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Is Mobile Broadband a Luxury Or a Human Right?

concealment sends this quote from an article at CNN: "Moderating a discussion on the future of broadband, Mashable editor-in-chief Lance Ulanoff tossed a provocative question to the audience: 'By quick show of hands, how many out there think that broadband is a luxury?' Next question: 'How many out there think it is a human right?' That option easily carried the audience vote. Broadband access is too important to society to be relegated to a small, privileged portion of the world population, Hans Vestberg, president and CEO of Ericsson, said during the discussion. Dr. Hamadoun Touré, secretary-general of the International Telecommunication Union, echoed Vestberg's remarks. 'We need to make sure all the world's inhabitants are connected to the goodies of the online world, which means better health care, better education, more sustainable economic and social development,' Touré said."

24 of 332 comments (clear)

  1. A Luxury by siphonophore · · Score: 5, Insightful

    One must be careful about diluting the word "right." Leave it at 3, and protect them fiercely.

    --
    Dance like you're hurt, Love like you need money, and work when somebody's watching.
    -Scott Adams
    1. Re:A Luxury by bondsbw · · Score: 5, Insightful

      When living your life often requires internet access, then it becomes a right.

      Living your life more often requires a car than internet access. Is owning a car a right? Do we all get free cars?

      --
      All my liberal friends think I'm a conservative, all my conservative friends think I'm a liberal.
    2. Re:A Luxury by Mephistophocles · · Score: 4, Insightful
      How incredibly naive.

      When living your life often requires internet access, then it becomes a right.

      I don't know whether to feel sorry for you or just be disgusted by the fact that you think one can't live one's life without internet access. What basic function of existence, exactly (and by the way, entertainment - as per your video machine rental analogy - isn't a basic function of existence) becomes impossible without the internet? How exactly do you think mankind lived before the internet existed (and by the way, I'm an old(ish) fart so I've spent more of my life without the internet than with it)?

      The number of examples where email/broadband availability is ASSUMED will increase in the future, because it is cheaper to remove human cost from the equation. Thus, the non-internet minority will become marginalized to an increasingly greater degree.

      And here you've committed a horrible and dangerous logical error, thereby missing the fact that marginalizing a segment of mankind because they a) can't afford a service, or b) choose - for whatever reason - not to spend money on that service, would be a pretty facist action. Whether or not it happens anyway isn't the issue; tacit acceptance of that happening (and thereby mandating that service as a human right) is.

      The internet is a wonderful thing - and access to it is certainly a nice thing to have. It does make some aspects of living in a 1st-world country very convenient (we can argue later about how convenience can and often does destroy skill, but for now we'll assume convenience is a good thing). But the absence of it does not make life unlivable. Anyone who says different probably works for Comcast. :)

      --
      Deja Moo: The distinct feeling that you've heard this bull before.
    3. Re:A Luxury by Kaz+Kylheku · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Here is a good way to express it. People have a right not to be ACTIVELY marginalized (i.e. singled out in some way and oppressed). People do not have a right not to be PASSIVELY marginalized (living in some disadvantaged way due to their own inability or inaction).

      Leftist "rights" advocates are not able to see the difference.

    4. Re:A Luxury by kelemvor4 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      When living your life often requires internet access, then it becomes a right.

      Living your life more often requires a car than internet access. Is owning a car a right? Do we all get free cars?

      Plenty of people live without both, and neither one is a right. This is silliness that's being used to sell electronics.

    5. Re:A Luxury by msauve · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yes, it's a luxury. A "right" doesn't exist where you can demand that someone else buy you something (the child/parent relationship excepted). If the CEO of Ericsson disagrees, I'll need to know his address, so I can send him my Internet bill.

      Of course, what he's really saying is "Governments, through the force of taxation, should get the richer taxpaers to buy Internet connections for the poorer, increasing the market for my company."

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    6. Re:A Luxury by fche · · Score: 3, Informative

      "When living your life often requires [...something...], then it becomes a right"

      Hogwash. The world does not owe you survival. Your neighbour is not violating your "human rights" because he fails to donate you something "your life often requires".

    7. Re:A Luxury by cayenne8 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      When living your life often requires internet access, then it becomes a right. If everyone had provided the non-internet equivalent of the daily services, then maybe it would be a luxury

      Seriously???

      I mean, the internet is fantastically convenient...but there's nothing I couldn't do to live (eat, buy stuff, pay bills) without having an internet connection, and doing things the "old fashioned" way of like 8-10 years ago....

      A right? Give me a break.....

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    8. Re:A Luxury by gsgriffin · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I was just in Zimbabwe in small villages...people there couldn't care less about the Internet, and their lives won't be getting better because of it. You provide access, now they need a computer. They have a computer, now they need power. They need power, now they need money to pay for the power. Problem: They don't have money. Who's going to give everyone that?

      They live on a barter system and off the land they live on. This is a LOT OF THE WORLD. Make it available, sure, but most of them don't give a rip about it other than a curiosity. Teach their kids how to use it, and there aren't any jobs that will use it there.

      As a privileged person who lives much of their lives on the Internet, you can't imagine life without it. Meet a person in sustenance living conditions, and they don't see it as a right or a need...just a toy.

      --
      jsut athnoer menagiensls ltitle psrhae for you to dcoede. Why do we wtsae our tmie dnoig tihs?
    9. Re:A Luxury by Elbereth · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The problem is that Slashdot is full of technocrats who think that we live in post-scarcity world. Arguing over whether broadband internet access is a human right or not just shows how out of touch we are with the rest of the world, which is struggling just to survive.

    10. Re:A Luxury by Dare+nMc · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I wouldn't use your definition to read this article, I would more use the American Convention of Human rights, to set a baseline:

      commits its parties to respect the civil and political rights of individuals, including the right to life, freedom of religion, freedom of speech, freedom of assembly, electoral rights and rights to due process and a fair trial

      From this I think internet in the US, meets that definition. To have a meaningfull say in the right to free speech, assembly, and information on how laws are interpreted... We are to the point where everyone needs to be given access to internet to defend these Human rights. Now the second part of the question is, does having that access freely available at public library still cover the need, or do we need to extend that to giving free access to anyone carrying say, a expired smartphone, like we do with dialing 911 and a dumb phone....
      I would come down on the side of "not a right" but I think the line is not nearly as far off, as your definition of rights goes. IE I don't think your definition of a right would include free speech.

    11. Re:A Luxury by CapOblivious2010 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Can you really not see the difference between the right to own a car (or use the internet) vs the right to have someone else (typically "the gov't", which really means "the taxpayers") pay for it so you can have it for free?

    12. Re:A Luxury by Dare+nMc · · Score: 3, Insightful

      A right doesn't equal funding or even government sponsored. IE the right to free speech, or bear arms doesn't equal no cost access to both, it does say undue restriction by government, ether by rule or cost is wrong. I would apply this to mobile internet. IE call it a right, so if the government, or provider ever bans a device because say the device didn't have a security back door for snooping, we have standing to say that is illegal, and mobile internet must not be overly restricted.

  2. You have the right to pay for your own stuff. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Oh spare us the human "rights" that involve other people paying for the stuff you want.

  3. Binary question by jellomizer · · Score: 4, Insightful

    A luxury or a human right. What there isn't a middle ground here?

    --
    If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
  4. Right vs Good Idea by BenSchuarmer · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's not a right, but that doesn't mean it's not a good idea. I think societies will find that the benefits of setting it up are worth more than the cost.

  5. Rights versus someone else's property by jedidiah · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Rights are only appropriately applied to liberties. You never have the right to someone else's property or labor. Goods and services are not something you can have a "right" to.

    Access may be a compelling social good but it is absurd to call it a right.

    --
    A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    1. Re:Rights versus someone else's property by vanyel · · Score: 3, Insightful

      A right is something you can do, not something someone else does for you.

  6. There is a pretty wide disparity between... by jpstanle · · Score: 4, Insightful

    There is a pretty wide disparity between "Luxury" and "Basic human right."

    I'd hardly call indoor plumbing, 99.9% uptime electricity, or interstate highways to be "basic human rights," but they're pretty much essential for an modern, industrial society/economy.

  7. Silly false dichotomy by fischerville · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This is the silliest of false dichotomies. It's not a luxury because it's so widely and cheaply available. It's not a human right because it's a proper commodity like everything else. Not everything that is desirable is a human right.

  8. Life, Liberty, Pursuit of Happiness by Revotron · · Score: 5, Insightful

    1. Life: Can you survive without it? Yes.
    2. Liberty: Does not having it limit your freedom of speech, right to bear arms, right to a fair and speedy trial, or other consitutional rights? No.
    3. Pursuit of Happiness: Could you live a happy life without it? Yes.

    It is not a right to be bestowed upon you, it is an opportunity afforded to you by others. As such, others may request compensation for it.

    I'm getting sick of this new generation of entitlement.

  9. Re:Have a bunch of "rights" for you, from 1936. by CanHasDIY · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Communism is not theoretically sound because it fails to account for the basics of human nature.

    I never said it was theoretically sound; my exact words were

    communism is just as theoretically sound as any other socioeconomic principle.

    The "basics of human nature" that you claim is the antithesis of communism also invalidate the thesis of capitalism, fascism, et. al.

    --
    An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
  10. A Luxury? by jiriw · · Score: 5, Informative

    None of those things are necessities for life. To survive, to be alive, I do not need to use on-line vendors.

    Here in the Netherlands we increasingly need to... Various government taxes already can only, be handled online. Currently the taxes that can only be handled online are those for all (small and large) businesses. And if those businesses refuse they are put out of business. Individuals can still get a paper form for their income tax but it's already strongly discouraged. More and more parts of the government are going an online-mostly or only route, not only for additional stuff but the essentials.

    Many businesses stopped sending bills through 'snail' mail. Most communication businesses (telephone, cable and internet providers) were the first to do so. Banks are decreasing their number of offices throughout the country rapidly. Most of the time only the major cities still have one (1) office where you can do your banking business. (Such an office would have to serve ten of thousands of customers if not a majority was doing his/ber banking online.) For the rest they only offer online services. The least expensive health-insurers (with the basic package) only offer you service if they can send bills electronically and medicine can only be ordered through an internet-apothecary (after you get a prescription by a certified GP or specialist of course).

    With other things, not interacting online causes a hefty financial penalty. Getting your receipts through mail is a value-added option, not included in the basic packages for those businesses still offering it that don't have to send you the actual goods by mail (like shops... which are cheaper most of the time, by the way, if you order the goods online). The best deals on contracts for electricity, cooking gas, all insurances, savings accounts, mortgages and other financial products, communication products, etc. are found online.
    If you want to access the educational system, you have to be online, if only it was to sign up for an actual school or university (for college education or equivalents or better).

    A person in the Netherlands which doesn't have access to the internet has either a very poor standard of living or a very high one (because he can afford to opt-out).

    I would say, here in the Netherlands the ability to have an internet connection capable of doing all this described above is a right. Of course that does not imply you should get a connection for free. You should still pay a proper (but also limited) fee for your connection if you decide to use the services of a provider that provides you with said internet connection. The providers however are (and increasingly so) regulated, for example, by means of laws for things like net-neutrality and the anti-telecoms-monopoly agency OPTA. And there are also government subsidies for providers willing to implement connections to places less profitable. Which is all fair, considering you can't really live in the Netherlands without having an internet connection of some sorts.

  11. No. by reiko13 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Vint Cerf gives a very good answer, though that was for the Internet and not Mobile Broadband. "For example, at one time if you didn’t have a horse it was hard to make a living. But the important right in that case was the right to make a living, not the right to a horse. Today, if I were granted a right to have a horse, I’m not sure where I would put it." http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/05/opinion/internet-access-is-not-a-human-right.html?_r=0.