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Black Death Discovered In Oregon

redletterdave writes "The Black Death, a strain of bubonic plague that destroyed nearly a third of Europe's entire population between 1347 and 1369, has been found in Oregon. Health officials in Portland have confirmed that a man contracted the plague after getting bitten by a cat. The unidentified man, who is currently in his 50s, had tried to pry a dead mouse from a stray cat's mouth on June 2 when the cat attacked him. Days later, fever and sickness drove the man to check himself into Oregon's St. Charles Medical Center, where he is currently in 'critical condition.'"

87 of 404 comments (clear)

  1. Darwin in action. by Gordonjcp · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why the hell did he think it was a good idea to try to get the dead mouse away from the cat in the first place?

    1. Re:Darwin in action. by TheRealMindChild · · Score: 5, Funny

      It really wasn't a dead mouse. It was a bag of pot he hid under a bush so his wife wouldn't find it. You can't really tell that to the folks at the hospital.

      --

      "When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back!" -- Cave Johnson
    2. Re:Darwin in action. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Because it could be a weakened mouse that has eaten rat poison, and then the cat dies if not treated with vitamin K to stop the internal hemorrhage.
      I've lost several cats because of this issue.

    3. Re:Darwin in action. by Pi+Is+A+Rational · · Score: 5, Funny

      [citation needed]

    4. Re:Darwin in action. by zill · · Score: 2, Funny

      Evolution isn't just about having babies you know. If that were the case, all men would have evolved condom breaking mechanisms already.

    5. Re:Darwin in action. by icebike · · Score: 3, Funny

      Swoosh !

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    6. Re:Darwin in action. by eqisow · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yes, because condoms have totally been around for an evolutionarily significant period of time.

    7. Re:Darwin in action. by Baloroth · · Score: 5, Informative

      The summary specifies it was a stray cat. Who the hell tries to pry open the mouth of a stray cat? You have no idea what kinds of bacteria, viruses, or other nasty infectious things are living in a stray cat's mouth.

      Although we certainly know now.

      --
      "None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
    8. Re:Darwin in action. by Xenx · · Score: 2

      I'm slightly dismayed to not find crude references to already doing so through superior virility.

    9. Re:Darwin in action. by EdIII · · Score: 5, Funny

      That's just like your opinion, man.

    10. Re:Darwin in action. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Except the appropriate onomatopoeia is woosh. A swoosh is the symbol on Nike gear.

    11. Re:Darwin in action. by MrWeelson · · Score: 5, Informative

      You probably mean Arthur C Clarke who many think 'invented' the geosynchronous satellite...or brought it into the public arena.

      No idea if he smoked pot though.

    12. Re:Darwin in action. by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 2

      "Growing Evidence of Football Causing Brain Damage"

      Yes, watching too much football can definitely do damage. Trust me.

    13. Re:Darwin in action. by Prune · · Score: 4, Insightful

      500 years is not evolutionarily significant. Biologically, humans have remained almost unchanged from the early days of civilization 10,000 years ago--just ask any anthropologist.

      --
      "Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason."
    14. Re:Darwin in action. by eqisow · · Score: 2

      I have found a paper on evolutionary rates of change. It calculates an instrinsic rate of evolution of .1 standard deviations per generation. If we call a generation roughly 20 years" we're looking at 25 generations over 500 years. Unless you can provide evidence of a relatively strong selection pressure towards some penis change that makes condoms less effective, I'm going to go ahead and stand by my original claim.

    15. Re:Darwin in action. by Artifakt · · Score: 2

      Seems like evolutionary pressure (h)as been applIed

                You would think so, but it hasn't. Reason it out a little further and I think you'll see why. One thing condoms are useful for is not having babies until you want to. Delaying reproduction isn't the same as not reproducing. Another thing condoms are useful for is avoiding diseases, some of which could make the user permanently infertile. In the long run, condom use could make some users more reproductively successful, not necessarily less. If you're betting there is significant evolutionary pressure, you're betting that there's a lot of people using a temporary method of birth control to permanently curtail reproduction instead of just to time it better, and that disease prevention doesn't offset avoiding reproduction in high risk situations. Neither of these is statistically supported.

                  There's plenty of examples where having just a few offspring and investing lots of resources into raising them beats having lots of offspring who are mostly on their own - in fact the whole mammalian survival strategy is basically "fewer offspring, more care", and mammals as a whole have been a pretty successful class. Condoms are a mammalian sort of idea.

      --
      Who is John Cabal?
    16. Re:Darwin in action. by b4dc0d3r · · Score: 2

      If you are talking about the most recent 500 years, I would argue that advances in medicine and science make the latest 500 years far less significant than any previous period of 500 consecutive years. I would be convinced that the 500 year periods making up the "dark ages" were much more evolutionarily significant than the period in which condoms were in any manner common. According to your own link, if such knowledge and use existed prior to the 5th century AD the knowledge and practice was lost. The most critical times which might lend credibility to your argument, and the crucial usage was missing.

      You replied to several comments already, but provided nothing other than "papers showing otherwise in the last twenty years." No one knows which papers you refer to, nor can anyone check if they have been redacted or superceded.

      Finally, since condom use is mostly a choice, except when it is not available, I don't see it exerting much pressure at all, certainly not as much as whatever factors might be discussed in the uncited articles of yours.

      Quite simply, you are protesting too much and adding little if any to the conversation. There is no evidence that an optional utility would exert any speciation change in the periods in which it may have been available, though not widely used. Feel free to post some sort of citation to the contrary, or just stop replying.

    17. Re:Darwin in action. by Prune · · Score: 2

      [Citation needed]
      The ONLY significant change that is measurable between generations is that of the immune system, which is by evolutionary design, as the immune system is in a constant arms race with pathogens and needs to match some of their speed of change.

      --
      "Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason."
    18. Re:Darwin in action. by theshowmecanuck · · Score: 4, Funny

      About 25 or 30 years ago in Toronto they had a "town forum" on one of the local super stations. The subject was about legalizing pot. Some stoner had the floor and when he got to the mic his speech went something like: "Ya heh heh heh.... Like I smoke pot you know... And like.... ... uhhh ... ... ... heh heh ... I fogot what I was gonna say... ..." then he turned around and sat down. The station this was on broadcast to all of southern Ontario, and transmitters close to the border meant a good chunk of the U.S. across Lakes Ontario and Erie. Potential audience of many millions (actual audience probably a few million since it was during the news hour... pre-internet days). A better spokesman for making weed illegal could not have been found. The panel were speechless for a minute.

      --
      -- I ignore anonymous replies to my comments and postings.
    19. Re:Darwin in action. by Lumpy · · Score: 3, Informative

      Civil infraction 27-5 against county Code 54.2.1 Hiding your pot in a fake mouse is a mistreatment in this county.

      $350.00 fine or 2 days in jail.

      There is your citation, you can pay it at the county clerks office.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    20. Re:Darwin in action. by Lumpy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      BIG disagree.

      Medical advances allow the Genetically defective to continue to survive and reproduce. Just 100 years ago this would not have happened.

      Just wait to see how fucked up as a species will will be in 500 years.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    21. Re:Darwin in action. by TapeCutter · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Lactose tolerance is the standard example of recent human evolution.

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
    22. Re:Darwin in action. by icebike · · Score: 2
      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    23. Re:Darwin in action. by jamesh · · Score: 5, Funny

      Jesus christ

      Can't we have an irrational flaming discussion about evolution without bringing him into it??

    24. Re:Darwin in action. by jc42 · · Score: 2

      Except the appropriate onomatopoeia is woosh.

      Depends on your dialect. My native dialect is one of the many that still preserve the "wh" sound (which has always actually been /hw/ phonetically, but the usual insane English spelling rules apply ;-). It's only "woosh" if you speak one of the many dialects that has dropped yet another kind of initial /h/, the one represented in the "wh" digraph.

      I'm not aware of any dialects that converted /hw/ into /sw/. But maybe the writer speaks a dialect (idiolect?) that does that. Stranger things have happened in the English language.

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    25. Re:Darwin in action. by jc42 · · Score: 2

      That's why God created bananas. So you could practice proper application of a condom. Just ask any American school kid. It's part of their curriculum.

      And this is why American bananas are a sterile species that reproduces only asexually. All those condoms make banana sex unproductive, so they've been selected for a means of reproduction that is productive under the conditions imposed on them by their human predators.

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    26. Re:Darwin in action. by LandGator · · Score: 5, Informative

      Well, Charlie was a neighborhood cat, who was well known to everyone on that street, and the sick man was in the habit of inviting Charlie in for dinner, but didn't care for the appetizer Charlie brought. The fever made Charlie atypically cranky, and Charlie chomped down... Three other folks from another household in that neighborhood are also receiving treatment, but don't have the blood-borne version, and they're doing OK. (I have neighborhood sources.) OBTW, no one has mentioned, this is in Prineville, in the High Desert of Crook County, Oregon, 2.5 hrs' drive ESE of Portland, where Facebook's data center is located and other data centers are in development.

      --
      There is nothing wrong with yr Internet. Do not attempt to adjust the picture. We are controlling the transmission - NSA
    27. Re:Darwin in action. by Cruciform · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The rate of stupid isn't growing. Your exposure to them has. Technology and urbanization have brought people together so that stupidity may be experienced in full 3D as nature intended.

    28. Re:Darwin in action. by hairyfeet · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I can't believe I'm even getting involved on this, but your comparison isn't correct. Just as one can have alcohol at anywhere from light beer to pga so too can pot be had with any strength from light buzz to "OMFG where are the cookies?" so it wouldn't be fair to say one is stronger than the other. i would argue that the very fact that it IS illegal is why you get super strength pot now, same as during prohibition you were more likely to get bathtub rotgut than you were a nice light wine. When things are illegal it simply makes more sense to sell the most concentrated you can because the laws treat mellow and strong pot equally and a customer can get more for less by buying stronger stuff.

      I have a feeling once this dark and shameful chapter of our history is over and pot is legal you'll see that just like with alcohol you'll have so many choices in flavor, texture, and intoxication factor that just like with booze there will be something for everyone. Personally i like pot from the Ozarks myself, the rich soil gives it a nice peaty overtone with a lovely aroma, almost like being in a forest, quite lovely.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    29. Re:Darwin in action. by EdIII · · Score: 2

      Personally i like pot from the Ozarks myself, the rich soil gives it a nice peaty overtone with a lovely aroma, almost like being in a forest, quite lovely.

      LOL.

      Ok. Personally, I have never experienced this "mellow" pot that you speak of. Only the super strength stuff. Even just a small puff and I was ready to go Ocean's 11 on the Keebler Elf factory.

      I get your overall point though and I have a strange desire to visit the Ozarks.

    30. Re:Darwin in action. by ancienthart · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Only on Slashdot could a news article about the Black Death turn into an argument about the relative merits of legalising/punishing pot usage.

    31. Re:Darwin in action. by Sulphur · · Score: 2

      It really wasn't a dead mouse. It was a bag of pot he hid under a bush so his wife wouldn't find it. You can't really tell that to the folks at the hospital.

      The moral of the story is never mix pot and catnip.

    32. Re:Darwin in action. by hairyfeet · · Score: 4, Informative

      Oh if you get a chance you really must go, and not just for the most delicious pot. you should really bring a camera and be ready to stop almost constantly because the vistas you will see are truly some of the most breathtaking i have ever seen, with huge valley scenes with incredible peaks and cliffs and flowing water everywhere, it is truly a wondrous view of nature that one simply must see with your own eyes. I swear you can simply pull on the side of the road in a large chunk of the Ozarks and the view is like standing on this great peak, with all this beautiful unspoiled wonder spread out before you, quite inspiring.

      But I can assure you that its true that in places where there is a lot of fertile land and pot being grown you'll find as many flavors and textures as you do alcohol, everything from lightly mellow to harsh, from sweet to skunky, from tasty to almost medicinal in flavor. If I were to describe the typical pot from the Ozarks it would be peaty with a slight sweet overtone, with a very forest scent, kinda like a mix of pine and juniper, quite lovely. If one were to go to the swampier south AR the pot is more musky, nice tasting but with a definite skunk scent, while the northeast area close to Memphis favors pot that has a much sweeter taste and aroma, almost candy like.

      In a way pot is a LOT like wine in that the kind of soil the plant is grown in and the conditions of the area does seem to cause differences in taste and texture not to mention buzz. I have a feeling most of the pot you've had has been either imported or been grown by mega-growers, their weed tends to be extra strong but not very much in the way of variety, kinda like the rotgut of old. And I can't believe that I'm sitting here actually judging flavors of various cultivars, but as a musician I've got to sample quite a few from different areas and there are some overall themes when it comes to pot grown in certain areas. Oh and FYI the worst pot I ever smoked was East Texas, it'll knock you on your ass but tastes like cheap cigarettes smell, a real ditchweed harsh nasty flavoring.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    33. Re:Darwin in action. by datavirtue · · Score: 5, Funny

      From the Black Plague to penis fangs, god I love slashdot.

      --
      I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
    34. Re:Darwin in action. by MaskedSlacker · · Score: 4, Funny

      There's no way to tell whether our ancestors had "teeth" or other condom-breaking protrusions on their penises. They may or may not have, since boners don't fossilize as well as bones. Maybe we merely lost our vestigial cock-teeth. Or maybe this is where myths of vagina dentata come from--it was the women who had the condom-breaking apparatus.

    35. Re:Darwin in action. by jc42 · · Score: 2

      Shwuck off.

      Hey, you speak Yiddish!

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    36. Re:Darwin in action. by mjwx · · Score: 2

      Well i have proof that the general population is far stupider now than 500 years ago. But the rate of stupid started growing exponentially in 1992.

      Today we have masses of drooling morons that cant even figure out how to add water to a radiator if their car was overheating, cant understand that it's bad to not look out the window of the car while driving, and has elected or supports a band of utterly evil people that want to roll back civil rights to the early 1950's.

      Well you're meant to add coolant to radiators as they easily get to above 100 degrees C. In summer in Oz, the coolant in my radiator can start cold at 40+ Degrees C after being left in the sun. If you put water in a radiator you'll find the water boiling out after 5-10 mins of driving.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    37. Re:Darwin in action. by roc97007 · · Score: 2

      About 25 or 30 years ago in Toronto they had a "town forum" on one of the local super stations. The subject was about legalizing pot. Some stoner had the floor and when he got to the mic his speech went something like: "Ya heh heh heh.... Like I smoke pot you know... And like.... ... uhhh ... ... ... heh heh ... I fogot what I was gonna say... ..." then he turned around and sat down. The station this was on broadcast to all of southern Ontario, and transmitters close to the border meant a good chunk of the U.S. across Lakes Ontario and Erie. Potential audience of many millions (actual audience probably a few million since it was during the news hour... pre-internet days). A better spokesman for making weed illegal could not have been found. The panel were speechless for a minute.

      Agreed, and when I hear something like this, I wonder if it wasn't intentional. It's a well known political tactic to find a subject to pretend to be on the other side in order to make a very bad case for the other side's position.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    38. Re:Darwin in action. by Unipuma · · Score: 2

      Actually, Arthur C. Clarke 'invented' the communication satellite, as in, he picked up on the idea that a geosynchronous satellite would be an ideal platform to bounce your radio waves off around the world. This was during the time he worked as a radar engineer in WW II.

    39. Re:Darwin in action. by Hognoxious · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This is a 50 year old man who got into a fight with a cat over a dead mouse.

      We're not talking about Paul McCartney or Michael Douglas.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    40. Re:Darwin in action. by Boronx · · Score: 3, Informative

      If you can survive and reproduce, you aren't genetically defective.

    41. Re:Darwin in action. by Gordonjcp · · Score: 2

      I'm fortunate in that whenever my cat catches mice, she just gives it a couple of good hard whacks and eats it. None of this mummy cat try-to-show-the-kittens-how-to-hunt thing, just *thud* *munch munch munch*.

  2. stupid by donaggie03 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Maybe you shouldn't be screwing around with wild animals and their food . . .

    --
    Three days from now?? Thats tomorrow!! ~Peter Griffin
    1. Re:stupid by donaggie03 · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Oh we want to play the definition game, huh? Well then, by definition (Dictionary.com), feral means

      1) existing in a natural state, as animals or plants; not domesticated or cultivated; wild.

      2) having reverted to the wild state, as from domestication.

      3) of or characteristic of wild animals; ferocious; brutal.

      All three definitions equate feral with being wild, so what was the point of your pedantic nitpicking again?

      --
      Three days from now?? Thats tomorrow!! ~Peter Griffin
    2. Re:stupid by Samantha+Wright · · Score: 4, Interesting

      A feral cat is a descendant of a domesticated cat that has returned to the wild.

      Have you ever seen a domesticated tiger? What about a domesticated fox?

      The difference between is mostly just a few generations of human attention. There are some more gradual changes (and numerous abrupt physical changes) at work in dogs, which creates the gap between 'feral' and 'wild' for them, but the most important alterations are purely in how the animal has been raised. Barn cats have been selected for their ability to survive and hunt, after all, for most of history. Not very pet-like traits.

      --
      Bio questions? Ask me to start a Q&A journal. Computer analogies available for most topics!
    3. Re:stupid by shadesOG · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The article says it was a cat. Cats, by definition, are not wild. Some of them may be feral, but they are never wild.

      Apparently you don't live in Oregon. We have wild cats. We call them cougars or mountain lions and they can fuck your day up. They have been getting a bad rep for pouncing on mountain bikers. http://www.dfw.state.or.us/wildlife/cougar/

    4. Re:stupid by Anarchduke · · Score: 3, Insightful

      he's bored?

      --
      who prays for Satan? Who in 18 centuries has had the humanity to pray for the 1 sinner that needed it most? ~Mark Twain
    5. Re:stupid by Grishnakh · · Score: 2

      Usually, when someone says "cat", they mean felis domesticus, not a mountain lion (same thing as cougar). If they meant a mountain lion, they would have specified that.

      Besides, what kind of moron would try to get a dead mouse (or anything for that matter) away from a mountain lion? Obviously, this case was about a housecat.

      Finally, I live in Arizona. We have mountain lions here too, though not generally in the city. Mountain lions live all over the western US, they're not unique to Oregon. I think they had some problems with them pouncing on bicyclists in southern California too a while back.

    6. Re:stupid by PNutts · · Score: 4, Funny

      "Girls Gone Feral" doesn't have the same ring to it, but sounds interesting for the same reasons.

    7. Re:stupid by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I think you over-estimate the effects of "domestication" on dogs... although I do admit that many of them have had the piss bred out of them. Pocket dogs are an abomination.

      But for most of human history, dogs were working animals, too. The only difference is that they are (usually) too big to be allowed to gather their own food. That would be dangerous (and inconvenient, considering that they are pack hunters). That is the difference: practicality, not biology.

      Dogs do go feral. In an area not very far from here there has been a pack of feral dogs, descended from escaped domestic dogs, roaming the mountains for at least 30 years. They have been spotted every few years (it is a very remote place and rough country) but their fate is uncertain now that the wolves have returned. And Dingos are of course another example of formerly-domesticated dogs returning to the wild.

      Another interesting example is the domestic ferret. Evidence indicates that they have been domesticated for approximately as long as dogs and cats. And again, for most of human history they were working animals: they were (and still are) used to hunt small game. Not only that, but prior to WWII, right here in the United States, ferrets were also popular farm animals, used for keeping rats, mice, etc. out of the granaries just like cats.

      But unlike both dogs and cats, and except in New Zealand (which presented very specific and unusual conditions), ferrets don't go feral. They just don't. It doesn't happen.

  3. Bring out your dead! by ColdWetDog · · Score: 5, Informative

    While an exciting headline, certain to raise the blood pressure of the angst brigade, this isn't terribly newsworthy. Bubonic plague has been found in animals (mostly prairie dogs in Colorado) for decades and apparently is the sixth case of plague in Oregon since 1995. It's easy to treat with antibiotics. The hardest part is actually thinking that Yersinia pestis is the causative organism.

    Bonus points for Monty Python addicts.

    --
    Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    1. Re:Bring out your dead! by aliquis · · Score: 2

      How sure are they it's the same?

      Seem legit:
      http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/352856/20120615/octomom-2-woman-pregnant-mouth-eating-squid.htm
      "'Octomom' 2.0? Woman Gets 'Pregnant In The Mouth' After Eating Squid
      By Dave Smith: Subscribe to Dave's RSS feed
      June 15, 2012 5:01 PM EDT
      A 63-year-old South Korean woman was shocked to learn she "became pregnant" with 12 baby squid after eating a portion of calamari."

      Seem too good to be true, but it probably is.

    2. Re:Bring out your dead! by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 4, Insightful

      There are 3 essential forms of Black Plague (all of them caused by the same organism), and each of them varies in the rapidity of onset.

      The most virulent is the pneumonic form. It can kill within days. But it is also relatively rare, even as cases of plague go. Usually it takes somewhat longer.

  4. Biggest question... by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 4, Informative
    Why was this guy trying to pry a mouse away from a cat? That appears to be the most interesting story here...

    Really though, from TFA:

    it is treatable with antibiotics

    the bacteria thrives in forests, grasslands and any wooded areas inhabited by rats and squirrels

    Without the help of modern medicine, Europeans in the Middle Ages could do little to combat the plague.

    So this is a bacterium that is common in the wild, which can be contracted by humans but is treatable with modern medicine. It is not as though we are facing another plague here...

    --
    Palm trees and 8
    1. Re:Biggest question... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Good thing that bacteria cant become resistant to antibiotics, right?

      captcha: evasion

    2. Re:Biggest question... by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 5, Informative

      Good thing that bacteria cant become resistant to antibiotics, right?

      Bacteria that spread from human to human can evolve antibiotic resistance relatively quickly. Bacteria that spread primarily from animal to animal, especially if those animals are wild, are much less likely to evolve resistance. I don't think we are going to start giving antibiotics to prairie dogs.

       

    3. Re:Biggest question... by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 2

      Good thing that bacteria cant become resistant to antibiotics, right?

      Sure, but there is more to keep in mind when it comes to this particular infection:

      1. Cleanliness slows the spread immensely, especially around areas where the bacteria live. One of the main reasons for the plague's spread in the middle ages was poor hygiene, as evidenced by the reduced rates of infection in communities where bathing and washing hands were common.
      2. We do not leave dead animal carcasses rotting in our streets. One of the ways this infection spreads is by fleas jumping from a dead animal to a live one.
      3. We have quarantine protocols for serious diseases, which help reduce contact between infected and uninfected people.

      So even if by some strange twist, the plague were to develop resistance to antibiotics, it would be unlikely to become an epidemic. Indeed, only a tiny handful of people become infected in modern times, and that is despite the fact that we have much larger populations and higher population densities.

      --
      Palm trees and 8
    4. Re:Biggest question... by AK+Marc · · Score: 2

      You are right. Bacteria can't become resistant to antibiotics. What happened with MSSA and such is that the resistant strains already existed, and the widespread and often inappropriate usage of antibiotics killed of the other strains, making MSSA more common. But the antibiotics didn't "create" MSSA, and and the bacteria didn't "become" resistant, but had been that way for longer than we have records.

    5. Re:Biggest question... by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 2

      This is possibly the worst infection to evolve

      Really, the worst? This is an infection that is not hard to control with quarantines, good hygiene and good sanitation -- none of which are a challenge in this century. It would be a pretty serious leap for the plague to evade all of the above.

      We have better medicine

      More importantly, we have better medical practices. Doctors wash their hands between seeing patients. Highly infectious patients are kept under special quarantines. Corpses are not handled without gloves. Medical instruments are carefully disposed of. These things are more relevant to the plague than antibiotics, which are just a treatment for those who become infected.

      --
      Palm trees and 8
    6. Re:Biggest question... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Wrong. Bacteria absolutely can become resistant to antibiotics. Scientists have recreated this phenomenon countless times in the lab. Now whether MRSA pre-existed the use of modern antibiotics, I don't know. Maybe you're right.

      Of course, we're both playing fast-and-loose with terminology. By create, of course, I presume we're both referring to the evolutionary mechanism of selective pressure.

  5. Bring out yer dead! by howardd21 · · Score: 2

    Obligatory Monthy Python Reference http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grbSQ6O6kbs "I'm not dead yet"

    --
    no comment
  6. This is hardly news. by hey! · · Score: 5, Informative

    Bubonic plague has been endemic (sustaining itself permanently, in this case in the animal population) in the western part of the US for years, although it is news to public health officials when a human contracts it. There was a case two years ago, also in Oregon.

    The reason it doesn't sweep the nation the way it swept Europe is advances in hygiene, public health and medical treatment. Rats and fleas in the house aren't unheard of these days, but they're no longer universal. If people are getting bit by fleas they'll call the exterminator or the board of health; they won't just accept it as a fact of life. If they contract plague they'll go to the doctor who will cure it relatively easily.

    --
    Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    1. Re:This is hardly news. by Mashiki · · Score: 2

      Bubonic plague has been endemic (sustaining itself permanently, in this case in the animal population) in the western part of the US for yeas...

      Yep. When I was in the US southwest in the 80's they were handing out phamplets at the national parks like the grand canyon(I think I have mine tucked away somewhere still--I was a kid and thought it was kinda cool) to avoid dead animals. This really isn't news, we see a dozen or so cases of it in Canada every year from the same way.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
  7. Re:The Plague by BitterOak · · Score: 4, Interesting

    True, many of the hiking trails in New Mexico have signs warning that rodents may be carrying the plague. What surprises me, though, is the man is in critical condition. I thought the plague was easily treatable with antibiotics today. Is this a new antibiotic resistant strain?

    --
    If I can be modded down for being a troll, can I be modded up for being an orc, or a balrog?
  8. Re:2012 strikes again by isopropanol · · Score: 5, Interesting

    No, must be confirmation bias on your part.

    Black Plague is rare, but still happens you just usually don't hear about it because it's treatable with antibiotics and preventable by controlling rodent populations - neither antibiotic treatment nor effective prevention were known in europe during the middle ages.

  9. Obligatory LOLcat ref by thatseattleguy · · Score: 5, Funny

    I can has worldwide pandemic?

    1. Re:Obligatory LOLcat ref by equex · · Score: 5, Informative

      haz

      --
      Can I light a sig ?
    2. Re:Obligatory LOLcat ref by xstonedogx · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's a beautiful world we live in when we have a second spelling and dialect for what we imagine our domesticated companions are telling us... and there are spelling and grammar nazis for that dialect.

  10. Re:The Plague by Grishnakh · · Score: 2

    Yep, it was a 50-year-old men. People in that demographic are infamous for avoiding medical treatment until it's too late.

  11. Sensationalized article by tirerim · · Score: 2, Informative

    Yes, he contracted septicaemic plague, the blood-borne form of Yersinia pestis. That doesn't mean he contracted "the Black Death". The Black Death was almost certainly caused by a variant of Y. pestis which is no longer around (microorganisms tend to change a bit over the course of a few centuries). It's also the name of a specific pandemic of plague, and while there were other smaller outbreaks in the following centuries, they weren't generally referred to by that name. One human case of a disease that is now treatable with antibiotics and easy to contain does not make for a pandemic.

    1. Re:Sensationalized article by Prune · · Score: 4, Informative

      You are wrong. Black Death DNA was extracted from teeth of victims in the Tower of London and it's the same Y. pestis as we have today: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/13/science/13plague.html?_r=1

      --
      "Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason."
  12. Re:2012 strikes again by AikonMGB · · Score: 4, Funny

    Wrong, it's a new zombie strain, carried by rodents and cats from Japan; I suspect it is entirely distinct from the zombie strain seen in Florida, originating in Cuba.

  13. Re:2012 strikes again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    A professor once told us, "It's around, and yes, occasionally kills someone. You just see, 'person died of severe bacterial infection'."

  14. Not a big deal. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Exactly this. In the Southwestern US there is a case of plague every couple of years. Not a big deal unless it isn't diagnosed and treated rapidly. It probably shows up in other areas of the world as well.

    1. Re:Not a big deal. by dpilot · · Score: 3, Informative

      My brother-in-law is a veterinarian in southeast Utah, and he found one of those "every few years" cases of bubonic plague a few years back. He told me the same thing - a case pops up every few years.

      --
      The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
    2. Re:Not a big deal. by TapeCutter · · Score: 2

      It does, from anecdotal reports I've read, India seems to be the place to go for a dose of the plague. Unlike smallpox (and soon Polio), it's doubtfull that it will ever be eradicated with current methods since it's normally transmitted by fleas, but we do know how to control it when it pops up so yeah, a repeat of the black death is highly unlikely. Pathogeans that turn into pandemics with a high mortality rate are rare, from an evolutionary POV it doesn't make sense to kill off your host and worse still if you kill your host too quickly (eg:Ebola) you have very limited opportunities to spread to new hosts. Smallpox (the biblical plague) and polio only occur in humans, 'simply' cure every last human case on the planet and they are gone for ever. Coincidently India is also one of the last places on the planet where polio still occurs, mainly due to local religious beliefs. That in itself is an fantastic achivement (I can recall going to school with several polio victims in the 60's, they were the lucky ones, they could still waddle around without a wheel chair. ).

      However there's an interesting moral conundrum with smallpox; As an achivement for all mankind the erradication of smallpox is right up there with the moon landing, and was a far more practical and noble use of our resources. It was made possible because a healthy 8yo boy was afforded all the rights of a lab rat by the man who discovered the vaccine. Yes it was a different planet in the 18th century, but the conundrum is timeless and can be expressed in star trek terms as - does "the good of the many outweigh the good of the few, or the one"?

      Once we have an answer to that connundrum we can decide whether or not the few pockets of anti-vaccine nutters should be forceably innoculated for certain communicable diseses. There existance provides a breeding ground from where new strains can evolve and launch themselves into the general population (re: recent whooping cough outbreaks in Australia). Fuck it, what am I saying? Unlike Jensen we KNOW modern vaccines work and we KNOW how to develop them without using humans as lab rats, I say round the ignorant fucker's up and jab 'em.

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
    3. Re:Not a big deal. by jedidiah · · Score: 2

      They plain have plague warnings at the campgrounds in southern Utah. This stuff is by no means new. It's just relatively rare and pretty localized. It's unusual enough that it fits into the "man bites dog" category of the news. No one remembers that it happened before 5 or 10 or 15 years ago and nothing came of it then either.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
  15. Re:Black Death? no, epidemiology guesses Ebola lik by Daetrin · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Actually, epidemiology is entirely unsure about the matter. (Also, don't anthropomorphize inanimate objects, they hate it when you do that.)

    Some people think it was the bubonic plague because that matches _some_ of the symptoms reported at the time and y. pestis has been found in mass graves from the period. (Obviously people who disagree are pulling out the "correlation does not equal causation" card.)

    Other people believe it was ebola, anthrax, or something else because the incubation period, the rate and nature of the spread, and some of the symptoms don't match those of the modern bubonic plague.

    Some people believe it was the y. pestis, but it behaved differently back then because humans had zero immunity when it was introduced, and both humans and the bacteria have had a few centuries to evolve since then.

    And some people believe that it wasn't just one disease that was responsible for the black death but a number of different diseases sweeping through around the same time. They didn't know much about disease at the time, and if everyone has heard of the black death and a bunch of people get sick and die, everyone is going to blame it on the black death.

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    This Space Intentionally Left Blank
  16. Re:The Plague by Nyder · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Yep, it was a 50-year-old men. People in that demographic are infamous for avoiding medical treatment until it's too late.

    That is because by the time we are that old, we know that most doctors don't actually know as much as they think (meaning they tend to guess alot), and don't want to pay the high price for that.

    --
    Be seeing you...
  17. Re:The Plague by AK+Marc · · Score: 3, Funny

    "I can survive with the Plague for another 15 years and get on medicare"

  18. Non story by Dunbal · · Score: 3, Informative

    There are 1-2 cases of bubonic plague in the US every year. "Yersenia pestis" is part of the normal body flora of several animals, especially underneath the nails of the armadillo. Now when we see cipro resistant plague, then you can panic.

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    Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
  19. Re:2012 strikes again by Kidipede · · Score: 5, Interesting

    One big cause of plagues in the Middle Ages was therefore situations that caused huge increases in the rodent population. This happened whenever there were food shortages, because people would stop being able to spare food to feed dogs and cats. When you stop feeding your dog, pretty soon you have to kill it (and then you may as well eat it). Without dogs and cats around, the rat population would take off. That's why in famines, as soon as people get done eating dogs and cats they start to eat rats. But of course the combination of lots of rats with underfed, weakened people means that plague can kill a lot of people. Indeed, the worse food security you had in your town, the more people tended to die of plague.

  20. Re:2012 strikes again by Caledfwlch · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Actually they did have rodent population control in those days, but it's effectiveness was severely curtailed as they associated cats with witchcraft and so went around killing them. An enlightening glimpse of how perpetuating a climate of fear with no sound basis can backfire!

    --
    These views express my own personal opinions, not those of the other voices in my head
  21. Re:2012 strikes again by dpilot · · Score: 2

    That may happen, but antibiotic resistance usually happens because of overprescription, and people not following directions. Since there aren't many cases of Plague, pretty much any time it does pop up, those people are under careful care, so if there is any antibiotic resistance to it, it's probably because of "environmental antibiotics" - pets under treatment peeing excess, same for farm animals, leaching landfills, etc.

    --
    The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
  22. More than that... by bashibazouk · · Score: 4, Informative

    From the linked article:

    Even though there are about seven cases of the Black Plague in the U.S. each year, most cases have been in the West and the Southweset, the bacterium is considerably less fatal than it once was. According to the CDC, 1 in 7 cases are fatal, but the disease can now be treated with antibiotics.

    I know, I know I'm not supposed to read the article...

  23. Re:2012 strikes again by rve · · Score: 2

    That may happen, but antibiotic resistance usually happens because of overprescription, and people not following directions. Since there aren't many cases of Plague, pretty much any time it does pop up, those people are under careful care, so if there is any antibiotic resistance to it, it's probably because of "environmental antibiotics" - pets under treatment peeing excess, same for farm animals, leaching landfills, etc.

    Antibiotic resistance usually happens because of the widespread use of sub therapeutic doses of antibiotics as a 'growth enhancer' in animal feed, and the ability of bacteria to exchange genes, even between different species of bacteria. A fairly recent example of this behavior is the EHEC strain, a strain of previously harmles e.coli bacteria that seems to have absorbed the gene for producing a deadly toxin from the dysentery bug.

  24. Re:The same axiom applies. by drkstr1 · · Score: 3, Informative

    I am actually a better programmer after smoking a _small_ amount. My right-brained creative problem solving abilities are greatly increased, at the expense of some of my left-brained activities (such as doing math in my head). This is particularly important for me, a heavily left-brained thinker. Whenever I get stuck on a problem, I go have a "smoke break," and suddenly I have all kinds of ideas flowing through my head (some of which are even good). Results will vary depending on the person though.

    --
    Fanboy Status: Apache Flex, C#, Eclipse, KDE, Pirate Party, Ron Paul, Slackware, Windows 7