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UK Court Sanctions Apple For Non-Compliance

drinkypoo writes "We've been following the story that Apple was ordered by a UK court to post an apology to Samsung both in newspapers and on Apple's UK website. After originally posting a non-apology and then hiding a real one, Apple finally complied. Now, PJ over at Groklaw reports on the ruling from the UK court itself, which condemns Apple's conduct in this matter. 'Since Apple did not comply with the order in its estimation, adding materials that were not ordered and in addition were "false," the judges ordered Apple to pay Samsung's lawyers' fees on an indemnity basis, and they add some public humiliation.' The judge wrote, 'Finally I should mention the time for compliance. Mr Beloff, on instructions (presumably given with the authority of Apple) told us that "for technical reasons" Apple needed fourteen days to comply. I found that very disturbing: that it was beyond the technical abilities of Apple to make the minor changes required to own website in less time beggared belief. ... I hope that the lack of integrity involved in this incident is entirely atypical of Apple.'"

133 of 217 comments (clear)

  1. Standby in Three... Two... One.... by wierd_w · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Cue the apple fanbois and their out of control apologetics.
    This story just wouldnt be complete without their sqealing.

    On a more serious note, I agree with the judge. This kind of change could have been implemented in less than one day. Apple probably just wanted more time to try to wrangle some legal way out of putting the directed message on their website in the manner proscribed.

    You know what they say-- Tell a lie enough times, and you will begin to believe it yourself. That's the danger of using an RDF.

    1. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by JustOK · · Score: 5, Funny

      Yah, it sounds like he would make the smart choice.

      --
      rewriting history since 2109
    2. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      On a more serious note, I agree with the judge. This kind of change could have been implemented in less than one day

      Bullshit.

      Their web design team is forced to use iPads.

    3. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by G3ckoG33k · · Score: 4, Funny

      But, the anti-Apple fanboys have valid arguments so what is your point?

    4. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by wierd_w · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I wouldn't mind apple at all, if apple conducted itself in a manner that wasn't synonymous with being contrite cock gobblers.

      Apple's ENTIRE business structure revolves around continual invocation of "The dick move". (We are apple. You want our shiny products! But---- If you want the shiny products, you have to do everything we say! If you dont, we'll break your, or rather, OUR, shiny product to stop your defiance.) [essentially. That and a whole lot more.]

      If apple just made products and sold them like any other company, instead of trying to create a bullshit mystique and bullying every other product manufacturer and their own potential user base while lieing through their teeth about being innovative, I wouldnt have any problem with them, much like I dont have any problem with the dozens of other handset makers out there.

      I dont have a boner for Google, or Motorola, or HTC, or Samsung, or any of the others. (and, contrary to your seemingly diametrically polarized world view, I actually DISLIKE google for a large number of reasons.)

      I just dont like Apple, because Apple conducts itself like a total douche.

      It bothers me greatly that such a large number of people are so beholden to Apple, that they would attempt to justify any action it takes, regardless of how horrendous it is, rather than make the personal admission that perhaps their devotion wasnt justified.

      I was simply sarcastically pointing out that stories like this draw them out of the woodwork without fail to cast apologetic rhetoric in favor of their preferred tech company.

      Companies don't deserve loyalty. They show us absolutely none. They deserve none of ours.

      It is as simple as that.

    5. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by yacc143 · · Score: 5, Funny

      You sure? My Apple-logic(tm) that would make super productive, as the iPad is clearly superior to a mere PC for any use, ....

    6. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by craigminah · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I like some of Apple's products but also dislike their business practices and I think Steve Jobs was an asshole. I have no brand loyalty...whatever is a bood value gets my money.

    7. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by craigminah · · Score: 1, Redundant

      Just saying the anti-Apple fanbois spew just as much anti-Apple comments as the pro-Apple fanbois do pro-apple comments. I thought it was ironic and don't think it relevant if the underlying comment was on point or not (it was)...it was the fact he/she was cueing the pro-Apple mob when he already formed an anti-Apple mob (figuratively because torches and pitchfork combo sets don't go on sale until after Thanksgiving...unless you opt for the iTorch and the iPitchfork which will allow the user to prod and protest much more condescendingly).

    8. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by kodekn · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I agree with you completely. I used to be a mac user for over 15 years, but in the end I just couldn't bring myself to give anymore of my money to Apple or for Jobs for the arrogance and the overall assholeness. It was very liberating to finally to move first to Ubuntu and then to Windows 7 (I use software that's only Windows and Mac) and find that Windows 7 is a great OS. OS X feels in someways suffocating, and perhaps partly it's because of the strict guidelines of the GUI, but probably much more because of the attitude of Apple and of its rabid fanbase.

      Using Apple's products is like being in jail all the time, where other inmates are constantly telling with bright eyes how lucky they are to be there. Granted, I still think OS X is in some ways better (e.g. multitasking), but after few years of using Windows 7 I don't miss OS X at all. And I haven't been interested to buy any other Apple's products either. Of course Apple is now with iphones and ipads much bigger, and its userbase is much much larger than only with macs, and probably overall the userbase is not that brand faithful anymore. Apple itself is just getting worse.

    9. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      Just saying the anti-Apple fanbois spew just as much anti-Apple comments as the pro-Apple fanbois do pro-apple comments. I thought it was ironic and don't think it relevant if the underlying comment was on point or not (it was)...it was the fact he/she was cueing the pro-Apple mob when he already formed an anti-Apple mob (figuratively because torches and pitchfork combo sets don't go on sale until after Thanksgiving...unless you opt for the iTorch and the iPitchfork which will allow the user to prod and protest much more condescendingly).

      With the crucial difference being that when we who are anti-Apple post how much Apple sucks and how they should die, (as a company,) we're RIGHT. The Apple fan is the man whose brains are so soft that they can ignore reality, and buy into the idea that Apple invented all the gadgets they stole from their betters, then polished. By the way, the iTorch costs 300 times what a real torch costs, and although it's made of a burnished aluminum-magnesium alloy, and has a perfectly smooth surface and the holes in the tip are so small that they're not visible to the naked eye, yet a flame flickers out of it looking almost as if the metal itself is on fire, which it isn't, and although it can be be controlled via an iPhone app, allowing the user to vary the size of the flame, color, rate of flicker, temperature, etc. it's still just a torch. Give me an old stick of wood with a piece of oil-soaked cloth wrapped around the head any day. The iPitchfork, I'll admit is a cool take on the pitch fork, and at $109.95 + 64.95 for Apple Care for iFarming iMplements, it's not that badly overpriced.

    10. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by boundary · · Score: 3, Funny

      I'll take Nazis over poor use of apostrophes any day.

    11. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by LordLimecat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As one who tends to be anti-apple-- though I wont deny some of their stuff is impressive-- Ill say most of my sentiment comes from the wild fanboyism. Im happy to have apple as a competitor, and producing the stuff they do. It gets me riled up when people come out of the woodworks making absurd endorsements of Apple products as if they are technically superior in all ways and a better value to boot.

      If everyone was a bit more realistic and honest about their products, a lot of my issues with Apple would disappear.

    12. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by LordLimecat · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Some companies do show loyalty-- for instance, off the top of my head, I can mention that Logitech, AMD, and Antec have been awesome to me whenever I have called them about broken or missing parts. Each of them has sent me no-postage, no hassle, no cost replacements for parts that went broken or missing. In AMD's case, they replaced an OC'd processor with non-stock mods and a cracked die-- with no questions. With Logitech, they replaced 2 G9 mouses-- one had had its cord eaten by a rabbit, the other stopped clicking. The rabbit-eaten one was upgraded to a G9x, again without cost.

      So I will disagree with you regarding loyalty. They had financial incentive to be loyal-- as now I highly recommend those products from a customer service standpoint-- but they treated me well which is why I treat them well.

    13. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by jo_ham · · Score: 2

      Just saying the anti-Apple fanbois spew just as much anti-Apple comments as the pro-Apple fanbois do pro-apple comments. I thought it was ironic and don't think it relevant if the underlying comment was on point or not (it was)...it was the fact he/she was cueing the pro-Apple mob when he already formed an anti-Apple mob (figuratively because torches and pitchfork combo sets don't go on sale until after Thanksgiving...unless you opt for the iTorch and the iPitchfork which will allow the user to prod and protest much more condescendingly).

      With the crucial difference being that when we who are anti-Apple post how much Apple sucks and how they should die, (as a company,) we're RIGHT.

      You missed off "in our opinion" from that sentence. Quite a crucial difference. You also forgot to log in. Hard to be "RIGHT", in capitals, if you can't even stand behind your arguments with something as trivial as a slashdot account.

      For the record: Apple in the wrong here. Should have simply done what the judge ordered without any messing around, even with all the publicity surrounding this.

    14. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      If true, you need to get some professional help.

    15. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by the_B0fh · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Isn't your problem with the idiot fanbois rather than with Apple then? Since Apple doesn't pay the idiot fanbois, I'm not sure how you managed to blame Apple for the idiot fanbois behavior...?

    16. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by sustik · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The only reason people buy Apple now is familiarity, and fashion... and the fashion statement has grown stale since you can buy them in Walmart now.

      Apple Inc. products are as fashionable as a Honda Accord or a Toyota Camry (the comparison stops there, these cars are fairly priced and of excellent quality). These are products for the masses. Apple marketing is outstanding in convincing their users that they are trendy and cool. The fact that only these users think so, while others just are shaking their heads in bewilderment does not deminish the accomplishment on the part of Apple's marketing machine.

      Apple products are primarily for those whose understanding of technology is cursory, but who want to pretend they are on the edge. Their actual functional needs of the users are average (few exceptions apply), but they pay a hefty premium for the brand and "belonging".

    17. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      On a more serious note, I agree with the judge. This kind of change could have been implemented in less than one day

      Bullshit.

      Their web design team is forced to use iPads.

      That it suck a lie. Their wouldn't be Amy difference in time coating a new home pave on a iPod.

      Sent from my iPad

    18. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      In our opinion, Hitler was wrong to kill six million Jews.

    19. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by LordLimecat · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The problem is that the sentiment spreads so now when people ask me about new computers, they inevitably mention that theyre thinking about going apple-- and as they are not really up to speed on specs, I can only assume its because some apple enthusaist has told them how it will solve all of their problems and balance their budget to boot. I have to stop myself from getting into an argument when a friend who otherwise knows nothing about computers gushes about how much better apples are.

      My problem is the culture that the apple products represent, I suppose. If someone tells me they have a linux / unix background and have grown tired of mucking around with breakage every 6 months so they went apple, wonderful. When someone tells me how they had 8 zillion viruses before and theyre so happy that they now have a machine that is inherently immune to viruses, i start to loathe apple because of the mistruths its culture and advertising have sold to the public.

    20. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Because Apple is often the one who fabricates the initial lies, instigates the conflicts and perpetuates all of the misinformation spread by their fanbois.

    21. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Kupfernigk · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Time for you to go back to college and do a course in quality management. You can buy very expensive cars that are badly made and of poor quality - Lamborghinis that catch fire, for instance. The Honda Accord is built with excellent consistency to meet its advertised specification. That is quality

      Going very fast and using expensive materials is not excellent quality. The definition of an engineer is someone who can do, over and over again, for 10c, what anybody can do once for a dollar.

      --
      From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
    22. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by bloodhawk · · Score: 1

      unlikely, Apple were claiming 14 days to complete the change, not weeks.

    23. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      So, let me start by saying that this move was stupid and unprofessional on Apple's part. They're being some sore losers.

      Apple's ENTIRE business structure revolves around continual invocation of "The dick move". (We are apple. You want our shiny products! But---- If you want the shiny products, you have to do everything we say! If you dont, we'll break your, or rather, OUR, shiny product to stop your defiance.)

      As far as I can see, their business structure revolves around products that are engineered to meet actual consumer needs rather than the "sticker and spec fetish" that most manufacturers obsess over. Their stuff is rarely the best in any given category, but they're usually in the top 10% of their market when you consider the overall product.

      You're claiming they deliberately "break" stuff. So what's been broken? Are you referring to newer software not running on older hardware? I don't get that, the old OS still runs fine, all the stuff you bought runs fine. You get four or five years of upgrades for that device and then it will continue to function until the hardware dies. And Apple hardware continues to beat the industry in terms of useful life.

      I just dont like Apple, because Apple conducts itself like a total douche.

      From my perspective, in the hundreds of cases where I've dealt with Apple employees in developer conferences, discussing bugs, talking to them at Apple stores, customer support on the phone, they've always been entirely courteous and professional. If their lawyers are assholes to their competitors, I don't see why I should give a fuck, that's what lawyers are paid to do. The worst I can think of is that some developers have been burned when Apple incorporated functionality they provided into the OS, even their accounts of it, though, were that it was just business.

    24. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      Apple doesn't pay all of the fanbois but it most certainly does pay a large number of them as part of it's marketing team as well as other Apple employees and share holders.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    25. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Fr33z0r · · Score: 3, Insightful

      ITT: Someone who calls up the manufacturer and asks them to replace products which have been damaged by rabbits.

    26. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by ozmanjusri · · Score: 1

      I understand iSurgery is very good, though overpriced. You should consider it.

      --
      "I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
    27. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by WGFCrafty · · Score: 2

      Quality is the Tao.

    28. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Rufus+Firefly · · Score: 1

      I wish I had mod points. As it is, I wish I knew who you are, because you owe me a new keyboard.

    29. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      We're not actually sure if it was the rabbit or the dog, but the cord was certainly thoroughly destroyed.

    30. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Pity the judge didn't take Apple at its word and order the website be taken down until compliant. That would have got some VERY quick action.

    31. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by the_B0fh · · Score: 3, Funny

      Apple pays its employees now?! Damn, I thought they just worked for the privilege of breathing in the air that Steve Jobs breathed out.

    32. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by Eunuchswear · · Score: 1

      I wish I had mod points. As it is, I wish I knew who you are, because you owe me a new keyboard.

      See, you should be posting from an iPad.

      --
      Watch this Heartland Institute video
    33. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by jo_ham · · Score: 1

      if you can't even stand behind your arguments with something as trivial as a slashdot account.

      A slashdot account isn't an argument, and it's not a citation. The parent isn't making any claims based on his own expertise or reputation, so his identity is completely irrelevant. Unless you're just trying to make more personal attacks, which around here is more than likely the case.

      No, an account isn't an argument, but his posting history can be relevant to the conversation (goodness knows it is very important to anti apple haters).

      Anonymously posted arguments are therefore worthless.

      If my posting history is so important in determining my validity as a poster then what's good for the goose is good for the gander, unless hypocrisy is a virtue to the apple hater.

      Also highly amusing to be accused of wanting to make personal attacks from an AC. How brave of you!

    34. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by petsounds · · Score: 1

      It's not about good or bad engineers. In the case of Honda, their consistent quality is an outgrowth of their old school Japanese company culture. Employees protect the honour of their company-family, and do so by having very high standards for the products they ship.

      Unfortunately other Japanese companies have taken on American corporate culture and just about ruined themselves. Remember when Sony was king of electronics in the 80's? Sony's rep for high quality has been wasted away by a western, profit-driven culture.

    35. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by mjwx · · Score: 1

      Apple Inc. products are as fashionable as a Honda Accord or a Toyota Camry (the comparison stops there, these cars are fairly priced and of excellent quality).

      Yep, I'd compare them to the Kia Rio, which is generally of poor quality and overpriced for what it is.

      But the Iphone has become the Camry of phones. They are not fashionable, cant go fast, handle like crap and everyone on the dole can afford one. The biggest difference is that the Camry comes in more colours.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    36. Re:Standby in Three... Two... One.... by bingoUV · · Score: 1

      It bothers me greatly that such a large number of people are so beholden to Apple, that they would attempt to justify any action it takes, regardless of how horrendous it is, rather than make the personal admission that perhaps their devotion wasnt justified.

      I guess it is the way we have evolved. At times our tribes would be "wrong", but it won't do to admit it. Such discussions would cause lynching, or at least an ouster from one's own tribes. So we have developed ways to justify our "tribe"'s behaviour.

      --
      Bingo Dictionary - Pragmatist, n. A myopic idealist.
  2. The UK judge by santax · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Should force Apple to remove it's homepage with one the Judge himself sees fit. I imagine scaled fonts up to size 340 that tell everyone: HI WE ARE BASTARDS AND LIED AND LOST ABOUT IT IN COURT. SAMSUNG PRODUCTS ACTUALLY ARE MORE VALUE FOR THE MONEY. Something like that. Just to make an example that you don't fuck with a court-ruling. Because what Apple did and still is doing (scrolling to see the court-ruling) is pissing on our all. Our laws, fairness, and rights. Apple is pissing on them and no-one in their right mind should accept that. Especially not a judge. Now fanbois, go ahead. Mod me down, but you know it won't make the truth go away.

    1. Re:The UK judge by cheesybagel · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I would just order the Apple UK domain name to be redirected to a government server webpage explicitly stating what I wanted to say with a link at the bottom to the actual Apple server.

    2. Re:The UK judge by santax · · Score: 1

      That probably would be perfect indeed.

    3. Re:The UK judge by GumphMaster · · Score: 5, Funny

      That probably would be perfect indeed.

      ... but only if the link to Apple at the bottom of the page had accompanying ECMAScript to ensure it started off life just outside the user's visible page area.

      --
      Patent litigation: A doctrine of Mutually Assured Destruction... in which everyone seems willing to push the button
  3. Apple and their lawyers were lucky by speardane · · Score: 5, Insightful

    not too be in more serious trouble for contempt of court

    --
    if "Faith" could be proved with facts - would it still be faith? So why does "Faith" try to present beliefs as fact? -
    1. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Nidi62 · · Score: 5, Informative

      They arguably did the job the first time as I don't believe there was anything that said they couldn't mention the other stuff.

      When a judge tells you to do something, you do it. No more, no less. Apple and their lawyers were trying to be cute, and in the end still got off a lot easier than they deserved. Turn off the reality distortion field and get some fresh air.

      --
      The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
    2. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by TWX · · Score: 5, Funny

      I have an idea. How about the court holds the lawyers and the titular head of Apple Computer in the United Kingdom in jail on contempt charges until the apology is properly worded and displayed? Call it, "Third Time's The Charm"...

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
    3. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by thebjorn · · Score: 5, Informative

      According to the judge, what they added was false, misleading, and did not convey the intent of the order -- and he analyzes each added statement in depth. In addition they used too much time to comply when it came to newspapers, where the judge expected "earliest possible time" to mean the next couple of days and not a month. As a punishment they now have to pay _all_ of Samsung's legal expenses (i.e. not only legal fees), they have to keep the notice up for much longer, and they have to put on their home page that they lied in their previous attempt. You don't have to agree with a judge's order, but you do have to follow it. Judges tend to get pissed off if you try to worm yourself around an order -- not something that should be news for Apple's capable legal team.

    4. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      Oh nonsense. The intent of the ruling is clear, and continually defying a judge will lead to ever greater sanctions.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    5. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by jkrise · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I think the judge has not yet said the final word. This sanction is only for the delayed newspaper ads and the non-compliant website ad. When they find the message in the UK homepage is specially designed to make the message invisible except after scrolling; the judge might impose more sanctions and maybe even fines. The subsequent javascript edit does not hide the fact that the UK page is differently designed compared to other pages.Apple's mischief has not stopped, yet...

      --
      If you keep throwing chairs, one day you'll break windows....
    6. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      Most people have enough sense not to defy, directly or via playing games, the direct order of a judge. Judges in most jurisdictions, and most certainly in the British and American tradition, are afforded wide powers to force compliance. The Court must be obeyed, otherwise it loses all credibility.

      I can only assume Apple overruled or ignored rather lawyers, who most certainly would tell them that playing this kind of game was only going to lead to more severe sanctions.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    7. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by yacc143 · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Well, lying as such is not covered by the 1st Amendment. Especially if done in the course of commercial activities.

    8. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by MightyMartian · · Score: 5, Informative

      I would wager you are very wrong. Mos certainly US courts have ordered similar sanctions and most certainly defying the court order would lead to increasing sanctions. When you lose a case, civil or criminal, you lose a good many protections as they pertain to the case. That is the underlying notion of due process.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    9. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by bhagwad · · Score: 2

      You can easily find yourself in contempt of court if you try to be funny. If Samsung paid Apple in coins, they would be in contempt of court regardless of the fact that they paid up. You don't go fooling around with a court order trying to "one up" the court.

    10. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      He's responding to this person: http://apple.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3244107&cid=41942733

      Please pay attention.

    11. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Karzz1 · · Score: 4, Informative

      I won't go into a long discussion on this, but in criminal cases you are correct but incorrect in civil cases. A judge cannot issue an order preventing you from stating that another court somewhere else disagrees with that court.

      I am fairly certain you are wrong in this context. If you read the judgement, the other cases either did not pertain to the same thing Apple suggested or the case had been reversed/dropped. Blatantly misrepresenting the order would certainly fall under contempt in a U.S. court, along with most courts.

      --
      Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master.
    12. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      That "legal team" works for a living there, and they'll meet that particular judge, not to mention his friends pretty damned often, I stronlgy doubt any lawyer would intentionally antagonize a judge if they planned to have a long career.

      No, I'd say, since they're behaving like this all over the world, it's Apples management to blame.

      Thinking about it, it's a poor idea for Apple too, since it seems they like to visit courtrooms all too often.

    13. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Because the intent is clearly to undermine that latest ruling. It's almost like being contemptuous, if you will, of the court. Maybe there ought to be rules against that...

      --
      systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
    14. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by cheesybagel · · Score: 2

      Apple is pulling the same kinds of bullshit Microsoft pulled before the anti-trust trial. In the age of too big to fail and when the US President points to Apple as an example of a a successful company during the elections they are so full of hot air they are probably floating higher in their gas balloon than the Red Bull Stratos guy did.

    15. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by ooshna · · Score: 2

      To play Devil's Advocate wasn't Samsung barred from showing phone designs they made that predated the iPhone? How can you be prohibited from mentioning those designs?

    16. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by FromWithin · · Score: 5, Informative

      Did you even read the on this, Mr. Ignorance?

      Apple lied. I shall quote the ruling here:

      21. I turn to the last paragraph. I do not think the order as made precluded any addition to the required notice if that addition had been true and did not undermine the effect of the required notice. But I do consider that adding false and misleading material was illegitimate. For by adding such material the context of the required notice is altered so that it will be understood differently.

      22. Here what Apple added was false and misleading. I turn to analyse it. The first sentence reads:

      However, in a case tried in Germany regarding the same patent, the court found that Samsung engaged in unfair competition by copying the iPad design.

      That is false in the following ways:

      (a) "Regarding the same patent." No patent of any kind has been involved in Germany or here, still less "the same patent."

      (b) As regards the Community Registered Design, the German Courts held that neither the Galaxy 10.1 nor the 8.9 infringed it. As to the 7.7 there was for a short while a German provisional order holding that it infringed. Whether there was a jurisdiction to make that order is very doubtful for the reasons given in my earlier judgment but in any event the order had been (or should have been) discharged by the time the Contested Notice was published.

      (c) There is a finding and injunction, limited to Germany alone, that the 10.1 and 8.9 infringe German unfair competition law. But the statement is likely to be read as of more general application.

      23. The second sentence reads:

      A U.S. jury also found Samsung guilty of infringing on Apple's design and utility patents, awarding over one billion U.S. dollars in damages to Apple Inc.

      That is misleading by omission. For the US jury specifically rejected Apple's claim that the US design patent corresponding to the Community Design in issue here was infringed. The average reader would think that the UK decision was at odds with that in the US. Far from that being so, it was in accordance with it.

      24. The third sentence reads:

      So while the U.K. court did not find Samsung guilty of infringement, other courts have recognized that in the course of creating its Galaxy tablet, Samsung wilfully copied Apple's far more popular iPad.

      This is calculated to produce huge confusion. The false innuendo is that the UK court came to a different conclusion about copying, which is not true for the UK court did not form any view about copying. There is a further false innuendo that the UK court's decision is at odds with decisions in other countries whereas that is simply not true.

      25. The reality is that wherever Apple has sued on this registered design or its counterpart, it has ultimately failed. It may or may not have other intellectual property rights which are infringed. Indeed the same may be true the other way round for in some countries Samsung are suing Apple. But none of that has got anything to do with the registered design asserted by Apple in Europe. Apple's additions to the ordered notice clearly muddied the water and the message obviously intended to be conveyed by it.

    17. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      There is no way in the US that a judge could gag you from mentioning *other* court cases or for that matter prevent you from stating your own opinion contrary to the judge's.

      I've got a good idea, why don't you get involved in a court case and try just that. While you're at it, dance a little jig in the courtroom. Let us know how that works out for you.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    18. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Tough+Love · · Score: 1, Interesting

      I can only assume Apple overruled or ignored rather lawyers, who most certainly would tell them that playing this kind of game was only going to lead to more severe sanctions.

      I sense the limp wrist of Tim Cook pulling these strings. By the way, Apple has lost $150 billion of market value in the eight weeks since the iPhone 5 introduction.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    19. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by bws111 · · Score: 2

      Read the ruling. The judges (there are more than one) specifically say they can not and are not barring Apple from saying whatever they want, even the outright lies, as that would be prior restraint. What they ARE requiring is that they have a page which contains ONLY the required text and nothing else.

      And quit calling this 'an apology'. It is not an apology in any sense of the word. Apple is being required to state a simple uncontestable fact, and nothing else. The text of the wording they are supposed to use is:

      On 9th July 2012 the High Court of Justice of England and Wales ruled that [Samsung's] Galaxy Tablet Computers, namely the Galaxy Tab 10.1, Tab 8.9 and Tab 7.7 do not infringe Apple's Community registered design No. 0000181607-0001. A copy of the full judgment of the High Court is available from [link]

              That Judgment has effect throughout the European Union and was upheld by the Court of Appeal of England and Wales on 18th October 2012. A copy of the Court of Appeal's judgment is available from [link]. There is no injunction in respect of the Community Registered Design in force anywhere in Europe.

    20. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Shimbo · · Score: 1

      There is no way in the US that a judge could gag you from mentioning *other* court cases or for that matter prevent you from stating your own opinion contrary to the judge's.

      The court explicitly said in its order Apple was free to say what it liked elsewhere.

      'Nothing in this Order shall prevent the Appellant from publishing any comment or information regarding the dispute between the parties in respect of the Samsung Galaxy Tablet computers in issue in this appeal.'

      However, when the court ordered Apple to publish a notice to clear up any misunderstanding, Apple wasn't free to add its own words to the body of the notice, especially when they were themselves misleading, and in some cases untrue.

      "I do not consider it was open to Apple to add matter in the middle of the notice we ordered to be published"

      "Even if that were not so, it cannot be legitimate to break up the ordered notice with false material."

    21. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by jo_ham · · Score: 1

      I think the judge has not yet said the final word. This sanction is only for the delayed newspaper ads and the non-compliant website ad. When they find the message in the UK homepage is specially designed to make the message invisible except after scrolling; the judge might impose more sanctions and maybe even fines. The subsequent javascript edit does not hide the fact that the UK page is differently designed compared to other pages.Apple's mischief has not stopped, yet...

      It doesn't do that any more. Apple took out the JS code that makes that happen. Now it's just underneath their other homepage material, but you have to scroll to see it if your monitor is too small. If you have a giant monitor and plenty of space it is visible without scrolling. I guess someone gave them a kick up the ass and told them to just stop messing around with it and just get it over and done with.

    22. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by nosferatu1001 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The cases did NOT contradict the UK court case, if you had actually read the judgement

      In fact the comments were factually incorrect, and technically therefore a lie.

      Apple showed contempt for the court, and are still showing contempt.

    23. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by bytesex · · Score: 1

      I'm sure that Apple still aren't swayed by the power of this particular judge - after all, all he can do is increase the fine by something that still will not be significant compared to Apple's bottom-line, but all the eyes of the world are now moving in Apple's direction. And what Apple first thought was a great joke, turns out to be more like a joke that silences the party.

      --
      Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
    24. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by nosferatu1001 · · Score: 1

      The judges didnt feel that they needed to tell Apple to NOT make up facts and add them to the stipulated text.

      Most people would consider that part of the idea hat you do not show contempt for the courts ruling.

    25. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by fast+turtle · · Score: 1

      I'm still hoping that the Judge will issue a temporary ban of 6 months on all Apple products in the U.K. for their contempt of court. That may be the only thing getting the message through to Apple that You Don't Fuck with the Judges. Of course it would be far better if Judge Dread Charged and Fined them

      --
      Mod me up/Mod me down: I wont frown as I've no crown
    26. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by flimflammer · · Score: 2

      The issue isn't whether they added extra information. The issue is they lied to everyone with that extra information.

    27. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by pnot · · Score: 5, Funny

      Seriously, if I were the judge I'd just up the stakes at this point. Something along the lines of

      "You have proven yourselves incapable of modifying the front page of your website in compliance with the court order. To avoid any further misunderstandings or evasions, we are providing this 800x1200px PNG containing the exact text we wish you to display. Your site shall serve this up as the only content of the front page for the next week, or we'll begin seizing assets.

      ... oh, and it's in Comic Sans."

    28. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by jo_ham · · Score: 1

      you have to scroll to see it if your monitor is too small.

      I've got a 23" monitor running at 1920 × 1080 resolution. I still have to scroll. Roughly are running at resolutions of the same height or less.

      This is just douchiness and intentionally trying to hide it by saying "well we just naturally had a bigass add, it wasn't being re-sized anymore!"

      But they do - the homepage has always been a huge advert, unless it's something for a special event (like the anniversary of Jobs' death, or a major product launch).

      Your second sentence makes no sense.

      You also forgot to log in.

      Maybe fix those issues, then we can debate.

    29. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by elashish14 · · Score: 1

      The judges (there are more than one) specifically say they can not and are not barring Apple from saying whatever they want, even the outright lies, as that would be prior restraint. What they ARE requiring is that they have a page which contains ONLY the required text and nothing else.

      Oh come on. Stop reading the ruling so literally. The judges can't possible state everything they want and don't want Apple to say short of writing the text for them (which completely defeats the purpose).

      I sent my kids to their room last weekend, so to get revenge they drew on the wall with permanent marker, threw all the furniture out the window and burned an effigy. But I guess I didn't explicitly state that they shouldn't do that, so it was perfectly okay. Right?

      --
      I have left slashdot and am now on Soylent News. FUCK YOU DICE.
    30. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Dwonis · · Score: 1

      The ad wasn't just big, it changed sizes as you resized the window, while the same ad on the US site did not.

    31. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Eunuchswear · · Score: 1

      That's a small monitor, sorry.

      --
      Watch this Heartland Institute video
    32. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by jo_ham · · Score: 1

      The ad wasn't just big, it changed sizes as you resized the window, while the same ad on the US site did not.

      Like I said initially, it does not do that any more, but then suddenly the argument switched to "oh, well you still have to scroll on 90% of people's monitors". You know, whatever argument works to make Apple the bad guy, if other arguments are dismissed.

    33. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by bws111 · · Score: 1

      I don't know what exactly you are trying to say. First of all, when a judge orders you to put some text on a web page and in print, and he gives you the text, that is meant to be taken quite literally. He wants that text, and only that text and not your marketing fluff, to be put on a web page and in print. Apple is free to put whatever nonsense that want on any other pages or in any other print ads, but they can not put it on the ordered page.

      I also haven't a clue what you mean by the court writing the text defeats the purpose. The purpose is NOT (as many seem to think) to force Apple to issue an apology, show contrition or remorse, or admit wrongdoing or lying. The purpose is to inform the public, at Apple's expense, that there is no legal threat vis a vis Apple's designs hanging over Samsung products. The public can feel safe in buying those products.

      And I really don't understand your little rant at the bottom. Nowhere did I defend what Apple did or imply that it was in any way OK.

    34. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by Patch86 · · Score: 2

      Technically you're getting into territory of legal tender, rather than contempt of court. In the UK, £ coins are legal tender up to any amount, and therefore a valid way of paying a court-ordered debt. Coins under £1 are only legal tender up to a certain low amount, so you can legitimately refuse a court-ordered debt that is offered to be paid in 50p coins.

    35. Re:Apple and their lawyers were lucky by elashish14 · · Score: 1

      Yes, my post wasn't very clear. I thought you were defending Apple's first post with the statements about the other rulings because the judge didn't explicitly state not to include stuff like that. Sorry, I guess I misread your post....

      --
      I have left slashdot and am now on Soylent News. FUCK YOU DICE.
  4. busy with mini by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    To be fair to apple, they couldn't make changes to their website for 14 days because they were busy making changes to show their new mini, and make people think the slow, relatively expensive, poor display device which is easily scratched, was a good deal. They had more pressing problems.

  5. Re:Enlighten me by jsepeta · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Apple doesn't think they're in the wrong. other courts judged in their favor.

    --
    Remember kids, if you're not paying for the service, YOU ARE THE PRODUCT THAT IS BEING SOLD.
  6. Too big to fail, or too arrogant to notice. by hessian · · Score: 3, Insightful

    When companies get big, they become a type of clique. Since so many people have to be on-board for any one thing to get done, the company controls them with a kind of dogma or culture.

    This reinforces an us-them mentality even where it doesn't need to exist.

    As a result, the companies get arrogant not so much from their CEOs, but from the rank and file. That then spreads upward. They have become victims of their own propaganda.

    This is why these "too big to fail" companies tend to blow out on obvious issues like this. Did they really just defy a sitting court? How stupid do you have to be to do that?

    Their lawyers must be apoplectic. Or just carefully filling out their bills.

    1. Re:Too big to fail, or too arrogant to notice. by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 1

      I don't think clique is the word. It looks more like tribalism these days.

    2. Re:Too big to fail, or too arrogant to notice. by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      It's more like a crack house.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  7. Re:Enlighten me by mamas · · Score: 2, Informative

    In a nutshell, Apple lied.

    But instead of forcing someone else to write it down for you, which you'll have to read anyway, why not go read beyond the headlines?
    Here, I'll spare the googling trouble for you this time:

    http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20121109130213229

  8. Re:er... what now? by neokushan · · Score: 4, Informative

    You didn't read the whole article, did you? Apple's response was "lackadaisical" because they were ordered to put the notice in each newspaper as early as possible, but they dragged their heels for weeks before doing it.

    --
    +1 IDisagreeSoHeMustBeATrollOrAnAstroturferOrAShill
  9. Re:Enlighten me by wierd_w · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It essentially boils down to Apple trying to "superficially" comply, while actually completely disregarding the purpose behind the order.

    For an example, there was recently a sting operation set up to catch a major traffic offender, who routinely drove on the sidewalk to evade stopped traffic from a routine school bus stop that made the news this last week.

    As part of her punishment, she has to wear a sign declaring that she is an idiot, and that only an idiot would try to pass a school bus while driving a car, by driving on the sidewalk.

    The intent behind the order is very clear, and directly tied to the heart of the infraction it was proscribed for.

    If the woman had followed after Apple's example, she would have worn the sign alright, but it would have given counter examples as to why driving on the sidewalk like that was perfectly justifiable, and made allusions that the judge that made her wear the sign was mistaken in his judgement, and that 2 other judges in similar cases (which were improperly conducted for different reasons, or later invalidated in their rulings) concurred with her point of view.

  10. Re:Enlighten me by dave562 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The heart of the issue is that the judge told Apple to "clarify" any misconceptions that Samsung had violated the specific patent in question. The judge was concerned that consumers would be confused about whether or not buying a non-Apple device would lead to problems down the road.

    What Apple did is glossed over the apology, and then went on to mention all of their other litigation against Samsung in other country and touted the positive (for Apple) verdicts in those countries. It was basically a marketing piece that said in short, "The judge is wrong, Samsung really is stealing our ideas, look at all of these other countries who think so."

    The judge called them out on their BS and told them to comply with the court order to "clarify" the misconceptions. Apple spouted some BS about how it was going to take 14 days to change the message. The judge told them that was a load of crap. Apple then changed the message, but made it much less prominent than the first one they posted. Again, the judge called them out on it.

    In short, Apple's legal team is the same as legal teams all over the place. They are a bunch of assholes who think they are smarter than everyone else and will do whatever they think they can get away with.

    I dislike lawyers intensely. I really do. I never realized how bad they are until I worked with them. We provide services to them. We are on their side. They still treat us like crap, like we are the adversary. They are constantly trying to trip us up over the slightest things. It's like their brains are hard wired to press any perceived advantage and exploit even the slightest gap. They want systems with five nines up time, yet they are the cheapest, tightest, penny pinching bastards on the planet. I really think they demand the insane SLA so that they have something to dispute with the intention of extracting concessions on the monthly fees. It is to the point where I will not get on the call with a client unless a member of our legal team is on the call. When I do get on the call, I give short, brief and extremely limited answers. I do not explain in detail. I do not think outside the box. I take everything literally. It sucks because I have to become a different person when I deal with them. I cannot even offer constructive solutions because then it turns into a game of, "Why are you only thinking about this now? Why did you not predict this need of ours a year ago? That sounds negligent to me."

  11. Re:Enlighten me by TWX · · Score: 1

    Other courts have rule in their favor, but their jury trial ruling in the US is itself in jeopardy based on undisclosed prior legal action on the part of a member of that jury against the defendant in that case, so Apple might find that verdict tossed with either a new trial ordered or else with a new ruling from the judge. This UK finding with the website order could well complicate that American suit.

    --
    Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
  12. Re:Enlighten me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

    OK, no doubt this will be modded to oblivion as a pedantic post by an AC. So be it.
    You use the word "proscribed". I do not think you actually meant that. I suspect that you meant "prescribed".

    To save you all the google time, here is an explanation:
    http://www.grammar-monster.com/easily_confused/prescribe_proscribe.htm

    The meanings are different. Really. Almost opposites.

    Yes, I know language changes, and so forth. This, however, is an example of the way meanings can be completely missed.
    It's called "malapropism".

    Another example would be "uninterested" versus "disinterested" - but I've pretty much given up on that one.

    Actual impoverishment of the language is not the same as shifting meaning.

  13. This behavior is in Apple's DNA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Apple has always treated the world, including its own customers, from a superiority position. Apple is all knowing. Apple doesn't follow standards or rules. Apple always knows best and can do no wrong.

    So why did anyone expect for Apple to behave differently this time? Arogance is a core value of their corporate culture and its only got stronger since their cash flow surged.

    I will be enormously happy when this tumor of a company will die off.

  14. Re:Enlighten me by Local+ID10T · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I admit I am ignorant in this case beyond the headlines. Did the judge order the exact wording of the apology? Did the judge order the exact location on a web site that the apology must appear? Did the judge order the exact page of newspapers the apology must appear? Also, we're the quotes attributed to the judge not accurate?

    The thing with judges is that they believe in their own authority. And they don't like it when someone fucks with them. (**Suddenly a mis-quote from "Pulp Fiction" is running through my head...**)

    When a judge tells you to do something, they are telling you to follow their intent not to find an alternative interpretation of their words. If you interpret their directives in a way other than what they intended for you to do, they can punish you for it.

    Sure, you can appeal that punishment, but then it goes to another judge (or judges) to decide if you were being treated unfairly -and all judges believe that their authority as a judge is sacrosanct: anything that challenges the authority of a judge is a potential challenge to the authority of all judges. Even when a judge disagrees with the decision handed down by another judge, they dislike being forced to admit that any judge may have been wrong as it creates an implied challenge to their own authority.

    --
    "You want to know how to help your kids? Leave them the fuck alone." -George Carlin
  15. Re:er... what now? by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Oh crap.. this decision is cutting edge and it was brilliant. This ought to be a new template. The standard in the corporate world these days is to NEVER admit they are wrong and act as arrogant as possible. This is one of the few ways this can that can actually make it on the public record that the corporations actually broke the law and that consumers ought to know about it.

  16. Nice work, Soulskill by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I didn't write my submission nearly so elegantly, nor with proper inline links. Now that is what I call editing.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    1. Re:Nice work, Soulskill by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Wondered why we had this old garbage was being posted again rather than something technical that may actually have been of interest.

      False dichotomy. The slashdot front page can take more than one submission per day. HTH, HAND.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    2. Re:Nice work, Soulskill by ais523 · · Score: 2

      Slashdot's community has a habit of picking on the editors whenever they do a sloppy job. It's nice to see them complemented when they do it properly.

      --
      (1)DOCOMEFROM!2~.2'~#1WHILE:1<-"'?.1$.2'~'"':1/.1$.2'~#0"$#65535'"$"'"'&.1$.2'~'#0$#65535'"$#0'~#32767$#1"
    3. Re:Nice work, Soulskill by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Slashdot's community has a habit of picking on the editors whenever they do a sloppy job. It's nice to see them complemented when they do it properly.

      I, for one, have frequently picked on the editors, and I feel it is only fair that I applaud them when they do an excellent job. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to come up as often as the converse ;)

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  17. Re:Enlighten me by drinkypoo · · Score: 5, Informative

    There was absolutely nothing false

    As per TFA

    22. Here what Apple added was false and misleading. I turn to analyse it. The first sentence reads:

            However, in a case tried in Germany regarding the same patent, the court found that Samsung engaged in unfair competition by copying the iPad design.

    That is false in the following ways:

    (a) "Regarding the same patent." No patent of any kind has been involved in Germany or here, still less "the same patent."

    (b) As regards the Community Registered Design, the German Courts held that neither the Galaxy 10.1 nor the 8.9 infringed it. As to the 7.7 there was for a short while a German provisional order holding that it infringed. Whether there was a jurisdiction to make that order is very doubtful for the reasons given in my earlier judgment but in any event the order had been (or should have been) discharged by the time the Contested Notice was published.

    (c) There is a finding and injunction, limited to Germany alone, that the 10.1 and 8.9 infringe German unfair competition law. But the statement is likely to be read as of more general application.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  18. Re:er... what now? by yacc143 · · Score: 1

    Well, they lost that one in the UK and the US (funny detail, but then the jury has gone so fast through the verdict that they had less than 5 minutes on average for each question, and that does include the time that they should have spent reading the explanations, guess a "quality verdict"), even the US jury found that the Galaxy Tab 10.1 does not infringe on the iPad design.

  19. Definition of "Sanction" by Wook+Man · · Score: 1

    As a verb, as used in this headline, "sanction" means approve of. So the headline here doesn't match up with the contents of the post.

    The headline, if it must use the word "sanction", should be "UK court levies sanctions against Apple..."

  20. Re:Apple committing slow suicide, Tim Cook assisti by Captain+Hook · · Score: 1

    Apple is heading for a cliff. It looks like Steve Jobs didn't choose his successor wisely.

    Apple was doing this stuff under Jobs as well. It's got nothing to do with Cook.

    It's a reaction from a company who make expensive gadgets to a threat which was always going to come, namely that innovation on smartphones has reached a plateau allowing mass market device manufacturers to undercut them with functionally equivalent devices.

    --
    These comments are my personal opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of the other voices in my head.
  21. Re:Enlighten me by TFAFalcon · · Score: 1

    And she would have worn the sign under a sweater.

  22. Re:Enlighten me by ais523 · · Score: 1

    Reading the ruling (it's at the last link in the summary) is quite interesting. Basically what happened is that Apple tried to exploit technicalities in the judge's wording, and the judges found a bunch of technicalities in Apple's statement to find it invalid anyway.

    (For instance, the judges focused on the facts that the court case had nothing, technically, to do with the iPad, and that patents weren't involved, both of which contradict Apple's original statement.)

    --
    (1)DOCOMEFROM!2~.2'~#1WHILE:1<-"'?.1$.2'~'"':1/.1$.2'~#0"$#65535'"$"'"'&.1$.2'~'#0$#65535'"$#0'~#32767$#1"
  23. Re:er... what now? by ais523 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    More information on what you said: apparently the notices will be in the newspapers on November 16th. The court was a little surprised that, given that the order was made on October 18th, it took that long to get an advert into the newspapers.

    --
    (1)DOCOMEFROM!2~.2'~#1WHILE:1<-"'?.1$.2'~'"':1/.1$.2'~#0"$#65535'"$"'"'&.1$.2'~'#0$#65535'"$#0'~#32767$#1"
  24. Re:er... what now? by neokushan · · Score: 1

    It's entirely possible that different people/teams were in charge of updating the website and publishing the newspapers. Plus, newspapers generally charge more if the ad is bigger so keeping it to a minimum probably suited them better (not that Apple isn't rolling in cash or anything).

    --
    +1 IDisagreeSoHeMustBeATrollOrAnAstroturferOrAShill
  25. Not this time, dude. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    Of course it took them two weeks. Don't you know Apple's MO? They take what someone else made, then spend a while polishing it to a brilliant luster, then pretend they invented the damned thing, let their version sink in, get a few million copies to all their sycophantic, empty-headed fans, cult-members, etc., then sue someone else for "copying" them.

    It took that time much time because they first had to wade through other, better apologies than they could come up with on their own, and try to figure out how to make them look slick and futuristic. You can't do that in a day, bro. It takes weeks at least, to polish a turd like that. THAT'S WHY. Shortly, they will seek a patent on a method or technique for making other people believe, using printed words, that you are experiencing sorrow and/or regret or remorse for some action you may have taken in the past.

    From the summary:

    I hope that the lack of integrity involved in this incident is entirely atypical of Apple

    No, it's very typical. Apple has no integrity. They steal from others, polish to a high luster, sell it to morons, who stare at each new shiny turd from crApple and say to themselves in hushed tones, "oooh... sparkly!" Then, reality in Cupertino so distorted that they believe their own bullshit, they start suing other people for doing something similar, even if those people have never heard of Apple or seen their products, or even if they were first. Like when they stole the idea for the GUI and the mouse-driven interface, then tried to pretend they invented it, just because they removed a couple buttons from the mouse, then sued someone else for doing exactly what they did. So basically, they're fucking shitheaded assholes who have never had an original idea in their lives. They're the worst kind of thieves, hypocrites who get mad when someone tries to steal an idea they stole first, or worse, they get mad when someone whose idea they've stolen tries to compete with them. Jobs was an embarrassment to all those hokey eastern philosophies he claimed to have learned from when he was out finding himself while failing to fulfill his obligations to his family and his kid. What a piece of dog shit he was. The world really is better off.

    Anyway, I really hope Apple will just get banned in the UK, as a punishment. They are ignoring court orders, then playing games with them, rather than complying. Who the fuck do they think they are, Microsoft? You can't just ignore what a court tells you like that. Hey, UK... Apple is saying they don't have to obey your little Mickey Mouse laws. Are you okay with that? Are you going to take that? Apple is saying your court is just a little bitch that they don't have to listen to. Are you seriously going to let them flout your laws in this way? Only a bunch of fags would allow that...

    : ) Sorry, just really hoping the judge in this case will pull his thumb out of his ass and slam Apple like they so richly deserve. : )

  26. Re:Enlighten me by sed+quid+in+infernos · · Score: 1

    The judge laid out his reasoning about why the additions were false and misleading in the opinion. Rather than just call him wrong, and accuse him of "pretending," how about you provide some reasoning, analysis, or evidence that he was wrong. Otherwise, we're left with a bunch of facts and reasoning laid out in a logical fashion on one side, and some guy on the internet saying "Nuh uh!" on the other.

  27. Re:Enlighten me by wierd_w · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I admit the mistake. It is however, one that is hard for me to break. :(

    When I read "Prescribe", I see it as a compound of the prefix "Pre", meaning "comes before", and "Scribe", meaning "to write or mark."

    So, "prescribe" means "Written in advance". (Such as with a doctor's script. He writes down the course of your treatment in advance of your receiving it. A prescription.)

    When I see "Proscribe", I see the prefix "Pro", (antonym of "Con") meaning "In favor of / supporting". (Nevermind that 'conscribe' is not a word, or at least not a proper word.)

    So, "proscribe" means "Written in support of." (Like with an editorial, citing a proposed course of action; a proscribed action.)

    I accept that this is not conserved by actual definition of those words. It is simply a malfunction in my ability to parse language I guess.

    As the site linked to points out, this is a very common mistake, for pretty much exactly the reasoning I pointed out. I understand that English has many special exceptions, but "proscribe" is particularly cumbersome in that respect.

    I will however, endeavor to correct my usage.

  28. Re:Apple committing slow suicide, Tim Cook assisti by quibbler · · Score: 1, Interesting

    The fact that Apple is still selling apple products in UK is testament to Tim Cook's more even keel.

    How easily you forget the Steve that swore to use Apple's entire cash cache (ha!) to destroy Google. Steve's solution might well have been to pay applicable fines, pull ALL iOS products from the UK, write an open letter to the judge and let public pressure roast the responsible magistrates alive.

    Like it or not, Apple IS the big kid in the playground, and they DO make excellent products that generates enormous public demand. Steve repeatedly used that demand like heavy artillery, I don't think he'd hesitate to do so with the little island off the coast of Europe.

    The bottom line is that the UK (through consumer demand) needs Apple far more than Apple needs the UK market.

  29. How a company *should* apologise... by ryzvonusef · · Score: 3, Informative

    If you are going to apologise, apologise with dignity, damn it!

    Dear Apple, learn a lesson from Michael McCain, the CEO of the Canadian food company Maple Leaf Food.

    In 2008, there was an outbreak [1] of Listeriosis, which was linked to Maple Leaf products.

    What did Mccain do? To quote [2] from The Globe and Mail (a Canadian newspaper of record):

    First, it admitted it was the company's fault. It admitted it was responsible. It said, in essence, "it's our fault and we're going to fix it."

    Second, Maple Leaf apologized. It wasn't "wordsmithed" or spin-doctored to deny culpability. The company didn't dodge the issue. It apologized up front in every possible media.

    Third, it didn't hire a celebrity to deliver the apology, or a blonde actress with very white teeth wearing a lab coat. CEO Michael McCain was the voice and the face of the crisis, and of the apology.

    Fourth, once Maple Leaf realized the problem was the company's fault, it acted decisively, and transparently. It recalled more than 200 packaged meat brands (amounting to tens of thousands of individual packages) that were manufactured or packaged at the affected plant.

    Which brings me to one of the best quotes about using (or not using) lawyers. CEO Michael McCain said in his apology on TV and on YouTube[3]: "Going through the crisis there are two advisers I've paid no attention to. The first are the lawyers, and the second are the accountants. It's not about money or legal liability; this is about our being accountable for providing consumers with safe food. This is a terrible tragedy. To those people who have become ill, and to the families who have lost loved ones, I want to express my deepest and most sincere sympathies. Words cannot begin to express our sadness for your pain."

    (bolded by me)

    I am not saying this let's MLF off the hook, but darn it, when it came to apologising, they didn't mince their words.

    Dear Apple, just shut and apologise, and get over it already. MLF did it and got over it, so can you.

    [1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maple_Leaf_Foods#Canadian_Food_Inspection_Agency_recall
    [2]: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/small-business/sb-growth/the-best-legal-advice-is-often-an-apology/article626797/
    [3]: (original link in article wasn't working, here is an alternative) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSrazdNo55U

    --
    I am an ACCA student. Got a query on Accountancy/Finance? Maybe I can help!
    1. Re:How a company *should* apologise... by ryzvonusef · · Score: 4, Interesting
      --
      I am an ACCA student. Got a query on Accountancy/Finance? Maybe I can help!
  30. Re:Apple committing slow suicide, Tim Cook assisti by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

    Or they could just use Android phones. Temper tantrums aren't a good way to run a business.

    --
    This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
  31. Re:er... what now? by rtfa-troll · · Score: 1
    Everything you wrote becomes a complete waste of time from the point where you failed to read the article here:

    Did the court give a deadline?

    Yes; the court gave a deadlne. The court said "as early as possible," That basically means "tomorrow; but if you can show you really made a good effort and failed, maybe the day after".

    Lets say the newspapers would have charged Apple a premium rate if they did it sooner... is the judge requiring Apple do this at any expense?

    Yes; that would be obvious from the fact that he said "as early as possible" rather than "as early as reasonable". This is a judge. Every word he puts in a judgement is written to be parsed very carefully and exactly. Please go and read the fucking article.

    --
    =~ s,(.*),<sarcasm>$1</sarcasm>,g if any_point_you_wish();
  32. My wild guess by Psicopatico · · Score: 1

    If called tor a third ruling on the subject, the judges wouldn't be that kind. At all.

    --
    Mastering the English language is fucking easy: all you have to do is to put an f* word in every fucking sentence.
  33. Re:Enlighten me by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

    Apple doesn't think they're in the wrong.

    Al Capone didn't think he was in the wrong.

    --
    When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  34. Re:Enlighten me by Tough+Love · · Score: 2

    The judge called them out on their BS and told them to comply with the court order to "clarify" the misconceptions. Apple spouted some BS about how it was going to take 14 days to change the message.

    And the judge basically called out Tim Cook on it:

    "I would like to see the head of Apple make an affidavit setting out the technical difficulties which means Apple can’t put this on [its site]. I just can’t believe the instructions you’ve been given."

    Ouch.

    --
    When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  35. Re:Apple committing slow suicide, Tim Cook assisti by rl117 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You seem to be suggesting that mere consumer popularity should permit that corporations can act effectively above the law, and that they can behave as illegally as they please. There are very obvious reasons why this can not be permitted! The law is the law, and Apple were found to be a pack of liars who are continuing to bring baseless legal action against their competitors. They have been hoisted on their own petard by their legal actions here, given that all of this is self-inflicted, and they are acting like a spoiled, petulant child.

    While kind of offtopic, if Apple were to be banned from trading in the UK, I think you'd find that it would hurt Apple Inc much more than it would British citizens. There are plenty of other computer and gadget manufacturers out there who would pick up the slack. Apple just manufacture shiny, but limited, gadgets. The world does not revolve around them.

  36. Re:Enlighten me by AthanasiusKircher · · Score: 1

    In the mode of pedantry....

    When I see "Proscribe", I see the prefix "Pro", (antonym of "Con") meaning "In favor of / supporting".

    That's not the most common meaning of "pro," at least from an etymological standpoint. "Pro" as a prefix more commonly means "before" (prohibit - literally "before having," progenitor - an ancestor before the immediate family) and by extension "in front of/forward/outward" (promise - to send forth [an expectation], prospect - looking forward, produce - lead forth, pronunciation - send a message outward, propagation - fasten/extend/reproduce outward) or sometimes "in place of/on behalf of" (pronoun, pro se).

    I suspect (though I don't know for sure) that our modern "pro" as meaning "for" something is an extension of that last meaning -- "in place of/on behalf of." Someone who speaks about the "pros" is arguing on behalf of something. The meaning of "pro" as "in favor of" is a later extension of meanings, so I would say if you're thinking etymologically, you probably shouldn't start with that as the assumed meaning in an unfamiliar word.

    (Nevermind that 'conscribe' is not a word, or at least not a proper word.)

    Actually "conscribe" is a word, though these days it tends only to be an unusual variant of "conscript."

    So, "proscribe" means "Written in support of." (Like with an editorial, citing a proposed course of action; a proscribed action.)

    Well, using the more common meanings of the prefix "pro" mentioned above, "proscribe" should mean "to write outward," which is actually the meaning -- someone who was "proscribed" in the Roman republic was a person whose name was "published forth" and singled out for punishment. Hence, it came to mean the same thing for things -- to prohibit or to outlaw.

    Etymologically, "proscribe" is very much the same as "program" (the latter from Greek rather than Latin roots for writing) -- both originally meant a public notice of something, a "writing forth" to the populace at large.

  37. Apple Again by tranquille+ · · Score: 1

    Apple Apple Apple!!! Always in the news,trying to prove themselves all over. Just get the fact:You can be the best(which i doubt),but that doesnt mean there wont be competitions.

  38. Re:Apple committing slow suicide, Tim Cook assisti by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

    The bottom line is that the UK (through consumer demand) needs Apple far more than Apple needs the UK market.

    You need some Prozac. If Apple followed your fanciful prescription its stock would be worth $100 billion less the next day, for starters.

    By the way, it is clear to everyone but you that consumers like Samsung's products more than Apple's.

    --
    When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  39. Re:stop selling the iphone and ipad in England by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

    see how pissed off brits get if apple just says "fuck you, we're taking our ball and going home."

    See how fired Tim Cook would be.

    --
    When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  40. Re:Enlighten me by AthanasiusKircher · · Score: 1

    By the way, the interesting thing about the error here is that it is a "prescription" involving a public punishment for a woman, which is fairly close to the original ancient Latin meaning of "proscribe," although in that case, the person would be "proscribed," not the punishment.

    I originally thought the GP was making a pun, which is the only reason I ended up reading the arguments.

  41. Re:Apple committing slow suicide, Tim Cook assisti by WizADSL · · Score: 1

    Steve repeatedly used that demand like heavy artillery, I don't think he'd hesitate to do so with the little island off the coast of Europe.

    I recall the Germans thinking that same shit in the 40s. It didn't turn out the way they expected, and I seriously doubt it would for Apple.

  42. What I don't understand by etresoft · · Score: 1

    is why the mysterious Pamela Jones and the rest of the open-source community has identified Apple as The Great Satan. What has Apple ever done to hurt them? Complied with the GPL? OK. Guilty as charged. People who love their Apple devices get derided as fanbois. People who hate, without ever being harmed, are the good guys?

  43. Re:Enlighten me by nosferatu1001 · · Score: 1

    On matters unrelated to the UK courts ruling.

    That Apple then lied about, and tried to say they were the same cases, to try to lessen the courts decision by making people think the UK court got it wrong.

    Thus showing contempt

    Seriously, not difficult!

  44. Re:Enlighten me by alexgieg · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I dislike lawyers intensely. I really do. I never realized how bad they are until I worked with them. We provide services to them. We are on their side. They still treat us like crap, like we are the adversary. They are constantly trying to trip us up over the slightest things. It's like their brains are hard wired to press any perceived advantage and exploit even the slightest gap.

    Years ago my brother found what he thought was a niche opportunity. He noticed a lawyers district downtown had very few computer shops and, figuring lawyers need notebooks, backup services and the like, opened a small shop near there advertising specifically to them, with things like special discounts to members of the bar association, monthly maintenance contracts, repair services and the like. Just guess what the result was after a few months. Yes, that! Exactly what's just crossed your mind!

    In a related note, once I and a few friends, one of which is a lawyer (a very nice one, not your usual villainous kind), were dinning together, and during the conversation we asked him who was right in a case that was receiving some attention in the news, and even he couldn't contain himself. His reply: "Depends. I'm the lawyer for which side?" We all laughed and all, but yeah.

    To those how haven't read Gulliver Travels, download a copy from Project Gutenberg and do a search for "lawyers" and similar terms. At one point Johnathan Swift provides one of the best descriptions I've ever seen of the profession. Read (or reread) it. It's well worth the effort, both for the laughs and for the awful realization that everything he says is absolutely true.

    --
    Conservatism: (n.) love of the existing evils. Liberalism: (n.) desire to substitute new evils for the existing ones.
  45. Re:er... what now? by JBMcB · · Score: 1

    The standard in the corporate world these days is to NEVER admit they are wrong and act as arrogant as possible.

    That's because if you admit you were wrong, you open yourself up to a metric *crapton* of lawsuits. From consumers claiming pain and suffering. From stockholders claiming failure of due diligence. From partners or suppliers or resellers claiming breach of contract or bad faith etc...

    --
    My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
  46. Re:Enlighten me by flimflammer · · Score: 1

    Wow, I'm really surprised that woman got off so lightly over that school bus affair. I hope some pictures crop up on the internet showing the sign. That would be great.

  47. Sanction as in, "Eiger Sanction" by reluctantjoiner · · Score: 1

    It's a sort of threat, you see.

  48. is he serious right now? by slashmydots · · Score: 2

    I hope that the lack of integrity involved in this incident is entirely atypical of Apple.'"

    NOOOOOOPE!!!!!!!!!

  49. Re:Enlighten me by Maritz · · Score: 1

    There was absolutely nothing false, and that the judge keeps trying to pretend that there was, is to me a red flag warning that he is no longer dealing in the facts of the case and the ruling, but trying to deny his own words.

    There were apparently three false statements, all pretty clearly mentioned and referenced in the article. So it looks like you can probably disregard that particular red flag.

    --
    I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
  50. marketing genius by Swampash · · Score: 1

    I'd love to see the web stats for Apple.co.uk for the past few weeks. Whether it realises this or not, the UK court has ruled that anyone wanting to see Apple acknowledge the court ruling has to see an ad for iPad Mini / iPhone 5 too.

  51. Re:er... what now? by rdnetto · · Score: 2

    Why, that sounds almost as if they would be held accountable for their actions, to the extent that it might actually be disadvantageous to break the law...

    --
    Most human behaviour can be explained in terms of identity.
  52. Re:er... what now? by Patch86 · · Score: 1

    That's because if you admit you were wrong, you open yourself up to a metric *crapton* of lawsuits.

    Considering we're talking about one of the richest companies in the world here, I think it'd be a good time to break out the world's smallest violin.

    Option 1 is don't break the law. Option 2 is, having been caught breaking the law, take your medicine quietly and without fuss. Option 3- wriggle, throw a tantrum, and try to weasel your way out of things- is not a good choice for one of the world's favourite brands.

  53. Re:stop selling the iphone and ipad in England by Patch86 · · Score: 2

    Estimates are that around 10% of Apple's proftis each year come from UK sales. What do you think would happen to Apple's stock if they announced that they were going to lose 10% of their profit, and abandon what is most likely their second or third biggest market to their rivals?

    Apple need the UK a lot more than the UK needs the second most popular shiny gadget of the moment.