Windows 9 To Win Over Windows 7 Users, Disables Start Screen For Desktop

DroidJason1 writes One of Microsoft's main goals with Windows 9, the next major version of Windows, is to win over Windows 7 hold outs. The operating system will look and work differently based on hardware type. Microsoft is looking to showcase the desktop for desktop and laptop users, while two-in-one devices like the Surface Pro or Lenovo Yoga will support switching between the Metro interface and the classic desktop interface. The new desktop will allow Modern UI apps to run in windowed mode, and have Modern UI apps pinned to the Start Menu instead of a Start Screen. There will also be a mini-start menu. Microsoft is looking to undo the usability mistakes it made with Windows 8 for those who are not on a touch device. WIndows 9 is expected around spring of 2015.

Comments

hmmmmm

[Anonymous Coward]

Isn't that supposed to be windows 8.2?

Re:hmmmmm

[TechyImmigrant]

It has become an industry law that every other major windows version be the good one.

So now, they have to number the products to fit the law.

Re:hmmmmm

[fustakrakich]

No, it's 8.11, for workgroups

Re:hmmmmm

[Daniel Hoffmann]

It might be every prime number version of windows, time will tell...

Re:hmmmmm

[epyT-R]

Maybe because touch devices make shitty desktop devices and they shouldn't be integrated for that reason.

Re:hmmmmm

[MightyYar]

I prefer the less-ambiguous "prime enough".

Re:hmmmmm

[BronsCon]

OSX? Touch-based desktop? Which Mac comes with a touch screen?

Re: hmmmmm

[Anonymous Coward]

I hate to be That Guy and kill the joke, but relative primes are actually a thing:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coprime_integers

Re:hmmmmm

[Em Adespoton]

Isn't that supposed to be windows 8.2?

Well, we all know that 8.3 is a holdover from the DOS days....

One switch to rule them all?

[damn_registrars]

Can they also put a switch in this to make Office usable? I can't stand that fucking ribbon interface that makes everything I used to do the most often 5 times more difficult.

Re:One switch to rule them all?

[Tarlus]

Given that it has been their standard for seven years and over three iterations of Office, I don't think they have any plans to undo it.

You can just customize it though, just add your commonly used tasks to the home tab of the ribbon and you're set.

Re:One switch to rule them all?

[bhcompy]

Or just switch to Open Office or other derivatives. Like all of those that hated ribbons did nearly a decade ago

Re:One switch to rule them all?

[wbr1]

I taught inmates with no past computer experience both versions of Office, 03 and 07. I hated 07, and the ribbons at first. It made my day to day tasks take much longer. However, I had to learn quickly as I was teaching it.

I have to say that seeing people with no computer experience learn both. The ribbons are better. People grasped complex workflows easier, effecience was improved, and the learning curve was significantly reduced. Is this anecdotal? Yes. But I stand by it.

Re:One switch to rule them all?

[roc97007]

Or just switch to Open Office or other derivatives.

That is exactly what I did. Unfortunately every once in a while one of my colleagues will send me a document (usually a power point presentation) that won't open in anything other than the newest version of office (and sometimes only the newest version on the same platform as their, to boot). They then get to listen to me cursing office for some time while I try to read their document.

This happens often, even with people who are using older versions of Office. My daughter's high school used to do this all the time -- append docx documents, get complaints from parents, and then re-save in doc format and resend. I dunno what kind of deal the school gets for software, but most of us, unless we've stolen a copy from work, are using an old version of Office or in some cases a third party equivalent.

So in your case, I'd do the same thing I did with daughter's high school teachers. Politely ask them to save the document in a less proprietary format and resend.

Seriously, I don't think I ever received anything from them that couldn't be sent in RTF format, but that's another story.

Re:One switch to rule them all?

[Jason Levine]

The return of Clippy? "I see you've bolded some words. Would you like to share this action on Facebook?"

Re:One switch to rule them all?

[Revek]

Unlike the real thing, microsoft shit still stinks 7 years later.

Re:One switch to rule them all?

[Ol Olsoc]

Your coworkers get butchered documents from you, then ignore it and revisions later, IT gets asked to "cleanup" the formatting bugs yuou injected and everyone else copy pasted over.

I'm not saying MS Office is better than Open/Libre Office is better. Excel, Outlook, PPT and Word generally are better, if not necessarily Access, but there are only substitutes, not equivalents in GPL or other vendors.

My experience is that MS Office doesn't play well with others - or even with itself. Try sending a PC Powerpoint to a Mac Office PowerPoint, and you'll not likely enjoy th difference. If Microsoft programs can't even play with their own selves, then no thanks.

I've achieved remarkable compatibility by using Open Office on all my machines, no matter the OS.

Microsoft is becoming the outlier here.

And here I'm hoping...

[Mashiki]

That it goes x64 only, much like they said a year and change ago.

Re:And here I'm hoping...

[cbhacking]

64-bit OS can run 32-bit processes (do you live under a rock or something?). Just like how 32-bit-only versions of Windows - which describes every version from Windows 95 until XP 64-bit edition - can run 16-bit apps. 64-bit-only doesn't mean it won't run a 32-bit app, it means it won't run on a processor which lacks 64-bit support. There are few such processors in use on PCs today, and they're on their way out. Even Atom chips, for a long time the holdout 32-bit x86 CPUs, support x64 these days. By 2015 it won't matter (seriously legacy machines can continue running legacy OSes; the OSes will probably outlive the machines).

Now, 64-bit OSes can't run 16-bit apps directly - the processor won't drop two levels like that - but 16-bit apps are cheap on CPU power so the tiny number that ever still need to be run (I'm mostly thinking games from the DOS days) can be easily emulated (which is exactly what DOSBox does on x64 today... and also on smartphones and such). 64-bit OSes also won't load 32-bit kernel-mode drivers, but that's not a big problem anymore; very little hardware still in use lacks a 64-bit driver, and if it does, it probably doesn't run on 32-bit Win8 anyhow so Win9 is out of the question.

Touch Server

[Liquidretro]

So this means my virtualized headless server won't have a touch screen interface? Glad someone used some common sense.

Re:Touch Server

[Anonymous Coward]

No no no! This is Windows 9, not Server 2015. Server 2015 will still maintain the Modern interface and force you to use the start screen.

Re:Touch Server

[rsborg]

No no no! This is Windows 9, not Server 2015. Server 2015 will still maintain the Modern interface and force you to use the start screen.

Your rumors are stale, Mr. Coward. From what I hear, Microsoft plans to integrate Kinect technology into Server 2015 as user testing has shown many data center workers have been using "hand gestures" when attempting to work with the Metro interface.

Re:Touch Server

[MightyMartian]

Server core... that's sort of like some braindead version of the Unix CLI, right, with a bizarre "object oriented" shell with stunningly long command names like "Dump-Exchange-Mailboxes-Into-Trash-While-Converting-All-Excel2007-Files-To-PDF", right?

Re:Touch Server

[Darinbob]

It will allow you to shut down the server by pounding your head against the touchscreen equipped monitor.

Hah!

[Bigbutt]

I finally got my Windows 7 system working reliably. I'm not budging until I have to.

[John]

Re:Hah!

[Anonymous Coward]

If you've only just got windows 7 to work reliably then the problem isn't with the operating system.

Re:Hah!

[Bigbutt]

Agreed, but I generally get heavily modded down when I complain about the actual problem (badly written drivers). I finally bought replacement cards and so far no problems.

[John]

Blank is to Blank...

[CanHasDIY]

So:

Windows 9 is to Windows 7, what Windows 7 is to Windows XP.

Why?

Because Windows 9 is to Windows 8 what Windows 7 is to Windows Vista (which is Windows ME to Windows XP).

Head == asplode.

Re:Blank is to Blank...

[just_another_sean]

No way can you convince me that Window's had anything before 3.5!

No seriously, I used 3.0, 3.1 and even 3.11 (for Workgroups) and had no idea what 3.5 was at the time but to this day I still love the fact that when you go deep enough on any version of Windows Server you find something that still looks a lot like it did in 4.0.

Other than finally offering console only (Server Core) the UI for Windows Server could have remained at the Windows 2000 level and I would have been happy. Just the UI, I do like the actual improvements made under the hood and the introduction of new server technology but the UI was fine, why mess with it?

(mumbles something about lawns, shaking his head as he wanders off...)

Windows 8.X / 8.1X needs a new name to

[Joe_Dragon]

Windows 8.X / 8.1X needs a new name to get rid of the bad PR and make the changes stand out more.

Re:Windows 8.X / 8.1X needs a new name to

[Darinbob]

Windows H8?

Re:Windows 8.X / 8.1X needs a new name to

[gmagill]

feed it to Excel, it'll round up to 9

Why didn't they just listen to users?

[ZorinLynx]

I know, ridiculous, right?

Microsoft could have avoided all this mess by simply listening to people who were beta testing and using 8 and complaining about the horrible start screen. I'm sure they got PILES of feedback, but they were so stubborn they even went out of their way to keep people from bringing back the traditional start menu.

What happened to listening to your customers? To providing options? Historically MS has always been all about that, and *Apple* has been the "our way, or the highway" company. It was really strange to see things reversed for Windows 8.

Also, MS really should break free of their "we are the only OS that exists" philosophy. Other operating systems support a wide variety of filesystems and networking protocols out of the box. Windows still only supports its own and assumes nothing else exists. It's time to knock that shit off, Microsoft.

Re:Why didn't they just listen to users?

[sttlmark]

Sinofsky happened, that's why. I'm sure there were people who raised red flags internally prior to Windows8's release, but Sinofsky was so hellbent on making MS a "devices & services" company that he ignored any feedback that didn't mesh with his vision.

Now he's gone, and MS has to undo his mess and spin it as innovation... So now we see MS shills writing things like this FTFA:

In order to do this, Microsoft is working on including in Threshold lots of new features specifically aimed at "desktop" users, meaning those who interact primarily with their Windows computing device from a desktop or laptop PC with mouse/keyboard and optional touch.

Note how "desktop" is in quotes as if this group is a fringe subset of its users instead of the 95% of its users who were completely alienated.

Re:Why didn't they just listen to users?

[NoKaOi]

What happened to listening to your customers? To providing options? Historically MS has always been all about that, and *Apple* has been the "our way, or the highway" company. It was really strange to see things reversed for Windows 8.

The big difference being that, at least when Jobs was around, Jobs was almost always right about what a vast majority of the users actually wanted vs what they said they wanted. Yes, I know you want to say how much it sucked, but that's why I said a vast majority of users, certainly not all users. MS, OTOH, has generally gone for what users say they want rather than what they really want (anybody who has developed software for non-techy customers knows what I mean). They tried it Apple's way for Windows 8, but apparently they didn't have anybody pragmatic enough to understand real-life users.

In other words, users said they wanted A, but Jobs knew they'd like B better. He made B, and 90% of them loved it. MS users said that wanted C, MS thought they'd like D better, they made D, and 90% of them hated it. The right answer for MS is probably not C or D, so they need to find the value of E.

Re:Why didn't they just listen to users?

[Anonymous Coward]

Because the Windows Store and Bing Search.

The only reason they have been so stubborn about putting the Metro Start in front of everyone, even Server users, is to force them to look at the Windows Store tile(s).

The store is a core part of Microsoft's bid to integrate a new revenue stream and a new way of bringing users into the fold of a subscription-based licensing model.

Another reason is to force users to use the Bing Search to find anything they used to just double-click from the desktop or the single click in the Start Menu. Each search gets routed to Bing and gets counted as a page view for the ads...

Re:It isn't just UI

[TechyImmigrant]

What about some of the huge downgrades in functionality that came with 8?

Audio controls being a big one.

Pardon?

Wouldn't it be more appropriate to say...

[hedgemage]

Instead of saying "One of Microsoft's main goals with Windows 9, the next major version of Windows, is to win over Windows 7 hold outs." wouldn't it be more factual to say the main goal is to "overcome the design failures that prevented widespread adoption of Windows 8."

As much as they love to pat themselves on the back for having such a "revolutionary" design, there is no better evidence that it Win 8 was a groupthink circlejerk than how no one who had the choice would use it.

Windows 7 end of life...

[QuietLagoon]

The end of life for Windows 7 is not until January 14, 2020. Windows 7 is working OK for me.

.
Why in the world would I want to give Microsoft more money just to stay on the Microsoft Upgrade Treadmill©?

Re:It isn't just UI

[fahrbot-bot]

What about some of the huge downgrades in functionality that came with 8?

Audio controls being a big one.

Pardon?

You need to speak up, his audio controls are messed up.

Re:Umm, ctrl+c/ctrl+v?

[Luckyo]

I was wondering when one of the "oh the new start menu is great, it's just misunderstood and needs to be relabeled" goblins crawls out of his cave to poop his bullshit on this thread.
Did the epic failure of 8 teach you nothing? We WANT the proper tree menu in start menu. Not your shitty catastrophe that can't even have a proper tree structure. An actual, usable start menu.

Go back to your cave. Eight is dead as is (hopefully) start screen. Even microsoft is apparently starting to get it.

I won't upgrade.

[Anonymous Coward]

They release new versions of windows too often, and charge too much for the upgrades. Also, far too many things stop working once one upgrades.

I intend to hang on to 7 until the end of extended support, and possibly after that, because I have no incentive to upgrade. Their willingness to give me back the interface they shouldn't have taken away in the first place is not an incentive to upgrade, it is merely one less disincentive.

Re:I won't upgrade.

[Bill, Shooter of Bul]

I don't think they care about software upgrades. I do think they care about hardware OEM's shipping old versions of their OS.

Re:I won't upgrade.

[Anonymous Brave Guy]

I do think they care about hardware OEM's shipping old versions of their OS.

That seems to be one area where Microsoft have actually been successful so far. I know a handful of friends and family who have bought new desktop/laptop PCs since Windows 8 was released. The ones actually running Windows 8 are those who didn't have a reasonable alternative, because what they bought came with version 8 preinstalled by the manufacturer and for one reason or another upgrading to Windows 7 wasn't a practical option. Several of them have been extremely vocal about their views on Windows 8, which are typically not things you would repeat in polite company, but buying a good laptop that even has the option of Windows 7 preinstalled instead of 8 now seems very difficult, at least here in the UK.

So will they skip 10 and go straight to 11?

[neo-mkrey]

Insert Spinal Tap joke here:

I skipped Windows 7...

[AnalogDiehard]

...and purchased a Mac Pro. My WIN2K machine started showing its age. HP stopped making ink cartridges for my printer. Upgrading required a completely new system as none my peripherals will work on Vista and higher. We started using WIN7 at work from XP and I just hated it. Since I had to buy a completely new system, a Mac Pro was only a little more money. And the migration to learning a new OS was easier than I anticipated. I have no regrets, especially seeing the stupid mistakes MS has made in WIN8.

Re:I skipped Windows 7...

[suprcvic]

Just wait for a few iterations of Mac OS until Apple says the latest one will not work on your still perfectly functional hardware.

Gone to Linux...

[LVSlushdat]

Too little.... WAAAAAAY too late....