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Australian ISP iiNet Walks Out of Piracy Warning System Talks
An anonymous reader writes with this excerpt from Torrent Freak: "A leading Australian Internet service provider has pulled out of negotiations to create a warning notice scheme aimed at reducing online piracy. iiNet, the ISP that was sued by Hollywood after refusing to help chase down alleged infringers, said that it can't make any progress with rightsholders if they don't make their content freely available at a reasonable price. The ISP adds that holding extra data on customers' habits is inappropriate and not their responsibility."
As an Aussie, I approve of them making a stand against how everyone in this country is ripped off by all the media outlets - especially when our dollar is worth more than the US dollar. And as for making us wait 3-6 months because they don't want us watching... well, the internet tore down that time barrier as well.
... wait, what?
I'm so glad I'm with iiNet; they take a stand for me as a consumer. I don't pirate anything, nor do I view content that is outside the norms of adult society, however my browsing habits are not other people's business - especially corporate entities!
My congratulations to Australians for having an ISP that stands up for the interests of its customers.
I wonder if we could ever get something like that in the United States? Haha, I'm just kidding... I know we can't.
However, I wish you all the best in keeping iiNet—particularly, resisting pressure and bullying tactics from my country's government and its corporate controllers.
Thank you, Edward Snowden.
"Arguments from authority are worthless." —Carl Sagan
I especially like
The ISP adds that holding extra data on customers' habits is inappropriate and not their responsibility."
Now that they actually don't do that is something else, but at least their saying it, and leaving the talks, so theres a good possibility they respect their customers privacy.
It also shows something else,these talks are probably organized with the idea that both parties could potentially benefit somehow. iiNet clearly states that none of that would be happening and the rights holders aren't looking for a scenario that would be positive for both parties, they only want to get free rides on the ISPs back. That's why the ISP is walking out with the nice taglines, they don't see any possible solution where they can benefit from talking with the rights holders.
Crack a series of tubes.
If you don't live here, in Australia - you don't understand.
We get gouged, delayed or denied on a lot.
Last week I bought a Steinberg Cubase 7 upgrade. A DOWNLOAD product - I paid $199. It's $149 to US customers. That's a typical situation for us. It's always the same story in this country. The distributors/retailers (whether they be television channels, bricks and mortar sellers or whatever), they control the price through publisher->retailer relationship and that means we get it when they want, for the price they want and fuck you if you don't want to pay for their shitty overheads.
If I want games off steam, often,I have to pay up to 90 US for a release title. Not steam's fault.
If I wanted to watch the final season of sopranos legitimately (and believe me, I tried), I saw something like 2 episodes, then it went away for about a month, came back for another couple of episodes and it was gone again. Typical television patronage, here. My response? What am I supposed to do? Hang out for the tv guide, every week? Sorry, you created my desire to watch your program and I'm now going to watch it.
If I want to watch English Premier League games online (because I can't afford the $70-80 a month for all inclusive pay tv) - I'm only able to watch a few games of someone elses choice through their online service because like so many things online, currently, the content just goes to whoever will front for it. Telstra own the rights to online rugby league coverage in this country - they do next to NOTHING with it.
I could go on with hours of fragments of information and complaints on the situation and I'm sure the grass is green here in many ways - but it is a little frustrating to have to constantly circumvent the legitimate purchase method (whether it be through downloading the product for free, or buying it at a grey import seller) - just so I can't feel like a chump for paying twice the price everybody else on earth does.
And let's get something straight - I PREFER to buy. Steam completely and utterly destroyed piracy for me. I love it. But what I don't love is how the shitheads running unprofitable stores contributing fuck all to my gaming life necessitate that I can't buy a game for the price retailers in the rest of the world sell it for.
Do they have service in eastern USA?
Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.
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Comment removed based on user account deletion
Americans have a similar situation.
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/game_of_thrones
You have a sick, twisted mind. Please subscribe me to your newsletter.
"freely available at a reasonable price."
How does that work out? Free as in open formats?
Thanks.
Americans have a similar situation.
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/game_of_thrones
Americans are not the only ones. I generally try to pay for stuff that I feel is worth watching, listening to or running. Pirating takes too long, the quality is often crap, and pirated stuff is riddled with malware. That cartoon is basically the story of what happened when I tried to pay for the privilege of watching Season 2, except most of these services that cartoon character tried are "... unfortunately unable to finalize the transaction due to geographical restrictions" even when the stuff I want is available. The only other ways to get to watch GoT Season 2 was a 3 month minimum package subscription featuring a legion of channels that I never watch or.... put up with the 12 hour delay and pirate GoT after exhausting all legal alternatives except overpriced cable subscriptions.
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
...and at the same time as the rest of the world. Social media is big enough that a delay is really noticeable.
Note: Please don't talk about the Hobbit film. It releases for us on the 26th December 2012. (thankfully not in December 2013)
kers at the wrong moment What happens when you catch stock tic
what are 'reasonable' prices? In my opinion the prices the ISP asks aren't reasonable themselves, but that's just my OPINION, they have the right to ask anything they want as it's their product.. Just like content is the product of those entertainmentcompanies, they created/put up the money so they can decide what prices are asked, not some moron who thinks he can put his will onto others.. Clearly people are interested in the content otherwise they wouldn't consume them, but remember, all content is still just a luxury product, if you think the price is too high, then leave it be, but don't go 'stealing' it. You can always wait until it's a more reasonable price or on the radio/tv..
and in this case, the ISP is just a big hypocrit, as they profit from all the need for content, because without that content most people didn't really need such speedy connections..
Really? Is there something stopping you from starting one? I don't think so. If you REALLY believe in it, go out there, find some like-minded people, raise some money and start one.
It isn't the ISP's job to do deep packet inspection on their customers, nor is it their job to restrict or remove their customers access to their pipe. I would say in the case of public safety it might be reasonable, but not because a third party doesn't like what the customer is downloading? Be real.
Here in the US, network providers have an enormous negotiating advantage when dealing with media companies. The one or two wires leading to your house are owned by the ISPs.
If media companies continue to turn the screws on ISPs, the ISPs can simply refuse to carry their content.
Think of the potential fall-out. Disney decides that Verizon isn't playing ball with regards to copyright enforcement. Disney makes unreasonable demands of Verizon and how they treat their customers. Verizon can simply stop distributing Disney's channels. The advertising and merchandising dollars that result from Phineas and Ferb would be sorely missed by Disney.
Let's be honest. If a carrier or two decides to make an example out of one of the content providers, there isn't much the content providers can do about it. There are only a couple of ways I can get TV and Internet. It's not like I can go out and get another ISP very easily.
Media companies better tread lightly here. They need the network operators to distribute their products. The network operators need us to keep paying the bill.
It isn't a voluntary exchange of money because the seller sets the price and therefore there is no negotiation.
If you want to claim "They didn't have to buy it", then piracy is just the free market managing to find the route that gives a price close to the percieved value of the product. If you can't negotiate the price, piracy is the next nearest acceptable price on offer.
Remember, the don't have to make the movies. They could just decide to do something else instead. Nobody is MAKING them make music/movies/whatever and it's not like piracy was sprung on them out of the blue: it's been known about for decades.
Instead of you setting a price, offer a price and accept a counteroffer.
If you, the seller, cannot agree with the buyer on a price, then either you cave in and sell it anyway or the buyer caves, or the transaction doesn't happen.
However, at the moment, the price is the price set by the seller and no negotiation is available.
THAT is why you don't know what a "reasonable price" is: you aren't asking for one, only claiming a price YOU want, not what the customer wants to pay.
When I worked for 2 different ISP's I repeated this mantra over and over. It's the responsibility of the rights holder to sell the product at a fair price so that people will want to use there services. You can't use ISP's to enforce your copyrights on bad products. ISP's don't have the manpower or money to act as the free gatekeepers of a corporations IP and should never be expected to.
The gaming industry came up with serials to manage online gameplay. The RIAA and MPAA need to understand that there tactics are doing everyone good (for the community) by driving people to make Indy projects that can be digitally shared for pennies on the dollar to millions of people. The business models of these outdated giants need to die and be replaced by something fair and open to the artists that produce the art.
> content is the product of those entertainment companies, they created / put up the money so they can decide what prices are asked
Exactly! In fact, those entertainment companies (Hollywood, Broadway) were all founded, are still owned and governed by jewish investors. Pirating is therefore equal to robbing jews, which is an antisemitic crime. Hurting jews is hurting YHWH himself, because they are his chosen tribe! Protestant christians are supposed to respect jews like their older brothers, so why do the gentiles of America pirate? Please repent.
(One should also not pirate asian popular media, because that one is full of underage sexual perversion and leads to a sinful moral fall. Japan and Korea are full of sick minds, because they have not received the wisdom of the Ten Commandments.)
Still nothing other than the bare claim that malware abounds in torrent downloads?
PS you already have a virus checker. Big hassle, huh?
Thanks Iinet. It's good to see a small wa company do well and continue to have morals. Was a custome for years, currently with internode who are now Iinet owned anway. I remember one of the early Iinet user group meetings at a local Perth pizza joint. Come a long way.
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
the quality is often crap... ...and stuff is mislabeled, has TV station logos in the corners, texts and crap overlaid,
Yeah, lets read that again.
a) Mislabeled. Who cares? You didn't pay for it, download a real one. Often the mislabelling is done to deliberately piss off infringers.
b) The stuff you get legally has TV station logos in the corners, text and crap overlaid AND HAS ADVERTS AS WELL.
"First, allow me to complement you on the tone of that statement"
The time and bandwidth I used to download the wrong file are an opportunity cost that I not only did pay, but was tricked into paying it.
The content I get from services like iTunes and Netflix does not have logo overlays or advertisements.
Because Slashdot fucking loves all things Australian.
Whoa there cowboy, slow down. What's not to like about us? Settle down mate, here, have a tinnie, I'll throw some extra prawns on the barbie.
We'll get you in the right frame of mind soon enough.
Moved to http://soylentnews.org/. You are invited to join us too!
Seriously, what is it about the Attorney General's department that turns ordinary politicians into authoritarian arseholes?
Plan My Week for iPhone
Oh, and fuck senator Conroy and his hairdresser.
ummm and which senator is in charge of delivering the nbn to you exactly?
Prawns? Barramundi, mate. Godzone. And a decent beer to wash it down. None of that American sex-in-a-canoe swill.
(And feeding Americans Fosters Lager is a bit like those nomads seeing if they can get you to eat a camel eye. It's a joke, not a brew.)
Do not mock my vision of impractical footwear
that gives the location as the US
Although maybe some sites check IP adresses as well or instead.