by John+Hasler · · Score: 1

    ...when the DOT discovers that Google Maps shows a bridge that isn't there. Yet.

    --
    Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
  13. Price is Right by Wireless+Joe · · Score: 1

    I have an image in my mind of the Price is Right Cliffhangers game, where the guy goes right over the top when you lose. Oh, and the song is now firmly implanted in my brain for the rest of the day.

    1. Re:Price is Right by ubercam · · Score: 1
    2. Re:Price is Right by amicusNYCL · · Score: 1

      For future reference, Family Guy references are never obligatory.

      --
      "Our two-party system is like a bowl of shit looking at itself in a mirror." - Lewis Black
  14. Re:Good thing the robotic car is NOT an Toyota. by brainboyz · · Score: 0

    Except AUDI has been known as 'Accelerates Under Demonic Influence' for some time now.

  15. Bravery by LotsOfPhil · · Score: 1

    It seems like it would be braver to have no driver but still have a passenger.

    --
    This post climbed Mt. Washington.
    1. Re:Bravery by Fnord666 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It seems like it would be braver to have no driver but still have a passenger.

      Maybe they could require the development team to ride along. I'll bet the quality of the code would go way up.

      --
      'The tyrant will always find pretext for his tyranny.' - Aesop's Fables
    2. Re:Bravery by radish · · Score: 1

      But I have a feeling the delivery date would keep slipping...

      --

      ---- Den ene knappen er powerknapp, den andre er Bender voice knapp "Bite My Shiny Metal Ass"

  16. Current achievements? by BoppreH · · Score: 2, Funny

    Shelley has reached speeds of 130 miles per hour without a driver on testing grounds at the Bonneville Salt Flats in Utah.

    I could do much better with a brick.

    1. Re:Current achievements? by cloudmaster · · Score: 1

      What kind of brick?

      • A common red brick has a mass of 1922 Kg/m^3 (ref)
      • A standard brick has dimensions of 3 5/8" x 2 ¼" x 8" (ref)
      • The smallest side (and therefore ideal side for max terminal velocity calculations) is 3 5/8 x 2 1/4, and therefore 8.15625 square inches
      • The mass of the brick would be 2.05510989 Kg (Google calculator ref
      • The coefficient of drag would be 2.1, according to this calculator site (which, incidentally, gives a nonsensical result of 3mph - which is why I did the math myself below)
      • The density of air at 35 celsius is 1.146 kg/m^3(ref), and 95 F seems pretty optimistic for the salt flats this time of year.

      So, Let's do the math with Google so I don't have to convert units, using the formula here. Since Google complains about square roots with more than a number inside, we'll find the answer in mph^2 first, then take the square root of that. Here's the first calculation, which gives 15 932.3342 mph^2. Take the square root, and you get 126.2 mph. So, you're not going to do better with a common red brick. Maybe something with a smoother surface, higher density, or a smaller surface area would be better... :)

      I'll bet that's closer than you expected.. ;)

    2. Re:Current achievements? by BoppreH · · Score: 3, Funny

      You know, you could just put the brick ON THE PEDAL OF THE CAR.

      Given a straight and long enough track, of course.

    3. Re:Current achievements? by cloudmaster · · Score: 1

      Doh. But isn't it at least *mildly* interesting that a brick's terminal velocity is just about the same 130 MPH? Something needs to make me feel better about completely missing the point (and spending the time doing the math). :)

    4. Re:Current achievements? by Barny · · Score: 1

      Huh, what?

      Oh yeah.

      Fucking WOOOOOOOOSSSSSHHHHHH.

      --
      ...
      /me sighs
    5. Re:Current achievements? by nacturation · · Score: 1

      A European brick. African bricks are non-migratory and don't do well in temperate zones.

      --
      Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
    6. Re:Current achievements? by holmstar · · Score: 1

      I doubt that would work. I'm pretty sure that even if you locked the steering wheel straight ahead, the car would still end up spinning out once it gets much above 100. The wind and variations in the lake surface would destabilize it to much.

    7. Re:Current achievements? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Something needs to make me feel better about completely missing the point

      Son, I am disappoint.

  17. Audi?! by Azghoul · · Score: 1

    If you were going to build a robot car, why not build it out of something you can get real cheap. Like, say, you know, your Grandma's Plymouth Aries K.

    1. Re:Audi?! by Tiger4 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Audi, specifically Audi Quattros, have been rally car favorites for years. Big engine, good tranny, four wheel drive. There are a lot of people that know how to get them running well, and the cars are built well to do the job.

      --
      Behold, this dreamer cometh. Come now, and let us slay him... and we shall see what will become of his dreams.
    2. Re:Audi?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ignoramus! Grandma might have had a Dodge Aries, or she might have had a Plymouth Reliant, but there's no way she had a "Plymouth Aries".

      Not that there was a nickel's worth of difference between the 2 cars, but still, the name is the name.

    3. Re:Audi?! by maxume · · Score: 1

      Perhaps they got the Audi real cheap?

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    4. Re:Audi?! by Mikkeles · · Score: 1

      To paraphrase the brilliant (but eccentric) Dr. Brown: The way I see it, if you're gonna build an automatic driver into a car, why not do it with some style?

      --
      Great minds think alike; fools seldom differ.
    5. Re:Audi?! by baegucb · · Score: 1
    6. Re:Audi?! by e2d2 · · Score: 0, Troll

      I may be off because I'm not an expert in optimal control theory or nonlinear dynamics but I'm gonna guess it's because the Audi offers 4WD and in turn a much more stable platform through what are very "dynamic" turns. Consider the mathematics throughout a turn on gravel while applying power with a 2WD versus a 4WD. Would the 4WD be easier to control? I propose it would be.

      Then again it could be because Audis are great at rally racing and they got one for cheap.

    7. Re:Audi?! by Krazy+Kanuck · · Score: 1

      "CARS is funded by Volkswagen, Bosch, Honda, Toyota and Nissan."

      Audi being a subsidiary of VW.

    8. Re:Audi?! by neurovish · · Score: 1

      I may be off because I'm not an expert in optimal control theory or nonlinear dynamics but I'm gonna guess it's because the Audi offers 4WD and in turn a much more stable platform through what are very "dynamic" turns. Consider the mathematics throughout a turn on gravel while applying power with a 2WD versus a 4WD. Would the 4WD be easier to control? I propose it would be.

      Then again it could be because Audis are great at rally racing and they got one for cheap.

      The Audi will also come with a lot of built-in "don't drive off the road" features called algorithms.
      Fortunately for the stanford team, Audi has already figured out computer controls to mostly keep the car from spinning out or locking up the brakes when presented with mostly reasonable inputs. They have to make it run up the mountain without creating any unreasonable inputs now.

    9. Re:Audi?! by mrdoogee · · Score: 1

      And not that either was worth a nickel. Stupid K cars!

      Carburetor stuck open on the freeway once, and I got my own taste of "sudden uncontrolled acceleration." Of course, I just popped it into neutral and let the engine blow, but still scary at the time.

    10. Re:Audi?! by chrysrobyn · · Score: 1

      If you were going to build a robot car, why not build it out of something you can get real cheap. Like, say, you know, your Grandma's Plymouth Aries K.

      They specifically state in the article that they're shooting for real racing speeds. While I don't know what a Plymouth Aries is, I think my grandma has a Reliant. I'm pretty sure that isn't going up Pike's Peak at anything like racing speeds.

      The Audi is a car that can let drivers shine, and any flaw in the driving algorithm will be quickly apparent at high speeds. Turned around, with proper tires, it's damn difficult to lose control of an Audi A4 Quattro in the snow at "normal speeds". There's a lot of speed between "racing speeds" and "previously done at 25mph" where Audi can actually hide an incompetent driver made of meat or silicon.

    11. Re:Audi?! by Syberz · · Score: 1

      Official answer:
      Cuz they're sponsored by Volkswagen and cuz the car has built in many of the electronic sensors and devices that they need.

      Short answer:
      Cuz they can and cuz an Audi TTS is hella cooler than an Aries.

      --
      ~Syberz
    12. Re:Audi?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Big engine, good tranny, four wheel drive.

      I'll thank you to leave my mother/father out of this.

    13. Re:Audi?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      haha, big engine :)

    14. Re:Audi?! by MechaStreisand · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You let the engine destroy itself rather than turning off the ignition? Interesting choice.

      --
      Disclaimer: IANAL. This post is, however, legal advice, and creates an attorney-client relationship.
    15. Re:Audi?! by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Specifically Audi Quattros? That's anything made by Audi with AWD. It's the exact same system as used by Volkswagen and called 4Motion, where they use torsen LSDs with a 5:1 maximum slip ratio, with the maximum slip then limited by automatic application of the ABS. Porsche uses basically the same thing. The most likely explanation is that Subaru and Mitsubishi have enough WRC wins to not need the publicity, but the post-VW-acquisition Audi could use some positive press, and it's worth it to provide a car and, more expensively, a bunch of support.

      As for your "big engine" claim, WRC cars are limited to two liters. So that's a load of nonsense as well. Of course, there's different classes for Pikes Peak; exhibition vehicles can have whatever crammed into them you think will let you win. Audi has made a "Pikes Peak quattro" (in 2003) which became the Audi Q7. Wikipedia doesn't say whether they actually took it to Pike's Peak. Suzuki is the current record-holder with a twin-engined car. Audi hasn't been the big cheese there since the eighties, so any "big engines" they may have been running haven't succeeded in making them the favorite. In fact, Audi holds exactly zero of the current Pikes Peak records.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    16. Re:Audi?! by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      The best rally cars, as evinced by their superior records, are the Mitsubishi Lancer Evo and the Subaru Impreza. The Impreza is the only car to win the WRC four years in a row. The Lancer Evo has better weight-distribution and about the same cojones but is more "touchy" by most reports, probably because of the superior weight-distribution; Having more front weight makes the car more reluctant to swap ends. The Subaru has the least body roll and best CG due to its "Symmetric AWD" design. Audi is now an also-ran, although they're ahead of marques like Seat and Skoda... which are also both owned by Volkswagen.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    17. Re:Audi?! by mrdoogee · · Score: 1

      Well I was 16 at the time and was just glad to be able to stop again, but you keep riding that high horse.

    18. Re:Audi?! by moosesocks · · Score: 2, Informative

      From what I remember, 4Motion does not necessarily refer to an AWD system with a torsen differential, although this has been the case in several instances (VW have also used a viscous coupling for AWD). Quattro, on the other hand, refers to a very specific set of technologies.

      As far as the engines go, Audi make one of the better (if not the best) 2 Liter engines out there. They put most V6s to shame.

      --
      -- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
    19. Re:Audi?! by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      As far as the engines go, Audi make one of the better (if not the best) 2 Liter engines out there. They put most V6s to shame.

      Most V6s are garbage. Limited counterexamples exist, but the V6 is a goofy engine. It lacks the anti-vibration advantage of the V8 and has more parts than a four cylinder. The world's best four cylinder engines by any reasonable measurement come from Mitsubishi and Subaru. Mitsu is the output leader; Subaru's motor is more durable and has less vibration. Subaru motors in particular are highly desirable for almost every purpose, including naval, aviation, dunebuggies, and swaps into Volkswagens :)

      In addition, Audi and VW now share engines. The 2 liter engine in the Audi TT is also used in Seat and Skoda vehicles. Ironically, it has the most power in a limited-edition SEAT Leon. So while Audi may have a dandy motor, it's not their motor any more, and they don't even have the most powerful version of the motor in any Audi vehicle.

      An Audi is a pretty, heavy Volkswagen. Not that VWs aren't heavy these days. Personally I'm afraid of Mitsubishi's poor record in the reliability department, so I'd have to give the "best four cylinder" award and the "best two liter" award to Subaru. I guess we could argue about it all day, but I think the records speak for themselves.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    20. Re:Audi?! by MechaStreisand · · Score: 1

      I didn't mean to come down from my high horse: I'll stay up there next time. I was just wondering why you did that. I know that it doesn't make you stupid to do something suboptimal when you're young and under a sudden stress.

      --
      Disclaimer: IANAL. This post is, however, legal advice, and creates an attorney-client relationship.
    21. Re:Audi?! by babyrat · · Score: 1

      Just wondering, what does displacement have to do with number of cylinders? What would happen if Audi developed a 2 litre V6? Holy Paradox, batman!

      I still find it entertaining that my XR600R has a 600cc displacement and one cylinder, and my YZF600 has a 600cc displacement with 4 cylinders.

  18. Obligatory AWESOME PP Video by imaswinger · · Score: 5, Informative

    Ari Vatanen racing up pike's peak: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKgeCQGu_ug

    1. Re:Obligatory AWESOME PP Video by ElectricTurtle · · Score: 1

      Once you get past the boring intro... damn! That is some fancy drivin'! Drifting through turns at such high speeds on unpaved roads inches away from a cliff-top drop to certain death... Makes me wonder how he can drive comfortably with such enormous balls.

      --
      I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
    2. Re:Obligatory AWESOME PP Video by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 1

      Rally racers are the last true racers. These people are nuts. More driving skills than F1, ballsier attitude than NASCAR.

      --
      Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.
  19. DARPA Grand Challenge? by CAFED00D · · Score: 1

    Are these the same guys that won the 2005 DARPA Grand Challenge? There's a fascinating documentary on this, available on Netflix Streaming. "The Great Robot Race: Nova".

  20. Good news by e2d2 · · Score: 1

    The good news about this is it can now drive only itself off a cliff when the gas pedal gets stuck.

    1. Re:Good news by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      its an audi.
      not a toyota

      get it right

    2. Re:Good news by Barny · · Score: 1

      I guess German and Japanese is so hard to mix up...

      --
      ...
      /me sighs
  21. What about weight distribution? by compsci06 · · Score: 1

    One very important part of high speed time trials through rough turns is weight distribution between the front and rear axles. With all the computer equipment adding weight to the rear of the car and the lack of a driver in the front of the car, it will not handle as expected by the original engineers. This could cause massive oversteer. I hope they compensate for this shift in weight distribution.

  22. Obligatory. . . by saisuman · · Score: 1

    When the car gets here, we, the inhabitants of Pike's peak, will welcome our new Audi-driving robotic overlords.

  23. Racing speed? Awesome! by mangu · · Score: 1

    Not many humans can drive up the Pike's Peak at racing speed.

    If they can create a robotic car to do this then one major criterion for a "human level" AI has been reached.

    1. Re:Racing speed? Awesome! by holmstar · · Score: 1

      That it can drive a car does not mean that it is in any way intelligent.

  24. But can it beat by rossdee · · Score: 1

    Rod Millen's time

  25. Reactionary or Predictive by gsgriffin · · Score: 1

    The advantage that a driver has is the cognitive ability to observe the road in front of them and make adjustments in prediction of what the conditions will be.

    If a computer is responding to programmed route and responding to sensed changes (reaction), it will be too late for the car to adjust. If their computers are looking ahead and making the same kind of informed estimates (road surface type, side-slope, etc...), then I'll be really impressed!!

    --
    jsut athnoer menagiensls ltitle psrhae for you to dcoede. Why do we wtsae our tmie dnoig tihs?
  26. Be thankful it's not Christine. by GungaDan · · Score: 1

    Although everyone knows all Audis are named Gretchen by default.

    --
    Eloi are stupid, throw morlocks at them!
  27. Interesting times with those culverts by Ancient_Hacker · · Score: 1

    It's going to be interesting to see how the car detects and handles the drainage culverts. The last few miles have corrugated metal drainage culverts crossing the road periodically to carry off the snowmelt. These often get overloaded and instead you have a big mud puddle with a hard metal culvert under the mud. Humans can use a little intelligence and slow down for these. It will be interesting to see how the automated Audi handles these and other unexpected situations!

  28. Hill climbing algorithm by wurtwurt · · Score: 2, Funny

    My understanding is that this is generally solved but doesn't really lead to anything interesting unless you know the right formulas for the for the domain. Any news on whether they got passed formula 1?

  29. I want this car (before it drives off a cliff)! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I want to program it to drive past a cop in the carpool lane with a mannequin in the passenger seat wearing hat and sunglasses on a cloudy day.

  30. Re:Good thing the robotic car is NOT an Toyota. by kclittle · · Score: 1

    That's because of the evil spirit that possesses drivers once they sit behind the wheel of a 'S' series Audi -- I know! :)

    --
    Generally, bash is superior to python in those environments where python is not installed.
  31. You are not a looser, by DRAGONWEEZEL · · Score: 1

    You are my new best friend.

    If it wasn't for KITT I wouldn't know how to perform a flawless in lane J-Turn!

    P.S. it's not as easy as it looks in the movies!

    --
    How much is your data worth? Back it up now.
  32. Audi Logo in the Salt Flats? by dogNamedMerlin · · Score: 1

    They've built one excessive printer.

  33. Time to market by ecorona · · Score: 1

    Something I find extremely frustrating when I read articles like this is why the delay in bringing products like this to market? If this car makes it up the peek and it is reproducible with a better chance of success than a human driver, and the same can be shown for regular driving conditions, then why isn't it being sold to people? Many older individuals who can no longer drive, or those with severe disabilities would benefit TREMENDOUSLY from this technology. Not to mention people like me who just want to reduce the probability of accidents on the road. I trust a highly optimized computer to be much more accurate at doing repetitive tasks like driving than I would a human in the same way that I trust the average computer to crunch numbers more than the average human.

    1. Re:Time to market by clonan · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This is GPS navigation only. The article makes no mention of visual processing. Without much better "eyes" these cars will just run you over follwoing the map....

      This is only safe because it is a closed road.

    2. Re:Time to market by Ancient_Hacker · · Score: 1

      I don't see how this has any relation to driving on actual roads. This is a marked-off course with no cross streets, pedestrians, bicycles, or other vehicles. Even under these very special conditions there's no guarantee it won't drive into the wall or off into thin air. Or hit a mule deer. Or get stuck in a mud-puddle/culvert.

    3. Re:Time to market by ecorona · · Score: 1

      Great point, but there is technology out there that allows driving on the road with advanced machine learning techniques interpreting video from multiple cameras (including infra-red) that see things even we humans can not see to avoid accidents. I would like to see some of these devices make it to market.

  34. Steering by godel_56 · · Score: 1
    From TFA:

    Many control features already exist on the stock Audi. For example, the computers in Shelley's trunk will plug into the car's existing electric steering system. The car moves into action with stock automatic gear shifting and brakes with an active vacuum booster, a feature that normal cars use for emergency braking.

    Huh? Does this mean Audis are "Steer by Wire"?

    1. Re:Steering by aXis100 · · Score: 1

      No. Apart from the gearbox, those other items are assistance devices. You can still steer without the power steering, and brake without the booster. It's just (much) harder.

  35. These people don't know rally drivers... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "There are some sheer drops at Pikes Peak in which any sort of self-preservation kicks in and you slow down a bit."

    As for successful rally drivers to which I've been acquainted, once they get behind the wheel, they no longer have anything resembling self-preservation.

  36. Passengers? by skywolf3 · · Score: 1

    Would be interesting to see if, during this adventure, they have someone in the car as they usually do during other tests. The other tests being on the salt flats doesn't really bring much danger into the mix that can't be avoided as opposed to long drops off cliffs. I hope they record a video of the interior while it goes up, that would be a neat one to see.

  37. I wonder... by gaelfx · · Score: 1

    ... if they will sell the pieces of flaming wreckage on eBay as one item or several. My money's on several.

  38. So it can race, by RivenAleem · · Score: 1

    But can it parallel park?