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Why Classic Video Game Revamps Must Disappoint

An anonymous reader writes "Somehow my brain, so addled by pop-culture and videogames, drew a link between the alteration of the game-play mechanics in a 20-year-old series, and growing up. I want things to be how they were. I want to play the games I played when I was a child, only I want them to be new. Naturally, this just can't happen. Things will never be the way they used to be. Summer days are no longer spent running around outside before collapsing on a sofa to try to beat Labyrinth Zone; instead they're spent in a sweltering office full of morons who watch The Apprentice. Life has changed. Circumstances have changed. Even if the perfect 2D Sonic game were released tomorrow, it still wouldn't feel right, because I'm no longer the person who played those games.'"

129 comments

  1. new sonic by aahpandasrun · · Score: 1

    The new Sonic would be great if it didn't run at 10 frames per second.

    1. Re:new sonic by Twinbee · · Score: 1

      Generations is only 30fps and not 60fps?

      Wow, really?

      --
      Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
  2. Really? by Haeleth · · Score: 4, Insightful

    And yet when I go back and play classic games, often in emulators -- games made at least 15 years ago, and in a few cases over 25 years ago! -- I sure feel like I'm enjoying them.

    And it's not purely nostalgia; I have enjoyed games from that era that I did not play at the time.

    1. Re:Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And it's not purely nostalgia; I have enjoyed games from that era that I did not play at the time.

      Blasphemy. If you have fun with anything that's more than a day old, the only possible explanation is that you have been blinded by that evil, bad, nasty nostalgia.

    2. Re:Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Another way I know it's not purely nostalgia is that sometimes I don't like a game that I have fond memories of. When I was a kid I thought Golden Axe was way cooler than Streets of Rage. Went back and played them both again and jesus, Golden Axe sucks.

    3. Re:Really? by Hatta · · Score: 3, Insightful

      As an avid retro gamer I don't think there's much more to be said. Maybe he forgot how to have fun. The rest of us enjoy classic game play.

      Personally though, I don't see the point in retro remakes. I'd rather play the original, in almost every circumstance. Developers should spend their time making new games in the classic genres.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    4. Re:Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yep. I've been replaying the M&M series only because nobody has really made a party crpg lately. Not that I'm aware of at least. Really sucks, because that genre was and is the best.

    5. Re:Really? by WaroDaBeast · · Score: 1

      I'm fine with remakes, as long as they have something new in them. It can be anything ranging from a new area to a new character or a new class. And no, graphics aren't something new to me. I expect the remake to sport new graphics, unlike Tales of Phantasia's remake on the GBA (which looked worse than the SNES version).

      --
      "The body may heal, but the mind is not always so resilient." -- Deus Ex: Human Revolution
    6. Re:Really? by RyuuzakiTetsuya · · Score: 1

      My thoughts almost exactly.

      In Japan, there's this weird culture of remakes. See: Sega Ages 2500 series. I played the Outrun version. It's replaced the original version for me in terms of what I'd go to for classic(read: not 2. Although OR2 is good fun) Outrun time.

      Upgrading graphics, tightening a few things, etc. is almost preferable to me over a sequel to redo old games in the modern age. MegaMan Powered Up/RockMan RockMan simply was awesome.

      We have better CPUs, better graphical capabilities, controllers, etc. Let's use them.

      --
      Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
    7. Re:Really? by Skarecrow77 · · Score: 1

      Metroid Zero Mission is fantastic. other than nostalgia, I can't see a reason to play the old one. it really feels clunky and you're getting nearly the same experience with zero mission (plus epilogue)

      Final Fantasy 1 for the PSP is superb. it is better than the original in every way. after playing the original for 15-20 years, I thought that the GBA and PSP versions were too easy/dumbed down, but the more I played them (especially the PSP version), the more I realized that the original was broken in several very important ways and I just always accepted the broken bits as part of the gameplay experience.

      Doom3 kicked the everlovin shit out of Doom1.

      remakes aren't bad if done well.

    8. Re:Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Doom3 kicked the everlovin shit out of Doom1.

      They're kind of apples-to-oranges, the games took very different approaches from one another. Personally, I much prefer the original. Other than that, I agree.

    9. Re:Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean like this?

      I want to fuck the girls I fucked when I was a child, only I want them to be new. Naturally, this just can't happen. Things will never be the way they used to be.

      Hey guys, an unmarked black van just pulled up in front of my house. Wonder what's up...

    10. Re:Really? by Darkness404 · · Score: 1

      I agree, the Final Fantasy remakes (especially Dawn of Souls) were amazing on the GBA. But Phantasia was a terrible remake, and when the "professional" translation makes more mistakes than the DeJap fan-made translation, it isn't a good sign. Overall though I've been disappointed with Namco's efforts with their Tales series in the west. Namco could have done a lot to help the RPG-starved Wii by releasing Tales of Graces for it rather than inexplicably deciding to only release it for the PS3 in the US. Then -none- of the DS/GBA series was localized for the west.

      All of the Tales games have been excellent games and yet few have made it to the US and even fewer to Europe. Symphonia was easily one of the top 5 GC games made, and Vesperia is one of the better Xbox games out there, but there is so much that Namco hasn't bothered releasing.

      --
      Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
    11. Re:Really? by 10101001+10101001 · · Score: 2

      Metroid Zero Mission is fantastic. other than nostalgia, I can't see a reason to play the old one. it really feels clunky and you're getting nearly the same experience with zero mission (plus epilogue)

      As an avid Metroid fan, I'd have to say you perhaps missed the point of the original Metroid? It didn't involve hand-coddling, story-driven direction. It threw you in a sandbox with a vague notion of your mission, then let you discover in a 2D platform adventure just where you were supposed to go and what you were supposed to do; ie, it in many ways was the platform adventure equivalent of the Legend of Zelda, which isn't that surprising.

      Now, having said all that, I agree that the original Metroid was clunky (limited direction of fire and no ability to crouch, off-hand). But, in some ways Metroid Zero Mission really missed the mark, IMO, in trying too hard to tell people what to do. Thankfully, yes, they put in enough hidden blocks so people could work around some of that.

      However, clearly the atmosphere in Metroid Zero Mission tries too hard to tell the player exactly where to go and what to do. In short, it simply feels too heavy handed. In some ways, I'd place Castlevania - Harmony of Dissonance and Castlevania - Aria of Sorrow as better Metroid games in spirit, as they don't try to push plot as a means to direct you on where to go or what to do; the point of an adventure and an adventurer is to figure that stuff out on your own. And yes, that means that the original Metroid, with all its many clear flaws, still has something to offer that I just don't see Metroid Zero Misson offering...except, you know, in that it includes Metroid as an unlockable. :)

      PS - Please don't mistake this for me saying Metroid Zero Mission is a bad game. It is quite good, just like Metroid Fusion. Truthfully, almost all the Metroid games pretty badly break the original Metroid formula, be it through progressively lowering acid, one-way gates, locked doors, or translation decoder locks. A major part of the fun of Metroid has resulted in simply bypassing the developer induced barriers in unexpected ways. Because of how glitchy the original Metroid is, it's actually one of the best in the series for that sort of fun. I mean, who wants to wait to get the Varia when it just requires some well timed bombing or luring a Waver up to freeze?

      --
      Eurohacker European paranoia, gun rights, and h
    12. Re:Really? by sproketboy · · Score: 1

      Yes I agree 100%. I've been working on goldchest with the same idea. Take an old game goldbox but re-imagine it.

      http://goldchest.sourceforge.net/

    13. Re:Really? by sproketboy · · Score: 1

      Yeah Might and Magic was good. There is dungeoncraft and forgottenworld which are decent remakes of the older RPG type games.

    14. Re:Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That only demonstrates you haven't evolved as a person since 1985.

    15. Re:Really? by Soul-Burn666 · · Score: 1

      I've been with you until the part about Doom 3.
      I've played Doom 3, everything on max, dark room - all the things needed to enjoy a dark atmospheric game.... It was *OK*, but felt a bit boring.

      Then I fired up jDoom with a 3d model pack and played it with a friend............... DAMN!! That was FUN. Pure unadulterated fun.

      Doom 3 is technically superior, but the old Dooms are just funner... And to be honest, the old monsters were SCARIER and much more vile than the new ones.

      --
      ^_^
    16. Re:Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Golden Axe 2 was the good one in the series, but yeah, the first two Streets of Rage games even beat that.

    17. Re:Really? by Hatta · · Score: 1

      Hey great idea! I'll keep an eye on this one.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    18. Re:Really? by sproketboy · · Score: 1

      If your interested I just release 0.5. It's very alpha still but progress is being made.

      http://goldchest.sourceforge.net/

    19. Re:Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Doom3 took the series from being a great arena shooter to being a boring corridor crawl relying on cheap scares. It didn't have the great level design, fast-paced gameplay, or enemy count of previous Dooms.

    20. Re:Really? by Lapine · · Score: 1

      Dark Spire on the Nintendo DS is really good for a Wizardry-style game and probably the closest to being like the old games of the genre, and there's also a new Wizardry game for PS3 I can't vouch for as I haven't played. There's also the Etrian Odyssey series and Strange Journey on DS, the latter which I'm playing through right now. Sadly, there hasn't been anything quite like the M&M series in a long time (games featuring a huge, amusingly-designed open world and rapid, dramatic character progression for a party of characters) and Ubisoft is currently using the license to release puzzle games. :( At least Heroes of M&M is still around, but that's a different genre.

    21. Re:Really? by tebixan · · Score: 1

      Classic games are great for gamers on a budget too. If you can get past the outdated graphics there are tons of gems from the 90's for sale on Steam or GOG for just a few bucks. Right now GOG is having a sale on Interplay games, so I picked up Fallout 1, Fallout 2, and Fallout: Tactics for $9.

    22. Re:Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not sure. I would make updates to graphics and controlers and most of the time that could be enought. A starcraft update for bigger resolution (not even new textures, take a screen from SC1 and look at it at native resolution and it still looks great) and some extra controls would be a great game still. Same for Dune2.

      I still play Master of Orion 1 for instance, even when it's 640x480. In no other game am I able to sent a 100 billon groud troups to invade a solar system!

  3. Really? by WrongSizeGlass · · Score: 2

    I want to play the games I played when I was a child, only I want them to be new. Naturally, this just can't happen. Things will never be the way they used to be.

    You can substitute just about anything for 'play the games I played' and that statement would hold true. The times (and games and people) are a changin'.

  4. I disagree: the ultimate revamp by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Funny for this just get posted. A few hours ago I was introduced to "Super Mario Bros. Crossover (Hacked!)" - I suggest the nostalgic among us give it a whirl. It's the original Super Mario Bros. except that you can play through the game as other 8 - bit Nintendo characters such Samus, Mega Man, and several others. The people who put this together did a bang up job. I blew through level 1-1 -> 7-4 in about an hour with one of the Contra guys. You get all of there weapons and attributes, the in game music even changes to accommodate the character. Anyway, I think Link and Contra guy are the most fun. If your missing the past, as I do, this is a fantastic way to relive it.

    It's free on the google chrome store.

  5. Summary: by humphrm · · Score: 2

    What a drag it is growing old.

    --
    -- "In order to have power, I must be taken seriously." -Mojo Jojo
    1. Re:Summary: by greg1104 · · Score: 1

      There are lots of classic games where you take a little yellow pill to help you on your way.

    2. Re:Summary: by Mordok-DestroyerOfWo · · Score: 1

      Things are different today, I hear every gamer say. Now pardon me as I run to the shelter for a gamer's little helper.

      --
      "Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what is right" - Salvor Hardin
  6. Different by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Life may be different and I may be different but I still love classic arcade games and side scrollers. Simple objects with a simple set of rules goes a long way. You would be amazed how great a game is by the stuff you don't put in it...

  7. Sigh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why is the truth so depressing?

  8. Re:Astounding by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I guess it makes sense I don't see the "'News' for Nerds" tag on the website anymore. /. has contining to stop being about news and nerds

  9. Sonic may not be the best example by Hahnsoo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Sonic the Hedgehog may be a poor example for this topic. The gameplay consisted mostly of running and jumping really fast while grabbing rings. It took advantage of the console technology of the time to provide smooth framerates with no tearing, which allowed the backgrounds to zoom by quickly, giving the illusion of speed. But that was the gimmick. Sonic the Hedgehog, as a series, wasn't known for being difficult (like Mega Man) or innovative (like Marathon). It doesn't even have that much of a compelling story (like RPGs). The same gameplay 20 years later may appeal to some people, but most gamers who played Sonic back then are different people now and are looking for more than just running and jumping really fast while grabbing rings (which is one of the laments of the article).

    A better example of a classic revamp would be the Bionic Commando Rearmed or the most recent Mega Man game. Bionic Commando Rearmed adds a lot of modern features to the original game, like big boss battles, hacking mini-games, and the ability to swap weapons within the stage, but the basic mechanic of swinging and shooting is still challenging. The most recent Mega Man was pretty popular, despite (or perhaps because) it staying true to the 8-bit Mega Man graphics and gameplay, mostly because it still maintained the same level of challenge.

    Of course, many classic games are getting a cloning vats treatment on the iPhone/iPad/iFranchise and Android market. If anything, the older 8-bit, 16-bit, and PS1 era games (or clones of those games) are seeing a bit of a renaissance on those platforms.

    1. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by greg1104 · · Score: 1

      Mega Man is also my pick for the appropriate counter-example. The recent re-releases used the old engine, so the controls felt exactly the same. And they perfectly recreated the feel of the old title. The difficulty level, the unfairness of play, everything was just right--just with all new levels and enemies. The way I wanted to throw the god-damn controller at the screen was exactly the same as when I first discovered the game in 1990. The only difference was that I'd be far more likely to damage my slim DLP panel if I actually did it, the old CRT survived the few times I gave in to that anger and let it fly.

      The most amazing part is that they eventually released one of the new Mega Man games for the PS3, too, and even that one ended up being the same experience. Didn't even require any Nintento hardware, yet it was once again 1990 and I was pissed at the level designers and alternated between fury to beat them and despair that I should just give up. If Sonic hasn't managed to accomplish the same retro yet updated feat, it's not because it's impossible; they just didn't do it right.

    2. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by VortexCortex · · Score: 1

      Yes. In fact it would make the worst example considering that Sega ported it to PC (Sonic2 [in a pack of other games along with Vector Man], Sonic3, Sonic&Knukles, and Sonic3+Knuckles) and I still have it installed and running via WINE (runs natively on XP).

      Additionally, I've also got the XBox 360 Ports of Sonic 1, 2, 3, Knuckles, Even the Dreamcast game Sonic Adventure (Directors cut) is available on the XBox Live marketplace. I've got the MegaMan series on the 360 (as a single disk) as well...

      I think the author just grew up, and/or got bored with the games; Hence the desire for novelty in the old format. I still enjoy the old games and buy old carts of games I never had the money to buy as a kid. I get just as much enjoyment out of these games and their music as I ever did as a child -- Even more so now since I have the patience to beat them, and there are SAVE FEATURES for the games that did not have them.

      I still have my original (S)NES. My original Genesis croaked, but I still have it along with all of my cartridges. Unlike most, who may be operating in a gray area WRT copyright laws, I dump my own original ROMs for use in emulators on my PC (no DRM = fair use).

      To address the lack of novelty issue: LOOK HARDER PAL. Seriously. There is a mod community. Whether or not it's legal: The holy grail of Sonic mods Knuckles in Sonic 1 exists... o_O (remember, you could plug Sonic2 into the top of Sonic&Knuckles to play as Knuckles in Sonic 2... but Sonic 1 was too different, so you got a mini-game instead -- Well now modders have done what the original devs at Sega never did by reverse engineering and modifying the machine code [and palette] of the game ).

      There are mods for Everything from new levels for classic Mario & Sonic to Commander Keen (which I still play in DosBox). The Doom modding community has come leaps and bounds, even adding whole new game types and RPG or RTS components (Currently enjoying Shotgun Frenzy Cooperative FPS vs invading demons + Real time strategy elements and in-level weapon purchasing & upgrading -- deployable turret FTW!)

      If you can't find enjoyment in the older games, I'm afraid you may have been dropped on your head as an adult.

    3. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by Tetsujin · · Score: 1

      Mega Man is also my pick for the appropriate counter-example. The recent re-releases used the old engine

      You mean the recent sequels? (Rockman 9 and 10 - both are on PS3...)

      They don't actually use the old engine, as they don't run on an NES emulation. The old engine has been reimplemented. This is why Rockman 9 had an option to allow you to emulate sprite flicker (which on old hardware would have been caused by software dealing with a hardware limitation on the number of sprites per scanline) - it's also why they were able to do things in 9 and 10 that aren't actually possible on NES hardware.

      I did enjoy those two titles, but as examples go they're kind of uninspiring. Going full retro like they did is fun, but it's not something that would work for every title and going backwards like that, back to familiar, safe territory means (in terms of game design) you're not taking a lot of chances.

      --
      Bow-ties are cool.
    4. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by ObsessiveMathsFreak · · Score: 1

      Sonic the Hedgehog, as a series, wasn't known for being difficult (like Mega Man) or innovative (like Marathon). It doesn't even have that much of a compelling story (like RPGs).

      The counterexamples to your assertions are, respectively, Sonic 2, Sonic 1 and Sonic 3&K. As platformers, they delivered on all three of these counts. I'll refer you to this article about S3K in particular.

      I think the analogy to Sgt Pepper is apt, if a little presumptuous. Certain games define the genres in the eras they are made, and usually become classics whose quality is obvious in any era. The single best example from the 16 bit platforming era is probably Super Mario World, but there are several titles across genres which remain playable and entertaining to this day.

      What the author is bemoaning appears to me to be the inability of these old game to achieve the same level of genre defining impact they once did. By definition, this is of course obvious; they cannot define a genre a second time. Nevertheless they remain classics, so long as no-one tries to remake them. I think the same applies to something like the Star Wars prequels.

      --
      May the Maths Be with you!
    5. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by Dogtanian · · Score: 1

      LOOK HARDER PAL. Seriously. There is a mod community.

      Yeah, well until the rockers kick your f****** heads in, that is.

      --
      "Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
    6. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by tepples · · Score: 1

      Unlike most, who may be operating in a gray area WRT copyright laws, I dump my own original ROMs for use in emulators on my PC

      What dumper would you recommend buying for NES, Genesis, and Super NES cartridges? Retrode is sold out, and the guy who made them complained that it'd be too hard to autodetect the mapper in order to dump NES games.

    7. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by equex · · Score: 1

      Exactly. For the same reasons as every movie which did the Bullet-Time effects after The Matrix, was pretty much forgotten. The only way one can try to remake the classics would be to assume the same mindset at they had back then and try to do a honest re-iteration of the game design and planning. Take what worked well and keep it and add a little extra that 'would have been nice' in the previous game. Upgrade and redo graphics but for gods sake don't alter the general feeling and atmosphere of the game. Do not 'do it in 3D' just because you have some OpenGL developers around. Hire talented pixel-artists who can do unique environment graphics and characters. I say even keep the 8 bit sound, just hire some exceptional people like Martin Galway and Jeroen Tel to do it. It will sound great.

      --
      Can I light a sig ?
    8. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by donscarletti · · Score: 1

      Also, the Sonic games over the last 5 years have been giant turds of games on their own. I played that one simply titled "Sonic the Hedgehog" and it seemed half finished, the graphics seemed PS1 era, the controls sucked and the level design was awful, short stretches of boring platforming separated by half-arsed cutscenes. Also, random bugs where you would die for no reason, like using circle to grab a string of rings but sometimes you would fling off into space instead. You don't have to be a hurt Sonic fan to hate them, I first played Sonic briefly in '03 and I still hate the new ones.

      --
      When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem
    9. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by Tharsman · · Score: 1

      I don't think Mega Man 8 is a good example since it is a game designed to feel old.

      The article/summary is also too vague and looks at only one side of the coin. There are many reasons for people to desire new old games.

      Some literally just want to go back in time and relive those gaming days as if technology had never improved. For them something like Mega Man 8 is perfect.

      Others want those beloved characters to stay alive or return in new adventures with today's tech. For these players games like Zelda Twilight Princess or Metroid Prime are the way to go.

      Then there are those that want things to retain their original form but with faster pace or up-to date visuals. For these games like New Super Mario Bros Wii or Super Street Fighter IV are great examples.

      I don't think it's impossible to bring sonic into any of these forms efficiently, but by now it feels as if the specific franchise is cursed or something.

    10. Re:Sonic may not be the best example by Patch86 · · Score: 1

      New Super Mario Bros. is another interesting example. In so many ways it is just SMB3 or SM World rehashed, with new levels and better graphics. But as a "retro experience" game for the DS, it hit just the right note. I enjoyed Sonic Rush for the same reason; the handhelds are perfect platforms for retro gaming experience, and they managed to keep the nostalgic feel without just doing a direct port.

      I just don't see the point of cramming nostalgia characters into whole new games. Mario only gets away with the likes of Galaxy because it too has nostalgia value- in the form of Mario 64. Sonic with a broad sword? Donkey Kong playing golf? No thanks.

  10. Comcast! AT&T! by earls · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Someone throttle this pirate!

    1. Re:Comcast! AT&T! by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      Not going to help much with stuff he's downloading being smaller in size then modern web pages.

    2. Re:Comcast! AT&T! by Mordok-DestroyerOfWo · · Score: 1

      I don't think he meant "throttle" as in bandwidth...

      --
      "Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what is right" - Salvor Hardin
    3. Re:Comcast! AT&T! by tepples · · Score: 2

      smaller in size

      Doesn't matter. It only has to be big enough to be original. George Harrison lost a million dollar lawsuit for copying nine notes from "He's So Fine" into his song "My Sweet Lord".

    4. Re:Comcast! AT&T! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      then modern web pages do what? and smaller than what?

    5. Re:Comcast! AT&T! by mattack2 · · Score: 1

      I too have enjoyed playing old games I never played at the time, though usually on e.g. a PS2 version. I wish I could legally get the ROMs to play on MAME.

      Also, the originator doesn't have to be insulting -- The Apprentice (and other reality shows) can be very entertaining.

  11. Re:balls by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think this accurately describes everything in this article, mod parent as informative

  12. WoW sucks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    ...Sorry, couldn't resist the snipe.

    But I reached this conclusion after being bored this past winter, and searching for a decent MMO. There aren't any. (EVE, of course, but I'm sorry - anything that requires complex spreadsheets that would make economics majors cringe isn't a game. It's not even a hobby. :P)

    I started reflecting upon the sad state of affairs that is the MMO genre, and I realized something. Part of what made MMOs attractive in the first place was the fact that they were, pardon the pun, game-changing. Sure, there were text-based MUDs aplenty - the golden age was just starting to wind down. Sure, there was UO, but at the risk of annoying legions of UO fans - well, come on, it was UO. Not even close to the same level as that horrible monstrosity and destroyer of lives, careers, marriages and time - EverQuest.

    There was something unique about EverQuest, that no other MMO has ever been able to capture, no matter how hard they've tried or what improvements they made. It was the 'newness'. Just a brief time earlier, there was nothing out there like it. But suddenly - bam - the future was here, and holy shit. A massive, 3D world, with ungodly amounts of players. It was the stuff of science fiction back when I was a kid, having to deal with mere 8-bit game consoles - but there it was, finally. The future(tm)! Woo!

    Now? Anyone can make an MMO. And it isn't exciting. Because it isn't new. You can change the names of classes; you can add cheesy mechanics, but that initial moment of awe-inspiring potential - stepping into a massive, virtual world for the first time and simply being astounded by the potential - can never come again. ...Also, no moment in gaming will ever be as awesome as getting to the end of Bionic Commando and seeing Hitler, in 8-bit glory. :(

    1. Re:WoW sucks. by SaroDarksbane · · Score: 1

      that initial moment of awe-inspiring potential - stepping into a massive, virtual world for the first time and simply being astounded by the potential - can never come again

      Wish I had modpoints right now. I was an Asheron's Call addict rather than EverQuest, but I feel exactly the same way. Nothing will ever feel the same as it did when I first logged into something of such an enormous scale. I guess it's true what they say: You can't go home. :(

      I also wonder how much of it had to do with the rest of the players feeling the same way. MMOs today (especially WoW, but especially EvE . . .) seem to have a much nastier playerbase than I remember from my Asheron days. Maybe we're so used to MMOs now, the sense of wonder and adventure has receded and all we're left with is an amusement park where you wait in line for your next "reward", which makes everyone bitter and entitled.

    2. Re:WoW sucks. by Kirin+Fenrir · · Score: 1

      Not to sound like an advert, but you might wan to look at Guild Wars 2:

      - No "holy trinity", dedicated tanks and healers forcibly removed to focus on tactics rather than roles.
      - No WoW-style quests, entire overworld is dynamic events that have different outcomes in the persistent world based on if you succeed or fail.
      -Buy to play, with no monthly fee.

      --
      Caffeine is my anti-drug!

      Duranin - A NWN2 Roleplaying Persistent World
  13. Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the worst by Quila · · Score: 2

    Tempest can't be played correctly without a potentiometer (the round dial), Missile Command can't be played correctly without a big trackball, and Battlezone can't be played without the two sticks that mirror real-life tracked vehicle driving (which I've done).

    However good the graphics and mechanics are recreated, it doesn't work without the controllers the games were designed for.

  14. Idiocy... by blahplusplus · · Score: 1

    ... it's not that you want the game to play as it was when you were a kid. When you were a KID you were at the beginning of game design, as game design advances in a genre or area your expectation bar moves higher. The real issue is that developers don't know or are too afraid of revamping old games. They are afraid of updating the design by what has been learned since the old games release. And quite frankly I think too many developers are out of touch and don't have it in them anymore and thats why we end up with graphics refreshes with the exact same old game template.

    There's tonnes many fans would love to add to old games if they had the skills/got the chance. I often wonder what Chrono resurrection aand possible other fan remakes/spin offs would look like if it wasn't for the copyright nazi's.

    http://www.opcoder.com/projects/chrono/

    1. Re:Idiocy... by Hatta · · Score: 1

      When you were a KID you were at the beginning of game design, as game design advances in a genre or area your expectation bar moves higher

      Or, when you were a kid you learned to like a certain style of gameplay, and game development grew away from that over time. In that case, it makes perfect sense to go back and play the great games you missed, rather than wasting time on games that aren't intended to give you that classic experience.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    2. Re:Idiocy... by blahplusplus · · Score: 1

      "Or, when you were a kid you learned to like a certain style of gameplay, and game development grew away from that over time. In that case, it makes perfect sense to go back and play the great games you missed, rather than wasting time on games that aren't intended to give you that classic experience."

      There are many great old game designs that just don't have enough meat on them because the content/quality bar has been pushed up. Most old designs don't suffer from out-right bad design, rather they suffer from you having seen it all before, hence there is a need to add new ideas and mix them with the old. Old games suffer from you having seen it all before, not that their basic design is incorrect.

    3. Re:Idiocy... by Hatta · · Score: 2

      And there are a great many modern game designs that don't have enough meat on them because the content/quality bar has been pushed so low to appeal to the lowest common denominator. That seems to be the prevalent trend. e.g. where are the turn based RPGs where you make your own party? What happened to FPSs with maps of any degree of complexity?

      If anything modern games have fewer novel ideas, simply because it's all been tried before. Back in the 80s and early 90s there was so much new ground to tread. People tried things they wouldn't today. New games rehash (a banal subset of) old ideas, and throw a new coat of paint over it. Hell with that, I'd rather play something classic.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    4. Re:Idiocy... by rgmoore · · Score: 1

      And there are many old games that are still very playable because they did a great job of basic design and were able to crank up to a high enough difficulty to give anyone a real challenge. I think this is true of a lot of the classic arcade games. They're built more around reflexes and hand-eye coordination than thinking and planning. As long as they can't be beaten by memorizing and following a predictable series of moves, they can be just as challenging as they were when they first came out.

      --

      There's no point in questioning authority if you aren't going to listen to the answers.

  15. For the nostalgic power players of old by wjcofkc · · Score: 2

    Funny for this just get posted. A few hours ago I was introduced to "Super Mario Bros. Crossover (Hacked!)" - I suggest the nostalgic among us give it a whirl. It's the original Super Mario Bros. except that you can play through the game as other 8 - bit Nintendo characters such Samus, Mega Man, and several others. The people who put this together did a bang up job. I blew through level 1-1 -> 7-4 in about an hour with one of the Contra guys. You get all of there weapons and attributes, the in game music even changes to accommodate the character. Anyway, I think Link and Contra guy are the most fun. If your missing the past, as I do, this is a fantastic way to relive it. It's free on the google chrome store. (I originally posted this as an AC - I've been posting enough the last couple years I decided I might as well log in)

    --
    Brought to you by Carl's Junior.
    1. Re:For the nostalgic power players of old by elsurexiste · · Score: 1

      Welcome to the herd! :D

      --
      I rarely respond to comments. Also, don't ask for clarifications: a brain and Google are faster, believe me!
  16. What about the Monkey Island Special Edition? by mackil · · Score: 1

    What about the remake of The Secret of Monkey Island? I thought it was terrific.

    1. Re:What about the Monkey Island Special Edition? by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      I play the original on my phone. Scummvm has been ported to just about everything with a CPU it seems.

  17. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by dcollins · · Score: 1

    Eh, I've had a pretty good time with a Missile Command clone recently, driven by the mouse (which is, after all, just an upside-down trackball).

    The other two, sure, I agree with those.

    --
    We know where leadership by an anti-intellectual "strongman" who scapegoats minorities and likes boisterous rallies goes
  18. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by Hatta · · Score: 1

    Tempest acutally uses a spinner. Potentiometers can only move so far in one direction, a spinner moves freely. You can build one from an old ball mouse pretty easily.

    For missile command, you can get arcade style trackballs still. I have an X-arcade trackball and it's quite good. I wouldn't recommend the joysticks though.

    For Battlezone, and other dual stick games like Robotron 2084 I've found the analog sticks on the dual shock to be a very very good replacement. But again, you can buy twin sticks for use with MAME.

    --
    Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
  19. Duke Nukem by the_raptor · · Score: 1

    Stop making excuses for Duke Nukem Forever. It was just bad, the poor reaction to it had nothing to do with nostalgia.

    I play plenty of old games (or remakes, or clones with the same mechanics) and find them just as good as I did when I was a kid. What the author is missing is the massive dopamine rush that some experiences produce and that you can never normally replicate (because your brain adapts, this is why junkies have to keep increasing their dose).

    --

    ========
    CINC, 4th Penguin Legion
    1. Re:Duke Nukem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think what's missing from the discussion is that some old games are just boring crap, it's just that nobody cares enough to talk about them, and this is giving the impression that older gamers think that "all" old games were great and so it must be nostalgia that's speaking.

  20. Meh, by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

    I just finished playing through Quackshot, and I'm working my way through World of Illusion. I also just beat Super Metroid. Sure, I'm not the same person I used to be, but I can appreciate things I didn't notice when I was a kid. Like level design, beautiful sprite work, little touches like Donald Duck closing his eyes when he fires or the water lapping against Samas' feet....

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
  21. The core of nostalgia by Twinbee · · Score: 1

    Speaking about the perfect sonic game, here's one based on the old Sonic 1 game, but fully modernized in 3D - the new "Sonic Generations":
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wuj-6T_ymqg

    They've even used the same music from Green Hill zone (which I still love today), and the orchestration is good, but I still prefer the original for various reasons (chorus section has the bass-line moving instead of the melody, giving more contrast etc.). Also the 3D on first glance looks great. But rasterization actually really spoils it. If this was fully-raytraced / globally illuminated, it would look a TON better, and much more likely to give the dreamlike feel that you would have gotten as a kid, but today instead of back then.

    To even get a glimpse of that atmosphere from when you were a kid, you need detailed graphics, an I mean REALLY detailed stuff (and no, I don't mean realistic). Generations is great, but you bet you could get 1000x better.

    I'm not saying playability isn't important, as it is, but a lot of the 'atmosphere' and nostalgia comes from the audio/visuals (and I would include even Space Invaders and Pacman here).

    --
    Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
    1. Re:The core of nostalgia by RyuuzakiTetsuya · · Score: 1

      holy crap. I thought Sonic Rush Adventure was damn good(Never played Rush). That looks amazing.

      I think CRT tubes had something to do with it. I still feel the same when I look at a classic game through an old CRT tube.

      Maybe it's also the fact that I didn't grow cynical in my years...

      --
      Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
  22. I guess by gaderael · · Score: 2

    I've had just as much fun with Donkey Kong Returns as I had with the SNES series. Great game. Same goes for Mega Man 9 on the Wii Store. Bionic Commando Rearmed was good fun as well. It is possible to make games like they used to. You just have to look at the plethora of indie titles that are available on the Wii Store, XBLA, etc. Super Meat Boy anyone? That's Nintendo hard.

    --
    Anyone got a light for my sig?
    1. Re:I guess by Yuioup · · Score: 1

      Exactly the point I wanted to make in this thread.

      Modern AAA games all seem to be the same because the developers and publishers want to keep playing it safe. Back in the 80s and 90s there was a lot more experimentation going on because it was the frontier of gaming concepts.

      If you really want to recapture your childhood and yet have fun with a modern game, play indie titles or Flash games. I personally think that Flash games is where it's at. There is an AMAZING amount of experimentation going on in that space.

  23. Elite by Smivs · · Score: 1

    Elite is alive and well, re-born as Oolite. Cross platform, open source and very free, with an enthusiastic community of players and modders.

  24. Re:balls by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I actually posted this because I don't understand the /. moderation system and as an engineer, I'm good at poking shit I don't understand (I read the FAQ too). It's mysterious to me that THIS is the one anon comment I post which gets modded up!

  25. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by greg1104 · · Score: 1

    Centipede is a more popular title than all these, and that also falls into the category where it's not the same with a trackball that doesn't feel like the one you'll find in a computer trackball. There are some reasonable arcade trackballs for emulation you can use to make it and Misslle command workable though, as well as some other big trackball games (Marble Madness, Crystal Castle).

    Emulating the Tempest spinner is much harder but still possible, by purchasing the same type of hardware and calibrating it obsessively. Never 100% right, but 95% is close enough to enjoy the game, and for the adjustment period to playing a genuine cabinet to be short.

    Battlezone, though, the feel of that game is impossible to recreate anywhere else. A sit-down vector Star Wars is in that category too.

  26. Achievement Unlocked by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Today's games are riddled with dumb shit like that.

  27. Stick with the old by DemonGenius · · Score: 1

    I have realized the same dilemma. My solution is to stick with the old consoles for those games that I have played in my childhood. It's amazing how fun it still is to play SMB1 on original hardware. Playing on original hardware for classics still beats emulation in terms of accuracy and nostalgia. Even though I know the NES cartridges need to be aligned and not blown, I still blow on them just for the hell of it. Classics that I never had a chance to play as a kid I buy on eBay nowadays. For newer consoles, I just stick to newer gems like Limbo on the Xbox 360 instead of going for remakes (except Perfect Dark since I don't want an N64). I never owned an Atari 2600, but I found myself buying one at a flea market and about 30+ games after that for dirt cheap. Many of those games are still entertaining to this day. One more thing I should mention is that young kids today go nuts for the old hardware more than you think. Break out the NES and they'll harass you to let them play with it forever.

  28. Can Sonic retire? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Many people want Sega to stop making Sonic games. Back in the late 80s Disney was able to mostly retire Mickey Mouse, keep him as the company mascot on merchandise but stop making cartoons based on him. They could do this because they had very popular new cartoons for both TV and theaters: Duck Tales, Rescue Rangers, Beauty and the Beast, The Lion King, etc. Can Sega come up with enough new franchises, or revive their other old ones, to the point that they don't need Sonic as a crutch anymore?

    1. Re:Can Sonic retire? by Darkness404 · · Score: 1

      I don't think that Sega can retire Sonic because Sega doesn't want to take risks like every other game company. When was the last time we truly saw something innovative that

      A) Worked

      And most important B) made money.

      For example: Okami was very innovative and a great game but sold poorly. On the other hand, Nintendo can put Mario in a game and it will sell based on the name alone. When creative games sell poorly and mass-produced games based on established names sell well, its no surprise that they all make cookie-cutter games, its the only way they can make a profit.

      --
      Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
  29. Nope nope nope by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Remakes suck because the designers remove things that made the original great.

    Persona was remade on the PSP, so they gutted the original soundtrack (one of the most memorable ones in a videogame) and replaced the entire thing with J-Rock/J-Hip-Hop. This was done out of some misguided sentiment of making the game more hip and youth friendly. People were disappointed across the board. Now with a sequel coming out, they held a press announcement _just_ to tell people the original soundtrack would be included.

    Or look at the Silent Hill 2/3 HD remake. They are canning all the original voice work and re-hiring new voice actors because Konami is too cheap to pay the original VAs for re-using their work.

    Contra 4 on DS came close to being a good remake, but had such excessive difficulty that it was impossible for anyone to enjoy even on the easiest setting. All the original Contra games were challenging but not hard for the sake of frustrating the player.

    The biggest problem with remakes is that frequently nobody from the original teams are involved, and they are made by people new to the industry with almost zero experience. So you get people with good intentions but no guidance and no real skill. Compare this to the original games that were all made by industry veterans with years under their belt.

    That's why remakes suck.

    1. Re:Nope nope nope by Zen+Punk · · Score: 1

      Yeah, this sounds right. The new 2d sonic games don't work because the physics aren't right. Sonic doesn't have the same weight and movement as in the old games. If somebody could just be bothered to play the old games and attempt to replicate what was satisfying about the mechanics, there would be a solid foundation to build on.

      --
      Sleep is futile.
    2. Re:Nope nope nope by andromeda1 · · Score: 1

      The Persona remake is actually pretty good: coherent with the rest of the series, since they restored the setting and spell names, and it works great on the PSP. If you actually like the music in Persona 3/4 (which I do quite a bit), then you'll like the new music for Persona PSP. Other problems with the original have been fixed as well. I expect it was done with some of the original folks involved, as you suggest. Persona 2/3/4 are brilliant, and the two other versions of P3 - FES and P3P - are excellent as well. I have high hopes for P2: Innocent Sin on the PSP (not to mention Devil Survivor 2 on the DS.)

  30. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by Greyfox · · Score: 1
    Tempest, Missile Command and Centipede play respectably well with a Logitech Trackman Marble. If you really like the big play-doh trackball, they sell one of those too.

    360 degrees can NOT be played without a joystick that can rotate around an axis but doesn't have freedom to go through the center. The game is just impossible.

    Spy Hunter absolutely can not be played without the 4 button steering wheel controller, shifter and pedal to control your speed. Which makes me sad because of all the video games I played growing up, I was by far the best at Spy Hunter, and could play it for as long as I wanted to on one quarter.

    --

    I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?

  31. The Sonic Cycle by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The "Sonic Cycle" has already been broken.

  32. Tron Arcade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When I turned 30, my wife bought me a Tron arcade game for my birthday. That was 9 years ago, and not only do I still enjoy playing it, but so do my kids...my 12 year old is unquestionably the household master. I just recently got back from a trip to Colorado Springs - there's a famous classic arcade up there (actually in nearby Manitou Springs) that we all really enjoyed.

    There is a pattern I see over and over again in art (and yes, video games are art...let's not get into that) - there is a rank presumption that the quality of art varies inversely with the restrictions placed on it, i.e., the freer art is of restriction, the better it will be. Obviously, there's a minima of freedom that has to be exceeded, but I've found it's almost never true - art thrives on barriers.

    There's an artist, Vic Muniz, who has a great term for this - the "semiotic black market". When there are restrictions on art (Muniz is referring generally to political ones, though technological ones apply as well), the artist is forced to represent his ideas symbolically rather than directly. What better description of classic arcade games? A human mind is just as capable of investing a twelve pixel sprite with meaning as it is with a photo-realistic model.

  33. Doubtful by Greyfox · · Score: 1
    I'm quite happy to play games I grew up with on mame or if I happen to find an old arcade game while out and about. I can think of several titles (Final Fantasy, Suikodan and Star Ocean) that I'd buy again if they released updated versions of the games on new graphics engines and possibly revamped gameplay (Though not revamped to the current final fantasy combat engine. Maybe they could find one that sucks somewhat fewer goat balls.)

    I don't know what your problem is, but please don't project onto me if you feel that it's more enjoyable these days to sit out on your porch and yell at kids to get off your lawn. I'm still happy to play a game, past or future.

    --

    I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?

  34. Speaking as someone who's very jaded with games... by Twinbee · · Score: 1

    I'm probably one of the more jaded people here when it comes to enjoying games. I rarely play them these days, as 'real life' gets in the way too much. Also, the atmosphere of games is WAY lower than when I was a kid. It's like having a weird dream, which has a strange kind of atmosphere, and then trying to explain that atmosphere to someone else - you can't do it (also similar to when you try to describe 'green' to a born-blind person). Hence nostalgia is incredibly difficult to pin down.

    However I will say this, despite my pessimism and the way I usually find today's games utterly boring, I know that an INCREDIBLE game could be produced in theory. For a driving type game for example, it would have the physics of something like Stunt Car Racer, with the tight controls of Outrun, and the futuristic setting of F-Zero, Wipeout or STUN runner, with the variety and sometimes colour/clarity of say, Rainbow Islands, but a million times better than any of these. The game would be easy to master, and incredibly hard to complete with worldwide competitions taking place each day trying to beat the best time / get the furthest. There would always be something to do with your fingers to keep interest at every millisecond in the game (twitch gameplay to the max). The graphics would also be fully raytraced, with full global illumination, not the rasterization crap they use today, which always makes 3D graphics look 'cookie-cutter'-esque. It would be as popular as football if done right I reckon.

    A while back, I made a spoof article and spoke about such a game. Look for 'Forward Inertia' which is described later on, and how it's compared to the dull and drab games which are churned out by their bucketloads with zero imagination today. Okay, that's a bit OTT, but not enough for me to feel a bit depressed about the situation.

    --
    Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
  35. X-COM by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    If they made the original X-COM with new graphics BUT with the old game play it would still kick the ass of 95% of the Black Ops-Uncharted-Battlefied-Halo shit out there.

    1. Re:X-COM by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      1. Start with OpenXCOM
      2. Make new graphics
      3. ???
      4. Profit!
  36. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by al0ha · · Score: 1

    True That Tempest. That and the fact that no video game since has been as challenging; period. Tempest rules them all!

    Tempest, while it had basic graphics, was a fast kick-ass game, you had to be one bad mo'foing potentiometer master which super brain to hand reflexes to rule at that game.

    --
    Did you ever wake up in the morning, with a Zombie Woof behind your eyes? -- FZ
  37. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yeah, but you can't duplicate the feeling of realizing that Centipede was going to take waaaay too many quarters to master.

  38. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by greg1104 · · Score: 1

    Actually, just by keeping me away from real work I'm quite sure that playing Centipede costs me far more per hour spent trying to master it now than I used to spend in quarters. Once you get decent, a game of that will easily last 5 or more minutes. That's $3 an hour of playtime. I lose a lot more than that when I blow off my job to play with MAME nowadays.

  39. Re:balls by Dr+Herbert+West · · Score: 1

    Mod parent up, please. Direct and to the point.

  40. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by Tehrasha · · Score: 1

    I have yet to find a good spinner for playing Tempest with MAME. The optics in converted mice cannot handle the speed required, compared to the dedicated hardware of the arcade cabinet.

  41. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by Tehrasha · · Score: 1

    Nothing compares to the hell of replicating/emulating the 49-position optical joystick used in Sinistar.

  42. Quite false. by Kaz+Kylheku · · Score: 1

    Playing the real Lode Runner on a decent Apple II emulator is pretty much exactly the same to me.

    I got sucked into it again a few months ago.

    You can't blame poor classic game re-makes on irrelevant changes in life. They do actually suck, inherently.

    1. Re:Quite false. by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 1

      Lode Runner and Championship Lode Runner are gems. Hell, almost everything by BrÃderbund, such as Wings of Fury, or Spare Change are still fun games today.

      Sadly, I still can't find a decent "remake" of Aquatron, or Gemstone Warrior ;-(

  43. 360 D-pad sucks by tepples · · Score: 1

    We have better CPUs, better graphical capabilities, controllers, etc. Let's use them.

    We don't necessarily have better controllers. The directional pad on even a worn Nintendo Entertainment System controller is far more precise than the miserable failure of a directional pad on an Xbox 360 controller.

    1. Re:360 D-pad sucks by RyuuzakiTetsuya · · Score: 1

      Funny, my PS3's DPad works just fine.

      (BTW, Microsoft responded to that letter with the pro controller. Last time this happened, 2nd gen controller sucks, was the 5200. I hope Microsoft's listening.)

      --
      Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
    2. Re:360 D-pad sucks by tepples · · Score: 1

      Funny, my PS3's DPad works just fine.

      An Xbox 360 controller works out of the box on most PCs. As I understand it, a PS3 controller needs a special driver, and according to this article (found via Google ps3 windows 64-bit), your PC has to be connected to the Internet every time you plug in the controller. If you were referring to the use of a PS3 controller with a PS3 console to play PS3 games, I'll address that after Sony's TPR web site comes back online.

      BTW, Microsoft responded to that letter with the pro controller.

      I've read articles claiming that Microsoft was making a pro controller, but I never ended up seeing any pro controllers in Walmart. Nor do any of the top ten results from Google xbox 360 pro controller appear relevant.

    3. Re:360 D-pad sucks by spire3661 · · Score: 1

      It most certainly does not work 'out of the box' You have to buy a special USB dongle receiver for $20 to get it to work on PC. And to be fair, Sony has never supported their game pad being on PC, even if it is using bluetooth.

      If you have to connect to the net everytime to use the controller thats a driver/software implementation issue imposed by a 3rd party.

      IM sure this http://www.pcworld.com/article/204614/microsofts_xbox_360_dpad_update_something_old_something_new.html is the xbox 360 'pro' version in question.

      --
      Good-bye
    4. Re:360 D-pad sucks by RyuuzakiTetsuya · · Score: 1

      I don't know about windows but throwing my six axis on my Mac via usb and hitting the ps button pairs them together via Bluetooth.

      --
      Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
    5. Re:360 D-pad sucks by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      It most certainly does not work 'out of the box' You have to buy a special USB dongle receiver for $20 to get it to work on PC. And to be fair, Sony has never supported their game pad being on PC, even if it is using bluetooth.
       

      That's if you want to play wireless. I picked up a wired controller for cheap and it works just fine. Eventually I relented and picked up the $20 receiver because well, cords suck.

      I like it because it's a nice gamepad to begin with - I even have a Xbox360-to-PS3 adapter so I could use the same wired controller with the PS3. I find the PS3 controller cramps my hand after a few minutes.

  44. Ultima IV is still awesome by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I played Ultima IV all the way through recently, not having been able to finish it in college. It was still totally awesome. Actually it was even better, since the emulator let me save snapshots -- that way if I died horribly I could reclaim my game. I think I didn't finish it before because without that, it would have been wayyy too much of a time commitment.

  45. Xbox 360 gamepad has two sticks by tepples · · Score: 1

    Missile Command can't be played correctly without a big trackball

    I've tried to make Missile Command work with a directional pad. Did I fail?

    Battlezone can't be played without the two sticks that mirror real-life tracked vehicle driving

    Na naa, na na na na na na na na Katamari Damacy! (That's Japanese for "every console since 2000 has two sticks.") Plug your Xbox 360 controller into your PC's USB port, map the axes, and you're set.

  46. Dude, nobody could beat Labyrinth Zone by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Seriously, has anyone ever gotten past that level without emulation and savestates? And where I'm from, the one console and a copy of Sonic 1 was the only video game we had.

    1. Re:Dude, nobody could beat Labyrinth Zone by CelticWhisper · · Score: 1

      I did. Took me forever to figure out that you had to press the jump button to break the poles Sonic holds onto in the current tunnels, otherwise you'd drown every time. Also took me forever to figure out that you didn't have to actually beat Robotnik in that level, just make it to the top of the pit.

      Those designers were goddamn sadists.

      Now, did anyone actually beat "Aliens" for C64 all the way through from beginning to end without using the RunStop-Esc command? I only ever beat the air-duct maze once and died at the "rescue Newt" level after it.

      --
      Help protect civil rights from abuse by the TSA - visit TSA News Blog.
      http://www.tsanewsblog.com
  47. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I was by far the best at Spy Hunter, and could play it for as long as I wanted to on one quarter.

    Do you remember your best score by any chance? The acknowledged record is just over 9 million done over approximately 11 hours.

  48. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    True That Tempest. That and the fact that no video game since has been as challenging; period. Tempest rules them all!

    Tempest, while it had basic graphics, was a fast kick-ass game, you had to be one bad mo'foing potentiometer master which super brain to hand reflexes to rule at that game.

    Eh, no. Tempest was relatively easy compared to Sinistar, which will kick most anyone in the nuts.

  49. Pokemon FireRed and LeafGreen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    was quite excellent

  50. Rebuttal in 5 Words: New Super Mario Bros Wii by UriahZ · · Score: 2

    Seriously, that game is exactly the game we all remembered, except better, and with epicly fun co-op.

  51. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by PRMan · · Score: 1

    That's why I have an arcade trackball.

    --
    Peter predicted that you would "deliberately forget" creation 2000 years ago...
  52. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Run Coward Run

  53. Goldeneye64 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Goldeneye64 is still as fun as it once was, actually more now.

    Now i can play it wihout fear that my mom comes upstairs and screams at me that i should LEARN and not play "Killergames" (she is 8000 miles away now Haha)

    We all grow up become disapointed old grumpy People. At one point i looked in the mirror and sayd. FU*K THAT!" go out and baught a N64^^ Still have a great time with it.

  54. Games are fun :D by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Cheers for the comments - the reason that games were so good is not just that you were younger, but that the games were remarkably well made with excellent design, visuals and controls.

    When I play classic games on the original hardware, it is almost always a great experience; the low-resolution graphics are often beautifully drawn and show up nicely on a CRT, the controls are comfortable and responsive, and I am struck at how great a job the designers and developers did with incredibly meager resources. Some of the games are also shockingly hard! But most importantly, it seems as if the overall system design - graphical display, sounds, control, feedback and physical affordance - is much more tightly calibrated than on modern console games.

    Part of the high difficulty and quality of classic games may be the arcade heritage, where a game had to be hard enough to make you keep losing, but rewarding enough to make you keep p(l)aying. And as others have mentioned, arcade machines also competed against each other with specialized, high-quality controllers (joysticks, paddles, trackballs, multiple buttons, pedals, you name it) which still work pretty well, since humans haven't changed that much.

  55. The Apprentice? by Darth+Hamsy · · Score: 1

    What's wrong with the Apprentice? More entertaining than -most- TV shows around now.

  56. Re:balls by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

    Well I'd say that Yahtzee over at Zero Punctuation nailed it when he described the difference between a GOOD remake and a shit one. He said a good remake or sequel should simply use the source material as a jumping off point while adding new direction or new experiences, while a shit one only wallows in the source material, simply rehashing what has already been done.

    Like the new Duke Nukem which my oldest had to pick up simply because he was a fan and REALLY wanted it to be good. I told him he's a college man if he wants to waste his money that was his business and sadly watching him and giving it a spin what a waste it was. It reminded me of those piles of shit "movies" like disaster movie and epic movie where they think simply pointing something out is equal to a joke while completely missing the point of parody. It especially hurt to have Duke make a joke about Halo power armor when he was doing the same shit with only being able to carry two weapons (WTF?) and having regenerating health.

    Now compare this to a remake I though was decent, King's Bounty. There they updated the graphics, gave new spells and abilities, gave the character more choices in which way they progress, all while still keeping the core gameplay. While I'm sure turn based strategy is a niche many don't like I thought they pulled that update off quite well.

    So I'd say it can be done, you simply have to know the core of the source material you are working with and have good ideas on where to go with it. Which is why I still don't get how they could fuck up DNF so badly, hell you can't get easier to write than a new Duke game!

    All they would have had to do is have a decent writer come up with good action hero one liners, allow him to carry more weapons than a tank, preferably with NO reload so you have the action movie cliche of firing 40 rounds from a 6 round gun, an environment with lots of things to blow up and explore, lots of titties and cheap sexist jokes, and at the end of a level an insane boss where Duke blows the living shit out of the place before walking away while lighting his cigar and spouting a smart ass remark, like say impaling a boss on a giant spike and then saying "I guess he got the point!" and just to add the delicious icing an authority figure bitching to Duke about all the shit he blew up followed by someone saying "I'm too old for this shit".

    So you can take a classic game and make something wonderful, just look at Half Life II, but you have to know what you are doing and not just phone it in. Sadly most companies get a hold of a classic franchise and look at it as a license to put out shit and get the nostalgia dollar and that just ruins it for everyone. After playing 30 minutes of DNF I had to dig out my old Duke shareware and the high res texture pack just to wash the crappy gameplay from my mind and remember what I loved about the game. that is NOT the reaction one should invoke!

    --
    ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
  57. Re:Tempest, Battlezone, Missile Command are the wo by Amarantine · · Score: 1

    I am not afiliated with them in any way, but have you tried www.ultimarc.com? They sell all kinds of controllers and interfaces for the DIY arcade cabinet. I only bought two sticks and a dozen of buttons from them for a cabinet i built for my employer's cantina at the time, so i have no experience on the spinners they sell, but perhaps it's worth checking out.
    I still plan on building a home console (atom or i3 based) with a self-built retro-looking controller, for my kids to experience the games i played yesteryear.

  58. Except... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I agree with the sentiment mostly. Except for Street Fighter 4. 20 years later and I can play street fighter on a telly way bigger than any arcade on an arcade quality joystick against random people elsewhere on the planet, some of who can wipe the floor with me... To 13 year old me that would be pure make belief!

  59. Space Quest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I still have nightmares thinking about the 8 pixel squggly monster Roger Wilco encountered in the caves of Space Quest 1. Some how it wouldn't be quite so horrific in 1080p.

  60. Civilization 2. by crhylove · · Score: 1

    I disagree with many of the comments on this thread. Some of the older games were just massively better.

    My favorite example: Civ 2.

    I've played every version of Civ out, the clones, the latest versions... None of them hold a candle to Civ 2. And it's not some nostalgia, and it's definitely not the graphics. IT'S THE GAMEPLAY. And this is true for nearly every classic game.

    Civ 2 though is the most profound example. Compared to Civ 2 most of the civs since released (and yes including civ 4 and 5) are just not all that fun. I'd really like to see Civ 2 redone with identical gameplay and modern graphics.

    --
    I hold very few opinions. I hold information based on observation and fact. If you wish to disagree, please use facts.
  61. How to remake a classic by Kevin+Fishburne · · Score: 1

    Most new games using classic IP, IMHO, are pure shit from a classic gamer's perspective. Not that the games themselves are necessarily bad, but they have little business using the classic IP other than to capitalize on its brand recognition. I say this because in almost every instance the fundamental joys of the classic are lost in the modern incarnation. Compare Castlevanias 1-4 and SotN with any of the 3D Castlevania games to see what I'm talking about. It's often an issue of 2D gameplay translating horribly, if not completely differently, into 3D gameplay, but also of a completely different dev team trying to make a completely different game with some obligatory references to the classic in an empty nod to us old timers.

    One of the reasons this occurs is because classic gamers are an aging breed, getting smaller by the day. The industry has grown so much and now includes vastly different and more diverse types of gamers. Most of them don't understand the essence of gameplay, of boiling it down to the basics, and just want great eye candy and a cinematic experience. Most classic games were nothing -but- gameplay with shitty graphics so you could see what was going on. Now it's largely the opposite. I recently bought a used Nintendo Wii and softmodded it, then proceeded to hit up the torrent sites for about 150 games. If you want a perfect example of a viable sequel to a real classic, play Punch-Out!! for the Wii. Out-fucking-standing. All it's missing is Mike Tyson, but I guess Nintendo isn't too fond of putting rapists in their games these days.

    --
    Buy your next Linux PC at eightvirtues.com
  62. The "switch" key by mgiuca · · Score: 1

    I've played a lot of video game remakes. I'm really a fan of the concept. I love playing old games with a facelift. But I don't consider them to be a replacement of the original, but a new experience. For example, in 2000 they made a fully 3D version of Myst called realMyst. I think it's wonderful (and it even has bonus content), but I still play Myst equally as much as realMyst.

    Now here's the key to enjoying the original and the remake -- the "switch" key that LucasArts implemented in the Secret of Monkey Island and Monkey Island 2 special editions. With one keystroke, you can flick between a precise replica of the original game (with the original graphics, music and user interface) and the modern remake version. It's quite fun to periodically switch between the two modes to see the differences.

    Does anybody know of another remake that does this? (Pre-2009?)

    1. Re:The "switch" key by omnichad · · Score: 1

      I wish I could FIND RealMyst to buy it. I only have the demo, and they stopped selling it before I had the money to buy. It's $50+ everywhere I look.

    2. Re:The "switch" key by frost_knight · · Score: 1

      It's available on gog.com for $5.99.

      --
      It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's Law. --Hofstadter's Law
  63. Breaking News! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That second snort of coke and that third injection of heroin don't feel as good as the first! Why? Because you are not identical to yourself yesterday.