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Hair-Raising Technique Detects Drugs, Explosives On Human Body

Posted by samzenpus on from the charge-and-detect dept.

sciencehabit writes Scientists have found a way to combine Van de Graaff generators with a common laboratory instrument to detect drugs, explosives, and other illicit materials on the human body. In the laboratory, scientists had a volunteer touch a Van de Graaff generator for 2 seconds to charge his body to 400,000 volts. This ionized compounds on the surface of his body. The person then pointed their charged finger toward the inlet of a mass spectrometer, and ions from their body entered the machine. In various tests, the machine correctly identified explosives, flammable solvents, cocaine, and acetaminophen on the skin.

108 of 162 comments (clear)

  1. hmm I wonder if.... by Ingcuervo · · Score: 5, Funny

    the way they detect the flammable solvents is by the ignition of them when the spark of static discharge is done

    1. Re:hmm I wonder if.... by flyneye · · Score: 1

      I'm betting most explosives, being highly combustible, can be set off with a static charge. Good thing they only worked w/traces. Now they can safely find nutballs with traces of explosives on them. Perhaps it would be best if they tried someone holding a keg of gunpowder, you know, to see if it's safe. Gotta trust degreed men of science, after all they paid a lot to get those degrees. We don't need a trace finder , we need a bomb finder, no matter how many degreed scientists we have to blow up to get one. They should feel honored to serve. GO RESEARCH!!!

      --
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    2. Re:hmm I wonder if.... by durrr · · Score: 2

      I wonder more about the cocaine detection, if it was intended or accidental.

    3. Re:hmm I wonder if.... by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      If you walk on a recently fertilized lawn, you have traces of explosives on you.

      Flying in new shoes saves hassle.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    4. Re:hmm I wonder if.... by mpe · · Score: 1

      I'm betting most explosives, being highly combustible, can be set off with a static charge.

      There are explosives, such as RDX, which will burn, but require a shockwave to cause them to detonate.

    5. Re:hmm I wonder if.... by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      They don't currently do wipe down tests looking for cocaine. They do for explosives. Which you can fail by wearing shoes with lawn fertilizer on them.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    6. Re:hmm I wonder if.... by ComputersKai · · Score: 1

      That would be ironic if the security scanner ended up blowing up the entire checkpoint.
      Not exactly the best solution, for other reasons also, but at least it probably works better than our current TSA detectors.

  2. New Traveler Hairstyles by Rich0 · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'm just looking forward to when the TSA hears about this. Pretty soon we'll all be sporting new traveler's hairdos!

    1. Re:New Traveler Hairstyles by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      They want you to feel like it's 1980's all over again. Well, perhaps with a Light Brown Scare instead of the red one - fashions change.

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
  3. Wait a minute... by Noryungi · · Score: 1

    Acetaminophen is illegal now??!! Please say it ain't so!!

    --
    The right to offend is far more important than the right not to be offended. (Rowan Atkinson)
    1. Re:Wait a minute... by Shakrai · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't know about Acetaminophen, but I've heard compelling cases made that if Aspirin were discovered today it would be a prescription drug. Think of the side effects, the modern day "think of the children!" attitude, and pathetic need of the body politic to feel "safe" from any and everything.

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
    2. Re:Wait a minute... by CastrTroy · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Acetaminophen aka Tylenol can actually be quite harmful. The difference between the maximum safe dose, and the amount to cause liver problems (or failure) is quite a small margin. Combine that with the fact that they put it in other medications such as cold medications that people take along with regular acetaminophen, and you end up with a recipe for disaster. This American Life did an episode on it.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    3. Re:Wait a minute... by Imrik · · Score: 3, Funny

      What do you really expect the margin between the maximum safe dose and the minimum unsafe dose to be?

    4. Re:Wait a minute... by Jason+Levine · · Score: 3, Funny

      I wonder if they'll detect that super-harmful chemical dihydrogen monoxide?

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
    5. Re:Wait a minute... by WormholeFiend · · Score: 1

      Tylenol is in high demand in Cuba. I always buy some as gifts to the hotel staff whenever I visit.

    6. Re:Wait a minute... by Headrick · · Score: 1

      I once dated a nurse who told me that acetaminophen was the most common cause of acute liver failure in the ICU.

      People keep popping them because they're over the counter -- they can't be dangerous!

    7. Re:Wait a minute... by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      There are still a few states that let you buy codeine cough syrup OTC.

      I don't know why anybody considers codeine a recreational drug though. Junkies sometimes use it to keep from getting junk sick.

      In terms of stumble/dollar vodka has it beat, hands down.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
    8. Re:Wait a minute... by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      Probably because they don't like the depressive effect of it, same reason why there's a huge demand for ultram(pure tramadol) on the black market as well. I've taken a lot of stuff for pain control, sadly doctors still believe that tramadol has a "less addictive effect" than other opiates. The downside to not taking it when you've been on it a long time is serotonin withdrawal, and that just sucks.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    9. Re:Wait a minute... by Rich0 · · Score: 1

      So, as others pointed out acetaminophen is actually fairly dangerous as drugs go. However, let's pick on something like ibuprofen instead which is definitely safer.

      Today even ibuprofen would have trouble making it as a non-prescription drug.

      Pain-killers in general have the deck stacked against them. For something like a heart medication to get on the market you basically have to show that it saves more lives than it takes. So, if it prevents 10k more heart attacks per year than any other drug on the market, and it kills 10 people per year due to liver toxicity, then it isn't hard to get it approved.

      Painkillers don't benefit from this kind of calculus. If it kills 3 people a year, you can't point to a single life that they save to balance it out. So, our regulatory system tends to keep painkillers off the market. It is hard to balance lives cut short vs long lives lived in agony.

      Diet medications have a lot of problems with suicide and tend to be kept off the market for the same reason. (Which makes me really wonder about the interaction between diet, obesity, and depression - eating is a basic instinct and we already know that people eat when they're upset - the need to eat is in many ways driven by emotion.)

    10. Re:Wait a minute... by mpe · · Score: 1

      So, as others pointed out acetaminophen is actually fairly dangerous as drugs go. However, let's pick on something like ibuprofen instead which is definitely safer.

      In intersting irony is that many illegal drugs are less dangerous than many available "over the counter".

      Pain-killers in general have the deck stacked against them. For something like a heart medication to get on the market you basically have to show that it saves more lives than it takes. So, if it prevents 10k more heart attacks per year than any other drug on the market, and it kills 10 people per year due to liver toxicity, then it isn't hard to get it approved.

      That process appears to have failed with HMG-CoA reductase inhibitors though. Drugs which havn't been shown to be of any benefit to other than a small minority of people. Which actually work by disrupting an important metabolic function.

    11. Re:Wait a minute... by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      It IS a very dangerous drug which. Ironically it became successful as the "safe" alternative to aspirin it is much more deadly. A huge problem is with children's versus infants dosages. There have been decades of delays getting accurate dosage information onto the bottles. The fiction that this is a safe drug is being actively maintained by the major manufacturer's like Tylenol. It was only considered safe in the early days because so little information was known about it.

      We're not talking about just anything that can potentially be harmful if you use too much, but which is *deadly* if using only a slight amount above the listed maximum daily dosage. Children die from this every year. Irritation of intestinal lining from aspirin is minor in comparison to irreversible liver damage.

    12. Re:Wait a minute... by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      It sounds funny, but with many over the counter remedies there is a gradual increase in danger. Ie, if you take too much aspirin you get intestinal irritation and bleeding that gradually gets worse as you take more. With acetominophen/tylenol you go from being fine to being hospitalized very quickly. Even one or two tablets beyond the "do not exceed" on the label is very dangerous. Yet most consumers take the "do not exceed" numbers as the proper dosage that they should be taking.

    13. Re:Wait a minute... by sjames · · Score: 1

      That shouldn't be true, but probably would be.

    14. Re:Wait a minute... by Shakrai · · Score: 1

      In terms of stumble/dollar vodka has it beat, hands down.

      Stumble/dollar is one of the best descriptions I've ever heard to rate drugs, just FYI. ;)

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
    15. Re:Wait a minute... by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      Overdosing on Tylenol is fatal and irreversible. You missed the point.

      Overdosing on dihydrogen monoxide is fatal and irreversible too, I guess you missed the point.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    16. Re:Wait a minute... by strikethree · · Score: 1

      It is even worse than what you think it is:

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P...

      So I happen to not physically be in America and I was not aware that paracetamol and acetaminophen are the same thing when the doctor asks me if I have taken any Panadol (what? Paracetamol)... so I say no and he proceeds to start pumping a thousand milligrams plus directly into my veins. Yeah, but I had taken Tylenol and some cold medications, which combined, had placed over a thousand milligrams of acetaminophen into my system previously. A thousand milligrams of acetaminophen here, a thousand milligrams of paracetamol there. Another thousand in rounding errors and a continuous drip into my veins... Who cares right?

      Needless to say, my liver goes, "WTF dude?" and 6 months of hell proceed to occur. Some Milk Thistle and time allowed everything to more or less return to normal.

      Yeah. It should be illegal to put that shit into ANY product other than one distinctly labelled as acetaminophen aka paracetamol. It should not be labelled Cold Medicine or Cough Medicine, or Muscle Relaxer or whatever the fuck else. That stuff is DANGEROUS. I do not want to have a liver transplant merely because of differing naming conventions and added ingredients.

      --
      "Someone needs to talk to the tree of liberty about its ghoulish drinking problem." by ohnocitizen
    17. Re:Wait a minute... by Meski · · Score: 1

      And in Australia. What of it? It's called Panadeine. (or a slew of generic names)

  4. Pity by y5t3m · · Score: 1

    It can't detect a total waste of money.

    1. Re:Pity by ThatsDrDangerToYou · · Score: 1

      It can't detect a total waste of money.

      No, clearly not a total waste. They got *several* publications out of this work I'm sure! ... and did you hear where they are having the conference next year? Somewhere exotic I think.

  5. So what happens... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    ...when the first terrorist decides that the best place to attack is the line (a "queue" to us Royalists) for security?

    Will there be a pre-inspection inspection? Inspections all the way down? Pre-crime profiling? Not allowed to leave your house until you're cleared tor pre-clearing? Just how would the play deal with this sinister turn?

    1. Re:So what happens... by sumdumass · · Score: 2

      They already do this. Check points in Iraq and other countries like Israel are known for being blown up. Buses are more typical because they are enclosed making the blast more effective. The thing is that the death toll usually isn't much higher than a bad car wreck compared to other methods so i think they are targeting the mechanism moreso than what we consider terrorist goals to be. But thats just my limited guess to why they aren't more popular in weatern nations.

    2. Re:So what happens... by bickerdyke · · Score: 4, Insightful

      if you're considering a large death toll as a terrorist goal, then you're wrong. Terror is the goal, and having people killed are only the means.

      --
      bickerdyke
    3. Re:So what happens... by Rashdot · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I believe most bombings are targeted, we just almost never hear who the target was. We just read about some marketplace being blown op, but not who happened to be walking there. Besides, the reasoning could be hard to understand, in some places people can get killed for holding a wrong opinion. Or because someone wants to gain power.

      --
      This is not the sig you're looking for.
    4. Re:So what happens... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      That depends on how you define 'target'. A terrorist that is using geographical targets (Pentagon) differs to a terrorist that is using 'crowds of people' as targets. But their overall, main target is inflicting terror in people's minds. That's why you don't 'hear' what the 'target' was, the term 'terroris bombing' already explains it.

    5. Re:So what happens... by ThatsNotPudding · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Terror is the goal, and having people killed are only the means.

      Or in the case of Bin Laden, a successful attack would lead to Machiavellian scumbags within the US government turning the country into a police state for power and profit, slowly boiling away the rights and privacies of his real target: the American citizenry (who allowed murderous, abusive foreign policies to be conducted in their name).

      And to this day, they are still running his playbook, with zero intention of ever stopping.

    6. Re:So what happens... by DigiShaman · · Score: 2

      It's mainly targets and not a single target. Bombing on a bus, mall, disco, market, etc all involve densely packed people to inflict maximum casualties. Please see Boston bombings for example here in America.

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
    7. Re:So what happens... by Rashdot · · Score: 1

      My point is that someone specific in that crowd probably was targeted, but to us the public, it remains a random crowd of people. At least that's what I've been told by someone who was in some special forces somewhere.

      --
      This is not the sig you're looking for.
    8. Re:So what happens... by Rashdot · · Score: 1

      True, the Boston bombers apparently considered the whole civilized world as enemies.

      But for instance in Lebanon some of the most powerful individuals were killed by bombings. Those were obviously targeted.

      So both are true, but in the west we mostly read about bombings and don't always get to hear who the true target was. Maybe because there's not much point in knowing what local figure was targeted and why.

      --
      This is not the sig you're looking for.
    9. Re:So what happens... by junglee_iitk · · Score: 1

      Exactly, but in a much larger scale, what US and the west in general has been doing for hundreds of years.

      Disclaimer: I am a Gandhian.

    10. Re:So what happens... by Shoten · · Score: 1

      They already do this. Check points in Iraq and other countries like Israel are known for being blown up. Buses are more typical because they are enclosed making the blast more effective. The thing is that the death toll usually isn't much higher than a bad car wreck compared to other methods so i think they are targeting the mechanism moreso than what we consider terrorist goals to be. But thats just my limited guess to why they aren't more popular in weatern nations.

      The way the Israelis learned to deal with this is very simple. You have a population coming through a checkpoint...almost always, in the case of Israel, a checkpoint between Israel proper and one of the Occupied Territories (Gaza, West Bank). The people coming through are, overwhelmingly, the population from where the risk comes...Palestinians. The cordon is designed so that a suicide bomber will not 1, be able to blow a hole through the barrier that the checkpoint acts as a valve for, and 2, be able to kill the people manning the checkpoint. That leaves only the Palestinians as potential victims...with the deterrent effect that results. Hamas doesn't win bonus points for blowing up their own people.

      --

      For your security, this post has been encrypted with ROT-13, twice.
    11. Re:So what happens... by mpe · · Score: 1

      if you're considering a large death toll as a terrorist goal, then you're wrong. Terror is the goal, and having people killed are only the means.

      People tend need to be alive to be terrified.
      Another similar idea is military weapons intended to wound, Since they can potentially remove three times the number of wounded soldiers from the battlefield.

    12. Re:So what happens... by mpe · · Score: 1

      It's mainly targets and not a single target. Bombing on a bus, mall, disco, market, etc all involve densely packed people to inflict maximum casualties.

      Note that an intended target may be someone from a specific group rather than a specific individual.

    13. Re:So what happens... by mpe · · Score: 1

      My point is that someone specific in that crowd probably was targeted, but to us the public, it remains a random crowd of people.

      That is more a "possibility" rather than a "probability".

      At least that's what I've been told by someone who was in some special forces somewhere.

      You ca't really generalise this to all terrorists. Even those supported by nation states.

    14. Re:So what happens... by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      The best plan for taking down the USA is to bomb the lines in 5 major airports at the same time. Denver is one of the largest lines I've ever been in. Kill dozens, injure hundreds.

      After that, they'll move the scan further away from the old lines. About a week later, bomb them there, 5 more different large airports. Probably at the check-in counters.

      Then, 3 more days after the last, go back to the original 5 airports, and car-bomb the line of cars stopping to drop-off/pick-up.

      Air traffic would stop. For weeks at least, maybe months. The economy would collapse.

      --
      Learn to love Alaska
    15. Re:So what happens... by kharchenko · · Score: 1

      you forgot the part about bankrupting the country along the way...

  6. The TSA has a new toy.. by wiredog · · Score: 1

    It's gonna make going through airport security even more fun. Especially for those with pacemakers.

    --

    Best Slashdot Co
    1. Re:The TSA has a new toy.. by necro81 · · Score: 1

      I'd be skeptical that sticking one hand on a Van DeGraff generator won't do anything for someone with a pacemaker. In order for things to get weird, you need some other part of the body grounded (e.g., the other hand touching earth ground), such that current passes through the person. Just building up a large electrostatic charge on the skin of someone isn't such a big deal, because a pacemaker (and, particularly, its electrodes) are contained within the body. If, as the article suggests, they turn this into a phone booth-like chamber, it should be pretty easy to ensure that the person inside is "floating", electrically, and unable to complete a circuit with their body.

      A person with the prosthetic arm that uses surface EMGs to control it, however, would need to think twice!

    2. Re:The TSA has a new toy.. by sjames · · Score: 1

      If the static voltage is high enough, you don't need to complete a circuit to ground to have a significant current flow. Capacitive effects are more than adequate to give you quite a shock.

  7. Bang by MichaelSmith · · Score: 1

    Its also great for detecting suicide bombers.

    --
    http://michaelsmith.id.au
    1. Re:Bang by WinstonWolfIT · · Score: 1

      Honestly that's fine by me. Better sending up a contained security area than a plane full of innocents.

    2. Re:Bang by MichaelSmith · · Score: 1

      Bomb belts really should have grounding points.

      --
      http://michaelsmith.id.au
    3. Re:Bang by sjames · · Score: 1

      So instead of killing one planeload of people, kill the ten planeloads waiting at the checkpoint? Bad trade.

    4. Re:Bang by WinstonWolfIT · · Score: 1

      You're not thinking it through. Small explosion on plane causes catastrophic decompression and ignites fuel. Small explosion in a security contained area takes out just a few.

  8. Breaking Headline : by Rollgunner · · Score: 5, Funny

    Air traveler shocked to find out he was carrying illegal drugs !

    1. Re:Breaking Headline : by mpe · · Score: 1

      This /is/ possible. For example on the US-Mexican border, people often don't know they carry drugs. They pass the border regularly by car, and on one side their bag gets replaced (break into their car, whatever) with a same-looking second one, having special content. On the other side, the same exchange happens just reverse. They don't even realize they have carried drugs, and when the police officers find the drugs, the innocent gets blamed.

      A similar thing has been known to happen with airline passengers' luggage. The criminal gangs involved are probably delighted with "TSA approved" locks.

  9. Even better by easyTree · · Score: 1

    Scientists have found a way to combine an industrial blender with test subjects; simply pop in the suspect, pulse intermittently for five minutes then place a sample of the fluid in a mass spectrometer to detect explosive residue.

    --
    Requiem for the American Dream
  10. Efficiency by Chrisq · · Score: 3, Funny

    This could be combined with automatic electrocution if the test turns out to be positive ;-)

  11. TSA waiting line will be interesting now by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 2

    No need to wait for Fourth of July any more. Once this technology is fully deployed in all airports by TSA you would be seeing this. . The large donut and the thick pillar are parts of the Van de Graff generator.

    --
    sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    1. Re:TSA waiting line will be interesting now by necro81 · · Score: 1

      No need to wait for Fourth of July any more. Once this technology is fully deployed in all airports by TSA you would be seeing this. . The large donut and the thick pillar are parts of the Van de Graff generator

      No, they aren't. Those are pictures of Tesla coils. A Van de Graff generator is like an industrial version of rubbing a glass rod with a piece of wool - it works via electrostatics. A Tesla coil is a resonant transformer with a huge turns ratio - it works via magnetic induction.

  12. but does it work on dead parrots? by Cardinal+Biggles · · Score: 1
    "mate, this parrot wouldn't voom if you put 4 million volts through it!"

    apologies to those too young to know Monty Python sketches :)

  13. As a protest to the use of these devices, by mark_reh · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I suggest that everyone who has to go through the scanner reach down into their pants and stick their finger into their butt hole just before they have to point their finger at the detector.

    1. Re:As a protest to the use of these devices, by Crypto+Gnome · · Score: 1

      I suggest that everyone who has to go through the scanner reach down into their pants and stick their finger into their butt hole just before they have to point their finger at the detector.

      Why do it yourself, when it only takes a *little* encouragement before THE TSA offers to insert THEIR finger in your butthole?

      Keeping in mind that THE TSA will not stop until their knuckles are knocking your uvula, or further press-the-digit-ation is blocked at their shoulder (whichever comes last).

      --
      Visit CryptoGnome in his home.
    2. Re:As a protest to the use of these devices, by sjames · · Score: 1

      Why yes, I did eat pork and beans, asparagus and eggs for breakfast, why do you ask?

  14. And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by swb · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The funny thing is, try to explain this to your doctor when she wants to prescribe an opiate like oxycodone.

    In about half the cases I've been prescribed opiates the doctor refused to prescribe oxycodone on its own -- I was told it was Percocet (oxycodone + acetaminophen) or nothing, they would not write a prescription for just oxycodone. I had one surgeon do it reluctantly, pointedly asking me why and not really liking my answer that I felt it was dangerous and could add in acetaminophen on my own if I felt it was helpful.

    I did have one specialist who wrote that way and when I asked her why she prescribed that way she said current research showed the liver risk outweighed the small benefits. Ironically she was the "less educated" physicians assistant and not a full MD.

    I think most doctors believe its beneficial but I also think they somehow see acetaminophen opiate formulations as some kind of bulwark against abuse. Either because they believe it is so much more effective paired with acetaminophen and you'll be inclined to take less overall or that people "know" acetaminophen is bad in quantity and it will serve as a deterrent to excessive dosage, especially people with a history of drug abuse.

    I also think they are highly skeptical of someone asking for a specific opiate formulation, even when they initiate the prescription (ie, you have an obvious injury and they prescribe an opiate). It's highly ironic that they're so worried about addiction they're willing to risk serious liver toxicity.

    1. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by durrr · · Score: 1

      Anyone prone to willfull abuse will use CWE and get rid of the acetaminophen. Some elderly person getting addicted will instead kill itself.
      Drug prescription rules and opinions about drugs are hyped the fuck up and retarded, there's several completely safe drugs that's prescription only and some pretty awful ones that's free for everyone.

    2. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by king+neckbeard · · Score: 3, Insightful

      While true (although it's quite likely the effects are exaggerated to some degree), there's no compelling reason to have them in the same pill. People build up very high tolerances to opiates, and there isn't a whole lot by way of extra side effects in doing so, but our ability to take acetaminophen without liver damage stays about the same.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    3. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by swb · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The FDA has been mulling a total ban on acetaminophen combinations only recently, I presume this is because the most recent research probably indicated that the benefits were outweighed by the risks.

      The physicians assistant who prescribed only oxycodone without acetaminophen to me was the youngest of the prescribers I've dealt with, so I'm also assuming her more recent education included this newer thinking.

      The oxycodone dosage she gave me was the same as the combination offered elsewhere -- 5 mg. I found that the APAP-free version seemed more effective -- faster onset of benefit with no obvious reduction in duration or overall benefit.

      The PA also prescribed other medication to try to enhance the oxycodone, hydroxazine and amytriptaline. Unfortunately both of these had significant side effects. Hydroxazine made me really sleepy and amytriptaline made it very hard to get up.

    4. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by ncc74656 · · Score: 4, Informative

      I think most doctors believe its beneficial but I also think they somehow see acetaminophen opiate formulations as some kind of bulwark against abuse. Either because they believe it is so much more effective paired with acetaminophen and you'll be inclined to take less overall or that people "know" acetaminophen is bad in quantity and it will serve as a deterrent to excessive dosage, especially people with a history of drug abuse.

      Also, the DEA watches doctors who prescribe opiates very carefully. If some government goon believes a doctor's handing them out like candy, the doctor's most likely going to be called in for some very uncomfortable questions. See chapter two of Three Felonies a Day for some examples.

      The way scripts for opiates are handled is also quite different. My wife's oncologist was able to submit the vast majority of prescriptions to her preferred pharmacy electronically; they would be ready for pick-up a short time after. The one time she was prescribed straight oxycodone (or whatever opiate), it was printed on security paper to thwart attempts at altering or copying. It was signed, and some sort of DEA ID number issued to the doc was printed in the header. I had to deliver the prescription to a pharmacy. Her usual pharmacy didn't have it in stock, so I had to find another that did. Once it was filled, I had to sign for it in a logbook (similar to when you buy products containing pseudoephedrine).

      --
      20 January 2017: the End of an Error.
    5. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by swb · · Score: 1

      Oxycodone has required a printed prescription on paper for a long time -- no refills, no phone in. I think hydrocodone (aka Vicodin) was scheduled lower and that made it eligible for phone-in prescriptions and refills without a new prescription, although I believe they recently re-scheduled it to be the same as oxycodone.

      I have to sign for every prescription, from opiates to my high blood pressure medication to antibiotics. I can't remember not having to sign for them.

      Ironically, I think the dependence on paper prescriptions as being more secure than electronic submission is kind of strange. Surely forging a paper prescription is easier than an electronic submission. I'm also surprised the DEA hasn't just created a mandatory centralized opiate prescribing system where all prescriptions are funneled through them.

      I'm not endorsing this, mind you, but they could tighten it down to the point where the only way to prescribe a narcotic is for a doctor to log into a DEA terminal, complete with two-factor authentication, complete the prescription form and have it sent to the pharmacy, all under their watchful eye.

    6. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by sudon't · · Score: 1

      I think most doctors believe its beneficial but I also think they somehow see acetaminophen opiate formulations as some kind of bulwark against abuse.

      That is, in large part, why it's in there. But, a lot of people are unaware of of acetaminophen's toxicity, and others will use it anyway, out of desperation, making it the "denatured alcohol" of drug prohibition. Instead of Jake leg, you get liver failure.

      Myself, I won't take anything except aspirin when I want a simple over-the-counter pain reliever, and always insist on acetaminophen-free opiates.

      --
      -- sudon't

      Air-ride Equipped

    7. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      oxycodone and hydrocodone are very water soluable. acetaminophen is not. Get a glass of warm water and a fridge. You know what to do.

    8. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by torkus · · Score: 1

      And then you have the option of just ... stealing the scrip pads assuming you don't bother to forge one. It's not rocket science by any stretch - and that's assuming the pharmacist bothers to check it.

      If they think anything sketchy is going on they call the Dr to confirm...typically via the number on the scrip. Derp. Also pharmacists in chain stores are often assholes...oh you have a scrip for opiates or amphetamines? And tattoos? Yeah...uh huh. Right. We're going to have to call this in. Come back tomorrow.

      Or you go to a mom and pop place where the biggest problem is if they have it in stock.

      Or if you *really* want to get the evil eye...try filling a scrip like that without insurance. "No, I'll pay for that oxy in cash please" Good luck...

      --
      You can get rich if you own a politician, but you have to be rich to buy one in the first place.
    9. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      That's the thing, doctors just don't know this stuff. Even with acetominophen they don't realize how dangerous it is, and only by studying mortality records at hospitals were people discovering a major connection. Even more bizarre is the association between "Tylenol" and "safe", so that parents have overmedicated their children thinking that nothing can possibly be wrong with such a safe medicine.

    10. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by kharchenko · · Score: 1

      Her usual pharmacy didn't have it in stock, so I had to find another that did.

      That sounds familiar. These prescriptions can be a bitch to fill. My father was in a really bad shape after a fall and the doctor prescribed him oxycodone (I don't think it was pure, may be percocet). I drove around the city half the night trying to find a pharmacy that would fill that prescription. After the fourth pharmacy, seemingly innocent "oh, we don't carry that" excuse sounded really disingenuous.

    11. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by sjames · · Score: 1

      The same effect happens with plain old aspirin with less risk to your liver.

    12. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by fafalone · · Score: 1

      Of course there's a compelling reason. It's to punish people who would take more than recommended by giving them liver damage. That's what the whole war on drugs is, punishing recreational drug users by increasing the harm that comes to them. Even if the doctor doesn't share that philosophy, the government forces it on them by making their life a living hell (everything from DEA records seizures and questioning, right up through loss of license and decades in jail) if they prescribe too many pure oxycodone products.

    13. Re:And good luck asking for APAP-free medicine! by fafalone · · Score: 1

      I also think they are highly skeptical of someone asking for a specific opiate formulation, even when they initiate the prescription (ie, you have an obvious injury and they prescribe an opiate). It's highly ironic that they're so worried about addiction they're willing to risk serious liver toxicity.

      This is exactly it. For every other condition, patients are encouraged to research their condition and its treatments on their own, and to have an informed discussion with their doctor about treatment options. But not for pain. Anyone with an even modest knowledge of painkillers is instantly labelled a drug-seeker. Ask for a painkiller by name, and the doctor looks at you like you're sitting there with a needle and spoon yelling 'GIMME GIMME DOPE'. And the more you justify why you want something, the worse it is. Doesn't matter how valid your research is, only junkies know that much. And the fact that you might have a clear need doesn't matter. Because if you WANT opiates, you're a drug-seeker, and drug-seekers should be left in pain rather than give them what they want.
      That message has been drilled into doctors heads with the DEA leading the push. It's the DEA and drug warrior bureaucrats that define how pain is treated, not doctors. They know that no matter how thorough and professional their care is, they're one junkie OD away from an investigation and jail. Pain management specialists that actually prescribe should be hailed as heroes. Mine used to have the DEA come in, shut down the clinic, and start seizing files at least once every 6 months. And this is a caring professional who is not even close to a pill mill.

  15. Re:Not "plain senses" by Dins · · Score: 1

    Pretty sure this is intended for security checkpoints like in airports, not random sampling of the population. At least for now...

  16. Re:Great idea by Dins · · Score: 1

    Right, and if detected there's the added bonus that the threat is almost immediately eliminated! However, one unfortunate side effect is that the tester and testing area might also be eliminated. But hey, it's a work in progress...!

  17. I'm on board! by CyberDruid · · Score: 2

    I for one, look forward to be electrocuted in loyal service to a totalitarian new world order. This way, they can exert a greater control over their treasonous subjects!

    I certainly hope the recent slander from Snowden will not stop the NSA and other semi-autonomous government organs around the world from keeping a full record of all traces of substances which are found on my body, each time I travel. That will be great in case someone in power is ever questioned and would need to put the offending party in prison or at least character assassinate them!

    --

    Opinions stated are mine and do not reflect those of the Illuminati

  18. "Don't Worry, it's only 400k volts" by retroworks · · Score: 1

    This is intriguing. Jokes about tasers and cattleprods will abound, and it would definitely get plenty of late night comedy attention. But if the science is good, it will have a lot of commercial applications. As the employer of several commercial truck drivers (and a CDL who takes the tests myself), I'd be very interested in having one at the doorway of our employment office (to scare away certain substance abusing job applicants, mainly).

    What it doesn't really address is the "bottleneck" equation at TSA. We've already reached the breakeven point where a suicide bomber can kill more people standing in the incoming security line of the airport than he'd kill bringing down a plane (arguably TSA is mainly a property crime and marketing psychology tool). Also I wonder what the "false positives" rates are and how many people will miss flight connections. You are going after one out of a billion flyers, it would have to either be wickedly accurate in order to achieve it's outcome, which is to redirect suicide bombers from airplanes and towards softer targets.>/p>

    --
    Gently reply
    1. Re:"Don't Worry, it's only 400k volts" by the_fat_kid · · Score: 1

      Your magic door way to the employment office (with death ray?) will also be good for keeping out anyone with any cash or Tylenol. Are you really prepared to bet you job that you haven't touched either? I'm not suggesting that you use drugs but your money does. American money is so soaked with cocaine you can almost chew it like coca leaves. If the trucking industry is so filled with Drug Addicts maybe the problem is deeper than "scaring away applicants"
      Now, if we can come up with a skin test for prostitute killing psyco I think we might have some thing.

      --
      -- Sig under construction...
    2. Re:"Don't Worry, it's only 400k volts" by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      We've already reached the breakeven point where a suicide bomber can kill more people standing in the incoming security line of the airport than he'd kill bringing down a plane

      Was there ever a time when that wasn't the case? Typical numbers queuing at my local airport (where I start or end intercontinental, but thankfully not American, flights on a monthly basis) are around a hundred, and the maximum size plane they can service is about 150~170. Since not all planes run full, it's probably always been more efficient to trigger the bomb when approaching the X-ray machines. (BTW, I think the radiation shielding in the X-ray machines will likely double up as blast containment. That's how I'd design one, anyway.)

      Thinking to larger airports ... yeah, easily a plane load of people in most scanning areas, except at 3 in the morning. I seriously suspect that the security check has always been a viable detonation point. The only thing doing the plane adds is visceral terror of surviving the bomb to experience the free fall. Briefly.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  19. Re:TSA pull my finger by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 2

    Any air travelers left in that shit hole of an abortion of a country called Merika? Line up at the Van de Graaff scanner! The wool you're covered with will be standing on end.

    Infowars called, They want you back.

    --
    The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
  20. 100 to 1000 times below NOEL by justthinkit · · Score: 1

    100 to 1000 times below NOEL is the goal -- the standard that few come close to.

    The maximum daily dose of Paracetamol (aka Acetaminophen) is 66% of the FATAL dose.

    --
    I come here for the love
    1. Re: 100 to 1000 times below NOEL by TheMeuge · · Score: 1

      You've got to be kidding me. Almost no drug gets anywhere near that. I'm happy with one log10 of leeway.

  21. Uh, let's see now... by jenningsthecat · · Score: 1

    "explosives, flammable solvents, cocaine...

    Depending on how specific their criteria, and how high they set the detection thresholds, the following people could be in for serious grief:

    1) Gardeners and farmers - (nitrate compounds from fertilizer, + fuel oil from any of a dozen sources)
    2) Painters, mechanics, people with Zippo lighters, people who use hand sanitizer, people who gas up their own vehicles - (flammable solvents)
    3) Anyone who handles paper money (cocaine)

    They'd be better off doing genetic research to figure out how to give us all the olfactory capabilities of blood hounds. Then none of us would have any secrets from each other. Of course, the ass-sniffing thing would get old pretty fast.

    --
    'The Economy' is a giant Ponzi scheme whose most pitiable suckers are the youngest among us and the yet-unborn.
  22. Re:countermeasure by Charliemopps · · Score: 2

    So... am I incorrect in thinking that a decent countermeasure would be to ground yourself in some way? Shoes with a hole in the toe... or if the put a grounding mat on the floor you could have a capacitor in your pocket...

    I would imagine that alarms would be set off if you didn't discharge into the mass spectrometer inlet even if it was just a "test malfunction, redo test" alarm. Also, grounding yourself while touching a Van de Graaff generator can be a very painful experience which would (hopefully) be noticed by the operator...

    And would give you a good excuse to refuse another test...

  23. Re:countermeasure by Charliemopps · · Score: 1

    There are ways of discharging static into a capacitor without a connection to the earth... I did it in high-school, but do not remember the specifics.

  24. Risk of Burns by Graydyn+Young · · Score: 1

    Wouldn't this be rather dangerous to use outside of the lab? I would think that if a person tried to pull their hand off the generator while it's on, the arc would burn them quite badly.

  25. Dubai will love this by l0ungeb0y · · Score: 1

    In Dubai, they already arrest and convict people if they find race amounts of marijuana on the soles of their shoes, I can only imagine they will be among the first to implement these detectors at their airport so they can have fun arresting even more infidels who come to visit their dystopian tourist trap.

  26. Many contaminants on paper currency by BoRegardless · · Score: 1

    Not the least of which are illegal drugs and they wind up on the fingertips!

  27. They buried the lead by cmeans · · Score: 1

    Headline should have been: "Scientists gets Cocaine"

    --
    Give a hand, not a hand-out.
  28. New PCS detection? by phillk6751 · · Score: 1

    Now police can use the device to charge you with PCS (possession of a controlled substance) for detecting minute traces of a substance. Just what we needed.

  29. Been there, done that... by tom_gram · · Score: 1

    Well at least the first part. Charging oneself up with a van de graff generator is a common first year physics lecture demo. We have a generator capable of 400,000 Volts (though it doesnt reach that when its humid), and I have many times, in front of about 230 students, held onto the charge storage sphere. for a minute or more. It's supposed to demonstrate the electric field from a point charge (nominally my head), with the 'sensor' being the hair on my head. It is really good at making one's hair stand on end.....

    Of course when we do that demo, we stand on a 2 inch plexiglass plate, which sits on top of a couple of 4x4's. Turns out (not suprisingly) that the discharge part is much more risky than the charging. I have a student turn off the machine, which I'm still holding onto, and wait 30 seconds. The machine is then discharged by touching to ground. That give me a bit of a jolt, but if its done too soon -- IT REALLY HURTS!!

    With the discharge event being an important part of this process, its not something I would willingly undergo....

  30. 400'000 volts by holophrastic · · Score: 1

    Yeah, um, just, no. Once a decade at the science centre is one thing; weekly in public is something totally different.

    I ain't touching that with a ten-foot pole.

    1. Re:400'000 volts by DeputySpade · · Score: 1

      Not even a wooden pole?

      --


      This space intentionally left blank
    2. Re:400'000 volts by holophrastic · · Score: 1

      Depends on the humidity.

  31. Re:My, my, the implications by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

    Application of cologne aka 'Arab shower'.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  32. Re:Preferred Screening Gender by Rich0 · · Score: 1

    Do you have a choice of the gender of the TSA screener, or just a right to one of the same gender?

    Must make it fun dealing with people with Klinefelter's. Just how do you define "gender" in today's society? Today we're just getting started with the marriage debate, but in 20 years we'll progress to figuring out what to do with bathrooms and workplace etiquette.

  33. OD'ing on Tylenol by wganz · · Score: 1

    Is a favorite method of checking out by the spoiled rich brats in the Plano/Richardson, Texas area. They get oral Mucomyst to hopefully counter act it before they die of liver complications. A lot end up on liver transplant lists.

    Tylenol( aka acetaminophen) is a good drug. Just don't get stupid with it. The main problem with this drug is that Homo sapiens is an oxymoron for the bulk of their population here on Earth.

  34. Re:Preferred Screening Gender by mark_reh · · Score: 1

    I'd be more concerned about the size of their fingers and the condition of their nails more than their gender.

  35. THIS IS GREAT! by bussdriver · · Score: 1

    I fixed a dozen of them for my high school when I was a student there. I had them all running together. Fun times! The shocks don't really hurt much; I kind of liked it... avoiding puns...

    Discharging can be done in ways that don't feel so bad, as the parent alluded to... I'm sure the HS mall cops will enjoy watching people jump who don't follow directions (and purposely being unclear with people they do not like.)

    Now if HS put just a fraction of that wasted money on naked scanners and molesting children... They could still waste $$$ for contracted devices but these actually work and have to cost significantly less. (Hey, the pedo job is 1 more salaried position for people who don't want naked photos of themselves taken; so it's not cheap either.)

    --
    Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
    1. Re:THIS IS GREAT! by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      When I was a kid we used to like to buy large caps at Radio Shack. Take them home and charge them, then rush back to radio shack to return them before they could discharge. Good times. Only worked once per store/clerk.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  36. It's a Spectometer by bussdriver · · Score: 1

    They will be able to detect many substances and do statistics on those. You might test off for drugs if you have a lot of money or handled a lot of money-- assuming you would leave your wallet out of the machine as one does at the airport -- if you handled a lot of money you'd get the extra treatment... in which case wash your hands before you go thru it; then you'll probably fit within the normal levels (assuming they calibrate the machine properly-- so many people use plastic that cash users will stand out from the average person.)

    I'm sure that some law will prohibit forcing people to have their recent diet tested to be a passenger... but pilots etc will not and this could make drug/alcohol tests CHEAP and commonplace. No more blowing into a tube which has to be sanitized each time-- you just breath in a general direction!

    Passive tests could be done without you knowing - there are evil uses for this. Making you wait in a long hall way for your interview for a job... they could charge the bench or the floor and use the security cameras... You could be ruled out for the job without knowing it was because of your medication (it's not like HR would buy the most accurate machines.) No, you CAN be discharged without a big shock so you wouldn't suspect it.

    --
    Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
  37. Re:Now I can check my kids by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

    Out of curiosity. What will you do if you catch your kid playing with explosives?

    My dad was 'That's my boy!'. Mom had sworn him to not tell any of us any of his 'when I blew up...' stories. Once I got there on my own, I got to hear them.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  38. it's just a speculum by the_fat_kid · · Score: 1

    And this is some how a good thing?

    I'm sure that some law will prohibit forcing people to have their recent diet tested to be a passenger...

    No "law" is going to prevent the TSA from deploying this against everyone who flies
    or takes a train
    or a bus
    or drives
    or uses public buildings
    or looks suspicious
    you know, Terrorists

    --
    -- Sig under construction...
    1. Re:it's just a speculum by bussdriver · · Score: 1

      They can't molest people legally-- EXCEPT the TSA. The TSA, NSA, CIA and military are above the laws already.

      --
      Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news