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Small Town Builds Its Own Gigabyte Network; Cost To Citizens $57/month

An anonymous reader writes "On Thursday, the board of O-Net gave approval for residents to get access to [full gigabit bandwidth] for the same price that they currently pay for a guaranteed download speed of 100 megabits per second — $57 to $90 a month, depending on whether they have bundled their internet with TV and phone service. ... the town realized that it couldn't attract technology-based businesses and that bandwidth was a challenge even to ordinary businesses. It came up with a plan — it would install a fibre network throughout the town that would connect to the larger inter-community network being built by the government at that time — the Alberta Supernet."

269 comments

  1. bits and bytes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

    Well, is it gigabit or gigabyte? Because the latter would be very impressive.

    1. Re:bits and bytes by icebike · · Score: 5, Informative

      From TFA:

      On Thursday, the board of O-Net gave approval for residents to get access to a full gigabit (or 1,000 megabits) per second of bandwidth

      I guess it was too much to expect someone posting as AC to actually click the link in the summary.

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    2. Re:bits and bytes by Spy+Handler · · Score: 4, Funny

      It says Gigabyte not gigabyte... so it must mean the network features customizable voltages and clock speeds for easy-to-use overclocking and a good warranty policy.

    3. Re:bits and bytes by icebike · · Score: 1

      The title of the summary disagrees with the summary itself, but TFA says gigabit.

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    4. Re:bits and bytes by Xicor · · Score: 1

      neither. it says afterwards "100 megabits per second"... which is one tenth of a gigabit

    5. Re:bits and bytes by Xicor · · Score: 1

      sorry, 1000megabits... is one gigabit.

    6. Re:bits and bytes by l_bratch · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If we assume that the AC was just poking fun at the title/summary disagreement, then it was a fair comment.

    7. Re:bits and bytes by l_bratch · · Score: 2, Funny

      Now that I think about it, neither gave a frequency, so both can be correct. Perhaps the title was implying per eight seconds and the summary was implying per second.

      Probably not though.

    8. Re:bits and bytes by hosecoat · · Score: 1

      From TFA:

      On Thursday, the board of O-Net gave approval for residens to get access to a full gigabit (or 1,000 megabits) per second of bandwidth

      I guess it was too much to expect someone posting as AC to actually click the link in the summary.

      I guess it was too much to have the headline correct "Small Town Builds Its Own Gigabyte Network; Cost To Citizens $57/month"

    9. Re:bits and bytes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      100 megabits is guaranteed to the internet. But you can probably talk to your neighbor at gigabit speeds.

    10. Re:bits and bytes by k3vlar · · Score: 1

      It says it costs people "the same as what they currently pay for 100mbit". So it's giving them gigabit speeds for what they used to pay for 100mbit. ($57-$90)

      The summary is poor, and the headline is just plain wrong. This is fail on a level I've not seen since...

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    11. Re:bits and bytes by Somebody+Is+Using+My · · Score: 1

      Except most of those customers will probably connect to their routers wirelessly using 802.11g adapters, for a whopping 54mbits to the Internet...

      "I don't understand what all the fuss is about, the Internet doesn't seem any faster to me!"

    12. Re:bits and bytes by TeknoHog · · Score: 1

      From TFA:

      On Thursday, the board of O-Net gave approval for residents to get access to a full gigabit (or 1,000 megabits) per second of bandwidth

      Bandwidth is measured in Hertz. I don't actually care how much bandwidth they use to deliver my 1 Gbps of channel capacity.

      --
      Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
    13. Re:bits and bytes by icebike · · Score: 1

      And pedantry is measured in posts like yours, apparently.

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    14. Re:bits and bytes by Raistlin77 · · Score: 1

      It's Soulskill, what the fuck do you expect?

    15. Re:bits and bytes by hedwards · · Score: 2

      Since the last time you read a summary on Slashdot, I assume.

    16. Re:bits and bytes by geekoid · · Score: 1

      That's wasn't pedantry, it was wrong. Bandwidth has two different meanings.

      There is asymptotic bandwidth, multimedia bandwidth, consumption Bandwidth, capacity bandwidth, and so on.
      Context is important.

      .

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    17. Re:bits and bytes by geekoid · · Score: 2

      This is fail on a level I've not seen since...

      the previous story?

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      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    18. Re:bits and bytes by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      The title of the summary disagrees with the summary itself, but TFA says gigabit.

      the transfer limit is one gigabyte, obviously.

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      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    19. Re:bits and bytes by unitron · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately it also puts a Host Protected Area on any hard drive with which it comes in contact.

      --

      I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.

    20. Re: bits and bytes by kenh · · Score: 1

      "I guess it was too much to expect someone posting as AC to actually click the link in the summary."

      I guess it was too much to expect the editors at slashdot to a) know the difference between gigabit and gigabyte, and b) to check their own headline before they publish the story...

      --
      Ken
    21. Re: bits and bytes by icebike · · Score: 1

      You've been here long enough to know that the submitter submits both the headlines and the story,
      and that the editors do little except make sure the links are diverted through as many ad supported
      sites as possible instead of going directly to the source.

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      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
  2. Started out impressive by MrEricSir · · Score: 4, Funny

    Headline says gigabyte network, then the summary says gigabit. Finally, it turns out it's 100mbps.

    By the time you finish reading this comment it will be 56k.

    --
    There's no -1 for "I don't get it."
    1. Re:Started out impressive by DarkFencer · · Score: 4, Informative

      for the same price that they currently pay for a guaranteed download speed of 100 megabits per second

      The 100 megabit figure is what they currently have, not the new network.

      The summary is right, but the subject (gigabyte vs gigabit) is wrong.

    2. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      No it doesn't, it clearly states that they will receive 1000mbps for the same price as they currently pay for 100mbps.

    3. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So when will the Dice job ads on this site start advertising for "Slashdot Editor"?

    4. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Wrong. You didn't read the article. It says they get gigabit for what they typically would pay for 100 megabit.

    5. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The headline is incorrect, confusing bytes and bits (a typical mistake that is easy to make when talking about bandwidth). However the summary and TFA are consistent, referring to a gigabit/second.

    6. Re:Started out impressive by aliquis · · Score: 1

      Also we just had that 31 terabit story less than 24 hours ago.

      Also it's not like $57 is very cheap.

    7. Re:Started out impressive by Xicor · · Score: 2

      lol i feel really upset that a small town like that gets 100megabits per second for only 57 dollars a month... in dallas texas, 57 dollars a month will get you max 10 megabits

    8. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      ...

      You are an idiot.

      The 9/10 is 9/10th of a cent. So the price is really 3.999, instead of 3.99.

    9. Re: Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I always interpreted that as an additional 9/10 of a cent to each gallon

    10. Re:Started out impressive by Bardez · · Score: 1

      Personally, I'm jealous that you live in the vicinity to know about Dallas pricing (i.e.: live there) and I don't.

      --
      Perception is the thin dividing line between reality and fiction.
    11. Re:Started out impressive by wooferhound · · Score: 2

      lol it is the same confusing thing they do with gasoline in the US. they try and make it look better by using some retarded system. internet companies wouldnt be able to get away with giving 5 megabits per second of the majority of the people realized that one megabit is only 1/8 of a megabyte. gasoline is the same way, they use 9/10 of a gallon to price their gasoline... everyone thinks they are getting a full gallon for the price listed, but they are only getting 9/10.

      You are wrong. You are buying a full gallon, but where they get you is that while they are posting a price of $3.25 a gallon, they are actually charging you $3.259 a gallon. It's 9/10 of a cent more than the posted price. This pricing comes from the days of low priced gas when the price may have been 12.3 cents a gallon

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    12. Re:Started out impressive by sl4shd0rk · · Score: 1

      The summary is right, but the subject (gigabyte vs gigabit) is wrong.

      Perhaps they are using a Linux box with a Gigabyte motherboard as a firewall.

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    13. Re:Started out impressive by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

      In bumfuck where I live, 57 dollars a month will get you 1.5 megabits. Within a bowshot you can get medicom cable or u-verse dsl but neither reaches here.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    14. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Have you tried AT&T recently? They want $60 for 6 Mbps.

    15. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I expect that if they ever introduce 100 Mbps service, let alone 1000 Mbps, it will still be priced at $10 per megabit.

    16. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Personally, I'm jealous that you live in the vicinity to know about Dallas pricing (i.e.: live there) and I don't.

      I didn't know there were places so bad that Dallas looked good and still had internet access. Do you have a satellite connection?

    17. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Meanwhile, my provider offers 200mbps for 37.50/mo when you pay for a year up-front. Fiber internet rocks!

    18. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      gasoline is the same way, they use 9/10 of a gallon to price their gasoline... everyone thinks they are getting a full gallon for the price listed, but they are only getting 9/10.

      I was going to say that this is the dumbest thing I've ever heard, but I was soon hit by a realization that left me awestruck.

      Because the truth is that the effect isn't just local to me. In my blockquote tags I gingerly hold the very dumbest thing it is possible to say.

      It's humbling, to say the least.

    19. Re:Started out impressive by Livius · · Score: 1

      In the example, $3.25 buys you ~0.9972 gallons, not 0.9.

    20. Re:Started out impressive by Tailhook · · Score: 2

      Network capacity has always been measured in bits and powers of 10, not 2. 100BASE-T is 100,000,000 bits per second. A full DS-1 line is 1.544 Mbps. Analog modems include rates such as 2400 bps and 33.6 Kbps.

      The isn't some nefarious marketing plot. I've never heard of any network service or medium specified in bytes per second.

      Stop making stuff up out of ignorance.

      --
      Maw! Fire up the karma burner!
    21. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some of you guys really ought to buy exactly $10.00 worth of gas and see how much comes out. Where I am at, there are a number of filling station that at $3.00 a gallon, and I buy $10 worth of gas, I should get 3.3 gallons of gas, but don't. They mess with the pumps all the time. Bastards...

    22. Re:Started out impressive by fazey · · Score: 1

      lol welcome to china

    23. Re: Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      Just attach some cat6 to the arrow before you take your bowshot.

    24. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How far off of 3.33 is it? All pumps in my state have a sticker showing that they have been certified by our states measures group. I would assume messing with the pump could land someone in a world of hurt.

    25. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You won't find a gas station in the US that charges $3.00 per gallon. ALL gas stations in the US tack on 9/10 of a cent. The closest you'll get to $3.00 is $2.999. The next cent will be $3.009.

    26. Re:Started out impressive by hedwards · · Score: 1

      I'd take that deal, that's about what I'm paying for 5mbps ATM.

    27. Re:Started out impressive by hedwards · · Score: 1

      $57 is extremely cheap for even 100mbps in the US. I'm paying roughly that much for 5mbps. And there are folks paying not much less for 1.5mbps locally.

    28. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Regular data networking data rates have always been measured in bits/second in my experience.

      However, storage data rates have often been measured in bytes/second. Just one of those differences that make life interesting.

    29. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Within a bowshot

      Metric PLEASE!

    30. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I'm sorry, but that is precisely because you live in an area where distances are measured by how far a FUCKING ARROW will fly.

    31. Re:Started out impressive by Xicor · · Score: 1

      dont forget ethernet transfer rate is in bytes as well, so are a lot of routers

    32. Re:Started out impressive by Xicor · · Score: 1

      and prettty much any device to device cables.... wait... why is it that cables between computers in my house(intranet) are in bytes, while cables going from my house to other houses(internet) are in bits? doesnt make sense lol.

    33. Re:Started out impressive by gl4ss · · Score: 2

      You won't find a gas station in the US that charges $3.00 per gallon. ALL gas stations in the US tack on 9/10 of a cent. The closest you'll get to $3.00 is $2.999. The next cent will be $3.009.

      and sales tax on top of that? you guys really have ridiculous consumer protection agencies, you should just put 10% of the tsa and nsa budget on that so maybe people wouldn't flip out after living there for two years.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    34. Re:Started out impressive by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      I get 12Mbps for around $50 a month. And that's incredibly faster than what I've ever had before except at the office. If this town is getting 100 Mbps for $57, they should consider that a great deal. Sure it may not be enough to run a big corporation but you can provide that sort of internet to companies separately from home users.

    35. Re:Started out impressive by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      $57 is too expensive for the average home owner that just wants to browse the web. That's why dial up companies still exist for $9.99/month.

    36. Re:Started out impressive by Kufat · · Score: 1

      All Ethernet standard speeds (10M/100M/1G/10G/40G/100G) are in mega/gigabits per second, not bytes. So are wireless Ethernet speeds (11M/54M/300M/1.69G).

    37. Re:Started out impressive by hedwards · · Score: 1

      Have you tried browsing with dial up lately? Even with the poor quality connection I had last year, which was substantially better than dial up, the whole process just crawled. Companies target the broadband that's commonly in use, so slow connections will suffer.

    38. Re:Started out impressive by AF_Cheddar_Head · · Score: 1

      Isn't it about time to migrate to ethernet?

    39. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it'll get you almost 50 mbps/7.5 mbps in Boston.

    40. Re:Started out impressive by fonos · · Score: 1

      Gasoline is one of the only goods in America that has sales tax factored into the sticker price.

    41. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There is no sales tax on gasoline, it's included in the price. Same goes for cigarettes, meat & poultry, produce, and some other things.

      Remind me again, what backwards country did you say you lived in?

    42. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes it is a marketing ploy, it is just an old marketing ploy.

    43. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Don't know about him, but I live in a country where 100/8 mbps internet costs 16 eur, and ALL taxes are included in a sticker price (and no city has ever gone bankrupt, and it's still a big deal if a soldier dies overseas, and I could go on and on...).

    44. Re:Started out impressive by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      I'm actually kind of surprised RAM manufacturers have not jumped on this bandwagon yet and started selling 9GB DIMMs.

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    45. Re: Started out impressive by davester666 · · Score: 1

      So the officer can follow it back to your home after the arrow kills the pervert watching your home from the woods.

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    46. Re: Started out impressive by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      So the officer can follow it back to your home after the arrow kills the pervert watching your home from the woods.

      No worries. The perverts are now working for the alphabet soup agencies and they're watching you from the comfort of an office chair. Or working the TSA lineup.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    47. Re:Started out impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL
      From what I read the impetus was converting an ag college into an oasis for nerds.

  3. That's socialism by Hatta · · Score: 0, Troll

    Whargarbl!

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    Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    1. Re:That's socialism by i+kan+reed · · Score: 1

      On the other hand, it is socialism. Using the government to do something for the greater good of society.

    2. Re:That's socialism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is it? I can't tell if it's owned by the government or owned by the individual members of the community. (Yes, there IS a difference.)

    3. Re:That's socialism by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      No, it's politicians grandstanding buying things private industry has spent a trillion dollars developing. Without the latter, the former has trouble bringing you a loaf of bread.

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    4. Re:That's socialism by h4rr4r · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Are you really this dumb?
      Do you know what started this whole internet thing?

      Nothing is stopping private companies from doing this, yet none of them do. Here in America #1 corporatist funtime land we can't get 1Gb connections for $570 let along $57.

    5. Re:That's socialism by i+kan+reed · · Score: 1

      Who cares who owns it(well I'm sure the people of the town do), that's a distinction that drives the line between communism and other systems. Socialism is defined by the character of trying to maximize the social good of government, regardless of the common conflation between socialism and communism.

    6. Re:That's socialism by i+kan+reed · · Score: 1

      Tell me again how private institutions invented the Internet of all things. I'm pretty sure that that is one very clear example of something that was developed by government research.

    7. Re:That's socialism by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 2, Informative

      Socialism is defined by the character of trying to maximize the social good of government, regardless of the common conflation between socialism and communism.

      Baloney. Socialism is government ownership of the means of production. Period. Sometimes that works well. Sometimes it turns out bad. But to say it is "socialism" only when it turns out well, is nonsense.

    8. Re:That's socialism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      The whole point of a government, and by definition its job.

      Unfortunately, no American knows that anymore, because corporations told him government must be evil, because government "regulates the free market", which is another way of saying "forbids said corporations to abuse the citizens like the only law is that of the jungle". When in reality, US government IS said corporations, and the only reason anything is ever "regulated" at all, is because corporations fight each other, using the government as their weapon, so they can blame everything they do on it.

      If America needs one thing, then it's an *actual* government. By the people, for the people.

      But hey, I never got how US society managed to equal being social to being evil anyway... Being social is half the damn reason we humans are so successful in the first place! It's kinda our thing.

    9. Re:That's socialism by dimeglio · · Score: 2

      Agreed. The Internet is a DARPA baby. I would say that corporations interests is what's preventing the Internet from progressing faster.

      --
      Views expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the author.
    10. Re:That's socialism by Kjella · · Score: 1

      No, it's politicians grandstanding buying things private industry has spent a trillion dollars developing. Without the latter, the former has trouble bringing you a loaf of bread.

      Said over the Internet, brought to you by the US government (Internet -> ARPANET -> Department of Defense -> US government). Which is rather beside the point anyway, unless you're still fighting the ghost of early 1900s Soviet-era socialism what it means in a modern context is the government collecting taxes to provide public services which they may or may not be buying from private companies. There's no contradiction between a public road or a public hospital or a public whatever being built by private companies. But sure, give all the credit for everything to private companies. Let me guess, libertar... I mean libertarian?

      --
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    11. Re:That's socialism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ironic isnt it it the demands of the free market lead to a socialist solution.

      Seems they believe in the if you build it they will come school of economics as opposed to if if you subsidise us we might build it. Damn Unamerican if you ask me.

    12. Re:That's socialism by Baloroth · · Score: 2, Informative

      Nothing is stopping private companies from doing this, yet none of them do.

      False.

      --
      "None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
    13. Re:That's socialism by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      So 1 company does it in a couple towns, for more than $57 but less than $570 and you think that proves something?

    14. Re:That's socialism by CanHasDIY · · Score: 1

      Is it? I can't tell if it's owned by the government or owned by the individual members of the community. (Yes, there IS a difference.)

      Yea, but supposedly it's a government of, by, and for the People, so theoretically they're the same thing here in 'Merica.

      Theoretically.

      --
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    15. Re:That's socialism by i+kan+reed · · Score: 2

      Rather than have an extended debate over an what amounted to an aside, I'll just concede the point and withdraw my original statement.

    16. Re:That's socialism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      Socialism is government ownership of the means of production.

      No, you're thinking of communism. And yes, there is a difference, despite their constant interchangeable use in conservative talking points.

      Also, neither one is fascism.

    17. Re:That's socialism by ethanms · · Score: 1

      It's probably worth pointing out at this juncture that one of the things that spurs competition, growth and new technology is the fact that stuff is sold for a profit--sometimes a really huge one.

      There would be far less drive to push further and further if it were not for the profit carrot being dangled... if everyone were buying from a municipal ISP for just about break-even costs, we might end up stagnating.

    18. Re:That's socialism by ethanms · · Score: 1

      Too much government control is bad.

      Too much corporate control is bad.

      Now let's sprinkle in corporate control of government through lobbying dollars and astronomical consultancy fees for former government officials...

      People suck.

    19. Re:That's socialism by Dishevel · · Score: 1

      The ;really good thing about the ay the country was originally designed was that it allowed for exactly this type of thing. While the federal government had very little to do with a persons life the State and the Local Community were able to much more. They had the ability do do many things. While the federal government guaranteed the right of the people to move freely to or away from these types of experiments. Competition between States was a good thing.

      --
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    20. Re:That's socialism by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1, Offtopic

      Socialism is government ownership of the means of production.

      No, you're thinking of communism.

      No I am not. Socialism is an economic system. Totalitarianism is a political system. Combine the two, and you get totalitarian socialism, which is communism. Just like fascism is totalitarian capitalism, as clearly stated by the founder of Fascism, Benito Mussolini: "Fascism ... is the merger of state and corporate power."

    21. Re:That's socialism by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      So explain that 1Gb connection they can get.
      Not everyone has those same motivations. I work harder at a job that pays less than I could get elsewhere. Here I don't have politics to worry about and can curse like a sailor. I set my own hours and can work from home when I want. I have a lot of freedom in all aspects of my job. To me that is worth a lot more than money.

    22. Re:That's socialism by Dishevel · · Score: 1

      Government invented the internet. Private companies made it useful.

      --
      Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
    23. Re:That's socialism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Give up boy. You lost. Now you just sound like a brat pitching a fit. QQ.

    24. Re:That's socialism by Dishevel · · Score: 2

      Small scale Socialism is really good. (Individual chruches, Community) Large scale Socialism is really bad. (Federal / State Governments, THE CHURCH)

      --
      Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
    25. Re:That's socialism by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      Go away troll.

      He found one company doing something outside their normal scope. This is like saying toothpaste is free because the dentist gives you a little bit at each visit.

    26. Re:That's socialism by fred911 · · Score: 1

      Boy.. you must be new here. Everyone knows is was invented by Algore.

      --
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    27. Re:That's socialism by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 2

      Is it? I can't tell if it's owned by the government or owned by the individual members of the community. (Yes, there IS a difference.)

      Yea, but supposedly it's a government of, by, and for the People, so theoretically they're the same thing here in 'Merica.

      Theoretically.

      ...except that this small town is in Canada, not the US of A.

    28. Re:That's socialism by sjames · · Score: 1

      However, were this a town in the U.S. one of the telcos (or all of them) would sue repeatedly for unfair competition until the service cost $5700/customer (to account for legal fees) and then when it shut down would tell the residents not to worry, they expected to set up a 1Mbps network there within the next 30 years and meanwhile, enjoy their $9.99/month 28k dial-up.

      For some reason either the state legislature, the courts, or both would buy that argument.

    29. Re:That's socialism by sjames · · Score: 1

      COOL! Send me $500/month , for progress!

      Unlike the telcos, I have no history of pocketing the money and running, so while you don't know me at all I am already a step up.

    30. Re:That's socialism by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 2

      The ;really good thing about the ay the country was originally designed was that it allowed for exactly this type of thing.
      While the federal government had very little to do with a persons life the State and the Local Community were able to much more.
      They had the ability do do many things. While the federal government guaranteed the right of the people to move freely to or away from these types of experiments.

      Competition between States was a good thing.

      Um, the towns that have tried to do this in the US have often fallen victim to lawsuits from private companies due to "unfair competition".

      But that doesn't matter, because this town's not in the US. It's true that the way the country was originally designed allowed for exactly this type of thing. It also allows for Crown Corporations, where the people by default own stock in the incorporated entity. This leads to the public actually getting dividends and rebates when a crown corp turns a profit. It's somewhat surprising that this is in Alberta though, where privatization is a big thing, and I'd expect more American-style lawsuits regarding unfair competition.

    31. Re:That's socialism by DontBlameCanada · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I disagree.

      My university was one of the first to get plugged into the Arpanet when it started expanding. Back then, my questions posted to the bulletin boards at the time were answered truthfully and frequently accurately. Information was accessible, there wasn't alot back then, but it could be obtained. Ftping the index.txt from a site would provide a carefully hand maintained index of what was available with a description and other relevant data.

      Now if you look for something like, "nearest gas station", you'll instead get bombarded with ads for cars, motor oil, car wash products etc while waiting for Google to start delivering the search results while they update their database of search terms you're interested in.

      I'd like the old, non-privatized internet back, thanks.

    32. Re:That's socialism by Baloroth · · Score: 1

      Do I need to quote you again?

      Nothing is stopping private companies from doing this, yet none of them do.

      I may be being pedantic, but you were being hyperbolic, and only one of those things is actually wrong. Besides, they're not even the only company (or, for that matter, municipality) offering 1Gbps Internet in the US (costs vary, some are as low as $35, most much higher). I'll leave the Googling up to you.

      --
      "None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
    33. Re:That's socialism by sjames · · Score: 1

      And then got trampled into the ground by large companies that do their best not to let it get more useful.

      Perhaps the ball is back in government's court to push it to the next step.

      Then we can let private companies have their turn.

    34. Re:That's socialism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ditto with democracy by the way...

      I thought about this... a lot. And in fact, large scale *everything* is rather bad for us humans.
      We are social animals. But the bigger a community gets, the more anonymous it gets. And that means people become more anti-social. Think about governments, big companies, big wars, big organizations of any kind, and at the top: the Internet.
      If everybody of us would have to look each other in the eyes, and risk being punched in the face or even expelled, like in a tribal village, do you think they would behave like that?
      No.

      We need that, to keep a working harmony.

      Unfortunately, tribal villages won't ever get to the moon. And if you know people from small towns, you know how they hate that accountability. You aren't anonymous anymore. Everybody knows everything about each other. It's not easy actually getting along, even in that small groups.

      So... I don't know how to solve this right now. I only know that we need to.

    35. Re:That's socialism by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      You are right I should have figured this would happen on slashdot. I should have set the constraints better.

      Now find one in a major market or available in a not extremely limited area for that kind of money.

    36. Re:That's socialism by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      Government invented the internet.
      Private companies made it useful.

      Odd... I was happily using the Internet before private companies were allowed on it. Seemed quite useful to me for transferring files, allowing ease of access to information (yay Gopher/FTP/Archie/Veronica/Jughead/elm/nn/telnet)! and even selling my own stuff and doing remote work (yes, some of us could telecommute 20+ years ago).

      The majority of what privatization has brought to the internet is a) entertainment and b) spam and malware. Everything else could probably be done just about as well without being connected to the Internet -- even without TCP/IP.

      For that matter, CableNet really is an entertainment network that has a peering arrangement with the Internet already.

    37. Re:That's socialism by CanHasDIY · · Score: 2

      Is it? I can't tell if it's owned by the government or owned by the individual members of the community. (Yes, there IS a difference.)

      Yea, but supposedly it's a government of, by, and for the People, so theoretically they're the same thing here in 'Merica.

      Theoretically.

      ...except that this small town is in Canada, not the US of A.

      What, you mean we haven't annexed that territory yet? Shit, no wonder maple syrup is still so damn expensive...

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    38. Re:That's socialism by icebike · · Score: 1

      However, were this a town in the U.S. one of the telcos (or all of them) would sue repeatedly for unfair competition

      Not so sure that would happen.

      There are a lot of cities and towns putting up free wifi networks in certain areas, simply because the have the ability to do so.
      (I live in such a town, where the Public Utility District has fiber to spare and is putting up free wifi).
      So far, no lawsuits. even though the fiber and the bandwidth to support it are all paid by tax dollars.

      There have been court cases that have selected this issue, and municipalities and county government is free to do this.

      Inevitably, free wifi will re-prove the tragedy of the commons as over use will force the governmental unit to drastic bandwidth limitations simply because they have to pay the upstream backbone networks.

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    39. Re:That's socialism by icebike · · Score: 1

      Google isn't the only company doing this in the US.

      Its just that we don't want to do your homework for you.

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    40. Re:That's socialism by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      It ain't homework.

      I know you can get it, in some very limited areas. It simply is not a real option for the vast majority of people, even ones living in very high density locations. Having the government roll it out will for quite some time be the only real option if we cared.

    41. Re:That's socialism by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      Small scale Socialism is really good. (Individual chruches, Community)
      Large scale Socialism is really bad. (Federal / State Governments, THE CHURCH)

      The majority of the developed world with successful socialist government would like to know why large scale socialism is really bad... sure, it gets abused, but so does capitalist government. There's nothing wrong with being social, as long as those being governed actually keep social ties to those governing. As soon as you build up a layer of bureaucracy between the two, the problems start. Bureaucracy is not socialism though.

    42. Re:That's socialism by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      ironic isnt it it the demands of the free market lead to a socialist solution.

      Seems they believe in the if you build it they will come school of economics as opposed to if if you subsidise us we might build it. Damn Unamerican if you ask me.

      Yeah; the town's in Alberta, Canada.

    43. Re:That's socialism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Socialism also has something to say about the question who runs the government, so it's "govt ownership of the means of production" under a very specific interpretation of what a government can do, how much power it has vis-à-vis its constituency, etc..

    44. Re:That's socialism by Hatta · · Score: 1

      That observation is as old as Marx. The Communist Manifesto states that "the bourgeoisie forged the weapons that bring death to itself".

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    45. Re:That's socialism by sjames · · Score: 1

      It has happened repeatedly. In some cases the telcos just cozied up to state legislatures to get bills passed banning municipal networks.

      See what happens if your town decides to start providing regular residential internet service to go with that free WiFi.

    46. Re:That's socialism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're both wrong. Google is the government.

    47. Re:That's socialism by Dishevel · · Score: 2

      Then you do not know how to internet.

      --
      Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
    48. Re:That's socialism by Dishevel · · Score: 1

      The main problem with the internet now is large corporations Using the power of the government to destroy competition and freeze the market.

      --
      Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
    49. Re:That's socialism by sjames · · Score: 1

      Some are doing that at the state level, but in general they are using economic power and back room deals to do their dirty work.

    50. Re:That's socialism by Dishevel · · Score: 1

      I am not sure how you think Large Scale Socialism would work without a massive bureaucracy.

      --
      Why is it so hard to only have politicians for a few years, then have them go away?
    51. Re:That's socialism by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Learn thew difference between socialism and social ownership.

      Hint, this isn't socialism.
      I know its' tough. You would have to go all the way down to the monks, and have them transcribe you a dictionary of terms which could take years. If only all the information was connected together some how..

      or, If only people would actually look up what they are talking about before post, Even better, if people would question themselves about the things they repeat and occasionally look them up to be sure they haven't become mistaken.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    52. Re:That's socialism by geekoid · · Score: 0

      All evidence regard infrastructure proves that statement false.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    53. Re:That's socialism by geekoid · · Score: 0

      false. The VAST majority of private companies glomed onto it when they saw they could make money. They have been trying to slow its development, and limit it's use every since.

      I was using the internet just fine well before large private companies got involved.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    54. Re:That's socialism by geekoid · · Score: 0

      Stop confusing socialism with social ownership.

      Large scale Socialism works pretty damn well, actually. Especially for basic needs and infrastructure.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    55. Re:That's socialism by nmos · · Score: 1

      Go read the article. That $57/mo is only a small fraction of the total cost of the system.

    56. Re:That's socialism by bogjobber · · Score: 1

      I agree with your point, but I would just like to point out that socalism means *collective* ownership of the means of production. This may or may not be facilitated the government. Example of extra-governmental socialism in the US would be cooperatives (consumer co-ops like credit unions/grocery stores as well as worker co-ops).

    57. Re:That's socialism by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 1

      Socialism is an economic system

      How do you implement socialism without an enforcing political system? There are three known means of regulating a population: government, religion, and markets. Those can operate independently or in combination.

      Totalitarianism is a political system

      That's a feature of a political system.

      Combine the two, and you get totalitarian socialism, which is communism

      No, communism is a bunch of people living on an farm sharing everything. The totalitarian socialists in the USSR called themselves communists, to try to fool [whomever].

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
    58. Re:That's socialism by mattack2 · · Score: 1

      Though AFAIK, "Google Fiber" has only been them buying out companies that already existed, not laying new fiber.

  4. Gigabyte Network? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I didn't know the motherboard manufacturer makes NIC cards. That is certainly news to me.

    Oh you mean Gigabit network. -.-"

    1. Re:Gigabyte Network? by thaylin · · Score: 1

      Well how else do you get a network interface built onto a motherboard, duh.

      --
      When you cant win, ad hominem.
  5. the Alberta Supernet by fustakrakich · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Canada.. figures.... Do that in the states and get sued into bankruptcy.

    --
    “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    1. Re:the Alberta Supernet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      victory is ours again

    2. Re:the Alberta Supernet by firex726 · · Score: 2

      Actually you don't even need to get sued; the big ISPs in some states have lobbied for laws that disallow municipal internet after one town successfully set up a network, because I think Comcast basically refused to provide them adequate service.

    3. Re:the Alberta Supernet by thaylin · · Score: 4, Informative
      --
      When you cant win, ad hominem.
    4. Re:the Alberta Supernet by GoodNewsJimDotCom · · Score: 1

      This is an example of both oligopoly collaboration for inflated prices and corporations regulating the government instead of governments regulating the corporations. The collaboration for higher prices is with all the telecoms being buddy buddy and not even encroaching on each other territories as a general working premise. You don't see UPS and Fedex trying to sue away the post office because it unfairly competes. Comcast/Verizon just know they're getting away with higher prices for less service than you can get in other places. Afterall it costs money to upgrade your service, and their users are gonna pay them anyway whether they get 3mb/s or 1000 mb/s. Keeping legitimate competitors out of the picture who didn't get the memo,"Low quality service for high prices" further perpetuates the myth that you can't do anything better than what they're doing now.

    5. Re:the Alberta Supernet by Deflagro · · Score: 1

      That's such a gross display of corporatism.. crazy. How can companies basically make laws to benefit big business and no one has a problem with it? I'm sure the government is just looking out for the people.

      This country seriously needs a reboot. The corruption is so blatant and the apathy is even worse.

      --
      Der Tod ist der einzige Weg hier raus!
    6. Re:the Alberta Supernet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This country seriously needs a reboot. The corruption is so blatant and the apathy is even worse.

      Yes it does. But why doesn't it happen? Because people think that voting someone else (Democrat or Republican) into the Government will fix everything and then sit back and forget about it while watching Glee or whatever is being fed to them. The consumers are voting these people in "for the people", right?

      People don't care enough and gladly pay because they frankly think it what it really cost and can't be any cheaper. Basically the media tells them nothing else, so they stay uneducated and will never learn. Not like they all stop by /. or such sites.

    7. Re:the Alberta Supernet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This country seriously needs a reboot....

      You know what was great about the states? You didn't have to pee in the house, into a bucket that you would dump into the street. No, you had plenty of space outside.

    8. Re:the Alberta Supernet by GodfatherofSoul · · Score: 1

      Why bother with a lawsuit when you can dump a few hundred thousand in the right campaign coffers? Local politicians come very cheap.

      --
      I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
    9. Re:the Alberta Supernet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's why...we can't have nice things.

    10. Re:the Alberta Supernet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In Tennessee, they did both, to try to stop the Electric Power Board of Chattanooga. They couldn't STOP them from doing it, but they could stop anybody else.

      Now Comcast is forced to advertise against EPB, and convince us that EPB sucks.

      Yeah, right.

      Fucktards.

    11. Re:the Alberta Supernet by catprog · · Score: 1

      Apparently UPS and Fedex actually use the post office to deliver some of the mail.

      --
      My Transformation Website
      Kindle Books http://www.catprog.org/rev
      Interactive CYOA http://www.catprog.org/st
  6. City not named in Summary by decipher_saint · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Olds, Alberta
    (Population eight thousand)

    Getting high speed internet in Alberta anywhere outside a larger population centre has been virtually impossible, so it's interesting to see rural towns take the problem by the horns on their own with success.

    --
    crazy dynamite monkey
    1. Re:City not named in Summary by dimeglio · · Score: 1

      There were delays in laying out the fibre but once they were shown all the pr0n they could get with 1gb, it motivated those workers to get it done quickly.

      --
      Views expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the author.
  7. Gigabit? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Gigabyte divided by 8. Not the same thing.

    1. Re:Gigabit? by v1 · · Score: 1

      Gigabyte divided by 8. Not the same thing.

      Though for practical purposes, I find dividing by 9 tends to give more realistic numbers.

      --
      I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    2. Re:Gigabit? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Network or most serial PHY interfaces (e.g. Ethernet, Firewire, USB, I2C) are always specified with bit as the base units as the PHY level only worry the raw '0' or '1' and not payloads..

    3. Re:Gigabit? by RabidReindeer · · Score: 1

      Network or most serial PHY interfaces (e.g. Ethernet, Firewire, USB, I2C) are always specified with bit as the base units as the PHY level only worry the raw '0' or '1' and not payloads..

      That's because the actual bitstream isn't really in data bytes. There can be all sorts of odd control bits and groups thereof tacked on. If you want an old-time horse-and-buggy example. remember that ASCII was originally a 7-bit code. The 8th bit was for use by hardware as a parity bit. And TTY devices often also had start and stop bits. Sometimes even 2 stop bits. So a "byte" over a modem could potentially be 11 bits long, and that's before the modem itself contributed anything.

  8. never happen in the states by Revek · · Score: 1

    Its been attempted but usually fails due to local corporate citizens derailing it as some kind of communist love fest.

    1. Re:never happen in the states by smooth+wombat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      No, it's because the three major providers in the U.S. sue the municipality for trying to offer what the provider refuses to do, and at a similar if not lower price. The companies claim they can't compete against the government entity.

      It's like the batshit crazy ex who doesn't want to be with you but also doesn't want anyone else being with you.

      Either way, you're screwed.

      --
      We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
    2. Re:never happen in the states by h4rr4r · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I thought government was inefficient and can't do anything right? How would a super efficient private company ever have trouble competing?

      These folks need to get their stories straight.

    3. Re:never happen in the states by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Either way, you're screwed.

      Or not.

    4. Re:never happen in the states by smooth+wombat · · Score: 2

      That's always my question every time some company royally screws up. Like the plant in Texas which blew up because they lied about how much explosive stuff they had on hand or in my local area, a paving company has to go back and redo some work they did because the work wasn't up to snuff.

      Every time a company screws up I say something to this effect on my local board because some guy always whines about the government screwing up and how private industry is always better.

      It's like the people who espouse "Free Markets!" yet cheered when the taxpayer was forced to pick up the tab for the sins of the financial industry. Either you believe in free markets and letting them do what they do with as little government intervention as possible, or you want the government to be there to clean up after your mess and thwart the free market through trading collars and other rules.

      --
      We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
    5. Re:never happen in the states by Njoyda+Sauce · · Score: 1

      It's like the batshit crazy ex who doesn't want to be with you but also doesn't want anyone else being with you.

      Either way, you're screwed.

      It would seem that the individual involved here in your example would not be screwed - at all.

      --

      You can only be young once, but you can be immature forever.
    6. Re:never happen in the states by thaylin · · Score: 1

      Higher level government is inefficient, and cant do anything right, local government on the other hand can be either.

      --
      When you cant win, ad hominem.
    7. Re:never happen in the states by h4rr4r · · Score: 2

      You could say the same thing about private enterprises. The bigger an organization gets, no matter government or business the less efficient it will tend to be. In my job I do a lot of "integration" with big companies, to facilitate passing data back and forth. Our timelines for these things are hours to days, depending on if they want to use our prepared systems or need more custom work. Their time lines are months to years. We also chronically find they are doing a worse job of security than we are.

    8. Re:never happen in the states by Kjella · · Score: 1

      Oh, oh I know the answer to this one. What the private companies are (or rather aren't) offering is the best anyone can do under normal, fair market conditions. So if the government can do it, it's because the government is awarding it indirect subsidies and siphoning off costs to be paid with taxpayer money in some unamerican commie conspiracy to destroy private enterprise and replace it with a protectionist government monopoly. Honestly, for some it's so deeply rooted in them that if the government appears to be doing anything at all better than private companies then they must be cheating somehow.

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    9. Re:never happen in the states by JesseMcDonald · · Score: 1

      The companies claim they can't compete against the government entity.

      This is an issue if the municipal system is subsidized with taxes, or funded through tax-backed municipal bonds, or receives special access to municipal right-of-ways, or any number of other things normal companies don't have access to. The municipality can easily undercut the competition because they don't have to pay for right-of-ways and, if all else fails, they can force people to pay for their service whether they want it or not. It's the same reason you don't see many private roads; given two otherwise equal roads, one private (toll) and the other public (tax-funded), no one is going to choose the toll road when they have to pay the taxes for the public one anyway, even if the tolls are ultimately less expensive.

      Note that I'm not arguing against community-provided Internet access, just the government aspects. If the service was provided by a local co-op with no special ties to the municipal government, competing on equal terms, the company would have no cause for complaint.

      --
      "The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat
    10. Re:never happen in the states by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, it's because it's illegal for government to compete with private enterprise engaged in a for-profit venture.

    11. Re:never happen in the states by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      'This is an issue if the municipal system is subsidized with taxes' all the corporations are as well via the infrastructure the government provides society.

      fair enough lets make the corporations pay to educate the wage slaves they need.

    12. Re:never happen in the states by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Think you meant either way you're no screwed

    13. Re:never happen in the states by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Like the plant in Texas which blew up because they lied about how much explosive stuff they had on hand

      Either you phrased that sentence really badly, or the act of lying is capable of magically igniting explosives.

    14. Re:never happen in the states by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Kind of like police? I to think we should privatize our judicial system. Think of all of the money that can be made!

    15. Re:never happen in the states by mdielmann · · Score: 1

      The companies claim they can't compete against the government entity.

      This is an issue if the municipal system is subsidized with taxes, or funded through tax-backed municipal bonds, or receives special access to municipal right-of-ways, or any number of other things normal companies don't have access to. The municipality can easily undercut the competition because they don't have to pay for right-of-ways and, if all else fails, they can force people to pay for their service whether they want it or not. It's the same reason you don't see many private roads; given two otherwise equal roads, one private (toll) and the other public (tax-funded), no one is going to choose the toll road when they have to pay the taxes for the public one anyway, even if the tolls are ultimately less expensive.

      Note that I'm not arguing against community-provided Internet access, just the government aspects. If the service was provided by a local co-op with no special ties to the municipal government, competing on equal terms, the company would have no cause for complaint.

      As the anonymous poster said below, but I'll expand upon. The U.S government paid billions in subsidies to get broadband up and running, and then when they don't do it and a town or city decides to roll their own (after the broadband companies say they have no plan to roll it out soon, nor do they have a timeline for when it will be done) the company sues for unfair competition. Personally, I'd ask them how they plan to compete in a market they don't service, nor have even tentative plans of servicing.

      This is beside all the tax breaks, sweetheart contracts, forgivable loans, and bailouts (yep, being rewarded for screwing up!) which these companies get while cities literally go bankrupt with no word of any help from the federal government.

      In short, the competing with government on equal terms sailed decades ago. Maybe it's time to either cut off the gravy or laugh in their faces when they whine about having to compete with the government.

      --
      Sure I'm paranoid, but am I paranoid enough?
    16. Re:never happen in the states by sjames · · Score: 1

      To be fair, if the government stayed entirely out of it, the telcos would be left to negotiate right of way with each individual property owner. They generally are happy to accept the government's help resolving that for them.

    17. Re:never happen in the states by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 2

      It's like the batshit crazy ex who doesn't want to be with you but also doesn't want anyone else being with you.

      Either way, you're screwed.

      I thought the opposite was the problem...?

    18. Re:never happen in the states by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      I thought government was inefficient and can't do anything right? How would a super efficient private company ever have trouble competing?

      These folks need to get their stories straight.

      The answer is simple: this town is Olds, Alberta, Canada. Using the US governmental system as a measuring stick is not very useful in this case.

    19. Re:never happen in the states by JesseMcDonald · · Score: 1

      That is entirely beside the point. An independent co-op would get the same opportunity to negotiate with the municipality for right-of-way. The problem is vertical integration with the organization controlling local law and taxes. A private company which has to convince each individual customer to subscribe cannot compete on equal terms with a municipal government which has the option of forcing people to subscribe (or to fund the operation without subscribing, through taxes).

      No one wants to sympathize with the telecoms, but they do have a very good point in this case.

      --
      "The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat
    20. Re:never happen in the states by JesseMcDonald · · Score: 1

      You make several very goods points in favor of eliminating subsidies favoring the telecom providers. I wholly agree. I'm just saying that the competition shouldn't get any special privileges either, even if that competition happens to be a cooperative community ISP.

      The U.S government paid billions in subsidies to get broadband up and running

      People keep saying this. Apparently the government really messed up, if they actually handed out that much money and yet can't seem to sue for breach of contract when the service isn't provided. I've heard conflicting versions of just what they were supposed to provide; it certainly wouldn't include modern multi-Mbps connections to every home. I would want to see the contract before making any accusations. In any case, this was all a very long time ago. It's time to move on.

      --
      "The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat
    21. Re:never happen in the states by sjames · · Score: 1

      I am not aware of any municipal internet that forced residents to subscribe. In every case I have seen, tax money was used to fund the build-out but the internet service was required to pay it back through revenues collected from willing subscribers (and have with interest).

      The most mystifying part though is how often the telcos cry foul over municipal internet after flatly refusing to move into the area. Effectively, they were given first refusal, did refuse and then got upset.

    22. Re:never happen in the states by mdielmann · · Score: 1

      And so I searched united states broadband subsidy in DDG, and this is the second link. My casual review notes somewhere between $7.2B and $11.7B in stimulus funding, paid since 2006, mentioned in the first three paragraphs, $4.5B of that announced in Nov. 2011. That would be one budget ago. Exactly how much more recently are you looking for? I'm sure if I look, I could find some slated for distribution in 2013, but I think the point is made. That particular trough is still open.

      --
      Sure I'm paranoid, but am I paranoid enough?
    23. Re:never happen in the states by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Businesses get sweetheart deals all the time from municipalities, giving them tax breaks, cheap/easy right of way, etc. Don't act like private industry doesn't go to the local muni government and get the exact same things.

    24. Re:never happen in the states by nmos · · Score: 1

      Let's see. This organization was able to get a sweatheart loan from the city, a grant from the province, and is able to use a government built network for their upstream. Keep in mind they've been working on this for 10 years and only have service available to 60% of the town's 8500 residents.

    25. Re:never happen in the states by manu0601 · · Score: 1

      The companies claim they can't compete against the government entity

      How cute. What happened to market invisible hand, which allocates resources in an optimal way?

    26. Re:never happen in the states by olip85 · · Score: 1

      It's like the batshit crazy ex who doesn't want to be with you but also doesn't want anyone else being with you.

      Either way, you're screwed.

      And not screwing.

    27. Re:never happen in the states by White+Flame · · Score: 1

      It's because there are multiple companies, but just 1 government. If a company does something bad, they screw up and people can go elsewhere (if there aren't monopolistic lock-ins that they try to legislate into existence). If the government does something bad, there's no other options. Consider that something will _always_ go bad somewhere, and it is better to have a more distributed set of options.

      The government is also _bound_ to do things inefficiently, because they are run under rule of law and voted policy; you can't have people using their own judgment and have the liability of just "making things happen" when they represent the people, their tax dollars, and varying interests. This policy-driven model is _good_ for certain things that must be handled with legislative care, but is always going to be more expensive than what private business _could_ offer, pretty much by definition, and again a central point of failure.

    28. Re:never happen in the states by mgcarley · · Score: 1

      Could a private entity feasibly set up a new network in the US, with the ruse being that it's set up - let's say "on behalf of" - a municipality (or at least with it's blessing), and offer the service for these sorts of prices without being sued in to the ground?

      So... basically the same as Google is doing (now that I think about it?)

      IMO the answer is basically a yes, but, the next question is "does that company need to have sufficiently deep pockets to do so"... because that's the stumbling block.

      The company itself would be for-profit and thus in direct competition with the big boys, so they'd then be private entity vs private entity rather than private entity vs government...

      Just throwing it out there.

      --
      Founder & COO, Hayai India (hayai.in) / USA (hayaibroadband.com) // t: @mgcarley
    29. Re:never happen in the states by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      So basically the same as any telco.
      They always get sweetheart loans, they get rights of way for free, and generally big tax breaks.

  9. 16 TV Theme Packages by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 2

    why can't we have something like that is usa?

    1. Re:16 TV Theme Packages by h4rr4r · · Score: 0

      Because the Tea party folks would go insane. That's socialisms! They don't want this or government in their medicare.

    2. Re:16 TV Theme Packages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      why can't we have something like that is usa?

      How dare you thinking in those socialist terms, high speed internet that is inexpensive !!! its a threat to society, how is NSA, CIA and FBI keep monitoring all of those bits, it will never happen.

    3. Re:16 TV Theme Packages by Jawnn · · Score: 1

      why can't we have something like that is usa?

      You can. So stop whining and buy some Congressmen. If the telco's can do it, B.F. KS can do it. Right?

    4. Re:16 TV Theme Packages by lazarith · · Score: 1

      Some people believe that property rights grant them the right to spend their money how they like. People have the right not to buy internet if they desire. But if enough people decide to infringe on those {god-granted|human} rights, they will be able to pass such a law in the USA.

    5. Re:16 TV Theme Packages by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      why can't we have something like that is usa?

      You can. So stop whining and buy some Congressmen. If the telco's can do it, B.F. KS can do it. Right?

      You just gave me a great idea: a Kickstarter project for buying congress/lobbyists. I wonder if it would work?

    6. Re:16 TV Theme Packages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      why can't we have something like that is usa?

      You can, but since building something as a community rather than doing it on an individual level is considered socialism you prefer to have bad internet, otherwise the commies will take over.

    7. Re:16 TV Theme Packages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can have McCarthyism and the Tea Party instead.

    8. Re:16 TV Theme Packages by servant · · Score: 1

      Chattanooga TN has gigabit fiber available to residences via city owned infrastructure. The price is a bit higher, but still not bad. $350/mo (362 with TV channels included). Still not bad if you have a $$$ need.

      --
      ... "When you pry the source from my cold dead hands."
    9. Re:16 TV Theme Packages by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

      weak HD lineup

  10. Sweden by Linux+User+95 · · Score: 1, Informative

    I live in Sweden and pay $5 per month for a gbit. It's partly sponsored by Microsoft's program for people with no hands, but still. Just saying.

    And because many other people here also have gbits, torrents work wonders. US probably isn't the same.

    1. Re:Sweden by ArcadeMan · · Score: 2, Funny

      People with no hands? Then what's the point of Internet access?

      Wink wink, nudge nudge, say no more!

    2. Re:Sweden by Linux+User+95 · · Score: 2

      We can still use computers with our mouth.

    3. Re:Sweden by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think he was asking how to use your COMPUTER's pointer ...

    4. Re:Sweden by thaylin · · Score: 1

      I guess the "Wink wink, nudge nudge, say no more!" was not obvious enough

      --
      When you cant win, ad hominem.
    5. Re:Sweden by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It was a joke. He was referring to porn and masturbating with your hands.

    6. Re:Sweden by aliquis · · Score: 1

      I don't really want to make fun out of that and your situation and I think his post really suck and was insulting and stupid.. And I'm a fellow swede.

      Anyway, what I really want to say is of course that some people likely even can get paid for having Internet access using their mouth.

      Which of course is totally off-topic and got nothing to do with the posts above.

      Of course there's things one can enjoy on the Internet even without any hands. And as you've shown reading and commenting on Slashdot and using Linux are some of them.

    7. Re:Sweden by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      When I go to Sweden, I go to see the loveli lakes!

    8. Re:Sweden by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They did indeed fail. They let asshats like you exist.

    9. Re:Sweden by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Internet...The Swedes do it with their mouth.

    10. Re:Sweden by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I see the shills have a new technique: Adopt a username that poses as a "Linux User" then post pro Microsoft stuff (as is seen in your profile history).

      While it's interesting, and I guess it gives you a job, it's not very effective.

      So... carry on. MS can afford its own 50 cent army it seems.

  11. $75 for 50Mbps right now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I want my fiber please.

  12. News From the Future... by Stormy+Dragon · · Score: 1

    Alberta Residents Complain About Internet Content Filtering Plan

    1. Re:News From the Future... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oddly enough you're more likely to have content filtered or throttled by American providers that have greased their way into the country.

      America or as I like to call it "China Jr"

    2. Re:News From the Future... by Stormy+Dragon · · Score: 1

      Not really. If I go to a public library, school, etc. there's all kinds of filters in place because busybody groups vote for laws requiring them "for the childrenz". There's no similar filters on the commercial ISP access I buy at home.

      The problem with making the government your ISP is that eventually pressure groups are going to begin using the political process to limit what you can and can't do on it.

    3. Re:News From the Future... by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      No, those exist because no one stood up to those idiots. The same busy bodies can do this to a private company as well. They try it all the damn time with TV.

    4. Re:News From the Future... by mvdwege · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Right, with a market solution you are at least sure of not filtering....Oh wait.

      Fucking libertards who always drag in their fairy-tales when this comes up. Move out of your Mom's basement into the real world, and until you do, shut up while the adults talk, OK?

      --
      "I know I will be modded down for this": where's the option '-1, Asking for it'?
    5. Re:News From the Future... by Stormy+Dragon · · Score: 1

      Yeah, and if you're upset tumblr did that you can go to flickr. Or photobucket. Or DeviantArt. Or imgur. Or...

      If the municipal ISP starts filtering, you're pretty much SOL.

    6. Re:News From the Future... by thaylin · · Score: 1

      Actually they exist because it makes sense to, it is a public places, In public places there is a very real need to filter some content. In the home that is a different story. As for private companies, I dont know about you but I know all the major ISPs do some type of filtering.

      --
      When you cant win, ad hominem.
    7. Re:News From the Future... by thaylin · · Score: 1

      Wait, huh? It would be the repubes who would argue with a market solution you are sure of not filtering, not the libtards.

      --
      When you cant win, ad hominem.
    8. Re:News From the Future... by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      I disagree. Public resources should not be filtered. If someone is touching himself in a library arrest him for it.

    9. Re:News From the Future... by sjames · · Score: 1

      Or you get a VPN.

    10. Re:News From the Future... by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      I disagree. Public resources should not be filtered.

      I like my potable water drinkable from the tap, thank you very much.

    11. Re:News From the Future... by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      Yeah, and if you're upset tumblr did that you can go to flickr. Or photobucket. Or DeviantArt. Or imgur. Or...

      If the municipal ISP starts filtering, you're pretty much SOL.

      Huh? If you're upset with the municipal ISP, you get an exemption and go with a private carrier, and hope that they're better (they likely will be, as the municipal ISP is the baseline). Kind of like the postal system vs couriers.

  13. Most Alberta internet is poo by maliqua · · Score: 1

    I wonder if they will notice a large population influx. /me calls his realtor

    1. Re:Most Alberta internet is poo by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      I wonder if they will notice a large population influx. /me calls his realtor

      I think this is the idea... they want to become a major Tech hub for Alberta. Not a bad investment, as long as the system scales well.

  14. From TFA.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    "Because we're a community-owned project we get to balance out profitability versus what's best for the community."

    I'm from America, so could someone please explain to me what that last part of the sentence means. Does it have to do with Q4 fiscal projections, or stocks, or something else? I just don't understand what this whole "community" thing is.

    1. Re:From TFA.. by thaylin · · Score: 1

      It means as a business you get to give as much in campaign contributions, since it is best for your community.

      --
      When you cant win, ad hominem.
    2. Re:From TFA.. by PPH · · Score: 1

      Its the basis of socialism: The needs of the collective over those of the individuals.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
    3. Re:From TFA.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Brilliant! That's all of the current USA captured in one single comment, folks!

  15. 57$ for gibabit internet? by ArcadeMan · · Score: 2

    I'd still rather pay 5.70$ for 100 megabits, which would still 20 times faster than my current connection at nearly 40$ per month. Gotta love monopolies in small towns.

    1. Re:57$ for gibabit internet? by neminem · · Score: 1

      It's about 20 times after than my current connection at 50 dollars a month, too (which, granted, also comes with a phone landline we didn't want, and aren't allowed to not pay for). Small town not required: I live in LA county, in one of the top 50 most populous cities in the US (though really, LA county is just one giant city anyway, certainly as far as laying cables would go.)

    2. Re:57$ for gibabit internet? by aliquis · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I have a hard time seeing any benefit with 1 gbps atm, and on average the bandwidth used/needed won't change much so it's not much to write about or charge for.

    3. Re:57$ for gibabit internet? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It is not the speed of the connection that costs you. It is the infrastructure debt that you pay for.

      1Gbps network is not 10x more expensive than 100Mbps network. It is probably about same cost these days. So you either pay $57 for Gbps, or you pay $40 for 1Mbps :P

    4. Re:57$ for gibabit internet? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The network construction costs almost certainly do not scale linearly like that. If they did, I'd probably take the 10Mbit for 57 cents a month -- would only be $10 per year, and that's if I tip well.

    5. Re:57$ for gibabit internet? by mgcarley · · Score: 1

      If you were paying for infrastructure separately, $5.70 might be feasible. Since you're not, you'd be more reasonable to expect something like $35.70 for 100mbits.

      --
      Founder & COO, Hayai India (hayai.in) / USA (hayaibroadband.com) // t: @mgcarley
  16. Lots of unused fiber by icebike · · Score: 5, Informative

    There are lots of towns in the US, big and small. that have un-used fiber laying around, which was installed the last time they ripped up their streets for remodel, or which was built into subdivisions as a conditions of their permitting process. Most of this is used to tie a few buildings public buildings together, or (an a sad number of cases) not used at all.

    There entire counties that have fiber running to every minor town. (Google county fiber network = 14 million hits).

    Most of these towns don't have fiber running everywhere. So turning it on ind the downtown core is often avoided simply because it will cause a clamor for fiber everywhere from the rest of the tax payers. Some of it has been in the ground so long nobody knows if it works or not. Since it wasn't being used, in some cities it has been damaged by construction and nobody was even aware of it. Some towns are putting up FREE PUBLIC WIFI, using their fiber. And almost as soon as it is turned on the "won't somebody think of the children" crowd shows up demanding censorship. There are a lot of political land mines to dodge when putting this stuff to use. So far too much of it sits idle.

    --
    Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
    1. Re:Lots of unused fiber by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is why we can't have nice things America.

      *A private concern won't put it in because of shareholders not wanting to pay for anything ever.
      *The local gov already paid for it but can't turn it on because the state gov screams "SOCIALISM!!1!" and shut it down right before GoLive on behest of private concern that didn't want to lose what little money they were getting from the townspeople
      *Small ISP can't implement it due to franchise laws and all the other tomfoolery due to contracts and right of way.
      *State and Feds don't care because they get their bandwidth paid for as part of their job and can get private lines ran to their homes. Also "SOCIALISM!!!!!".

      This leaves small town USA limping along on data lines that were obsolete in the late 80s.

      And this is why we can't have nice things.

    2. Re:Lots of unused fiber by icebike · · Score: 1

      Mostly I agree with you, but on one issue, you're just over the top wrong:

      *A private concern won't put it in because of shareholders not wanting to pay for anything ever.

      Shareholders and bond holders are people that have lent the company money EXACTLY for this type of thing, Infrastructure expansion. Railroad building. Pipeline building. Fiber network building. Building building.

      Shareholders seldom get a chance to turn down capital spending (other than choosing not to by the initial public offering).

      --
      Sig Battery depleted. Reverting to safe mode.
  17. PRIVITAZATION by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The boondoggle that keeps picking your pocket, on the premise that if more people are inserted as middle-men, the cost of service will go down.

    "Competition in the market" is true for goods produced through labour. It does not account for structural differences in the sale of services and delivery, or in extractive "rent seeking".

    --
    "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
    Never been known to fail..."
    1. Re:PRIVITAZATION by Lumpy · · Score: 0

      The better solution is that they raise the towns taxes to cover the costs completely. Then the town residents dont have ANY internet bill. This spreads it out and guarantees that everyone has internet access.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    2. Re:PRIVITAZATION by LordLimecat · · Score: 0

      The problem is that a government-owned ISP could easily end up sucking terribly 10 years down the road.

      I dont think theres a magic bullet to this solution, and im especially wary whenever anyone says "I found one, and its the government".

    3. Re:PRIVITAZATION by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This as opposed to what? As I understand the US broadband "market", it's mostly oligopolized, with pretty much all of the ISPs being shit, and without anyone being able to do much about it. Start-up costs are prohibitive, so no chance of meaningful competition coming down the road. So you've already got the "sucking terribly" option, only at much higher prices than at 'cost', because it's cost+rentierism (due to the ISPs being oligopolists).
      At least with a government offering the option that "sucks terribly" you have a chance of finding an ear; good luck going that route with a big ISP.

    4. Re:PRIVITAZATION by nmos · · Score: 1

      ALL products and services are ultimately produced through labor. The "low cost" in this case is largely due to the fact that they were able to get other people to pick up much of the cost rather than paying for it themselves.

    5. Re:PRIVITAZATION by nmos · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The lack of competition in the U.S. isn't due to startup costs, it's due to government granted monopolies. In most of the U.S. it's illegal for a second cable or phone company to come in and start laying lines even if they want to

    6. Re:PRIVITAZATION by nmos · · Score: 1

      They essentially did, the town "loaned" this non-profit $6 million to help with the costs and another $2.5 million was taken from the other citizens of Alberta who won't even get to use the network. They're also using a government network for their upstream so all in all the tax payer is responsible for the majority of the costs.

    7. Re:PRIVITAZATION by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 1

      I found one, and it's a co-op. Oh, look. Lets elect some people to do operations on our co-op, from among its members.

      --
      "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
      Never been known to fail..."
    8. Re:PRIVITAZATION by saleenS281 · · Score: 2

      There absolutely is a bulletproof solution. The government installs and maintains last-mile runs to the premises. They pull it back to a POP and allow ISPs to compete there. The barrier to entry drops precipitously, while allowing TRUE competition instead of the current competition on paper.

    9. Re:PRIVITAZATION by servant · · Score: 1

      It didn't used to be. But municipalities or other entities allow 'franchises' that pay a fee for the privilege of charging residents enhorbatent fees. When I was in college cable was about $7/mo from any of 3 local companies. 2 of which were allowed to serve every house in town. So if one ticked you off, the other was there and there was no connect fees/transfer fees/etc. Eventually the companies were all bought out and now all 'served' by one omnipotent and omnipresent cable provider. Of course they want a tenth of the income from every building served as their tithe for allowing limited access. (Significantly higher prices anyway)

      --
      ... "When you pry the source from my cold dead hands."
    10. Re:PRIVITAZATION by Gallomimia · · Score: 1

      I feel your argument is sound, and prediction is likely to come true. I refute that this is anything akin to a magic bullet solution, but agree that there isn't one in this problem. It is my opinion that this is a step in the right direction, and there will need to be many more steps taken in such a direction, with effort coming from as many places as possible. I say, why not let the government pay for some of those steps? As long as the government is spending public money on expanding internet access in a way that doesn't result in 100% of that money being spent on surveillance, (Canada has a nation-wide system for the censorship and surveillance of the expected things on all public education institutions) then it is a good thing. It sure beats public money being spent on oil and gas extraction, weapons of war and troops to use them, or diplomatic measures that deprive sick children of needed medicine.

      --
      Sadly, a Libertarian cannot force his views on another, and freedom cannot spread as does the cancer known as religion.
    11. Re:PRIVITAZATION by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So the people dont even get an internet bill? Why does the summary say they pay $45 a month?

    12. Re:PRIVITAZATION by nmos · · Score: 1

      No, but the monthly fees are ON TOP of all of the tax money that has been put into this thing. Consider that if this organiztion wants/needs to raise fees in the future the town will have to give in no matter what may be in their contract because otherwise they'll never get their $6 million back.

    13. Re:PRIVITAZATION by nobodie · · Score: 1

      Mod this up. There are many things that it makes sense to have the government do. Making a profit is not one of them, of course, but when it comes to important goods and services, maybe giving that responsibility should not be given to large corps who plan to make a profit, like, say... oh yeah, AT&T. They sucked buckets of cash out of us for long distance because the government was convinced they couldn't do it as well as AT&T, when it fact lots of government teleservices were better all over the world.

      The libertarian ideal of the corporatized service sector is, to keep it civil, very mistaken. Look around us, Americans, and see how we are being cheated on a scale that boggles the mind, for services big and small. From the "privitization" of the mail and the trains to education, the telesector and ISPs, we are getting the shaft.

      --
      Subversion of spatial scale luxury decoration ideas.
    14. Re:PRIVITAZATION by MA179 · · Score: 1

      My town has Comcast cable, RCN cable, Verizon DSL, and Verizon FIOS. The three companies all provide voice, Internet, and TV services. Both RCN and Verizon have their own copper for voice and offer VoIP through their data services. Comcast only does voice as VoIP. All of these are available throughout the town, this was a requirement when the town approved the installation of their copper/coax/fiber (except Verizon copper which pre-dated town control of the poles and buried services). But for some reason, despite the much higher level of competition having all these services should result in, pricing is identical to the local towns and cities that do not have this. And before someone says it, no they are not sharing the infrastructure. There are two sets of coax, two sets of copper, fiber for FIOS, and fiber interconnect for RCN's distributed nodes. RCN doesn't scramble their non-pay channels but still tells you you have to have a cable box for each TV, FIOS and Comcast do scramble. My point is, how can this not be price fixing. The coax goes back something like 15 years, the initial investment is long since paid for. When the town approved RCN to run their own cable they were told it would create competition with the existing Comcast cable TV service and Verizon phone service, reducing costs to town residents. Never happened.

    15. Re:PRIVITAZATION by nmos · · Score: 1

      That's pretty amazing, where is this (if you're comfortable saying)?

    16. Re:PRIVITAZATION by MA179 · · Score: 1

      It's in the Metro-west area of Massachusetts. We were also one of the initial trial sites for FIOS and still get the higher speed FIOS offering before most others. But frankly I'd prefer a lower price.

  18. Though the question will be backhaul by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 1

    Offering gigabit to endpoints isn't that hard. Gig Ethernet is cheap these days, GPON is likewise cheap for metro type situations. However, you can hook all the endpoints up at gig but if your backhaul to other providers isn't good, then it doesn't matter. You can have "gigabit" but only to other nodes on the network.

    So that'll be the real question is what kind of bandwidth they can buy to hook this network up to. That'll determine if it is really fast internet to homes and businesses or just a big LAN with slow 'net access.

    1. Re:Though the question will be backhaul by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They're hooked into the albertan supernet.
      http://www.servicealberta.gov.ab.ca/1561.cfm
      I'd like to know more about their infrastructure, but they don't seem to be the sharing type.

    2. Re:Though the question will be backhaul by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Case studies have shown that going from 10Mb to 1Gb typically results in only a 30% increase in average usage. Other studies have shown that bursty traffic is much easier for core infrastructure than a constant base-load. So moving to 1Gb may only require increasing your trunk speed by 30%-50%, while reducing congestion.

    3. Re:Though the question will be backhaul by sjames · · Score: 1

      They tied in to the Alberta Supernet.

      TFA doesn't give exact figures, but apparently the backhaul is adequate to make all customers quite happy including some that were going to leave the town if they couldn't get good connectivity.

      Although the net isn't complete yet, it's already up and running.

  19. big media companies won't sell that way by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The big media companies that actually make, and own, the TV programs, will only sell their cable channels in bundles.

    The Cable company primarily delivers product to the customer, provides maintenance, tech support of the infrastructure, and bills the customer. The cable companies would sell individual channels, but the media companies would let them.

    1. Re:big media companies won't sell that way by Em+Adespoton · · Score: 1

      The big media companies that actually make, and own, the TV programs, will only sell their cable channels in bundles.

      The Cable company primarily delivers product to the customer, provides maintenance, tech support of the infrastructure, and bills the customer. The cable companies would sell individual channels, but the media companies would let them.

      Is Time/Warner / Comcast / Cox a cable company or a media company?

      Don't get fooled by the shell companies... it's the same people making the decisions at the end of the day. They just use the shells to provide layers of protection against collusion and culpability.

      Government, on the other hand, doesn't shell well. If done right, the people responsible are actually held accountable.

  20. o-net? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    o-net?

    o-face.
    o-yeah!

  21. Ashland, OR by curunir · · Score: 3, Informative

    Ashland, Oregon did this many years ago. From what I've heard from people that live there, it's worked out well.

    --
    "Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos!"
    1. Re:Ashland, OR by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Their "premium" service is 20/5 with a bandwidth cap? Are you joking?

    2. Re:Ashland, OR by mgcarley · · Score: 1

      This seems to be an HFC network - they talk about connecting with DOCSIS 2.0 which is a bit old and crusty these days - and would explain why the speeds basically top out at 20mbit/s.

      --
      Founder & COO, Hayai India (hayai.in) / USA (hayaibroadband.com) // t: @mgcarley
  22. Fuck off Harrar! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When people like you make Harrar look like the jackass that they really and truly are, I give you mod points. Enjoy it. Keep up the good work and Harrar can go back under his bridge and masturbate with his tears.

  23. Hardly "on their own" by Phil+Urich · · Score: 1

    Getting high speed internet in Alberta anywhere outside a larger population centre has been virtually impossible, so it's interesting to see rural towns take the problem by the horns on their own with success.

    Considering this is only possible by them jacking into the (expensive, very slow to actually roll out, many years in the making) provincial government's Supernet project, I really don't think it's a case of "rural towns tak[ing] the problem by the horns on their own".

    --
    I remember sigs. Oh, a simpler time!
    1. Re:Hardly "on their own" by decipher_saint · · Score: 1

      Getting the link was the key yes, however this should serve as a model for other towns that want to get connected via Supernet.

      --
      crazy dynamite monkey
  24. Use the free market by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why should they filter? If you want filtering, pick one of the many free-market filtering tools from the competitive and totally-not-intrinsically-monopoly-prone software marketplace. The electric company doesn't care if you use your electricity to watch porn; this utility should work the same way.

  25. 19th century wants their corporations back by Tom · · Score: 2

    Surprise, people with a common interest banding together and pooling their resources to make it happen is a model that can actually work.

    Thinking about it, that's how corporations originally got started. You know, before they turned into immortal international government-corruption special interest lobby groups.

    --
    Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
  26. 1 Gbit downstream by citizenr · · Score: 1

    1Mbit upstream, and behind a nat. You know its gonna be like that.

    --
    Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
  27. cost $13 million to $14 million for 8,500 resident by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

    Just think how much more the build out costs will be for bigger citys.

  28. Re:cost $13 million to $14 million for 8,500 resid by Skapare · · Score: 1

    Like Detroit?

    --
    now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
  29. The collective is made up of individuals. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Therefore if you look after the collective, all the individuals are looked after.

    This is the same reasoning you've used to defend corporations as not being psychopathic evil monstrosities: corporations (a collective) is made up of humans (individuals).

    1. Re:The collective is made up of individuals. by PPH · · Score: 1

      used to defend corporations

      Probably the best example of the collective not looking after the individual you could find. Most of the corporate 'looking after' you refer to is mandated by legislation and runs counter to profit maximization motives. Henry Ford was labeled a socialist (among other things) by raising workers wages. But he was an outlier in this instance.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
  30. Even if they wanted to, it is expensive. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sorry, do you think that even if they had absolutely no need to consider licensing and paying for the disruption to property when digging up main street and your front lawn all the way to their POP, that it would be free or even just cheap?

    HELL NO.

    And then, unless you're making your own backbone, you have to connect to one of the big ISP backbone providers. Who will require cost plus profit off you. And if you're stealing "their" customers, only government intervention can make them sell access to you.

  31. $99/month by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'd pay that for gigabit Internet.
    I wonder if I can do this in Gardena ca. Probably not that town had a government facility going in so they took advantage