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Open Radeon 3D Driver Runs At 60~70% of Proprietary Driver Speed
An anonymous reader writes "AMD's Radeon HD 6000 series open-source Gallium3D driver for Linux is now working and running at 60~70% (in some cases, 80%) of the speed of the official proprietary 'Catalyst' driver. This is a big speed improvement in Mesa/Gallium3D compared to the times when the performance was crippling or even just a few years ago when AMD didn't support open-source drivers. When will NVIDIA change ways?"
Why change when their driver runs at 100% of it's speed?
...it's only advantage is being Open?
I can see how many people may not see a great cost/benefits ratio there...
My book: Friendly F#, fun with game development and XNA; my game: Galaxy Wars by VSTeam; my gamedev language: Casanova.
Remember, it's Phoronix.
Yet Another Tech Blog
(but so much more, including game and movie reviews)
http://yanteb.peasantoid.org
That's just great! I have 3 PCs, 2 of them with Radeon and it was like having a 15-year-old graphics cards because of the slow open source drivers for gnu/linux. Things are gonna change now. ;)
You get what you pay for.
I have CAD at home on Linux (Draftsight for 2D and Varicad (It's Linux native!!) for 3D), and there's no substitute for the Catalyst driver. The free drivers don't cut it. They may cut it for generic desktop stuff like playing video and spinning desktop cubes, but somehow combining the free driver and any CAD package gets you a very slow experience.
Until performance really does reach 80 percent, I'm gonna have to stick with the proprietary one. And since this is only for the 6000 series and not the 4000 series (my card), I'm just gonna have to forget about it until I get new hardware.
Hands up if you've ever had to call the ATI BBS in Peterborough, ON back in the day to get the driver of the week for Mach32 on any system.
By the way, if you want free 2D Cad for Linux, get your ass over to Dassault Systems and download Draftsight.
--
BMO
It's not like you're going to be doing alot of gameing on those machines. So honestly. who gives a shit if it's not at 100% of its speed...
Oh right. delusional geeks. carry on.
The nvidia-glx package has been broken for a week or two in Debian wheezy, and the nouveau driver makes my GPU fan spin as if I was trying to calculate a trillion decimals for pi. Result: I am booting Windows XP right now. Guess who's going to be buying ATI next time he replaces his computer?
Dammit I do not know - but it is not going to be soon; how could they opensource it and prevent disclosing secrets to their competitors at the same time?
The three laws of thermodynamics:(1) You can't win. (2) You can't break even. (3) You can't even quit.
ATI proprietary driver for linux, at least the Radeon 5x mobile whatever that is in laptops is utter FAIL.
.png objects, a chat window that can roll dice... with the ATI Catalyst driver , once the map got bigger, it didn't bother to redraw screen in places, leading to new messages in chat being hard to notice without constantly messing with the window and corruption of graphics elsewhere...
Yeah, it has nice fast performance of glxgears, but that's about it. All the games i have played with an NVIDIA card under WINE, like World of Tanks, and Starcraft II... they become either unplayable due to texture corruption, or outright crash when executing.
The second it was a hell to install simply due to failure to render the fancy installation graphics.
Well, that'd have been somewhat bearable, only non-native apps... but , MapTool , the program i use for DnD sessions... nothing fancy , just a map with a bunch of simple
The opensource one for this series was slow as hell, (tenth of performance) and somewhat buggy too, but at least the above program worked.
somehow combining the free driver and any CAD package gets you a very slow experience
Not quite true for me: Maya and Blender work fine. In fact, Maya is noticeably faster that it is on Windows 7 on the same machine, and I have taken no special steps to make it faster on Linux. I am using the laziest Linux distribution there is (Wubi Ubuntu, click click click until you have a working OS)
Minecraft is faster and more solid too (not exactly a CAD, but it uses GPUs if I am not mistaken)
The three laws of thermodynamics:(1) You can't win. (2) You can't break even. (3) You can't even quit.
I'm sure there are still plenty of problems but the charts show FPS in excess of 50... even going much higher. Erm...eyes can detect something like 20FPS right? But we really need more to get the smooth experience? But shouldn't this be already "good enough" to use then?
Give 60~70% of all games released over the past 8 years native Linux support and maybe, MAYBE some of us will give a damn.
You're right, the current open drivers do not cut it, by far. But the ones mentioned in the article are not included yet in any major distro, do look for them in the next Ubuntu. As for your 4000 series card, it's probably time to upgrade to 6000 ... I just did for playing wine games and the difference between the two is pretty incredible.
For games, I will stick with the closed driver until the open one is just as good or better. AMD has promised to make the open driver have the same development cycle as the closed one for the 8000 series cards. Since they promised some years back to help the OSS guys build a driver, and have delivered on that promise, I'm optimistic this will happen.
At that point we should see the performance of the open driver be just as good as the closed one, with the advantage of more testing : better stability and security. It could even surpass the performance of the closed driver.
Good move on AMD's part, and I will be continuing to support their video hardware. Now if only they would release a CPU I actually want ...
Maya and Blender both are not CAD.
And Minecraft certainly isn't.
There's something about CAD that drives the free drivers over the edge.
Like I said, in some situations, the free driver is certainly enough.
I consider the driver as part of the card. I can't modify the card itself, and it doesn't bother me that I can't go mess around in the proprietary driver changing things around. In an ideal world, self help for fixing proprietary drivers would happen, but both ATI and Nvidia think that keeping features locked away is a competitive advantage because it keeps "the other guy" from copying hardware or such.
--
BMO
Maya and Blender both are not CAD
CAD = Computer Aided Design, right? Am I missing something here?
keeping features locked away is a competitive advantage because it keeps "the other guy" from copying hardware or such.
I could not agree more (see my post further below)
The three laws of thermodynamics:(1) You can't win. (2) You can't break even. (3) You can't even quit.
>CAD = Computer Aided Design, right? Am I missing something here?
Yes.
--
BMO
Open source is more than just a development model. Open source means that a program integrates cleanly and correctly with my linux system. Everything from packaging, to installation, to file placement, startup -- open source software follows the rules on open source operating systems.
Proprietary software on an open source operating system is ugly. It blatantly disregards the rules regarding file placement, installation, and just about everything else. It's a situation where the nightmare of windows third-party software comes to linux, where every single program does things differently in order to stand out for marketing purposes, or DRM purposes, or just plain arbitrary convention. Here we have a perfectly uniform system, every package correctly installed and in its place, able to uninstall any package clean and trust that every last file was removed, the beauty of the linux filesystem standard intact. And then comes the black sheep, the proprietary video driver, installing itself to the root directory, using filenames with spaces and caps, demanding special exceptions to proven security standards, a custom hack of an install script that pukes all over the filesystem -- you get the picture.
That's why I use the open source driver. I don't need blistering 3D acceleration, so why wouldn't I free myself from the proprietary ball and chain for the benefit of a clean system?
How many FPS do you get with an abandoned propriatory driver? I.e. how many FPS are you getting with your ATI Radeon from 2001 on your Windows 7 box?
Nil.
Same for Linux and the latest stable/packaged 2.6 kernel for the propriatory driver.
But the open driver gets infinitely times as many FPS on the same hardware and OS combination.
Because there IS a driver.
The NVIDIA closed source drivers are miles ahead of ATI's closed source drivers as well as the open source drivers. NVIDIA cards are capable of decoding HD content in Linux while my four year old ATI card still only gets about 3 seconds per frame for 720p files with either driver. Also, the open and closed ATI drivers are buggy as hell, especially when running dual monitors. I bought an ATI card over NVIDIA because ATI released the documentation for their hardware, but unless there is significant progress on the open source drivers in the near future (especially in video decoding), then my next card will be NVIDIA.
You *really* didnt just make a comparison between CAD software..
And Mindcraft.......
-- I'm the root of all that's evil, but you can call me cookie..
While you are correct, you are not informative... Chill dude, stop being elitist and give the guy a break, he doesn't know.
For the GP: Basically CAD is used for design that will generally end up in a real world object. You can design for example a fancy box or even a desk/chair/house/skyscraper and then from your printouts (including the precise measurements) make the real thing. While you could do this in Blender, it is the wrong tool for the job. They're designed for modeling the real world not making something from scratch. Basically in Blender, you want something that looks like the real thing. In CAD, you want something that will help you build the real thing. They don't allow (easily anyway) the sort of precise pedantic precision you need for CAD. I have used both and I do know the difference, even if it is a little subtle. Never used maya, but I doubt it counts as CAD.
I have determined that my sig is indeterminate.
This is probably a lot more to do with the fact that Maya performs faster on Linux, than it being a noticeable performance improvement related to the graphics driver. Its not the only app where this is the case, Houdini is also a tad faster on Linux than it is on windows. Linux is.. well... faster on the whole isn't it ? This may also probably the case for minecraft too. Also, I don't think Maya officially supports ATi cards, just saying that cos YMMV depending on the generation of ATi card too. Basically, there are too many vagaries to make anything approaching a meaningful comparison here. The only thing to do would be to run graphics based benchmarks on both platforms, assuming that the benchmarks are coded in the same way too of course. But they've already done that, hence the % figures in this articles title. As for the argument that CAD applications give the graphics cards more work, I really don't see how thats the case, a 3D viewport is just a 3D viewport after all. However, yeah, the processing in the backend to maintain the surfaces accuracy (is the term Type A surfaces ?), yep, thats a lot more hardcore than it is for 3D animation/modelling/rendering applications. But, and I'm interested to know if this if its wrong and someonecan explain it to me, drawing the 3D representation on screen isn't any much more of an effort for a CAD app than it is for something like Maya.
Maya and Blender are both focused on artwork.
CAD programs are focused on design for manufacturing.
That means CAD stuff is frequently working on B-reps instead of polygon meshes, 2D elements such as lines and points are much more common, everything is in an orthogonal projection rather than a perspective, and everything will be heavy on geometry with very little texturing.
If the folks working on the drivers are focused more on artwork and/or games, it's not surprising that the type of rendering CAD does would go quite a bit slower.
As long as they PROVIDE the driver, I don't care either. The whole free driver thing started because they didn't provide, and we didn't have a choice. Either you hacked a driver together, or you were SOL.
Today, companies do much better.
I8-D
"Official" drivers work 100% on my Windows box.... *runs*
Yes, you really are I'm afraid.
You just said the equivalent of "Powerpoint is good enough for DTP right, so why worry about slowness in InDesign?"
Although that's not fair, actually, since Blender and Maya are actually pretty powerful in their own forte, but they're simply not CAD.
Because 3D horsepower is only used for games, right?
Don't you have homework to do before you're allowed computer time?
When will NVIDIA change ways?
When the open AMD driver gets to at least 100% of the proprietary driver's speed in ALL cases, AND when AMD's sales start jumping up because of it, AND when Ubuntu decides to stop making it easy to install the Nvidia proprietary driver*. In other words, when they have a market reason to change ways and when competition is threatening to creep up on them if they don't.
Wow, that was easy enough. Next question?
*: Face facts, among Linux users who are going to want to use high-end video cards, the vast majority will use Ubuntu.
Demanding constant attention will only lead to attention.
Well, Blender has been used to make models for 3D printing. Does that count as Computer Assisted Design? Maybe we're not at that stage yet, but Blender has been used to create architectural designs.
While I was dickish, I have neither the time nor the ability to even begin pointing out the differences between working in CAD to design something and "using a program that looks like CAD to design something."
The reference by the other person in this thread to Minecraft was insulting, frankly.
Just because you're working in 3D doesn't mean what you're doing is CAD.
I'm also going to go out on a limb here and say that Maya and Blender, while resembling parametric solid modeling to the casual user, aren't.
If this sounds elitist, then so be it. CAD is for stuff that eventually becomes physical. Accurate representation is /everything/.
--
BMO
The vast (VAST) majority of 3d use is games.
Second would be 3d modeling. And why the hell are you trying to do that on consumer grade hardware anyway?
Unless you're NOT serious. NOT funded. And are just fucking around. (Something that can apply to most *nix users, they all want the professional support for their fucking around hobby.)
Spending any time to squeeze out the last bits of preformance out of already obsolete commercial hardware for your hobby/enthusiast needs is a waste of time and money for everyone involved. Including you.
ATI cards have traditionally been better at video and dual head than 3d. Nvidia, traditionally, has been the exact opposite. Open source also drivers get a lot more attention to 2d graphics than proprietary drivers though, as everyone benchmarks and buys based on 3d performance.
---------- Open Source is capitalism applied to IP.
I said
>Accurate representation is /everything/.
I can't leave it at that.
CAD is also used to generate code for machining in post-processing. If i do not have a really accurate model, I'm not going to have parts that come out to the tolerances I want.
How accurate are the surfaces generated by Blender or Maya? Do they even close? For film and graphics and such, this doesn't matter. Nobody's going to care. A milling machine or lathe with garbage code from garbage surfaces, is going to give you garbage parts.
--
BMO
I understand the benefit of having a FOSS driver, but why would anyone in their right mind buy a $300-500 video card, then cripple the shit out of it by using the FOSS driver when their exists a proprietary driver that will give you 100% of the card's potential performance? It seems to me that instead of targeting the top-of-the-line GPUs, the Gallium3D project should be targeting the older GPU's that are more at risk of fading into obscurity. Yeah it's great they they can get the cutting-edge GPU's working, but it seems to be it would be better time spent working on better GPU support from the older cards that either are, or are soon-to-be unsupported by AMD.
Mommy told you to play nice.
And who said I ran 3D graphics hardware on Linux? My only Linux machine is an old G4 Powerbook.
Oh right, you thought I was "personally defending" myself or something, rather than just participating in a discussion. Ah, to be that narrow minded again! Simpler times!
That totally depends on who buys NVIDIA after Intel and AMD squeeze them to death. At that point, the answer could be anywhen between "immediately after that" and "never."
As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
Maybe open source software is just naturally inferior to proprietary?
That almost doesn't suck.
Point taken...
Cad programs typically use double precision coordinates. Maya/Blender use single. Most video cards doubles run at 1/4 speed of single precision numbers even with the proprietary drivers. Fermi based Quatros being the only exception I am aware of. I wouldn't be surprised if the free drivers were worse than that.
Cad is the only area where this particularly is a big issue (unless you count games with really big world sizes).
Maya & Blender are considerably more than generic desktop stuff however.
Why aren't you going to be doing any gaming? Because there aren't many games that are made to run well on Linux. And why is that? Because the graphics stack sucks for 3D. It's a circular argument that has allowed the state of Linux graphics to continue to lag behind embarrassingly. I can't see how ATI being committed to improving their Linux drivers is anything other than a good thing?
Fair enough. I wasn't suggesting you give him a full course(and my explanation wasn't intended to be complete either), but maybe rather than a simple "yes" a bit of "well here is something to get you started on understanding the difference..." might have been helpful to the poster...
I have determined that my sig is indeterminate.
So what did you use a few years ago, when your 2D and 3D acceleration were slower than the open drivers are today?
will never open up fully. And Microsoft will by up their IP at the fire sale to fuck over Linux just a bit more.
By the way, if you want free 2D Cad for Linux, get your ass over to Dassault Systems and download Draftsight.
I'm logging in and commenting for the first time in years to say thank you for sharing this information. I've been dying to find a decent CAD package for Linux.
but when I saw the headline say that it was 60 - 70% of the proprietary driver, my first reaction was to wonder why it was so slow...
The problem with your statement bubba is the fact that I just bought a replacement system in March that includes an HD4220 Radeon IGP with no PCIe Video Card Slot. This is a business system so upgradeability is limited. As a small business owner, I'm not willing to replace a working system for at least 5 years as the IGP is sufficient to handle the Win7 Aero Needs and such with reasonable performance. Keep in mind this system was not bought for Gaming/Fun. It's a Business machine, thus makes money.
Mod me up/Mod me down: I wont frown as I've no crown
He's drawing a distinction between CAD-CAM products and CAD-rendering products.
Presumably he works with CAD-CAM stuff.
Speed is cool, but improved stability would be even better. Right now the large amount of crashes have lead the chromium team the to disable webgl on all linux machines with ATI cards. Here is their bug report
http://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=73910
Hey I know some of the guys at Phoronix, and they began over on Linuxgames.Com. They're wholesome to report the abilities of their hardware as used on Linux comparisons.
Going back to the Benchmarks, did any of you actually read the article? The Gallium3D drivers outperformed the proprietary drivers in a couple tests, such as with V-Drift ( http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_hd6000_open&num=5 ). That's worth noting that something even in the Catalyst drivers is simply not up to par after all these years despite barely keeping above par with open source ( http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_hd6000_open&num=4 ).
I raise your grains of salt with my assalted beachfront property in Afghanistan, brought to you by The Weather Channel (the initial donators for ATI Radeon open source DRI driver development in XFree that POWERS the green-screen of their weather-tracker on Television).
Yes. CAD typically implies some sort of engineering drawings. Not modeling (which is what I think Maya and Blender are for).
when you write software/drivers you cant expect the first, second or even third version to be perfect. you make it work and then you optimize it. this is the same way the proprietary drivers started out.
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
Careful guys...
It might have rabies!!!
"City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
You seem to be using English words, but what your saying bears no resemblance to reality.
AHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Loser!!!
"City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
"!!!resoL AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA .ytilaer ot ecnalbmeser on sraeb gniyas ruoy tahw tub ,sdrow hsilgnE gnisu eb ot mees uoY" - by cbiltcliffe (186293)ANOTHER "ne'er-do-well" /. OFF-TOPIC TROLL who has nothing but trolling & adhominem attacks left after being thrashed by APK on Friday July 15, @05:27PM (#36780360) Homepage
"???"
Uhm... Could we get a translation of that off-topic "troll-speak/trolllanguage" of yours, please?
* Is THAT the "best you've got" troll? Because you surely didn't do to well in the next 2 links below... now did you? Nope... lol!
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36776728
or here
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36777198
"Run, Forrest... RUN!!!
LMAO!
APK
P.S.=> Yes, it must have just have been another off-topic done nothing of significance with his life troll spewing his off-topic b.s. again & not contributing to the ongoing conversations. Oh well - No biggie!
("ReVeRsE-PsYcHoLoGy", for trolls - Courtesy of this code by "yours truly" in less than 1 second flat):
---
#TrollTalkComReversePsychologyKiller.py (Ver #2 by APK)
def reverse(s):
try:
trollstring = ""
for apksays in s:
trollstring = apksays + trollstring
except:
print("error/abend in reverse function")
return trollstring
s = ""
print reverse(s)
try:
s = "Insert whatever 'trollspeak/trolllanguage' gibberish occurs here..."
s = reverse(s)
print(s)
except Exception as e:
print(e)
---
... apk
Everyone can see how soundly you got thrashed here:
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36776728
and then they can watch you "Run Forrest", here too:
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36777198
APK
P.S.=> I love it, lol... so, keep running there, Gump - Your credibility's shot to hell, lol, & you only did it to yourself!
... apk
Oooooh! You can write a program to reverse a text string! I cower from the obvious supremacy of your 1337 programming skillz!!! HAHAHAHA I bet you pulled that off the Internet with Google, because you couldn't even figure it out yourself!
* Is THAT the "best you've got" troll? Because you surely didn't do to well in the next 2 links below... now did you? Nope... lol!
I love how the best you can do is link to your own posts, with my statements cut down and taken out of context, because that's the only way you can twist them to say what you need them to say.
Like when I supposedly "agreed" with you that your method of moving rootkits works. You conveniently left off the part of my statement where I tell the type of rootkit it doesn't work against, because that's the only way a loser like you can feel like you won an argument.
What? Do you just hope that people won't read back in the thread to see what I actually said? Everybody on this board knows your too much of a douche to take anything you say at face value.
HAHAHAHA
Loser!!
"City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
And, I'll continue trashing you w/ UR own words and facts vs. your poor mastery of things computing as is my usual this week vs. yourself which I consolidated here:
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324592&cid=36776760
* Go for it, because you sure "talk big", lol!
(I will enjoy doing it some more based on that which I posted above in the link above, if you don't agree with any of it... simple!)
APK
P.S.=> You say it's "out of context"? I have each link still up in a tab here I took those from... I can show everyone here publicly just how much of a b.s. artist you really are, & it will be FUN to do imo...
... apk
Kill the allegedly indestructable rootkit which was the topic there, & you admitted it yourself my technique does:
"Will it get rid of an MBR rootkit? Yes. Will it get rid of a driver-based rootkit with a discrete .sys file for the driver? Yes." - by cbiltcliffe (186293) on Tuesday July 12, @03:12PM (#36738656) Homepage Journal
Didn't you state that which is quoted above?
That my technique for non-destructively destroying the rootkit portion using Windows installation media (read only) works for non-destructively removing the rootkit portion of this combined rootkit/botnet??
Yes, you did! Period...
(Which means your CD you were "hawking/shilling" there was totally unnecessary! Folks already have tools @ hand for it off of their install media for Windows!)
Partially quoting me is NOT the answer to winning here, cbiltcliffe!
---
"In your paranoid delusions, you made the assumption that I didn't write it myself" - by cbiltcliffe (186293) on Friday July 15, @08:49PM (#36782014) Homepage
Did you or didn't you? I don't recall you ever answering on that note there... in fact, I am almost certain you did not, because I tend to quote you & others point by point, & disprove what you write usually.
Wouldn't matter anyhow - it's unnecessary vs. that rootkit!
It's about as useful in the case of the "allegedly indestructable rootkit" as a third leg is for people, because my technique works to do so non-destructively.
(Which uses proven RC tools in listsvc, disable, & fixmbr does the job already & you admitted it no less, quoted above!)
---
"There you go again, conveniently removing the part where I said it won't work against a rootkit that patches legitimate driver files." - by cbiltcliffe (186293) on Friday July 15, @08:49PM (#36782014) Homepage
Ahem: That wasn't the topic, or the mechanics of the rootkit being discussed there - it was about the mechanics of THE ROOTKIT that was called "indestructable" & it was DESTROYED by me, w/ out destroying a Window setup, & with tools folks already have... AND, you DID admit that my technique for removing it, works, quoted above!
(And, your CD? Again, unnecessary!)
Also, I list a way to remove patched files rootkits too, as well as layering defenses against it in WFP, Group Policies, & even bcedit commandlines too! That's shown in my reply above as well...
(Funny how you "omit" those 2 crucial points here, eh? NOT!)
APK
P.S.=> "Next"... lol! All you had after that was more "adhominem attacks" & what I put up above in response to your partial quote of my words ( Reduced to 'pot calling the kettle black' tactics, are we now on your end??)?
Easily trashes you once more, albeit this time, more publicly... too easily!
... apk
If I were to design and 3d print a fancy paperweight in blender, is this not computer aided design?
Will I really care about tolerances on it when said physical objects only purpose is to look nice and be heavy?
Wholeheartedly agree that blender is ill suited for cad, and you aren't exactly going to design engine parts with it even if you do use it to design things, but to be pedantic it would still be computer aided design so long as something physical with the general properties wished for is made.
If Microsoft produced a driver that ran at less the the speed of a official proprietary 'Catalyst' driver, Slashdot posters would be rolling in the isles laughing and criticizing Microsoft for its failure to produce a quality driver. When the FOSS community does the same thing, it is heralded as the greatest thing since the invention of the wheel. However, as surely as day follows night, a poster(s) did involved Microsoft into the mix. The creed of the FOSS and *.nix/*BSD lovers everywhere, "When in doubt, blame Microsoft". It is easier to blame others than to get off your dead ass and do something constructive to correct a problem.
I will now yield the floor to Anonymous Coward who will thrill us with his vocabulary skills.
Pigskin-Referee
Linux: Yesterday's technology, tomorrow
http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2282088&cid=36621818 with proven tools from a read-only environs of Windows installation media's "RECOVERY CONSOLE" using listsvc, disable, & fixmbr + NON-DESTRUCTIVELY!
(AND, many DAYS before it was though it could even be done @ all, period...)
"I'd suffocate both of you if could. APK is nuts, he has an excuse, what's yours?" - by badkarmadayaccount (1346167) on Saturday July 16, @10:10AM (#36785544) Homepage
I guess then, that'd make ME the "mad scientist" here, but that's ok - they called NIKOLA TESLA (one of my techno-intellectual heroes of all time) that too!
* I'd like to part with some words of wisdom on your comment though:
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society..." - J. Krishnamurti
APK
P.S.=> And, until you have these things to your name/credit:
--
1.) A PHD in the Psychiatric sciences
2.) Years-to-Decades of hands-on/"in-the-trenches" practice doing it
3.) A license to practice psychiatry professionally
4.) A formal examination of myself administered in a professional environs
---
Your actually LIBELING myself, you know... as well as, imo, suffering from your own "delusions of grandeur" in thinking you are capable of judging myself in any way, shape, or form on the grounds of mental health!
... apk
It's not
Your actually LIBELING myself, you know" -by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 16, @12:31PM (#36786614)
* It's correctly phrased & spelled You're in this instance...
(So sorry, my bad, + catching it prior to the spelling nazis here is all!
APK
P.S.=> "Onwards & UPWARDS!" time to go finish BIG cleaning day here... have guests coming in from "out-of-town" & all, soooo, C-YA!
... apk
Funny you avoid disproving what I put down there though: (NOT)
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36776728
and, here as well: (Again, sarcasm -> "NOT")
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36777198
(You're only proving my points for me... by your evasions of them!)
---
So you know - and, you do KNOW this because you put up your immature "mother ship" post...?
I have guests over from out of town, & I haven't the time to deal with you (not as much as I'd like though)
In fact, so you know - One of them's laughing his butt off watching you "Run, Forrest... RUN!!!" in fact...
So, I haven't replied in a couple days now, until now. Just to see what your "reaction" would be, & of course, it's "projecting" what you do onto others, in this case, myself!
Plus, I've caught others here red-handed posting in multiple registered accounts (clone52431/53421 & of course the "infamous MichaelKristopeit" but I think he's just a sock-puppet others victimize here though & he does make some points on those that attack him though).
---
Now, LASTLY:
On to your own "Delusions of Grandeur", lol, @ trying to play The "SiDeWaLk-ShRiNk of /." now:
"Psychology 101 pop quiz time:" - by cbiltcliffe (186293) on Sunday July 17, @01:26PM (#36793616) Homepage
I have a better quiz for you instead!
DO YOU HAVE THESE THINGS TO YOUR NAME/CREDIT:
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1.) A PHD in the Psychiatric sciences?
2.) Years-to-Decades of Professional practice in them??
3.) A license to practice Psychiatry & to make your "snap-prognosis/diagnosis"???
4.) A formal examination of myself administered in a professional environs for doing so????
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No, of course, to ALL of the above for you!
So, "that all said & aside" - who the HELL do you think you are, trying to judge me on the account of mental health then?????
(Get over your OWN "delusions of grandeur" & instead, tell us why you are avoiding the points I put up in my links above after your 1st FAIL attempt @ doing so, shown below?)
APK
P.S.=> HOWEVER - The funniest one was your "1st attempt here" @ doing so, when YOU partially quoted me to TRY to save face, & only blew it once again too (which is doubtless why you avoid those 2 links above & you have since that 1st FAIL attempt on your part, as usual, vs. myself, everytime):
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36782140
This? This was just "too, Too, TOO EASY - just '2EZ'", as per usual, vs. yourself, an admitted jerk (I thought it was funny when others said that to you, so you know)
... apk
Pot calling the kettle black again, Forrest? See here -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2326772&cid=36781858
I also never said it was a "bunch of people" - it's just YOU, using sock-puppet alternate registered accounts & yes, I have caught others red-handed doing it on this website (clone 52431/53421 being one, & of course, "the infamous MichaelKristopeit" being another - but Mike gets attacked constantly, & seems to be merely defending himself @ times is all!)
* Pretty much says it all, & others have told you off repeatedly throughout your threads, posting as anonymous cowards, to avoid your trollish immaturity as well.
APK
P.S.=> LMAO - not ONLY do you have "delusions of grandeur", but also plain old delusions! You see fit to try to play "The SiDeWaLk-ShRiNk @ /.", well, then so can I in return... except I can point out that you accuse of others of what you do, yourself!
... apk
That's all I've ever asked that you do (so I can watch you squirm like the trolling worm you are again) http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36776728
and here:
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36777198
and here:
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36782140
* Do so, point-by-point, & I will just destroy you again on each one...
APK
P.S.=> Funny how you "Run, Forrest - RUN!!! from your own words quoted in those & mine quoted in response to them disproving your b.s. (it's either that, when you tried putting words in my mouth I never even said above ALL else, or you truly have some issues reading like Dyslexia or ADHD/ADD (whatever))
... apk
While I was dickish [..]
Apology accepted; just do not take the next one for granted.
I have neither the time ..
Try spending less time being a smartass- it works fine for me
.. nor the ability
It seems that you do have the ability, and a fine one I might add. You explained what CAD is pretty well, as did others, and now I know.
The three laws of thermodynamics:(1) You can't win. (2) You can't break even. (3) You can't even quit.
1.) Was the topic subject in the article on slashdot about the "indestructible rootkit" where we had our debate?
2.) Did you admit my method works to kill the rootkit portion of the allegedly "unkillable rootkit" in kernel mode both at the driver level & bootsector also??
3.) Does ProcessExplorer also work to kill the malware the botnet portion running in usermode brings in???\\
4.) Did you assume that I use ProcessExplorer &/or TcpView to "detect rootkits"????
5.) Did you also assume that I use ProcessExplorer to destroy rookits?????
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Answer those... & then, I will post what you actually said, yet again, + post my replies to you on points you try to "weasel out of" here... lol, with your "you implied it" (what a crock of shit - I implied NOTHING & explicitly stated what worked on what portion of the combined rootkit/botnet & in what ring of operation (0/kernel mode & 3/usermode)).
* 5 simple questions I feel that you can manage to answer pretty easily, now that I've simply enumerated them for you!
APK
P.S.=> This is where I completely pin you down, & watch you destroy yourself, yet again...
... apk
I'll switch when it is faster or more stable, but until then why limit my hardware?
You *really* didnt just make a comparison [..]
I obviously did not make myself understood; I mentioned Minecraft because it is popular (so many people would have something to say about it), it runs on many platforms (so comparisons between different OSs can be made), and its performance depends on your card and drivers- that last point, by the way, being what this thread is about.
Though I did not intend to mention Minecraft implying that it is CAD software (and apparently offend a bunch), in retrospect, I should point out that there are very many people who use it for art.
The three laws of thermodynamics:(1) You can't win. (2) You can't break even. (3) You can't even quit.
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2324770&cid=36796978
APK
P.S.=> You don't DARE answer, because I'll just tear you apart here publicly yet again, you amateur wannabe (& You KNOW it ( & I know it, + your evasions of 5 simple questions in that link above show everyone else here that much too - easily))
... apk
Why don't they use something more modern like the Unigine benchmark, or a not so ancient game like Enemy Territory Quake Wars?
Because on the state tracker side of things, Mesa/Gallium3d doesn't support as much eye candy as Catalyst.
Gallium3d is slowly entering the world of OpenGL 3.x, whereas the proprietary drivers are at OpenGL 4.1
It will come with time (specially since Google made the opensource Intel drivers jump on the Gallium3d bandwagon), but for now you'll have to be patient.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
but why would anyone in their right mind buy a $300-500 video card, then cripple the shit out of it by using the FOSS driver when their exists a proprietary driver that will give you 100% of the card's potential performance?
When :
- you don't need 100% perf 100% of the time. Some people dual boot into Linux for work and into Windows for games.
- you want to vote with your wallet for a company which actively supports FOSS driver development. Even if you personally won't run the open-source drivers, and end-up for now running the blob, you're still encouraging a hardware maker which supports open-source.
- some time people cycle the hardware between several machine. Today, you'll be getting top of the line performance on your main machine with the catalyst driver. In a couple of years, this card might end-up populating a less important machine in your kitchen. By then, the performance and power-saving would have become better for this card and you'll be happy to have a driver solution which runs perfectly out of the box with Ubuntu Zanny Zebra when AMD have dropped official support from their BLOB.
it seems to be it would be better time spent working on better GPU support from the older cards that either are, or are soon-to-be unsupported by AMD.
- Today top of the line card are tomorrow's older cards. Because back then, when they were top of the line, people *did* work on supporting them in OSS, now the Radeon 9600 to Radeon X1950 generation of cards have a nice working r300g driver, which is also recommended by AMD as the official way to support these older cards.
- The same way, you might complain that it doesn't make absolutely sense right now. But, as written above, in a couple of years down the line, the r600g driver may become the official way to support older Radeon HD cards and you best way to use that HD6000 you still have laying around in some 2nd or 3rd machine.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]