Papa John's Sued For Unwanted Pizza-Related Texts

jfruh writes "Nationwide pizza chain Papa John's is finding itself on the receiving end of a $250 million text spam lawsuit. From the article: 'Seattle law firm Heyrich Kalish McGuigan, representing three Papa John's customers, alleged that the pizza delivery service has sent 500,000 unwanted text messages to customers. If the court finds that Papa John's violated the U.S. Telephone Consumer Protection Act, the pizza maker could have to pay damages of $500 per text message, or US$250 million, one of the largest damage awards under the 1991 law, the law firm said. "Many customers complained to Papa John's that they wanted the text messages to stop, and yet thousands of spam text messages were sent week after week," Donald Heyrich, attorney for the plaintiffs said in a statement. "This should be a wake-up call to advertisers. Consumers do not want spam on their cell phones."'

Comments

it would have been more cost effective

[TheGratefulNet]

to just have pirated 3 movies and be done with it.

This is wrong.

[RudyValencia]

Companies should honor requests for people to be able to opt out of their text messaging programs. I used to work in a call center supporting a major cellular carrier and their devices. The most common problem people called about was text messages they did not want and needed help in stopping. All we could do was educate the customer on how to opt out of the text messaging spam. This was one year ago. I left and never looked back.

Re:This is wrong.

[Joce640k]

Companies should honor requests for people to be able to opt out

No, they should all be "op-in"...

(...otherwise they just set up a new company every week and we have to "opt-out" all over again)

Re:This is wrong.

[mcgrew]

As Sheldon would say, "Oh, good lard!" Dude, your tinfoil is leaking.

Law Firm: $50 mil - You: $1 off next pizza

[Anonymous Coward]

Enjoy your justice - American sytle.

Re:Law Firm: $50 mil - You: $1 off next pizza

[c0lo]

(hmmm.... can't stop thinking... a dozen more suits like this and the US economy would be growing... right?)

Re:Law Firm: $50 mil - You: $1 off next pizza

[Sulphur]

(hmmm.... can't stop thinking... a dozen more suits like this and the US economy would be growing... right?)

A gross domestic product.

Re:Law Firm: $50 mil - You: $1 off next pizza

[azalin]

"gross" describes Papa John's "Pizza" quite adequately.

The law says...

[iYk6]

The law says that you aren't allowed to spam cell phones with commercial advertisements. No opt out necessary.

Re:The law says...

[houghi]

In Belgium this is different. We can (and do) send commercial offers to our customers. Two things:
1) We honor the opt-out
2) The customer never has to pay when receiving messages (unless he is in another country and roaming is on)

Re:The law says...

[Anonymous Coward]

But of course there's a loop hole... one used by a company during this past election.

You don't spam the phone by sending text messages... you spam the phone by sending "emails" to
@

Such as 8145553345@vtext.com or whatever Verizon's service is. The company in Virginia that was doing this hasn't gone to trial yet but many see it as "breaking the spirit of the law but not actually the law its self".

Re:The law says...

[kbdd]

You don't spam the phone by sending text messages... you spam the phone by sending "emails" to @

I would like to hear what they tell the judge when he asks where did they think the messages would end up if not on a cell phone as a text message?

Re:The law says...

[franciscohs]

So how do you know if the customer is in another country?

Last time I travelled I paid more for text and call spam than what I spent myself with legitimate texts and calls (which were very few, not that I got hundreds of spam messages, but still).

Re:The law says...

[ShanghaiBill]

So how do you know if the customer is in another country?

They don't know and they don't care. Why is it the Belgian government's problem that US carriers have stupid "receiver pays" billing policies? Belgium can't fix an American problem.

Papa John

[nospam007]

Just as info for those who don't know these morons.

"Before the election Papa John’s CEO John Schnatter, a big Romney supporter, was one of the highest profile CEOs threatening layoffs and pizza price hikes (god forbid!) if Obama won. He doubled down after the election, like the Vegas man saying he’d start making layoffs and reducing hours at Papa John’s locations rather than having to provide healthcare for people working more than 30 hours per week."

http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/190955/idiots-line-up-to-thank-papa-johns-for-screwing-them-out-of-healthcare/

Re:Papa John

[TheGratefulNet]

did not know that and now that I do, they are on my do-not-buy list.

in my area, they had semi-ok pizza but now that I know the ceo is like that chick-fil-a guy, I want no more part of them.

Re:Papa John

[RabidReindeer]

"...doubled down"?

Is that the latest trendy phrase over there?

Scott Adams mentioned it today, I thought he was exaggerating. Apparently not.

Yes. You're late to the party.

Translation: It didn't work before, so now we'll do it twice as hard.

Re:Papa John

[MysteriousPreacher]

Because it's a job creator taking a brave stand against Comrade Obama. A job creator, cutting jobs and pay of already poorly paid employees, is an admirable stand against the communism that is causing the EU and Canada to descend in to governmental Orwellian surveillance, economic ruination, soccer, no freedoms and a whole bunch of stupid national anthems and incomprehensible languages.

I salute Papa John's financially successful and well educated Facebook fans. Fight for the job creators, not the White House Politburo!

Re:Papa John

[drinkypoo]

did not know that and now that I do, they are on my do-not-buy list.

You realize, of course, that by doing that, you're hosing the employees even further, because not only will hours be cut, but so will the number of employees.

Perhaps they can go to work for a more ethical pizzeria when Papa John's cuts back locations due to reduced business. I suppose you'd prefer that nothing ever get better at all because some people will suffer if it does.

Re:Papa John

[arth1]

You realize, of course, that by doing that, you're hosing the employees even further, because not only will hours be cut, but so will the number of employees.

People won't stop buying pizza. They'll buy from other places instead, which means other places will be hiring.

Anyhow, I don't really get the whole pizza delivery thing. Where I live, it's quicker for me to make a pizza from scratch than to order one.
It's really not hard - if it were, those guys wouldn't be able to do it...

Re:Papa John

[ehynes]

How can it be payback? The lawsuit is being brought by a private law firm and it was certified as a class-action case by a Reagan appointee.

Re:Papa John

[clonehappy]

Don't bother. People on here don't understand basic economics. They think that somehow these pizza joints (franchises mostly that have nothing much to do with John Schnatter anyway...barely keep their heads above water) are raking in cash hand over fist and greedily sticking it into their vaults to swim in occasionally. This is patently false.

If it costs them an extra $50,000 a year to run a restaurant, many will be forced to lay people off, simply because they can't afford to pay them anymore. Some restaurants may even close. But somehow, in the new Amerika, this is progress?

It boggles the mind. Fix the problem within the healthcare system, then worry about forcing the poorest individuals to pay a tax if they don't have healthcare. But since it was packaged up and shoved in the sickly-sweet loving liberal exterior, it has to be good...and anyone who understands the real ramifications of the healthcare act is a very very bad person and/or a racist.

Re:Papa John

[DerekLyons]

Papa John's is reacting to the new economic reality they face under the Obama regime. It's that simple. Obamacare will force them to cut hours and let people go. They know that. We know that. This has never changed since the concept was first floated. It's reality.

Some people knew it - but many people lived under a reality distortion field that lead them to believe that there would be no consequences of any kind under the new law. Those of us who pointed out the flaws in the plan and pointed out that you couldn't alter the trajectory of billions of dollars without consequences were and are being called haters, and liars, and ignorant... and worse.
 
The worst part is that Obamacare doesn't actually do anything to reform health care or control costs. It's a shell game to hide the mounting costs.
 
Still, the effects of this farce are only beginning to be felt. The shell game they've been playing about funding is going to end, with a shell lifted to reveal... nothing. Expect a wave of insurance companies going under over the next decade, if they aren't bailed out to the tune of billions or trillions (which the government doesn't have). Since many underwriters and insurance companies also provide other forms of insurance, the ripple effects through the economy will be staggering.
 
And those ignorant people under the reality distortion field won't understand that these consequences were as predictable as the sun rising. They simply cannot comprehend TANSTAAFL.

Re:Papa John

[MysteriousPreacher]

The negative score is telling about how much liberals like to suppress opposition. You basically said the exact thing as the +4 post you responded to (except to state a positive action,) and your post got modded as flamebait.

The fact that someone actually used one of their few mod points to hide your post is key to their insecurity.

It cuts both ways. Slashdot tends to have a liberal slant, ergo there'll be liberals with mod points who think downmodding is the way to deal with opposing views. Head over to forums/sites with a conservative bent and you'll see the same. This isn't a phenomena exclusive to any particular ideology.

Chick-fil-a as a company is perfectly entitled to sponsor anti-gay efforts. Hell, let them fund efforts against interracial marriage if they wish. I'd defend their right to be utterly unpleasant, while still considering anyone who supports their right-wing fundie positions to be vile bigots.

Re:Papa John

[jackbird]

Actually, the clusterfuck that ended up being the ACA was an attempt to get republicans on board. The actual sickly-sweet loving liberal version is single payer, like, you know, the rest of the developed world. And small business owners should be first in line to ask for it (perhaps only after large corporations with large retiree healthcare expenses), but somehow they've all been convinced it's anathema.

Re:Papa John

[Renevith]

I can't help but picture this CEO as a 6-year-old who's been prevented from stealing his younger sister's toy and is now throwing a tantrum.

I am a libertarian. It should be a no-brainer for Republicans to attract my support (over the Democrats at least). Instead they're giving me and everyone else the finger with their absurd rhetoric and childish political games. This goes for their politicians, their pundits, and quite a few of their supporters. Everything Obama supports is automatically bad, even if it's the same thing the Republicans earlier supported.

This insane prioritization of winning vs. losing and minor social issues instead of real governance is why I agree with the sentiment of this post. The Republicans are a menace and must be stopped.

Re:Papa John

[PraiseBob]

Or maybe he will be force to lower his franchising fees, since clearly the parent corporation is making a ton of money.
They have options:
A) Everything stays the same, go out of business (so the CEO claims)
B) Cut back employee hours to save money, and stay in business
C) Cut back franchise fees to a billionaire who has a private golf course and moat, and stay in business
D) Raise prices by the 11 cents per pizza and pass along the cost to the customer

They've chosen options B and D. Raising the prices by 50 cents to cover health care costs, while simultaneously cutting worker hours so they don't have to give them health care either way, and hiring more "part-timers". Essentially the plan is to screw over both the customers and the employees, rather than cutting his own obscenely large paycheck.

People on here don't understand basic economics
I think people on here don't like assholes.

Re:Papa John

[hey!]

Actually, he isn't the the Chic-fil-A guy at all. The Chic-fil-A guy has a problem with gay marriage because of his Christian religion, but *also* because of his Christian religion gives his employees and excellent benefits package. That includes health, dental, vision, disability and life insurance. He also offers a 401(k) retirement plan with a 5% company match, a defined benefits plan, and tuition reimbursement. In other words he's a stand-up guy who happens to be wrong about gay marriage, but I for one support his right to have and express his opinion.

The Papa John's guy wont' offer health care to his full time workers because it'd cost him fourteen cents a pie. He does marketing promotions that cost more than covering his employees would but he doesn't want to do it because he's a scum-sucking bottom-feeder.

Re:Who doesn't want Pizza?

[bfandreas]

Not to be nitpicky but proper Mozzarella is made from (European) buffalo milk. Not that cheap cow stuff.
Not every lactation of any bovine will do for proper Mozzarella.

But anything is better than that horrid cheese analogue they stir together from second rate fat, rotting skunks and paint.

Sounds like a Marketing-led clusterfuck

[Anonymous Coward]

What I imagine happened is this: A marketing firm contacts Papa John's marketing about spamming sms, convinces them its a great idea.

Marketing arm of Papa Johns goes ahead on its own, resulting in this case.

At no point was any technical, legal or compliance arm of Papa Johns consulted, where they would have found people who know about this stuff due to existing business relationships with above-board SMS platform providers who would have informed them of the legal requirements for operating a sms service (opt-ins, requirement for STOP handling, etc).

Anonymous because the stuff in bold is true.

This won't go to trial, it will be settled beforehand. The case is that unwinnable for Papa Johns.

Re:If I get spam from a pizza company,

[houghi]

It will cost the pizza drivers, not so much the company.

Re:Spam tastes great

[6031769]

Rectangular squares? I suppose you need to differentiate them from all those elliptical squares we see nowadays.

Re:Spam tastes great

[dkleinsc]

So you're saying you want spam, spam, spam, spam, tomato sauce, spam, spam, cheese, spam, spam, and crust?

Well...

[Ronin Developer]

Couldn't happen to a "nicer" guy. He was so angry about the $0.14 per pizza he would have to spend to give his employees healthcare coverage that he will now be paying out the equivalent on healthcare costs for an entire state and with nothing to show for it.

Oops.

Stupid is as stupid does.

Re:If I get spam from a pizza company,

[Joce640k]

I'm going to order so many pizzas to be sent to random addresses with the name "sam spam" etc they're likely to get the message pretty quickly.

Be sure to order a spam, spam, spam, spam, cheese, tomato and spam topping.

That would buy a lot of health care

[WOOFYGOOFY]

he pizza maker could have to pay damages of $500 per text message, or US$250 million, one of the largest damage awards under the 1991 law...

That would have bought some health care for their employees.

According to Forbes magazine, it would cost Papa Johns 5 cents per pizza to provide health care to their employees.

http://www.upi.com/Health_News/2012/11/14/Forbes-Papa-Johns-ACA-cost-5-cents/UPI-54101352940627/

It never was about the nickle and it never was. Most species of apes, specifically the males, assert their sexual dominance by keeping more of the good stuff - whatever that might be- for themselves than they can possibly use. This is so they can broadcast the fact of their dominance to females .

I think it's safe to say that the owner of Papa Johns is a physically unprepossessing specimen, basically he looks like some guy on your neighborhood watch.

http://www.politico.com/politico44/2012/08/papa-johns-obamacare-will-raise-pizza-prices-131331.html

Without a mindset that causes him to spend his life seeking, acquiring hording and displaying his wealth, he'd never get laid, or at least, he would not get as laid as he feels he should be.

In making a show of denying those under him healthcare, and especially by talking about how little it would cost him to provide those benefits as per the article above his primordial mind is attempting to broadcast the fact of his sexual dominance / desirability to available females. That's what's going on here.

When shit as demented as "No nickle for healthcare !!!! " becomes that public and is even paraded around by the perps themselves, you have to go to waaaaay back in evolutionary time to find the part of their brain that's being activated.

It's amusing that the conservatives who deny evolution is real seem also to be the people whose motivations are most clearly amenable to forces governing basic evolutionary processes.

Re:That would buy a lot of health care

[Dr_Barnowl]

I'm sure there is an element of this, but it's not just about the nickel ; it's about the dollars he'd have to spend on wages for employees that were no longer terrified of losing their jobs.

People who aren't worried about their healthcare costs are less scared of losing their job. The American healthcare system is a nightmare because a single accident can bankrupt you, wipe you out, make you choose between keeping a finger and sending your kids to college.

People like this ass perceive their employees as convenient victims, not partners in their pizza enterprise. Making them happier and more content is not on their agenda, because happy contented people are less likely to want to work for minimum wage and clock out when the restaurant is empty.

Re:Who doesn't want Pizza?

[jtownatpunk.net]

I fail to see what Papa John's has to do with pizza.

Re:If I get spam from a pizza company,

[tangelogee]

I don't want spam, I want pepperoni!

Well, you could order the spam, spam, pepperoni and cheese, that hasn't got much spam on it.

Re:If I get spam from a pizza company,

[Y2KDragon]

No, the drivers lose in the cost of gas to go out. They lose tips for non-existent deliveries. They lose income from people being angry and petty. Remember, the people working in the stores aren't the ones who sent the spam, but they will be the ones to bear the worst of the punishment for such actions. Best response is to just not buy from them anymore. I've stopped ordering a long time ago when I found out he was a heavy political backer of the "nut-job right" (not to be confused with actual Conservatives).

Re:Spam tastes great

[drinkypoo]

However if Papa John ignored their own "stop" requests they shouldn't be surprised if they get fined (mind you $500 per text is a bit excessive).

Why is $500 excessive for an act of harassment? I think you should also get a restraining order against them in the bargain, and if they send you one more text, the CEO gets jailed for 30 days.

The FCC is soliciting comments on this topic.

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, the FCC has a currently open comment period on how to address automated system for sending spam texts to cell phones. See http://apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/view?id=7022037251

With this Public Notice, we seek comment on the petition for an expedited clarification and
declaratory ruling filed by Revolution Messaging, LLC.1 Revolution Messaging asks the Commission to
clarify that the Telephone Consumer Protection Act (TCPA)2 and the Commission’s related rules3 apply
to users of Internet-to-phone text messaging technology and similar technologies involving the storage
and automatic dialing of wireless telephone numbers.4 Revolution Messaging states that such a ruling
would make clear that Internet-to-phone text messaging technology is a type of “automatic telephone
dialing system” under the Commission’s rules and is therefore subject to the prohibitions in the TCPA
and the Commission’s related rules.

Anyone can file comments urging the FCC to make clear that such systems should be considered a type of “automatic telephone dialing system” under the Commission’s rules.

Read the full petition here: http://apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/view?id=7022037252

File comments on the FCC ECFS system, the docket number to use is "02-278". http://http://apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/upload/

And although the deadline is close, the FCC is generally fairly liberal in allowing and considering late-filed comments.

Re:Who doesn't want Pizza?

[mcgrew]

I personally can not stand there food.

Why are you calling the GP "food"? And why can't you stand there?

Re:Who doesn't want Pizza?

[geminidomino]

Papa Johns is one of the better nationwide chains of pizza

That's like saying "Having electrodes pasted onto your nuts is one of the more tolerable forms of torture."

Re:Who doesn't want Pizza?

[theArtificial]

Apparently cooking is like alchemy to most people. While I'm not the world's greatest chef I do know how to prepare my own meals and making pizzas is extremely fun to do especially when you get down to making the crust. It's great to get the family involved with, too. Most breads are pretty simple to make, the most difficult part is having a decent oven. Pizza stones help out with this. Ultimately it comes down to effort and not everyone is motivated after work. BTW I like the et viola, very cool!

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