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Study Suggests Magnets Can Force You to Tell the Truth
Estonian researchers claim that magnets can either force you to lie or make it impossible. Subjects in the study had magnets placed at either the left or the right side of the dorsolateral prefrontal cortex, and the results suggest that the individual was either unable to tell the truth or unable to lie depending on which side was stimulated. From the article: "Last year, researchers at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology also used powerful magnets to disrupt the area said to be the brain's 'moral compass,' situated behind the right ear, making people temporarily less moral."
...how do they work?
Just wait until Pistole hears of this.
Quite an experience to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave.
But how do they work?
"magnets to disrupt the area said to be the brain's 'moral compass,' situated behind the right ear, making people temporarily less moral"
Is that why people on cell phones act like assholes?
Must be the pull of the North Pole influencing their moral compass...
...or feel my right arm.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
I doubt it.... sure, you can prevent me from telling a lie...fine. Its no lie at all that I don't want to continue this conversation, and am unwilling to talk any more without a lawyer present. It is also completely true that I wish to remain silent.
"I opened my eyes, and everything went dark again"
I find the claim that they were able to make people unable to tell the truth much more surprising than the one that they were able to make people unable to lie.
While fun and useful, lying is somewhat cognitively demanding: You have to synthesize and deliver a contracfactual statement, you can't just remember it because it didn't happen. There has been some previous speculation that you should be able to detect lying, based on the greater mental effort(and distributed across more brain regions effort) involved, vs. the recall activity required to tell the truth.
That you can knock-out truth-telling(without just inducing aphasia or amnesia temporarily, which is a bit heavy handed) is much more surprising.
Modern neuroscience is killing any wiggle-room that might have remained regarding souls and free will. As I've mentioned before, neuroscientists, ethicists, and legal scholars are concerned that "my brain made me do it" will become a reasonable courtroom defense. (No, I'm not talking about the traditional "insanity defense".)
We will eventually be forced to re-think a lot of cherished beliefs about brains, minds, and behavior.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Note that not being able to lie does not imply not being able to tell anything but the truth. Many people telling wrong things actually believe them.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
Yeah, I find the whole thing a bit dubious. It's not shocking to me that it might be possible to disrupt brain activity in such a way that a particular patient couldn't fabricate certain kinds of lies, but the idea that everyone's brain has a clear "lies on" and "lies off" switch that can be activated with a magnet.
Reading one of TFA:
The volunteers were presented a series of coloured discs, and told they could tell the truth or lie about the objects' colours while half were being stimulated on the left and half on the right.
Results showed that the eight volunteers who had their left DPC stimulated lied more often, while the ones with the right DPC stimulated were more likely to tell the truth, researchers said.
So it sounds like they were given the option of lying about something with no consequences, and they lied more often with one part of the brain stimulated. It doesn't say that it was "impossible" to lie, or even that it made it difficult to lie when strongly motivated to do so. Maybe it didn't directly cause them to be more likely to lie, but made them feel more whimsical or creative and likely to want to lie in a consequence-free environment.
Then there's the much-overlooked difference between "not-lying" and "telling the truth". I can tell you something false because I'm mistaken, because I'm telling you a fictional story, or because I'm over-simplifying. None of those actions are deceptive in nature, but none of them are "telling the truth".
Lying implies knowledge that you are intentional not telling the truth. Truthfully telling incorrect information is called 'a mistake'. sometime also could be 'Making bullshit up so as not to disturb my cognitive dissonance'
And just so people know, this is MRI level magnetic field, not 'Magnets'.
It does seem that people are less likely to lie. More research needed.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Sigh.. It's an MRI level magnetic fields, not 'magnets' so no, you can't do it in your home. Unless you happen to be very wealthy.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
"No mention of how strong a magnet."
You win a prize for asking the correct question.
It is a TMS. so we are talking about a MRI level magnetic fields.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcranial_magnetic_stimulation
here is a slightly better article:
http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21128284.400-powerful-magnets-hamper-our-ability-to-lie.html
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Funny story.
Friend of mine was driving back home from grad school for a short vacation. Got pulled over by some state troopers on the way home. Apparently he was driving a road that is frequented by drug runners from mexico and his little compact car was stuffed to the point of overflowing with random possessions. Trooper asks to search his car. He says no.
Trooper then calls in a K-9 unit after mumbling something to himself, which walks around the car for many minutes without once alarming (barking). Obviously annoyed at this damned citizen who won't let him do what he wants, the trooper then moves my friend behind his police car and goes back to the car with the K-9 trooper. My friend sees them kick the car to get the dog to bark, and the troopers come over and inform him that the dog barking gives them right to search the car. They then spend the next half hour throwing his possessions all over the side of the highway. They found nothing and went on their way.
Moral of the story is - it doesn't matter. The more authority we surrender, the more our 'rights' become meaningless in the face of an overwhelming corporate/government bureaucracy that protects its own rights over yours.
How does it feel to be a liar with pants constantly on fire?
I tried building a gauze rifle, once. It was very fluffy.
psmylie's dictionary: Godzillion (noun) Any number large enough to destroy Tokyo
Ok. That was funny :) Yes I misspelled it. So sorry to the fans.
The next sentence was made with a magnet on my left hemisphere.
The previous sentence was made with a magnet on my right hemisphere.
Which one is tru-WHO GIVES A SHIT I HAVE NO MORALS WARWRWERWARWAAWKLERJA
For those thinking parent's story is just an anecdote and thus not evidence, here's a Chicago Tribune story on some real research into how common this practice is.
I am officially gone from
It sounds about as credible as phrenology, so I'll await confirmation.
But in the meantime, think about the impact this would have on society if there was truly a way (temporary, harmless) to prevent people from lying.
How many marriages would survive?
What would happen if 435 congressmen simultaneously "decided to retire...immediately"?
Would the resulting society even be recognizable?
-Styopa
That's not at all what the study showed/claimed/whatever. People were MORE LIKELY to tell the truth with the magnetic treatment. That's a far cry from force.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Gustav_recoilless_rifle
And you don't have a choice to remain silent since you are not under arrest.
Ummm...I'm not sure that's how it works. IIRC, the 5th Amendment says that the government cannot (well...legally, anyway) compel me to incriminate myself. Whether or not I have been arrested yet, forcing me to answer that I am a terrorist (assuming it's true) would still be incriminating myself. Just because the Miranda rule says that the police have to advise you of your right to remain silent when you are arrested doesn't necessarily mean that you only have that right when you have actually been arrested. Any actual lawyers care to chime in on this?
Don't you just love the "land of the free"!
Well, I did when it actually kind of was...now, not so much.
MCSE? No, sir...I don't do Windows. Yes, I am an idealist. What's your point?
If our courts were at all sincere about protecting Constitutional rights, police would be required to apologize on the spot, put everything back where they found it, and pay for any damages immediately after any search. After all, innocent people should not have their stuff pawed through or damaged and the subject of a search has not been found guilty in a court of law.
It would also take all the fun out of the process and so make it less likely to happen unless actually necessary.