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July Heat Set U.S. Record

gollum123 sends this excerpt from CNN: "The July heat wave that wilted crops, shriveled rivers and fueled wildfires officially went into the books Wednesday as the hottest single month on record for the continental United States. The average temperature across the Lower 48 was 77.6 degrees Fahrenheit, 3.3 degrees above the 20th-century average, the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration reported. That edged out the previous high mark, set in 1936, by two-tenths of a degree, NOAA said. In addition, the seven months of 2012 to date are the warmest of any year on record and were drier than average as well, NOAA said. U.S. forecasters started keeping records in 1895. And the past 12 months have been the warmest of any such period on record, topping a mark set between July 2011 and this past June. Every U.S. state except Washington experienced warmer-than-average temperatures, NOAA reported."

422 comments

  1. Hopefully it's an outlier by SomeJoel · · Score: 1

    I certainly hope that this heat was an outlier, and not "the new normal".

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    1. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      It was God punishing people for practicing science so boldly in the open, no doubt.

    2. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      Of course. It's a coincidence. Not related to AGW or anything. I'm sure it's just the sensors being closer to pavement. Also, it hasn't felt any hotter for me, so it must just be the crazy greens trying to take all our money for their solar companies. Just keep letting me burn my dinosaur.

    3. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Penguinisto · · Score: 3, Funny

      Urgh.

      Okay kids, time to brace for the usual arguments:

      "Itz teh global WarminGz!"

      "Iz nawt! Itz teh outLiarz!"

      "Yoo Dunt no SHIT abut SCIENCE!"

      (rinse, repeat, ad nauseum...)

      Seriously. Get a grip.

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    4. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by J+Story · · Score: 1, Insightful

      In 1936, according to the article, it was almost as warm. Basically, a "so what?". Between then and now, States have had record cold temperatures as well. This report would be just one more Jeopardy! item, were it not for the political hay that will be made of it.

    5. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Outliers go up and down. Sometimes you will have a value that can cause the Dust Bowl and sometimes it is less. The problem with climate change is that we only need smaller outliers to cause what would be considered major events in the past.

    6. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Hatta · · Score: 1

      Unless you know some way for the atmosphere to clear all the heat trapping CO2 we've been dumping for the past 100 years, I wouldn't get my hopes up.

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    7. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, if it's an outlier, that makes 13 of them in a row.

    8. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by cpu6502 · · Score: 1, Insightful

      This July's record heat is only 0.2 degrees higher then the previous record. Let's not blow things out of proportion. (Unless you think the record set in the 1930s is indicative of global warming too?)

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    9. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Couldn't we just get giant ice cubes from Europa and drop them in the ocean? That would solve it once and for all.

    10. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Splab · · Score: 1, Insightful

      And the fact that weather is setting records across the globe year after year right now, is not a concern because equipment used in 1936 had almost the same reading?

      You know what, global environment change might be man made or natural cycle, but if it turns out to be man made, I hope you will do the honorable thing and let someone who tried to save the planet have your spot.

    11. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Internetuser1248 · · Score: 5, Informative

      No it is god punishing you for using fahrenheit.
      25.33 degrees for those that both care and didn't already type '77.6f in c' into google.

    12. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sycodon · · Score: 2, Funny

      That's a pretty charitable depiction.

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    13. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rrohbeck · · Score: 1

      Yeah. Unless we break the PETM global average, this is really "Meh!"

    14. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Internetuser1248 · · Score: 1

      Well you know what they say: 'make hay while the sun shines'. Maybe a bumper hay crop may offset some of your corn losses. Mind you, you are talking about political hay. I think there is a glut on the world market at the moment, at least of the US variety of hay.

    15. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Doing so would actually heat the Earth, in the long term. Any amount of Europan ice capable of cooling the oceans is going to increase sea level and therefore, sea surface area. That will lead to greater water vapor content at equilibrium. Water vapor is a greenhouse gas.

    16. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by BasilBrush · · Score: 4, Insightful

      In 1936, according to the article, it was almost as warm. Basically, a "so what?".

      Never read The Grapes of Wrath I take it.

      0.2 degrees higher than the the hottest month on record is certainly a notable event.

    17. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by BasilBrush · · Score: 4, Funny

      Cold temperatures in Celsius. Hot temperatures in Fahrenheit. It's the natural way.

    18. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Should we also rename Fahrenheit 451 to Celsius 232.778?

    19. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      What the critics are saying:

      http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/08/08/dear-noaa-and-seth-which-1930s-were-you-referring-to-when-you-say-july-is-the-record-warmest/

    20. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Forty+Two+Tenfold · · Score: 2
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    21. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Yes, well PV=nRT. Increased heat will increase pressure.

    22. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Obfuscant · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And the fact that weather is setting records across the globe year after year right now, is not a concern because equipment used in 1936 had almost the same reading?

      I think the fact that the previous record was set in 1936 pretty much disproves your "fact" that the weather is setting records "year after year". "Year after year" to most people means "every year or two", not "every 7 decades or so".

    23. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes

    24. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Smauler · · Score: 1

      depends how cold it is....

    25. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      WE are fucked.

      No we're not.

    26. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And the fact that weather is setting records across the globe year after year right now, is not a concern because equipment used in 1936 had almost the same reading?

      You know what, global environment change might be man made or natural cycle, but if it turns out to be man made, I hope you will do the honorable thing and let someone who tried to save the planet have your spot.

      This is a prime example of politics at play. Failing to run around and throw one's hands in the air is painted as "dishonorable", and somehow a threat to the existence of planet Earth. Such posturing, especially when practised by politicians funding research organizations, ensures that scientists hew close to the party line.

    27. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by c0lo · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Should we also rename Fahrenheit 451 to Celsius 232.778?

      505.928 Kelvin is better.

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    28. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The 5 stages of denial:

      1: It's not happening.
      2: It's happening, but it's no big deal.
      3: It's happening, it's a big deal, but there's nothing we can do.
      4: It's happening, it's a big deal, this is what we can do, but it's too expensive.
      5: It's happening, it's a big deal, this is what we can do, the alternative is worse, so let's just get on with it.

      Alright - we're at step 2 of the denial process! Looks like we've made progress in the last.... 25 years or so. I hope step 3 won't take another 25 years.

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    29. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Smauler · · Score: 2

      Incidental temperatures fucking are a coincidence. More storms, less rain, cold winters, whatever - it's not the issue. That's the argument AGW denialists have been using for years, ok?

      Headlines like this prove nothing - the overwhelming body of scientific literature shows that AGW does exist, and localised weather is not really a good indication of it (though some, especially those in the media, try to make it so).

    30. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I love it.... "Take the 1936 Texas below normal temperature out of the mix and there goes your 0.2F record making difference with July 2012." Of course, if you randomly take out data points you don't like, you're going to get the result you're looking for. Not to mention that their entire post focuses on the fact that not all states all linearly increased in temperatures, which betrays a complete lack of understanding of how temperatures are come about.

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    31. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Funny how I took that one small point so very differently than you did. Also interesting how you missed the part about adjusted data.

    32. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by AlienIntelligence · · Score: 1

      This July's record heat is only 0.2 degrees higher then the previous record. Let's not blow things out of proportion. (Unless you think the record set in the 1930s is indicative of global warming too?)

      Yeah, the new records they set in the Olympics were only milliseconds faster.
      Let's not give them a medal or anything. Cause you know.. you don't want to
      blow it out of proportion. What's a record anyway, if they are so close to each
      other. Amirite?

      -AI

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    33. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Farmer+Tim · · Score: 2, Funny

      Easily solved: use the much colder methane ice from Titan instead.

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    34. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by AlienIntelligence · · Score: 5, Informative

      I love it.... "Take the 1936 Texas below normal temperature out of the mix and there goes your 0.2F record making difference with July 2012." Of course, if you randomly take out data points you don't like, you're going to get the result you're looking for. Not to mention that their entire post focuses on the fact that not all states all linearly increased in temperatures, which betrays a complete lack of understanding of how temperatures are come about.

      FWIW, a graph tends to be of more value if you evaluate and potentially take out outlier points.
      If you are looking for trends. Also, some toss lowest and highest as well.

      Just saying.

      -AI

      --
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    35. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by arkane1234 · · Score: 1

      Actually, it's because the sun is on a direct collision course with earth.

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    36. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by arkane1234 · · Score: 2, Informative

      The dust bowl was not caused by temperatures, it was caused by severe drought coupled with decades of extensive farming without crop rotation, fallow fields, cover crops or other techniques to prevent wind erosion.

      It kinda was something other than nature that exasperated the situation.

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    37. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 4, Informative

      I think the fact that the previous record was set in 1936 pretty much disproves your "fact" that the weather is setting records "year after year". "Year after year" to most people means "every year or two", not "every 7 decades or so".

      Back in 2009 they were saying the it had been the warmest decade ever recorded, and the years between then and now haven't been any less exceptional either.

      So yeah, "setting records year after year" is a pretty accurate good description.

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    38. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by MightyYar · · Score: 1

      Always been a Rankine man myself...

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    39. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by dkleinsc · · Score: 1
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    40. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Muros · · Score: 1

      the overwhelming body of scientific literature shows that AGW does exist, and localised weather is not really a good indication of it (though some, especially those in the media, try to make it so).

      Where do you propose to define the cut-off point between weather and climate though? One is the average of the other. You can lose a lot of detail when you average everything.Don't know about where you live, but where I am, the weather has been strange,. Two of the last three winters had countryside buried in snow and ice for weeks on end where we usually get occasional frosts. So far this year, we've had dry sunny weather in spring when it usually rains, and it has been pissing rain all summer so bad that my father (cattle farmer) gave up on the land ever drying out and started making silage last week, ripping the ground to shit with tractors while still having to give fodder to the cattle. In the middle of the summer. Maybe its just a few strange years in a row in my little local area. But the weather has been really fucking weird for a few years. And people all across the world are saying the same thing.

    41. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And then we can burn it after it cools the oceans!

    42. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      For now it's still an outlier but in 10 or 20 years it may be the new normal.

    43. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by jcoy42 · · Score: 5, Informative

      No, poster is correct. It's called winsorising. It's common to toss out the top and bottom 5% just to discount anomalies.

      But you don't discount it after you see the data because you don't like it, you plan to discount it before you collect the data and more importantly you do it indiscriminately and equally on both sides of the data set. Not just points you don't like after you see the data.

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    44. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 0

      Maybe in the 1930's there was a 0.1% chance of a heat wave like that happening. Maybe now there is a 1% chance. Maybe in 20 or 30 years there's a 10% chance of it happening. If you raise the average temperature that's how the odds change out near the end of the bell curve.

    45. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by budgenator · · Score: 1

      3 decimal points on a thermometer, you had better be carefull or people will confuse you with a climatologist.

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    46. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      It's not surprising that record cold temperatures are still being set when the record is only a bit over 100 years old. Since the 1980's however the number of hot records being set has outnumbered the number of cold records being set by a considerable margin. If there were no global warming you'd expect the number of hot records and number of cold records to be approximately equal.

    47. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by budgenator · · Score: 1

      This July's record heat is only 0.2 degrees higher then the previous record. Let's not blow things out of proportion. (Unless you think the record set in the 1930s is indicative of global warming too?)

      Yeah, the new records they set in the Olympics were only milliseconds faster.

      Since the stopwatches only have tenth of a second resolution, we have to average the results of a 100 timers to get to milliseconds.

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    48. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      I could see tossing the outliers if you think they are *recording* anomolies. Tossing accurate measurements because they don't fit the nice linear graph you want to draw is just bad science.

      Taking out *valid* outliers doesn't give a graph "more value" to those wanting to understand the meaning behind the data, just to those wanting to use the data to justify their preconceived conclusions...

    49. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      Incidental temperatures fucking are a coincidence.

      I'm pretty sure if you ever see incidental temperatures fucking it's a very deliberate act.

    50. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by budgenator · · Score: 1

      Funny, I've heard of a lot of computer simulations, all predictting dire global warming due to increased CO2 in the atmosphere, but I've never heard of a simulation of what might happen if we actually managed to reduce CO2 in the atmosphere. Everybody assumes that if CO2 is predicted to cause continued warming, then reductions would cause cooling. but has anybody checked it out? Perhaps we can't get there from here!

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    51. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My AC bill was $5 cheaper in July than June, even with the extra day and *alleged* heat. Can't explain that!

    52. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by microbox · · Score: 1

      I think the fact that the previous record was set in 1936 pretty much disproves your "fact" that the weather is setting records "year after year". "Year after year" to most people means "every year or two", not "every 7 decades or so".

      This argument is pretty vacuous, since you are talking about a single record. A single point does not a trend make or disprove.

      Each year we have cold records broken, and warm records broken. There are 1000s of records that are being tracked. We are breaking warm records twice as often as cold records. Scientists predict that that ratio will increase, based on a physical understanding of the world that has undergone sustained and deep statistical analysis.

      But by all means, believe what you want. A single data point.

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    53. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Climate is a guy walking a dog.

      He goes from point A to point B in a reasonably straight line - but the dog is yip-yip-yipping all over the place, always tugging at the leash. Eventually, despite the dog's meanderings, they both get to point B.

      The dog is weather.

    54. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by yester64 · · Score: 1

      It wasn't so much about the temperature as more with the trend. The trend is going up, but who is to say. Just buy a better sun factor with your suncream and everything will be fine.

    55. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      Interesting statement Do you have a cite discussing this or is it the result of your own mental quantifiers?

    56. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Cyberax · · Score: 1

      Well, there are such simulations. They show that it's almost impossible to actually do this because a lot of "carbon sinks" would become "carbon spigots" once you reduce atmospheric CO2 concentration. But if you do this using some sort of magic - you'll get very rapid (months, not years!) cooling effect. (temperature will

    57. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Well, my cite would be James Hansen's recently published paper. He specifically discusses the shift of the normal distribution of temperatures toward the hot end of the scale due to global warming. The numbers I used were just pulled out of my ass but temperatures are distributed in a normal distribution (aka bell curve) with average temperatures most common and extreme temperatures the least common. It doesn't take much of a shift in the normal distribution to significantly increase the chances of a specific extreme temperature occurring.

      This post on Hansen's Sunday Op-Ed in the Washington post lays it out fairly well. Look down the page a bit at the graph titled "Shifting Distribution of Summer Temperature Anomalies" for an illustration of what I was talking about in the GP post.

    58. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not always bad science. It depends on how variable the system is. Comparing data from one set of measurements to another can be difficult if there is a lot of scatter in both data sets and measurement anomalies are common. A data point may be accurate but still be an anomaly. In such a case it helps to have a LOT of measurements for a certain variable condition so uncertainty can be characterized. If we are comparing record Julys, then there aren't many data points, and maybe it is OK to toss a low temperature.

      It is always nice when reading a paper to have a good description of the measurement method, number of data points and an explanation of the uncertainty analysis. I didn't read the article, so I don't know if that happened here. I just know that Ph.D.s the world over toss outlier data points to make a trend clearer, and they frequently aren't wrong to do so. It is best to redo experiments that produce lots of outliers using a different measurement method to confirm a trend, though I have seen this help and hurt uncertainty.

    59. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 0

      lol. Hansen.. I tend not to put much faith or credit in people who use stage tricks to exaggerate a point then claim it was justifiable because of his own belief in the urgency of it. He's sort of like the crazy guy on the street corner claiming the world is going to end on a specific date then running out in front of a bus on that day.

    60. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      You can denigrate Hansen all you want but most of his predictions have proven to be on the conservative side.

    61. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by JDG1980 · · Score: 1

      Unless you know some way for the atmosphere to clear all the heat trapping CO2 we've been dumping for the past 100 years

      Step 1: Plant a shitload of fast-growing trees.

      Step 2: When they reach maturity, cut them down and bury or sink the wood. (Or use it for furniture or housing if it's suitable.)

      Step 3: Repeat.

    62. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 1

      That's the point - you either decide beforehand how you account for systematic errors and potential faulty measurements, and discard data on both ends of the spectrum. You don't just say "I'm lopping off the bottom part, and now the data proves that another data set has a lower average."

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    63. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      True. Temperatures are caused by thermometers... if there's a temperature problem, that's the first thing we need to get rid of.

    64. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by dwillden · · Score: 1

      The athletes don't get medals for setting new records, they get the medals for winning their event, regardless of whether or not they set a record.

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    65. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Simploid · · Score: 1

      In 1936, according to the article, it was almost as warm. Basically, a "so what?". Between then and now, States have had record cold temperatures as well. This report would be just one more Jeopardy! item, were it not for the political hay that will be made of it.

      yeah, and that's without even considering inflation!!

    66. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 2, Informative

      "Headlines like this prove nothing - the overwhelming body of scientific literature shows that AGW does exist,"

      No, it really doesn't. It hasn't been proved, just marketed better than the other theories (which seem to explain things better).

      If you're so sure of this tell me what % of carbon is mans contribution.

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    67. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by dbIII · · Score: 1

      That's right, what do those NASA guys know?
      Sorry kid - YOU are the crazy guy on the street corner from that long string of weird posts you've put here.

    68. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 1

      It did this in the 80s. El Nino.

      The drought in the us has everything to do with bad land management and very little to do with the weather; they accelerated biological succession about 5000 years because of insane industrial processing of the land before figuring out what an "ecosystem" is.

      They did this in Babylon too, the dumb shits, and that's why you can't see the hanging gardens. They blamed the gods of course, you can blame the Mayans or CO2 or whatever gets you through the night but the actual science is a bit more complicated than that.

      Very few thigs in this world are static - coastlines, temperatures, ice levels, they bound around all over the place, they always have and always will. Why would anybody think these things are static or predictable?

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    69. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Yeah, about that deep statistical analysis. I went to Waterloo in the 80s in the math faculty and I went back 2 years ago just to have a look around, and found myself in the stats department, a hall with about 12 offices.

      You know how those office doors have jokes on them? 3 of the doors had the math behind the IPCC model with snide comments and exclamation marks. If you think their math is valid I don't think you've sought professional guidance there.

      Follow the money.

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    70. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Pretty much. "Survival of the fittest" means that which can adapt best, not that which is most fit for a certain static set of conditions (which doesn't really occur in nature).

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    71. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 1

      "0.2 degrees higher than the the hottest month on record is certainly a notable event."

      No, it's a data point and doesn't matter. Trends do.

      If you cut down all the trees you get a desert. No matter what the climate.

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    72. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      How about I just pay attention to the scientists who don't remind you of a cross between a used car salesman and a TV evangelist preacher.

    73. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      Actually, you are the crazy one here. You must be having conversations in your head and thinking I was actually there or something. I never said a NASA guy didn't know anything, I said I do not pay attention to him because he pulled some crap in the past in order to increased the perceived value of his statements and validated by saying his opinion matters more then exaggerating claims.

    74. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 1

      You are aware there's two major types of plants on earth, low co2 ones and high co2 ones right? (Go look up CAM plants in Wiki)

      And you are aware the IPCC sort of ignored the fact that plants eat co2 right?

      http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/12/08/new_model_doubled_co2_sub_2_degrees_warming/

      "n particular, green plants can be expected to grow as they find it easier to harvest carbon from the air around them using energy from the sun: thus introducing a negative feedback into the warming/carbon process. Most current climate models don't account for this at all, according to Bounoua. Some do, but they fail to accurately simulate the effects – they don't allow for the fact that plants in a high-CO2 atmosphere will "down-regulate" and so use water more efficiently.

      Increase in precipitation contributes primarily to increase evapotranspiration rather than surface runoff, consistent with observations, and results in an additional cooling effect not fully accounted for in previous simulations with elevated CO2.
      The NASA and NOAA boffins used their more accurate science to model a world where CO2 levels have doubled to 780 parts per million (ppm) compared to today's 390-odd. They say that world would actually warm up by just 1.64C overall, and the vegetation-cooling effect would be stronger over land to boot – thus temperatures on land would would be a further 0.3C cooler compared to the present sims."

      It took 10 years to drive this point into their skulls and they haven't even noticed all plants aren't created equal yet. They will.

      A decade ago suggestions plants might eat co2 with a positive feedback was scoffed at - because of one paper that tried to bring dead grass back to live in a desert and failed (no water, ahem). It was at that point I knew something wasn't right and the more you look the less right it gets. But if you only believe what Time prints you get what you deserve.

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    75. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 1

      This is Dysons suggestion. You could also make homes out of the wood. Just a thought.

      Actually if we hadn't cut down or otherwise nearly all the trees in the world things might be a little different right now.

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    76. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Bonus. I live in Canada. Bring it.

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    77. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, the whole point of "Farenheit 451" was that the society was run by a bunch of morons anyway, so we can leave it.. the title is intentionally using an outdated and illogical scale.

    78. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I think you are all missing the point. He was pointing out that the majority of the US was actually hotter in '36 than today, except that Texas brought the average down. Get it? Sheesh.

    79. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      More critical response:

      http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/08/08/an-incovenient-result-july-2012-not-a-record-breaker-according-to-the-new-noaancdc-national-climate-reference-network/

    80. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by fatphil · · Score: 1

      I thought that was just a réaumur.

      --
      Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
    81. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by fatphil · · Score: 1

      Screw you, slashdot, and your broken double-escaping of my e-acute.

      --
      Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
    82. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by fatphil · · Score: 1

      Exacerbated, though I like the idea of a dust-bowl being exasperated.

      --
      Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
    83. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 1

      Actually, if you are looking for trends, the succession of highs and lows is often far more predictive. The middle is often muddled.

    84. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 0

      You are a denialist, we got the point. And an anonymous coward.

    85. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 1

      Because as we all know, people you don't like couldn't possibly have any insight into the statistical thermodynamics of gases.

    86. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 1

      Well, you are earning your username.

    87. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 1
      The fall of the Akkadian period is directly related to a global period of cooling and a shift from wetter to drier conditions. The Neo-Babylonian Empire fell to the Persians, there was no agrarian collapse. As for agriculture, there are still people's living in the reed swamps near the Persian gulf using an agricultural system largely untouched for the last 5000 years.

      As for static and predictable: human civilization is the gift of one of the longest stable climate periods in the last million years, screwing that up would be an event of, quite literally, biblical proportions.

    88. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 1

      40 years ago they would have been throwing the "n" word around just to prove that they don't pay attention to any of that liberal science that says that we are all human.

    89. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 1

      The future is fucked, there are plenty of people doing quite well making the death bet.

    90. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're an idiot...

    91. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      lol - yep that's about it.

    92. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by tbannist · · Score: 1

      No, it's a data point and doesn't matter. Trends do.

      It's still a notable event. It could be an outlier, but every outlier is a notable event as well.

      If you cut down all the trees you get a desert. No matter what the climate.

      Actually, you usually don't. Usually the trees grow back (it takes time), sometimes you get grass land or savannah. The problem may be that you don't understand what a desert is. It's classified as "a landscape or region that receives an extremely low amount of precipitation, less than enough to support growth of most plants", cutting the trees down usually doesn't have that much effect on regional precipitation patterns.

      --
      Fanatically anti-fanatical
    93. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It kinda was something other than nature that exasperated the situation.

      I think the word you were looking for is "exacerbated" :-)

    94. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      "Because as we all know, people who0 have exaggerated claims, participated in fraud, and justified it with how they "felt about the situation", couldn't possibly have any insight into the statistical thermodynamics of gases."

      FTFY.

      And it isn't that they won't have any insight, its that I do not want to spend the effort weeding through the bullshit to find it from the exaggerations.

    95. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by microbox · · Score: 1

      You know how those office doors have jokes on them? 3 of the doors had the math behind the IPCC model with snide comments and exclamation marks. If you think their math is valid I don't think you've sought professional guidance there.

      Sounds like bullshit to me. These mathematicians could advance their careers by publishing -- something that academics are under pressure to do.

      Follow the money.

      Indeed. Follow the money. But really, you just gotta know what a cognitive bubble is to understand how "skeptics" can firewall themselves from their elementary mistakes.

      --

      Like all pain, suffering is a signal that something isn't right
    96. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 1
      Sorry, "Fuck That, Fuck You" is not an answer. I note that you don't supply any links, because then everyone could see that your source for your allegation is commieblaster and other denialist sites.

      You're pathetic.

    97. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Two of the last three winters had countryside buried in snow and ice for weeks on end where we usually get occasional frosts.

      Which has happened before and will happen again. Period.

      People seem to forget that high records have long been set. With your logic, the world came to an end in the early 1900s.

      Honestly, climate trending on anything other than something around 1000 years is dumb.

      Interestingly enough, you exact same argument was used by pro-GW people to dismiss information which disproved global warming.

      People here are constantly confused about what climate is. Climate is weather trending over large spans of time. In relationship to most of the global warming data, the information provided in this article is literally garbage. That, however, doesn't mean the data taken as part of a much larger sampling is garbage.

    98. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by ralphdaugherty · · Score: 1

      We'd have to cut it nearly in half to get back to 1850 pre-industrial revolution CO2 levels. btw, all of that CO2 since then is from fossil fuels whose carbon has not been in atmosphere since before dinosaurs. This is what people do not understand, for example your question.

    99. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Maybe it would be helpful if you cited an example of Hansen's exaggerated claims. Then we could talk about something of substance rather than you attacking Hansen for perceived character flaws.

    100. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What the f*ck. The planet is around 4.5 billion years old. We have been collecting accurate weather records for little more than 100 years. As any staistician will tell you: the data is meaningless. We should expect to be setting records the longer we collect data. Since our statistical sample is too small by thousands of years.

      Climate Change as any 8 year old will tell you is based on the weather which is inherently non-predictable. Atmospheric and Solar Dynamics are coupled sets of non-linear partial differential equations that cannot be solved. No matter what iterative scheme you use the solutions are gibberish because insufficient boundary and initial value data exists.

      We cannot predict next month's weather accurately so why would we let the same pile of scientists predict it for the infinite future? This is nothing more than Socialism which having lost at the polling place, (Socialism is dead everywhere but in college faculty) seeks to creep back as regulation.

      There is an upside to global warming: food prices will drop as the enzymatic machinery in plants run faster. This can save millions of the world's poorest from starvation. Al "Daddy gave me a zinc mine" Gore should not have gotten the Nobel Prize for his insipid movie. He should have his testicles nailed to his forehead for wanting to condemn millions of the world's poor to death via starvation as his idiotic policies slowly strangle the western world's economies. It won't bother Laureate Al (if I had a Nobel prize in physics I would give it back in shame) because he is fat, happy, and apparently horny as he globe trots in a private jet spewing lies and gibberish while always looking for that next 'rub and a tug'. I'll bet when it comes to tip his relaxation therapist he is a cheapskate.

    101. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you cut down all the trees you get a desert. No matter what the climate.

      Thanks for showing us that your forestry expertise is roughly equal to your climate expertise.

    102. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by hazah · · Score: 1

      Now I'm confused... can someone please explain to me how this could possibly be understood as flamebait? I also don't get the joke either, and all that was meant is basically "why".

    103. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Red+Flayer · · Score: 1

      I also would like to mention that tillage technology & methods played a big role. There was a big push of settlers moving west who tilled their soil extremely fine before planting... once they started clump-tilling instead, the dust problem wasn't near as bad.

      --
      "Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
    104. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It snowed in South Africa last week.

    105. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

      No, poster is correct. It's called winsorising. It's common to toss out the top and bottom 5% just to discount anomalies.

      But that is exactly what they didn't do. They only took out a low value state instead one low and one high. And they also didn't pick the lowest "below average" value (Maine, which had an actual all time record cold for that month), but that of the largest state with below average temp - which means more low station values to drop.

      --
      Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
    106. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fuck you too asshole.

    107. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by mcgrew · · Score: 1

      No it is god punishing you for using fahrenheit.

      It's a story about temperatures in the US, on a US-based web site, using US nomenclature. If it were about records in Europe, C would be more appropriate, but it's about the US. And as you noted, Google ain't hard to use.

    108. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sexconker · · Score: 1

      They looked at the data THEN decided they didn't like certain data points. That's not Winsorization, that's bullshit.
      You're dumb, and dumbshit slashdot modded you +5 because you included a wikipedia link.

      Furthermore, Winsorization itself is bullshit. ALL data is valid unless you have an actual reason to discount it (known to be an inaccurate measurement, etc.). The desire to make data fit a preconceived model is what drives people to discount data, and discounting data results in shittier models.

    109. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      sigh... James Hansen (with a couple democrat staffers in 1988) has been involved in turning the AC units off in congress claiming they were broken on the historically hottest day of the year in order to exaggerate his clams of global warming. The day wasn't an accident either, he admitted in an interview that they looked up the day and month that was statistically the hottest and orchestrated a scheduling to make sure it was that day so congress would be baking in the heat when he went and told them the world is getting hotter.

      Then there is the work of other scientists like Dr. Hoerling who come right out and say he's exaggerating perception and not doing science.

      There is a wealth of well known information about him. I suggest you learn for yourself.

    110. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      Actually, it's fuck that, fuck him and yes, it is perfectly good enough for all that he deserves. Obviously you don't think so, so you can continue to suck his cock all you want.

      When other scientists who do not exaggerate things like Hansen's co worker Dr. Hoerling come right out and say Hansen's latest puke of an article isn't science, I tend to not care about your insistence on honoring the shill.

    111. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hell, no, it's cherry-picking time! It was only two tenths of a degree warmer than it was 76 years ago! So, there's nothing to see, move along!

    112. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Right, the climate changed. it does that. See also "biological succession".

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    113. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 1

      I'm just telling you what I saw. The math is a butt of jokes. Call them yourself to verify this. Google is your friend.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    114. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by rs79 · · Score: 1

      I'm sorry, you seem to be unaware of what happened or don't understand biology or both because this makes no sense and is nothing to do with what happened. They do actually have books for this sort of thing.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    115. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Dahamma · · Score: 1

      If we are comparing record Julys, then there aren't many data points, and maybe it is OK to toss a low temperature.

      Records are almost by definition outliers, so tossing them out defeats the whole point.

      And as I said, if it's a possible measurement anomaly, that's one thing. But no reason to talk in generalities here, it was a simple *temperature* measurement where no one is contesting the data point or measurement technique, just whether it should be ignored since it was "not normal".

    116. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      1: It's not happening.
      2: It's happening, but it's no big deal.
      3: It's happening, it's a big deal, but there's nothing we can do.
      4: It's happening, it's a big deal, this is what we can do, but it's too expensive.
      5: It's happening, it's a big deal, this is what we can do, the alternative is worse, so let's just get on with it.

      6: ???
      7: PROFIT!

    117. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Grumbleduke · · Score: 1

      If you're so sure of this tell me what % of carbon is mans contribution.

      Last time I checked, 100% of carbon has been contributed by a star. It forms when three helium nuclei fuse together, but that requires something like 100MK of temperature, and an awful lot of helium close together. You don't tend to get that outside large stars. The carbon is then scattered throughout the universe via supernovae. Of course like all science, that's just a theory. It hasn't been proved, and unlike global warming, no one has measured it occurring directly, so it could be completely wrong.

      Oh wait, you were trying to talk about something completely different; global warming/climate change and the impact human activity (particularly the burning of fossil fuels, releasing carbon dioxide into the atmosphere) is having on average global temperatures. If you want scientific opinions on it (rather than the general public's, politician's or the media's - and when it comes to science, what they have to say is pretty meaningless), this is probably worth a read.

      I'm no scientist, but to be blunt, it doesn't really matter how much of it is our fault. Imagine there is a leak in the roof of your house, but it just so happens to be over a bathtub. The bath seems to be filling up with water, (but gradually, sometimes going down, but trending upwards). Some of that water is coming in via the roof (because it is raining), and some is coming from the taps (which you have turned on because you were going to have a bath). Do you:

      (a) turn the taps off, make sure the plug is out, and hope that the water drains fast enough so that the room doesn't flood before the rain stops (and maybe try to fix the hole in the roof when you can),
      (b) leave the taps where they are, arguing that the tap water is probably not having much of an effect (you can't prove it is), or
      (c) turn the taps on full, using the above argument, but also pointing out that you want to have a bath, and it's easier (and faster) to run the bath from the taps, and if it floods, well that's someone else's problem, at least you'll have had your bath.

      Of course, even if science does say global warming is happening, is going to be pretty disastrous for our civilisations (but not for the planet; we'd need to really screw things up before we cause damage that affects things in geological time-spans), and humans are contributing to it, that doesn't mean we should stop. That's the political decision, and it is up to politicians and the general public to decide what to do (as it should be). The best scientists can do is present them with facts, theories and suggestions, if they don't want to listen, that's their choice. The 'evil' (and I use the word reluctantly) side to the "climate change" debate is those politicians who, in order to cover their decision to ignore the scientific advice for their own goals, try to distort the scientific message by spreading misinformation, fear, uncertainty and doubt.

      Scientists should deal with the science aspects, politicians with the political. When politicians try to meddle with science, you tend to get problems (although strangely enough it doesn't seem to be a problem the other way around...).

      [Disclaimer: I am not a scientist (although I may have been one in the past), but am, in theory, a politician. I do, however, remember learning about global warming, its causes and local effects (hotter summers, colder winters etc.) in school, along with the other major problem at the time, the hole in the ozone layer. We were taught that the science said the former was partly due to the burning of fossil fuels, and the latter by the use of CFCs. In the mid 90s, production of CFCs was banned in much of the world, and it looks like the rate of ozone depletion is decreasing as a r

    118. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Hah, I hoped you'd come up with something more recent than 24 years ago. That doesn't have anything to do with science. Why don't you come up with an actual scientific point that you think he's exaggerated. There are a few things he's said that seem a bit extreme to me but they all involve predictions for sometime in the far future (50-300 years out) so it's impossible to judge them yet. I've followed what Hansen has said fairly closely over the years and as I said he's been pretty much a bit on the conservative side with is actual scientific predictions.

    119. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by HArchH · · Score: 1

      ...who WAS washing...

    120. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by HArchH · · Score: 1

      Less than a half degree warmer than 1935.

      Any form of energy used results in the release of heat.

    121. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by HArchH · · Score: 1

      Sorry...didn't see your same point already posted.

      Science abhors a vacuum. It requires the generation of an explanation for everything and the answer "I don't know yet" is apparently not acceptable.

      Not unlike "dark matter" and "dark energy" which I heard described as "I don't know #1" and "I don't know #2". Refreshingly honest.

      People here seem to forget why hypothesis and theories exist and don't appreciate the value of differing opinions. Like children, perhaps?

    122. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by HArchH · · Score: 1

      We've only been keeping records for 150 (?) years. Geologically that's nothing. That's even nothing related to the time since the last ice age ended, back when global warming was thought to be a good thing. (not sure who thought that though. :)

    123. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by HArchH · · Score: 1

      Perhaps, just for consideration, we really do not understand?

      Say it with me...it won't hurt...

      "We do not know"

      "We do not know"

    124. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      Why? I never said his science was wrong, although many others have pointed to his flaws in the past and he has had to correct it. You do not think his latest BS is actually science do you? No, it's an opinion he is making while pretending it is science. This is obvious considering that in 2004 the blame for Europe's weather changes was placed on changes in the north Atlantic current and the Atlantic multidecadal oscillation which has a cycle of about 70 years and was known for a while that weather patters would change with it. So here we have your preacher cherry picking a time span that falls within this 70 years pointing to the changes in weather claiming it's proof of global warming when the entire time before the claim was claiming weather is not climate and you couldn't use weather to prove or disprove climate change- until something magically changed now.

      Does that mean he has lied? I don't know, but it does mean that I'm not jumping at his claims like premature ejaculation in a whore house full of teen age kids getting their first piece. Hansen is a shill and doesn't deserve to be trusted. You badgering me will not change my mind, it will only make you look the same.

    125. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by notonthegrid · · Score: 1

      Let's experiment... Let's bulldoze NYC and surrounds, and maybe San Fran and surrounds, into the ocean. Replace all that asphalt with grassy knolls and trees, and see if that makes a difference in the temp readings we take from those areas.

    126. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by MightyYar · · Score: 1

      You need to take that up with Dr. Seuss... :)

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    127. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by tbannist · · Score: 1

      Maybe if you were to provide some details or evidence as to what you're talking about? You wrote "If you cut down all the trees you get a desert. No matter what the climate." Which is clearly false on the face of it. Maybe you'd like to provide some mitigating context? If you're specifically talking about the Dust Bowl, the causes are more complex than "cut down all the trees [and] you get a desert".

      --
      Fanatically anti-fanatical
    128. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by microbox · · Score: 1

      Call who in particular. Tell me which professors you are talking about, and I will get in touch with them.

      Google is the perfect friend of the cognitive bubble. You know what that is, right? Well, let's put this to the test. Let's find out who these professors are, what they really believe, and why.

      --

      Like all pain, suffering is a signal that something isn't right
    129. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 1
      Sorry the truth bothers so many people around here. 1936 was the hottest summer on record, as well as the most active atlantic tropical season until 2005. However, it was one of the coldest winters. Rather than being like this year, that has had record or near record months, one right after another.

      Nice to see that you are a sock puppet as well as a dishonorable cheat for moderating with another account while trolling as an AC. I hope you are getting paid well for the amount of negative karma you are racking up.

    130. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by budgenator · · Score: 1

      Even calling our present levels 400ppm, that would be 200ppm, 180ppm is iceball Earth levels, 150 ppm is extintion levels where plants sufficate and die. the 1850's were more like 280 ppm, my calculator says 280/390 is 0.72, a bit over a quarter, not a half.

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
    131. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Hansen's latest paper is a statistical analysis of long term changes in global temperatures. That is exactly what climate science is about, the statistics of aggregated weather events. Individual weather events such as an extra cold winter storm or a heat wave are not climate but when you examine the patterns of many events over time it is climate. As I said you can denigrate Hansen all you want but his work has stood up well compared to actual observations.

    132. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by gzuckier · · Score: 1

      lol. Hansen.. I tend not to put much faith or credit in people who use stage tricks to exaggerate a point then claim it was justifiable because of his own belief in the urgency of it. He's sort of like the crazy guy on the street corner claiming the world is going to end on a specific date then running out in front of a bus on that day.

      Hmmmmm..... PNAS, random guy on Slashdot who makes a lot of insinuations without any references; PNAS, random guy on Slashdot who makes a lot of insinuations without any references; ..... whose opinion on Hansen's work should I believe? just too hard to decide.

      --
      Star Trek transporters are just 3d printers.
    133. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by gzuckier · · Score: 1

      You realize that you're talking about Senator Timothy Wirth, not Hansen, right? Wirth tells the "funny story" about what he did the day when Hansen was to speak, I know you guys think all us AGW folks are in collusion, pawns of the all-powerful climatology lobby and all.

      --
      Star Trek transporters are just 3d printers.
    134. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You know how those office doors have jokes on them? 3 of the doors had the math behind the IPCC model with snide comments and exclamation marks. If you think their math is valid I don't think you've sought professional guidance there.

      Follow the money.

      ZOMG, how could I ever doubt you!? This is the most factishish thingy-provingy writing me have ever read, it's un-credible!!!

    135. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What happened, and where? What are you babbling about, and what does it have to do with your claim that cutting all the trees will invariably result in desert?

      You got 'em books? Great, let's hear a citation...

    136. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just make shit up about people you disagree with. That's called a dick move. I find it fascinating how otherwise intelligent people can pull shit like that with a straight face. But there you go.

    137. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      And as I said, when another scientist who isn't Hansen makes the same claim, I would be interested. Until then, I'm uninterested.

    138. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      No, I'm talking about Hansen and Wirth, who's staff coordinated with Hansen. Hansen has admitted to it and even said that exaggerating the effects of AGW was acceptable in the beginning because he thought the urgency of it warranted it to get the word out. You can't say Hansen isn't an activist, he's constantly getting tossed in jail for his activism and rewarded shit tons of money for his activism from Global warming groups. Remember all the crapstorm a few years ago where he had to redo his ethics reporting to the government because he wasn't disclosing those sources?

    139. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by lsatenstein · · Score: 1

      It was God punishing people for practicing science so boldly in the open, no doubt.

      In other words, Believing in GW Bush, who put his head in the ground and flatly stated, "Global Warming, what's that? It is a myth! Go petroleum companies go!".

      The predictions that I read are than within 25 years Arizona will be inhabitable in the summer, Texas shortly thereafter or even before, and the american desert will expand significantly in size.
      Its not all the USA's fault. Big contributors are China, India, Russia, and Pakistan. But the USA stopped burning coal for electricity, and used more solar and wind for energy, it would make a very small but important dent in global warming.

      As for agriculture, my recommendation is for cultivators (can't say farmers as farmers have disappeared, to be replaced by large corporations), to visit Israel. Israel has same weather almost all year round as Arizona, but Israel is drier. Israel has a water shortage, but they use drip irrigation to raise crops. They also have a very large tree planting program, to reclaim desert and actually moderate high temperatures..

      --
      Leslie Satenstein Montreal Quebec Canada
    140. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      Why don't you do this thing called think for yourself and examine all the criticisms about Hansen and all the support for him out there then make any decision you think you are trying to make. I said I tend not to put much faith or credit in him or people that act like him, not that you couldn't. Seriously, hanging him as infallible and irreproachable because he got a membership or title is about as silly as basing everything on a single person's online opinion.

      Politicians, preachers, cops, judges, are all people who have memberships and titles and even though we expect them to be infallible and irreproachable, tend to end up being self serving and corrupt quite often. I bet if you think about it, you can find more.

    141. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Not that I expect it to sway your opinion but here are some comments on the paper by other scientists:

      The science in Hansen’s study is excellent “and reframes the question,” said Andrew Weaver, a climate scientist at the University of Victoria in British Columbia.

              Another upcoming study by Kevin Trenberth, climate analysis chief at the National Center for Atmospheric Research, links the 2010 Russian heat wave to global warming by looking at the underlying weather that caused the heat wave. He called Hansen’s paper an important one that helps communicate the problem.

              White House science adviser John Holdren praised the paper’s findings in a statement: “This work, which finds that extremely hot summers are over 10 times more common than they used to be, reinforces many other lines of evidence showing that climate change is occurring and that it is harmful.”

                Granger Morgan, head of engineering and public policy at Carnegie Mellon University, called Hansen’s study “an important next step in what I expect will be a growing set of statistically-based arguments.”

    142. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      And here is one you'll probably laugh at because of the source:

      James Hansen’s latest findings linking extreme weather to climate change is science society cannot afford to ignore.

      by Michael Mann, via The Daily Climate

      The first scientist to alert Americans to the prospect that human-caused climate change and global warming was already upon us was NASA climatologist James Hansen. In a sweltering Senate hall during the hot, dry summer of 1988, Hansen announced that “it is time to stop waffling. The evidence is pretty strong that the [human-amplified] greenhouse effect is here.”

      At the time, many scientists felt his announcement to be premature. I was among them.

      I was a young graduate student researching the importance of natural – rather than human-caused – variations in temperature, and I felt that the “signal” of human-caused climate change had not yet emerged from the “noise” of natural, long-term climate variation. As I discuss in my book, The Hockey Stick and the Climate Wars, scientists by their very nature tend to be conservative, even reticent, when it comes to discussing findings and observations that lie at the forefront of our understanding and that aren’t yet part of the “accepted” body of scientific knowledge.

      Dire warning

      Hansen, it turns out, was right, and the critics were wrong. Rather than being reckless, as some of his critics charged, his announcement to the world proved to be prescient – and his critics were proven overly cautious.

      Given the prescience of Hansen’s science, we would be unwise to ignore his latest, more dire warning.

      In a paper published today in the prestigious journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, Hansen and two colleagues argue convincingly that climate change is now not only upon us, but in fact we are fully immersed in it. Much of the extreme weather we have witnessed in recent years almost certainly contains a human-induced component.

      Hansen, in his latest paper, shows that the increase in probability of hot summers due to global warming is such that what was once considered an unusually hot summer has now become typical, and what was once considered typical will soon become a thing of the past – a summer too improbably cool to anymore expect.

      We need to view this summer’s extreme weather in this wider context.

      Not random

      It is not simply a set of random events occurring in isolation, but part of a broader emerging pattern. We are seeing, in much of the extreme weather we are experiencing, the “loading of the weather dice.” Over the past decade, records for daily maximum high temperatures in the U.S. have been broken at twice the rate we would expect from chance alone. Think of this as rolling double sixes twice as often as you’d expect – something you would readily notice in a high stakes game of dice. Thus far this year, that ratio is close to 10 to 1. That’s double sixes coming up ten times as often as you expect.

      So the record-breaking heat this summer over so much of the United States, where records that have stood since the Dust Bowl years of the 1930s are now dropping like flies, isn’t just a fluke of nature; it is the loading of the weather dice playing out in real time.

      The record heat – and the dry soils associated with it – played a role in the unprecedented forest fires that wrought death and destruction in Colorado and New Mexico. It played a role in the hot and bone-dry conditions over the nation’s breadbasket that has decimated U.S. agricultural yields. It played a role in the unprecedented 50 percent of the U.S. finding itself in extreme drought.

      Other threats

      Climate change is also threatening us in other ways of course, subjecting our coastal cities to increased

    143. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by gzuckier · · Score: 1

      Why don't you do this thing called think for yourself and examine all the criticisms about Hansen and all the support for him out there then make any decision you think you are trying to make.

      I did. Feel better now?

      --
      Star Trek transporters are just 3d printers.
    144. Re:Hopefully it's an outlier by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      There you go then.

  2. All except Washington by toejam13 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    According to this report, global warming will make western Washington even gloomier than it already is. So while the rest of the nation bakes, people in Seattle will be perfectly comfortable while they're being glum.

    1. Re:All except Washington by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Time to buy more coffee futures. I certainly can't afford the coffee today.

    2. Re:All except Washington by rrohbeck · · Score: 1

      Sorry, coffee is one of the plants severely affected by global warming.
      http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-502303_162-20121250.html

    3. Re:All except Washington by bobcat7677 · · Score: 1

      I live in the Portland, Oregon area. I can tell you it's not much less gloomy and wet here. Record rainfall in both June and July. Now it's the beginning of August and I am wearing a coat in the middle of the day to stay warm. Feels more like an ice age then global warming here.

    4. Re:All except Washington by DarthBling · · Score: 1

      It's been pretty cool here in the Pacific Northwest all year. In fact, we just had our first day above 90 degrees last Saturday here in Portland.

    5. Re:All except Washington by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I live in the Portland, Oregon area. I can tell you it's not much less gloomy and wet here. Record rainfall in both June and July. Now it's the beginning of August and I am wearing a coat in the middle of the day to stay warm. Feels more like an ice age then global warming here.

      Its ike 72 degrees outside man, move around

    6. Re:All except Washington by houghi · · Score: 1

      There is a "hell freezing over" joke somewhere. Oh wait, DC?

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    7. Re:All except Washington by Boronx · · Score: 1

      Isn't that a reason to buy futures?

    8. Re:All except Washington by fredgiblet · · Score: 1

      I live in Vancouver and work in Portland. You're either full of shit or you moved here from California. TODAY isn't bad, last week was terrible.

    9. Re:All except Washington by Smauler · · Score: 1

      Can't believe anyone from the UK hasn't replied yet - June was literally absurd in terms of rain here - Where I live, we get an average of 12 inches of rain per _year_, distributed evenly between the months, on average.

    10. Re:All except Washington by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No Seattelites will think God is punishing them...

      from Bill Cosby "Seattle" (I Started Out as a Child).

      I want to tell you about Seattle, Washington, then I'm going. Seattle, Washington is a city as far as the weather is concerned, they're a little backwards. Now, in Seattle, uh, they have rain at least 365 days a year. So; therefore, they don't know anything about... the sun. As a matter of fact they think the sun is EVIL! You know, when the sun comes up, "What did we do?" "Is our town bad?" You know, "What have we done?" They go out and cut a calf and put him up on a rock, you know, that kind of thing. But ah... no it's the truth! You can see them out there, they don't know the difference. You know they're out on the beach, when it's raining, getting a rain tan, you know they're out there, and they think the more wrinkled the body the better you look! You know, really! "You look like a prune!" "Thanks a lot! I appreciate that!" It's the truth! You ask anyone from Seattle, "Do you like the sun?" "NO!" "Why?" "It dries up the sinuses! That's why! I can't breathe!" They've got little gull slits on their raincoats, and stuff like that.

    11. Re:All except Washington by TapeCutter · · Score: 1

      The last two years have been the wettest on record here in Oz, this was preceded by our worst and longest drought. That's what climate scientists mean when they say extremes will be more common. James Hansen has a new paper in the Journal of Science (it's pay-walled) that estimates the recent level of extreme events we are seeing have only a 0.1% chance of happening in the absence of AGW, (N hemisphere only). He uses the concept of loaded dice to illustrate what this means, it's not a difficult concept to grasp and is backed up by solid evidence published in a highly regarded peer-review journal. Arguing about the 1930's dustbowl is irrelevant, it's not about comparing single events in a particular region, it's about the rate at which those (and more extreme) events can be expected to occur. One dustbowl per century is tragic but manageable, one per decade would be catastrophic.

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
    12. Re:All except Washington by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      You are obviously not a native if you're wearing a coat when it's warmer than 50 F.

    13. Re:All except Washington by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I was there last saturday. 100 degrees wasn't particularly cold.

    14. Re:All except Washington by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Add to that the random Indian attacks.

      For all you people roasting away, enviously looking at the tv weather report thinking it must be so nice out there, it really sucks living out here. Summer is too cold. Too many hipsters, riding their white-rimmed fixie bikes, wearing their skinny jeans. Too many rednecks (oh wait, that's only in Kent, Lynnwood or Clackamas). Too many granolas.

      The beers are ok, as long as you like pale ales. No, not really. The beers all suck and taste the same. Different than corporate beer, yes, but they still all taste the same. And coffee. Do you really want to get into a hipster argument about whether Starbucks is better than Peets, Tully's, or McDonald's? No.

      And, there are hardly any Walmarts. If you're lucky, a tiny Safeway or Albertson's, you know, where normal people buy groceries.
      The traffic sucks compared to where you live, 24x7. And mass transit is just rolling freakshows every day.

      You think it's fun watching "Portlandia" and laughing at it, thinking, it can't POSSIBLY be like that? Well, it is! And the taxes are insane and ludicrous. As soon as October hits, you'll be trying to book your vacations to Reno, Wichita, Baton Rouge, anywhere with sunlight, while you're hopelessly trying to use your computer monitor as an indoor sun light. And all they play on the radio and every pa system is Heart, Nirvana, Presidents of the United States, Alice & Chains, and Soundgarden. Better like salmon for Thanksgiving. They don't sell turkeys for thanksgiving out here. Bunch of pinko-commie tree huggers with "sustainable" salmon.

      You've been advised to stay away.

    15. Re:All except Washington by budgenator · · Score: 1

      Not to worry, I just put a down payment on a rich volcanic soil coffee plantation in Iceland; take that Juan Valdez!

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
    16. Re:All except Washington by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      WTF are you talking about, it was 97F on Saturday in Portland. Not what I would call rainy or gloomy. And whats this about a coat?

    17. Re:All except Washington by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Extreme weather is bound to happen. Whether or not it is related to global warming, I say we should cut pollution for the sake of cutting pollution.

    18. Re:All except Washington by Mindcontrolled · · Score: 1

      We have seen a southward shift of the Jet Stream during summertime for the last couple of years, which leads to increased rainfall over UK. You better get used to it, this seems to become the new normal - Faroer/Iceland-style summers for you guys, sorry.

      --
      Ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant.
    19. Re:All except Washington by dbIII · · Score: 3, Funny

      If there's no coffee I don't care if there is a future.

    20. Re:All except Washington by rs79 · · Score: 1

      So.... areas that can grow coffee can't any more because things got warmer but places that just wern't quite warm enough to grow coffee didn't get warmer? How does THAT work?

      For each acre you lose you pick one up somewhere else. Call me when Greenland competes with Yirgacheffe.

      And about those tropical fossils under the north (and south) pole(s)...

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    21. Re:All except Washington by rs79 · · Score: 1

      That's because you guys got north america's summer rain. The weather went sideways, literally because of El Nina. it does that.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    22. Re:All except Washington by fatphil · · Score: 1

      > And about those tropical fossils under the north (and south) pole(s)...

      You do realise that what is currently the south pole was level with Australia and abutting India when some of that fossil record was being laid down?

      --
      Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
    23. Re:All except Washington by tbannist · · Score: 1

      Actually, it's probably because of blocking weather patterns that are being caused by a decrease in temperature difference in Arctic and the Tropics. The Arctic air currents are breaking the blocking patterns up like they used to because the currents are weaker. The Arctic is warming faster than the Tropics, in part because of declining sea ice, as you may have noticed ice is white and water is not. As the sea ice declines, the water absorbs heat from the sun that would have previously been reflected by the ice accelerating the heating trend.

      Also it's either El Nino or La Nina, and according to a quick Google search we are currently neutral (between the two conditions), but it looks like we're building towards an El Nino condition for the fall.

      --
      Fanatically anti-fanatical
    24. Re:All except Washington by rrohbeck · · Score: 1

      It takes a couple of centuries for an ecosystem to adapt, to build soil for example.
      Even if you had tropical temperatures in Greenland today it'd all be just rubble.

    25. Re:All except Washington by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For each acre you lose you pick one up somewhere else. Call me when Greenland competes with Yirgacheffe.

      And you're a farming expert as well! Good God, is there anything you're *not* an expert at?

    26. Re:All except Washington by rsmith-mac · · Score: 1

      Huh? July's rainfall wasn't a record. In fact it was far below average.

      http://www.brucesussman.com/portland-weather/july-2012-portland-salem-astoria/

      Now June on the other hand was above average, but that wasn't a record.

    27. Re:All except Washington by rs79 · · Score: 1

      You do realize there are fossils everywhere right? Why are you trying to be deceptive?

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    28. Re:All except Washington by rs79 · · Score: 1

      I think it's pixies but I have no proof. You?

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    29. Re:All except Washington by fatphil · · Score: 1

      I think the one who mentions a territory that used to be tropical is the one who's trying to be deceptive.

      --
      Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
    30. Re:All except Washington by tbannist · · Score: 1

      I think it's pixies but I have no proof. You?

      Try doing some reading.

      --
      Fanatically anti-fanatical
  3. Brace yourselves by __aaeihw9960 · · Score: 0

    The well thought out pro- and anti-global warming arguments are coming.

    It's real!

    No it isn't.

    YOU SMELL!

    YEAH, WELL, YOUR FACE!

    1. Re:Brace yourselves by AwesomeMcgee · · Score: 3, Funny

      What about his face?? Such a cliffhanger..

    2. Re:Brace yourselves by xevioso · · Score: 1

      His face smells. Possibly because of global warming.

    3. Re:Brace yourselves by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      That's not his face. Common mistake.

      And he's not a he. Less common mistake.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    4. Re:Brace yourselves by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      His face is a cliffhanger?! Ouch!! What an insult!

      Wait, does that mean he should go hang his face off a cliff? Or his face looks like he's been hanging off a cliff by it?

  4. What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    America may be baking, but what about the planet as a whole? Before blaming the elevated temperatures on global warming, does anyone have data on whether or not the globe is also melting along with us?

    1. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      Before blaming the elevated temperatures on global warming, does anyone have data on whether or not the globe is also melting along with us?

      Oooo! I do I do!

      Signed,

      Greenland

    2. Re:What about the rest of the world? by ilsaloving · · Score: 4, Informative

      I dunno about other areas, but I've read that Europe is also suffering from a very intense heat wave.

      Keep in mind that this doesn't mean that the entire planet will heat up uniformly. Some areas may even become unusually cooler.

      The biggest concern is actually an increase in natural disasters like hurricanes.

    3. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Fourth warmest June since records began Unless things were dramatically different in July, I think it's safe to assume that global warming has "stopped".

    4. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Increase" in natural disasters is also bull. There could be the exact same amount of extreme weather occurrences now as 200 years ago but because there's more people spread over more area, they will land on populated areas and do damage.

    5. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Sandman1971 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      We Canadians, you're neighbours to the north, also recorded record heat and record (lack of) rainfall in July.
      Hopefully August will be better. As I type this, it's been raining heavily for the last 20 minutes. We've had more rain in the last 20 mins here in Ottawa that we've had the entire month of July. I'm pretty sure I heard my grass cheering.

      --
      It's better to burn out than to fade away
    6. Re:What about the rest of the world? by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 0

      Define global warming. Define stoped.
      The last ten years the sun e.g. was in a cold cycle is noww slowly gettig hotter again.
      There are dozens of effects finally defining the local temperature.
      That has nothing to do with GLOBAL warming.
      Why don't you look a bit around over the rest of the GLOBE to get an idea how bad it already is?

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    7. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Troed · · Score: 3, Funny

      Hi,

      Northern Europe here. We've not seen summer yet this year. It's just cold and wet.

      regards,
      Sweden

    8. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We Canadians, you're neighbours to the north, also recorded record heat and record (lack of) rainfall in July.
      Hopefully August will be better. As I type this, it's been raining heavily for the last 20 minutes. We've had more rain in the last 20 mins here in Ottawa that we've had the entire month of July. I'm pretty sure I heard my grass cheering.

      Canada is a big place. Here in western Canada, it's been a bit hot, but nothing out the ordinary, though we've had more rain than in a long time. All our farmers must be doing the dance of joy.

    9. Re:What about the rest of the world? by styrotech · · Score: 5, Funny

      Far from it. Here in NZ it is noticeably colder than it was just 6 months ago. In fact nearly every one of the last six months has been colder than the month before!

    10. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You should read up on global warming the weather will be weird everywhere. And it's only in "fjällen" where the spring is _probably_ going to go directly to autumn or just a few days of summer. Everywhere else i.e. Umeå, Örebro and other northen cities the weather has been very warm and among the rainiest years ever. Some good is coming out of this though the electricity bill is going to be somewhat smaller.

    11. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Saija · · Score: 1

      Here in Colombia, South America, we are experiencing a summer longer than previous years. This summer is hotter and dryer than other years with some max temp of 36 celsius.
      Hopefully last-july and august are the "meses de las cometas"(months of the kites) wich brings some air flows refreshing the sunset

      --
      Slashdot ya no es que lo era! ;)
    12. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Cl1mh4224rd · · Score: 2

      Before blaming the elevated temperatures on global warming [...]

      Begs the question: Who's blaming this on global warming? The CNN article isn't. Hell, even the summary isn't.

      --
      People will pass up steak once a week, for crap every day.
    13. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It is.

      Sincerely,

      The Education You Never Got.

    14. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hi,

      Northern Europe here. We've not seen summer yet this year. It's just cold and wet.

      regards,
      Sweden

      That's because we got your summer last January in Florida. All the neighbors switched on their air conditioning on what should have been the coldest days of the year. I came close and I don't run A/C until the pavement starts melting.

    15. Re:What about the rest of the world? by RabidReindeer · · Score: 1

      Define global warming. Define stoped.
      The last ten years the sun e.g. was in a cold cycle is noww slowly gettig hotter again.
      There are dozens of effects finally defining the local temperature.
      That has nothing to do with GLOBAL warming.
      Why don't you look a bit around over the rest of the GLOBE to get an idea how bad it already is?

      There are also dozens of effects finally defining whether you get lung cancer.

      However, we're pretty sure that smoking is one of the more significant ones now.

    16. Re:What about the rest of the world? by arkane1234 · · Score: 3, Funny

      It's kinda like coming home and before she says anything, instantly telling your wife you didn't touch that woman at all tonight...

      --
      -- This space for lease, low setup fee, inquire within!
    17. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hi, Gensokyo here!

      It's STILL winter time! The cherry blossoms haven't even emerged yet! I hope Mistress will let me go figure out what's going on!

      -- Sakuya Izayoi, Maid of the Scarlet Devil Mansion

    18. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Yaztromo · · Score: 1

      America may be baking, but what about the planet as a whole? Before blaming the elevated temperatures on global warming, does anyone have data on whether or not the globe is also melting along with us?

      For the record, average global warming doesn't mean evenly distributed global warming. All it requires is that there are more degrees increase times area of landmass in regions that are hotter than previously than there are degrees decrease times area of landmass in regions that are colder than in previous measurements. That is, if we take measurements in ten regions and find that six of them have a 2 degree increase and four of them have a one degree decrease, the average would be a 1 degree net increase in temperature.

      Yaz

    19. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ditto.
      Have to go south of the alps.
      Just getting more and more rain every year. :(

    20. Re:What about the rest of the world? by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

      We Canadians, you're neighbours to the north, also recorded record heat and record (lack of) rainfall in July.

      Maybe in the part of Canada you're in. But do keep in mind that Canada spans an entire continent...

    21. Re:What about the rest of the world? by suss · · Score: 1

      So far, summer in the Netherlands has been unusually cool and wet.

      I think we had 3 days of hot weather.

    22. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Vreejack · · Score: 1

      Can't speak for the summer, but Eurasia had a hell of a cold winter. It snowed in the middle of the Mediterranean, and Moscow had its first winter in years.

      --
      "Will future ages believe that such stupid bigotry ever existed!" -- Ivanhoe
    23. Re:What about the rest of the world? by OhANameWhatName · · Score: 1

      I'm pretty sure I heard my grass cheering

      Stop smoking it, that'll help.

    24. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 1

      Define stopped.

      I'll use it in a sentence.
      Global warming stopped in 1998

      (The warmest Junes were in 2012, over the land; in 2010, over both land and sea; and in 1998, over the oceans.)

    25. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Before blaming the elevated temperatures on global warming [...]

      Begs the question: Who's blaming this on global warming? The CNN article isn't. Hell, even the summary isn't.

      Hell, no it doesn't. Hell, you're completely misapplying the fallacy. Hell, you probably think you're clever or something.

    26. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Troed · · Score: 1

      I live in Örebro. Let me know where that warmth is supposed to have been - because this has been a very very cold summer so far.

    27. Re:What about the rest of the world? by dbIII · · Score: 1

      You haven't seen summer yet this century.

      regards,
      Australia
      PS. That's not a summer. THIS is a summer.

    28. Re:What about the rest of the world? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      "I dunno about other areas, but I've read that Europe is also suffering from a very intense heat wave."
      "Northern Europe here. We've not seen summer yet this year. It's just cold and wet."

      And you wonder why real scientists just giggle at Hansen and his PR campaign that even supposedly intelligent people have swallowed hook line and sinker.

      The state of science eduction in the US is utterly appalling, matched only by the intellectual laziness of believing any old crap you read without *actually checking it out*.

      Facts matter.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    29. Re:What about the rest of the world? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Turns out not. Ever notice people who don't smoke get lung cancer too?

      Smoke is one of a number of things that a carcinogenic and mutagenic but the body usually takes care of this. in 2004 we found out there's a cytochrome B enzyme, the CYP1B1 variant, and that it only occurs in cancer cells, and a phytoallexin in some foods is converted to picotaneol which happens to kill cancer cells but not regular cells. Gene 53 controls this and low and behold gene 53 is deactived in nearly all cancer patients. This theory just panned out with trials in SF of Potters new prostate drug, so good they stopped the trials and just gave it to everyone and that was V1.0 of his drug, V2.0 works in the general case. So it's not so much smokes cause cancer (so does gasoline, those organics are generally why non-smokers get it) as it is the body lacks the raw materials to make the molecules that get rid of cancer. Long story short, spraying fugicides since wwii did it, since plants make this phytolallexin in response to mold.

      So, bad example, try a car analogy, they go over well here.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    30. Re:What about the rest of the world? by rs79 · · Score: 0

      You'd believe data from those crooks? That's so cute.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    31. Re:What about the rest of the world? by bungo · · Score: 1

      As others have pointed out, northern Europe is having a cooler than average summer so far.

      The jet stream that brings warm air from the US over the Atlantic is currently keeping static over London, usually at this time if year, it's over far northern Scotland, 1k km north.

      This has the effect of bringing the cooler arctic air south over northern Europe, instead of the normally warmer air from northern Africa.

      This is an unusual condition, but it is not possible to say that it is caused by GW or not.

      --
      "The best part? I became an ordained minister while not wearing pants." -- CleverNickName
    32. Re:What about the rest of the world? by RabidReindeer · · Score: 1

      Turns out not. Ever notice people who don't smoke get lung cancer too?

      Smoke is one of a number of things that a carcinogenic and mutagenic but the body usually takes care of this. in 2004 we found out there's a cytochrome B enzyme, the CYP1B1 variant, and that it only occurs in cancer cells, and a phytoallexin in some foods is converted to picotaneol which happens to kill cancer cells but not regular cells. Gene 53 controls this and low and behold gene 53 is deactived in nearly all cancer patients. This theory just panned out with trials in SF of Potters new prostate drug, so good they stopped the trials and just gave it to everyone and that was V1.0 of his drug, V2.0 works in the general case. So it's not so much smokes cause cancer (so does gasoline, those organics are generally why non-smokers get it) as it is the body lacks the raw materials to make the molecules that get rid of cancer. Long story short, spraying fugicides since wwii did it, since plants make this phytolallexin in response to mold.

      So, bad example, try a car analogy, they go over well here.

      Ah. So Global Warming is a myth, Smoking doesn't cause cancer and your day job is in a pretzel factory.

      Care to explain why the Earth is flat, next?

    33. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Same here in Amsterdam. I can not for the life of me remember this kind of weather. It has been raining for 2-3 months. As a matter of fact, the lack of sun means the ground & air have not had the time to warm up which practically means: on a sunny day the temperature drops 5-10 degrees if a cloud passes by.

    34. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unlike the United States?

    35. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Dixie_Flatline · · Score: 1

      This is why the nomenclature has changed in the last few years. It's not a matter of 'Global Warming' as much as 'Global Climate Change'. It isn't just a tactic to dress it up, there are changes happening that will make SOME areas colder and some areas warmer, but the global average temperature will go up.

      Air and sea currents move a lot of energy around, and if they're diverted or stopped all together, you'll see cool water move to different areas of the ocean, and cause localised cooling where there wasn't any before. Similarly, places that historically were near cool water might see a big change as the water heats up, and they don't get the same weather effects from that body of water.

      Weird weather seems to be everywhere this summer...which is actually what climate change models predict.

    36. Re:What about the rest of the world? by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      *Cough* newscientist is not a science site imho ...
      Global warming will stop when there is an equilibrium of energy input and output reached. That will be somewhere after 10 to 30 years AFTER we STOPPED completely emitting CO2 into the atmosphere.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    37. Re:What about the rest of the world? by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 0

      Perhaps you should have answered to my parent and not me ;D

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    38. Re:What about the rest of the world? by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Do you ever wonder why people giggle at you and your complete misunderstanding of what Hansen is saying?

    39. Re:What about the rest of the world? by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      I keep hearing about the "nomenclature" change from global warming to climate change but if that's true they why did they call it the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change when it as created in 1988 instead of the Intergovernmental Panel on Global Warming? I guess you could say global warming is a subset if climate change.

      Also, the big global climate models don't predict weather, weird or not but climate. They project possible climate changes based on different scenarios and their main output is a 30 year running mean of global temperatures for a given scenario.

    40. Re:What about the rest of the world? by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      Oh my God, Sweden is right here in Seattle! Who knew?? ~

    41. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 1

      I'm pretty sure that Climate Stabilization Targets: Emissions, Concentrations, and Impacts over Decades to Millennia (2011) from the National Academy of Sciences, contains all the gory details on the time to equilibrium. It's on a much larger timescale than you think.

      Cite this, cite that. It's almost as if slashdotters expect me to maintain thousands of dollars in journal subscriptions just to back up my trolls, flames ,jokes and asides.

    42. Re:What about the rest of the world? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      No, we're too busy LOL'ing when Hansen opens his mouth while playing "spot the PR".

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    43. Re:What about the rest of the world? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      No, global warming isn't a myth, you said that, not me, the climate is changing, you know like it always has? Why is another story and CO2 has about as much to do with it as putting a suitcase in your trunk then demanding more gas money from passengers for fuel.

      Nor did I say smoking does't cause cancer, I said that it did along with lots of other things but that the problem wasn't that it was the inability of the body to make cellular repairs because of the lack of a precursor to an unusual reaction we just learned about.

      The earth isn't flat, the ancient Greeks knew that and only the insane and deliberately obtuse pull out the flat earth thing and have for many thousands of years. But I'm sure you're not one of them.

      I hope you fix whatever's bothering you and have a nice day.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    44. Re:What about the rest of the world? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      That's far far too simplistic to be taken seriously. It isn't like that, but if you think it is there's a whole lot of catching up you need to do before you can even talk about it; it'd be like explaining second order differentials to somebody who can't multiply. And who probably shouldn't.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    45. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 1

      And yet, some people are comforted by such nonsense

      but if you think it is

      Whoosh!

    46. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anthony · · Score: 1

      NASA have a map for that.

      --
      Slashdot: Where nerds gather to pool their ignorance
    47. Re:What about the rest of the world? by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Why don't you take something scientific he's said and try to debunk it if you can. Mostly he's been on the conservative side with his predictions.

    48. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Dixie_Flatline · · Score: 1

      While it's true that climate models don't predict the weather per se, they do implicitly forecast what sorts of weather we will see as a result of climate change.

      If, for instance, the climate model predicted that the average temperature of Earth would drop by 20 kelvin, you can bet that the implication is that what we'll see is a lot of snowy weather.

      It's good that people are starting to learn that climate and weather aren't equivalent, but the former certainly leads to the latter. A study of climate is a study of broad, long term weather trends. You can't say that we'll see more drought in certain areas of the world without implying that there will be less precipitation. They can't tell you the days where it will or won't rain, but they CAN tell you it will rain less.

      As for the actual history of the name, I couldn't tell you for sure. But I suspect it was scientists hedging their bets. They knew climate was worth studying and that it might be changing, but picking a name for the panel that pre-supposed a possible climate change direction would have been unscientific.

    49. Re:What about the rest of the world? by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      The earliest use of the term "climate change" I'm aware of was a 1956 paper by Glibert Plass titled "The Carbon Dioxide Theory of Climatic Change" so it's been around for a long time.

      I agree that GCM's may be able to tell you something about expected changes in average precipitation for broad regions. But with a horizontal grid size of around 100 x 100 km they're not very precise. There are smaller regional climate models that offer more precision

    50. Re:What about the rest of the world? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL'ed hard :D

  5. Choose, denialists by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

    Either a cold winter doesn't disprove AGW or this absolutely proves it beyond a shadow of a doubt.

    CHOOSE

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    1. Re:Choose, denialists by Penguinisto · · Score: 1

      This, right here.

      Of course, I'm hoping you didn't expect differently.

      --
      Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
    2. Re:Choose, denialists by Bob-taro · · Score: 2

      Nice. Conversely:

      Choose, believers: Either a cold winter disproves AGW or this doesn't prove it. CHOOSE

      I've heard the similarly inconsistent arguments from both sides of the debate.

      --
      Prov 9:8 Do not rebuke mockers or they will hate you; rebuke the wise and they will love you.
    3. Re:Choose, denialists by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I choose "cold winter doesn't disprove AGW" — where we learned that "weather is not climate" — which also applies now.

    4. Re:Choose, denialists by cpu6502 · · Score: 0, Troll

      Since the temperature isn't any hotter than it was in 1936, I'm not seeing any evidence that temps are climbing. The global alarmists said (in 2001) that we would soon never see snow. They people wouldn't be able to go outside. And yet July 2012 was not really any higher than July 1936 when my great-grandparents were alive. So what gives???

      --
      My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
    5. Re:Choose, denialists by GameboyRMH · · Score: 4, Informative

      I hope you're being snarky.

      http://www2.ucar.edu/sites/default/files/news/2011/noaa_globaltemp_2010.jpg

      Maybe there was *a* summer as hot in '36 but it's definitely hotter overall than '36.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    6. Re:Choose, denialists by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1, Informative

      Perhaps you should learn to read. Even the summary says it correctly. Every single month of THIS year is hotter than the hottest one of a random year on record.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    7. Re:Choose, denialists by LordLucless · · Score: 1

      No, no, no, not enough suffixes. It should be believerists. Apparently, "deniers" wasn't perjorative enough, so you need to whack some extra letters on the end to make the term sound even more dramatic.

      --
      Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean there isn't an invisible demon about to eat your face
    8. Re:Choose, denialists by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Choose, believers: Either a cold winter disproves AGW or this doesn't prove it. CHOOSE

      Huh? Were so-called "believers" supposed to get upset by that? Because I personally have no qualms with selecting "this does not prove it", and I suspect that most other "believers" would have no problem saying the same.

      It just makes it easier for us to demonstrate to people who don't understand that a cold winter does not disprove AGW that AGW is real. At least I imagine it does. Which is why I leave the making of such arguments to the people smarter than I.

    9. Re:Choose, denialists by jd.schmidt · · Score: 1

      Either a cold winter doesn't disprove AGW or this absolutely proves it beyond a shadow of a doubt.

      CHOOSE

      To be fair, they did choose, they think cold winters don't disprove AGW, but rather are examples to them of how such information is unknowable. It is just used as a zinger to say "show me how your AGB model predicted this". If anything it is more frustrating to me. I normally reply "show me your everything is OK model."

    10. Re:Choose, denialists by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sure neither answer is correct.

      The correct answer would be if the majority of the world has abnormal weather this winter the likelihood of global warming being real is increased.

      If the majority of the world has normal weather, then there does not seem to be a change.

      Of course everyone is going to frame it to make it impossible to answer. If you want my guess, my guess is it will not be a normal winter.

    11. Re:Choose, denialists by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What gives? You are an idiot.

      It has been hotter then normal the past few summers. Just because its been hotter before for brief periods does not mean that an extended or repeated hot spells are normal. But you didn't want to hear that answer did you?

      Think things through next time, you look silly.

    12. Re:Choose, denialists by Qwertie · · Score: 2

      A hot summer does not prove AGW, nor does a cold winter disprove it. In fact, any number of hot summers does not prove AGW; at most they only prove that warming is occurring.

      To prove that the Global Warming is Anthropomorphic requires a lot of additional evidence, which has been gathered. There is now a strong concensus among scientists that "man-made" is the only explanation that fits.

    13. Re:Choose, denialists by BasilBrush · · Score: 2

      Since the temperature isn't any hotter than it was in 1936

      In what way is 0.2 degrees higher temperature than July 1936 not hotter?

      The global alarmists said (in 2001) that we would soon never see snow.

      Who precisely said that, and what specifically did they say.

      You don't seem to be too good with the facts.

    14. Re:Choose, denialists by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      Either a cold winter doesn't disprove AGW or this absolutely proves it beyond a shadow of a doubt.

      Anyone who talks of climate trends with anything less that a 30 year view is an idiot. However for those idiots that say "Global warming has stalled for the last 10 years" it's nice to rub their faces in their own shit.

    15. Re:Choose, denialists by hazah · · Score: 0

      I honestly don't get it. All this is is chasing your own tail. Why not just admit that we don't have a model we can trust either way. Seems far more likely that we're holplessly ignorant on all sides.

    16. Re:Choose, denialists by Oakey · · Score: 1

      It was Dr David Viner at CRU;

      http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/snowfalls-are-now-just-a-thing-of-the-past-724017.html

      "According to Dr David Viner, a senior research scientist at the climatic research unit (CRU) of the University of East Anglia,within a few years winter snowfall will become "a very rare and exciting event".

      "Children just aren't going to know what snow is," he said."

      --
      "Dre don't get as high as me.... I'm Cheech and Chong" - Snoop Dogg
    17. Re:Choose, denialists by LurkerXXX · · Score: 2, Informative

      Anyone who says a warm summer proves it, or a cold winter disproves it, doesn't understand the science. At all.

      Talk to the actual scientists. There's very good consensus that it's real.

    18. Re:Choose, denialists by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's not just that this year was incredibly hot, it's not even that the last year was also very warm. It's that the top 10 hottest years are all since 1998 with 2012 looking like it will be the hottest.

    19. Re:Choose, denialists by AlienIntelligence · · Score: 1

      It's not just that this year was incredibly hot, it's not even that the last year was also very warm. It's that the top 10 hottest years are all since 1998 with 2012 looking like it will be the hottest.

      Obviously that's not true if we beat a record from 1936.

      -AI

      --
      For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion
    20. Re:Choose, denialists by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      AnthropGENIC, not anthropomorphic.

      Anthropomorphic indicates "having the shape of man".
      AnthropoGENIC indicates causation by man.

      Just a minor difference.

    21. Re:Choose, denialists by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      And yet he doesn't say "we would soon never see snow."

      "Heavy snow will return occasionally," says Dr Viner, "but when it does we will be unprepared"

      Which is pretty much where we are in England.

    22. Re:Choose, denialists by Fjandr · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The 1936 record was a monthly average record, not a yearly record. Even if we didn't beat it, 1936 wouldn't be in the top 10 yearly records while 2012 will almost certainly be.

      The monthly records prior to 2012 were not all in the same year. The new monthly records are now all from the same year.

    23. Re:Choose, denialists by budgenator · · Score: 1

      0.2 degrees is less than the amount the temperatures were adjusted.

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
    24. Re:Choose, denialists by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Yeah. I gotta say I don't give much credence to people who don't even understand the big words they're using or pull the proof by authority crap, logical fallacies being what they are.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    25. Re:Choose, denialists by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      Really? You're still hanging on to that old cannard?

    26. Re:Choose, denialists by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      In 1936 perhaps there was a 0.1% chance of those hot temperatures occurring but now is 2012 perhaps the chances of the same heat occurring are 1.0%. That's what illustrates global warming is occurring, the shift in the chances of some weather event happening. Climate science is statistical in nature so you have to look at it in those terms. (Numbers were made up by me but I'll bet they're in the right ballpark).

      A few people may have said those things but most scientists did not believe that at the time. I pay attention to what scientists say but take it with a grain of salt until I see further confirmation.

    27. Re:Choose, denialists by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      The 1936 record was only for the continental US, not the globe.

    28. Re:Choose, denialists by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No need. Actually, cherry-picking isn't necessary when the entire body of evidence supports the theory.

    29. Re:Choose, denialists by budgenator · · Score: 1

      FTA

      The average temperature for the contiguous U.S. during July was 77.6F, 3.3F above the 20th century average, marking the hottest July and the hottest month on record for the nation. The previous warmest July for the nation was July 1936 when the average U.S. temperature was 77.4F.

      What they are not saying is that this was computed using the data from the old COOP/USHCN network; if they had used the new high quality, U.S. Climate Reference Network (USCRN), the results for CONUS, July 2012 is mean temp of 75.74F, of course don't believe me just go to Report Page download some data and see for yourself; it doesn't take a PhD to load a .csv into a spreadsheet and to a Tmax + Tmin /2.

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
  6. well that settles it.. by spiffmastercow · · Score: 1

    i'm moving to washington!

  7. Not here in California, Bay Area by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Been here my entire life, one of the most comfortable summers I can recall.

  8. Can we swap? by pswPhD · · Score: 1

    Over in England, We have had the wettest April through June since our records began [BBC News]. Please send us some sunny weather!

    1. Re:Can we swap? by ukemike · · Score: 1

      Over in England, We have had the wettest April through June since our records began [BBC News]. Please send us some sunny weather!

      Well we might not be able to send any sunny weather over, but we're making a pretty good effort at stalling the Atlantic thermohaline cycle. That'll stop your rain for you.

      --
      -- QED
    2. Re:Can we swap? by BasilBrush · · Score: 2

      It's long been predicted as the most likely scenario that global warming will make Britain wetter. Britain's weather mostly comes from the Atlantic, and warmer weather causes more evaporation, which turns to rain as it hits land masses.

    3. Re:Can we swap? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Over in England, We have had the wettest April through June since our records began [BBC News]. Please send us some sunny weather!

      You'll have to wait for the Olympics to finish... there's no fun having them on sunny weather.

    4. Re:Can we swap? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Along with the predictions that it would desertify except for the ones that said it would glaciate.

      How are those 20 foot searise by the end of the century predictions looking?

      What does the guy who said we're already past the tipping point and are going to burn feel about all this? Ok, right, he became a skeptic once he learned a bit more science.

      Now there's a thought.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    5. Re:Can we swap? by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      Along with the predictions that it would desertify except for the ones that said it would glaciate.

      By 2012? Who were they then? These vague claims that someone made some prediction are worthless unless we know who, whether they had widespread peer support, and what precicely the prediction was and in what time scale.

      The mainstream scientific opinion for the last 20+ years that it would get hotter and wetter have indeed been right though.

    6. Re:Can we swap? by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      There is no 20 foot sea level rise prediction for the end of the century, just maybe 3-6 feet. The 20 foot SLR comes from how much sea level would rise if all of the ice on Greenland melted but that will take several hundred years under any realistic scenario.

    7. Re:Can we swap? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Doesn't sound like you were there 20 years ago, that's not what I saw. Just one theory that hasn't panned out but got a lot og big-industry funding. Cause, you know, big business is nothing but concerned for the environment.

      "The problem is we don't know what the climate is doing. We thought we knew 20 years ago. That led to some alarmist books — mine included — because it looked clear-cut, but it hasn't happened," Lovelock said. "The climate is doing its usual tricks. There's nothing much really happening yet. We were supposed to be halfway toward a frying world now," he said. "The world has not warmed up very much since the millennium. Twelve years is a reasonable time it (the temperature) has stayed almost constant, whereas it should have been rising — carbon dioxide is rising, no question about that," he added.' Lovelock still believes the climate is changing, but at a much, much slower pace." - from 3 months ago. But if you believe one data point changes all that or that the commonly held theories as to why are accurate than I think you have some reading to catch up on.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    8. Re:Can we swap? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Oh. So there are no WMD. Dammit, fell for it again.

      Actually they're saying 1 meter in 500 years now. And that's with about a 5% confidence factor, their most accurate guess so far.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    9. Re:Can we swap? by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      Doesn't sound like you were there 20 years ago

      You're wrong. I followed The Earth Summit in Rio in 1992 as closely as it was possible to in the days before WWW was significant.

      Lovelock displays the kind of honesty you never, ever see in the deniers. There is still no doubt that AGW is real, but when increasing knowledge and the collection of more data adjusts the estimates of the timing and details of it's effects, climate scientists say so.

      Deniers on the other hand keep on repeating the same old lies.

    10. Re:Can we swap? by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Who is saying 1 meter in 500 years?

  9. Re:Choose by dkleinsc · · Score: 3, Funny

    That's easy: I choose to accept all evidence that fits my predefined worldview (whatever that may be), and pretend any contradicting evidence doesn't exist or is incorrect.

    Hey, it works for a lot of other things, why should AGW be any different?

    --
    I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
  10. National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration by Antibozo · · Score: 3, Informative

    Minor correction: the O in NOAA is Oceanic, not Oceanographic.

  11. Hello from Oklahoma.... by rts008 · · Score: 1

    This may set a record for the national average, but it has been cooler and milder than last summer here in Oklahoma.

    Our avg. July temp. is 91-94 F, but the past 3 or so summers it has been 7-10+F over avg.

    Here is an example :this July.
    And here is Aug. this year(so far...note the diff between avg. and observed)

    Glad to share! ;-)

    --
    Down With Slashdot BETA!!! I've been around the corner and seen the oliphant; you can only abuse me from your perspecti
  12. Living in Seattle is Killing Me by sandysnowbeard · · Score: 3, Informative

    "Every U.S. state except Washington experienced warmer-than-average temperatures, NOAA reported." Run, children, run from the Pacific NorthWest. Do not come here, the sun does not shine.

    1. Re:Living in Seattle is Killing Me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      the sun does not shine

      That star gets on my nerves. It ruins expensive stuff; car interiors, house paint... basically anything not made of rock. You end up blinded by it driving east or west. Two sets of expensive eye wear required; one for exposure to the naked fusion reactor and one for everything else. Expose yourself enough and you get any of several forms of skin cancer. Trying to work on the property in the summer is hell.

      Try to appreciate your clouds.

    2. Re:Living in Seattle is Killing Me by frank_adrian314159 · · Score: 1

      Run, children, run from the Pacific NorthWest. Do not come here, the sun does not shine.

      No! Do not listen to the infidel! That's just the shadow from the mighty Balmer's lifted chair, ready to be flung at a moment's notice!

      --
      That is all.
    3. Re:Living in Seattle is Killing Me by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      It ruins expensive stuff; car interiors,

      Unless Im mistaken, car windows tend to block UV rays for this very reason. Certainly my transition lenses do not activate at all when in the car.

  13. A new cherry-pick start by amorsen · · Score: 1, Informative

    In 2017 we will hear "5 years of falling temperatures" and in 2022 "no temperature rise for 10 years" and so on. Just like 1998.

    --
    Finally! A year of moderation! Ready for 2019?
    1. Re:A new cherry-pick start by Mikkeles · · Score: 1

      Your climate model intrigues me and I would like to subscribeto your newsletter.

      --
      Great minds think alike; fools seldom differ.
    2. Re:A new cherry-pick start by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      The Escalator graphic illustrates this point perfectly.

  14. Re:Choose by rrohbeck · · Score: 1

    You mean, the worldview of your wallet?

  15. This is nothing to worry about . . . by Kimomaru · · Score: 1

    All we have to do is water everything with Brawndo. It's the thirst mutilitator and it has elecrolights.

  16. AGW Converts by arthurpaliden · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Ex-sceptic says climate change is down to humans

    "The results of the Berkeley Earth Surface Temperature are in and Richard Muller, the study's director (formerly an AGW skeptic) declares, 'Call me a converted skeptic. Three years ago I identified problems in previous climate studies that, in my mind, threw doubt on the very existence of global warming. Last year, following an intensive research effort involving a dozen scientists, I concluded that global warming was real and that the prior estimates of the rate of warming were correct. I'm now going a step further: Humans are almost entirely the cause.'

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/30/opinion/the-conversion-of-a-climate-change-skeptic.html?_r=4

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-19047501

    CEO Exxon admits AGW is real and burning fossil fuels causes it.

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/27/exxon-ceo-climate-energy-fears-overblown/

    The natural progression:

    • 1. There is no such thing as global warming!
    • 2. Global warming is theoretically possible, but it's not happening.
    • 3. Global warming is happening, but we are not the cause
    • 4. Global warming is happening and we are the cause but it's no big deal.
    • 5. Ok, we should probably do something about this global warming before it gets worse.
    • 6. We're really fraked now.

    We are now at step 4.

    1. Re:AGW Converts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Richard Muller was never a skeptic. His papers failed peer review.

      (Feel free to verify)

    2. Re:AGW Converts by BasilBrush · · Score: 3, Informative

      52 million years ago is easily long enough for tectonics to feature. The continents weren't in the same places they are now, and ocean currents around Antarctica flowed very differently.

      Oh, and it was also a time of high CO2.

      So I wouldn't go thinking you've made some great rebuttal of AGW there if I was you.

    3. Re:AGW Converts by Kimomaru · · Score: 1

      Actually, it's "if I WERE you".

    4. Re:AGW Converts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Have you read anything on climate change? I haven't seen anyone say that the Earth has not been warmer in the past. Nor I have I heard anyone say that climate change is not natural and goes in cycles. What people are saying is that the climate is changing at a far faster rate than is natural and that humans are at least partly to blame. If the change is slow, ecosystems can adjust and plants and animals will adapt. The issue is that the climate is changing too fast and ecosystems will not be able to adapt. And most of our big cities are still on the coast

      In other words, your argument is not only poorly written, but is also flawed.

    5. Re:AGW Converts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      6. We're really fraked now.

      Why did you stop there? We humans aren't going to throw up our hands and die just to please malcontents like you.

      Let's grow up a bit and face a real #6

      6. Stop burning coal. Replace it with nuclear.
      7. Stop burning oil for vehicles. Use our abundant natural gas instead.

      There you go; net carbon emissions about 1/3 current rates. Net economic damage: zero.

    6. Re:AGW Converts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Did you notice how Mullers paper got an article on Slashdot yet Watt's news release never got a mention?

    7. Re:AGW Converts by Kimomaru · · Score: 0

      I don't believe my thinking is flawed any more than I believe that anything written on the subject of global warming is concrete or that we have reliable logitudinal data for our assertions on global warming. Common sense - we're better at collecting data than we were 30 or 40 years ago, never mind a century ago. We're still learning new things all the time, which is normal and good. We may yet conclude, although it would be embarrassing for us as a society to admit, that the the conclusions we assumed on AGW were wrong all along. We've been changing our conclusions on the climate trends for the past 40 years. AGW started as a scientific issue and, over time, has changed into a political conviction. It's had to believe that so many people block their ears and preach mindlessly about how we're all doomed because of findings printed in a scientific journal. Findings that are revised all the time. There MAY be a problem and we should pay attention to it and be reasonable, but that's not what the vast majority of people who believe in the AGW argument do. They're not skeptics at all and they assume that anyone who doubts the AGW science is a "screw-the-earth poltical right winger" (and I'm not). Sorry, I prefer to be sceptical about every side of this issue since we don't know everything there is to know on it yet.

    8. Re:AGW Converts by LurkerXXX · · Score: 1

      You do realize weather patterns were slightly different 50 million years ago when the continental layout was different, right?

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Paleogene-EoceneGlobal.jpg

      The Gulf Stream and most of the other major currents which move warm/cold water that sets up our weather system were very different then. Any place being much hotter or colder than what we experience 'there' now isn't suprising at all.

    9. Re:AGW Converts by Attila+Dimedici · · Score: 1

      The only problem is that Richard Muller has never been a skeptic of AGW. The reason they get away with calling him a skeptic was because he said that AGW alarmists should not lie about the science in order to convince people (while saying that he was a firm believer in AGW).

      --
      The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
    10. Re:AGW Converts by BasilBrush · · Score: 1

      If that's the best you've got...

    11. Re:AGW Converts by dbIII · · Score: 1

      It doesn't matter since they don't really believe in this argument anyway, they are just throwing it up in a "fight fire with fire" way to piss us off. After all, 50 million years ago is earlier than the science deniers belief in a 6000 year age of the entire universe.

    12. Re:AGW Converts by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Meanwhile the gaia theory guy became a skeptic. THERE IS BALANCE IN THE FORCE.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    13. Re:AGW Converts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean lies like that map of surface melt in Greenland at the beginning of July that circulated on Facebook with no context, just a lot of "Look how much WHITE there was! White means cold! Now it's all RED! Which means HOT!" The map that the Goddard Institute said actually fits a known cycle (but should be watched closely).

      Deliberately misinterpreting data hurts one's cause.

    14. Re:AGW Converts by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      No, Richard Muller was a skeptic in the true sense of the word. He was willing to change his opinion once he examined the evidence in detail. A person who is unwilling to change their opinion regardless of the the evidence is not truly a skeptic but instead is an ideologue.

    15. Re:AGW Converts by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Lovelock did not become a skeptic, just a realist. He was way over the top before.

    16. Re:AGW Converts by Attila+Dimedici · · Score: 1

      What opinion did he change? He has believed that global warming is occurring and that it is caused by man since at least 2004 when he said "If you are concerned about global warming (as I am) and think that human-created carbon dioxide may contribute (as I do)..." Looking for more information I find him to be a believer in global warming at least as far back as 2000. I was unable to find any references where he expressed skepticism about man caused global warming, merely skepticism about the science of some of the alarmists, while agreeing with their general conclusion that there was man caused global warming.

      --
      The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
    17. Re:AGW Converts by Rakarra · · Score: 1

      We may yet conclude, although it would be embarrassing for us as a society to admit, that the the conclusions we assumed on AGW were wrong all along

      Hey, I'd love to find out you're right, I really would. But at the moment we have no reason to think you are and every reason to believe you aren't.

  17. The Devil In the Details (Adjustments To 'Data') by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There have been so many adjustments to the 'data' for conformance to a psychological requirement of anthropogenic global warming that such 'news' stories are without merit.

    LOL

  18. personally I love global warming by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    there was no winter last winter here in NYC! it just went from fall to spring. it was fuckin' great walking to school in February and it's like 50 degrees out! sure, it's probably bad for the planet in the long run but fuck it. no one else cares, so why should I?

    i'm pissed though i bought an expensive new coat in the fall of 2011 and now i find out winter is cancelled, oh well, maybe i can sell it to a Canadian or something.

  19. wheu shore is hawt out there huh (spits tobacco) by Bigsquid.1776 · · Score: 1

    Yep shore is... hot yesterday... gonna be hotter t'marruh I hear... uuuuuh huh... (spits tobacco)

    ITT people talking about how hot it is outside. The pinnacle of intelligent conversation.

    Up next: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_cooling

  20. Atlanta Weather by Botia · · Score: 1
    From Kirk Mellish, the only weatherman I have ever known to have any sort of accuracy, speaking about weather in metro Atlanta when the heat wave hit:

    Fortunately this does not mean the whole summer will be hot. Remember in May when it turned unseasonably hot and everyone was saying "OMG its gonna be killer hot from here to fall" and I said history does not support that. Well, until now June has been cooler than normal! After this heat wave, the rest of the summer will be closer to normal but with both more heat waves and some spells of below-normal temperatures expected through August. So relax, hot spells happen in summer in the south. We won't know what kind of summer it was until September!

  21. NCDC by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It looks like the NCDC (National Climatic Data Center) is part of the NESDIS (National Environmental Satellite, Data, and Information Service), is part of the NOAA (National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration), is part of the U.S. DOC (United States Department of Commerce).

    I wonder what the Department of Commerce has to gain from this.

  22. Re:Slashdot morons... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    also, smoking is good for you! fuck that socialist surgeon general faggot and all the hippy doctors!

  23. I'm ready. by rickb928 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I've been watching climate change debates most of my life.

    First, it was the threat of nucler wear, and the nuclear winter to follow. This was well explained, and there wa polenty of data to back it up, and anotehr good reason to abandon nuclear weapons. In the midst of the destruction and poisoning, we would be huddled around burning straw, freezing to death. Women and children would be affected the most.

    Then, it was the new Ice Age, inevitable due to climate cycles that were very well explained and with plenty of data. This was a good reason to either acllerate the adoption of advanced technologies, or to eschew them in favor of a sustainable lifestyle in the coming freeze. Oh, and to get as much oil as possible, just in case. And of course it would cause calamity and chaos, we would need to share resources, and we might get by, but don't count on it. Oh, and women and children woudl be affected the most.

    Next, it's Global Warming, with now massive evidence of the causes and impacts, much more data, and warnings that we need to do everything to both prevent and adapt to it. We need to abandon our technology, improve it, change fuel sources, use fuels that don't cause other harms, and do it all now. NOW. Oh, and women and children will be affected the most, and the soonest.

    Well, if AGW is real, which it seems to be, then I'm ready to both prevent it and mitigate the consequences of what is going to happen no matter what we do.

    Just one thing.

    So far, most of the solutions to AGW rely on taking from me pretty much eveyrthing that makes my life, as a middle-class U.S. citizen, special. I can deal with that, but so far ther eis little real discussion of the problems of the rest of world hell-bent on achieving the same special life as I have. I don't begrudge them that. But I'm concerned that they are going to tip the climate over the edge sooner than I could have, and will not readily listen to complaints that they are ruining things for all of us.

    I expect to give up a lot - I will have to change my diet, my transportation, pay way more taxes, do with less or most everything, and in the end all it will get me is a feeling of contribution. I will not live long enough to see the results. No, I am not that young.

    And I will get the nagging feeling that deep inside this, the truth is, that most of the AGW movement is very, very happy that I am paying for my profiligate lifestyle. Because I neither deserve it, nor shoudl it be even permitted. That bunch has been at it since the Nuclear Winter debate, in one fashion or another.

    Because that is the way it's going. The so-called 98% are taking it in the shorts, while the top 1% cling to their place at the top. And the bottom 1% scheme to take all of that and more from the top 1% first, and then from whoever they designate as their next targets. And when the top 1% is ruined, then it's the next 1% and the next.

    Soon enough, it will be me.

    All so a very few can have their way, and rule us all. They hope.

    Then again, this may not work out that way. If sensible people prevail.

    --
    deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    1. Re:I'm ready. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why do you have to give anything up to reduce carbon dioxide emissions? I have never seen a plan for reducing emissions that calls for such a thing. If you get your electricity from a nuclear power plant or solar plant, you can have your lights and air conditioning on just as always. If your car is electric or runs on biofuels, you can drive it just as much. I think this is the biggest sticking point in the "debate" -- I think most people want to deny that the warming is happening because they don't want to change their lifestyle. But we don't have to.

    2. Re:I'm ready. by bhlowe · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As soon as Al Gore gives up his mansions and jet setting lifestyle, I'll join you in turning off my computers and air conditioner.

    3. Re:I'm ready. by Guano_Jim · · Score: 1

      Wow, what a downer.

      I'm a lot more hopeful. I think the challenges brought on by climate change are going to unleash a wave of human creativity and problem-solving the likes of which we have never seen before. We're going to adapt and thrive, and our grandkids are going to wonder why we dilly-dallied for so long in the first place.

      But then I'm a glass-half-full kind of guy.

    4. Re:I'm ready. by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      The glass is always full...

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    5. Re:I'm ready. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bad news, sonny. Because of the global warming heat waves and evaporation, your glass is now only 1/4 full.

    6. Re:I'm ready. by quantaman · · Score: 2

      I've been watching climate change debates most of my life.

      First, it was the threat of nucler wear, and the nuclear winter to follow. This was well explained, and there wa polenty of data to back it up, and anotehr good reason to abandon nuclear weapons. In the midst of the destruction and poisoning, we would be huddled around burning straw, freezing to death. Women and children would be affected the most.

      Has the Nuclear winter hypothesis fallen out of favour? If it hasn't, then science warned about a catastrophe that could occur if we had a large scale nuclear war, fortunately for a variety of reasons, including the warnings of scientists, nuclear war was averted.

      Looks like the science did good there.

      Then, it was the new Ice Age, inevitable due to climate cycles that were very well explained and with plenty of data.

      No it wasn't. The new Ice Age was never a popular hypothesis, there were a small handful of papers when scientists were still trying to figure out the long term effects of atmospheric CO2. The Ice Age made a bit of a splash in the media as hypothesis sometimes do, and then it was very quickly discarded when science settled on the AGW consensus.

      Next, it's Global Warming, with now massive evidence of the causes and impacts, much more data, and warnings that we need to do everything to both prevent and adapt to it.

      Unlike Nuclear winter we haven't solved this problem, and unlike the new Ice Age there's not only a consensus, but a consensus that has lasted for decades.

      We need to abandon our technology, improve it, change fuel sources, use fuels that don't cause other harms, and do it all now. NOW. Oh, and women and children will be affected the most, and the soonest.

      Well, if AGW is real, which it seems to be, then I'm ready to both prevent it and mitigate the consequences of what is going to happen no matter what we do.

      Just one thing.

      So far, most of the solutions to AGW rely on taking from me pretty much eveyrthing that makes my life, as a middle-class U.S. citizen, special.

      Yeah, that sucks, but unfortunately that's reality. Cheap energy has side effects and if you want to reduce those side effects either the energy has to cost more, or you need to use less.

      I can deal with that, but so far ther eis little real discussion of the problems of the rest of world hell-bent on achieving the same special life as I have. I don't begrudge them that. But I'm concerned that they are going to tip the climate over the edge sooner than I could have, and will not readily listen to complaints that they are ruining things for all of us.

      There's been a ton of discussion, the world can't sustain 6 billion 2012 American lifestyles. And saying the rest of the world has to stay poor because the first world already screwed the planet is really unfair, and saying the first world has to lower their standard of living is a very tough pill to swallow. Probably the reason you haven't heard discussion is because taking a serious look at the topic means that we need to lower our standard of living a lot, while they raise theirs, and that's not a conclusion many people want to come to so it's often undiscussed.

      I expect to give up a lot - I will have to change my diet, my transportation, pay way more taxes, do with less or most everything, and in the end all it will get me is a feeling of contribution. I will not live long enough to see the results. No, I am not that young.

      And I will get the nagging feeling that deep inside this, the truth is, that most of the AGW movement is very, very happy that I am paying for my profiligate lifestyle. Because I neither deserve it, nor shoudl it be even permitted. That bunch has been at it since the Nuclear Winter debate, in one fashion or another.

      Because that is the way it's going. The so-called 98% are taking it in the sho

      --
      I stole this Sig
    7. Re:I'm ready. by hondo77 · · Score: 1

      So far, most of the solutions to AGW rely on taking from me pretty much eveyrthing that makes my life, as a middle-class U.S. citizen, special.

      Huh?

      --
      I live ze unknown. I love ze unknown. I am ze unknown.
    8. Re:I'm ready. by DerekLyons · · Score: 1

      I've been watching climate change debates most of my life.

      You may been watching, but you haven't been paying attention. The "new Ice Age" came first, and was completely media hype - with absolutely no evidence. Nuclear winter came next, but with only a modest amount of data (which relied on some pretty big assumptions) and great deal of hype.

    9. Re:I'm ready. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You forgot to mention the ozone hole and CFCs.

      Oh, that's right. Because we actually did something about it and stabilized the situation. It will be a while before it starts to improve, but at least we see signs it won't get significantly worse. Same for nuclear war (the Cold War is over and we are working on reducing the numbers of weapons), and we've realized that while new Ice Ages will eventually happen it won't be for thousands of years at least (so AGW is more urgent). Ice ages would be inconvenient, but the fact is that humans lived through them before. We practically grew up as a species during the last Ice Ages. Things aren't *that* bad in terms of handling these big problems.

      If you're going to be that cynical, then you may as well retire to some far flung corner of the world and live out your last few days in peace. Yes, the problem is a hard one. Finding a way to keep energy as cheap as it has been with fossil fuels isn't going to be easy, and may well not be possible. But this challenge will occur whether we decide to do something about AGW or not. Fossil fuels are non-renewable and are getting harder to find. Deal with it. It's the way the world *is*. I think it's a lot more helpful to face that problem than to despair about the prospects of succeeding, or to ponder unlikely grand political/economic conspiracies.

    10. Re:I'm ready. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, you don't have to give up much at all, and most of what you give up will save you money which you can spend on other things or leave to your grandkids. What has become clear over the last couple of years is that the claims that super-drastic lifestyle changes are required are alarmist. What is true, however, is that the sooner you start, the less pain you suffer.

    11. Re:I'm ready. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Glasses only work because they are empty.

    12. Re:I'm ready. by dbIII · · Score: 1

      So far, most of the solutions to AGW rely on taking from me pretty much eveyrthing that makes my life, as a middle-class U.S. citizen, special

      You are losing that anyway unless the country climbs out of a very deep hole.

    13. Re:I'm ready. by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Um, I don't think you have any idea what you're talking about. Prove me wrong: what causes glaciation?

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    14. Re:I'm ready. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So far, most of the solutions to AGW rely on taking from me pretty much eveyrthing that makes my life, as a middle-class U.S. citizen, special.

      This is why we are fucked. This right here. It sums up the entire reason why its gotten the way it has and why nothing will change.

    15. Re:I'm ready. by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      Nuclear power in the US is not yet in favor. Expanding nuclear is not yet an accepted solution.

      Electric vehicles have a massive carbon footprint. we are being crazy with electric vehicles, and real solutions are 10 years away.

      We do have to change our lifestyles.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    16. Re:I'm ready. by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      Um , I was born and raised on land that bore the scars of glaciers. Easily taught in high school science, and before. I'm not ignorant, my friend.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    17. Re:I'm ready. by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      Most of what i give up will be replaced by more costly things. What I don't give up will be taxed , cost more to make, deliver, and dispose of.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    18. Re:I'm ready. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why do you feel persecuted like that? You think AGW is real, you're willing to do something about it, and somehow you feel that others are taking some sort of sadistic joy in your willingness to sacrifice? You're not that special, and for what its worth, the lower percentiles are too busy trying to make ends meet than give a shit about your CO2 foot print. Get over yourself.

    19. Re:I'm ready. by DavidHumus · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure the "nuclear winter" scenario really counts as part of the climate debate as it's more about atomic weapons. I guess it really is unfair to focus mostly on the bad effects of global nuclear war.

      The "they used to tell us we were heading into an Ice Age" is a favorite bogus argument of deniers. There was a single peer-reviewed paper in the '70s proposing this hypothesis which made the cover of Newsweek but was retracted less than a year later (see http://atheistethicist.blogspot.com/2009/12/climate-change-ice-age-fears-of-1970s.html).

      As for the fears of a liberal conspiracy to take away our profligate llifestyle, all I can say is: don't worry little scaredy-cat, selfishness will prevail as it always has.

    20. Re:I'm ready. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just what is so special about your life that is "taken away" by, say, shifting subsidies from fossil fuels to renewables? By transitioning from incandescent lightbulbs to CFL/LED? By developing cars that go further on the same amount of fuel, or run on even cheaper electricity? By updating building codes to reduce the amount of energy you need to heat or cool your house/apartment? By improving public transit so you're not as dependent on cars? From what I can see, most everything that is being done to reduce the amount of CO2 entering the atmosphere will either save you money or improve your quality of life, or both.

    21. Re:I'm ready. by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      Here is the problem....

      First, that old ice age warning was shorter-lived than the current warming debate, but was for the time a moderately intense debate. And it did not go so quietly aa many claim.

      Second, the cause of a cooling climate, back then, hardly mattered.

      As for the conspiracy theories, well, that's your focus.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    22. Re:I'm ready. by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      If global warming is real your lifestyle is going to change whether you like it or not. Wouldn't it be better to proactively try to change it in a way that makes things better rather than try to cope with changes forced on you unwillingly by global changes?

    23. Re:I'm ready. by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      What makes you think anyone is asking you to turn off your computers and air conditioner?

      I'll agree that there are a few extremists who would say that but that's not most people including Al Gore.

    24. Re:I'm ready. by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Maybe nothing will change until it has to. By then the change that is forced on you will be at best extremely unpleasant and could be catastrophic as far as any individual is concerned.

  24. Sophistry by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    In 1936, according to the article, it was almost as warm. Basically, a "so what?". Between then and now, States have had record cold temperatures as well. This report would be just one more Jeopardy! item, were it not for the political hay that will be made of it.

    The article presents yet another piece of evidence supporting the AGW hypothesis, yet you argue as if it's the only such evidence. Obviously, no single anomaly or measurement is persuasive by itself, but the weight of the collective evidence is very clear, and this anomaly only makes it clearer. To pretend otherwise is dishonest.

  25. FTFY by PeanutButterBreath · · Score: 1

    The 5 stages of denial:

    1: It's not happening.
    2: It's happening, but it's no big deal.
    3: It's happening, it's a big deal, but there's nothing we can do.
    4: It's happening, it's a big deal, this is what we can do, but it's too expensive.
    5: It's happening, it's a big deal, it's too late to do what we could have done earlier, next time be rich like us so you can insulate yourself from the consequences

    1. Re:FTFY by RabidReindeer · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The 5 XXXx 6 stages of denial:

      1: It's not happening.
      2: It's happening, but it's no big deal.
      3: It's happening, it's a big deal, but there's nothing we can do.
      4: It's happening, it's a big deal, this is what we can do, but it's too expensive.
      5: It's happening, it's a big deal, it's too late to do what we could have done earlier, next time be rich like us so you can insulate yourself from the consequences
      6. It's happening. We're DOOMED! Why didn't those damned greenie hippies DO something about this while there was still time????

    2. Re:FTFY by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nah, 6 is:

      6. It happened. We survived it (well, some of us). Even though it was horrible for a lot of people and many many died, there were many benefits, including some economical and technological advances.

      History is written by the victors. Look to past human-caused global tragedies (eg. WWII) to see how we handled it afterward.
      No worries! We'll set aside a day to remember all those who don't fare well... we all "hope it's not me."

    3. Re:FTFY by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      History is written by the victors.

      "History" ... "Writing" ... Yeah I've heard some of the old timers talk 'bout those. They had 'em had back in the cold days, long with ... aww whatcha call 'em ... I can't remember right now.

    4. Re:FTFY by Stirling+Newberry · · Score: 1

      Just because life will go on, doesn't mean your life will go on.

  26. Damn cold, too! by bhlowe · · Score: 1

    Watch out for isolated snow storms in South Africa.

  27. It's gettin' hot in hurrr by logicassasin · · Score: 1

    so take off all yo clothes...

    (C-walks to the pool in the back yard)

    ... Sorry, couldn't resist.

    --
    Fifty watts per channel, baby cakes.
  28. Test equipment calibration? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe.. just maybe... the equipment in 2012 is slightly more accurate and calibrated a little different than the equipment used in the 1930s?

    Crazy, I know.

    1. Re:Test equipment calibration? by arkane1234 · · Score: 1

      Somehow, I don't think the measurement of temperature was really off back then since it was dont with what we consider medical style technology. (mercury, etc)

      --
      -- This space for lease, low setup fee, inquire within!
    2. Re:Test equipment calibration? by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      Maybe.. just maybe... scientists are well aware of the issues with changing instrumentation and the potential for that to introduce errors. Maybe that's one of the main reasons to make adjustments to the raw temperature data. Also, for most climate studies an accuracy within 1 degree is plenty good.

  29. Whew! Thank goodness! by AlienIntelligence · · Score: 1

    I sure am glad global warming doesn't exist, this could have been SO much worse.

    -AI

    --
    For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion
    1. Re:Whew! Thank goodness! by qu33ksilver · · Score: 1

      Reminds me of Michael Crichton's "State of Fear". And btw, wasn't there an article on /. about a certain melt in the antarctic ice mass ? (I can't remember for sure whether it was in /. or not) Wonder if that was fake too..

  30. No snow in England by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yeah he said no snow in England... not no snow anywhere. They are at the end of the gulf stream so they get extra heat accumulated along they length of the current.

  31. Re:Choose by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sounds like a Republican friend of mine. Come to think of it, sounds like every idiot Republican newly elected to Congress last cycle. Not kidding about that either.

    Meanwhile, the rest of us who know that weather is not climate and that things like this should not be taken as proof BUT should be properly investigated will continue to get called all sorts of names by the people in power, their paid shills, and the uneducated cretins who continue to vote against their own interests.

  32. It IS "every year or two" by mangu · · Score: 3, Interesting

    1936 was an outlier. It happened "every 7 decades or so".

    The last decade, setting YEAR AFTER YEAR records was NOT an outlier.

    1. Re:It IS "every year or two" by rs79 · · Score: 1

      I was a math major. Give me that data and I can write you two reports, one that shows it's hotter than normal and one that shows it's about the same if not a little cooler. And these guys get to pick which stations data to use, that's even better.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
  33. How can this be! by Arancaytar · · Score: 1

    North Carolina passed a law against global warming. This is illegal!

  34. ready steady go by manaway · · Score: 1

    I expect to give up a lot - I will have to change my diet, my transportation, pay way more taxes, do with less or most everything, and in the end all it will get me is a feeling of contribution. I will not live long enough to see the results. No, I am not that young.

    This is what the beginnings of thinking beyond yourself feels like. To consider others, including the generations who are not your direct descendents. You do not live long enough to see the results. You will not be thanked in anyone's memory. You will find no thrill since your contribution is miniscule, while impotence prevents you from influencing others to do more. Your giving up a "profligate lifestyle" is without personal benefit even as deniers and the ignorant enjoy profits and luxuries. You will do it because the alternative is a horror you can't ignore nor contribute to. This is what it's like to be a fairly aware individual.

    We've seen what the rich 1% do with the world. And you're right, it's past time to have more "sensible people prevail."

    1. Re:ready steady go by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      You will do it because the alternative is a horror you can't ignore nor contribute to. This is what it's like to be a fairly aware individual.

      Ive generally stayed out of these arguments, because they seem irrelevant and a waste of time. Certainly pollution is bad, and speeding the adoption of cleaner technology is a very good thing, and certainly I will strive to reduce my footprint. Arguing endlessly over the details just doesnt seem productive.

      But if the hope of environmentalists is that the world around-- including the many billions in developing countries-- are going to join us so that we might stand a chance of preventing disaster, then those environmentalists live in a dream world. We have already seen time and time again that regardless of how much "sense" communism makes you simply cannot get people to go along with it, for even a medium-term return. What on EARTH makes anyone think that India and China will give up a booming economy and lifestyle for a return that wont come for centuries?

    2. Re:ready steady go by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      Exactly. But we cannot stop them . And we will be blamed.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
  35. Record highs to record lows by microbox · · Score: 1

    Between then and now, States have had record cold temperatures as well.

    That's why you want to look at the rate of record highs to record lows. There is a field that works out how to understand if we are looking at trends or outliers. It is called statistics.

    --

    Like all pain, suffering is a signal that something isn't right
    1. Re:Record highs to record lows by rs79 · · Score: 0

      And there's a really cool book called "How to lie with statistics".

      Now, go get the Norwegian tree ring graphs, and take the IPCC hocky stick graph.

      Now *normalize the axes* and superimpose them. Now start laughing and stop worrying.

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    2. Re:Record highs to record lows by tbannist · · Score: 1

      You know what's really cool about Skeptical Science? They already did that. I'm surprised that someone who claims to have a degree in mathematics is foolish enough to believe that tree rings from a single country are a better measure of temperatures than a global network of thermometers.

      --
      Fanatically anti-fanatical
    3. Re:Record highs to record lows by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Now, go get the Norwegian tree ring graphs, and take the IPCC hocky stick graph.

      Yes, because the June temperatures in Scandinavia (going back 2000 years) statistically trumps all the other time series that make up the hocky stick!!!!

      IDIOT

    4. Re:Record highs to record lows by rs79 · · Score: 1

      Ok you explain the tree ring data then.

      As for the link, it doesn't seem to be what you say.

      I did the same thing though, here it is: http://rs79.vrx.net/opinions/ideas/climate/fraud/climategate/

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    5. Re:Record highs to record lows by tbannist · · Score: 1

      So you are actually talking about the recent Scandinavian tree ring data? They wrote about that too. The problem appears to be that you're comparing one regional proxy of summer temperatures (with a 100 year smoothing filter) to a combination of global proxies of annual temperature (with a 40 year smoothing filter). Additionally, given that Scandinavia is around 55-70 degrees North, a trend from that region is highly likely to report amplified cooling (or warming) when compared to the global trend because the poles tend to cool (and warm) faster than rest of the planet.

      Additionally, you might want to watch this video on the Medieval Warm Period.

      --
      Fanatically anti-fanatical
  36. Heatwave Center was SIXTH hottest on record by itsybitsy · · Score: 1

    "Missouri was the most anomalously hot state in July, yet measured maximum temperatures were only sixth hottest on record – five degrees cooler than 1934."
    http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2012/08/08/heatwave-center-was-sixth-hottest-on-record.

    "Warrenton, Missouri is located right at the hottest of the hot in July, 2012. ... Average temperatures in Warrenton during July were six degrees cooler than 1901, 1934 and 1936, and almost one degree cooler than 1954. ... July 2012 wasn’t anywhere near as hot as July 1936."
    http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2012/08/09/record-heat-fraud-ground-zero.

    1. Re:Heatwave Center was SIXTH hottest on record by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Last Sunday the Seattle prognosticators were saying over and over that this days Seafair hydroplane race would likely be hotter than the (mid 90's F) one back in 1982.
      By the end of the brodacast they declared a new record for the day of 90 F.
      (Posting anon to avoid embarrasment of admiting I watched their news)

    2. Re:Heatwave Center was SIXTH hottest on record by T+Murphy · · Score: 1

      It's entirely possible to set a national record for hottest month without breaking a single state or local record (though I don't know how many such records were actually set this July). You just need simultaneous above-average temperatures over a broad portion of the country, not necessarily extreme temperatures.

    3. Re:Heatwave Center was SIXTH hottest on record by riverat1 · · Score: 1

      There were 3,135 new hot records set in July for the continental US. They outnumbered cold records by 16.6 to 1.

  37. Why is this tagged with 'globalwarming'? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Since most of the North American population lives in/near the contiguous U.S., this sure may seem like global warming. However, if it is global warming, then Alaska must have a thermal wall around it because last winter was phenomenally snowy on the southern coast [1], and insanely cold [2]. In fact, if the unofficial temperature was accurate, on January 28, 2012, a certain spot in Alaska came only 2 degrees Fahrenheit from the North American record cold temperature [3].

    This summer has been very cool, too [4]. The rest of this month is predicted to be colder than average [5]. Most Alaskans would tell you that they think of global warming as nothing more than fantasy they wished was reality.

    [1] adn.com/2012/04/07/2411798/city-inches-closer-to-the-seasonal.html, thecordovatimes.com/article/1202big_snow_of_2012

    [2] newsminer.com/view/full_story/17574836/article-Frigid-weather-dominated-Alaska-throughout-January, newsminer.com/view/full_story/17366572/article-Brrrr--Alaska-shivered-through-one-of-coldest-Januarys-on-record, adn.com/2012/01/27/2287406/anchorage-on-track-to-set-record.html

    [3] wunderground.com/blog/weatherhistorian/comment.html?entrynum=59

    [4] newsminer.com/view/full_story/19659433/article-Fairbanks-sees-cool--fairly-dry-month-of-July

    [5] See latter part of the article in [4]

  38. Glass half-empty, glas half-full -- but of what? by zooblethorpe · · Score: 1

    The glass is always full...

    While those of good nature with light in their hearts
    Find goodness in each of life various parts,
    They see each blessing as a bountiful bowl;
    A half glass of water they see as half full.

    But I say these folks need a stick in the eye!
    Beat them in the head till they break down and cry.
    Tell me not to be cheery! To you I say this:
    My life is a glass that is half full of piss.

    (everybody now!)
    Tallu tallary ta tippy tarye,
    I shan't feel better till the barrel is dry.
    So fill up me tankard with that good foamy bliss!
    Me life is a glass that is half full of piss.

    (With apologies / thanks to The Poxy Boggards.)

    --
    "What in the name of Fats Waller is that?"
    "A four-foot prune."
  39. Crushing Falsification of July Record Temps by itsybitsy · · Score: 0

    "The press release is out, and the usual serial bloviators are rushing to trumpet the news. July 2012 was the hottest ever on record! “Yikes! We’re gonna roast! Global Warming!” ... Of course the first thing I do when I see these sorts of things is go look at the data. It tells a far more interesting and credible story. Here’s some graphs NCDC and Seth won’t ever put in a press release or AP story:"
    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/08/08/dear-noaa-and-seth-which-1930s-were-you-referring-to-when-you-say-july-is-the-record-warmest

    1. Re:Crushing Falsification of July Record Temps by Joe+blows+co2 · · Score: 0

      Also a bit on icecape.us Anthony comments on the NASA animation by Dr. James Hansen of surface temperature trends from 1955-1999:http://icecap.us/index.php/go/joes-blog/nasas_james_hansens_big_cherry_pick/

  40. Blame by jimbrooking · · Score: 1

    Clearly this is all Al Gore's fault!

  41. Creationists and Flat-Young Earth Faithful Unite by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Been doing some backgrounding on this.

    Looks like a common thread is emerging.

    The Anthropogenic Global Warming types are:

    1) Creationists.

    2) Believe in a 'Flat Earth', i.e. Earth is a plane and at the center of the Universe.

    3) The Earth is NOT 4.5 billion years old, they contend. It is 4006 years according
    to a Biblical interpretation.

    Ah Ha.

    I will posit that the Anthropogenic Global Warming Believers also Deny Human Evolution.

    Lordy Lordy Lordy.

    Hmmmm.

    Lets also observer that the Anthropogenic Global Warming Believers are ... Caucasian ... or desperately hope to be one ... Protestant.

    !!!!!!!

    Now we have them profiled.

    Laugh Out Loud

  42. US Record by formfeed · · Score: 1

    All I see is a headline with a new U.S. record !

    Go team USA!

  43. You all realize by buddilla · · Score: 0

    that the sun is has basically started it's solar max cycle right now even though the predictions were for 2010 - 2011 with one scientist say 2012. Some say 2013 now. I personally believe since the solar storms have already started that it has started and will peak in February.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_maximum
    http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2006/10mar_stormwarning/
    http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2012/20jul_tasteofsolarmax/

    --
    Pitch Forks: check Torches: check Angry People: check - A. LaChasse V for Victory
  44. Weather == climate by CptNerd · · Score: 0

    And we all know, weather is climate when it's hot, and not climate when it's cold.

    --
    By the taping of my glasses, something geeky this way passes
  45. Central limit theorem by mdsolar · · Score: 2

    Climatologists do get to work with some pretty precisely determined average temperatures owing to the central limit theorem.

    1. Re:Central limit theorem by budgenator · · Score: 1

      Climatologists do get to work with some pretty precisely determined average temperatures owing to the central limit theorem.

      given certain conditions, the mean of a sufficiently large number of independent random variables, each with finite mean and variance, will be approximately normally distributed. Central limit theorem

      I'm not at all sure that
      1. Tmin+Tmax/2 is a representative average temperature,
      2. the decimate of thermometers used over the years would count as "sufficiently large number",
      3. the adjustments, homogenization and gridding of the raw data blows randomsness and independance out of the water as well; but I'm open to rational arguements.

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
  46. In other news, Snow in Johannesburg... by flyingfsck · · Score: 1

    ...meanwhile, all nine provinces of South Africa got snow at the same time and severe flooding in the Karoo desert. Obviously this must be the start of the next Ice Age and it is clearly all due to Man Made Global Warming...

    --
    Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
    1. Re:In other news, Snow in Johannesburg... by Dixie_Flatline · · Score: 1

      That's why it's actually 'Climate Change' not 'Global Warming'. If you read up on the subject, the prediction is for some areas to get colder, some to get warmer, the average temperature of the Earth to go up, and for strange weather events to increase. 'Global Warming' is a bit of a misnomer, in that it's easy to get confused and think that it means just everywhere on Earth will simultaneously get X degrees warmer. Those extra degrees represent extra energy in the system, and how the energy is dispersed is what drives the weather and the climate.

      So, yeah. Those things that you said aren't just unsurprising, they're exactly what we can expect more of as the climate changes due to an average surface temperature warming.

  47. What a bunch of wusses. Here's how to win. by ajaxlex · · Score: 1, Troll

    Deniers are not only sociopaths, they're also crying terrified babies. For some reason, they've forgotten what a properly primed market can do. We are seeing adoption of renewable energy sources far in excess of predictions just 8 years ago. Why's that? Some governments are properly incentivizing the research and development of transformative technologies.

    Meanwhile, the entrenched interests continue to muddy the situation with studies from the Heartland Institute and other wholly self-serving tools. We _can_ turn things around, and still have a very good standard of living. But the people who profit from the status quo aren't interested in seeing their golden goose fly away.

    Amory Lovins of the rocky mountain institute has been teaching businesses how they can save energy and money _at the same time_ since the 70s. He's just published a new book ( a must read for anyone who doesn't want to wring their hands and whimper ) called "Reinventing Fire". It shows how we can transform our economy and enjoy GDP _growth_ - by eliminating inefficiencies, and rewarding new technologies and systems.

    We made this mess. If we are willing to try without fear, we can certainly clean it up.

  48. Only 150 years out of 4.54 billion? by Relayman · · Score: 1

    July may have been the hottest month in the United States since 1871 but that doesn't even include the Middle Ages. Give me a break!

    You could say, "The world's population has never been less than 1.5 billion people" by using estimates of the world population but only going back to 1871,

    --
    If I used a sig over again, would anyone notice?
  49. 2 Tenths Of A Degree by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    From Wikipedia: [begin Quote]

    The thermometer was used by the originators of the Fahrenheit and Celsius scales.
    Anders Celsius, a Swedish astronomer, devised the Celsius scale, which was described in his publication the origin of the Celsius temperature scale in 1742.
    Celsius used two fixed points in his scale: the temperature of melting ice and the temperature of boiling water. This wasn't a new idea, since Isaac Newton was already working on something similar. The distinction of Celsius was to use the condition of melting and not that of freezing. The experiments for reaching a good calibration of his thermometer lasted for 2 winters. By performing the same experiment over and over again, he discovered that ice always melted at the same calibration mark on the thermometer. He found a similar fixed point in the calibration of boiling water to water vapour (when this is done to high precision, a variation will be seen with atmospheric pressure; Celsius noted this). At the moment that he removed the thermometer from the vapour, the mercury level climbed slightly. This was related to the rapid cooling (and contraction) of the glass.
    When Celsius decided to use his own temperature scale, he originally defined his scale "upside-down", i.e. he chose to set the boiling point of pure water at 0 C (212 F) and the freezing point at 100 C (32 F).[1] One year later Frenchman Jean-Pierre Christin proposed to invert the scale with the freezing point at 0 C (32 F) and the boiling point at 100 C (212 F).[2] He named it Centigrade (100 grades).
    Finally, Celsius proposed a method of calibrating a thermometer:
    Place the cylinder of the thermometer in melting ice made of pure water and mark the point where the fluid in the thermometer stabilises. This point is the freeze/thaw point of water.
    In the same manner mark the point where the fluid stabilises when the thermometer is placed in boiling water vapour.
    Divide the length between the two marks into 100 equal parts.
    These points are adequate for approximate calibration but both vary with atmospheric pressure. Nowadays, the triple point of water is used instead of the freezing point (the triple point occurs at 273.16 kelvins (K), 0.01 C).
    Before the discovery of the true thermodynamic temperature, the thermometer defined the temperature; thermometers made with different materials would define different temperature scales (a coloured alcohol thermometer would give a slightly different reading than a mercury thermometer at, say half-scale). In practice several materials gave very similar temperatures to each other and, when discovered, to the thermodynamic temperature.
    [edit]Maximum thermometer

    A medical mercury-in-glass maximum thermometer showing the temperature of 38.7 C.
    A special kind of mercury-in-glass thermometer, called a maximum thermometer, works by having a constriction in the neck close to the bulb. As the temperature rises the mercury is pushed up through the constriction by the force of expansion. When the temperature falls the column of mercury breaks at the constriction and cannot return to the bulb thus remaining stationary in the tube. The observer can then read the maximum temperature over the set period of time. To reset the thermometer it must be swung sharply. This design is used in the traditional type of medical thermometer.
    [edit]Maximum minimum thermometer

    A maximum minimum thermometer, also known as Six's thermometer, is a thermometer which registers the maximum and minimum temperatures reached over a period of time, typically 24 hours. The original design contains mercury, but solely as a way to indicate the position of a column of alcohol whose expansion indicates the temperature; it is not a thermometer operated by the expansion of mercury; mercury-free versions are available.
    [edit]Physical properties

    Mercury cannot be used below the temperature at which it becomes solid, -38.83 C (-37.89 F). If the thermometer contains nitrogen, the gas may flow down into the column when the mercury solidifies

  50. 5 stages of corporate blame by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    1. Everything is great. Here, buy my iphone.
    2. Not enough, here, have this SUV
    3. By the way, now that you have those things, use them a bit more would you!
    4. You're using them too much, now we have to take them away.
    5. You have to give them to us our we'll take your home, and your cat. Also, you no longer have any rights.

  51. Re:wheu shore is hawt out there huh (spits tobacco by dbIII · · Score: 1

    What's with it with you kids revising history? Global cooling was little more than a joke from journalists that didn't know any better that got printed along with all those "next year we'll having flying cars" bullshit. Even those those "in search of ..." false documentaries had more credibility.
    I also have an American technician on a visit here that is doing that spitting thing all the time at work and it makes everyone want to hit him. Does that stuff happen a lot?

  52. Oh yes you did - look at where he works by dbIII · · Score: 1

    With that pathetic backpedal above but you didn't quite manage to move the goalposts far enough. I suppose "lol. Hansen" and "like the crazy guy on the street corner" is not quite equal to "didn't know anything" but it doesn't really matter which way you twist your words to win your silly troll game. I'm not playing whatever silly game you are and instead pointing out that if you are going to compare reputations like you tried above you are going to come out very far behind.
    Sorry kid, you are too full of shit the play the "that idiot, what does he know" game and doing it against someone at the top of a completely different field is nothing other than childish.

    1. Re:Oh yes you did - look at where he works by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      I don't need to back peddle. We have been through this before, it's why you decided you had to show the entire world how pissed you are at me and put that foe dot on.

      I simply do not go to the same church as you do and do not bow down to worship every fucktwit who preaches your gospel. Get over it. Hansen is a politically motivated self interested buffoon who doesn't interest me. HE could tell me there is a spider on my sleeve and I wouldn't pay attention until someone else told me it was there or I saw it for myself somehow. HE is nothing but a shill that happens to work for the government. His actions show this, not my ignorance or anything else you can imagine to make yourself feel good about hanging on his every thought.

    2. Re:Oh yes you did - look at where he works by dbIII · · Score: 1

      I simply do not go to the same church as you do and do not bow down to worship every fucktwit who preaches your gospel

      Ah, the Ian Plimer approach of pretending that climate science is a religeon and then making fun of religeon. WTF is it with you people?

    3. Re:Oh yes you did - look at where he works by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      I'm sorry that your actions have inspired that reaction so many times that it has a common name for you to refer to.

      Perhaps if you look at yourself you will find WTF is it with you people. Usually, when you are confused to why people are treating you a certain way, self reflection helps you figure it out.

      I'll give you a hint, it has a little to do with your comprehension skills and overly zealous approach to all things global warming advocacy. You see, not only did i not say Hansen didn't know anything, I never proceeded to make fun of your religion either. Yet somehow you perceived it and made the accusation.

  53. Texas Cooler by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I've looked at some of the records from weatherspark.com, and my personal experience tells me this summer has been significantly cooler at least in the eastern half of Texas than it was last year. Last year was a real scorcher, this year is at least cooler in terms of max heat.

  54. what to do by manaway · · Score: 1

    Agreed, let's not have another endless argument. You ask what can we do to make the booming economies and lifestyles of India and China change, and the countries join us in preventing disaster. I think the question is too broad, and not only can I not answer it, no one can. Don't get me wrong, I like big picture utopias of cheap basement fusion, solar roofs and deserts, windmills with molten salt storage, underground homes, workers keeping the income instead of CEOs and shareholders and bankers, and... However, back on earth in the present: if you get specific, find something you're really interested in, then you can sort out approaches, figure out how to apply your skills, start gathering resources.

    For example: I watched a documentary about a grade school kid who could hardly believe that a village in Kenya had no water. I guess he figured out what not doing anything leads to, so he had a fundraiser and built a manually operated (no CO2!) local well. Then he raised money for another. And toward the end he flew to the country to celebrate the 50th (or so) well. Another example: Women Helping Women started in the 1990s with one educated but poor person, now it's up to some 600 people in 20-something countries.

    I won't presume to suggest what you should do, as I have no idea what you're capable of. You say these arguments are a waste of time. Maybe you've mastered the craft of endlessly detailed arguments, and are ready to move on. To participate in some productive task. Get on the phone or your feet and pick a project. Some are so desperate for people that they'd even be grateful for help from you or me. Or start one. If it doesn't work out, try another.

    1. Re:what to do by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      We cannot MAKE China or India do anything.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    2. Re:what to do by manaway · · Score: 1

      Yes, this. The only country one can change is one's own.

  55. Futurama by ThatsNotPudding · · Score: 2

    "Is that Fahrenheit or Celcius?"
    "First one, then the other."

  56. Re:What a bunch of wusses. Here's how to win. by rickb928 · · Score: 0

    "Deniers are not only sociopaths,"

    Just go away. Accusing those who questioned AGW of being 'sociopaths' is the tactic of socialists, anarchists, and those who just hate. You are a useful idiot. No different than the other extreme you mistakenly think i was part of.

    Go protest something, and continue to derive meaning from it.

    --
    deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
  57. Nobody will confuse you for a physicist. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You know all that stuff about measuring and how as you measure you have an error bar and how that error bar is used to define how many decimal places are significant?

    But you probably didn't do science at homeschool, did you.

  58. Only if you keep it locked in a strong box. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Guess what there's a lack of in our atmosphere? A strong roof keeping the atmosphere in.

    Did you know that the tropopause is around 3km higher at the equator than the poles?

    P=nRT/V

    Temperature goes up, volume per mole goes up, pressure doesn't change much.

  59. most hot years during solar activity maxima by peter303 · · Score: 1

    The 1930s solar maximum was very strong as well as the US drought and temperatures. I think this drought and temperature has surpassed that.

    1. Re:most hot years during solar activity maxima by Krojack · · Score: 1

      Depends where you live. In my area people are all complaining because it's the hottest it's ever been, according to them. This is false unless they lived and can recall the summer of 1921 which was even hotter according to records.

  60. Re:What a bunch of wusses. Here's how to win. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ha. My ad hom is better than your ad hom.

    I differentiate true skeptics from deniers. Scientists are the original true skeptic. Deniers will repeatedly ignore rebuttals of their faulty arguments, re-present their discredited positions, and ignore evidence that goes against their worldview. Inasmuch as they subvert useful discussion towards important societal concerns, they are, by definition, sociopaths. Try harder next time.

    socialist? anarchist? I just presented a rational market based approach to solve the issue, that doesn't require that we stick our head in the sand. I'm not protesting, I'm adding useful information to the discussion. Tell you what. Look up Mr. Lovins' credentials and his excellent book, and then decide whether I rate Troll.

  61. Still wasn't the hottest on record where I am by Krojack · · Score: 1

    The record was set back in 1921 in my area. Was global warming a problem back then also? o.O

    On a side note, it's very very dry here like most if the US however my area isn't anywhere near being in the top 10 driest years on record. This according to the local weather man about two weeks ago.

    1. Re:Still wasn't the hottest on record where I am by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      The record was set back in 1921 in my area. Was global warming a problem back then also?

      Global warming means that global average temperature is rising. Which it is. It does not mean that it's necessarily warmer in your particular neck of the woods, though. In fact it may well be noticeably colder due to weather pattern disruption. It's just that more places grow warmer rather than colder.

    2. Re:Still wasn't the hottest on record where I am by Krojack · · Score: 1

      I guess I worded that wrong. I should have said "man made global warming"

      My point being, weather patterns like what we're going though now, have happened for hundreds of thousands of years. Up and down, warm and cold spells. Melting and freezing of ice glaciers. Hell there is even proof that Greenland's ice glaciers haven't even existed in the past and plants grew there. Also proof that the ice glaciers have had sudden melts in the past (before man) just like the recent melt that was just recorded.

      Doesn't matter if the heating will occur over the next 10 years, 50 years or 500 years. Someone will cry and others will try to profit off it. It's similar to how every single year the news media hypes the current year as being the "WORSE EVER FOR HURRICANES" ever since Hurricane Katrina hit in 2005. Only one hurricane hit the USA since and it wasn't even a major one.

      I myself will continue to enjoy life while driving my SUV yet also recycle as much of my trash as I can.

  62. Realisticaly by DarthVain · · Score: 1

    You forgot mine:

    It's probably happening, however the potential reprecussions are severe enough that we should do something just in case.

    To many people think of in terms of absoultes (it is or is not happening). I think more people need to think in terms of risk, of what might be potentionally happing, and what the results are from doing nothing.

    Something like this, using the analysis and data available it is very difficult to prove with any absoulte certainty, however we can look at probable causes, and potentional outcomes, and make decisions based on that.

    1. Re:Realisticaly by HArchH · · Score: 1

      The risk is that some loon will do something of global scope that plunges us into a glacial ice age.

    2. Re:Realisticaly by DarthVain · · Score: 1

      There is that as well, all should be weighed against each other. But I would agree, the human track record for implementing "fixes" to our enviroment hasn't been great. The theme has usually been "unintended consequences "... That is why I would be against pretty much against any "geoengineering" project. Dumping stuff into our oceans or atmosphere seems to be to be a very bad idea, that will have long lasting consequences, many of which we probably do not have a clue about.

      However there are plenty of passive things that can be done.

      Anyway I think it is all moot, as politically I don't think enough of the world can get it together to do anything meaningful one way or another. The developing countries are going to continue to develop expanding industry, emmisions, carbon, etc... and they would argue it is there turn, who are we to tell them they can't, when we all got rich doing it 50-100 years ago. Then there are finite resources, etc... I see things getting bad before any actually change is forced. I'll probably be an old man by then however.

  63. Lower 48?!? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Here in the Pacific Northwest we've had one of the coolest, wettest summers ever. Oh, I forgot - if it happens on the east coast, it happens across the whole US.

  64. Lies, damn lies and statistics. by pubwvj · · Score: 1

    Lies, damn lies and statistics.

    You say "Record Temperatures" but what you FAIL to mention is that the record is only by 0.2ÂF and the previous date is during the 1936 dust bowl. That's a mere two tenths of a degree which is well within the margin of error.

    Stop being an alarmist. Shame on you.

  65. Let's get back to the point by dbIII · · Score: 1

    When Hansen is saying the stuff you "lol Hansen" at, it is part of his job for NASA. If it was really such an extreme fabrication as you suggest then he would be out on the street and no longer be working for them.
    Trying to deflect your "I know better than NASA" bullshit by personal attacks on the person than points it out is quite pathetic really.

    1. Re:Let's get back to the point by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      so manipulating the environment in order to make a claim about the climate have more impact then it otherwise would is part of his job huh? Getting arrested and leading protests is part of his job.

      Bullshit. Hansen jumped the shark in the beginning and the reason he hasn't been fired is because it's near impossible to fire government employees not directly related to security.

      Ever wonder why the US doesn't believe in the seriousness of global warming? It's because Hansen attempted to defraud us from the start and it's almost impossible to not look for the fraud in the claims ever since.

  66. Not Really An Issue by hidave · · Score: 1

    I didn't read all the comments, but from the ones I read, no one has recognized that the US represents a mere 2% of the earth's surface. A few weeks of hot weather in one year on a tiny fraction of the earth's surface is hardly anything to get excited about. http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/08/07/editorial-hansen-is-simply-wrong-and-a-complete-and-abject-failure/

    --
    Synchronizing stop lights across the US = one less nuclear power plant
  67. it's an outlier by JBaustian · · Score: 1

    The drought and abnormally warm temperatures in the Midwest started nearly a year ago, and it was clear from the beginning that the cause was a shift in the jet stream. The midwestern US was receiving the heat and precipitation normal for New Mexico and west Texas, because nearly all the weather patterns were flowing directly from there. We weren't getting Pacific storms, Alberta clippers, or flows north from the Gulf of Mexico.

    Do the global warmists have an explanation that incorporates a shift in the jet stream?

  68. What's up with Washington? by HArchH · · Score: 1

    Those idiots in the State of Washington better get with the program. Otherwise they are going to be left out in the cold.