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The Fall of 38 Studios

An anonymous reader writes "Boston magazine provides the first reasonably satisfying account of the final year of Curt Schilling's video game company 38 Studios, which was heavily subsidized by a huge loan guaranteed by the state of Rhode Island. During his career as a baseball pitcher, Schilling helped lead three different teams to four World Series, resulting in three championships. He has so far been much less successful as a video game CEO; although he has some of the stereotypical qualities of a successful entrepreneur (passion, energy level, optimism, selling ability), his company seemed utterly lacking in controls, while facing a very tough industry and economy. Schilling apparently regrets the decision to bet the company on an MMO game, but otherwise seems to accept little blame for the demise. His company burned more than $133 million over six years, mostly for headcount, according to an analysis of public documents by Providence TV station WPRI."

30 of 172 comments (clear)

  1. So what's the purpose of this story again? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Is it so we feel sorry for some rich dumb fuck who's greatest achievement in life is throwing a ball around, and who only got the chance to cause hundreds of hard working people to lose their jobs because America seems to reward the former attributes above all else?

    1. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by stms · · Score: 2

      What's the point of your comment again? Do you not like this story because it threatens your political views? That not all rich people are old fat evil guys sitting in their office lighting cigars with hundred dollar bills. When some people get money they want to make something other people will enjoy. It doesn't always turn out right for the people trying to do the nice thing. The world and the people in it are not black or white they are a wonderful and confusing shade of grey.

    2. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by docmordin · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Although the story doesn't mention it, unlike others, I'm guessing it's one more subtle jab to the fact that he [Curt Schilling] is vehemently opposed to government financial bailouts and stimulus funds, yet didn't bother to eschew a tax-payer backed state loan, let alone managed his company, from afar, in the same impetuous manner as those that required government aid in the first place.

      Had Schilling really wanted to make Copernicus a reality, there were plenty of other alternative steps he and the management at 38 Studios could have taken. One option would have been to scrap the development of an MMO, something that, as the article noted, resulted in a number of years without revenue, and instead focused on an excellent single-player game from the get-go, so as to build up brand recognition before branching out. (While they, in a half-hearted attempt, did this with Kingdoms of Amalur, it really wasn't a good enough effort, which is evident in just about every facet of the game.)

    3. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by Trepidity · · Score: 4, Interesting

      He didn't create much of it: he bought existing companies and then ran them into the ground. Big Huge Games had jobs and products before 38 Studios bought it, and would, in retrospect, have been better off if Schilling hadn't bought 'em.

    4. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by tburkhol · · Score: 2

      [Curt Schilling] is vehemently opposed to government financial bailouts and stimulus funds, yet didn't bother to eschew a tax-payer backed state loan, let alone managed his company, from afar, in the same impetuous manner as those that required government aid in the first place.

      Furthermore:

      Schilling apparently regrets the decision to bet the company on an MMO game, but otherwise seems to accept little blame for the demise.

      So, it seems, like many executives, Schilling is acutely aware that success of a business depends on the whole team's effort. Blame is distributed and diluted. While the company operated, Schilling (and all the employees) drew salaries off the government teat under a program specifically designed to foster entrepreneurship by reducing individual risk. Schilling's successes, though, are down to his personal leadership, ability to inspire his team members, and his own personal skills.

      It's a very different story than the guy who mortgages his house to buy a Subway franchise, or to open his own small business. It emphasizes the difference in risk between "small businesses" with $10M payrolls, and small businesses in the individual entrepreneur sense. The former - call then $100M businesses - need some help getting started. Venture capital seems not to be willing to jump in early in the process, so government (either state or federal) loan programs really can foster startups. Those programs are practically only available to people who are already successful and at least moderately wealthy, because no one ever prepared a credible $100M business plan while living in his car. We should recognize that small business loan programs are a public support network for 'job creators' in exactly the same way that unemployment and food stamps are a support network for employees.

      Small business success depends on taxpayer largesse and acceptance of occasional failure

    5. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by DarkOx · · Score: 4, Insightful

      [Curt Schilling] is vehemently opposed to government financial bailouts and stimulus funds, yet didn't bother to eschew a tax-payer backed state loan

      Which is why I don't blame Curt. Liberals love to jump on people like Schilling for being opposed subsidies and then taking advantage of the ones that exist. They are the first to say "we're all in this together" and suddenly forget that sentiment as soon as it applies to anyone who disagrees. Tough, we live in a society. That means people like Schilling, if they had their way would not get subsidies and neither would anyone else. They don't make the rules though and neither do I. I vote all the time to end this crap but It does not happen, in the mean time people like Schilling and I pay the same taxes to support it as everyone else; just be cause we don't think its a good idea does not mean we are any less entitled when society collectively decides to create an entitlement.

      So what we really have here is a case where Government was gambling with public monies making loans. That is not the governments job, or it should not be. Capital risk belongs in the private market. There are two really important reasons for that. The first is that when things don't work out bankruptcy can destroy private debts, sovereign debts on the other hang around and drag on the economy forever. The second is that private financing means the people making the call and taking the risk have their own skin in the game. That tends to put the breaks on ideas where the risk is outsized compared to the potential reward; money gets allocated better.

      People keep saying 38 Studios should have take a less aggressive path. They probably could not have raised 75M in the private markets and would have been forced to do just that. That would have put them on the path to grow by doing some number of less ambitious but likely more successful in ROI terms projects first. Who knows if government had not dumped a bunch of overly cheap money on them they might exist today.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    6. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by scarboni888 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hmmm... must be an election year.

    7. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by Raenex · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Since when do Republicans believe that government loans to business are a good idea?

      When they're the ones giving them out.

    8. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by thePowerOfGrayskull · · Score: 3, Insightful

      So you're saying it's the government's fault for making the money available, and the person who took the money has no responsibility?

      Isn't that akin to blaming the person who left his car unlocked when it gets stolen?

    9. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by DarkOx · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So you're saying it's the government's fault for making the money available, and the person who took the money has no responsibility?

      -Yes and No-
      He has responsibility for the business failing yes. He has no responsibility to public for the loss of the 75 million, that is what a loan grantee does after all. I also really do think that when government intercedes in the market place and makes money overly cheap, either via loan grantees or direct lending, it does lead otherwise savvy business people to make poorer decisions. It also enables unproven decision makers like these folks access to capital that nobody would give them otherwise. The outcome seems to be often calamity.

      This is an example of someone who had they been forced by nature to swim in a smaller pond for a time, might have learned, grown, and installed a team around him of proven people. What that 75Million loan did is effective let him skip from the high school team and jump directly to majors. Things might have gone better with some time in AAA

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    10. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by Rogue+Haggis+Landing · · Score: 2

      Dude, please. Agribusiness, defense and oil, the biggest welfare leeches in America, are all squarely Republican.

      Agribusiness is squarely Midwestern. Its bloc of supporters in Congress are representatives from farm states from both parties. For instance, when (oil state) Senator Tom Coburn proposed legislation to end the ethanol subsidy, a bipartisan group of Midwestern senators came up with legislation that attempted to save a subsidy of some sort. This sort of thing happens all of the time. If you're an elected representative from Indiana or Minnesota or Iowa then you're probably going to support Big Agriculture no matter what part you belong to.

      A senator may be very clear on what limits there should be on government spending, and he will also probably believe very strongly that such limits should not apply to his constituents. This is of course both a a feature and a bug of a republican form of government.

    11. Re:So what's the purpose of this story again? by CodeArtisan · · Score: 2

      To be fair, he blew all his own money in the company too. $30M+. Dude's broke. He'll be living off his salary as an ESPN analyst.

      Of course, there is a school of thought that suggests his claim to be broke will last only slightly longer than any pending lawsuits against him.

  2. Re:HOW FAR DID IT FALL ?? by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 2

    38 steps, that's how far !!

    Glad it stopped there - one more, and Mr. Memory would've been toast!

    --
    #DeleteChrome
  3. Congratulation by mwvdlee · · Score: 3, Insightful

    After reading the article, I can only say one thing.

    Congratulations mr. Shilling, for winning the "most arrogant douchebag of the century" award.
    We've still got 82 years to go, but we're pretty sure nobody will even come close.

    He wanted to outdo with half the money in half the time and no experience, what few experts dare to do.

    My whole life was spent doing things that people didn’t believe were possible, because God blessed me with the ability to throw a baseball. And I carried that same mentality into everything I did here.

    You weren't doing anything anybody thought impossible. Any league has a finite number of teams, one of which will win; this is not an impossibility.
    Apart from being CEO at Microsoft, the ability to throw objects has no value outside the baseball field.
    The mentality to do short bouts of activity for a few hours every week isn't necessarily the right mentality for anything else in live.

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  4. Re:1/4 of the RI budget deficit by AuMatar · · Score: 3, Informative

    The loan wasn't given out under Chafee, it was given out under his predecessor. Chafee was only governor during the time the company was publicly imploding. Try researching things before posting next time, ok?

    --
    I still have more fans than freaks. WTF is wrong with you people?
  5. Lesson: Your ability to throw a curveball... by outsider007 · · Score: 2

    Does not predict success as a tech CEO, particularly when you are a right wing ultra-religious asshat.

    --
    If you mod me down the terrorists will have won
  6. Re:why the fuck didn't he make a baseball game by Opportunist · · Score: 2

    Because that's pretty much the only stuff you got money for in the IT world a few years ago. Seriously. Walk into some investor's office and tell them you're gonna make a computer game, they'll wait until you add "and it's an MMO like WoW" and suddenly their eyes will light up and they shower you with money. For some odd reason they seemed to think every MMO is an instant success like WoW. For some odd reason they thought the market wasn't saturated. It seems they had no idea how the success of WoW came to be and that they could easily recreate it just by fiat. I wanna, so I can.

    I guess that's how he got the money. Greedy investors without a clue what they invest in.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  7. No kidding by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Same shit with the "Make an MMO first because it makes you the most money!" thing. What a retarded, arrogant, idea. When you are new in business, best not to try and shoot straight for the most financially risky stuff because good chance you fail. Had he really wanted to make games and been smart about it he would have started small, maybe with something he could self-fund, and then as he learned moved on up.

    Just as you don't start pitching for the majors, you don't want to start on an MMO. It is a shit ton of work, a lot of money, and easy to fuck up. Even for the big players it can happen. Look at The Old Republic. Bioware was doing the design and story on it, and they have a history of very solid single player MMOs, EA was publishing and controlling it, and they have a few MMOs to their name (Ultima Online, DAoC, and Warhammer Online) and yet they still screwed it up fairly badly and it is questionable if they'll manage to break even.

    He just thought he was such an amazingly smart motherfucker that he'd go straight to the top, fuck all that noise of learning the business or anything. Instead, it was straight to the bottom.

    1. Re:No kidding by charlesbakerharris · · Score: 4, Funny

      "Single player MMOs"? Derp?

  8. Re:Better Idea: Dancing with the Hollywood Squares by Trepidity · · Score: 2

    It would also give basically free publicity, of an actually good kind. "Curt Schilling making a baseball MMO" gets you into both the tech press and the sports pages, and probably would build interest and anticipation even without having a product yet. "Curt Schilling is making a WoW clone" also produces some press, but more of the puzzled/curious kind.

  9. Re:Can't stop reselling in the EU by Alain+Williams · · Score: 2

    Whoops ... I got this story mixed up with the one about Gamestop! I'll repost.

  10. Re:why don't you do some research yourself? by Hognoxious · · Score: 2

    Don't be so fucking dumb. It's not like you can walk into office with a bottle of Tippex and erase all the checks that your predecessor wrote; they've already been cashed.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  11. Re:Jocks & Nerds by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This "jock" is probably a bigger gaming nerd than you ever were -- he was leading a major guild in everquest one back when playing professional baseball (as pitcher, he had plenty of off days when he could lead raids!), and he's still got active max level characters in several MMOs.

    He's a hard-core player of tabletop boardgames, and rescued the company that publishes the advanced squad leader franchise when it was having financial problems; he sometimes wore t-shirts from boardgame conventions around the office, and occasionally stayed late to play boardgames with employees.

    I'm hoping he hasn't learned his lesson, because 38 studios was a great place to work, and I'd be happy to work for him again if he starts another company.

  12. Re:No profits = no accountability by Hognoxious · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The middle class can't carry both the rich AND the poor.

    Probably true. I just wonder which will get thrown overboard first.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  13. Great Power points though by EmperorOfCanada · · Score: 2

    Not a flippant comment. I suspect that this guy gave a presentation like no 100 geeks could give. Because of his sports fame and no doubt an ability to have access to the corridors of power he was able to convince the government that they could "pick a winner". I have watched and dealt with people like this my whole career. They see money being made and they insist on getting a "taste" Then they use their one schmoozing skill, round up an obscene amount of money put on a great show which usually is designed to impress and round up even more money. Then since their single driving focus wasn't putting out a great product they fail.

    In fact I have long suspected that these guys don't usually want a product out as then the product would potentially drive the success well beyond their simple abilities.

    The real drag in these situations is that not only do they waste taxpayer's money but they drive legitimate start-ups out of business; this is through their eating much of the available investment money, eating up the local talent, overpaying for rent, and then leaving a sour taste in everyone's mouths in the area for tech start-ups with the whole once bitten twice shy thing. In my area there was a famous flameout of an educational business. Same deal these guys literally had top government education people working for them "on secondment". Then boom it all blew up over a decade ago. The lawsuits and criminal charges are still working through the system.

    Any good tech business need some business savvy people near the top; but It all boils down to whether there are tech people making the decisions. The showmen should be the head of marketing, not the head of the company.

  14. Partisan Politics by RudyHartmann · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The comments venturing over into partisan politics are getting lame and mean spirited. This is a story about a tech failure and an unqualified CEO. Comments about that are interesting. All the "Republican this" or "Democrat that" replies are irrelevant and pointless.

    --
    Oh, yeah! Wise guy, huh? Woob woob woob woob! Nyuk! Nyuk!
  15. Fascinating psychology by FranTaylor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    What's fascinating about this is that Curt Schilling (and apparently many Slashdot readers) think that you can IGNORE poor business practices by PRETENDING it's the fault of those who make those poor business practices available.

    To these people it's not Curt's fault he took the loan, it's the fault of the people who offered it to him.

    Equally fascinating is the implication that Curt Schilling is DUMB AS A STUMP if he JUST CAN'T STOP HIMSELF FROM TAKING THAT MONEY.

  16. Re:HOW FAR DID IT FALL ?? by mypalmike · · Score: 2

    "It's way too easy to contribute to making the world shit and then deflect all responsibility" - Anonymous Coward

    Indeed.

    --
    There are 0x40000000 types of people: those who understand 32-bit IEEE 754 floating point, and those who don't.
  17. cycle of life ... by swframe · · Score: 2

    Maybe they will open source their code and the IP won't entirely go to waste. As for the money, well, it is in someone's bank account. It is not lost, just redistributed. Every day we make bets that seem stupid later but such is life. Sometimes stupid bets payoff (I'm looking at you instagram).

  18. Re:This question is based in semantics by argStyopa · · Score: 2

    Actually, no, you're entirely mistaken. From Brian Youse, one of the ACTUAL founders of MMP: (http://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/9253202#9253202)

    "...MMP began in 1994 when we released Backblast, an ASL fanzine, and was comprised of four AH ASL playtesters and a guy who had some layout skills. Avalon Hill had made the decision that ASL was "dead" and we wanted to keep seeing some new scenarios, etc.

    Curt didn't become involved until sometime around the end of 1995 when he was also attempting to buy the rights for ASL from Avalon Hill. We had been working with AH by then on the restarted ASL and Avalon Hill didn't want to sell the rights (read: they thought geez, we can fleece this guy, lets ask for the moon!) but wanted him involved (name value, something the Dott's - the owners of AH - did recognize, having put Tom Clancy on the AH Board of Directors somewhere around then as well). So, to make a long story short, AH told Curt about us, we met, he joined the company, and its been that way since then..."

    So essentially Curt, having an interest in ASL, bought his way into MMP.
    So *no* management/business experience at all. But lots of cash, and interest.

    --
    -Styopa