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Logitech Aims To Control the Smart Home
An anonymous reader writes: Household devices are getting smarter these days: the so-called internet of things is bringing software-controlled thermostats, lighting, and other appliances into the mainstream. Many companies are fighting for a piece of the pie, but Logitech is taking a different approach. They're mostly known for computer peripherals, but they also make multi-function remote controls, and now they're trying to build remotes that will control all of a home's smart devices. "Logitech doesn't want to own the device, it wants to own the app experience. But to do that, it had to build a software overlay and a controller that would convince people to put it in their homes. So it's offering a $100 hub that combines IR, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth and RF that will let you use the Logitech Harmony app to control gear that uses those protocols. This means if you have a SmartThings, a Peq or a Lutron hub, the Wi-Fi in the Logitech device will let you control the others' gear from Logitech, which so far seems to have a much nicer interface." They've worked out partnerships with a lot of companies that are big in the home, like Nest, Honeywell, and Philips, all of whom seem to want this extra layer of control for the user.
Google, Apple & Microsoft will control (and stagnate) the HA industry by buying up all the innovative little patent holders to try to force people their platform.
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I hope their home offering isn't like the TV remotes, where to get it to work, I had to create an account with them (with demands for a lot of personal info), go through their relatively awkward website to find the televisionI was using, have that downloaded to the device via USB, and then add some configuring after that before the remote could be used as a remote.
Heck with that. If a remote can't offer an interface to locate stuff on the device itself, it should at least not require an Internet connection (the application should handle this, perhaps downloading codes for newer items), and definitely not require registration on a website to be used.
So...when this device gets hacked, does my entire home get pwned ?
with any of said companies servers I'm ok with it. The major problem with all these things is that everyone wants information about me. I'v had enough with that. In fact, I think there needs to be laws protecting people from these companies. There are strict laws prohibiting recording of audio. There needs to be laws prohibiting recording of any kind of information. Law's that can't be undone by a 50 page EULA that no one reads and that is updated every 14 days anyway.
Non-technical people are too frustrated by smart home systems because they don't know how they work, they're constantly misconfiguring them, and they don't know what to do when they break. Technical people and smart enough to know that it's a giant hacker target and stupid marketing fluff for a detrimental product. That leaves a market of....nobody.
I still don't understand which problem these smart devices would solve for me. It's a light switch. It's on when I want the lights on. It's off when I flick it. The thermostat requires my attention four times per year, when the season changes -- and software doesn't help because the floor registers need to be adjusted manually, and it's still no more than 5 minutes of "effort" per year. I sure as hell ain't letting software turn on my oven, and I'm not letting water nor fire run when I'm not home -- because I've read my house insurance policy; can you say "negligent behaviour"? And again, none of this was difficult to begin with. How about solving a problem that I have, instead of trying to convince me that I have a problem?
People that buy technology, particularly the innovators that buy the new products like their privacy. You want to wire my home and be the company that sets the standard?
Make my personal privacy your priority.
Because honestly, that is my primary concern. I don't want to put a camera or microphone in my home and have ANY concern that someone else might look at it.
So you need to convince me that not only can I set up the password, but that I can trust your company not to put in a back door. That means convincing me that you will go BEYOND what I consider to be necessary. I need to believe that you will stand up to the NSA and close the company down if they come knocking on your door with a court order to not even talk about you getting the court order.
Otherwise, I would rather buy the equipment myself and pick the software myself. That way I know the software is not customized to open back doors on the hardware.
Because I am perfectly willing to give up the functionality you so loudly proclaim is helpful if I can't trust you.
excitingthingstodo.blogspot.com
Logitech has some serious issues to contend with. Namely, they dont adhere to standards entirely like bluetooth and expect users to install management and configuration software. this software is cloud based and requires an internet connection to function as well as constant communication with the logitech servers. The other issue is that this might not be the right direction at all. Home ownership has sharply declined after the great recession. the new owners are investment firms that bought up the property for a song and would seek to minimize expenses like regular maintenance and home automation upgrades for their tenents. At best their venture will amount to a bunch of neat devices that still dont entirely play nice with eachother, and a few houses with enough background RF radiation to broil a turkey in the living room.
Good people go to bed earlier.
Yes, but why the hell would modern hackers(who are after money, rather than bragging rights) give a shit about your air conditioner?
There is plenty of malware out there that has no purpose other than causing problems for others. Some @$$hole amusing themselves. There are WAY too many smart bored young hackers with a chip on their shoulder. Someone is going to cause problems just because they can.
Plus if someone really wanted to cause problems they could turn EVERYONES air conditioner up all at the same time on the same day to try to overload the system.
Hopefully this will not bring new meaning to the term.
Brought to you by Carl's Junior.
This issue keeps being pushed from time to time, but I am not at all convinced that there really is a good justification. It's not that I'm a luddite - or, I hope that I'm not - but introducing technology that doesn't solve a problem is idiotic - like eating oysters despite disliking them, simply because it is a luxury. I can see the use of being able to find free parking spaces in real time - that would be very useful - or having cheap, networked sensors measuring things like temperature, wind speed etc. But other things I have heard of - like being able to check what's in your fridge over your smartphone - that just solves problems that we don't have.
So, the intent here is that I'm going to install a bunch of devices with dubious security (and which likely provide my information for marketing/analytic purposes), to do tasks I can already do now, and have the whole thing controlled by a single source using protocols which themselves have dubious security, and which have the potential to either damage the stuff in my house or cost me money?
Have I got this right?
Because, really, nothing about this scenario sounds appealing to me. It just seems like technology for the sake of technology.
The privacy and security implications of this "smart" home make me want to grab another layer of tinfoil.
I'm sure there will be nerds salivating over being able to use their smart phone to flush the toilet. But I have no interest whatsoever in this stuff.
Why does the exciting new future always seem like rehashed ideas which nobody really actually has any need of and which are mostly toys for people with too much money?
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Logitech never opened up the Harmony remote API for interfacing with the smart hub, etc. I won't be buying into any home automation products from them until they do. So much potential squandered by them keeping everything so closed.
Only a fool would be OK with cloud based control and automation. If all the processing and control is not done on the local LAN then the product is 100% crap.
And yes I am calling most of this consumer "smart home" products utter crap.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Only a fool would be OK with cloud based control and automation. If all the processing and control is not done on the local LAN then the product is 100% crap.
The programming of the system is cloud based. The communications between the remote, the base, and your device occurs locally. The only ongoing cloud stuff comes in if you want to be able to use the app on your smartphone to control certain devices while you're away. If you don't want this functionality, nothing stopping you from firewalling off the base so that it can't communicate with the outside word.
...si hoc legere nimium eruditionis habes...
I started a project, a game engine built for controlling electronics, that can do the same thing using open source hardware, and for free:
Screenshots from the current Alpha: http://imgur.com/a/p6Obn
Website: https://hyperplaneinteractive....
Blog: https://hyperplaneinteractive....
If you log in and go to the Account page, you can download and install Touch Control System (TCS). It has some sample mods to explore, including a screen of light bulbs. The Module Editor is fully functional so you can create new mods and content.
There are a several home automation companies out there (Logitech now one of them) who specialize in selling you custom hardware that is super expensive, only works with their software, and requires a certified technician any time you have problems. I can tell you from experience that they all have frustrating levels of limitations (some don't even allow for script variables), are narrowly focused on their own hardware, and get outdated very quickly. The total cost of ownership for these things are insane. I think we've made something much better.
I still don't understand which problem these smart devices would solve for me. It's a light switch. It's on when I want the lights on. It's off when I flick it.
There are plenty of use cases though they may or may not apply to you. I have controls on certain lights in my house because I forget to turn them off. It's also nice to be able to control multiple lights at the same time for specific purposes. If I'm setting up to watch a movie it's nice to not have to hit several switches, dim the lights, turn on a bunch of devices, etc. Instead of me wandering through the house turning stuff off at night, I can simply push one button and set everything. Same with when I come home. I can check if I've left lights on or turn them on remotely if needed. It's certainly a luxury and not a necessity I'll admit but that doesn't mean it isn't useful or that I don't have a use for it.
Furthermore fine grained controls can save power. While the technology is still new so the economic payback is sometimes iffy, I do get satisfaction out of not wasting power needlessly.
The thermostat requires my attention four times per year, when the season changes -- and software doesn't help because the floor registers need to be adjusted manually, and it's still no more than 5 minutes of "effort" per year.
Sounds like that may not apply to you. I tinker with my thermostat more often than that and having some controls actually is pretty helpful to me. I have a Nest thermostat and I've found it pretty helpful to be able to control and check the house temperature through my smartphone.
I sure as hell ain't letting software turn on my oven
But you might want the ability to turn it off in case you left it running for some reason. It's quite possible to make a control that only turns things off. It's also possible to have it notify you that it is on if you leave the premises.
How about solving a problem that I have, instead of trying to convince me that I have a problem?
Be careful generalizing your own situation. There are plenty of us out here who actually do find some of this stuff useful.
Home pwner.
In my humble opinion, the ISO needs to create a communication standard for all smart home devices, that way the end user can get any device and control it with any app that controls any other device.
But what do i know, I am just a pion in the great scheme of things.
Don't appear to make tv/home theater remotes.
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The main driver for me was that I wanted to control a light switch on my pier remotely, I decided to purchase a starter kit that had more switches and outlets so I did a little more than just the pier light to test some of these devices out.
My wife and I fall asleep sometimes watching TV and lights can get left on, so I've programmed the lights to automatically shutoff at a certain time if they are left on.
My daughter likes to read in bed and can shut off the light from her bed if she has a remote or device with her.
Separately, I noticed bathroom lights being left on all the time by the kids, so I installed motion detection light switches in the bathrooms, unfortunately I only installed one for the main lights in the bathroom and not the mirror lights, and I swear those are on every time I walk past a bathroom.
I would like to have sensors on my doors to know if someone went in my house when no one was home or set as an alarm at night.
What I dislike is that I am stuck with only this one brand currently using their proprietary communication protocol, but I don't feel that I have a lot of money invested in this hobby at this point and could switch brands if I really found something that I liked better, but I believe the industry still has a way to go, for remote control of the pier light alone, I find it worth it, the rest is just hobby really. I could use different brands for different functions I suppose (1 brand for the lights and outlets and another for the security function), but it would be a lot nicer to mix and match across the many brands.
Raspberry Pi and Arduino already exist and do the job handily. My home's already covered from CCTV to lighting & temperature to intercoms and it all integrates with XBMC scripts that both control and notify on every TV in the house, powered by (you guessed it) more/Raspberry Pis. Controllable through tablets and smart phones as well as my TV remote. All hard-wired aside from the wireless endpoint, and no lousy third party servers that everything gets uploaded to.
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I used to be a big Logitech fan. Not any more.
I had one of their trackballs for close to 10 years. I was happy with it and loved it, so I bought a new one when it failed. The new one died in 9 months.
So I bought one of their mice, 'cause I've always had good luck with them. It died in 6 months.
Logitech makes absolute CRAP nowadays. There is no way in hell I'd trust them to keep my house working
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
I can highly recommend Logitech for home infrastructure. I decide to invest in the Logitech Squeezebox line with two SB Touch, four SB Radios, and even a Boom sitting around somewhere. Rather than going with something with short shelf life, it is good to be on a platform from a known long-term player, with a long-term commitment for maintaining and further developing that platform. Their server software is rather well hidden on the internet, but hey ... if something is not worth spending lots of time chasing, then it is probably not of much value - I understand, you are just playing hard to get Logitech. I know that deep down you actually want my business.
I also own a Harmony remote. It works great, except the one annoyance that it cannot be programmed so that the TV button actually controls the TV, unless you reprogram the entire thing. I am sure they will get around to fixing that eventually, they are probably just too busy rolling out the next Squeezebox upgrade, so I don't mind waiting a few years more for that one.
Given Logitech's reputable history in the home media center market, I certainly have expectations what they could do to home automation.
We'll call all the device manufacturers IBM, Dell, etc. And Logitech's app Windows. Great model if you can convince the soon to be commodity manufacturers to go along with it.
I will never trust Logitech to run anything on my home network again. They had a great platform in their Squeezebox devices, but ditched it and rendered the devices obsolete. A couple of years later and it is probably still the best alternative to Sonos.
I realise the device in the article is not a platform, but I am not going to buy anything from them other than unintegrated bits and pieces of hardware.