Ecuadorian Navy Rescues Bezos After Kidney Stone Attack

theodp writes "While vacationing aboard a cruise ship in the Galapagos Islands, where the State Department warns the quality of medical facilities and services are 'generally well below U.S. standards', Gawker reports that Jeff Bezos was rescued by the Ecuadorian Navy so he could receive treatment for a kidney stone attack on New Year's Day. The Ecuadorian Navy confirmed Bezos' rescue, which involved taking Bezos by Navy helicopter from Academy Bay in Santa Cruz Island to his private jet stationed on Baltra Island."

Comments

Wait What?

[Anonymous Coward]

I thought the US had the worst medical system in the world. Whats this? A Socialist country (actually half of the politicians in Ecuador are communists) has worse medical treatment? That just doesn't seem right. State run medical facilities are ALWAYS better, or so I was told by the NYT.

LOL. I love these stories where reality just smacks the left in the face.

Re:Wait What?

[ToddInSF]

Nobody of any consequence is interested in the tired "left" this "right" that blather. Begone. You've nothing to contribute here.

Re:Wait What?

[Anonymous Coward]

I thought the US had the worst medical system in the world. Whats this? A Socialist country (actually half of the politicians in Ecuador are communists) has worse medical treatment? That just doesn't seem right.

Generally speaking, the rule of thumb is, if you are looking for the best medical system for your population as a whole, it will look somewhat socialist. On the other hand, the US is well known to have one of the very best medical systems in the world -- if you have a lot of money. And then when you start talking about money, you start talking about medical insurance rather than medical skill or medical facilities, or the amount of money that doctors or drug manufacturers should earn for providing the care, and then suddenly we're talking politics and not where to find the right doctors.

Re:Wait What?

[hawguy]

I thought the US had the worst medical system in the world. Whats this? A Socialist country (actually half of the politicians in Ecuador are communists) has worse medical treatment? That just doesn't seem right. State run medical facilities are ALWAYS better, or so I was told by the NYT.

LOL. I love these stories where reality just smacks the left in the face.

Right, you'd think that an island chain with an immense population of 25,000 people would have top-rate medical care, it must be the politics that's getting in the way.

Re:Wait What?

[sjames]

If you're as rich as Bezos, health care in the U.S. isn't so bad. If you're poor, it is no better than what he was rescued from. You'll lie on the floor in your home in agony hoping the stone passes soon.

Re:Wait What?

[Anonymous Coward]

Social democracies have the best healthcare systems in the world.

Capitalist countries don't.

Commie countries don't.

Balance: it's what you begin striving for after your freshman year.

Re:Wait What?

[NoNonAlphaCharsHere]

It is the worst medical system in the world - for people who care what it costs. Statements like yours remind me of Mitt Romney's "What's the big deal? Borrow the money from your daddy and start a business!" comment - completely impervious to reality.

Re:Wait What?

[Joe_Dragon]

also talking about money in the us you can get X10-X100+ markup on costs as well.

Re:Wait What?

[ganjadude]

well to be fair, what is different in what he said, and what our government does? How much money do we borrow from china every year to keep our "business" going?

Re:Wait What?

[the_B0fh]

Are you really that stupid?

Re:Wait What?

[Anonymous Coward]

Alright, half-Ecuadorian half-European here. I've been to Ecuador often and visited their "state run medical facilities". I can tell you hospitals in the capital are pretty okay, all things considered (as in, "it looks passable to me": I have zero medical degrees but I do come from a rich Western country with good hospitals and clinics).

The Galapagos on the other hand, they're an archipelago of small islands, almost 1000 km off the coast, pretty rural and even the towns are quite small, so, yeah, wouldn't wanna catch something while there.

Another point: "worst medical system" does not imply "worst medical treatment", but my guess is you knew that and you're just trolling. The idea is of course that for the amount of money you guys are paying, you're getting way less than we are, and yes I'm factoring in my taxes.

(captcha: excrete)

Re:Wait What?

[Garridan]

Somewhere, some people are taking too much profit, I'm sure, just I don't know who they are, or how to find out who they are, and I don't know how to change the system without changing a big part of American society in the process.

Just about everybody, except for those in care of actually doing the medicine (doctors, nurses, technicians, pharmacists... and janitors, who really shouldn't do the medicine, but need to be paid more). It's a deep bureaucracy where middlemen abound. Insurance companies take a huge cut, execs get paid way too much. Some rockstar surgeons get paid a cool half million a year... and they deserve every penny of that. Hospital C*Os shouldn't make anywhere near that. But they control the budget... so that'll never happen.

This is why social health makes sense to people. All the money is getting distributed wrong. Sure, there will be more overhead and more tiers of hierarchy, but the higher levels of the bureaucracy are government jobs with relatively low pay. It seems like a mixed public/private system is best: let the rich spend their millions on shorter lines and more advanced care -- but if you need to pay to get healthy, the poor get sicker, hence poorer, and drain the economy.

Re:Wait What?

[Joe_Dragon]

In social australia doctors get paid about the same as they do in usa and over all costs are much lower and most people are covered (at a lower cost to them then people pay in the usa)

Re:Wait What?

[Anonymous Coward]

for the best medical system for your population as a whole

Medical needs occur individually. We do no show up at the clinic "as a whole" for a flu shot. Socialized medicine is the ecological fallacy writ large & tragic.

That is one of the few examples where your comment is completely false -- vaccines, after all, only work if a large percentage of the population gets them. Broken legs, okay, that's individual.

Still, I don't see what's wrong with socialized anything... it seems to me that people are still throwing around the world as code for communist, without saying what they actually mean. To start in the beginning, how about that Ron Paul debate question: poor person shows up at the ER, no insurance, is going to die -- you treat them for free, or let them die? The first one seems "socialist", and the second one seems inhumane.

Re:Wait What?

[rsilvergun]

Yeah, the next time I'm feeling under the weather I'm sure the US Navy will be happy to send a helicopter to pick me up, right?

Re:Wait What?

[Fieryphoenix]

Here's good place to start. DME providers for CPAP supplies. Work your way up from there.

Re:Wait What?

[Garridan]

I love that you spout this black-and-white thoughtless bullshit and then deride GP for a lack of "balance". Your worldview is utterly simple. I'm an american living in a social democracy (Canada). We've got this 'universal health care' thing. It mostly works. It's better than the US in that mcdonalds & walmart employees are all covered. But, quality of care leaves much to be desired.

A typical example. It took my wife 9 months to get a NMR after a concussion -- the conversation with the doc was surreal: "What complications would an NMR find?" "Well, the worst thing would be internal bleeding in the brain." "How bad is that?" "Well, it could kill you in a week." "Are there any warning signs to look out for?" " but other than that, no." "That sounds like an emergency, can't we get bumped up the line?" "No, the system does not view this an emergency."

I've spoken to probably a dozen people about this -- everybody has a similar story. Another example, my neighbor tore a ligament in his knee, waited 7 months before he could get it reattached. During that time, he picked up an addiction to pain killers and lost 70% of the muscle mass in the leg. And then once he got the surgery, paid a few grand out of pocket for physiotherapy.

We also have huge problems getting prescription drugs. We bargain with pharmaceutical companies for drugs... and Canada has a smaller population and less bargaining power than certain markets in the US. So we literally get edged out of the market on certain pharmaceuticals. It's increasingly common in some provinces to make 'conditional surgery appointments': they'll operate if they get the necessary drugs... otherwise you go back on the waitlist.

Re:Wait What?

[MichaelSmith]

Aussie here. Its weird how expensive things can be in the US. I know US people here in Melbourne who flew back to Aus for treatment because they didn't have medical insurance while on a visit to the US. Its also funny how the best serious treatment is in the public system here. The private system will get your nose job faster but on the spot life saving surgury will be in a public hospital.

Re:Wait What?

[MichaelSmith]

Market based systems don't work where there is a high barrier to entry. If absolutely any US person could become a health care provider (as they could become a food grower) then the current market based system would be much cheaper. As it is, the government regulates entry into the health services market, and the businesses in the market use that fact to take huge profits.

Re:Wait What?

[MichaelSmith]

I think Canada must be suffering from proximity to the US. Here in Australia I have never seen a wait of more than a week for an MRI and a head injury case would go in within a few hours.

Re:Wait What?

[ThatsMyNick]

If you are in the sea, the US coast guard would gladly do that. They will usually bill you for it, though it is likely covered by your insurance for medical evacuation.

Re:Wait What?

[Lamps]

You can say the cost is too much, but the doctors need to be paid, and their education is not cheap, so they should be paid well

Insurance companies have recently been getting creative in their attempts to keep costs down. Perhaps another thing they may want to consider is to subsidize the education of med school students who intend to start their own practices, with those individuals' practices then giving discounts/preferred treatment to the customers of the companies that subsidized them to the amount of some value exceeding the amount of financing that was provided by the insurance company (adjusted for inflation, taking into account the risk that not all med school students will start a successful practice, and so on).

Re:Wait What?

[smittyoneeach]

So you're saying "as a whole" = "a large percentage"? Yeah, maybe cancer would've been a better example.

Re:Wait What?

[sjames]

I'm pretty sure I understand that sitting at home hoping it goes away works about the same anywhere.

Re:Wait What?

[Garridan]

Who the hell criticized a doctor? The system is clogged; that's hardly the doctor's fault. You're off base: I was replying to the coward who claimed that social democracies are the best, and my entire point is that there are tradeoffs, that no system is perfect.

Re:Wait What?

[TC (WC)]

Neat, I'm also in Canada and when I had head trauma they observed me and because it looked at least somewhat risky I got a CT scan within a half hour of walking into the hospital. Then when I started showing additional symptoms and the CT was reviewed I got an MRI, also within a very short period of time. The bleed ended up stopping itself.

In the year after that I had another MRI because of some continuing symptoms, in that cases there wasn't an emergency so I had to wait a while, and that's fair enough. Yeah, it's possible something horrible had happened again, but it was unlikely.

While it's certainly possible that your exchange was some horrible problem with the medical system, it's more likely that this:

"That sounds like an emergency, can't we get bumped up the line?" "No, the system does not view this an emergency."

was the doctor telling you he didn't think it was critical enough to escalate. Yeah, there is a system in place, but if a doctor actually has a reason to push for something due to a possible emergency he can do it. If you've had a concussion and it's been a little while and you're not symptomatic it's pretty darn likely that you don't have a bleed. It's not standard practice to perform imaging unless there are certain indicators:

http://www.ohri.ca/emerg/cdr/docs/cdr_cthead_poster.pdf

Re:Wait What?

[Sique]

This is a fallacy. You don't have a high barrier of entry to become a health care provider. Train for becoming a nurse, it's not very expensive, and after that you can legally provide health care. That's one reason why nurses are not paid high wages. The market works here - not for the lowering of your costs, but against the people actually helping you to get healthy.

Doctors are constantly breaking the law by poisoning people, keeping them drugged, causing grievious bodily harm. The barrier of entry is not necessarily the governmental regulation itself, it's the fact, that doctors are allowed to do things no other is allowed to do -- because they supposedly know what they are doing. If you can prove that you can be trusted enough to be taken out of the normal course of law when it comes to keeping people in strict confinement, cutting them up, drug them until they fall unconcious, it might be ok. But if you can't show that you are know what you are doing, keep out!

Re:Wait What?

[Sique]

The difference is that your dad might not have money you can borrow. China has. And that's what's wrong with many of the silver-spoon-population, they take for granted what isn't. They think everything is easy because they had it easy, and they just don't have an idea why it shouldn't be easy for someone else.

Re:Wait What?

[Anonymous Coward]

Somewhere, some people are taking too much profit, I'm sure, just I don't know who they are

Just about everybody

Okay, so here's a question... why aren't you in the field, then, if you think they have too high an income to effort ratio? You decided to make economically poor decisions on purpose?

Re: Wait What?

[sycodon]

Actually, that's pretty much the standard treatment once they confirm it. Pain control, lots of water, and wait for it to pass.

Re:Wait What?

[Garridan]

Don't like the taste of dick.

Re: Wait What?

[sjames]

That pain control part is where it gets interesting in the U.S. if you can't afford a doctor. The government wastes billions making sure you don't get any.

Re:Wait What?

[Hognoxious]

What you say is true, but there's no good reason why all those costs should be an order of magnitude greater than they are in, say, France or Britain.

Re:Wait What?

[Aighearach]

Just sounds to me like in this case it was not an emergency, and the doctor had poor communication skills. That happens everywhere, and isn't the system's fault. If you have a hangnail and ask your doctor what is the worst case, the worst case is that it gets infected and you die.

http://www.aarp.org/politics-society/government-elections/info-03-2012/myths-canada-health-care.html

Re:Wait What?

[Dan667]

statistics don't backup your statement that US health are is good. It ranks pretty crappy as far as first world countries go.

Re:Wait What?

[FireBreath]

As a Canadian I also find the US system weird and unfortunate that it leaves so much financial burden on those who are sick or injured. Our private system is similar to the Australian one. The private hospitals/clinics don't offer any different quality of treatment (the money the hospital can (legally) receive from the government is fixed for each treatment/process, and they cannot charge the patient beyond this) but private facilities can charge over the top for things like private rooms, personal nurses, shorter waiting queues, etc. (Some/many private facilities require you to pay for a room in order to receive treatment there.. and thusly they make their $). The cost of the treatment itself is covered by OHIP. Drugs and prescriptions are not covered by OHIP (Ontario Health Insurance Plan). For this, most of us have 3rd party insurance, personally I have this as part of my benefits package at work. Even from when I was working as a teenager part-time at a national pizza chain we had access to benefits packages that would cover this insurance for reasonable deductions from your pay ($20-40 month). If you break your arm, and are one of those that don't have their own insurance for prescriptions/drugs, the hospital isn't going to turn you away with nothing.. I've been in this situation myself between jobs and they've hooked me up with a free bottle of (prescribed) tylenol 3's to get me through it. From what I understand there are programs set up to get people access to the basic drugs they need if they're in such a situation where they can't afford them otherwise... From my perspective, the system just works, and its crazy that the US hasn't adopted something similar sooner! (The above applies to taxpaying citizens in the province on Ontario at least.)

Re: Wait What?

[NormalVisual]

Pain control, lots of water, and wait for it to pass.

Unless they're too big. Like you, I've had multiple occasions of having them, but the last time they were too big to pass and had to be broken up over multiple procedures after they put stents in. And God help you if you have staghorn stones.

Re:Wait What?

[Cyberax]

Markup on actual salaries is not that large. Typically private hospitals have less than 15% of profit margin - it's healthy but definitely not something to write home about.

Now, medical equipment manufacturers are profiteers. For example, a 1L bag of sterile IV saline solution costs $300 - that's literally 100x markup. And I'm not kidding - I have it in my medical bill from my stay in a hospital a couple of months ago. Drugs are even worse: oral vancomycin costs $500 per one dose - it can be bought for $5 in Russia or India (I checked).

Re:Wait What?

[SuiteSisterMary]

As a Canadian, the US system fill me with dread. It's just plain WIERD to think that, were I American, I'd have had to actually think about whether or not to get my gall bladder out. It would have been an economic decision. That's not right.

Re:Wait What?

[Rich0]

As a Canadian, the US system fill me with dread. It's just plain WIERD to think that, were I American, I'd have had to actually think about whether or not to get my gall bladder out. It would have been an economic decision. That's not right.

Well, for the 2/3rds of Americans who have functional insurance it isn't a hard decision at all. If I needed my gall bladder out it would cost me a $500 deductible, and then 20% of the marked-down costs until I hit about $2500 (the $500 already spent counts towards that), and then the rest would be free. Oh, and the marked-down costs are fairly reasonable - probably more expensive than Canada but not the figures you see in the news. The way it works is that I'd get a bill from the hospital for $100k. Then I'd get a statement from the insurance company telling me that they feel $15k is fair and that I'd have to pay my $2500 limit, the insurance would pay $12.5k, and the hospital would consider it paid in full). If you pay cash then the hospital tells you that since you're a cash customer and save them all the trouble of dealing with the insurance companies they'll mark the price down to only $40k and you'll go on about how much more insured people pay, clearly never having seen what insured people actually pay.

Now, for the rest of America it is a HUGE mess. They either pay cash, in which case they pay a lot more than insured people pay for the same care, or they think they have insurance but they have a scumbag company that collects premiums and then denies care at the last minute. Fortunately, this second case has been in theory largely eliminated by the ACA with its ban on denial pre-existing conditions. That practice made sense in theory and makes sense for most other forms of insurance, but for health insurance it is hard to prove when a disease started and it was often used as a loophole to deny claims for perfectly honest consumers who just happened to have a break in their coverage sometime in the past.

In any case, I'm all for reform and consider the ACA really just getting started. However, the reason people in the US aren't all gung-ho about reform is that many haven't actually had to deal with serious illness if they do have insurance, and most Americans actually do have decent insurance and do just fine under the status quo (well, ignoring the problems they probably will face in a few decades as a result of insufficient preventative care).

Re:Wait What?

[Rich0]

Here's good place to start. DME providers for CPAP supplies. Work your way up from there.

Heck, just look at buying contact lenses or glasses. That's just the CPAP mess at 1/10th scale or so.

Re:Wait What?

[unixisc]

Maybe medical facilities in the Amazon rain forests (i.e. Brazil, not Seattle) are better than that in the Galapagos Islands?

Re:Wait What?

[SuiteSisterMary]

2500 out of pocket? Nuts. I was something like 13 dollars out of pocket for codeine.

It went like this. Go to hospital ER one night in horrid pain. Get ultrasound. Get told I have stones. Get told I should have them out. Scheduled for two weeks hence. Get gall bladder out. Go home.

Re:Wait What?

[travisco_nabisco]

The issue wasn't that there wasn't a sufficient hospital in Ecuador, just not on the Galapagos Islands which are almost 1000 km off the coast of Ecuador. "In smaller communities and in the Galápagos Islands, services are limited, and the quality is generally well below U.S. standards." Travel.State.Gov

Re:Wait What?

[jasper160]

I thought the US had the worst medical system in the world. Whats this? A Socialist country (actually half of the politicians in Ecuador are communists) has worse medical treatment? That just doesn't seem right. State run medical facilities are ALWAYS better, or so I was told by the NYT.

LOL. I love these stories where reality just smacks the left in the face.

Quite correct. When I was stationed there the common practice for the Ecuadorian military "doctors" was amputation for broken limbs on their enlisted. No attempt was ever made to set it. The USAF or USN always had a medevac available for US government civilians and military due to their primitive medicine.

Re:Wait What?

[Rich0]

2500 out of pocket? Nuts. I was something like 13 dollars out of pocket for codeine.

And what is your tax rate, including excise taxes on gasoline/etc? Actually, you'll probably still find your costs to be lower as the US has very high costs even when you factor out the crazy list prices that nobody actually pays. However, you'll find that socialized costs to individuals are still a lot higher than $13 for a major surgery.

$2500 is also the max I can spend per year on an individual on my plan. I've only spent that much once, and this is in a family with fairly usual health problems.

Still, it is way too much money for somebody who is poor. The issue in the US isn't just the cost of care, but how those costs are distributed. That is the main goal of a socialized system - to make the costs more progressive. Drug prices are an even bigger case of this - any sustainable system for creating new drugs is going to cost nearly as much as the one we have today (oh, maybe you can chop out 20% if you try hard), but a socialized system would put the initial costs into taxes so that pill prices are closer to marginal cost. No, the prices paid by EU citizens for medicine today are not sustainable unless the government picks up the R&D tab entirely (not just basic research) - they can only charge so little because US citizens basically subsidize all their drug development.

Re:Wait What?

[Rich0]

Or we could just pay a 5-10% increase in taxes and be done with it.

Well, that's why I called the ACA just as start. However, simply increasing taxes isn't really a complete solution to the problem. Costs also have to be contained, and the whole system needs a lot of restructuring.

Re:Wait What?

[Garridan]

Love all the grief I'm getting about this post. Y'all clearly know a lot more about my wife's head injury than her doctor... guess I should have Asked Slashdot.

Re:Wait What?

[sjames]

And then they'll bill you. And bill you. And bill you.

Re:Wait What?

[quenda]

And what is your tax rate, including excise taxes on gasoline/etc? Actually, you'll probably still find your costs to be lower

A lot lower. Surprisingly the US has one of the highest rates of government health spending in the world, similar to the total health spending in many developed countries.
How does the US manage this while keeping taxes low? By borrowing and printing money. US gov't taxes are low, but spending is not.

Re:Wait What?

[kaatochacha]

Socialized costs are often less obvious, and hidden under layers of bureaucracy.
Here is a personal example: I was at the bank the other day, and a guy walks in, asking the teller if she had a good holiday.
He then proceeds to tell her how his department received two weeks off, paid, for the Christmas/New Years holiday. How nice his bosses are, how often they get this, how surprised everyone was.
She asked him where he worked, and his answer: "The city of Los Angeles".
There's obviously no accountability to this, and that's where it hides in socialized systems.
Invariably, next year, the city will ask for increased tax revenue that's desperately needed: and ignore his free two weeks.s someone who worked over that holiday. As someone who worked over that time, subsidizing his two week vacation is infuriating.

Re:Wait What?

[kaatochacha]

"nurses are not paid high wages"...
Wha? Most of the nurses I know are very well paid.

Coming soon Amazon MD

[captjc]

He has Amazon Prime! I'm sure a drone has already been dispatched with his new kidney and a qualified surgeon.

its great to be king

[nurb432]

Hes got the cash to be treated like that, so more power to him. I don't really see how this is 'news', unless its more stoking fires of the 'class war' that is going on.

Re:its great to be king

[the eric conspiracy]

Ordinary people get treated like that too.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ALNW-USCG.jpg

Re:its great to be king

[nurb432]

Then even less of a non-story.

I guess its a slow news day.

Re:its great to be king

[Radak]

Airlifting people with medical emergencies from the Galapagos Islands to the Ecuadorian mainland is part of the Equadorian Navy's job description. You'd have received the same treatment and so would I.

Now, the quality of the medical care you receive afterwards might be affected by your wealth or influence, but the airlift is something they do for anybody who needs it, and it happens all the time. The only reason this is "news" is because of the notoriety of the patient, not because of the airlift.

Re:its great to be king

[the eric conspiracy]

It's a story because celebrity.

Re:its great to be king

[Hognoxious]

Huh huh. heh heh. You said "logging accident".

Re:its great to be king

[bill_mcgonigle]

I don't really see how this is 'news'

It's not, the submitter just wanted to say:

where the State Department warns the quality of medical facilities and services are 'generally well below U.S. standards'

to try to paint Bezos as some dolt who should have just listened to the government. As if nobody visits the Galapagos and humans never suffer from sudden, acute kidney stones.

Re:its great to be king

[jslaff]

Good thing he had Prime--he got there in two days.

Re:its great to be king

[romcabrera]

Not that I doubt what you've said but, source?

Re:its great to be king

[Radak]

You can find information about the functions of the Equadorian Coast Guard (which is part of the Navy) at http://www.armada.mil.ec/fuerza-operativa/coguar/ . Health emergency-related airlifts would fall under the first of their tasks, "Salvaguardar la vida humana en el mar." The map of what they consider "el mar" can be seen at http://www.coguar.dirnea.org/images/stories/guardacostas/mar_ecuador.jpg .

Re:its great to be king

[romcabrera]

Interesting, thanks. (I'm ecuadorian, btw).

Insurance

[BringsApples]

Wow, the new Obamacare requiring policies to include free ambulance service really went a lot further than I thought it would.

Re:Insurance

[grub]

Your sig is relevant to this story...

Re:Insurance

[BringsApples]

My sig is relevant to every situation. :)
See where it came from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/This_too_shall_pass

There is an old fable that a king had his wise men figure out what phrase could be said under all circumstances. They supposedly came up with this.

Re:Insurance

[ultranova]

My sig is relevant to every situation. :)

Constipation?

There is an old fable that a king had his wise men figure out what phrase could be said under all circumstances. They supposedly came up with this.

Pity they didn't have xkcd back then.

Darwin: Survival of the Financially Fittest

[theodp]

"Jeeves, bring around the Dassault Falcon 900EX. This hurts like HELL."

Not such a big deal

[confused one]

In the U.S., this would have been handled by a U.S. Coast Guard flight if a private helicopter flight could not be chartered. In the United States the Coast Guard is a separate entity because of the Constitutional limitations of\n having our standing army and navy act as a police force within our own borders. In Ecuador, the Coast Guard is part of their Navy. This is sort of being blown out of proportion by the media because of the lack of understanding where Navy = Coast Guard in this instance.

Re:Not such a big deal

[Anonymous Coward]

wow, someone in the govt actually observed & obeyed a constitutional limitation?

We must put a stop to the coast guard immediately!

International Travel Insurance

[Anonymous Coward]

You can get international travel insurance that will cover the cost of emergency medical evacuation back to the USA. You don't have to be a billionaire to afford it. I used to do a lot of international travel and would purchase a policy that covered me for one year. As I recall, the cost was only around $350.

Re:International Travel Insurance

[BringsApples]

Wow I've never heard of it before. I managed to find this:
http://www.travelguard.com/travelinsurance/international.asp?intcmp=clc-001-Nav-2-International

Very interesting, thanks.

Re:International Travel Insurance

[Anonymous Coward]

Wow I've never heard of it before. I managed to find this:

http://www.travelguard.com/travelinsurance/international.asp?intcmp=clc-001-Nav-2-International

Very interesting, thanks.

Now all you need to find is a few people who have had claims against this policy paid without a massive hassle.

Re:International Travel Insurance

[BringsApples]

Welcome to the world, almost everything is a "hassle" depending on your mindset. So long as this type of insurance exists, I feel a bit more secure, as I had previously not known about it.

Re:International Travel Insurance

[Dunbal]

Yeah tell me about it. Most of these policies also state that you have to pay up front and they will reimburse (if they decide to accept the charge). Air ambulances start at around $15,000. Good luck putting that on your Visa. Yeah some people can, but not everyone.

Sounds like a Standard Evac Insurance Policy

[Kagato]

Business people who travel the world usually have global medical plans. Most of those plans include evacuation coverage. Medical transfers off a ship are customarily handled by a coast guard. I'm sure the insurance company had to pay for the service.

If anything the insurance company saved a little money because Bezos already had the private jet in position and that saved them the cost of an airline ticket.

Re:Sounds like a Standard Evac Insurance Policy

[ColdWetDog]

The tone and substance of this story is more than a little suspect. The hospital at Peurto Aoyra (the biggest one) is used to transporting people off island for various problems although kidney stones are usually just treated with morphine and fluids initially. They certainly could handle that. The place is sparse, but clean. The docs there are mostly military (the military, such as it is has a large presence on the island) the commercial airline is owned by the military, and, at least at Baltra (the main airport) there is no evidence of anything else but military aircraft (a grey 737 and a helicopter when I was there).

So, the story line that the "Navy" "rescued" Bezos is a bit overdone. They shipped him to the mainland on a helicopter because that's pretty much the only way to get him to the mainland short of firing up a bigger aircraft. Like pretty much anybody else.

Must be International Drama Queen Day or something.

Re:Sounds like a Standard Evac Insurance Policy

[isorox]

The tone and substance of this story is more than a little suspect. The hospital at Peurto Aoyra (the biggest one) is used to transporting people off island for various problems although kidney stones are usually just treated with morphine and fluids initially. They certainly could handle that. The place is sparse, but clean. The docs there are mostly military (the military, such as it is has a large presence on the island) the commercial airline is owned by the military, and, at least at Baltra (the main airport) there is no evidence of anything else but military aircraft (a grey 737 and a helicopter when I was there).

So, the story line that the "Navy" "rescued" Bezos is a bit overdone. They shipped him to the mainland on a helicopter because that's pretty much the only way to get him to the mainland short of firing up a bigger aircraft. Like pretty much anybody else.

Must be International Drama Queen Day or something.

Standard for island communities, Women in labour in the Isles of Scilly off the Cornish Coast get airlifted to hospital on the mainland by the RAF. For free of course, it's a civilised country.

Re:Sounds like a Standard Evac Insurance Policy

[isorox]

Business people who travel the world usually have global medical plans. Most of those plans include evacuation coverage. Medical transfers off a ship are customarily handled by a coast guard. I'm sure the insurance company had to pay for the service.

If anything the insurance company saved a little money because Bezos already had the private jet in position and that saved them the cost of an airline ticket.

Personal travel insurance in the real world covers all that, and pretty much anyone in my country travelling internationally has it. Medical is not a cheap $5k plane ticket, a 4000 mile evac will easily cost 6 figures, in some cases 7 figures.

taxpayers money!

[joseph90]

Seeing how he does not believe in paying tax maybe he will re-emburse the navy and hospital for the full cost of his "rescue" and treatment.

J.

Jeff, people with your medical history

[Anonymous Coward]

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Re:Jeff, people with your medical history

[TheGratefulNet]

"Sorry, the kidney you have in your cart is no longer available from the seller you selected."

I don't see what the problem is?

[hackus]

Everyone I know gets the Navy to come to their rescue for Medical problems.

Why are people upset, I don't understand.

-Hack

Re:I don't see what the problem is?

[ArsonSmith]

They're upset because they said there was a location that had worse medical care than the US. Obviously this isn't true.

Re:I don't see what the problem is?

[Idarubicin]

Everyone I know gets the Navy to come to their rescue for Medical problems. Why are people upset, I don't understand.

Apparently you don't. It turns out that in most moderately civilized countries - and also in the United States - if you need urgent medical care while on an isolated island and there aren't any other good transportation options then the government pitches in. In the U.S., the Coast Guard maintains a substantial fleet of search and rescue ships and aircraft which are frequently used for medical evacuations of patients from remote locations. If you Google using keywords like "medevac" and "coast guard', you'll have no problem finding scores of incidents. Here's just one from a few weeks ago.

Ecuador, being a small nation, doesn't have a separate Navy and Coast Guard; the functions of the latter are performed by the former. So...yeah, if you have a serious medical issue in a remote area, the Navy is the go-to option for emergency transportation--whether you're an internet billionaire or not.

Rescued?

[ecotax]

It's bullshit the navy rescued anyone here. Transported, helped - many verbs would have fitted better.
Kidney stones supposedly hurt like hell (no personal experience here), but it's not something people generally die from.

Re:Rescued?

[mpoulton]

Kidney stones supposedly hurt like hell (no personal experience here), but it's not something people generally die from.

They sure can be fatal. I would have died from a kidney stone if it weren't for modern medical technology. A stone which is too large to pass obstructs the ureter, which prevents the kidney from draining urine into the bladder. A kidney that can't drain will be permanently damaged and fail within a day or two. Worse, stones can become infected (as mine did), resulting in a kidney infection which will rapidly cause permanent damage and will progress to sepsis and death within days.

Re: Rescued?

[florin]

A kidney stone attack can have very similar symptoms to an acute appendicitis (searing pain around the abdominal area, vomiting) which qualifies as an emergency. It is possible that an accurate diagnosis could not be performed on site.

Other than that, kidney stones are among the most painful afflictions there are. Patients are best brought to a place where windows can't be opened as some may decide to jump out on the spot. They will do anything to get the pain to stop, and a guy like Bezos just happens to have some resources.

Re:Rescued?

[ColdWetDog]

Not to be too picky, but stones can't get infected... they are just mineral deposits. (seemed like you exagerated for effect) But your point was made.

Actually, the stones DO get infected. They are lovely little hiding places for the bacteria because they don't have any blood flow (they are in the ureter) and if the stone blocks the flow of urine (as apparently happened to mpoulton) it sets up conditions where the occasional bacterium can hide and grow and cause a clinically apparent infection.

That said, although an infected stone can be life threatening, the afflicted individual can be temporized by giving them antibiotics and pain killers until he or she does get to adequate medical care. And infections usually don't happen right off the bat - the kidney stone itself tends to give you warning that something is wrong.

There are always exceptions - the first thing that clues you off to an infected kidney stone might be fever / chills / sepsis, but that isn't common. We certainly don't have enough information from TFA to say if this was a complicated kidney stone or not. But from the breathless article we are led to assume that, had it not been for the brave members of the Ecuadorian Navy (who were probably flying back home to Guayaquil anyway), Bezos would have expired in a septic heap.

Re: Rescued?

[confused one]

You have kidneys on both sides...

Re:Rescued?

[VortexCortex]

Kidney stones supposedly hurt like hell (no personal experience here), but it's not something people generally die from.

They sure can be fatal. I would have died from a kidney stone if it weren't for modern medical technology. A stone which is too large to pass obstructs the ureter, which prevents the kidney from draining urine into the bladder.

Yep. Kidney stones are scary as hell, I was pissing myself in terror before realizing it was a relief.

Re:Rescued?

[Dunbal]

No, usually the treatment is morphine or fentanyl for the pain, an anticholinergic (over the counter in most countries) to calm down the ureter's spasms and peristaltic movements, and then waiting until it gets expelled. It's usually a good idea to get some sort of imaging (x-ray) to ensure that the stone is small enough to pass without trouble. I am sure ALL of the above could have been dealt with in any 3rd world hospital. But obviously His Majesty did not want to mix with the plebs.

Re:Rescued?

[Dunbal]

You can live without a kidney. So you probably wouldn't die from that, no matter how painful it was. Infection (pyelonephritis) on the other hand is a very real although minute possibility and its more often seen with stones made of struvite. Those are pretty rare. So combine the chance of the stone being large enough to obstruct (small possibility) with the chance of it being struvite (small possibility) combined with the chance of it getting infected (small possibility) and it's highly unlikely you would have "died". Although it is possible, which is why we doctors like to have a look at all kidney stones, since we can't let a patient go without making sure there won't be potentially serious consequences. And of course it's our duty to relieve the tremendous pain these stones cause.

Re:Rescued?

[Dunbal]

Yes they can, sweetheart. Look up struvite. You learn something every day. But don't worry, I only knew that because of medical school :P

Re: Rescued?

[SuiteSisterMary]

Yeah, but the abdomen is known for having really bad pain localization. The worst pain a man can experience, in my personal experience, is a 'good' gall bladder stone. Which tends to manifest as pain in the lower back. The second is a 'good' kidney stone.

Re:Rescued?

[Rich0]

I'll take your word that it is rare, but I know somebody who has had sepsis multiple times from infections that originated in the kidney. She isn't really a typical case though. I think finally getting her blood sugars under control did the trick as she hasn't had that problem in a few years, though unfortunately she graduated from there to strokes, and now she is right on the border of stage 4 kidney disease...

Re:Rescued?

[cthulhu11]

Same here. Were it not for the procedures I endure periodically I'd be dead right now.

Re:Rescued?

[Dunbal]

Oh yeah, being diabetic increases your chances of infection (almost anywhere in the body) by at least an order of magnitude. And people who get pyelonephritis tend to have it recur. Usually it's because of some anatomical defect (duplicated ureters, for example) obstructing the flow of urine. Urine must flow. If it doesn't flow, then you start getting trouble :)

Your Wish is My Bad Paintbrush Command

[theodp]

Amazon Prime Air Kidney Unboxing :-)

Jeff is a Good Guy - Hope He's OK

[Anonymous Coward]

Setting aside all the blather, I hope Jeff is doing 'ok'.

Re:Jeff is a Good Guy - Hope He's OK

[isorox]

Setting aside all the blather, I hope Jeff is doing 'ok'.

In the UK today 220 people were admitted to hospital with kidney stones. Extrapolating globally thats 30,000. Today. 30,000 tomorrow and 30,000 yesterday. That's one every 3 seconds.

I hope you hope all these people are doing ok too? I expect 30,000 replies from you, one for each person with kidney stones.

Kidney Stones

[jklovanc]

The general "treatment" for kidney stones to to fill the patient full of pain killers and/or smooth muscle relaxants and wait. Later an ultrasound would be done to see if other measures need to be taken. Kidney stones are rarely if ever life threatening; They are just very painful.

Re:Kidney Stones

[Skinkie]

Indeed, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butylscopolamine is doing the magic there.

Re:Kidney Stones

[nitehawk214]

The general "treatment" for kidney stones to to fill the patient full of pain killers and/or smooth muscle relaxants and wait. Later an ultrasound would be done to see if other measures need to be taken. Kidney stones are rarely if ever life threatening; They are just very painful.

Yep, also FlowMax also works wonders on stones once they hit the bladder.

A RICH MAN'S KIDNEY IS WORLD NEWS

[Jeremiah Cornelius]

Well I hear you went up to Saratoga
And your horse naturally won
Then you flew your Lear jet up to Nova Scotia
To see the total eclipse of the sun

Re:A RICH MAN'S KIDNEY IS WORLD NEWS

[radarskiy]

I bet you think this post is about you.

Re:A RICH MAN'S KIDNEY IS WORLD NEWS

[93 Escort Wagon]

Well, his horse naturally won, after all.

How to fail at lying

[Immerman]

This sentence is fal.... is fa-a-a...
Hmph. Fine.
This sentence is true.

Below US standards

[FuzzNugget]

I'm sorry, I can't accept any argument that lauds the US healthcare sys^h^h^h business as being worthy of comparison.

The fires don't really need much stoking

[rsilvergun]

The best kind of war is one where the other side doesn't even know it's being fought...

Not a bad idea: Amazon MD

[goombah99]

Ecuador Military: 7500 people

Amazon employees: 110,000 people.

I expect

[WillyWanker]

That the kidney stone will serve a life sentence for this unprovoked attack on one of the world's most respected businessmen and all-around asshole?

I had a kidney stone while travelling last month

[langelgjm]

I had a kidney stone while travelling last month in South Africa. The pain developed over a day until I was doubled over on the floor, unable to concentrate on anything. At that point I realized I needed to go the hospital.

I went to the ER and was admitted within about 15 minutes. They did blood and urine tests, gave me morphine (I assume it was morphine, it took the pain away completely) and IV fluids, then did a CT scan. A doctor saw me, and I was discharged in about five hours with a filter cup and antibiotics. The stone had made it through the ureter and was small enough to pass without issue.

I paid for everything out of pocket. The total cost of ER admission, doctor's fee, CT scan + radiologist report, blood and urine tests, and IV fluids was USD $550. As far as I can tell, they did not charge me for the morphine, the antibiotics, or the filter cup. Also they gave me copies of my test results and a CD with my CT scan images, and I did not even have to ask for them.

From what I hear, a CT scan alone can cost thousands of dollars in the U.S. In some ways I am glad that this happened when I was travelling... my co-pays back in the U.S. might have exceeded the entire cost in South Africa. I probably could have flown there, gone to the hospital, and flown home while still spending less than what it would have cost in the U.S. I really see why people do medical tourism. It could make sense even if you have insurance.

I should note that this was a private hospital in Cape Town. The hospital was not fancy like we are used to seeing in the U.S., but the staff were professional and knowledgeable, and the quality of care was first rate.

what an awesome non story

[maliqua]

everyone who gives a shit and thinks this is news worthy raise your hand..

Re:what an awesome non story

[VortexCortex]

everyone who gives a shit and thinks this is news worthy raise your hand..

Yep. I don't have any stock in Amazon or its competitors. It's about as tech related as Steve Jobs' health or lack thereof. I mean, it would be as relevant to tech news as, say, if Steve Ballmer was possibly Microsoft, or if Google CEOs were saying terrifying things about privacy. Absolutely no consequence whatsoever. I mean really. Next thing you know they'll be listing news about video games I don't play or, alternate operating systems I don't use, or political rights online I haven't had since the 80's.

I'm strictly opposed to this continuing trend of presenting news only a small segment of nerds gives a shit about. If this is what Slashdot is cumming to then count me out. If it doesn't interest everyone, it shouldn't be news for anyone!

Re:Proportion

[confused one]

He has a private jet. He's also the CEO of a billion dollar company. You're right, people need to get on with their lives and stop reacting every time someone is in the news because they used the wealth they've managed to acquire. FWIW, my employers travel insurance and healthcare plan would get me to a local hospital for trauma treatment then have me put on a commercial airliner back to the U.S.

Re:I had a kidney stone while travelling last mont

[TechnoGrl]

What they gave you - believe it or not - was Ibuprofen IV. Morphine will not take away the pain of kidney stones (it's that bad!) but massive ibuprofen takes the pain away in a really short time. Been there done (and screamed) that.

Re:I had a kidney stone while travelling last mont

[Ralph Spoilsport]

Mine were so bad, none of that worked. They finally blasted me with enough Tramadol to stun an ox. THAT worked.

It must be nice...

[TDyl]

to live in a country where no-one gives a damn about anyone outside of their family or tiny social groups. As humans we have a duty to protect the weak and disadvantaged - and before you go off on one I am slightly right of Genghis Khan. If we cannot protect and help those that suffer more than we do, then how can we call ourselves human? We have to work for the benefit of all, not just shareholders and VC's/hedgefunds. Societal harmony and protection should be a minimum for anyone. The arrogance and plain ignorance of certain shards of corporate American life (which filters down into how the differing sections of society view each other) is an anathema to trying to advance our civilisation and improving the lot of the majority of our species. The sci-fi books I read (mainly the golden age) as I grew up in the 60's/70's presented a much nicer/better ideal of our world than that the politicians, preachers and flaming libertarian and republicans idiots are trying to form. If we as a global community of - hopefully - right-minded and socially aware techies can change things for the better (Farcebook, Goggle, Twatter etc, I'm looking at you) then we ought to; we should. Sorry for the rant and I'll probably regret it tomorrow. Chris

Everyone is missing the REAL story

[93 Escort Wagon]

Jeff Bezos went on a cruise? Did he suddenly turn 80 or something?

Re:Everyone is missing the REAL story

[Dunbal]

No, he's a CEO. Ergo he delegates his work to other people and takes it easy while raking in millions a year in salary and stock options. Life is so hard.

Re:I had a kidney stone while travelling last mont

[BringsApples]

The hospital was not fancy like we are used to seeing in the U.S., but the staff were professional and knowledgeable, and the quality of care was first rate.

Exactly the opposite here in the US (nice hospitals, asshole doctors that want antibiotics to fix everything), that's why it's so damn expensive.

Bozos is a pussy

[sycodon]

I have had 5 kidney stone episodes in the last 30 years. The first one is scary because you have no idea what is happening. The rest are routine, more or less.

Urine sample to check for blood and a simple x-ray ( CT Scan? Really?) and they send you home with Vicodin and tell you to drink lots of water. Hell, he could have gotten the RX and continued the cruise if he wanted.

What a wus.

Re:Bozos is a pussy

[sjames]

( CT Scan? Really?)

That's a perfect example of the problems in American medicine. We have a fairly inexpensive decades old technology that provides the needed information but it languishes in the corner so they can use the much more expensive (but not more useful for simple cases) technology even though it exposes the patient to considerably more radiation. Even so, a CT shouldn't cost nearly as much as it does.

Re: Bozos is a pussy

[sycodon]

Yeah...too much soda, not enough water.

Take heed everyone.

Doc Wagon

[nitehawk214]

Obviously he can afford the Doc Wagon evacuation plan.

Re:Proportion

[isorox]

He has a private jet. He's also the CEO of a billion dollar company. You're right, people need to get on with their lives and stop reacting every time someone is in the news because they used the wealth they've managed to acquire. FWIW, my employers travel insurance and healthcare plan would get me to a local hospital for trauma treatment then have me put on a commercial airliner back to the U.S.

My employers travel insurance is a little special as it covers war zones, Somalia, disaster areas that I enter after the disaster etc.

My personal travel insurance costs about $100 a year. The u.s.a add on doubles the price. It covers a private medical flight back home if need be, forget commercial travel. Also covers lost bags, stolen property, and delayed flights.

The u.s. Seems weird in that it doesn't generally "do" travel insurance.

Irrelevant flamebait article

[dbIII]

Just about any service is better in a large city than in a remote area with hardly any people.

Re:Just wait until you have one

[TheSeatOfMyPants]

The pain is similar for peritonitis, which is also supposed to be worse than childbirth.... It's so intense that memories of it have the intellectual knowledge "I was in pain"rather than any sensory memory -- I've heard that's the reason that most women are willing to give birth more than once.

My main memory of having peritonitis at 9 and 13 is of remaining totally motionless on my side and trying to will my body to stop breathing so I'd die. On the bright side, when the surgeon told me that the second infection obliterated my ovaries, I immediately thought of how painful childbirth is supposed to be, and secretly reacted with cheerful relief, "awesome, I can have all the sex I want when I grow up and never have to worry about getting pregnant!"