Science Channel Buys Rights To Firefly

citking writes "The Science Channel has purchased the rights to Firefly and plans to air all episodes in order and in high definition. In addition, physicist Dr. Michio Kaku will appear to explain the theoretical science behind the show's sci-fi concepts. There's a brief interview in the article as well with Nathan Fillion, who chimes in with his thoughts on Firefly and playing Mal."

Comments

This is important?

[redemtionboy]

Since when is it news that a second rate basic cable channel gets the rights to air a show? Call be when they buy the rights to make new episodes.

Re:This is important?

[Anonymous Coward]

Since when is it news that a second rate basic cable channel gets the rights to air a show? Call be when they buy the rights to make new episodes.

since Firefly is the best show of ALL TIME!!

Re:This is important?

[sirambrose]

Unfortunately, I don't think that will happen after the movie wrapped up the story line and killed off major characters.

Re:This is important?

[Scutter]

Unfortunately, I don't think that will happen after the movie wrapped up the story line and killed off major characters.

I'm prepared to pretend the movie never happened if it mean more episodes. Who's with me?!

Re:This is important?

[Leuf]

There were characters other than Kaylee?

Re:This is important?

[Asmor]

Since when is it news that a second rate basic cable channel gets the rights to air a show? Call be when they buy the rights to make new episodes.

since Firefly is

[snip]

I'mma let you finish... but I just wanna say... Stargate is the best show of all time!

Re:This is important?

[Anonymous Coward]

The Science Channel now has more 'good' science fiction than Sy Fy

Re:This is important?

[bill_mcgonigle]

Call be when they buy the rights to make new episodes.

Well, that's Plan B.

Re:This is important?

[flimflammer]

I have to question what you consider a "first rate" channel. The Science Channel is one of the only channels with anything even remotely interesting on television.

Re:This is important?

[jamesh]

Unfortunately, I don't think that will happen after the movie wrapped up the story line and killed off major characters.

I'm prepared to pretend the movie never happened if it mean more episodes. Who's with me?!

What movie?

Re:This is important?

[flimflammer]

I still don't see the appeal to Ghost Hunters.

The series starts off with them actually debunking everywhere they go. Of course the series is boring because it amounts to a little history lesson about a place and then a bunch of walking around in the dark.

So they change the series up, now suddenly everyone really believes there's ghosts everywhere, lots of spooky noises that always seem to catch the crew off guard. Lots of places are now "possibly haunted".

Still don't see the appeal even after they dressed it up and made it utterly fake.

Re:This is important?

[Necroman]

Wrapped up? Joss Whedon loves to kill off main characters. He probably would have killed off at least 1 of those people if he had a second season.

Re:This is important?

[westlake]

Since when is it news that a second rate basic cable channel gets the rights to air a show?

The Science Channel is a Discovery network.

Market penetration, 100 million households for Discovery Channel, 50-70 million households for each of its second-tier networks. Discovery Networks U.S.

Discovery tends to stay on target. True crime on I.D. Animals on Animal Planet. No pro wrestling to pump up the male demographic. I'm looking at you, SyFy.

You could do much worse if you were looking for a new home for "Firefly."

Re:This is important?

[rsmith-mac]

When they have enough importance that they're not channel 305, and when advertisers revere them enough to put on ads beyond electric nicotine inhalers and not-from-the-US-mint "collectible" money.

Re:This is important?

[Psion]

I'll be in mah bunk.

Re:This is important?

[lilomar]

um, there is a gap between the final episode and the movie, plenty of room for a season or two :)

Re:This is important?

[Schadrach]

Or more reasonably, that any new episodes would fit between the two, since it's implied that a lot of time passed between the series and the movie.

Re:This is important?

[brokeninside]

I think the scene with his grieving widow in front of a tombstone with his name on it suggest that Wash did actually die.

Re:This is important?

[H0p313ss]

Unfortunately, I don't think that will happen after the movie wrapped up the story line and killed off major characters.

I'm prepared to pretend the movie never happened if it mean more episodes. Who's with me?!

As much as I loved the series I'm awfully tempted to say let sleeping dogs lie. That one season's worth is a work of art

Re:This is important?

[93 Escort Wagon]

Unfortunately, I don't think that will happen after the movie wrapped up the story line and killed off major characters.

Not to mention that the lead actor is already committed to a different series that's on a different network.

Re:This is important?

[u17]

I'mma let you finish... but I just wanna say... Stargate is the best show of all time!

Oh, come on, mods, do you think it responsible to mod up flamebait comments like this as insightful?

Besides, I thought everyone knew that Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

Re:This is important?

[X3J11]

Oh, come on, mods, do you think it responsible to mod up flamebait comments like this as insightful?

Besides, I thought everyone knew that Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

I'm sorry, but you are both mistaken. Farscape was far superior to both.

Re:This is important?

[retchdog]

You mean "a major character," that being Shepherd Book.

But seriously, it'd be a bit challenging to keep things going. River is now a fully-capable uber-assassin and psychic, which would make continuing petty heists kind of unbelievable after a while; not to mention that she could almost replace the entire crew, from Jayne to Kaylee, single-handed. Either she and Simon would leave (which is kind of unsatisfying) or the crew would go full-out revolutionary (which could very easily come off cheesy).

Still, the worst bar would be that the original cast had an incredibly strong chemistry. It's very unlikely to repeat that, esp. in a lower-budget cable show.

Re:This is important?

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't forget Inara!

She is a fine piece, always.

Re:This is important?

[flimflammer]

Do you actually think channel numbers are ranked by order of importance? Channel 1 is the best or even one of the best channels? Or even that channels have the same numbers across networks/the country? (It's not even near 305 where I live)

Re:This is important?

[dAzED1]

did you watch the same movie as me? It already deviated pretty hard from the show. I preferred to think of it as the same characters (with one exception - shepherd got changed a lot) in a completely different timeline.

Re:This is important?

[mug funky]

maybe it bombed because the fans all downloaded it and hence didn't go to the cinema?

just sayin' :)

Re:This is important?

[Culture20]

Nobody in their right mind would try bringing a series back again

What, like Family Guy? A return to TV so successful that a spinoff was created? A Firefly/Serenity return would be less successful, but successful nonetheless. I have a lot of geek friends (including one that hates sci-fi), that love Firefly enough to buy the DVDs.

Re:This is important?

[mug funky]

because advertising dollars determine what i choose to watch, too.

perhaps if geeknet had a budget they'd start spamming the science channel with TVCs?

Re:This is important?

[citizenr]

When they have enough importance that they're not channel 305, and when advertisers

Its called Education. WTF, doesnt US fund educational TV channels like the rest of civilized world?

Re:This is important?

[Penguinisto]

That's funny, because out here (Portland, Oregon) all the premium movie channels are high-numbered, while all the crap (including such gems as QVC or one of its clones) hangs out around the low-numbered local channels. The pr0n channels sit way up there in the 800's-900's, next to the freebie music channels.

(Besides, Comcast has The Science Channel at 272 here, if that helps you out any).

Re:This is important?

[UnknowingFool]

I liked the movie. It was well done; it explained the backstory to non-fans in a seamless way and the plot was well written. It actually extended the series by revealing the true origin of the Reavers. Do I wish that some of the characters were not killed? Yes. If for some miracle that Firefly is ever resurrected, they can create new characters.

Re:This is important?

[ooshna]

Besides, I thought everyone knew that Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

I'm sorry, but you are both mistaken. Farscape was far superior to both.

You are all wrong it was Lexx that was the best.

Re:This is important?

[Xer0ss]

I couldn't agree more! However new episodes would be nice.

Re:This is important?

[trappa]

I'm not sure what universe you're in, but in this universe Sliders was the best.

Re:This is important?

[Culture20]

maybe it bombed because the fans all downloaded it and hence didn't go to the cinema?

I tried to go to the theater for Serenity, but couldn't go the first week due to obligations (can't remember what now). It was gone by the next week. I've never seen a film taken out that quickly, even complete stinkers. I suspect film sabotage.

Re:This is important?

[UnknowingFool]

I guess the poster means that typically the single digit channels are local. For most cable systems, the next 90 or so are holdovers from analog days and are more popular like ESPN, CNN, etc. After that you get to the extended channels that don't as much viewership. For HD, a lot of the popular channels are no longer in the first block but there are still many people who don't get HD cable. They don't have the equipment (like a typical senior citizen) or they don't want to pay the extra.

Re:This is important?

[Fluffeh]

That is the downright shiniest website I have seen all week! I think I have found a new hobby to put effort and time into!

Re:This is important?

[Anonymous Coward]

Get a grip. Nothing has ever come close to Mork and Mindy.

Re:This is important?

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

or soldier on with out them.

I mean, death and loss are a part of story telling. Particularly when it's supposed to be a Western but in Space.

Re:This is important?

[Arancaytar]

Yeah, dammit. Seeing SGU canceled was like watching Firefly die all over again. :(

Re:This is important?

[wisnoskij]

Oh come on mods, show a little professionalism for once.

Stargate gets Insightful and Babylon 5 gets Flamebait??? I don't care what show you like, their is nothing in this comment that deserves a modding down.

And Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

Re:This is important?

[lazybeam]

Me and a group of friends drove over 120km (each way) to go to a pre-screening of Serenity: we saw it at the cinema and didn't download it! The showing had completely sold out. But then I guess that would have been ALL the fans in the area, leaving none for the actual run...

Re:This is important?

[grahamd0]

I don't think it would work. I doubt that Summer Glau, while a she is right purdy lady, can pull off 17 anymore.

Now, I would love them to do another season or two, I just don't think a timeline that involves Wash and Book would work.

Re:This is important?

[Kortalh]

Au contraire, A.L.F. took the basic formula of Mork & Mindy and improved it several times over.

Re:This is important?

[stonedcat]

No reason? What about the age of the actors?
You can dress them up however you like but it's been almost 10 years since the show aired.
The change is still going to be noticeable especially for the younger members of the cast.
Sorry, but if Firefly were to ever return it would have to take place after Serenity.

Re:This is important?

[Black Parrot]

Unfortunately, I don't think that will happen after the movie wrapped up the story line and killed off major characters.

I'm prepared to pretend the movie never happened if it mean more episodes. Who's with me?!

I really didn't like the way the movie tried to rush a wrap-up of all the story lines. Some of them might have proven interesting.

Re:This is important?

[hedwards]

The one where they killed off all the main characters, don't you keep up with things?

Re:This is important?

[zaivala]

There is still plenty of stuff that can be done with the cast members who are left, and add new ones. I note that most of the actors have done rather well with jobs in TV. So we'd get Nathan Fillion back, but what about the others? (Gina Torres, yum!)

Re:This is important?

[hedwards]

Eh, just throw them through some sort of space/time anomaly, I'm sure that will fix the plot holes necessary to make it worik.

Re:This is important?

[Warshadow]

No it didn't. The timeline starts after the series. It seems likely that River was caught at some point after Objects in Space and the beginning of Serenity shows them rescuing her.

Re:This is important?

[ghmh]

The show can always reincarnate in an alternate parallel universe. Could be worse, could be better (e.g. Batman).

Re:This is important?

[MoonBuggy]

I'm pretty sure that's not the case - the actual timeline of Serenity occurs after the end of the series, but the recording that the operative watches is of Simon breaking her out of the 'school' before they end up on Persephone for the first time (i.e. before the start of the series); its an explanation of how they came to be on the ship in the first place. River was never recaptured by the Alliance after that initial breakout.

Re:This is important?

[Seumas]

Shiny!

Re:This is important?

[Jarik C-Bol]

You know, it really sucks that the movie bombed. I had not discovered firefly until the previews for the movie came out. I saw that trailer, and told all my friends at the time that 'we are going to X city to see this movie in the good theatre when it comes out'. And then we poked around and discovered the show, got the dvd's which we watched in one setting, then watched again. And we all made the 200 mile pilgrimage to the good theatre and we watched the movie. The movie should not have bombed, because it stood so well on its own.

Re:This is important?

[CheerfulMacFanboy]

I'm not sure what universe you're in, but in this universe Sliders was the best.

I can't remember the episode were they went to your universe ....

Re:This is important?

[CAIMLAS]

Eh, I'll second this, though I will say that Sci Fi (er, SyFy), being second rate, still manages to put out a fairly large amount of decent original content on their own (or airs it when it dies somewhere else). Also, they're one of the highest watched cable channels out there, for all age groups (very even demographics). They're about as close as you can get to generally acceptable family fare anymore. (I'm not saying most of their internally produced stuff is -good-, mind you, but for evening fare with the family, it's almost the only thing on that everyone can accept.)

I'm not sure what significance this has on SyFy buying the rights, though. Most of the actors were already "SyFy" actors - I've seen most of them in at least a handful of times in Stargate and Stargate Atlantis, for instance. So it sort of belongs in the family, as it were.

As for Firefly, Firefly may have done well on Fox, had they not aired the episodes out of order. Who the hell thought to do that? The order or the episodes was fairly important for plot development. I'm sure there are many people, such as myself, who hates missing an episode of a show (even going to the lengths of not watching the show if there are significant holes).

IMO, it's wise - given their demographics - for SyFy to buy the rights. The franchise is by no means dead, even though it's 9 years out of production. Even if it wouldn't be the same with a different cast of characters (and there's no saying the story couldn't be continued with many of the same actors, even), it'd still be better entertainment than most of what's on TV. Firefly, all 14 original episodes, are still a favorite evening fare in our household (up there with Stargate).

Re:This is important?

[MrQuacker]

What SGU were you watching? Because the one I was watching kinda started to suck...

Re:This is important?

[CheerfulMacFanboy]

Two words: Prequel episodes

Baby Fireflies!

Re:This is important?

[CAIMLAS]

Eh, she could certainly pull off 17, I think. She still has a very young, pert/fresh face. She's not exactly buxom now, and I'm sure she's probably at least reasonably in shape (SCC recently shows that to be true) - she looks little different (though actually a bit more attractive to my eye).

The only thing stopping them at this point is their ability to get the full staff on board for a second season, and possibly a couple decent writers to make it akin to the spirit of the original. There's still a lot of story to be told there, and disenfranchising the movie would not be an unheard of (or unacceptable to fans) decision.

(And, of course, actual rights to production/the IP. Seems they've only gotten publishing rights?)

Re:This is important?

[Lord Apathy]

What do you mean "kinda started to suck?"

Re:This is important?

[Sporkinum]

What is the Science Channel? I never heard of it before this Slashdot reference. The only thing I do know is that I don't have it.

Re:This is important?

[Landshark17]

"He probably would have killed off at least 1 of those people if he had a second season."
And when he got a movie, he killed off two.

Re:This is important?

[bertoelcon]

I don't know about the rest but I really would rather have my Chuck and Castle casts remain unchanged.

Re:This is important?

[MrLint]

If you ignore season 9 and 10, and stargate infinity, and all the escort mission episodes of atlantis,, and that they bascially stopped going off world.

Re:This is important?

[MrLint]

I describe Farscape as "Epic" in the proper sense. Its really quite as fantastic as the old Greek epics. Death, betrayal, strange places and monsters. Heroic deeds, sacrifice coming home, leaving again, love, loss. It really had everything.

Re:This is important?

[Sulphur]

Since 98% of slashdotters love it with a fanatic cult like adoration. Now be careful getting down off that high horse.

Mr. Ed, is that you?

Re:This is important?

[Scrameustache]

I would murder a thousand Castles and Chucks to have Firefly back.

Re:This is important?

[MrQuacker]

I was just trying to be nice. It really sucked, but I still kept watching hoping it got better.

Re:This is important?

[MidnightBrewer]

Tell me about it. The clock is ticking and the cast isn't getting any younger, or more available. Fear the juggernaut of incompetence that is Fox!

Re:This is important?

[elashish14]

Mod parent up.

I don't have TV myself, but when I visit my parents, anytime I turn on the TV I find myself most attracted to channels like Discovery or Science or History[2] - not network channels spewing tasteless pop culture crap[1][3] but the ones providing documentaries, facts, history, geology, astronomy, zoology, other things about the world. /. is news for nerds - I would like to think of nerds as the kind of people that would seek insight and learning from the things they watch on TV (or wherever they get their cultural fill from). I always figured that that's why I always seek out the channels in the hundreds, cause that's where you find that kind of quality.

So I guess you'd say that in my humble opinion, these are the real top-tier channels. And besides, if you have to judge the quality of a show by the channel it's on, I'd say you have problems thinking for yourself.

[1] Actually, lately the shows I've seen on network TV aren't as bad as I remember. Also, I don't mean to insult others for their tastes, but seriously, how many American Idol remakes do we need?
[2] Sure, Discovery and others have a reputation for trying to glam up things so they can appeal to a broader target audience, but you can look past that and see that there's still some good content in it. Except for Mythbusters, that's just painful for me to watch.
[3] If this were written in Latex, you wouldn't have to consult the footnotes out of order.

Re:This is important?

[MacGyver2210]

Plus Morena Baccarin has her own new show where she's still an alien, but now she's in CHARGE of a bunch of huge ships...

I don't think you're gonna get that money-grubbing space whore to give up her huge destructor fleet on V for some junker in Firefly.

Re:This is important?

[Crudely_Indecent]

Wow...

So, Wash and Book were all the main characters?

I would have considered River and Simon to be the MAIN characters, considering their roles in the story. Malcom, Zoey, Jane and Inara were more than supporting roles also.

There were quite a few main characters present at the funeral.

Re:This is important?

[MacGyver2210]

They're only 46 here.

Having lived here for over 25 years, I can say that the company most certainly doesn't order their channels by popularity or quality, but by the order in which they were added to the service.

The additional discovery, history, natgeo, and science channels were added to a nice little gap between QVC and the Disney Channel. Hell, 49 is still empty if they ever find something worthwhile to fill it with that can safely border Cartoon Network and TV Land.

Re:This is important?

[fredjh]

I liked it... and I didn't know it was cancelled until just now.

I guess I live under a rock.

Re:This is important?

[Cwix]

Well... we do... but the Republicans are trying to put a stop to that too. I mean, who needs educational tv... if it isn't something an advertiser would pay for, it must be no good right?

Ap article:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hQFmfwcJVeKhlulkYWG1QYGRvxpQ?docId=1ef92d9015bf434daf73dd26f89c322a

Re:This is important?

[sumdumass]

Most of the casts/crew doesn't show up until the first episode so your still in a pickle about not having everyone.

Unless your thinking about subdividing it into back stories of everyone. And you can throw that idea out right now cause it would suck.

Re:This is important?

[Crudely_Indecent]

Why worry about prequels? The movie ending left the door open to future episodes (without Wash and Book).

Main characters die....bummer.

I'd love to see new Firefly episodes because it would get Summer Glau off of that crap show "The Cape"

Re:This is important?

[hairyfeet]

That is pretty much the problem with ALL sci-fi though, isn't it? you let a series go on and depending on the quality of the writing to start with either very quickly or in a slow death spiral the writing just goes to shit.

And for all the guys here that moaned about Firefly getting canned? Frankly you should be grateful as Joss Whedon is notorious for getting involved in something new and just phoning it in for anything other than the "new hotness". For an example look at the last two seasons of Buffy and Angel where he was wrapped up in the new hotness that was Firefly. He ended up taking the best writers to Firefly and bringing in third stringers and just phoning it in on Buffy/Angel. Out of those last two season you have MAYBE five episodes between the two worth watching, maybe.

So in a way you should be glad it went out while it was still decent, because otherwise Whedon would have gotten another idea and then Firefly would have been given the Buffy/Angel treatment. Funny thing is now that Firefly is toast and Whedon is doing the comic version of Buffy/Angel the writing is actually good again. Maybe if we wouldn't have been phoning it in it wouldn't have gotten canceled in the first place.

I mean having Harmony have her own MTV reality show and bitching that slayers are interfering with her "God given right as an American" to shop? Now THAT is a hell of a lot funnier and more interesting than the snoozefest he put out for most of the last two years of Buffy/Angel and which I'm sure he would have done to Firefly after a season or two. The guy just bites off more than he can chew and phones it in too much IMHO, and with the kinds of shows he does you really can't do that, if the writing isn't good the whole thing falls apart.

Re:This is important?

[basotl]

If your counting flashbacks then... you must be saying the Simon Rescued River before the War with the Independents (Pilot Episode).... which would be incorrect.

Re:This is important?

[oldmac31310]

Me

Re:This is important?

[retchdog]

No, I didn't forget about Space Xander.

Re:This is important?

[93 Escort Wagon]

You didn't read the interview, did you?

In the interview, Fillion said he's ready and willing - but that's basically irrelevant. He's already committed by contract to some crime drama that's on ABC, IIRC.

In other words, the choice isn't his.

Re:This is important?

[camperdave]

Cast members who are left? Who died?

Re:This is important?

[jamesh]

That's what I was going for.

Re:This is important?

[jamesh]

Now I can't tell if you missed the fact that I was playing along and pretending the movie was never made, or if you are being sarcastic...

Re:This is important?

[zaivala]

Pardon the inaccuracy of my statement. I meant those who were "killed off" in "Serenity", such as Shepherd Book and Wash.

Re:This is important?

[EdIII]

Considering how damn good the show was..... hell yes.

But unless you get some technology to create the show with flawless CGI, it would never happen.

Jane is on Chuck.
Mal is Castle.

As for explaining it, or ignoring it, since they destroyed the Star Trek universe with the last movie, I hardly see how it requires that much more effort to wrap your mind around an alternate timeline in Firefly.

Re:This is important?

[dbIII]

"Forest Gump" technically "bombed" when it was time to pay the writer a percentage despite it being the highest grossing movie to that date. Hollywood accounting makes no logical (or legal) sense and it probably all really comes down to who is screwing who as to whether something is considered a success or not. Serenity probably made more money than it cost to make simply because it was not that expensive for the actual costs and not all of those cinemas were empty. We'll only know for sure around the time that Hollywood opens up the real books and starts paying tax :)

Re:This is important?

[retchdog]

Am I really the only one who thinks Buffy s06 was the pinnacle of the show (and no, not just for the musical one)? Now, s07, I can agree with you there, but I think it was because they were trying too hard to go back to the feel of the earlier seasons, while also doing the "final conflict" thing. Angel, well, yeah...

You may be right about Firefly, anyway. As I understand, the original treatment of Mal was much darker; war-scarred and almost totally out of touch. His quirky humor that people seem to like was partly Executive Meddling.

Apropos of almost nothing, Firefly is the only show he managed to pace correctly from square one; Buffy took two seasons, and Dollhouse took maybe 3/4 of its run just to get up to speed.

Re:This is important?

[retchdog]

Huh. That's interesting. I mean, it was obviously meant to be a flashback, and it's unlikely that Simon could maintain such cover as a fugitive. On the other hand it would also correct various things like why River didn't bring up Miranda on the show, without needing a retcon.

Re:This is important?

[inasity_rules]

Book had a deep complex and interesting past that was never explored... So, yeah, they dump quite a lot of plot by killing him. Wash was also a useful character because he kept the mood lighter as a sort of counterpoint to all the uber seriousness...

Re:This is important?

[retchdog]

The Alliance substituted a clone when they invaded; the real Wash is being wet-hacked into a psychic uber-pilot.

Re:This is important?

[hack slash]

The only reason to watch that show was the blue girl.

Re:This is important?

[hack slash]

And Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

You are Sheldon Cooper and I claim my five "*knock* *knock* *knock* Penny"'s.

Re:This is important?

[hack slash]

I really enjoyed the Buffy series, I tried to enjoy the Angel series but it didn't rock with me so I gave up watching it fairly early on, I can't understand why they made a series continuing the 'life' of a dumbass emotionally weak vampire - why the fuck didn't they make a series about Spike? best vampire of the whole Buffy series.

Re:This is important?

[SETIGuy]

Quark beats every show, ever. At least according to the Betty twins.

Re:This is important?

[hack slash]

Stargate had a 'stroke' when Richard Dean Anderson effectively left the show, I still watched it because it was Stargate but it was never the same again, like the Red Dwarf episodes without Chris Barrie (Rimmer).

Re:This is important?

[Noughmad]

Sheldon was crazy about Firefly as well, in fact he reserved the time slot for several years into the future.

Re:This is important?

[camperdave]

Wash was literally dead on impact. Sudden massive trauma kind of tends to do that.

Wash did not die on impact. He died when the Reaver harpoon impaled him.

Re:This is important?

[slashdot_commentator]

I always look at Farscape as the '90's version of American cultural propaganda.

The archetype of American cultural propaganda was Star Trek (The Original Series). It portrayed a world (galaxy) of the future, free from the fear of atomic weapons wiping out humanity. Where the Earth was united, racial differences irrelevant, the guy in charge was a handsome white guy, reminiscent of JFK, leading an interracial crew, who zipped through the universe, boffing females of every species, kicking the asses of their (evil) enemies with superior weaponry, spreading democracy (the federation) throughout the galaxy, solving every problem with technology and "The American Way". People throughout the Earth ate it up, hook, line and sinker.

But that storyline became tired and incongruous in a post-Soviet world. Hence, American cultural propaganda program 2.0, Farscape. Instead of pushing American military imperialism, it was American economic imperialism. Moya's crew now consisted of interspecie free-agents, a group of (H1-B) aliens led by a handsome white guy, reminiscent of JFK. Since its post-AIDS, great white leader now sticks to a monogamous relationship. Instead of a grand Federation uniting the galaxy fighting evil empires, its now the big Peacekeeper gov't that's the bad guy, while the plucky entrepreneurial startup who are the good guys. And now all these alien factions are struggling to seize control of Critchton's technology (wormholes), while the crew, at various times, scheme to backstab each other when its to their advantage and struggle to take control of the ship (startup).

Re:This is important?

[slashdot_commentator]

Buffy's last two seasons were difficult because they really sucked. The previous seasons had well constructed plot arcs, excellent dialogue and character development, and most important, underlying themes relating to adolescence, right & wrong, etc. The last two seasons were aimless, the dialogue and character development sucked, and boy, did the villains suck. The last season of Buffy was worse than the last season of Battlestar Galactica. It was only the finale of BSG that really sucked, every episode of season 7 Buffy were clunkers. The lack of Joss showed.

Re:This is important?

[AtrN]

In my universe Cleopatra 2525 was the best.

Re:This is important?

[slashdot_commentator]

Angel (the series) was awesome. The series was built on a totally different structure than Buffy. Buffy was teen angst and adolescence. Angel was film noir. Angel was the down on his luck, private dick trying to do the right thing while MAKING A LIVING. Its a fictional fantasy for adults, with adult themes. Only the 2nd half of the 4th season of Angel sucked. Season 5 was brilliant. And it had a GOOD finale, unlike Buffy or BSG.

If you didn't like Angel, fine. But it was a significantly different show than Buffy.

Spike was always a combination of comic relief and a modern day perspective on villainy. Spike was too simple as a character to be a grand villain. He was the mental equivalent of the hired hitman. If Spike had his own spinoff series, it would flop like the Lone Gunmen.

Re:This is important?

[ElderKorean]

maybe it bombed because the fans all downloaded it and hence didn't go to the cinema?

just sayin' :)

I watched it twice at the cinema, and have since brought the DVD's of the movie and the series.

Most people I know who liked the series have also brought them both.

Re:This is important?

[Spad]

Of course not, that would be communism.

Re:This is important?

[slashdot_commentator]

Have to add The Cape to that list as well. (River Tam Orwell)

Re:This is important?

[mrb000gus]

I'm prepared to pretend the movie never happened if it mean more episodes. Who's with me?!

As much as I loved the series I'm awfully tempted to say let sleeping dogs lie. That one season's worth is a work of art

^ What he said.

Re:This is important?

[ivucica]

Well, if some franchises could kill off 70+ years of history of an entire universe, I guess we could pretend characters of Firefly didn't die.

Re:This is important?

[Nyder]

I'mma let you finish... but I just wanna say... Stargate is the best show of all time!

Oh, come on, mods, do you think it responsible to mod up flamebait comments like this as insightful?

Besides, I thought everyone knew that Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

You sill peeps that don't even understand quality Sci-fi.

Doctor Who is, was and will always be, the best.

Re:This is important?

[johny42]

Book had a deep complex and interesting past that was never explored...

Actually, it was pretty well explored in the latest of Whedon's comic books.

Re:This is important?

[Nyder]

Unfortunately, I don't think that will happen after the movie wrapped up the story line and killed off major characters.

I'm prepared to pretend the movie never happened if it mean more episodes. Who's with me?!

What movie?

I thought it was a alternative reality 1 shot double episode myelf.

Re:This is important?

[slashdot_commentator]

With my vendor (Cablevision), it makes a b-i-i-i-g difference what channel number its on. "Family" cable plan only goes up to channel 99, you have to pay another $13(?)/mo to get the "IO" package which will give you access to the channels under 200.

All I have to say is I'm pretty disgusted that SyFy would allow itself to get outbid on Firefly, and that a "Science" channel would be picking up a fictional program.

Re:This is important?

[hairyfeet]

Actually if you watch the box set and listen to the commentary you can read between the lines and see what killed Buffy, and that was Joss. For example despite doing a kick ass job with nothing the director of "one down" (the last two Dark Willow episodes) complains throughout that Joss waltzed in when he got his idea for the musical and blew the entire seasons budget on it leaving him with practically nothing to finish the season. He said they literally had to draw the lines on Willow with black pens because that was what they were down to budget wise.

And I would argue that the series could have easily recovered if Joss would have actually showed up instead of only doing the musical and then phoning it in for the rest of the series because the season 8 in comic form (where Joss is actually writing again) is really good, with witty dialog and good character depth same with season six of Angel in comic form (if you wanted to know what happened after the big battle with the dragon you really ought to pick it up, its damned good.).

And for the guy that said "The last two seasons of Angel were good"? Watch the box sets starting at season one and you can tell almost to the episode where Joss started working on Firefly. About midway through season three the episode quality starts getting uneven and the season four was a soap opera that had dick to do with the rest of the series and you can tell Joss had almost nothing to do with the day to day by that time, especially with the second half.

Now compare it to season five from midway on (puppet show) where Joss found out it was to be canceled and actually showed up to finish the series? The writing is like night and day compared to the phoned in episodes. You have character depth again, you have adding to the backstory and mythos, and you have damned witty dialog, all of which are missing when Joss phones it in.

Same thing with Buffy season six where except for the musical and the last two episodes it is just one giant dark suckfest, with none of the witty writing or character development. Even Michelle Trachtenberg in a round table between season 6 and 7 asks point blank if Joss is gonna have her character killed off, because without Joss there to add depth she just comes off as a cliche whiny brat.

While I liked both shows and have the complete box sets for both if you try watching them back to back you can really tell when Joss stopped caring and got busy with other shows. It is especially noticeable when on the rare occasion Joss would show up, as with the musical in season six or the episode with Webbs (Dead friends I believe?) in season seven. The writing difference between Joss when working with his core team like Greenwald and Noxon VS when he just handed off the show to one of them solo or even worse the third stringers in season six and seven of Buffy really is striking. Hell compare the comic written by him now to season four and the first half of Angel season five and Buffy season six and seven and the writing is like night and day.

So try watching them back to back sometime, especially the first four seasons of Buffy and the first three of Angel and compare them to the latter. You'll notice pretty quickly the writing isn't snappy, the dialog is a LOT more ham fisted, and instead of character development you get cliche, because the the third stringers are simply following established character traits instead of developing the characters further as Joss did. I like the hell out of his writing but you can tell a BIG difference between his style and those he brought in to CYA, and it frankly hurt both shows badly.

Re:This is important?

[Shivetya]

Well I would be worried when they rename themselves to the Syience Channel. Until they they are better than the channel supposedly dedicated to Science Fiction.

Besides, it isn't like the Science Channel is twenty four hours a day educational. Worse, they really do need to broaden their line up which seems to be centered around running two to three copies of the same show back to back.

Re:This is important?

[Ginger Unicorn]

no, merely speculation and inneundo.

Re:This is important?

[Canazza]

you do know it was an Australian show right...

Re:This is important?

[Mikkeles]

'... how do you top Michael vs. Lucifer in an apocalyptic battle?'

Seraphim vs. Cherubim mud wresting?

Re:This is important?

[mrxak]

I'm 100% certain AC meant the impact of the reaver harpoon to his chest, not the impact of the ship with the hangar.

Re:This is important?

[Mikkeles]

'... how do you top Michael vs. Lucifer in an apocalyptic battle?'

Seraphim vs. Cherubom mud wresting?

Re:This is important?

[mrxak]

Nah, I think he means episodes that take place before the movie, but after the series.

Re:This is important?

[AmiMoJo]

Okay...

B5: Terrible acting/dialogue but the whole story was planned from the beginning and ended up being pretty epic with some good character development.

SG: Suffered from perpetual fear of cancellation and budget issues but still had some really good moments. The way new earth gained access to new technologies and understanding was cool. Starring in it seemed to cause pregnancy in females for some reason.

Firefly: Wow, a well written and acted sci-fi show, a rare thing indeed. Naturally killed off before it could make everything else look bad and thus attaining legendary status because of what it might have been.

DW: Chronically underfunded and victim of dodgy BBC special effects but long lived due mainly to all other British sci-fi being even worse. Moffat's stories are usually excellent.

BSG: So depressing you want to kill yourself but compelling at the same time. Somehow managed to include religion in a way that didn't boil it down to good/evil. Exactly the right length too, a rare thing in TV.

Re:This is important?

[Thing 1]

You have an infatuation with telephones, is what I'm picking up.

Re:This is important?

[AmiMoJo]

Maybe not the best but Space, Above and Beyond was excellent right up to the moment it was cancelled.

Re:This is important?

[MattSausage]

Nathan Fillon has been on the record saying if he won the lottery he'd purchase the rights to the show, produce new eps and release it as an internet series.

http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/HelpNathanBuyFF

Apparently some people are taking him up on his word.

Re:This is important?

[Intrepid imaginaut]

Burn!

Re:This is important?

[Enigma23]

Besides, I thought everyone knew that Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

I'll see your B5 and raise you B7 . :)

Re:This is important?

[KlaymenDK]

Or swing by RePet?

Re:This is important?

[Enigma23]

or soldier on with out them.

I mean, death and loss are a part of story telling. Particularly when it's supposed to be a Western but in Space.

I was wondering when someone was going to point out that Firefly is simply the winning combination of "Cowboys in Space." Of course, this still doesn't excuse the upcoming film Cowboys vs Aliens...

Re:This is important?

[Gaygirlie]

Besides, I thought everyone knew that Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

Yeah, everyone, except those who are familiar with Farscape!

Re:This is important?

[Builder]

To be fair, the GP said 'major characters' not 'all the...'

Re:This is important?

[Captain Hook]

I know you are just trying to reduce the attraction of the show down to as basic level as possible, I don't think Inara was a lesbian, unless you are thinking of someone else in the show? isn't the whole point of a Companion to be what the partner needs them to be? Inara would have said what ever was appropriate to put her partner at ease, whether male or female.

In fact, the only hint we have about who Inara really is, was attraction she had to Mal, and I got the feeling most of that was more about Mal's personality traits rather than a physical attraction.

Inara was one of the most overlooked/least explored characters on the show.

Re:This is important?

[JackieBrown]

I always look at Farscape as the '90's version of American cultural propaganda

Your assumption that this Australian show was an American show demonstrates how well you have succumbed to the notion that all things are American :)

This show was very pro-UN control (versus American control,) very much against the idea of a group making themselves the police of the galaxy that nobody asked for or wanted, renamed NASA to ISA (or something like that,) and towards the end was pro-peace to the point that I was expecting them to break out in song. HEck, they even had an episode that showed how the US was letting 9/11 destroy world unity over the space program.

That said, this is my second favorite shows of all time only trumped by Babylon 5. And it surpasses Babylon 5 in terms of consistent awesomeness.

Re:This is important?

[Crudely_Indecent]

You mean this?

The one where they killed off all the main characters, don't you keep up with things?

Funny, I don't see the word major in that sentence anywhere.

Re:This is important?

[kevorkian]

did you actually watch the show ?? It was one of the few that really tried to follow actually true physics. There will be no wormholes !!!

Remember it was all one solar systems .. They did REAL entries into the atmospheres. They did not just add in a "Faster Then Light" drive to get around , travel took time!.

 

Re:This is important?

[JackieBrown]

I don't usually agree with what you write but I really enjoyed your post here. I wish I had a mod point to throw your way.

A lot of people seem to find it blasphemy to blame Joss for any wrong doing.

I lost almost all respect for him since putting his name on Dollhouse. This was a show that only had failed potential. If Fox wouldn't let him show it the way he wanted, he shouldn't have done it. This wasn't his first experience with fox so he knew what he was in store for going in.

Re:This is important?

[tophermeyer]

Also, they buried him. If the crash or the harpooning didn't immediately do him in, I'm pretty sure the lack of oxygen or prompt medical attention probably took care of it.

Re:This is important?

[somersault]

Totally forgot about that show, good choice.

However, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex (1st season) ranks as my favourite series, good combination of sci-fi, politics, philosophy and action.

Re:This is important?

[JackieBrown]

I don't know about the rest but I really would rather have my Chuck and Castle casts remain unchanged.

Wow - that would be a tough choice. I love Firefly but I think I must agree with you on this.

Re:This is important?

[kevorkian]

Likely he is just stuck on the fact that advertisers traditionally pay the biggest bucks for channels 2 through 13 ..

Re:This is important?

[JackieBrown]

I didn't like the shows when it aired but watched the movie at the theaters. I then went back and watched the show (in the correct order) and really loved it.

Re:This is important?

[sgt scrub]

Oh Come On! All the shows mentioned above are complete rip off's of scooby doo, which btw IS the greatest show of all time.

Re:This is important?

[dgatwood]

Since it's post-AIDS, great white leader now sticks to a monogamous relationship. Instead of a grand Federation uniting the galaxy fighting evil empires, it's now the big Peacekeeper gov't that's the bad guy, while the plucky entrepreneurial startup who are the good guys. And now all these alien factions are struggling to seize control of Critchton's technology (wormholes), while the crew, at various times, scheme to backstab each other when it's to their advantage and struggle to take control of the ship (startup).

That would have been a lot more readable if you had used the contraction for "it is" instead of the possessive form of "it". Leaving out the apostrophe when it should be there makes it just as hard to read as putting it in when it shouldn't. When in doubt, leave it (the entire contraction) out. It is far, far better to type "it is" when you mean "it's" than to type "its" when you mean "it's".

Now, back on point, I don't think Star Trek was propagandist at all. It merely reflected the cultural ideals of the time. A series in which the human culture seems too alien to the viewers will never make money.

More to the point, the purpose of good science fiction (and Star Trek spanned the gamut from bad to good, depending on the episode) is to show something about the real world and make you think about real-world issues, while doing so in a setting that is different enough for people to still accept the criticism. Therefore, all good science fiction, by definition, must incorporate aspects of the current culture of the time. Without that, it's just space opera.

Re:This is important?

[sgt scrub]

huh? it was a story about a boy who gave people rides on his totally awesome horsey. oh. and it had puppets like star wars. oh. and it even had an ASTRO NAUGHT!

Re:This is important?

[sorak]

Actually, we are in the process of defunding public broadcasting which is our only non-cable educational station. Then again rather than funding things we pay for what we want to consume. It is more responsive to viewers as whole that way.

And that is why all our privatized educational channels are obsessed with sharks and Hitler, present UFO stories as if plausible, and are producing reality shows now.

EDIT: I don't pay $100 a month for cable television. There may be a few good channels that are only available to super premium subscribers. Science may be one of them.

Re:This is important?

[ravenshrike]

I didn't even learn of the series until after the movie, and the ONLY piece of advertising for the movie that I saw was 2 weeks after it came out at around one in the morning on Comedy Central. The advertising campaign for that movie was virtually nonexistent.

Re:This is important?

[WalkingBear]

You have a lot of Geek friends, but how many of them are Nielson families? Unless you're counted in the ratings surveys, what you watch or don't watch is irrelevant.

Find a way to get onto the ratings surveys and suddenly you count for a million or so geeks in our demographic brackets.

Re:This is important?

[hairyfeet]

I'm just an old greybeard that tries to call it as he sees it, groupthink be damned. You'll notice my posts tend to be an even split between +3 insightful and -1 troll or flamebait as some here appreciate an honest comment while others can't stand having anything negative said about their sacred cows. Personally I think life is too short for lying and hypocrisy so I'd rather just always be honest, whether the group agrees with me or not. Sorry if I may have stepped on one of your pet projects in the past but I'm just being my brutally honest self.

Personally while I like the Whedon writing style (as I said I own the box sets of Buffy/Angel) you'd have to be deluded to not notice when the man gets a "new hotness" project the writing suffers on anything he had going to that point. Anyone who has watched the earlier seasons of Buffy/Angel can tell almost to the episode when Firefly started taking hold because he starts phoning it in and it really shows. While his core team of Noxon/Greenwald are good writers they remind me of musicians where they don't really do their best work unless their other half (in this case Joss) is there to bounce ideas off of.

And while I can't give a full critique of Dollhouse as I only watched the first two episodes just from those two I got the feeling it was another case of Joss phoning it in and got turned off. Sure enough I read later Joss is pissed at Fox for executive meddling and is actively chasing the Wonder Woman writing gig. It is almost like the guy has ADHD and can't stand to turn down a job, as he seems to always end up biting off more than he can chew and when his attention is focused on some new thing he just phones it in and uses CYA third stringers to try to cover for him, which with his peculiar writing style sticks out like a sore thumb.

If anyone here wants a perfect example just watch season six of Buffy and compare the rest of the episodes to the musical and the last two episodes of the season, or to frankly anything in season three or four. What you will notice right off the bat is the "Buffyisms" way of speaking, such as her valley butchering the language or Willow's babbles, are almost completely absent, and along with them nearly all character development or building on the mythos. I believe this is because the third stringers are afraid of accidentally fucking with the cannon so they just follow the backstory instead of adding to it, which inevitably leads to characters simply spouting cliche versions of their lines instead of actually being in character. For an example see how they had Anya spout off an inappropriate sexual comment nearly every episode without any of the character building like her speech in the body.

So in conclusion while I like the witty Whedon writing style that doesn't give the man the right to just phone it in and expect us to buy it. If he wouldn't bite off more than he can chew and concentrate on the show at hand frankly his shows would last longer, as when he is on the ball it is some of the wittiest writing on television. If he would have even had half the great dialog and wit he is currently showing in the Buffy/Angel extended season comics the shows would probably still be here. And as for the one who said Spike wouldn't make a great show? Don't judge what happened to the character to what he started out as, as even in the commentary some of the second stringers talk about how they didn't know how to write for the character and basically gave him the Cordy/Anya comic relief lines just to give Marsters something to do. If they wrote it as "Spike and Dru:The early days" it would probably be kick ass, although frankly too dark and disturbing for an American TV series. As we saw with American Gothic or Brimstone the average US viewer don't like their TV TOO dark. What allowed Buffy/Angel to get away with it was the humor, I just don't know if the American audience would accept the humor coming from a pair of serial killers like Spike and Dru.

Re:This is important?

[Port1080]

Not just you, I thought Season 6 was brilliant. My favorite seasons, in order, would be:

Season 3
Season 6
Season 2
Season 1
Season 7
Season 4*
Season 5**

I'd even taken season 5 over most of what's running on network TV or cable right now, though.

* The whole college plot was really lame, but it did have some good stand-alone episodes.
* That low mostly because Glory was horridly annoying - it also had some really good stand-alone episodes, with "The Body" probably being the best episode of the entire run.

Re:This is important?

[Gilmoure]

Might be interesting to see stories set in the Firefly universe from a different angle. Maybe, a spiritual wanderer, fleeing some foul deed in his past? He could also not like to use guns and instead defends himself with an open hand martial arts while spouting pop-cultural platitudes? Ooh, and flashbacks to his time from before wandering!

Re:This is important?

[Gilmoure]

But then Calypso brings him back, along with his undead monkey...

Re:This is important?

[Spykk]

Discovery tends to stay on target.

Maybe, if their target is a heap of heavily edited 'reality' shows...

Re:This is important?

[Gilmoure]

Watched the first televised episode (Train Job) and turned it off about 15 minutes in. Didn't seem that interesting. A few years later, picked up the Serenity DVD. It was good so we picked up the TV Series set. Watching them in correct order, oh man, is Firefly a good show. Bummer that Fox internal politics (showing out of order, moved around on time slot) took it down.

Re:This is important?

[Gilmoure]

Yeah, but no one would bring back a Fox Sci-Fi show, once it was cancelled.

Not even one as good as Futurama.

Re:This is important?

[Culture20]

That was a typo; I meant non-geek friends. Obviously my geek friends like Firefly.

Re:This is important?

[BJ_Covert_Action]

You shouldn't insult Firefly fans like that. They fancy themselves freedom fighters and rebels and will gladly kick your ass to the edges of the 'verse for such a low blow.

Re:This is important?

[Cwix]

Thats right folks, you heard it here. If you cant afford to purchase the educational tv from the store, in a nicely put together three disc set, you shouldn't be allowed to watch it. Your kindness is so generous m'lord.

I think you don't like it cause it doesn't spout fud like fox news.

Re:This is important?

[Cowmonaut]

And that the white guy wasn't the guy in charge usually....

Re:This is important?

[hedwards]

But, how realistic was their modelling of that Wooshing sound?

Re:This is important?

[ConceptJunkie]

And anyone who disagrees must be a Gorgie sympathizer!

Re:This is important?

[ImpShial]

Jane is on Chuck.
Mal is Castle.

River is on The Cape
Kaylee was/is on SGA
Inara is on V

Re:This is important?

[Killjoy_NL]

Is this ALF the cat eating furball from Melmak? Or some totally different show I would need to see?

Re:This is important?

[Killjoy_NL]

SGU did suck, but finally started to get more interesting so of course it got cancelled :)

Re:This is important?

[RESPAWN]

Although I've got to say that I find her more attractive these days on The Cape than I ever did on Firefly. Maybe she's like a fine wine and gets better with age?

Re:This is important?

[blacklint]

All of the space scenes were silent, so perfectly realistic :)

Re:This is important?

[Builder]

I was referring to this, by sirambrose further up :

Unfortunately, I don't think that will happen after the movie wrapped up the story line and killed off major characters.

See - no all in there.

Re:This is important?

[Phoghat]

since Firefly is the best show of ALL TIME!!

I'mma let you finish... but I just wanna say... Stargate is the best show of all time!

Besides, I thought everyone knew that Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

I'm sorry, but you are both mistaken. Farscape was far superior to both.

You are all wrong it was Lexx that was the best.

I'm not sure what universe you're in, but in this universe Sliders was the best.

Get a grip. Nothing has ever come close to Mork and Mindy.

Boys, boys, you're all right (except maybe Mork and Mindy). Now if they would get rid of the crap like "Punkin Chunkin" (?!) et al, they would have room to fit these into the schedule and SyFy might just die the slow painful death it deserves.

Re:This is important?

[xhawkx]

LMAO, A simple subject of a network showing a SciFy TV show, begins a hemispherical fist fight shows again that we humans need to watch more of these SciFy(you know,make believe) shows, the moral of the story always pops out at you right before the last commercial. All the freakin' shows mention are good, and some are great, it's all in the opinion of YOU. And to my co-commentator of Australian decent, are you always this political or can you not let yourself pause your miserableness and just gather up any friendly sense of humor you may be hiding. I am an American and it never in my life (51years) before you made that statement of thinking everything is made American, it never passed thru my mind, along with that arrogance,disrespect,rudeness,egotistical-ism, and feeling of superior being, that we Americans always get branded with. I live as a human being on Planet Earth, hoping, that in my lifetime ,I, will be able to welcome the return of our brothers and sisters from the point of light,up over there, and so I can tell them , I did not do it...........

Re:This is important?

[badkarmadayaccount]

And in turn, Dr Who is far superior to Farscape.

Re:This is important?

[elrous0]

Ditto. A series just can't return after 10 years and be the same as it was before. Even the new season of Futurama sucks, and that was only gone for 6-7 years (and cartoon characters don't even age). Trying to revive Firefly at this point would just be sad. Let it go.

Re:This is important?

[H0p313ss]

Ditto. A series just can't return after 10 years and be the same as it was before. Even the new season of Futurama sucks, and that was only gone for 6-7 years (and cartoon characters don't even age). Trying to revive Firefly at this point would just be sad. Let it go.

However, a completely new post-Browncoat series could be cool. That's a pretty big universe they constructed, lots of potential there.

Re:This is important?

[RockDoctor]

[Stargate comment]

Besides, I thought everyone knew that Babylon 5 is the best show of all time.

I'm sorry, but you are both mistaken. Farscape was far superior to both.

Speaking from a position of limited insight (I've never been drunk and incapable enough to leave an episode of any of the Stargates running for more than a couple of minutes, never seen an episode of Babylon 5, despite having respected local nerds encourage me to watch it, and never having even been aware of whether Farscape has ever been broadcast in the same country and time zone as me.), I can say with surety that Firefly was a pretty damned fine SF series. A bit silly in parts (what isn't?), but pretty damned good overall.

I really should follow up on Peet the Pervert's recommendation for Babylon 5. When I've some time on my hands.

Re:This is important?

[Samizdata]

I'd love to see new Firefly episodes because it would get Summer Glau off of that crap show "The Cape"

Pity that comment shows no taste in television.

Re:This is important?

[retchdog]

heh. he's not chopped liver, but ("War Stories" aside) he's definitely a supporting character, not a major one.

River: yeah, that could work, but she's still a psychic genius. That kind of thing just doesn't work, especially in a group context, unless the character is severely disabled in some way, which she clearly isn't anymore.

NOOOOOO, KAKU!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Leave Firefly alone, you attention whore!

I can't watch half of the Science channel programs because I'm sit of seeing him spew bullshit on camera.

Re:NOOOOOO, KAKU!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Seriously. What science behind FF needs to be explained? It's not bloody technobabbling Star Trek. Will Kaku try to explain why artificial gravity was still active in "Bushwhacked", why there was so much air flowing when the fire was being extinguished in "Out of Gas" or why there was something that looked like a CD in Rance Burgess' laser pistol in "Heart of Gold"? Just fuck off, Kaku.

Reavers Ahoy....

[rajeevrk]

Seriously, i think i'm mostly interested in finally seeing in detail what those "skyscraper" class capital ships are like :) That show focussed waay too much on the single firefly class ship. Or maybe that was it's charm.....

My turn.....

Re:Reavers Ahoy....

[Penguinisto]

Hell, I'd be happy with seeing an episode or two showing what it's like from the Alliance POV...

and plans to air all episodes IN ORDER

[v1]

what a novel idea!

the whole first attempt at airing this was a textbook trainwreck, and the result was blamed on the show's merit.

Re:and plans to air all episodes IN ORDER

[hedwards]

It debut on Fox, right? I'm surprised that anybody is willing to trust them with their show ideas, given the number of them they've killed prematurely with their incompetence. They killed Family Guy what, like 3 times so far? And failing to give Futurama a consistent slot, I mean what the fuck? Is it really so strange to give viewers the chance to get used to watching a show at the same time long enough to get hooked?

Re:and plans to air all episodes IN ORDER

[Thing 1]

what a novel idea!

the whole first attempt at airing this was a textbook trainwreck, and the result was blamed on the show's merit.

Exactly. I remember seeing the "naked girl in a box!" trailers, and then wondering that it was weird to not see that for something like 8 episodes, and that the eighth episode was two hours, and seemed to be a back story; I thought "oh, flashback time" until I later bought the DVD. Fox sucks.

Re:and plans to air all episodes IN ORDER

[quacking duck]

For all the flack Fox (justly) deserves for its handling of Firefly, one thing they may have done right was ordering the tone of the series much lighter.

A few years ago I introduced the series to a roommate, who didn't like the pilot, but ended up loving the series because Captain Mal Reynolds had a much lighter and humourous side which was completely absent in the pilot.

Fast forward, coincidentally, to tonight; I was talking with another friend who's seen the pilot and the movie, but not the regular episodes, and doesn't see why we're all so taken by the series. She's willing to give the series another go based on my assurance the series is much lighter in tone.

Now, I loved the original 2-hour pilot. But I also saw it last, after the rest of the episodes were broadcast, and had come to know and love all the main characters, and the show's lighter tone. I'm not sure we all would've liked it as much had it all been the darker tone from the pilot.

Re:and plans to air all episodes IN ORDER

[elrous0]

Universal HD aired them all in order for several runs a few years back (in HD too). So this is hardly something new. And, what's more, they're all already available on blu-ray anyway. So I'm not sure why this is even news (unless you want to use it as a further example of how the "Science" channel is a joke).

Good news, Everyone!

[Penguinisto]

(yeah, so I ripped off a different show for that title, but...)

Maybe this will (I hope?) mean that the Science Channel picks up some actual Hard Sci-Fi (as in "science", kids, not "horror") shows, perhaps expanding on them?

Doesn't necessarily have to mean making new Firefly episodes (though it would be damned cool if they did that too). Just making new shows that don't suck will suffice.

They can play 'em on one or more nights of the week, and have documentaries (and yeah, even An Idiot Abroad, semi-sucky as I consider it to be) during the rest of the time.

Re:Good news, Everyone!

[KlaymenDK]

I just had to leave my calling card here, on account of my signature.
Bye now...

...the science?

[straponego]

Okay, yay Firefly and all that. But the science? I'll be very interested to hear how interplanetary travel, which takes a matter of days, almost invariably results in passing within a couple hundred feet of another ship headed the opposite direction at a few feet per second relative velocity. ...very small solar system? With a couple hundred planets?

Re:...the science?

[SloppySevenths]

I'd like to hear the science of Inara's profession explained by Michio.

Re:...the science?

[Kell Bengal]

Let me draw on another cancelled-before-its-time-then-revived-by-a-fan-campaign-only-to-vanish-into-obscurity sci fi show: Farscape. One of the most memorable moments of the series was when, after a close-call escaping the bad guys, the crew seek solitude from each other to consider what has happened. One works on his space plane, another meditates, another sharpens his sword, another does a grueling workout. We see those characters engaged in their everyday life, away from the action. It made you think of them as people, not just as card-board cutout action heros.

I would gladly watch a Firefly episode where the characters made dinner, maintained the engines, checked the navigation computer, and whatnot, and simply let the personality dynamics carry the interest of the viewer. When you have sufficiently engaging characters, you don't need things blowing up every 5 minutes to produce compelling television.

Re:...the science?

[jbeaupre]

The short answer is because an entire season of watching people stare out the window, as they spend months a million miles from anything of interest, doesn't get very good ratings.

Re:...the science?

[sootman]

Actually, what they should do is follow the lead of sites like this and this and teach science by explaining everything that the show gets wrong. They'd never run out of material if they did that.

As for your example about ships passing each other while going from Point A to Point B: space travel isn't like a transatlantic cruise. To get to where you want to be, you need to head for where the planet is going. To pick a simple (and simplified) example, consider two ships flying from Earth to Mars and vice-versa. Imagine you plan your trip for a time when the planets are both pretty close together. Since they both go around the Sun in the same direction, let's simplify and pretend they're on parallel tracks heading in the same direction, like two cars driving down the road next to each other. As you know, it is a multi-month trip, and if both ships leave on the same day, they will have to fly at an angle to reach where their destination will be in a couple months. So their paths would not be two parallel lines--they would actually form an X. (And that's before you factor in elliptical orbits, varying orbital planes, etc., to say nothing of relativity and how really effing big space is.)

In other words, imagine firing a gun in Los Angeles towards Maine at the same time someone in Miami sends a bullet towards Seattle. Calculate the odds of them hitting in mid-air. :-)

Re:...the science?

[Black Parrot]

I'll be very interested to hear how interplanetary travel, which takes a matter of days, almost invariably results in passing within a couple hundred feet of another ship headed the opposite direction at a few feet per second relative velocity. ...very small solar system? With a couple hundred planets?

The short answer is because an entire season of watching people stare out the window, as they spend months a million miles from anything of interest, doesn't get very good ratings.

Yeah, but think of the dramatic potential for when they go insane and start trying to murder each other.

Re:...the science?

[ISoldat53]

Hence the demise of Stargate Universe.

Re:...the science?

[capnkr]

That works in a system where the travel is between two planets orbiting at different speeds and distance around a common central point, but in interstellar travel, the motion between two stars over a relatively (no pun intended) short time and distance would not produce such startlingly different trajectories.

That said, the two ships meeting on opposing trajectories yet at the relative velocities depicted, was of course a huge amount of artistic license.

Then again, what do *we* know of interstellar travel? Maybe it will work like that, for some strange and currently unforeseen reason... ;)

Re:...the science?

[MartinSchou]

very small solar system? With a couple hundred planets?

I'm not sure they're all planets. I'm pretty sure a lot of them are moons.

And for a relatively small solar system, that's still doable. Our solar system's 8 planets have 168 natural satellites.

Re:...the science?

[unixan]

Okay, yay Firefly and all that. But the science? I'll be very interested to hear how interplanetary travel, which takes a matter of days, almost invariably results in passing within a couple hundred feet of another ship headed the opposite direction at a few feet per second relative velocity. ...very small solar system? With a couple hundred planets?

As a matter of fact, the whole show occurred in a single large solar system with lots of inhabitable moons: here's a list and here's an official map.

True, the passing in different directions (if they really were different directions) at small relative velocities was a bit unrealistic. We suspend belief for the purposes of plot, lest we bore a prime time TV audience with why being interdicted by a military vessel requires hours of burn time.

Re:...the science?

[Johnny Mnemonic]

I like to think that's where the Reavers actually came from. Basically I've managed to ignore the "canon" of the movie.

I'm as big a fan of the series as you'll find, but I didn't care for the movie hardly at all. The tempo was wrong, the explanations were not credible and worst, the real strength of the show was the characters and yet in the movie the characters barely had time to talk to each other.

So: Reavers are pilgrims that have had their psyche blasted by the emptiness of space and ungrounding from Terra Firma; no one really knows how the human psyche would react after a decade in space, and there might be a profound mental effect.

Re:...the science?

[quacking duck]

very small solar system? With a couple hundred planets?

I'm not sure they're all planets. I'm pretty sure a lot of them are moons.

And for a relatively small solar system, that's still doable. Our solar system's 8 planets have 168 natural satellites.

... the majority of which orbit gas giants, far from the light and heat of the sun, and incapable of supporting human life because their mass is too low to maintain an atmosphere.

Multiple earth-sized moons around a gas giant would suffer from severe tidal forces as they pass near each other in their respective orbits. There's a couple other possible problems involving the planet/moons being much closer to the star (since the amount of sunlight is always similar to our Earth's), but I admit those are gut feelings since I'm not *that* familiar with orbital mechanics.

A big problem I had with Serenity was their trying to explain this aspect of the show scientifically. Like the midichlorians in Star Wars Ep 1, the "explanation" caused more trouble than it was worth.

Re:...the science?

[_Shad0w_]

The Firefly setting is a single solar system.

Re:...the science?

[plover]

Maybe it's like the flight paths between our major airports? Airplanes don't go wherever they want.

Oddly enough, smugglers often find flight paths counterproductive to the goal of remaining hidden. There'd be no reason Serenity would stay in a space equivalent of shipping lanes, and plenty of reasons for her not to.

"Blockades" around planets is still one of those sci-fi plot holes that always bugs me. Seriously, who could have enough hardware to surround an entire planet such that they can stop a wee little 100m ship from passing by at a speed difference of dozens of kilometers per second? Or worse, when the Reavers were occupying the space between planet Miranda and the other nearby colony? Seriously, there were enough reavers to blockade "space"? Their lasers might as well go "pew-pew" for all the realism in the blockade.

Re:...the science?

[retchdog]

it's "explained" in the show. it is a smallish solar system, and yeah, most of the offworld sites are moons. also, since they're mostly a trading vessel, they'll be mostly following standard trade routes for fuel economy.

it's not very plausible, but it does make the show mostly consistent at least.

Re:...the science?

[Neil Boekend]

Well, the people pay her for the fun. The fun is found in friction. The friction causes neurons to fire, which cause hormones to be released. The concentration of these hormones is increased until some other neurons fire, causing other hormones to be released and muscles to be contracted.
We don't need Michio to explain that.

Re:...the science?

[isorox]

Or worse, when the Reavers were occupying the space between planet Miranda and the other nearby colony? Seriously, there were enough reavers to blockade "space"? Their lasers might as well go "pew-pew" for all the realism in the blockade.

Well people aren't jumping over themselves to go anywhere near Somalia. It's only because there's little in the way of alternatives they do.

Now multiply the pirates up by a couple of orders of magnitude, close the suez, and remove any military in the area. Who's going to bother then?

Re:...the science?

[chrispalasz]

Ever heard of trade routes? or pre-programmed fastest-route-to-destination? And you don't even have to pay me to easily come up with explanations. Please grow an imagination.

Re:...the science?

[mrxak]

In fact, there was an episode based just on that premise, that the Serenity was purposefully staying away from the usual shipping lanes.

Re:...the science?

[mrxak]

And Defying Gravity.

Re:...the science?

[avg_joe_01]

Plot hooks notwithstanding, I'm pretty sure the shortest route from point A to point B is also the shortest route from point B to point A, and that if points A and B are sufficiently interesting, there should be a relatively decent amount of traffic between the two. I don't remember the episode that included your description of vessel interaction, but I'm not saying it didn't happen. Most of the interaction that I remember started via long rang scanners followed by a side trip to check things out. Did I miss something?

Re:...the science?

[plover]

multiply the pirates up by a couple of orders of magnitude, close the suez, and remove any military in the area. Who's going to bother then?

We're talking about the unrealistic sci-fi concept of an effective blockade of a planet from space. A couple orders of magnitude will change nothing.

"Space is big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mind- bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space." - Douglas Adams.

The Somali pirates control an effective area of less than about 50 km each (maybe a 15km radius if they have radar, and much less if they don't) randomly patrolling an area of water about 1600 square km. Given that they are effective to a vertical range of perhaps 100 meters above the water (effective against ships 10m tall or less, and able to fire small arms at airplanes), a fully crewed Somali pirate ship "controls" a volume of about .005 cubic kilometers.

The geosynchronous orbital sphere surrounding Earth is a surface area of about 6 billion square kilometers, containing a volume of about 40 billion cubic kilometers. It would take about 300 trillion Somali pirate ships to achieve the same density of coverage in geosynchronous orbit around Earth, and many quadrillions if you wanted to have pirates "all the way down". Sure, we can imagine that a pirate space ship goes faster, has longer range weapons, and so has a bigger effective sphere of influence, but it won't change the math by enough orders of magnitude to make a practical difference. In order to have an effective blockade around a single planet, it would still take more than the entire food output of the planet just to feed all the blockaders required.

And the reavers weren't simply blockading the planet, they were "occupying" the space between planets! When the movie showed Serenity flying through them, it wasn't like a one-ship-per-blockade-volume, either. The reavers were flying in close formation, mere hundreds of meters apart. Given that a space ship in the Firefly 'verse can fly between planets in a period of days, there seems to be little reason to fly through any obstacle they could have easily flown around.

While the Flying Spaghetti Monster may approve of that many pirates, we'd probably all be happier if he'd focus more on the beer volcanoes.

Re:...the science?

[capnkr]

No, it isn't. They frequently refer to traveling between planets obviously from/of different solar systems and/or regions of the 'Verse. They visit the 'core planets', they visit desert planets, water planets, other desert planets, stations around moons, etc etc... During the one episode, when Serenity breaks down and all but Mal abandon ship, reference is made to the fact that they are nowhere near any habitable systems or likely traffic areas between such.

If the total area where all this takes place is all in one system, then it must have at least 20+ man habitable planets, which would make for a pretty crowded orbit there in the Habitable Zone around whatever star that might be...

Of course, they could be in a galaxy-sized Dyson sphere, and *that* would maybe be a way to count the Firefly 'Verse as "one system", yet still pack in all these other features, but...

Re:...the science?

[Black Gold Alchemist]

Solar systems have been detected with up to 7 stars (3 is not all that uncommon), like this one: Nu Scorpii. Depending on how the stars run around, you could have a lot of planets in the habitable zone or closer. There are also globular clusters with tons of stars in them, however, planets would likely be unstable there.

Re:...the science?

[badkarmadayaccount]

Nitpick much? I suppose you think Dr. Manhattan being nude takes away from the depth of The Watchmen?
And she's supposed to be a companion? Her face somehow says country-girl from India. On second though, she looks like she has some features typical of whites... Way to depict your characters far from your comfort zone, America. ~

Re:...the science?

[badkarmadayaccount]

What about the orbits being at an angle to each other - no tidal forces for most of the year. A metallic dust cloud suspended by the gas giant magnetic field to crank down the intensity of that young star/small black hole/dual star system?

Re:...the science?

[quacking duck]

There's a reason star systems and even galaxies tend to exist in roughly flat shapes (i.e. in a plane), even though space is of course 3 dimensions (at least ;-) ).

Imagine you were a god and you changed Earth's moon to orbit 90 degrees from how it does now, like a giant wheel running along Earth's orbit, rather than along the same plane Earth uses to orbit the sun. The sun's gravity would immediately start pulling the moon out of the perpendicular plane, enough that by the time it starts swinging back towards Earth its orbit has already changed. Eventually it'll return to an orbit that's "flattened out" again.

Don't have time to check, but most planets and moons in our own solar system probably don't deviate from the solar system's plane more than a few degrees.

Re:...the science?

[badkarmadayaccount]

Neptune...

Re:...the science?

[quacking duck]

As the farthest planet in our solar system, the sun won't have an appreciable effect on Neptune's moons, many of which are captured asteroids anyway.

I've since seen a graphic some people put together, speculating on the layout of the star system in Firefly, with multiple stars each with their own planetary systems. If someone at NASA or otherwise knowledgeable in orbital mechanics thinks that's plausible, then fine, until then I'm still skeptical.

Re:Michio Kaku

[PopeRatzo]

...The man who happily becomes a sellout

Seriously, Kaku just doesn't seem to understand that sometimes it's better not to take every single offer from the Media.

The only physicists who were more overexposed than Michio Kaku died as Los Alamos.

Yay

[Fysx]

About time! Let's hope they don't botch it now.

Science Channel?

[reboot246]

Oh, you mean the "How It's Made" channel!!!
Or maybe it's the "Technology Channel".

Yeah, I know it. So now it gets even further off track with sci-fi?
What's next? Wrestling and reality shows?

Re:Science Channel?

[Penguinisto]

To be fair, engineering *is* a science...

Re:Science Channel?

[Anonymous Coward]

No, it's not. I'm a professor of engineering and I can tell you that engineering is not science. Engineering makes use of science, but that is not the same thing as being science. The goal in science is always reductionist: find a simpler set of precepts to explain the phenomena observed. The goal in engineering is to expand the scope available tools. Science is convergent, engineering is divergent.

Re:Science Channel?

[BJ_Covert_Action]

That's the stupidest theoretical trash I've ever heard. I'm an engineer (not a professor), and I can tell you that engineering is science, a very practical, applied science:

Science: Formulate a hypothesis. Design an experiment. Conduct experiment. Gather data. Analyze results. Form conclusion.

Engineering: Formulate a hypothesis (This system can solve this problem). Design an experiment (Build the system). Conduct experiment (Test system in operational environment or appropriate simulation of environment). Gather data (Analyze system dynamics, performance, and control signals). Analyze results (Was all the gathered data within expected envelope? Did we find any unaccounted for modes? Did the damn thing explode?). Form conclusion (It worked in the test, it should work in the real world! Shit! It exploded! Let's redesign the crappy part that failed!)

Anyone who says engineering is not a science has never actually engineered anything.

Mod that ^^ Mofo up, please!

[Penguinisto]

Seriously, I couldn't agree more. Science Channel did wander a bit off the reservation with the whole 'Punkin Chunkin' thing, but otherwise they tend to stay pretty much within the realm of science-related bits.

I'm kind of hoping they could cough up a weekly/daily topical news show (err, again?), and a little Science Fiction would do the place wonders, IMHO.

Re:Mod that ^^ Mofo up, please!

[westlake]

Seriously, I couldn't agree more. Science Channel did wander a bit off the reservation with the whole 'Punkin Chunkin' thing, but otherwise they tend to stay pretty much within the realm of science-related bits.

In the late 1970s, TVOntario seems to have pioneered the idea of taking a series like The Prisoner or Dr. Who and framing it with first-class commentary by a journalist like Warner Troyer or the science fiction writer Judith Merril.

If I remember rightly, supplementary materials were available for The Prisoner as part of a distance learning course for college credit.

The first time I can remember a commercially broadcast TV series being given that kind of academic credibility and significance.

Re:Mod that ^^ Mofo up, please!

[kevorkian]

Thats physics made FUN !!!!

How could you not make the connection ?? Throwing a pumkin is 100% Newtonian .. Well within the name of the channel !

Re:Mod that ^^ Mofo up, please!

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

Well, it's practical applications of physics. I mean, if you want science made fun, you could go horribly wrong and end up with a show like Brainiac: Science Abuse.

Re:What the hell is the science channel?

[Penguinisto]

Actually, most cablecos do it with a moderate package deal (e.g. Comcast does it as part of their 2nd-tier up from basic cable). Out here in PDX, we get it on channel 272, nestled in w/ NatGeo, History International, Military, and (for some odd reason) that distracting celebrity-crap channel A&E stuck in there somewhere...

As far as the general crap on TV goes, that particular grouping of channels makes for a relatively sane place to hang out.

they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU and

[Joe The Dragon]

they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU and make SGA S6 and SGU S3!

Different channel, eh?

[Penguinisto]

SyFy (*puke*) is a whole different channel. The Science Channel is part of the Discovery channel ecosystem (not perfect, I know, but still better than SyFy...)

Re:Different channel, eh?

[ElderKorean]

SyFy (*puke*) is a whole different channel. The Science Channel is part of the Discovery channel ecosystem (not perfect, I know, but still better than SyFy...)

Is the old name of the SciFi Channel still being used?
Perhaps Discovery could create a new Science Fiction only channel and call it that.

Que? Waitaminute...

[Penguinisto]

The URL is http://science.discovery.com/ WTF, Slashdot?

Why is this news?

[LoudNoiseElitist]

They've been running commercials for over a week now. I'm assuming they bought the rights a while back.

Re:This is important

[Robin47]

Battlestar Galactica

Ouch

[WindBourne]

I missed that entirely. Thanx.

Have to say that Comcast absolutely sux, since we do not get science with them. I am looking to change out to Dish and pick that up.

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[muphin]

why? because SGA and SG1 have hundreds of episodes, SGU died as it didnt follow the SG mantra.
Firefly on the other hand had SG1 potential but was cut short due to incompetency, with only 10 episodes (i think) it had gotten a huge following, with a movie aswell... this plainly shows there is a HUGE demand for it, buying the rights to this show would be a winner, just get in there before someone makes a try hard copy and ruins it for everyone.

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[Desler]

it had gotten a huge following, with a movie aswell... this plainly shows there is a HUGE demand for it,

If you ignore the fact that the movie bombed...

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[robot256]

it had gotten a huge following, with a movie aswell... this plainly shows there is a HUGE demand for it,

If you ignore the fact that the movie bombed...

Well duh. Not even Firefly could make us come out of our moms' basements. Put it on TV or the Internet and there won't be a problem.

What did they buy?

[Decessus]

Someone else on another board ( perhaps on this one as well ) mentioned that The Science Channel didn't buy the Firefly IP rights but only bought the syndication rights. Can anyone confirm or deny this?

Re:What did they buy?

[Decessus]

That's what I was confused about. I didn't know if they were buying the IP so that they could eventually make new episodes or if they were just buying the rights to show the old episodes. Apparently it is the latter.

Re:What did they buy?

[Decessus]

That's a shame. I'll admit I got my hopes up a little bit that new episodes were at least being considered. Thanks for the clarification.

SGU belongs on the soap opera channel

[EzInKy]

Still can't believe they murdered a fine sci-fi action adventure series with that garbage.

How many times?

[rudy_wayne]

As much as I like Firefly, how many times can you watch the same 14 episodes? If Firefly had a longer history it would make a lot more sense.

Re:How many times?

[fermion]

Not all 14 episodes are the same. Some shows, with 24 episodes a year, have fillers, recaps, and general bad episodes. Ou of he 14 episodes, there is only 1 or 2 that are genuinely bad.

The Simpsons is probably going going to pass 500 episodes, but I don' know if there are 10 I would wach repeatedly. Fawlty Towers is 12 episodes, each perfect, each one I have watched serveral times. Yes, Minister 22 episodes, not all perfect, but quite wonderful.

Re:How many times?

[atrus]

Out of curiosity, which would you consider the bad episodes in Firefly? I agree there are 1-2 less stellar ones, but would like to see if it lines up with what I felt.

Re:How many times?

[fermion]

I think "Out of Gas" is pretty bad. It is not the writing, but what looked liked an Elevator Episode, not really advancing the series, seemed like a case of having to produce a certain number of shows but not really having the resources/reativity to do so. This is a problem with have a limited number of shows producing 20+ eps a years rather than a larger number of shows producing 6-13 eps a year. Imagine if we tripled the shows on TV, each with fewer eps. We could have 6-12 Firefly, 6-12 SGU, 6-12 Happy Towns a year. No elevator eps, no clip shows.

I also don't know if an episode like 'Ariel' were really earned. The 80's montage A-Team thing worked very well when with BA, but not so well since them. That would have been much better off focusing on the tension between Jayne and the Tams rather than focusing on the job.

Re:How many times?

[elrous0]

You sir, are a retard of an epic order. "Out of Gas" is probably the best episode of the entire series. And "Ariel" is definitely in the top 5. Did you hate "Jaynestown" and the original pilot too?

As long as Kaku sticks to physics...

[amstrad]

...we'll be alright. Once he strays into other areas of science he becomes a blathering idiot.

http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/02/why_do_physicists_think_they_a.php

killing off and the undead

[davidwr]

Well, we can jump the shark and discover that the harpoon that killed Wash was covered with reaver-vampire blood and a few days after the Serenity crew leaves him behind he rises again, with a lust to regain his piloting role on a Serenity filled with a vampire crew.

Re:killing off and the undead

[Spad]

Jumping the Shark requires a pinnacle of awesomeness, a point beyond which is it only possible for the show to go downhill because it can never again equal such an event.

Otherwise it's just a show that's dropped off in quality.

Not federally, if the proposed budget passes.

[oneiros27]

Or at least, it won't be funding public television and their programming (Sesame Street, etc). ... but that's only what I know based on stuff that was reported on public television; I haven't read the budget myself, so it's possible that there's other for-profit TV channels that'd get some sort of funding for education stuff, like cable in the classroom or similar.

Anyway, the PBS press release from yesterday regarding their funding:

http://www.pbs.org/about/news/archive/2011/pbs-statement-elimination-funding-public-broadcasting/

Re:Not federally, if the proposed budget passes.

[drinkypoo]

I grew up on PBS and I think it's outdated. Today you can get on Youtube and view Khan academy. You can stream (or have mailed) documentaries from Netflix, which I have found to be a more than adequate substitute for cable. They only have so much streamable material that I want to watch, but it's more than cable offers me at any given time and I don't have to rent a PVR from my cable co. Even Cookie Monster has been deprecated.

Re:Not federally, if the proposed budget passes.

[JackieBrown]

Maybe if PBS and NPR would butt out of politics, then they wouldn't have to worry about their funding.

When they were mainly a science/history/ learning channel, they weren't a target.

Re:Not federally, if the proposed budget passes.

[JackieBrown]

Why are you relating them?

Or do you really think one justifies another?

You misunderstood the beginning of the movie.

[Anonymous Coward]

The Timeline did not start before the series. The sequence where you see Simon rescuing River at the beginning of the movie is through the Operative's eyes watching recordings of the event. He pauses and rewinds it and then walks right through the holo-recording.

Not staying on target ...

[oneiros27]

I was actually talking with my flatmate about that very topic as soon as we saw the commercial for Flrefly on the Science channel (and *not* on the 'syfy' channel (note, I refuse to pronounce 'syfy' like 'sci-fi'; I prefer a pronounciation that rhymes with 'iffy')

But, shows seem to make no sense based on what the channel claims to be for:

• wresting on syfy
• Star Trek on BBC America
• reality television on History (if it was following an archaelogist, sure, but 'Ax Men'? It was better when it was still the Hitler Channel)
• almost everything on MTV
• anything repetitive on Discovery (we discovered crab fishing and ice roads are dangerous ... how many seasons ago? And I have no idea what we're supposed to 'discover' about watching people make motorcycles)

... and I admit, Survivorman and An Idiot Abroad aren't really science (maybe a few of the skills that Les teaches are based in science), but they're both damned good shows.

Thank god I have the DVDs.

[Wicked Zen]

On the one hand, the awesomeness of Firefly.

On the other hand, Michio Kaku.

*shudder*

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[VoidCrow]

I dated a girl, a long time ago, who was taught to spell phonetically. She wasn't an idiot. In general, I try to avoid making shallow judgements lest I look like an idiot myself.

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[Culture20]

Berried? You're an idiot.

Or a friend of Strawberry Shortcake.

What movie?

[Anonymous Coward]

Movie? Just alliance propaganda.

You can't stop the signal.

More Firefly please!!

[crabel]

Oh my. I would sacrifice a chicken to get more Firefly. Heck, another movie would be swell too, even without the full cast! Any voodoo priest here that would like to help?

Re:This is important

[hack slash]

Red Dwarf.

"Smoke me a kipper, I'll be back for breakfast."

bad science in there

[YesIAmAScript]

Isn't this the show where the writers said that at the start of the series they weren't exactly clear on the differences between a solar system and a galaxy?

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[unitron]

Oh , okay, she was only taught by idiots.

Re:This is important

[Canazza]

Hyperdrive was 10x better

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[s-whs]

they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU and make SGA S6 and SGU S3!

They don't need to make SGU S3. Just go watch "As the world turns", it will give you the same excitement, the same deep drama that even Shakespeare can't match, and similar fantastic quality camera work! The science fiction content is slightly less, but so little it's just not worth talking about. Really!

Re:Caprica was the greatest .......

[JockTroll]

I drink ceylon for breakfast, loserboy nerd.

"The best job I ever had"

[KlaymenDK]

The only thing stopping them at this point is their ability to get the full staff on board for a second season, and possibly a couple decent writers to make it akin to the spirit of the original.

Are you kidding? Have you seen the DVD bonus material? These people would give Wash'es right arm for another chance to do more Firefly episodes. The writers, though, may be a bigger challenge, unless Joss takes it upon himself to dedicate a couple of weekends to the cause.

Re:"The best job I ever had"

[elrous0]

Some of them would return, but certainly not all of them. Most actors move on, and accept that as part of the business. And many of them are one more established shows now, and are pretty unlikely to return to a low-rated ensemble show with an uncertain future.

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[mrxak]

SGU was good because it *didn't* follow the SG mantra. I'm not a Stargate fan. I loved SGU.

It was your Deep Space Nine. It's a shame Stargate fans weren't able to expand their horizons a bit and embrace something new.

Re:Why?

[mrxak]

Because ultimately, nobody wants to watch 168 hours of television on a particular topic every week, and the people who like one kind of thing like other predictable sorts of things. Now, if you can afford to keep 168 hours of television programming going every week, with some of it making no money at all due to demographic dilution, so be it. But if you're running a business that wants to make money, you need more variety in your programming.

Certainly I disagree with SyFy doing professional wrestling and all the other atrocities they're committing these days, but at least it makes business sense. Ultimately, the best thing we can hope for is having a lot of other channels trying to do sci fi on their line-ups to take advantage of SyFy's weaknesses. One channel being the place for sci fi was never going to work out. A lot of people would agree with me, I think, when I say that the 90s were great for sci fi, and back then there was sci fi on all sorts of channels. Shows had to compete head-to-head for the same demographics in the same sort of time slots, and everybody won. With just one sci fi channel, you end up with other networks ignoring the whole sci fi viewership, and that one sci fi channel competing with itself. It's far easier to pare back to just a small number of shows in that case, so the demographics don't get spread over too many shows.

Pinnacle of awsomeness

[davidwr]

There are some Firefly fans out there who would say the whole series was a pinnacle of awesomeness.

Then again, some of those fans think Josh is such a creative genius that he can surpass his own best work so far no matter how good it is.

Mod up Chigbait

[simplypeachy]

I got the boxed set of S:AAB after giving in to a reminiscent moment. First impression: oh my god the production quality is shocking! Acting was a bit weak and the script was wobbly, but all three did improve and made it a worthwhile addition to my shelf. In fact I may watch some right now :-) I managed to miss the last episode THREE times! (Part of the reason I gave in to the set)

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[JackieBrown]

Kind of like how you embraced the other two Stargate shows?

Uh.

[Bruce McBruce]

I guess the only news here is that it kind of puts a dent in Nathan Fillion and co's plans to buy the rights to Firefly and distribute it online.

Though I guess with recentl-purchased IP comes the outside possiblity of another series.

Uh, for a one month subscription to...

[johnny0099]

...Netflix you can already do this. Both the episodes and the movie are in HD.

Re:they should buy the rights to SGA, SG1 and SGU

[BJ_Covert_Action]

SGU was good because it *didn't* follow the SG mantra. I'm not a Stargate fan. I loved SGU.

It was your Deep Space Nine. It's a shame Stargate fans weren't able to expand their horizons a bit and embrace something new.

So, you're saying that you don't actually like science fiction, but, rather, soap operas? If they're in space, that's just an exciting background right? Face it, SGU was the sci-fi show made for the Twilight generation. It was high school drama in space, and that's why it sucked. At least the original two series had competent and intelligent women in them who were able to solve problems and look good while doing it.

Science Channel Refuses To Dumb Down Science..

[jonabbey]

Oh, Michio Kaku is going to be talking about science in Firefly? Guh.

I wish Discovery would have the guts to rename the damn channel, for all the shit they care about the science on it.

As always, The Onion put it best: Science Channel Refuses To Dumb Down Science Any Further

Re:This is important

[Killjoy_NL]

*chimes in* Red Dwarf is awesome-sauce, so at least 2 viewers :)

Yes, This is important - and really annoying!

[billstewart]

When Firefly first came out, my local Comcast service didn't include the Sci-Fi channel in their standard cable service, only in extra-price bundles where that was the only station I cared about. A couple of years ago, it was even part of the standard package on the other side of town, but not my side, though it finally started working most of the time, and hasn't bounced off and on the list in a couple of months.

Now that Firefly might be showing up on Science Channel, does Comcast carry it? Nope, "Channel 272 Not Authorized"....

And my Tivo's DVD player can't play the standard DVD sets, because they've got some stupid copy protection that it can't cope with.

The major question here is

[dbIII]

The major question here is did it really cost $39 million in production costs or did Hollywood accounting throw a few extras unrelated to the film into the mix? Hollywood accounting is the petty crap of mid sized companies where costs from one department gets shuffled to another to make them look good or bad writ on a truly epic scale.
Maybe it was the only honest bit of accounting coming out of Hollywood in three decades and the numbers are right. Maybe it's higher or even lower to make the numbers come out to a slight loss for tax purposes without making it look like either a total bomb or minor success.
We can sort of trust the box office numbers because the data comes from a lot of sources but the production numbers come from what is known to be an untrustworthy source. We can only really speculate as I can and wonder where $39 Million went now that special effects are cheap and there were no "major name" actors that can demand millions. What other films did that fund or more likely whose pockets did the money flow directly into for no services rendered?

Re:The major question here is

[dbIII]

That's the thing about Tax avoidance. The numbers have to look good. Hollywood is a fetid corrupt swamp. What the accounting can and does do is turn a small success into a minor failure on paper.
It was obviously not a wild success but I doubt that it wouldn't break even if more honest accounting was used. Even then that doesn't matter though because it would have had to be a wild success to get another chance.

Re:This is important

[Meski]

3 & BBC SF generally.

S:AAB

[tekshogun]

Why can't this happen for Space: Above and Beyond... I miss that show :-(

Re:This is important

[KritonK]

So say we all!