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Modeling Software Showed BP Cement As Unstable

DMandPenfold writes "Advanced modeling software analyzed the cementing conditions for BP's Deepwater Horizon oil well as unstable, days before the blast that killed 11 oil rig workers and let millions of barrels of oil spill into the Gulf of Mexico. Halliburton, the company that carried out the cement job, used its own modeling software called OptiCem, to support arguments that more stability was needed for the piping and cement. ... An OptiCem test on 15 April, five days before the blast, stipulated that from Halliburton’s point of view, 21 ‘centralizers’ needed to be added to the well bore. The centralizers are used to provide space around the oil pipe casing within the well, as cement is poured around it, and are a vital part of safe drilling. BP initially adhered to the OptiCem software test and ordered 15 extra centralizers. But when technicians on the rig received the extra centralizers they mistakenly decided the new centralizers were the incorrect type. At this point BP proceeded with the drilling anyway, with the six centralizers, deciding another known technique of injecting cement in other places would work."

160 comments

  1. Paranoid Mode: ON by drinkypoo · · Score: 0, Troll

    Why is this story hitting the front page on a day when you can't click on news links?
    Why is the slashdot staff so incompetent as to not have this fixed already? Oh yeah, because people pay for subscriptions even though they are total failures.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    1. Re:Paranoid Mode: ON by Idimmu+Xul · · Score: 1

      I can click on the links just fine ...

      --
      The problem with slashdot is that most of its users were bullied and stuffed into lockers as kids!
  2. BP by bucklesl · · Score: 1, Funny

    Long live Cthulhu.

    --
    help fill in hidden movie endings @ End of the Credits
    1. Re:BP by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Actually I do believe

      "Thank you Captain Hindsight", is more appropriate of a comment here.

    2. Re:BP by Haedrian · · Score: 1

      "We're sorry :( "

    3. Re:BP by angelbar · · Score: 1

      We need pictures of this comment !!

      --
      -no sig today-
    4. Re:BP by countertrolling · · Score: 1

      Not really. It was an obvious lack of foresight. They were warned. They simply took a chance that nothing would happen. The most appropriate comment would be "living on the edge".

      --
      For justice, we must go to Don Corleone
    5. Re:BP by Adrian+Lopez · · Score: 1

      Considering the analysis took place before the drilling, it seems to me Captain Foresight would be more appropriate. Too bad BP decided his advice was too much bother.

      Also, South Park's creators are being obtuse in their criticism of BP's critics. Hindsight is what allows us to learn from our mistakes. If Matt and Trey's naive political philosophy gets in the way of recognizing that, it's not really the critics' problem.

      --
      "In prison you just have to shut your eyes and take it. Here you have to shut your eyes and give it."
    6. Re:BP by mosb1000 · · Score: 1

      But the summary seems to imply that they used a different cementing technique in order to overcome the problem. It also says they received the centralizers, so it's not really fair to say it's a lack of foresight. It's just that they thought they'd received the wrong parts and they decided to use a different method rather than wait for replacement parts. That doesn't sound unreasonable to me. Also, we haven't yet determined whether the cementing contributed to the blowout.

  3. Politically connected by revscat · · Score: 2, Insightful

    So what? BP has massive amounts of money, as well as political connections out the ass. Nothing is going to happen to them, even if half of the Gulf Coast population winds up with cancer. Complain away, Slashdot. If it makes you feel better to post on the intertubes, excellent. Meanwhile, nothing gets done.

    1. Re:Politically connected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hear you. I can't wait for big brother to come hold all our hands so that we don't have to get anything done on our own.

      You're a lazy git.

    2. Re:Politically connected by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 4, Insightful

      What I don't understand, with these "Corporation that doesn't give a fuck and has more politicians in its pocket than you ever will fucks over some more luckless saps" stories is why there isn't more extralegal violence associated with them.

      Obviously, subjecting large corporations to serious penalties under law would be unamerican, and we generally avoid it; but America is crawling with angry and well armed people, many without too much to lose, and spree-killing is something we start practicing in high school.

      Why isn't there an enraged ex-fisherman with an AR-15 lurking outside the window of every BP C-level whose name is publicly known? People get killed all the time over petty shit, why not the big stuff?

    3. Re:Politically connected by AnonymousClown · · Score: 1

      ...as well as political connections out the ass.

      Political connections are usually up the ass.

      --
      RIP America

      July 4, 1776 - September 11, 2001

    4. Re:Politically connected by bsDaemon · · Score: 1

      People feel powerless over big stuff and don't think that their lone action will have any effect. There are likely more consequences associated with such an action than rewards, and even fishermen can figure that one out.

    5. Re:Politically connected by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Given the number of stories where people either come to work and shoot up the place after being laid off, or even murder-suicide their own families and then themselves due to economic stresses, I'm not at all sure that it is rationality saving them.

      Obviously, the rational thing is to fatalistically suck it up and try to move on, and I'd fully expect most people to do so; but an irrationality incidence of less than 1 in 1000 adds up to more than a few very dangerious people on a population level...

    6. Re:Politically connected by khallow · · Score: 1

      So what? BP has massive amounts of money, as well as political connections out the ass. Nothing is going to happen to them, even if half of the Gulf Coast population winds up with cancer. Complain away, Slashdot. If it makes you feel better to post on the intertubes, excellent. Meanwhile, nothing gets done.

      The obvious solution is to publicly angst over our powerlessness. Meanwhile, nothing gets done.

    7. Re:Politically connected by pla · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Obviously, the rational thing is to fatalistically suck it up and try to move on

      That depends.

      Sometimes, the most rational course of action requires doing what little you can to send a simple, clear, and potentially bloody message of "don't do this again". In particular, when you have almost nothing left to lose, and those who destroyed you have almost no risk of seeing any meaningful penalties.

      A handful of BP execs dead at the hands of the fishermen they ruined would do a whole heap more to prevent another such catastrophe, than any monetary penalties ever could. "Companies" behave like complete sociopaths, abusing both convention and law to maximize profits; the humans running companies, however, can experience real fear.

    8. Re:Politically connected by icebraining · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Usually those shootings are not premeditated - the guy just picks up his gun, drives back to work/home and starts shooting.

      Killing some executives requires a plan. Finding their addresses, driving hundreds of miles, etc; Plenty of time to lose the "heat of the moment" and realize the consequences of such actions.

      Also, having a company and not a person to be raged at makes it harder. They don't have such strong feelings against the particular people, they might not even know who they are.

    9. Re:Politically connected by bsDaemon · · Score: 1

      Being laid off is a small thing, compared to region-wide ecological and economic disaster. A school or workplace incident would feel more approachable, I suspect: the perpetrator is familiar with the the target, the victims, etc. It's not storming a tower the size of a city block and rooting around for strangers in an unfamiliar setting while the SWAT team assembles outside preparing to take you out.

      Of course, if you get a sufficiently sized group of co-nuts, then all of a sudden you have momentum and the force of history and blah blah blah. People from groups, from families to gangs to countries to tackle problems they instinctively know they can't take on by themselves. Apparently people down there don't see this as a big enough deal, or having a high enough payout, to form a group and try the violence route. Or maybe its because its the gulf coast and they aren't literate enough to be able to organize.

    10. Re:Politically connected by thijsh · · Score: 4, Informative

      So what? BP has massive amounts of money, as well as political connections out the ass.

      Something did get done. Look at the graph of BP stock. Zoom to 1 year and notice the huge dip following april 20th. They (and their stockholders) did lose money over this...
      Beside that they also (temporarily) lost political connections, to them it's all fine when it's deals in the dark, but when the spotlight is on BP no politician wants to support them.

      So their irresponsibilty caused them to lose some of the two powers they care about, money and connections. It will make them think twice before fucking up on this scale ever again, they may not care about the environment or the fishermen, but they care about losing money and connections.

    11. Re:Politically connected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It'd be a start if the blame was even being spread fairly. This US obsession with blaming BP entirely largely started by Obama as he needed to deflect political attention away from his own incompetence, but BP was only one of a few companies who deserve blame. BP was certainly the majority stakeholder, but whilst BP has from the start accepted it's fair share of the blame - it never once said it'd pay anything less than the full costs of cleanup and compensation. You can't even claim that BP were the ones raking the profits from the well and hence the ones that deserve to pay because other companies including the US oil company Anadarko, and Japanese company Mitsui also had a share in the well but to date have dodged all responsibility, and then there's the fact that companies like Transocean and Halliburton still profited from the well by being contracted to play the part they did in the first place.

      I'm amazed that so little criticism is being pushed towards Halliburton, when it seems they were in fact guilty of at least some degree of negligence - even the US panel investigating the spill is beginning to accept that now-

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11648354

      It's incredible that Americans seem to feel the need for a foreign bogeyman in incidents like this, that despite Halliburton's record in it's dealings regarding the Iraq war all blame is deflected away from it, and companies like Anadarko, Mitsui, and Transocean.

      Sure BP fucked up, sure they were getting the biggest slice of profits, but at least they're the one company out of all those involved who has from the start been willing to pay for the fuckup, even though it seems pretty now that BP might actually have been the company that least screwed up compared to it's partner Transocean, and compared ot Halliburton:

      http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/u-s-spill-panel-examines-causes-of-bp-oil-spill-reuters_molt-7a2344c54e1b.html;_ylt=Atte73PsYsywCFWErVA85UrBXGwF;_ylu=X3oDMTE2MTRia2tlBHBvcwMxMgRzZWMDdG9wc3RvcmllcwRzbGsDdXNzcGlsbHBhbmVs?x=0

      It's sad that the one company that takes responsibility and offers to pay full costs from the outset gets demonised, whilst those others who are responsible keep getting given a free ride by the press and public and are still to this day refusing to accept blame, or pay their share of the costs despite the mounting evidence that they were in fact more responsible for fucking up than BP themselves.

    12. Re:Politically connected by The+Dodger · · Score: 1, Interesting

      > So what? BP has massive amounts of money...

      Actually, that's not as true as you think. They have a lot of assets but they don't have a lot of money. In fact, back in June, there was a serious risk that BP would find itself in financial trouble because it's short-term liquidity sources (i.e. the money markets) had dried up as lenders became increasingly concerned with the lunatic rhetoric being spouted by Obama and his cronies. The markets began to suspect that the administration might actually be stupid enough to try to effectively "kill" BP as a company, so they stopped lending to them. Without funding, BP could have collapsed. That's why Obama's statement after his meeting with Tony Hayward and the other BP senior management team, was so supportive of BP. In that meeting, he was basically told, in no uncertain terms, that he was being a fucking moron and that he should wind his fucking neck in before he did something so incredibly stupid that it would push one of the world's biggest companies into an artificially-induced insolvency, resulting in millions of investors (a lot of them American) losing a lot of money, thousands of employees (again, a lot of them American) losing their jobs and the entire bill for the clean-up, restoration of the environment and compensation for those affected falling on the American taxpayers.

    13. Re:Politically connected by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 1

      He'll get around to it right after "Are you smarter than a 5th grader" is on and he watches the latest "American Idol" with his wife.

    14. Re:Politically connected by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      That used to be true in the old world mass media space, where bas stories where killed off but is is no longer true on the internet. The longer the story is kept alive, the more people you can engage, the more harm it does to those corporations.

      So in this case every effort must be made to keep the story going, to keep hounding BP and it's political supporters, to keep pushing for fairness and where required changes to the law. To keep discussion going on and on and on for years, to keep picking away at them, to keep working ar=t taking away the customers of corporations or the foolish supporters of corrupt politicians. A continuous grinding struggle to wear those fuckers down, we might be ants and they are immense dinosaurs but we will continue bite them done to size bit by fucking bit, no matter how long it takes.

      So yes discussion on slashdot and on every other forum, anti-BP web sites, and also driving past BP service stations and fuelling elsewhere, and does this preclude any other measures to ba taken to seek justice for those affected by BPs pollution, of course not, it is just part and parcel of the overall battle, the first step informing and discussing, prior to taking further action.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    15. Re:Politically connected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is how the animal libbers targeted Huntingdon Life Sciences in the UK, by menacing their staff. It was moderately effective - the staff hated it and extra security was expensive.

      No guns though, because we're British. ;)

    16. Re:Politically connected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Um...

      Yeah, the stock dropped from 60 down to 27, and then people who had lots and lots of money and political connections bought the stock. It's now at 40...so those people who had lots of money and lots of political connections have made 40% on their purchase...I bet they'd like to see that change to 100%...

    17. Re:Politically connected by couchslug · · Score: 1

      "Nothing is going to happen to them, even if half of the Gulf Coast population winds up with cancer."

      There is no hope for peaceful change, yet the public are too comfortable to put the fear of death into corporate leadership (who might lie awake at night if they had to worry about someone they defrauded or poisoned going kamikaze on them) so expect more of the same forever.

      --
      "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
    18. Re:Politically connected by kent_eh · · Score: 1

      So their irresponsibilty caused them to lose some of the two powers they care about, money and connections. It will make them think twice before fucking up on this scale ever again, they may not care about the environment or the fishermen, but they care about losing money and connections.

      Maybe, but I doubt it'll make a significant long term change.
      Also, do you really think that BP's example will have any significant impact on the way other companies operate (except, maybe, to take measures to insulate themselves from repercussions)?

      --

      ---
      "I can't complain, but sometimes still do..." Joe Walsh
    19. Re:Politically connected by fat4eyes · · Score: 2, Informative

      The problem with threatening people with death for their crimes is that they compensate by making sure that their crimes are big enough to warrant the risk of losing their life. Killing some executive does not kill the company and its drive for profit, and the one that replaces him will just commit a bigger crime that is worth the risk of being killed. And since corporations will always be driven by profit, the only real way to prevent such negligence from happening again is to make it such that such negligence that leads to damage to other people's livelihoods is _not_ profitable. Then it's in their interest not to screw up.

    20. Re:Politically connected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because it would be immoral to kill people just because they were greedy or negligent? Those C-level execs are people, too.

    21. Re:Politically connected by Ihmhi · · Score: 1

      In this day and age, it wouldn't really matter.

      Let's say BP fucks up another oil well. Here's what happens.

      1) BP does a cleanup operation as best they can while their stock takes a nosedive.

      2a) Things get so bad that they file for bankruptcy protection.

      2b) They manage to get through things financially without much of an issue.

      3) BP is rebranded under an entirely different name.

      4) As the logo and name will be carefully designed to be nothing like BP, most people will not recognize BP 2.0 for what it is. Almost all of the employees and assets will remain intact, and much of the upper management and board will remain in place. An aggressive marketing campaign will help reinforce this rebranding due to Advertising 101: if you shout often enough and loudly enough, people will listen.

      5) Legally, almost nothing will happen to BP. No economic sanctions, no jail time, etc. They'd likely "sell" all of their assets to the "new" company so that the old BP virtually doesn't exist anymore in a legal sense.

      6) Another corporation gets off scot free. Repeat as necessary.

    22. Re:Politically connected by shadowofwind · · Score: 1

      the humans running companies, however, can experience real fear.

      I think this approach would make things much worse instead of better. In the risk/reward analysis, the lavish lifestyle that the executive gets for his behavior already rivals the value of his own life. Coercion works better against poor people, who might not risk their own lives for $200. But for $200,000,000, the rich person will just use some of that money to add walls, security cameras, and hire body guards. And this reaction is damaging, because the poorer people then have to live in a more security paranoid society, as well as pay for it ultimately. We already see a lot of this. And it makes appealing to the rich person's sense of civic responsibility, already weak, even less effective, because they see all the little people as dangerous enemies.

      As ineffective as the ballot box approach is, for various reasons, I still think its far better than the violent approach. If people were less selfish, and voted more consistently for lawmakers that make fair laws, then the law would make abuse a lot harder for the wealthy.

    23. Re:Politically connected by camperdave · · Score: 2, Informative

      Wait a minute. Why is BP getting blamed for all this? Sure, they operated the well, but it was all rental equipment. Why Transocean or Hyundai getting any heat? Three quarters of the incidents on oil drilling platforms are on Transocean owned platforms, even though less than half the rigs being operated are from Transocean. Oh, and guess who manufactured the blow-out preventer on the Deep-Horizon Oil Spill. You guessed it: Transocean.

      --
      When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
    24. Re:Politically connected by thijsh · · Score: 1

      You forgot: 2c) Shareholders sue BP management for mismanagement that caused them to lose billions, management gets jailtime. One of the few useful perks of capitalism (although it can be argued also one of the most dangerous)...

    25. Re:Politically connected by TheVelvetFlamebait · · Score: 1

      It's because the government and corporations are responsible for a vast majority of extralegal violence cases. They use them to exterminate their opponents, and at the same time, securing a platform to get votes. The sheep go gaga over these "tragedies", and will pretty much vote however the pollies tell them.

      BTW, if it's not clear by now that I'm joking, then there is either something very, very wrong with people in general, or just something very, very wrong with you.

      --
      You know, there is a difference between trolling and pointing out the flaws in your reasoning. Just saying.
    26. Re:Politically connected by bonch · · Score: 1

      Perhaps society is more civilized than you give it credit for. If anyone is most likely to practice violence against BP, it's environmental extremists, not angry ex-fishermen.

    27. Re:Politically connected by eth1 · · Score: 1

      Killing some executives requires a plan. Finding their addresses, driving hundreds of miles, etc; Plenty of time to lose the "heat of the moment" and realize the consequences of such actions.

      I'd not expect to see such a thing from people merely ruined financially; however, if, as one of the OPs suggested, you have a bunch of people basically already sentenced to death from cancer caused by this, it would be a *completely* different story.

      Divorce your spouse (if any), and make sure they and the kids end up with all the assets. Then you have a few months for your crusade before you die anyway. Heck, getting killed by the cops during your rampage might even save you from a slow, painful death from the cancer.

    28. Re:Politically connected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's all well explained right here (pdf). The concept is fairly simple. Sex deprivation, like sleep deprivation will make you crazy. Unwilling to act against your aggressors. In fact you will end up supporting them.

    29. Re:Politically connected by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      Er, and what exactly are you doing?

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    30. Re:Politically connected by frisket · · Score: 1

      Zoom to 1 year and notice the huge dip following april 20th. They (and their stockholders) did lose money over this...

      Nonsense. You only lose money when you sell the stock. If you simply hang onto it until the price goes back up, you've lost nothing. You may lose some paper value for the duration, but that isn't the same thing as hard cash,

    31. Re:Politically connected by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      Why isn't there an enraged ex-fisherman with an AR-15 lurking outside the window of every BP C-level whose name is publicly known? People get killed all the time over petty shit, why not the big stuff?

      Maybe because they rate murder more of a sin than losing their fucking job?

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    32. Re:Politically connected by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      Yes, and it was generally admin staff who suffered most, not just the directors. Same with BP, you'e going to have a much easier time blowing up some randompetrol station than stalking Tony Thingymabob down.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    33. Re:Politically connected by countertrolling · · Score: 1

      They (and their stockholders) did lose money over this...

      *It's but a scratch.. No it isn't. Your arms are off!... I've had worse...*

      A simple name change would be the maximum effect needed to recoup any minor losses. Their biggest expense would be the new stationary.

      --
      For justice, we must go to Don Corleone
    34. Re:Politically connected by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      Wait a minute. Why is BP getting blamed for all this? Sure, they operated the well, but it was all rental equipment. Why Transocean or Hyundai getting any heat? Three quarters of the incidents on oil drilling platforms are on Transocean owned platforms, even though less than half the rigs being operated are from Transocean. Oh, and guess who manufactured the blow-out preventer on the Deep-Horizon Oil Spill. You guessed it: Transocean.

      BP are evil Europeans (and therefore probably socialists), Transocean is a good old US corporation.

      Simples.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    35. Re:Politically connected by cusco · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The Press Corps(e) wants to dumb down the news as much as possible, they can't include too many bad guys in the story without confusing the sheeple. Not many people have heard of Transocean or Mitsui (even I had never heard of Anadarko), and most only associate Haliburton with the Iraq fiasco. Everyone knows that BP is an oil company, the disaster is on an oil platform, so BP is the designated villain for this story. Sad but true.

      --
      "Think about how stupid the average person is. Now, realise that half of them are dumber than that." - George Carlin
    36. Re:Politically connected by MarcQuadra · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I bought-in like mad when the stock started going below $40/share. I made a bunch of loot, and I'm just a regular working Joe. There's a reason stocks are 'public', it means anyone can buy them.

      It drives me mad when people say that investing is something for 'people with lots of power and money', It's not rocket-science, and anyone can do it. Investing has netted me about $15K of spending cash in the last two years, all on a middle-class salary.

      Anyone with half a brain knows that institutional investors were dumping BP stock because their clients were angry at them and it was driving the stock down; the fiscal fundamentals would put the shares back over $40 once things stabilized. I'm still holding, though. I suspect a lot of the $20B put aside won't get used and BP will resume dividends again soon. Once that happens, there's no reason the stock won't bump up another 30%.

      --
      "Sometimes, I think Trent just needs a cup of hot chocolate and a blankie." -Tori Amos on Nine Inch Nails
    37. Re:Politically connected by budgenator · · Score: 1

      Obviously, subjecting large corporations to serious penalties under law would be unamerican, and we generally avoid it; but America is crawling with angry and well armed people, many without too much to lose, and spree-killing is something we start practicing in high school.
       

      BP could face as much as $17.6 billion in civil penalties, based on a federal panel of experts' estimate on Aug. 2 that about 4.1 million barrels of oil leaked from its well into the Gulf. BP: Now Come the Fines

        BP paid the two largest fines in OSHA history – $87.43 million and $21.36 million – for willful negligence that led to the deaths of 15 workers and injured 170 others in a March 2005 refinery explosion in Texas.
      o In September 2005, OSHA cited BP for 296 “Egregious Willful Violations” and other violations associated with the explosion, fining BP $21.36 million and entering into a settlement agreement under which BP agreed to corrective actions to eliminate hazards similar to those that caused the explosion. Cost of Doing Business: BP’s $730 million in fines/settlements + 2 criminal convictions

      They don't seem to care about fines, so I guess that trhey are just that ingrained that hurting them is like hurting yourself.

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
    38. Re:Politically connected by fat4eyes · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The same reason why you get charged for manslaughter if you run over someone with a rented car: you were driving.

    39. Re:Politically connected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe if you let us know what you're doing, we can help by doing something similar. So, what are you doing?

    40. Re:Politically connected by Attila+Dimedici · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It has nothing to do with BP being foreign. I suspect that most Americans think BP is an American company (I know at least one slashdotter wanted Congress to confiscate all of BP's assets). BP gets all of the blame because it serves the interests of several groups (much of the press, some politicians. etc) to have a single"villain".

      --
      The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
    41. Re:Politically connected by pckl300 · · Score: 1

      Something did get done. Look at the graph of BP stock. Zoom to 1 year and notice the huge dip following april 20th. They (and their stockholders) did lose money over this...

      So what? Money is meaningless. Take away something that matters: life, liberty, or happiness.

      --
      In the beginning, there was null.
    42. Re:Politically connected by hesaigo999ca · · Score: 1

      Here here i second that motion and cant wait to get my popcorn once the hubdubb starts

    43. Re:Politically connected by hesaigo999ca · · Score: 1

      Yeah but in this scenario we are talking about our government being manipulated because the ones in power elected by the people no longer server the people, but their own bank accounts and take payoffs by these big cos. that end up bypassing laws set in place to stop them from doing all these bad things, I for one would love to see more extreme activists making statements against the politicians directly, like if you accept bribes and we end up hearing about it, we visit your family,
      and next time, there won't be a next time.....guaranteed, they won't feel like they are above the law, and might think twice about taking payoffs etc....

      Remember the episode of the fonz in happy days, where the sheriff was all over him, then everyone else started to show up wearing the same leather jacket (even the mom!), this is what I am talking about, if more "heroes" were able to do this, then even if one was sent to jail, 12 would be ready to take his place...wow, can you imagine .....

      but no....sadly, we are a nation of slap me in the face and then bend me over....and we like it like that!

    44. Re:Politically connected by camperdave · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Maybe, but who gets charged if the wheel falls off and kills somebody? At some point the makers of shoddy equipment need to be called to task.

      --
      When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
    45. Re:Politically connected by Shotgun · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Even worse is that when "that dirty fisherman" does cap Tony, the next C-level will put up higher walls and add security and then feel smug in dumping in the backyards of the "dirty proles", because they are stupid and violent.

      These guys don't fear death. They've got plenty of security to handle us. What they fear is poverty and the resulting public humiliation.

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
    46. Re:Politically connected by Red+Flayer · · Score: 1

      They don't seem to care about fines

      And why would they care about those miniscule fines? $730 MM in fines is only two weeks' profit for them.

      Fine them multiple years' worth of profit, hell, even multiple *quarters* of profit, and then they'll care.

      Make the fines the single largest line-item expense on their financial reporting, and they'll care.

      --
      "Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
    47. Re:Politically connected by Red+Flayer · · Score: 1

      2c) Shareholders sue BP management for mismanagement that caused them to lose billions, management gets jailtime.

      Management wouldn't get jailtime from a civil suit.

      --
      "Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
    48. Re:Politically connected by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      Those C-level execs are people, too.

      There's no actual evidence for that...

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    49. Re:Politically connected by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      You may lose some paper value for the duration

      And if you've got a smart enough accountant, you can probably use that 'loss' to offset tax somewhere...

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    50. Re:Politically connected by h4rr4r · · Score: 2, Insightful

      So you value money over moral or ethical actions, awesome.

      I considered it, but buying into BP would probably impact my ability to sleep at night.

      Have fun with your blood money.

    51. Re:Politically connected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm sorry but you're talking about a company who does business in some of the shittiest parts of the world. I've gone to a lubrications plant where I had two armed guards escort me from the airport all the way to the plant which itself looked like a prison compared compared to the simple fence around the oil refinery I do work at.

      You think shooting at some staff will change the way they do business? Well it will, but it'll be in the form of protective action, not of reduced drilling or different standards.

      I really hope you take yourself out of the gene pool for your stupid comments.

    52. Re:Politically connected by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      of course bp is paying for the clean up, under us law the people that own the oil clean up the mess, it doesnt matter than the american poured concrete was bad, it doesnt matter that the rig was owned and operated by transocean, yes another american company, one thats caused similar mess all over the world. somestimes the americans get what they deserve, your companys the ones you let get away with this mess have do it to millions in lots of countrys, but you dont give a shit becuase those people arent american

    53. Re:Politically connected by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      Wait a minute. Why is BP getting blamed for all this? Sure, they operated the well, but it was all rental equipment.

      This is a valid point in general - if you leave out some of the more hysterical gibberings of other people in this thread. And within the industry, people know it. TransOcean are gearing up to be on the receiving end of a shitstorm.

      Why Transocean or Hyundai getting any heat?

      Why aren't they? Well, Hyundai aren't receiving any shit because they built a rig to a design from a client, and delivered it. And it worked according to specifications. Then the rig's owners did some things out of specification and the rig sank after burning for several days. I fail to see any grounds for throwing shit at Hyundai.

      TransOcean on the other hand ... have been extraordinarily lucky in the way that all the vitriol and invective has been directed at BP, and almost no attention has been paid (by the general public ; within the industry, attention is being paid!) to the fact that a number of TransOcean-owned, maintained and operated bits of equipment either failed or were not operated correctly.

      If you've been on a TransOcean rig in the last few months (I've been on 2 since DWH), you'd have seen the near-hysterical manufacturing of safety statistics ; someone high up in TransOcean is well aware that the shit and the fan are going to come together, and they're putting the squeeze on every one to produce pretty-looking safety statistics.

      Three quarters of the incidents on oil drilling platforms are on Transocean owned platforms, even though less than half the rigs being operated are from Transocean.

      Actually, as an insider in the industry, without any particular affiliation with TransOcean (or any other drilling company), I don't see any great disproportion between TO's operational safety and the average. If push came to shove, I'd say that they're probably a little better than average - but that's mainly because there are some shockingly bad operators out there.

      That's scarcely a ringing endorsement.

      And it just begs the question of why the fuck they continued using a BOP that wasn't able to pass it's pressure test. Someone, somewhere is going to have to answer that question. Or they're going to have to migrate to a country that doesn't have extradition arrangements with the US - which is a tactic that several drilling companies have practised over the years, so there is plenty of experience of how to get around problems like that.

      Oh, and guess who manufactured the blow-out preventer on the Deep-Horizon Oil Spill. You guessed it: Transocean.

      Errr, I don't think so. I think that it was a Cameron stack.

      It was TransOcean personnel who operated it, and maintained it. There are suggestions that some of the hydraulic control lines may have been incorrectly rigged up. Which will make Cameron's people breathe a sigh of relief if it's proven true.

      I've got a £5 bet with a colleague that it will turn out to be America's equivalent of the "Ocean Oddyessy Lesson" : replacing a $100 O-ring from the manufacturer with a $5 O-ring from the local car shop may just slightly compromise performance of the equipment in question.

      That's a cheap lesson. It's depressing that people still decline to learn it.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
    54. Re:Politically connected by ultranova · · Score: 1

      The problem with threatening people with death for their crimes is that they compensate by making sure that their crimes are big enough to warrant the risk of losing their life. Killing some executive does not kill the company and its drive for profit, and the one that replaces him will just commit a bigger crime that is worth the risk of being killed.

      Of course, this same logic holds for all other possible punishments, including fines and jail time. So, if you are right, we should stop the enforcement of all laws.

      --

      Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.

    55. Re:Politically connected by drsquare · · Score: 1

      Most retail traders lose money, the institutional traders make money off the backs of ordinary people trying to play the markets. The average person doesn't have the time or the knowledge to do the necessary research to reliably make money, nor can they afford to risk their savings on what is essentially gambling.

      I'm not sure how relevant your anecdote is compared to the statistics.

    56. Re:Politically connected by drsquare · · Score: 1

      If it's moral to use oil, then it's moral to invest in its extraction and processing. Unless you live a pre-industrial lifestyle, yours is a pretty hypocritical stance.

    57. Re:Politically connected by camperdave · · Score: 1

      Errr, I don't think so. I think that it was a Cameron stack.

      I stand corrected.

      --
      When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
    58. Re:Politically connected by MarcQuadra · · Score: 1

      As a stockholder, it's in my interests that the company -not- screw up again, and that they do right by the Gulf communities.

      I get a voting stake on who sits on the board.

      I -take their money-.

      All you do on the sidelines as a normal consumer is buy the product.

      Look, I did the math and researched oil spills of this magnitude before I bought in. I don't think this spill is as bad as most environmentalists want it to be, and I'm overall quite pleased with BP's restitution and cleanup. In the end, it's going to be half a missed shrimping season and a basic cleanup of the few places where oil did make it to shore.

      --
      "Sometimes, I think Trent just needs a cup of hot chocolate and a blankie." -Tori Amos on Nine Inch Nails
    59. Re:Politically connected by hawkfish · · Score: 1

      It has nothing to do with BP being foreign. I suspect that most Americans think BP is an American company (I know at least one slashdotter wanted Congress to confiscate all of BP's assets).

      Even the idea that a company the size of BP has a "nationality" is pretty silly.

      --
      You will not drink with us, but you would taste our steel? - Walter Matthau, The Pirates
    60. Re:Politically connected by badkarmadayaccount · · Score: 1

      What amount of security can handle military grade explosives?

      --
      I know tobacco is bad for you, so I smoke weed with crack.
    61. Re:Politically connected by Shotgun · · Score: 1

      You have to get that military grade explosives to the correct C-level, so I think the direct answer to your question is, "A suprisingly small amount."

      Besides, whatever it costs will be spread across a small increase in gas prices. 8*(

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
  4. It's A Big Mystery by Anne_Nonymous · · Score: 4, Funny

    "Sherlock, we could find a place to put the blame if only we knew what kind of rock they were drilling through."
    "Sedimentary, my dear Watson, sedimentary."

    1. Re:It's A Big Mystery by Mr+Thinly+Sliced · · Score: 0

      Reminds me of my favourite Sherlock Holmes joke:

      Watson comes home early one day from sidekick school to find his cohort naked on all fours in the living room with lemon jam smeared all around his ring piece. There is a sign with an arrow pointing at his arse with the words "Do Me"

      Watson: My God Holmes, what on earth are you up to?
      Holmes: Lemon-entry, my dear Watson.

    2. Re:It's A Big Mystery by tehcyder · · Score: 1
      You spoiled it by mentioning "lemon jam" it's too obvious what the punchline will be. You'd need to find some way of referring to the fact that it was lemon jam without actually saying so.

      Also, who ever heard of lemon jam?

      Overall B minus needs more work.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
  5. BP's fault, but not their fault. by Flowstone · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Translation:
    "We have concrete evidence that bp not only dropped the ball, but insisted on risking screwing themselves over. However we're not going to say it was their fault, as they're a big oil company that pays us alot of money."
    so much for biting the hand that feeds you.

    1. Re:BP's fault, but not their fault. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In this case, when they say concrete evidence, they mean it literally.

    2. Re:BP's fault, but not their fault. by The+Dodger · · Score: 3, Funny

      Oh, shut up! It's obvious to anyone with an IQ above single digits that the constant sniping at BP is nothing but a xenophobic witch-hunt, fomented by a faltering White House to distract attention from their own failings. The Oil Spill Commission has already found that BP did not sacrifice safety in favour of profits so give us all a fucking break!

      Why don't you direct some of your ire at the federal investigators who haven't yet started an examination of the blowout preventer (made by a US firm, by the way) that FAILED TO WORK, even though it's been sitting in a NASA faciloty for TWO MONTHS!

      Morons.

    3. Re:BP's fault, but not their fault. by yoyoq · · Score: 1

      Leave BP alooooone!

    4. Re:BP's fault, but not their fault. by Adrian+Lopez · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "Oh, shut up! It's obvious to anyone with an IQ above single digits that the constant sniping at BP is nothing but a xenophobic witch-hunt, fomented by a faltering White House to distract attention from their own failings."

      I thought you were kidding, but reading your other posts makes it clear you were being serious. I guess it's not just religious fundamentalists whose thoughts are indistinguishable from parody.

      --
      "In prison you just have to shut your eyes and take it. Here you have to shut your eyes and give it."
    5. Re:BP's fault, but not their fault. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The only funny thing about his post is that it is true. If it were parody it would not be funny.

  6. news.slashdot.org down ? by alexhs · · Score: 1

    He means news.slashdot.org links.
    I also get "404 Not Found" for these links, like News: Firefox 4 Regains Speed Mojo With No. 2 Placing.

    --
    I have discovered a truly marvelous proof of killer sig, which this margin is too narrow to contain.
    1. Re:news.slashdot.org down ? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Worse, you can't just drop "news." from the URI on the front page. I only got a URI which I could drop the hostname from by visiting the RSS feed! WTF?

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    2. Re:news.slashdot.org down ? by Haedrian · · Score: 1

      You can just remove the 'news.' part of the URL once you get the 404, and it'll work.

    3. Re:news.slashdot.org down ? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      No, I can't. Tried that. Just redirects in a loop. That's why I said I had to go to RSS to get a working link.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    4. Re:news.slashdot.org down ? by alexhs · · Score: 1

      Yes and no.

      The story link works, but the article.pl link keeps redirecting to the broken news.slashdot.org server.
      However, when logged in, I only get article.pl links (maybe 'cause I'm using the classic index).

      Just in the case where a Slashdot staff would read this and didn't notice, http://news.slashdot.org/ redirects to http://news.slashdot.org/www.sourceforge.net ...

      But as I write that, I notice that news.slashdot.org has now been fixed.

      --
      I have discovered a truly marvelous proof of killer sig, which this margin is too narrow to contain.
    5. Re:news.slashdot.org down ? by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      I can click on those, is this a problem that has now been fixed, or am I missing something?

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    6. Re:news.slashdot.org down ? by alexhs · · Score: 1

      It has been fixed at 14:55 GMT, after at least 6 hours of downtime. (cf. my other post)

      --
      I have discovered a truly marvelous proof of killer sig, which this margin is too narrow to contain.
  7. Fools... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 0

    If they had written to the correct registers they could have put the well into debug mode and sorted all this out...

  8. Software? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So what surprises me is that there is IT involved yet we didn't see some AC whistleblower on slashdot or anywhere else during the incident.

    1. Re:Software? by nedlohs · · Score: 1

      Why would IT know anythign about the results the modelling software spits out. They aren't the ones actually using it.

      You expect an IT whistleblower on everything because I'm sure someone did something related to it with Word or Outlook at some point?

    2. Re:Software? by TheKidWho · · Score: 1

      Do IT people suffer from some type of delusion that only IT people can productively use software?

    3. Re:Software? by tom17 · · Score: 1

      COMPLETELY off-topic, but...

      anythign

      I am CONTINUOUSLY making this typo these days and having to go back and correct it all the time. I wonder where it all went so wrong that the timing of my fingers in 'auto-mode' has become so off. I never learned to touch type, I have just developed my own fast enough 3-5 finger peck-typing over the years. I'm now able to type without looking at the keyboard sometimes for whole sentences. But even when looking down, this 'ng' keeps happening.

      I know, I know. Slow down and pay more attention. Maybe it's time to learn to touch type properly, though it feels a little late after ~20yrs

    4. Re:Software? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      did you mean CONSTANTLY ?

    5. Re:Software? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      I have yet to see a single posting on Slashdot that appears to come from a real source that would even come close to being a whistleblower.

      I have seen a lot of big egos who think they're in the know but never anyone who really was in any inner circle with the real goods.

    6. Re:Software? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some form of IT is employed in every company of note. Why expect a whistle blown over one cement incident? Why not every incident by companies large or small?

      Maybe IT's involvement is merely keeping offender's hardware up and running, not knowing or caring what people do with their legit software.
      Maybe IT doesn't read Slashdot (or anything else), or does, but only lurks.
      Maybe IT could blow the whistle, but just doesn't share your ideals and visions or has no desire to blow the whistle on anything.
      Maybe info has been leaked, but the anonymous posting was ignored as unverifiable or as crackpottery.

    7. Re:Software? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      anythign anythign anythign anythign
      anythign anythign anythign anythign
      anythign anythign anythign anythign
      anythign anythign anythign anythign

      fyi My comment violated the "postercomment" compression filter. I should try less whitespace and/or less repetition.

    8. Re:Software? by nedlohs · · Score: 1

      You likely use your right hand for the i and n, and your left hand for the g. So you left hand has a head start due to not having been involved in pressing the i and gets there first.

      At least that's my excuse.

    9. Re:Software? by tom17 · · Score: 1

      this is a test for anything.

      Yup!, never analysed it before. Right middle hits, say, i. Right index hits n and left middle hits g, but sometimes does it before the right index hits n. They are all moving too fast!

      /me slows down.

    10. Re:Software? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How do you know he's not locked in a room somewhere typing anythign over and over again all day long?

    11. Re:Software? by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 1

      I say you go with it, it should be pronounced similar to "pardigm".

      You can make up whatever meaning you want, too (as long as it is at least related to "anything") since it is your word!

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
  9. Good Job Halliburton by Talderas · · Score: 1

    Come on people. Give Halliburton some props here.

    --
    "Lack of speed can be overcome. In the worst case by patience." --Znork
    1. Re:Good Job Halliburton by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      Oh forget that. Halliburton is evil, therefore even when they do their jobs properly and attempt to prevent a massive ecological disaster though technology and expertise, they're doing it out of evil motives!

      I'm sure Dick Cheney was on the rig tossing the centralizers over the side!

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    2. Re:Good Job Halliburton by Talderas · · Score: 1

      God bless you Slashdot. You don't fail to disappoint.

      --
      "Lack of speed can be overcome. In the worst case by patience." --Znork
  10. Leftist Heads About to Explode by geoffrobinson · · Score: 0, Troll

    We have information that will put blame on BP. But in means giving credence to Halliburton. What is a diehard leftist to do?

    --
    Except for ending slavery, the Nazis, communism, & securing American independence, war has never solved anything.
    1. Re:Leftist Heads About to Explode by bonch · · Score: 0, Troll

      They'll simply ignore it and shout more loudly through their bullhorns. Volume is an excellent distractor.

  11. Sometimes smart people make mistakes by davidwr · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The issue isn't "omg they ignored the modeling - those bastards!"

    The issues are:

    1) Was their mistaken belief that the stabilizers were the wrong size reasonable under the circumstances, was it due to an understandable human error, or was it due to gross incompetence?

    2) Was the backup plan based on sound engineering and sound industry practices, or was it a "we think this will be okay, let's cross our fingers and drill?"

    If the mistake on the stabilizers was reasonable under the circumstances and the backup plan was based on sound engineering and sound industry practices, I don't see any blame as it relates to this particular decision.

    On the other hand, if either decision was based on incompetence, then it's easy to pin blame. If the mistake was based on something less than incompetence - say, a competent person demonstrating the reality that good human beings occasionally make mistakes and making a bad or careless decision at what would turn out to be the worst possible time - then there is blame but the punishment for that person should not be as severe as that of incompetence.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
    1. Re:Sometimes smart people make mistakes by Combatso · · Score: 1

      i agree... but replace all "incompetence" with "negligence"... the difference being "i didnt know" vs "i didnt care"

    2. Re:Sometimes smart people make mistakes by frisket · · Score: 1

      1) Was their mistaken belief that the stabilizers were the wrong size reasonable under the circumstances, was it due to an understandable human error, or was it due to gross incompetence?

      This is the outstanding unanswered question. Does anyone have any information?

    3. Re:Sometimes smart people make mistakes by The+Dodger · · Score: 1

      You're missing a fundamental question: When the Halliburton team was asked to go ahead and do the cement job with only six centralizers, did they (a) believe that it was unsafe to do so and (b) tell anyone that they believed it was unsafe?

      Their testimony to the Marine Board of Investigation hearings indicates that the answer to both those questions was "No.".

      This is all a big Halliburton smokescreen. If you go back through the various statements they've put out since they finally stopped stonewalling back on 30th April, they keep changing their story and attempting to obfuscate the pertinent details.

    4. Re:Sometimes smart people make mistakes by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      So if they tried their best it was ok?

      Wow, that is setting the bar pretty low. Why in the world are they even allowed to drill with out being able to prove they can control this kind of well when, not if, something like this happens?

    5. Re:Sometimes smart people make mistakes by TapeCutter · · Score: 1

      "So if they tried their best it was ok?"

      Sort of, it's called due dilligence and it exists because of the mice/men/plan thing.

      "prove they can control this kind of well"

      It's logically impossible to prove any action is safe before the action is performed no matter how many times it's been done in the past. The best that you can do is lower the proability of known problems occuring by regulating inherently dangerous actions, but with half the US population demanding that "government get out of the way of business" I'm not sure how you would sell such a rational approach to a large group of people who basically want to have their cake and eat it.

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
    6. Re:Sometimes smart people make mistakes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      2) Was the backup plan based on sound engineering and sound industry practices, or was it a "we think this will be okay, let's cross our fingers and drill?"

      And if it wasn't why isn't anyone holding Halliburton criminally negligent for constructing something they knew was going to fail? Please someone at Hallibruton show me your legal contract that says BP will assume all responsibility for your cementing job. Oh what, don't have a clause like that? Is that because you a) don't have lawyers, or b) didn't give a flying fuck about your own engineering data and wanted to complete the job and get paid at all costs.

      As an engineer doing something that I know would cause mass problems would make me criminally negligent. Since Halliburton doesn't seem to have a get out of jail clause in their contract with BP they are either insanely stupid or are trying to divert attention with a shitload of modeling after the fact. Thanks, guys but you can share the blame.

    7. Re:Sometimes smart people make mistakes by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      i agree... but replace all "incompetence" with "negligence"... the difference being "i didnt know" vs "i didnt care"

      Most people who get to any level in the drilling game that involves brain work instead of muscle work, understand fully that their fuck-ups can result in them getting personally dead. "didn't care" doesn't last long ; "didn't understand" or "didn't know" is much more likely.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  12. So who's in the dock? by dkleinsc · · Score: 4, Interesting

    For what, you ask? Negligent homicide. Because somebody decided to drill in a situation they knew to be unsafe, putting the lives of everyone on the rig, including those with no choice in the matter, at risk for the sake of profits. A few criminal prosecutions would change that culture quickly, otherwise it's just a cost of doing business.

    --
    I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
  13. When "systematic" becomes "invisible"... by MRe_nl · · Score: 1

    From the article:
    The report said there was “no evidence” to suggest BP had put cost before safety.

    And then:
    Commission co-chair William Riley noted “what appeared to be a rush to completion” at the drilling site. He added that “one must ask where the drive came from that made people determine they couldn’t wait for sound cement, or the right centralisers”.
    Is this guy stupid? That's the norm!. Ever heard of "time is money"?

    “In the inhuman system of capital, every technical problem boils down to an economic one, that of the prize to be won by cutting costs and boosting returns”.
    http://www.vajont.info/eNGLISH/thePiaveLegend.html

    --
    "Kill 'em all and let Root sort 'em out"
    1. Re:When "systematic" becomes "invisible"... by The+Dodger · · Score: 2, Insightful

      How about we go right back to the source of the problem and track down the bastard who issued the licence to drill in such deep water to begin with? Surely it's obvious to even the most dim-witted American politician that drilling in 5,000 feet of water is going to entail some risks?

    2. Re:When "systematic" becomes "invisible"... by MRe_nl · · Score: 1

      I don't think the source of the problem is any one individual, but the system in which these individuals operate.

      "Surely it's obvious to even the most dim-witted American politician that drilling in 5,000 feet of water is going to entail some risks"?

      If the experts say "risky but doable",
      and it concerns a potentially very profitable project, it usually seems to get approved.

      --
      "Kill 'em all and let Root sort 'em out"
    3. Re:When "systematic" becomes "invisible"... by aaarrrgggh · · Score: 1

      I think the cost issue is related more to the well design rather than the final rush to completion. There was a lot of discussion about liner/tie-back vs long string early on. Liner/tie-back is a slower process.

      Clearly they were on a schedule and trying to make the schedule. It isn't so clear if they made negligent decisions in order to maintain the schedule.

    4. Re:When "systematic" becomes "invisible"... by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 1

      That's because Commission co-chair William Riley has a name to make for himself. It's funny that he contradicts the commission a day after the official report comes out, is it not?

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    5. Re:When "systematic" becomes "invisible"... by drakaan · · Score: 1

      I think of this as more of an "unintended consequences" scenario.

      Yes, it's obvious that drilling in deep water is risky, but when there is a general refusal to allow drilling on land or near shore (at least in places known to have significant oil deposits), then where else can you drill? Allowing zero permits isn't really an option yet, since nearly all transportation uses refined oil as a power source.

      To me, this seems like a case where environmental protection got very much in its own way without intending to. It certainly would have been easier to both stop a leak and to clean up after it for a similar accident that occurred on land or in 100 feet of water.

      --
      "Murphy was an optimist" - O'Toole's commentary on Murphy's Law
  14. Oh, and by the way... by The+Dodger · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ..BP didn't do the cementing. Halliburton did. So, if Halliburton's model showed that more centralizers were required but they decided to go ahead with the cementing anyway, seems to me that they were negligent.

    It's like a builder telling the developer "We should use beams and girders in this wall to make it stronger" and the developer saying "Hmmm. We haven't got any steel beams to hand. Can you use reinforced concrete instead and maybe make the wall thicker?". If the builder says "Yeah, sure!" and goes ahead, he can't blame the developer if the wall later collapses.

    I sense desperate attempts at ass-covering on Halliburton's part. Probably worried about all their lucrative no-competition Pentagon contracts.

    1. Re:Oh, and by the way... by stdarg · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Halliburton did the cementing, then said hey it's wrong, then BP proceeded with drilling anyway, rather than redoing the cement. Halliburton didn't do the drilling so I don't see how you can blame them.

      According to the Oil Spill Commission’s findings this week, Brian Morel, drilling engineer at BP, wrote an email to Brett Cocales, another BP engineer, as the drilling proceeded, saying: “Who cares, it’s done, end of story, we’ll probably be fine”.
      [...]
      At a hearing in July, BP’s well team leader, John Guide, explained the decision not to go with the software’s recommendations. “The model is – first of all, it’s not accurate all the time. ...I put very, very little faith in the model because it’s wrong a lot.”

      BP still drilled with “no direct indicators of cement success” and no cement evaluation log, the Oil Spill commission said. The company conducted a separate negative pressure test, an oil engineering test designed to show whether the casing and cement would hold against significant pressure, and isolate potentially dangerous hydrocarbons.

      The test was failed, but was – for an unexplained reason – deemed a “complete success” by both BP and rig owner Transocean at the time, a presentation on Monday said.

      That's pretty blatant. Halliburton warned them, BP did their own separate test, which failed. Then they're like, oh well let's do it anyway! And you find a way to blame Halliburton in that?

    2. Re:Oh, and by the way... by The+Dodger · · Score: 2, Informative

      Let's take a look at the original Oil Spill commission letter reporting back to the commissioners on the findings relating to the Halliburton cement, shall we?

      "The documents provided to us by Halliburton show, among other things, that its personnel conducted at least four foam stability tests relevant to the Macondo cement slurry. The first two tests were conducted in February 2010 using different well design parameters and a slightly different slurry recipe than was finally used. Both tests indicated that this foam slurry design was unstable.

      "Halliburton provided data from one of the two February tests to BP in an email dated March 8, 2010. The data appeared in a technical report along with other information. There is no indication that Halliburton highlighted to BP the significance of the foam stability data or that BP personnel raised any questions about it. There is no indication that Halliburton provided the data from the other February test to BP.

      "Halliburton conducted two additional foam stability tests in April, this time using the actual recipe and design poured at the Macondo well. We believe that its personnel conducted the first of these two tests on or about April 13, seven days before the blowout. Lab personnel used slightly different lab protocols than they had used in February. Although there are some indications that lab personnel may have conducted this test improperly, it once again indicated that the foam slurry design was unstable. The results of this test were reported internally within Halliburton by at least April 17, though it appears that Halliburton never provided the data to BP."

      One of the four conclusions in that letter was that "Halliburton (and perhaps BP) should have considered redesigning the foam slurry before pumping it at the Macondo well."

      There's plenty of blame to go 'round. People should quit the pretence that it's all BP's fault.

    3. Re:Oh, and by the way... by dkleinsc · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Here's what I actually suspect: BP and Halliburton were both responsible to some degree. Because of that, the companies will insist on separate trials if it ever gets to court, and the defense in each of the two trials will be "the other guy did it". That way, neither of them has to actually take responsibility for their actions.

      --
      I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
    4. Re:Oh, and by the way... by The+Dodger · · Score: 3, Informative

      One significant difference between the two is that BP has accepted it's responsibility and has voluntarily waived the $75m statutory limit on monetary damages (contained in the Oil Pollution Act of 1990), instead establishing a $20bn compensation fund. And that's on top of the clean-up costs.

      Meanwhile, Halliburton and Conway are keeping their heads down, desperately hoping that no one notices that it was their cement and blowout preventer that failed to, y'know, prevent the blowout from happening in the first place.

      Note that there's a difference between responsibility and blame. BP are responsible for cleaning up the spill, because they are the operator of the lease. That doesn't necessarily mean that they are to blame for what happened (although I broadly agree that the blame is probably shared between several of the parties involved).

    5. Re:Oh, and by the way... by realisticradical · · Score: 1
      Wait, those are actual quotes? "Who cares, it's done" "We'll probably be fine" "it's wrong a lot"

      These are the engineering geniuses we have doing the most complicated oil drilling possible? WTF! Last I checked "probably be fine" and "wrong a lot" don't count for sound scientific basis.

    6. Re:Oh, and by the way... by bonch · · Score: 1

      Halliburton told BP that the cementing was wrong, but BP ignored them and drilled anyway. Halliburton actually tried to do the right thing here and was ignored.

    7. Re:Oh, and by the way... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      If the builder says "Yeah, sure!" and goes ahead, he can't blame the developer if the wall later collapses.

      That's not how it works. I won't bother to address whether your comment is actually related to the topic at hand, but it is wrong.

      The Kansas City Hyatt Regency. There was once a suspended walkway in this building, where essentially poles came down from the ceiling and supported a few walkways stacked on top of each other. The design called for a single beam for each pole, but the contractor decided that shorter beams would be easier to make, so they decided they could just use a pole that goes down to the top level, then one that goes between that level and the next. An engineer rubber-stamped the change.

      Long story short, that pretty much doubled the stress on the attachment points of the supports that ran to the top level, the walkways came down when people were on them, and 114 died. Several people lost their engineering licenses in the engineering firm involved, and the firm itself was shut down. As far as I can tell, the contractor was never held responsible for anything.

      Moderator hints: (Score: -1, cited real world data)

    8. Re:Oh, and by the way... by The+Dodger · · Score: 1

      Wrong. The people Halliburton had doing the cement job have already told the Marine Board of Investigation hearings that "they did not deem the cement job on the well to be unsafe even with the use of six centralizers -- nor did they believe there was a risk of a well blowout."

      However, if you're willing to swallow Halliburton's story, I have $50m in a Nigerian bank account that I'd like to talk to you about...

    9. Re:Oh, and by the way... by The+Dodger · · Score: 1

      You mention that an engineer rubber-stamped the change and that the engineering firm ended up being shut down. You don't mention the owner of the hotel.

      In the Deepwater Horizon example, Halliburton are the equivalent of the engineering firm and the contractors combined.

    10. Re:Oh, and by the way... by Firethorn · · Score: 1

      Not just that, they'll point out every little spot where employees failed to follow policy in anything related to the incident - some listed such as NOT using the engineered solution. That smacks of 'middle management looking to meet it's goals' to me. They'll hang the local boss out to dry, insulating the top executives who were going to go with the 'properly engineered solution' over the alternative the local team decided to use instead when they thought the delivered parts were incorrect.

      --
      I don't read AC A human right
    11. Re:Oh, and by the way... by dkleinsc · · Score: 1

      One significant difference between the two is that BP has accepted it's responsibility and has voluntarily waived the $75m statutory limit on monetary damages (contained in the Oil Pollution Act of 1990), instead establishing a $20bn compensation fund. And that's on top of the clean-up costs.

      On the flip side, that could be an indication that BP thought at the time that the actual damages would end up being way higher than $20bn. For corporations, the bottom line is the bottom line, and they aren't going to spend that kind of money without a reason why that spending will either mitigate risk, reduce costs, or increase profits.

      --
      I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
    12. Re:Oh, and by the way... by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 1

      Wait, what am I missing here...

      ...voluntarily waived the $75m statutory limit on monetary damages (contained in the Oil Pollution Act of 1990)...

      Is there some other kind of damages they might've had? Becasue $20bn is way higher than $75m.

      --
      Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
    13. Re:Oh, and by the way... by dkleinsc · · Score: 1

      I'm not entirely sure, although my best guess is nations other than the US that were affected by the spill.

      My point is that BP is not an altruistic organization, and is required by law to do what's in the best interests of their shareholders, so they have a financial reason for doing what they're doing. It may not be a short-term financial reason, but it's there nonetheless.

      --
      I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
    14. Re:Oh, and by the way... by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      Yeah, that 75M limit is only if no criminal liability is found. By offering 20B they made sure their C level execs would not be guests of the state.

    15. Re:Oh, and by the way... by maxume · · Score: 1

      Do you know if Conway was responsible for the incredibly lax maintenance of the blowout preventer?

      A bit tough to blame Conway if BP was using it wrong.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    16. Re:Oh, and by the way... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Halliburton has yet to show a legally defensible document where they passed on liability for their job. If I build you a house and say, hey I fucked it up, don't live in it or it'll collapse, and then it does killing all the occupants. Who's fault is it? Just yours for not taking the non-legally binding advice? Or both of ours for my negligent building?

      BP couldn't have legally started to pressure test the well (which is what they were doing when things went south), without a complete handover by Halliburton. Either Halliburton handed it over and were criminally negligent for doing so, or Hallibruton had a legally binding document saying we hand over this well but you assume liability (which they didn't have).

      Coming after the fact and saying that they mentioned this to BP does not cut it. Halliburton assumes part of the blame.

    17. Re:Oh, and by the way... by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 1

      My point is that BP is not an altruistic organization, and is required by law to do what's in the best interests of their shareholders,

      Cleaning up the mess is in the best interests of the shareholders who happen to live there. Building a better public image, and keeping the Earth habitable, are both likely to be good investments in the long term compared to the alternative.

      So, altruism and "best interests of their shareholders" aren't mutually exclusive. In particular, take a good hard look at what happened to BP and Transocean stock after the oil spill...

      --
      Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
    18. Re:Oh, and by the way... by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure how they've guaranteed any such thing, though. And are those execs really worth that much? (I guess I really don't want to know.)

      --
      Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
    19. Re:Oh, and by the way... by The+Dodger · · Score: 1

      I doubt, to the point of virtual certainty, that the $20bn bought immunity from prosecution.

      You asked whether there "some other kind of damages they might've had". They didn't pledge the $20bn to avoid other damages. It's basically protection money, to get Obama off their backs.

      As I've pointed out elsewhere, the rhetoric being spouted by Obama was seriously affecting the market's confidence in BP and that was making it difficult for them to raise short-term funding (which is how a company of BP's size operates on a day-to-day basis). There was a real risk that BP could run out of cash - i.e. go bust, essentially.

      Now, you expect that sort of lunatic, xenophobic rhetoric from Congress and, even if a couple of representatives from Bumfuck, AZ and Shitsville, TN decide to introduce a bill that would seize all of BP's assets, the markets aren't going to take it seriously...unless it looks like the President might actually sign it into law. The fact that Obama and the White House were demonising the company and blatantly stirring up public opinion by constantly referring to it as "British" Petroleum (it's not been called that since the merger with Amoco over a decade ago) made them nervous.

      From the BP board's perspective, there were two issues at stake. Firstly, straightforward survival. Obama had clearly identified BP as a scapegoat. He clearly didn't care whether BP was to blame for the oil spill or not - he needed someone to blame and BP were the prime candidate. Arthur Andersen's experience being scapegoated for the Enron collapse showed that the US government is prepared to effectively lynch a company, even if they're innocent (Arthur Andersen was eventually exonerated by the Supreme Court, by which time it was far, far too late to save the company). BP needed to avoid that at all costs.

      The second issue was that BP needed to ensure that it could continue to do business in the US. BP has a huge footprint in the US - more than 40% of BP is what used to be Amoco. If BP didn't placate Obama and get him back on-side, they may well have faced legislation targeting them in the US. That would certainly have had a seriously detrimental impact on their future profitability and may have forced them to sell their US operations at a knockdown price. BP's board probably felt that $20bn over four years was a price worth paying to avoid that.

      Ultimately, they went into their meeting with Obama (at which the $20bn was agreed) with a carrot and a stick. The carrot was the $20bn - basically, they agreed to pay the protection money. Sure, no one like to be the victim of a shakedown but shit happens.

      The stick was the risk of BP going under. If that happened, the entire cost of the clean-up effort and compensation would have had to be borne by the US government and Obama would have been crucified had it emerged (and the BP board would have made sure it did - in fact, they would have completely trashed him in the press) that he had turned down a $20bn peace offering from a company that was only liable for $75m.

      So, end result is that BP eats humble pie and coughs up 18 months' profits spread over four years (and there's a chance that the total compensation bill won't even come to that much), while Obama walked out to tell the press corps that "BP is a strong and viable company and it is in all of our interests that it remain so."

      A minor side-effect is that the United States' attractiveness as a place to do business has taken a knock. Multinational corps will be just a little bit more wary of doing business in the United States from now on. If the equivalent of a BP-Amoco merger were to occur today, there's a good chance that the Amoco name would be retained and that it would be given a separate stock market listing, to insulate the parent company from the US' banana republic-style political foaming-at-the-mouth lunacy.

      Another impact is that Obama has damaged US-British relations. Remember that, whether you support the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq or not, Britain has been the

  15. because you can sue BP by dutchwhizzman · · Score: 1

    for more than the gratification of taking a shot at them would give you. Also, you'd have to shoot an awful lot of BP managers before you would get anywhere near as much effect as shooting the guy that just fired you. Shoot just one, and he will never be able to fire you again, but BP will just put another manager in the place of the missing one, without any less effectivity of the company after your deed.

    --
    I was promised a flying car. Where is my flying car?
  16. Answered your own question by Firethorn · · Score: 1

    except, maybe, to take measures to insulate themselves from repercussions

    Thing is, how do you insulate yourself from these sorts of repercussions? In the case of an oil company, it's that you do pretty much whatever is necessary to prevent a well blowout like this from happening again.

    Why? It's bad publicity, it costs money to clean up, you're not making money from the oil from that well, etc...

    The cost of having to deal with even a rare blowout, compared to the cost of safety equipment, is such that it's nearly always better to spend the money on the safety equipment, studies, and engineering solutions than to screw up and have a major leak.

    Even if the executives are moustache twirling evil, they're still driven by profit. Oil dumped in the ocean is oil that they can't sell, which costs them money. They don't want that.

    --
    I don't read AC A human right
  17. Halliburton by segedunum · · Score: 1

    What hasn't come to light is Halliburton's role in all of this. They're not exactly the most trustworthy company in the world and it's strange that this has come out now. As far as I know BP had outsourced all of their drilling which is probably how this stupid state of affairs came about.

    1. Re:Halliburton by bonch · · Score: 0

      Huh? Halliburton's role is that they did the cementing. They warned BP that the cementing was wrong, and BP drilled anyway.

  18. Crime pays very well? by tekrat · · Score: 1

    So what you're saying is: If you're going to commit a crime, commit the biggest crime you can, because the bigger the crime, the better it pays, and therefore, is worth the risk to your life/freedom.

    That explains Bernie Madoff then. I would suggest then, that we ALL run Ponzi Schemes and get rich, go to jail for 150 years, but at least our families will be set for a few generations.

    Your argument basically states that crime is OK if the crime is for $billions, but the mugger on the street who robs you of $60 at gunpoint is a drag on society that needs to be jailed for years at a rate of $100,000 per year.

    --
    If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
    1. Re:Crime pays very well? by tophermeyer · · Score: 1

      He's just saying that a death penalty forces people who are going to commit crimes to shoot for grander crimes to keep a favorable risk/reward ratio. People don't expect to be caught, but they are aware they might be caught and want to make sure that the potential benefit of their crime outweighs the potential risk.

      Plus when you get into organizations that commit crime, you have to remember that the individuals that are responsible for the decision making will not suffer the full brunt of the punishment. They do stand to receive a huge portion of the gain if they succeed.

  19. Wondering about that myself by tekrat · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Yeah, I can't figure it out. People on the street shoot each other over liquor store robberies for a $100, but when your livelihood is affected to the tune of tens of thousands, people sit in their sofas watching American Idol.

    Never mind some fisherman picking off BP execs, I'm shocked no one has been picking off mortgage brokers, bankers, and other high-ups that handed us the Great Depression, that will essentially, last for the remainer of our lives (all indicators point to things getting worse, not better, unless you're already in the top 1%).

    Even more amsuing is that that south is filled with gun-nuts, you'd think that at least one of them would get riled up enough to do something. Amazing that they'll shoot at each other about a scratch on the pickup truck, but when it comes down to REAL things, they act like they have no power.

    Maybe there's something to those chemtrails after all, as the populace is handing the country over to a few elite, with no fight whatsoever. John Carpenter's "They Live" is starting to look like a documentary. Where's the Hoffman lenses when you need them?

    --
    If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
    1. Re:Wondering about that myself by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Maybe there's something to those chemtrails after all, as the populace is handing the country over to a few elite, with no fight whatsoever. John Carpenter's "They Live" is starting to look like a documentary. Where's the Hoffman lenses when you need them?

      Let people get hungry and you'll see that violence we're talking about here.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    2. Re:Wondering about that myself by hawkfish · · Score: 1

      Maybe there's something to those chemtrails after all, as the populace is handing the country over to a few elite, with no fight whatsoever. John Carpenter's "They Live" is starting to look like a documentary. Where's the Hoffman lenses when you need them?

      Let people get hungry and you'll see that violence we're talking about here.

      ...which is why public assistance will never go away. It is too risky for the Powers That Be to have large herds of hungry animals running about with opposable thumbs.

      --
      You will not drink with us, but you would taste our steel? - Walter Matthau, The Pirates
  20. wow, what cover up by hesaigo999ca · · Score: 1

    This mysterious fire suddenly made away with the fact that the platform was not properly done and could eventually be told to tear down the whole thing and start over, where burning it down and ending it would cost much less.....interesting!

  21. Say it aint so! by pugugly · · Score: 1

    I find this concept of a situation in which listening to Halliburton would have protected the environment and made life better highly uncomfortable.

    Are we absolutely sure the ink is dry on these recommendations they supposedly made?

    Pug

    --
    An Invisible Entity of Vast Power whose existence must be taken on faith alone: Liberal Media
  22. What does the contract say? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It would be interested to read the contract between BP and Halliburton. Who was responsible for doing the design? Also surprised there wasn't more on-rig government oversight. Heck, you've gotta have a building inspector come out and inspect a new residential construction job, surely a deepwater drilling rig warrants as much oversight as Aunt Bea's new front porch.

  23. Dunning-Kruger meets Dilbert by thethibs · · Score: 1

    So the technicians on the rig made a decision they weren't qualified to make, and the PHBs were happy to let them. Agile drilling?

    --
    I'm a Programmer. That's one level above Software Engineer and one level below Engineer.
  24. OMG serious????! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I knew obaba was a communist all along.

    He is so incompetent at cleaning up oil spills he just had to blame BP for his mistakes.

    LOLLOLLOL

  25. Irrelevant by the+eric+conspiracy · · Score: 1

    So what? The bottom line is that the well didn't leak primarily due to cement failure or use of too few centralizers. There is post cement pressure testing and other redundancies involved too. Cement failure is a quite common occurrence; nobody in their right mind would just dump a load of cement in the hole and walk away without following up to make sure the cement job was good.

    Halliburton will probably get stung a bit because of the legal system we have, but in reality they aren't the problem here.

    The real cause of this leak was sloppy operations by Transocean, BP's drilling subcontractor. There were several places where they just flat fell down on the job and made faulty decisions any one of which could have prevented the spill. Many of these people are dead now, killed when the rig sank. It's unfortunate not just for the people involved but also for the process of finding out exactly what happened, but that is just the way it is sometimes.

  26. technicians on RIG not BP staff by eionmac · · Score: 1

    Oh! technicians on rig were not BP staff, I understand, but drilling contractor's staff. To override a BP purchased supply may take liability away from BP.

    --
    Regards Eion MacDonald
  27. Calling all extremists! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The most effective method would be to "see" an image of The Prophet Mohammed in the oil spill, and let the extremists have their way with BP. It would be pretty hard to run a company if everyone working there fears for their life.

    I jest of course.