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No PDFs, No Co-editing On Underwhelming Apple iCloud
An anonymous reader writes "Apple's iCloud service has been a little overlooked in the bunfight for the iPhone 4S. When it was first announced some predicted it would wipe out companies like Box.net, DropBox and so on. As the NYTimes put it, "Maybe Apple will kill them all.' Box.net's CEO disagreed and it looks like he was right. You can't store PDFs and images on iCloud except with PhotoStream, there's no co-editing, and the document management interface is a shambles."
Hahahaha. WTF are they thinking?
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
Never in any presentation did apple commit to any of those features.
It's a personal sync service, backup service.
That's it. It's storage somewhere, it's a sync service for your photographs between devices, and in a bit it'll be a music service for yourself.
Never did they say they'd let you directly access it like DropBox. Nothing would stop someone from making a PDF reader that saved and wrote to the iCloud but this last round of Apple products & software updates has created this bizarre 'oh they're doing THIS' line of crap from these analysts and they make up some of the craziest crap.
As a rock-in-roll Physicist once said, No matter where you go, there you are.
iCloud was not meant to address collaborative cloud document working. That functionality was never mentioned or even hinted at. Stupidest article ever.
You're meaning to tell me the first iteration of a service 10's of millions of users will be using on a regular basis was rolled out with a basic feature set?
That should be "bunfight" (an old idiom), not "bumfight" (NTTAWT).
On the other hand, if Apple had positioned iCloud as an app service (eg. Google Apps) or a generic file locker (eg. Dropbox) then everyone would cry foul at how Apple was trying to use its market position with iDevices and Macs to force competitors out of business. (OMGWTFBBQ! Monopoly!! Microsoft!!!1!!)
iCloud = Cross-device media syncing
Google Apps, Office Live = Office apps in the cloud
Dropbox = Network Filesystem for the rest of us
Yes, there's some overlap, but mostly they're separate services. Choice and competition folks; it's a good thing.
This has been among the most useful features provided by MobileMe. Is it still available with iCloud? (CAPTCHA: “reject”)
I'm no expert, but isn't it a framework for both iOS and Mac Apps to use? Out of the box it does very little, except for a few Apple functions that are already taking advantage of it (Safari's "Reading List" for example). But if someone wants to create a PDF editing tool, you just use the iCloud API to store your PDFs. Then the Mac version of the PDF editing tool can access the same file as your iPhone version. Or your iPad can do the same. It's a storage device that apps have access to. It is not a storage device that you will browse for files in. Also, each app will only have access to it's own data.
The interface to the iPhone is via iTunes. I tried to put a pdf on my wife's iPhone for her because she couldn't figure out how and I couldn't figure out how to do it via iTunes either. Finally, a friend with an iPhone told me the easiest way to do it is to email it and use the phone to grab the emailed file. Doesn't Apple think that people use their phones for anything but listening to music and looking at photos? Oh yeah, there are all sorts of apps, but how does anyone who works for a living get business related stuff on and off the phone?
The software is still called iTunes ferschissakes. If you're in anything but the music business why would software called iTunes seem to be the right choice? It sounds like something you'd sell to college kids so they could load their phone with pirated music.
Apple never claimed they were going to offer that stuff.
However, Apple *has* provided an API that provides iOS 5 apps with a cloud-based key-value store that *applications* can use pretty much however they want to. There'll be a lot of interesting iCloud functionality appearing over time, but don't expect stuff like co-editing because that's not what the service is intended for.
Note that I'm currently less than delighted with iCloud however - for such a big deal, flagship, gosh-wow product, for iCloud mail (both via IMAP and the web-based version) to be dead as a doornail less than 24hrs after launch is pretty poor.
...Oh wait. Damn.
Where's a reality distortion field when you need one?
How is this "News for Nerds?" I know I'll get modded down but simply posting articles from some random dude on the Internet really isn't news...
Yah, I think it's meant to be bunfight... but then again it's Apple, and knowing the preferences of their customers, maybe the summary is right.
No co-editing. Less space than Amazon EC2. Lame.
Domains, shared and dedicated hosting, SSL certs, and more: ArrowBay.net
But iCloud is just, it's just, it's Magical!
While I own no Apple products and use none of their services, I find this article to have no content. Why would a competitor praise their service? As a CEO of Box.net, it is his job to say why his service is better than Apple's. We can argue amongst ourselves whether those omissions noted are important for a cloud service or not, but this article has no point.
Steve Jobs isn't even cold and Apple's already going all pear shaped.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Apple: We're coming out with a new product. It's a pill that'll give you surprisingly good night vision.
Apple Zealots and various talking heads: Oh. My. God. The iPill will CURE CANCER.
The Other Zealots and various talking heads: Pssh. Will it make my headaches go away? Will it stop indigestion? I just can't see how anyone would want this where there are so many better pills already on the market.
months pass
Apple: Here it is: The iPill. Take one, and you can have 20/20 vision in the dark for an entire month.
Apple Zealots: Oh. My. God. This is soooo disappointing! And it doesn't even cure cancer! We thought it was going to cure cancer!
Other Zealots: Hah! Oh, Apple's really screwed themselves this time. All this stupid pill does is give you night vision! Big deal--you can get night-vision goggles that can be turned off, are half the price and don't need to be swallowed! You idiots really missed big time on this one!
months pass
Apple: The iPill has sold over ten bajillion units, and we've made more money on it than god raised to the god power. Night vision goggles are now considered obsolete. Soon, we'll release the iPill 2, which will add the ability to see into the ultraviolet spectrum.
Apple Zealots: Yaaaaaay! Finally, a cure for CANCER!
Other Zealots: ARRRGEGHRHRHGA People are such fucking stupid SHEEP
Obliteracy: Words with explosions
Random anonymous readers can basically whine about a non-issue and get a story on /. now?
I've been away for too long. And, clearly, the current /. management wants to make sure I, and other old time readers, stay away.
I think it's time for Taco, Neal, and Hemos to come back and clean house, because this isn't responsible in any way, shape, or form.
A storage/cloud service with crippled functionality by a company with billions of dollars to spend is always mockable, no matter what the vendor promises the customer. Oh, and Jobs is dead, no one with vision to oversee beating and maiming the little chinese children that make your next fashion accessory.
It has documents sync, nowhere in the docco does it mention limitations on file type. You pay for your storage and you store your shit...
Nope. You pay for your applications' storage and your applications store their stuff.
Apple made it *very* clear after the iCloud announcement that iDisk was going away and iCloud wasn't going to provide a comparable interface to let a user store files. While someone could undoubtedly use the iCloud APIs to write an application that lets you store files of your own choosing (i.e. an iDisk-replacement), it's a good bet Apple would refuse to approve the app precisely because it would be an iDisk replacement.
How'd that work out last time? http://slashdot.org/story/01/10/23/1816257/apple-releases-ipod
Looking at the OS X preferences panel for iCloud, it just looks like a rehash of MobileMe (which was just a rehash of .mac). I'm flipping back and forth between the preferences pages for iCloud and for MobileMe, and they seem to offer nearly identical services (though MobileMe costs money).
Even a light reading of the article reveals that iCloud is an impressive service but not targeted at business or enterprise users (shocking), a fact which the OP (who clearly does not like iCloud and/or Apple, in general) noticeably neglects to mention. If Slashdot is a news site, and news should objectively divulge facts, then I have to wonder why such a blatantly slanted article summary has once again been allowed to be posted. If you want me to not like iCloud, just draw attention to the shortcomings of the product, don't paraphrase a reasonable review into "is a shambles".
Anonymous rantings snarkily purveying incorrect information given the dignity of a slashdot posting? "News for nerds"? Or just another gizmodo-like Android fan site? Is it any wonder the number of readers here is plummeting?
I've always feared that the iCloud would get rid of our ability to store arbitrary files of various types.... if you want a file based approach to the world, stick with Dropbox.
Apple is rethinking how people store information. iCloud is most definitely not a file based system. It's a data store where it (Apple) dictates how the data is stored and organized. Communication to the cloud is API only (which Apple controls). Much of the iCloud magic is in the API and, of course, completely transparent to the user. They will find that the "information" created by their apps is seamlessly synced across their iDevices.
So, basically Box.Net's CEO says:
No wifi. Less storage than a Nomad. Lame
Yeah, just sit back and ignore it. We'll come back in a couple years and see how that worked out for you.
/. is really going downhill... Apple never claimed there would be co-editing (or editting AT ALL) on iCloud, and saying it does not allow "PDFs" to be stored is absolutely ridiculous...
There's an API (do ppl still know what that means around here?) that allows you to write an App that makes use of iCloud storage... The service became official YESTERDAY, so it's quite natural that most apps aren't making use of it yet.
So yeah, there WILL BE apps that let you store PDFs and random images that aren't in your library and game saves and whatever else you want...
In fact, I prolly should go write one in 30 min and charge a $ for it, eh? lol
You guys need to review how articles get posted here, seriously...
Ask any butcher and he'll tell you:
You buy a special purpose knife (shaped handle, long blade, slightly curved, thin blade) because it's the right tool for what you're doing (filleting).
Try filleting with a 100 blade swiss army knife and you'll create lousy cuts, wear your hand out holding all that bulk, and likely cut yourself in the process.
So, a specialized service or function generally is optimized for that activity.
Here-
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT4942
2nd question down. I think you need iWork to do it (maybe?) Dang help piece is all over the place.
Don't you just love new stuff?
Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
if you exceed expectations when those expectations were low.
Simple, PDF = Adobe, Apple hates Adobe, hence they don't save PDFs. Probaly corrupts Flash files too
Apple fanboys will still flock to it, and others will start using it because it's "cool" since Apple courts the sort of people who drive what's cool. In the meantime Apple will add the features that everyone wants, cloning from other services as needed, while still locking in every feature they can to their applications. Within a year it will be the only major player.
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
But I also think you're right, it isn't DropBox
...and I've seen people get into a right knot with DropBox when its used as anything more than an alternative to emailing files. Its a great fallback when trying to exchange files that are too big to email, but its not much good for collaborative work.
Creating a sharing/syncing/collaboration service for editable files that won't confuse the hell out of Apple's target non-techie customers is a non-trivial exercise. (Hint: syncing and sharing music/video/books - even emails and, to some extent, photos - is rather easier, because for 90% of users those files are immutable).
In a survey of 100 programmers, 111111 thought that duck-typing was a good idea.
n/t
Geek filth like you are the reason geeks rightly and justifiably get their faces stomped on a daily basis.
Terse answers. Yes, but how is it used? Suppose the Apple ID I use with iCloud is an email address not previously hosted on MobileMe?
You won't be able to understand what it is until you stop trying to think of it as rsync.
I think you captured the state of Apple's relationship with the media and general public perfectly. Bravo! I hope you get 1 million mod points.
"All great wisdom is contained in .signature files"
Exactly. On phones and pads, notice that regular people don't think 'filesystem'. Why should they?
As far as I can tell, that's the most important conceptual change distinguishing a "post-PC" device, not a touchscreen.
Sometime later, say MacOS Liger or something, iCloud will talk to MacOS Finder and then files will be shared in a dropbox, because iCloud will support the natural things that a filesystemish OS does because there's a client for it.
I've looked and looked at Apple's information about iCloud, and no where have I seen any of these features mentioned. iCloud is simply a personal, lightweight backup/sync solution for users. It's not meant to be an enterprise level doc sharing interface. Considering that there were very few solutions available that do what iCloud does before it was introduced, I'd call it a pretty amazing product. There are plenty of enterprise level backup solutions that have the features mentioned in the article. Why would Apple even bother messing with that? What they did makes perfect sense, and it's the perfect product for what it's intended for. Let's also not forget that it's brand new. Features can ALWAYS be added.
We all know where this one's going.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it