Slashdot Mirror
Apple's "iKey" Wants To Unlock All Doors
Pickens writes "The Telegraph reports that Apple is developing technology, already being nicknamed the 'iKey,' which will allow users to gain access to their office and unlock their car or front door with a single electronic device like an iPhone. Users would simply have to enter a PIN and wave the device over an electronic pad fitted beside a door to open it. 'The device can communicate with an external device to open a lock. By way of example, the electronic device may be a model of an iPhone,' says the newly released patent application. 'The external device may be any suitable electronic device such as a portable media player, personal data assistant or electronic lock that may be used to access a door, car, house, or other physical area.' The technology behind the invention is known as Near Field Communication; it allows electronic devices to transmit information when in proximity. 'If true, it's a very big deal. As well as opening doors and unlocking your car, it could also turn your iPhone into an electronic wallet and ID card,' says Leander Kahney, a consumer technology expert. 'The trouble is that the technology hasn't gone completely mainstream. If Apple were to adopt the technology, they would likely set the standard, and that would drive widespread adoption as everyone scrambles to make their systems iPhone-friendly.'"
The fourth generation of the iPhone is getting NFC/RFID capabilities, much like some other phones already have.
This isn't new. The only new thing they could possibly bring to the NFC table would be (gasp) actual security, given that RFID/NFC devices are notorious for being horribly insecure most of the time.
Sounds very much like iButton stiff using RFID.
Nothing new about Apple patenting existing apps I guess. Though as mentioned, it's not mainstream, having an iphone adapter in the car to play music, and using that same phone to open the door makes sense.
Waiting for an amusing sig.
When will they make iDildo?
A universal key could never lead to bad things.
I scream. You scream. I assume that means we're both acquainted with the problem. We proceed.
Is it wise to have a consumer Internet-enabled(which I presume it would be) device that can unlock physical security? "Keylogger" has a whole new meaning. :p
Sounds cumbersome. It's arguably more secure to require both an object and a pin but people are used to just having an object. Plus it seems like it's going to be more expensive to buy an extra iphone for a friend who's staying, compared to getting extra keys cut. Also, less space than a nomad.
Isn't this already very common in Japan?
And what employer would want to tie an identification/access system to a highly attractive theft target?
What happens when someone breaks the security on the device/ technology? A thief would be able to get into your house and rob everything, make an escape in your car, and then empty your bank account all for cracking just 4 numbers. I think I'll stick to the old manual lock and key thank you.
Flat battery
AT&ROFLMAO
Imagine getting locked out of your car because you spent too much time waiting for AT&T to download the latest Rickroll mashup on Youtube on your iPhone as you sit in Starbucks, only to have insufficient battery power to activate the slick wireless doorlocks. Sure, you could use those quaint "key" devices, but that is far from trendy!
An entire industry gears up to create technologies for short range wireless communications in order to replace keys. Several companies already have solutions in the market, but they haven't caught on yet because the technology isn't quite ready yet and not quite cheap enough.
If things continue along Apple's usual path then: (1) Apple starts patenting the obvious applications of those technologies, something other people weren't even considering because that's what those technologies were designed for, (2) Apple starts adding immature implementations of the feature to their products at a premium price that only Apple customers would be willing to pay and gets accolades for how "innovative" they are, and (3) a few years later when other people are starting to offer mass market products at mass market prices, Apple starts suing them for patent violations.
And of course, (just like the app-store) if you are wearing just a bikini, or have a 'hot babe' on your arm, the doors just won't open.
1. repulsive or distasteful.
2. excessively sweet or sentimental.
3. unsophisticated or old-fashioned.
4. sticky; viscid.
Origin:
1930–35, Americanism
(According to dictionary.com)
What's new here is that Apple is possibly thinking of making this a standard while owning critical patents on it, then after this is widespread (if it ever happens) crackdown on competition using its patents.
Apple is becoming more evil lately, see the recent attempt to shut down competition on smartphones from HTC using completely trivial software patents (the original article is from LWN, I highly suggest getting a subscription there).
Sounds familiar? Remember GIF? MP3? h.264? Yeah, I know, this last reference will get me modded as troll.
There's a hidden treasure in Python 3.x: __prepare__()
I can currently do this with my Zipcar app http://www.zipcar.com/iphone/ . It allows you to unlock, lock and honk your cars horn. It does this using your EDGE/3G connection, so not near-field/RFID however, same kind of thing is currently being done.
You know, with Apple products experiencing something of a resurgence in the past 5-10 years and their popularity slowly increasing, they will eventually cross that invisible line where hackers decide that it becomes worth their time to attack Apple products the way they attack Windows. The fact that people are sold Apple products under the guise of security and not having to worry about compromised hardware/software means they won't see it coming and won't know how to deal with it, either.
Be careful with becoming too big, Apple Nation.
Living With a Nerd
Somehow, it seems so appropriate...
This is a bad idea. Mainly because the iPhone doesn't have a very sophisticated security architecture, so any cryptographic keys and wallet information are fundamentally vulnerable to theft. This is best demonstrated by the recent attack where a handful of SMS messages was sufficient to give an attacker root on the device. If you're going to put something like this into widespread deployment you at very least want to include some sort of hardware security module to validate the software and store cryptographic secrets.
Right now I wouldn't want to use the iPhone (or any Android phone, for that matter) to store any kind of critical secrets.
I for one don't consider it "bad" if stupid people get punished for using "0000" as their PIN.
Hey... we are long overdue for some regular punishment of stupidity.
There are no longer wild bears roaming the streets at night, eating stupid people. Haven't been any for centuries.
Wee need something to eliminate those genes from the pool.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
I cracked it yesterday.
"scramble to make their systems iPhone-friendly". Everyone? No.
Any company with any sense of self worth is likely going to tell its employees not to bring they're overpriced phone to work, anyway.
Fantastic... now I can finally have a Multitool...
Every company is trying to get you to put all your eggs in their basket.
When will they ever learn that we will NEVER keep all our eggs in one basket.
(fool's excepted)
'nuff said.
I often wonder why central locking hasn't caught on for houses yet. Especially if you could set it to beep at you when you've leaving but you've left a door/window open elsewhere.
Help me! I'm turning into a grapefruit!
Oh my-fucking-god, NO.
If this actually takes off, goodbye to physical security, because now compromising a single device opens all the doors, literally. What a shockingly bad idea.
I remember reading about this some time ago. That Bill Gates guy is a visionary.
Be careful with becoming too big, Apple Nation.
Clearly, the correct solution is to stay small and not rock Microsoft's boat anymore. [/sarcasm]
Considering the relative ease with which RFID has been hacked, and how long it took for Bluetooth to become only reasonably secure, and how far off good wireless security is . . .
And that's the discussion you go through before you get to "stupid people."
And let's not even have the "If software can't keep gas pedals from sticking, what will it do for door locks."
I'm an opponent of the excessive and unnecessary desire to expand technology into areas where an existing technology already does a better job.
I scream. You scream. I assume that means we're both acquainted with the problem. We proceed.
I'd be afraid someone would try to jailbreak my front door and end up bricking my house.
1 (short ton / firkin) = 89.1432354 slugs / keg
1. You can tuck a key under the doormat if you lose the ones in your pocket. Not so electronic gadget. 2. As somebody else mentioned - flat battery? lose access to all your property. Flat battery in the lock or power cut in the house? lose access. 3. Replacing locks just got a whole lot more expensive and no doubt all lock makers would have to have some kind of license agreement with Apple. In short, LAME. This seems to be technology for technology's sake. I can see pretty much nothing but downsides to this.
I for one would think the "great steve" would actually innovate and implement iris scan into the device ;)
Isn't apple supposed to be the leader of innovation?..
Never mind that their department breaks down to something like 60% marketing, 30% design and 10% engineers (yes, I'm being generous)
I greatly look forward to every car company, bank and lock manufacturer investing huge amounts of money into this.
I also greatly look forward to being mugged for my phone, and realising that not only do I need a new phone and phone number, but to replace the locks to my house, car and office, as well as re-registering with the bank.
I also await with great enthusiasm the moment that Apple sues every manufacturer of competing products, essentially taking over the entire planet's security.
Besides that, will I still be allowed to watch porn on my keys?
What happens when someone breaks the security on your keyring? They gain access to whatever you've protected by it, obviously. How is this different than a person who gains access to your physical keyring? They gain access to whatever you've got keys for.
In the current "security model", the reality is, most of us protect our property with insurance, really. If someone steals it, a claim is filed and you're compensated for the loss. (You may also qualify for a tax write-off for the loss on the next year's taxes.)
Lock and key technology is really a VERY weak form of protection. Look up the art of "lock bumping" on YouTube sometime. You can find numerous videos illustrating a technique that defeats most locks in seconds, and doesn't even require any traditional "lock picking skills".
I think it's fair to say that an electronic keyring built into, say, one's iPhone, is no less secure than the traditional method. At least with the iPhone, you can set up a PIN for access to the phone itself. So someone stealing or randomly finding your lost phone would have to break that before they could even get to a control panel allowing them to enter PIN codes to use with your electronic locks. When they find my physical keyring, the biggest issue they have is trying all the keys to see which one fits a given lock of mine .... and many can be ruled out just by seeing their physical dimensions make them unsuitable.
All I'm saying is that a LOT of Apple customers are your average consumer without a lot of computer knowledge who have bought Apple products under the impression that they are secure and safe. Once Apple's marketshare gets big enough to make them a worthwhile target of hackers and virus writers, it's not going to be pretty.
Living With a Nerd
Pre OS X, Apple had lots of worms, virus like apps, malware, trojans and loggers ect. :)
What can really be noted for OS X security after many years?
Fake flash installers, physical access loggers and ???
Where are the FAQ pages to pop any Mac hitting a web site or just connecting to the net?
As for Apple DRM, that will be wide open
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
For the knowledge that I can sue people responsible will keep me warm at night.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
Because a thief is much more likely to steal your house keys than your iPhone, you are more likely to leave your car keys forgotten somewhere as you're always handling them around, and your keys are much more likely to broke or fall in the water and leave you locked out. How about making the iPhone your pacemaker, so your heart can beat to the rhythm of your music? BRB patenting.
for geeks. from geeks. out of geeks_ http://www.freewear.org
I'm an opponent of the excessive and unnecessary desire to expand technology into areas where an existing technology already does a better job.
EVERYTHING is better with the "latest thing" tacked on! How do you not understand!?
Have you ever tasted ice-cream witn an iPhone or some other smart-phone? Way better than eating it with a spoon.
Even plain vanilla tastes like... so much better.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
Luckily it will be very straightforward to protect yourself from hackers: an old fashioned lock will do.
I would never connect my front door or car to anything that is on any network. I am the one with the keys now - that's a very nice feeling.
The motivation for hackers now is to gain control of a computer to make a few euro/dollars. If they can steal a car, or just open a front door and walk in - I dunno - I can just imagine that they are much more motivated to hack even small niche technologies.
Well, a lot of Microsoft customers are your average consumer without a lot of computer knowledge who have bought Microsoft products because they don't even know the alternatives exist. They already are targets of hackers and virus writers. It won't be any worse.
This concept including the name iKey and iLock and a description of this product were described a year and a half before Apple applied for the patent.
http://www.jenom.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&cid=17
"iKey and iLock, for lack of a more creative product name
Give me a tiny device the size of a flash drive that I can encode with some unique ID like a segment of my DNA. When I get within 2 feet of my office, my car, my house, or whatever locked item it is, it reads the code from the device in my pocket and unlocks the electronic lock. No more carrying 200 keys around like some medieval jailer. 2007 is half over and we're still securing our possessions with medieval technology.
"Apple credits Michael Rosenblatt, Gloria Lin, Sean Mayo and Taido Nakajima as the inventors of patent application 20100042954, originally filed in Q3 2008."
Apple lies.
Hope is the currency of fools
http://www.bash.org/?908184
this is an RFID chip then. With the added inconvenience of having to also enter a PIN number anyway.
Of course if all they have is your key ring, they have to figure out where the things the keys go to are. If they steal your Iphone, much of that information is in there.
The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
your keys won't scratch your iphone anymore. :/
Yes, but Microsoft doesn't advertise their products as being secure and safe from viruses...Apple specifically states in their advertising that Macs don't suffer from those issues (which, at this point, is mostly true).
I'm telling you...once Apple's market share is big enough to entice virus and malware writers to pay attention to them, things are going to get bad really fast.
Living With a Nerd
"The remote-access computer transponder called the "joymaker" is your most valuable single possession in your new life. If you can imagine a combination of telephone, credit card, alarm clock, pocket bar, reference library, and full-time secretary, you will have sketched some of the functions provided by your joymaker. " From The Age of the Pussyfoot, published in 1966 by Frederic Pohl. (I read this as a scholastic bookclub selection if fifth grade, It's been obvious for a few years now that the iPhone is well on it's way to becoming a "joymaker", this patent brings it even closer.
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
some fluff to beat lameness filter, message as subject.
http://slashdot.org/~GuyFawkes/journal
I forget what this program is called, but there's a program for the Mac that unlocks your computer if you are within x feet of it. It works over bluetooth and you can set a radius in which it unlocks that works by signal strength. I thought this was kind of cool at first but then realized I don't always want my computer unlocked just because my phone is near it.
Some things should just *not* be networked or left to vulnerable to electronic signals.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
So everyone in the house who currently has a key would need to own an iPhone, plus have a spare iPhone for when guests come to stay.
Well I can see why Apple like the idea...
Doctor Who, sonic screwdriver. http://www.thinkgeek.com/geektoys/cubegoodies/8cff/
Now I need to remember another password to get into my house. If anything I'd prefer to validate my online passwords with the combination of a physical key turn and a short pin.
"Open the pod by doors, Hal" > "I'm afraid I can't do that, Dave" sudo "Open the pod bay doors, Hal" > alright
So instead of punching my PIN number directly into the lock on my car or house, which have had PIN based locks available for decades, I instead pull out my phone, load my iKey app, and punch my PIN in there? Is this really easier or more secure?
Basic house door lock and key from Home Depot - ~$20
Extra key cutting - ~$2
Watching your neighbour spending hundreds or more than a thousand to outfit their home with an iLock and having their iPhone run out of juice or fumbling and dropping/breaking it before they could unlock the front door.... Priceless.
What happens when Apple decides that I should be locked out of my car because I drove past the local porn shop and they consider that a TOS violation? And how do I know they arn't going to purposely brick my key if I make after-market changes to my car?
"linux is just DOS with a UNIX like syntax" -- Galactic Dominator (944134)
How is this more convenient? If mere proximity were sufficient (as in the Prius key) it might be interesting, but if I have to pull out a device and tap in a pin to make it work, that's hardly more convenient than having a key that I had to pull out and fit into the lock. And what happens when the device runs out of grunt? Do I have to find a charger before I can get into my house? Maybe not if I can still use a conventional key. But if I have to keep a key with me anyway, what value, other than excruciating nerdism, would the device have?
I guess one could argue that it's more secure ("something you have and something you know") but with all the people hacking rfid these days, that doesn't seem likely either.
This seems like a gimmick.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
So, say this does catch on and people start getting house doors and cars compatible with this. What if there's an emergency and I have to get into the house of a family member or friend and I don't have an iphone or whatever it'll take the pop the lock? If there's an emergency, I doubt they're going to be able to hand me their phone or whatever this device might be...and what if they're so used to using this device to open all their doors and they don't have a physical key on them?
I don't like this every growing dependence on electronic devices for simple tasks, like opening and closing doors. Of course, there's going to be the arguement that this is great for when you forget your keys at home, lock your keys in your car, etc. And it will be great for those uses. But come on, lets me seriously, people will use their device exclusively as their way of unlocking doors. I definitely don't want to be stuck outside of my car or house just because I forgot to charge my phone before I leave the office...
Wise men say, "Forgiveness is divine, but never pay full price for late pizza."
A time-variant RFID key would be significantly more secure.
I can see the next gone in 60 seconds. How they stick a second android phone in her purse (or something close to the Iphone) perp walks up to the persons car, house, etc. It sends the query over the celluar network from the first phone, to the second phone, to their Iphone, then sends the response back for yours to retransmit. Although to be movie worthy I guess it will need to be a stripper getting close...
Maybe an okay idea until you realize that the locations of your home can probably be found somewhere on your phone (or e-mail on your phone)
>> would likely set the standard, and that would drive widespread adoption as everyone scrambles to make their systems iPhone-friendly
Since when do people scramble for a new standard? Do you mean standards like 32 or 64-bit? How about C++ strings? When was the last time you received a dollar or half-dollar coin? You think people are going to upgrade their cars and home to work with a cell phone?
They will ban you from their approved users list, leaving you with an email message on your iPhone standing right before a closed door :-D
because no one would think of abusing this for their own needs....
That's so awesome in a "wow how many people are going to try and fail at this" kind of way... Your cell phone or other electronic device can't replace your wallet or keys. You can't replace your keys until everything on your key chain has an electronic lock, including your shed out back, that lock box you keep, and the old truck you keep around for getting mulch. You can't replace your wallet until it can replace your Drivers Licence (Required by law in all 50 states to operate a car), you mil ID, that emergency credit card, you work ID and the emergency key for you car. They want me to pay big money to get a device that is compatible with a system they developed, then replace my car, all my house locks, get everyone I have a key for (Half my family) locks changed, entrust my credit card to yet another 3rd party (that I am sure will charge a fee) and all it will do is mean I have a few less keys (Unless they are going to make a electronic pad lock for my shed and rental storage and my work desk) and a slightly thinner wallet. This is all before looking at the device for security issues, what happens when the power is out, or the battery in the device is flat? What happens when someone steals it or it's broken? Can you just give someone an electronic copy in case you loose it? How do you keep them from just giving copies away, etc,etc. This is what we call failure to think through the problem.
Let the lawyers engage in battle ...
http://www.ikey.com/
FYI
While overplayed it does work. Just Google for it, there are many stories on the technique. Google stores about a bic pen insert and a major lock company. Then to top it off realize that many Ford owners can either unlock or start older Ford cars other people own, most likely works for the majority of brands. Newer keys with embedded micro chips at least stop people from starting your car but rarely do they stop someone from unlocking your car.
Nothing secure where there is a will.
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
...now they're aping Human Target !
Save Maine's economy: write stuff down. All comments are exclusively my own, not my employer.
iDon't ithink ilike ithis.
iReally idon't iwant ithis isort iof ifunctionality.
iOne icompromised iKey (ihehehe) icould igive ian iattacker iaccess ito ieverything.
iEpic iFail!
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
Until they find a reliable means to secure the iPhone, I will never, ever allow it to do any sensitive functions -- much less unlock my damned car. Forget it, Apple. Get your priorities in line.
I don't know what their patents are on, but ever since the idea of a smartphone existed (5-10 years ago), I've thought this exact application was a perfect fit. I didn't know the EM side of how to make it work, but I knew exactly how to make the cryptography work. It seemed obvious to me. I assumed the reason everybody wasn't already doing it was some nefarious profit motive on the part of credit card companies or banks in which they made money from how horribly insecure credit cards are.
OK, so a credit card isn't exactly a key (except in the movies) but the article itself points out that the exact same technology that would make an iPhone into an excellent key would also work to make an iPhone into a decent electronic wallet. And I thought the same thing. I just thought the wallet side of it was more important than a garage door opener. Possibly because I don't drive.
Need a Python, C++, Unix, Linux develop
pffft. I saw that done on on a category of locks with a screwdriver, a hammer and some fine metal rigid bands. That did not even took 10 seconds. You know what I did for my last 5 flats when i lost my keys ? In my first flat it was easy I used my library card. The next one were a bit more harder I had to either use an Xray picture (got it from my neighbor) or a bicycle brake cable. I ahd to fiddle for 35-40 seconds TOP. Ask a locksmith , one of those 24/7 service. They very often open such doors with very basic instruments relatively quickly. Secure lock are very rare for flats. Now normal "house" it might be a bit different.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
and the number of B and E's increase 200%. Hackers rejoice.
It only takes one guy to crack the code to be able to break into this device and post his software online for millions to access.
imagine being able to download a keygen for peoples houses.
guess we will have to unlock doors the old way for another 100 years or so
Or, on a variety of less expensive locks (and often some more costly ones), they could just use a bump-key.
Several times I've thought about installing a card key reader in my house so I could just badge into it with my work badge. It's not all that hard to set a system up if I could be bothered, but it doesn't quite have enough cool factor to actually do that. I don't know if there's anything interesting Apple could patent in the area though -- key swipe and RFID readers have been in use by companies for decades now.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
I want an iBumpKey.
'Brute force' app for RFIDs.. now controlled by your phone!
Of course an RFID reader app for it too.. swipe your phone near your bosses wallet and wallah, now the card readers can say it was clearly your boss that entered the server room at 2am drunk, and urinated on the VMWare server cluster.. (you just gotta deal with the security cameras..)
Of course, this is all possible now anyway w ith other methodologies... but *shrug*.. now it's provided by Mister Jobs!
----- The internet has given everyone the ability to have their voice heard equally as loud.. even if they shouldn't be
Am I the only one that read the title and immediately thought of this bash quote? http://bash.org/?908184
finallyy been waiting for this type of device for a long time
Hm, lemme see. On the one hand, I have the essentially medieval technology of the physical key and keychain. Since I'm not a landlord or building maintenance worker, my keychain is of a manageable size. It only costs a few bucks, works with all of my existing locks, and you'd have to be a decent pickpocket to steal it from me. On the other hand, I have the proposed iPhone key function. It's a bit bigger than my keychain, costs a couple hundred bucks and involves a monthly fee in excess of my likely lifetime expenditure on traditional keys, requires daily charging, won't work with any of my existing locks, and a would-be thief only needs to steal my data.
What's not to like here? I mean, besides all of it.
Proud member of the Weirdo-American community.
when I go out and forget my iPhone? Or want to leave a key hidden for the kids coming over before we get back? Or the painter?
Simple problems deserve simple solutions.
This isn't much different than using Bluetooth and the Ubuntu lock package.. you link your bluetooth device with the computer, and then if you're phone/bluetooth device is further away than a distance you set the computer goes into a screensaver lock. When the bluetooth device is within the proximity again, the screensaver unlocks and you can use the PC again.
Also, many companies and HUD housing little key ring RF devices that you run near a pad and the door unlocks/opens. Placing this chip into a phone isn't much different. Heck a lot of cars now use smartkeys that also use this method. Even home automation (for example Control4) has options for this as well that I believe can be linked to a phone also. I'm not sure what Apple is going to be able to patent in regard to this idea that hasn't already been patented, or isn't obvious to anyone in the field.
These are just a variation of lock raking (Drag a piece of metal across all pins while applying pressure to the lower half of the lock). It just makes it easier.
Still, I'd not heard of those before. Thanks for the insight! I'm glad I have a lever lock on my front door too...
Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
Cause then you can hear the Echelon guys talking on the other end...
And you start talking to them... and pretty soon, someone is busting your door in. Red team go! Red team go! Just some weird shit man.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
Just... you know... tidied up a little.
Cleaner, not clean.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
I got the reference, didn't I?
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
Maybe not, look at modern cars. Many, if not most, have electronic keys that can only be duplicated at a dealership and are expensive.
AAC has always been an open format, the problem was really the DRM that Apple initially used. The iTunes Store now offers DRM-free AAC files that play on non-Apple devices.
--
Perpenso Calc for iPhone and iPod touch, scientific and bill/tip calculator, fractions, complex numbers, RPN
How long will it be until we drop the "i" and just start calling them keys. What a great invention, something to open locks.
Apple is even helping us deter theft. Will their wonderfulness never cease. What next? Will they invent analog clocks perhaps?
all wireless security/universal-key-is-a-bad-idea comments aside, what happens when I have to run out to my car in the rain, pull out my electronic key, punch in the pin and while waving the bloody thing over the pad...ZAP! The rain fries my idiotic iKey.
Dammit, I guess I'll just go back inside and call a locksmith.
Dammit! I'm locked out of my house!
Message as subject? Is that really what you meant?
Wild notion: why not use the message as the message, and the subject as the subject.
Bow-ties are cool.
I know Syncrosoft makes a software dongle product called iKey (steinberg user~). I'm not sure how far reaching their mark is registered for, but I can't imagine legal sitting still with the potential for an out-of-court settlement from apple.
--- Do you believe in the day?
With a physical key, you don't run out of batteries. IPhones will not be attached to your key chain like the current remote open/start devices.
People will begin to regularly forget their keys if they rely on this, and all of the sudden, how much charge you have left on your phone could dictate your ability to gain access to your vehicle.
That, and just imagine trying to punch in a pin while being chased by Zombies. Fumbling for keys was bad enough.
You know, with Apple products experiencing something of a resurgence in the past 5-10 years and their popularity slowly increasing, they will eventually cross that invisible line where hackers decide that it becomes worth their time to attack Apple products the way they attack Windows.
People already attack Apple created systems for a variety of purposes, it's just the average person never experiences it because the level of security is still good enough to make large scale automated attacks too hard to implement. As Apple's market share increases, so will the number of people attempting attacks, but that's not really a big concern. Apple and Linux developers both have a vested interest in making sure security is never a huge problem for most customers. As such, they invest in developing real security as needed. If a couple of worms make their way about exploiting OS X machines, Apple will immediately invest in better security technologies because they don't want to lose money. Heck, they see it coming which is why they have application signing and mandatory access control frameworks already built into OS X, even though they are barely used. That's the real security difference from Windows. MS has little or no financial incentive to spend money on real security improvements, because they don't lose significant money when people are exploited and marketing does a better job than engineering on keeping the money flowing.
Ironically, this universal key will never unlock an iPhone.
Its not in Japan. FeliCa is used in ICoCA, Suica and PiTaPa train passes in Japan and there's even a creditcard version (Edy) that lets you make cash payments at any convenience store in the country without so much as opening your wallet. Pin number entry is optional (if using a mobile phone). You can also tie it to point cards for various department stores and electronics retailers (BIC camera, Yotsubashi Camera). Apple are in a good business position to push this to the rest of the world but its not a new tech and as far as I'm aware, the Sony system has yet to be cracked but its based on 3DES so strong but I wouldn't bet on it being that way in 10-20 years.
This could allow option of key splitting like encryption keys. For example, my key will always work to open my lock, but I also have the option of having any 3 friends out of 10 I designate combine keys to allow my lock to open. This would be handy for getting locked out...just call the n number of neighbors you trusted with parts of you split key to meet you at the door.
Oh, gee, my breaker's blown in the fusebox in the basement.
Ooops, there's no power to the lock, so my e-key won't open the door so I can't turn the power back on to the door....
mark "don't let your house BSoD..."
my brother was able to use an app from my Palm Pilot using IR to unlock his Ford Taurus' doors back in 1998. Way to keep up with the times, Apple.
Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
My problem is that my iPhone battery is dead every day by the time I get home. I'd be locked out while waiting for my iPhone to recharge.
I'll stick with a key.
in making me completely sick of iWords...
Mooltipass!
Free Martian Whores!
Of course, the fact that it's seriously hard work to run as root on OS X and friends *might* just slightly help - as will the absence of retarded crap like ActiveX.
Go to any Apple dealer and they will try and sell you "virus protection" software to go with your apple computer. They know there are no known viruses in the wild, but they try and sell this software anyway, at a not so cheap price. I've been asked to leave an Apple store for telling people that it's a waste of money. Same with Best Buy, CompUSA and a couple other places that sell Apple computers.
Now, that said, there is nothing stopping someone from writing a virus specifically targetting the appstore or iPhone/iPods and I suspect very soon someone will have a valid implementation. When it happens, though, it will be the same with Windows users. People will take it as part of the process and will either allow themselves to get viruses or they will buy something to prevent it. It won't make any difference to the sales numbers, I guarantee it.
"Growing old is inevitable; growing up is optional."
If a couple of worms make their way about exploiting OS X machines, Apple will in theory immediately invest in better security technologies because they don't want to lose money.
It took them until .5.6 to deal with issues from .0
The only app that would buy from you would be the iWishYouWouldFsckOff
Something like the "Android controlled door opening Linux WiFi router" (via Make)
No trespassing. Violators will be shot. Survivors will be shot again.
If this is "one key to control everything I own", I'm not signing up. Now, I know what people are going to say if I utter these words, but I think this needs some serious independent security audits. Apple might not trust another company or independent consultant(s), but I think the US government (FBI, NSA) and other international law enforcement should look at this. Even if you distrust the government, you know they have the resources and manpower to test and review this and in anycase and they will figure out a way to hack it anyways. Might as well make it "known" who is testing it anyways. :)
Now, that said, there is nothing stopping someone from writing a virus specifically targetting the appstore or iPhone/iPods and I suspect very soon someone will have a valid implementation. When it happens, though, it will be the same with Windows users. People will take it as part of the process and will either allow themselves to get viruses or they will buy something to prevent it. It won't make any difference to the sales numbers, I guarantee it.
I daresay the current security models on iPhones/iPods are doing a splendid job stopping someone from writing a virus for them.
Writing a virus isn't as simple as Independence Day and other Hollywood drivel make it out to be. Not for a reasonably designed system, anyway. Malware writers have tried on OSX and iPhones/iPods already, and the furthest they've gotten are either proof of concept viruses that never spread, or trojan horses which no semi-open system can defend against that.
If a couple of worms make their way about exploiting OS X machines, Apple will immediately invest in better security technologies because they don't want to lose money.
It took them until .5.6 to deal with issues from .0
Dealing with potential issues that aren't actually causing a significant number of customers real problems is different from dealing with real problems that are costing Apple money and tarnishing their brand. It's always possible Apple systems could start getting exploited regularly and Apple would do nothing but it is extremely unlikely and would be an idiotic business decision. And as I said, Apple is already investing in security, they are just keeping it limited to a minor subset of their OS until the security need outweighs the potential hassle for users and developers. Apple encourages developers to sign their applications today, but does not limit unsigned apps because that would be a hassle for users and developers and there is no security problem that yet justifies it.
That's why I've listed my address as 1060 West Addison, Chicago IL for about 30 years now...
Peter
Downsize DC Today!
I'm sorry but this is not a big innovation.
Actually, Apple's stance on it is thus:
Security Advice
The Mac is designed with built-in technologies that provide protection against malicious software and security threats right out of the box. However, since no system can be 100 percent immune from every threat, antivirus software may offer additional protection.
http://www.apple.com/macosx/security/
Which is on their security page for OS X. I see what you're saying, but I really don;t think the bulk of the security protection (or the major reason why the malware issues are low) on the Mac is due to obfuscation/lower market share. They also tweaked their marketing to focus more on the fact that there was no immunity from threats (I think originally it said 'immune to windows viruses' which is technically accurate but somewhat misleading).
Can I shoot you in the face?
Um, isn't this what Smart cards were supposed to do for us?
As for the 'waving it in front' part, they have that too - in the form of contactless smart cards. They use them for TransLink around here. I know this, because I took an ordinary JavaCard and waved it in front of a TransLink terminal and it actually responded (of course, it responded, "Tag Card Again," because the correct applet obviously wasn't on the card, but still).
It's after dark in a rainstorm with blowing wind. I'm struggling with my groceries and digging in my pocket for my keys and oops!!!! I drop them in a puddle, then step on them, fish them out of the mud, wipe them off, and they still work.
The first and most important rule of engineering is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."
Now, that said, there is nothing stopping someone from writing a virus specifically targetting the appstore or iPhone/iPods and I suspect very soon someone will have a valid implementation. When it happens, though, it will be the same with Windows users. People will take it as part of the process and will either allow themselves to get viruses or they will buy something to prevent it. It won't make any difference to the sales numbers, I guarantee it.
I daresay the current security models on iPhones/iPods are doing a splendid job stopping someone from writing a virus for them.
Writing a virus isn't as simple as Independence Day and other Hollywood drivel make it out to be. Not for a reasonably designed system, anyway. Malware writers have tried on OSX and iPhones/iPods already, and the furthest they've gotten are either proof of concept viruses that never spread, or trojan horses which no semi-open system can defend against that.
I didn't say it would be trivially easy to do so, just that someone will make something viable in the future. I have no doubt that it's a difficult task, especially on a system that is designed reasonably well, but it's not impossible.
"Growing old is inevitable; growing up is optional."
Cars do this now. It just uses the key fob instead of the phone. So what, now Apple going to get this patent and try to sue for key fobs that do the same thing. They say they're using NFC to do this, which many, many other devices already do. So big deal.
You can do this with commodity hardware. CMU's GREY program has been letting users not only open doors, but manage issues such as access control lists, key management, and usability issues associated with such a system. There's been a considerable amount of information published as a result of their research. They've been doing this since about 2005. It is by no means a new idea.
Now when I "find" your iphone, I not only can find out where you live, but I can use it to access your house.
Be seeing you...
I read this and totally thought it was a joke. The worst thing about this technology is that if anyone implements it, I might actually have to buy an iPhone.
I like Apple but this is an awful idea. If you want security then get a dog.
This stuff can be really great;
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Except when:
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A. It gets hacked; and
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B. The metaphorical "power goes out" or system crash / failure events occour.
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No home. No Computer. No phone. No car.
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And of course the only way access can be restored is by a phone call to the flooded call center, on a phone that doesn't work.
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Me thinks: No Way.
This stuff can be really great; - Except when: - - A. It gets hacked; and - - B. The metaphorical "power goes out" or system crash / failure events occour. - - No home. No Computer. No phone. No car. - - And of course the only way access can be restored is by a phone call to the flooded call center, on a phone that doesn't work. - - Me thinks: No Way.
.
Voting up, Voting down - If I really gave a fuck about your approval or not, I'd come and ask you.
The more different things are cramped into one single point of failure, the scarier it gets. What happens when you lose this phone? Sure, even if you have real high security standards (in Apple's case I'll have to say phaha!), what happens to your access? You are locked out of everything- your home, car, mailbox, wallet and what not. Today when you lose a key you probably ring up your friend or neighbor and ask for your spare key. I'm pretty sure most people will not pay Apple for two iPhones. Things like these always remind me of this quote- "Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction." - Albert Einstein.
The last building I worked in had a keypad. It was a pain in the ass. A physical key is much better. The building I'm in now has RFID cards, and I love them - just wave the card at the reader and the door unlocks. From my perspective it's far better than a key.
1) Something you have
2) Something you know
3) Something you are
The keypad is 2). The RFID is 1). This Apple thing is 1) and 2). The more factors, the more secure and the bigger pain in the ass.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
So that dumb bastard that was out in the woods with his girlfriend a year or so ago wasn't eaten, right?
Musta just been a nibble....maybe the bear was feeling snackish.
Oops..was I supposed to push that button?
There are products like BlueID (http://www.blueid.de) that do the same as iKey (open doors, pc login) and work with various mobile platforms.
What about this, you have low-power stage where only RFID signaling works.
Even if your flashy iPhone UI does not work, you could still send iKey signal to open doors etc... Only problem I can see with this is the input, if user is requested to type PIN it won't work cause that probably takes significant amount of battery anyway. I bet the remainders what was left when UI died would satisfy for several years as RFID signal transmitter, then again I'm just guessing here.