Sony To Take On Netflix With Playstation Vue

stephendavion writes "Sony is planning to launch PlayStation Vue, a TV service for PlayStation 3 and PlayStation 4 consoles providing on demand programs and live content. The company will roll out the service to selected customers in New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles, and is expected to feature content from CBS, Fox, NBC Universal, Discovery Communications and 75 other channels. The service is expected to allow users to save their programs for up to 28 days."

Comments

Stupid

[halivar]

Netflix works on every device, everywhere. Sony is planning a competitor that works on a system with a fraction of Netflix's availability. Ask Microsoft how well the XBox Live's on-demand streaming is kicking Netflix's ass.

Re:Stupid

[ganjadude]

exactly. this is another attempt at vender lockin in a market where openess has already been king. What cant you put netflix on? and for that matter what cant you put XBMC on these days???

I like the idea of being able to do more with the systems, but this seems like a "they got it so we need it" type thing. except there is no need at all for such a service.

Re:Stupid

[rhsanborn]

That's because they need to stop trying to make a Netflix clone and do something new. Apple pay isn't better or all that different from Google's NFC pay, the difference is that they've done the legwork to build a network of vendors. Similarly, whoever can build a model where their service has live streams of TV shows and channels that people want, or something similar, will be fantastically successful. It's not clear, but this may very well do that.

Re:Stupid

[lolocaust]

What's interesting is that it's marketed as a "PlayStation" product when they could have tied their television service to, you know, the televisions that they are known for.

Re:Stupid

[chemicaldave]

Sony has exclusive rights to publish software on their own hardware and you think it's stupid that they're only focusing on that user base? Seems like the first logical step for a competitor.

Re:Stupid

[91degrees]

And it's very likely to suffer from Sony's usual concern about not ditrupting Sony's other business interests, so crippling their product - a concernt that Netflix isn't worried about.

Re:Stupid

[BarbaraHudson]

What's interesting is that it's marketed as a "PlayStation" product when they could have tied their television service to, you know, the televisions that they are known for.

Do people even buy Sony TVs any more? Well, the stats say some do, but nowhere near Samsung and LGs numbers. Go into any big box store and the Sony TVs are positioned like the 2nd tier products they are.

Re:Stupid

[NotDrWho]

I just worry that all these Netflix wannabes is going to fracture the content market (with content being hopelessly split amongst competing streaming services thanks to a morass of exclusive deals). It's fine now, with just Netflix and Amazon Prime being serious contenders (and Hulu's half-assed effort pulling up the distant rear). But I see a possible future where I've got 300 different streaming services on my box, all of them wanting a monthly fee--and with me trying to remember which one of those 300 has the movie or TV show I want to watch tonight.

Re: Stupid

[pauljlucas]

Apple pay isn't better or all that different from Google's NFC pay, the difference is that they've done the legwork to build a network of vendors.

The differences are that Apple Pay is easier to set up (just take a picture of your CC card -- no logging in to your bank's web site), easier to use (just put your finger in the sensor -- no turning on the phone, no launching the Wallet app, no PIN to enter), neither Apple nor the merchant has your real CC number (unlike Google), and the kicker is that Apple doesn't track your purchases (unlike Google that brokers every purchase through their Wallet debit card).

Re:Stupid

[Anonymous Coward]

XBMC is an inferior media platform when compared to Plex.

Re:Stupid

[jedidiah]

The only thing it has on XBMC is the server side transcoding and that's something that should be made obsolete by better decoding hardware.

Also, the Plex backend server is an incredible pig if you've got a non-trivial media library. In general, the whole thing makes you want to rip it apart and re-engineer it for efficiency and performance.

Re:Stupid

[swb]

I would think that fracturing the market would be less likely the greater the number of competitors.

The more services there are, the more likely their subscriber base is smaller and the more a content provider is going to charge per view and upfront to guarantee the same revenue they would get releasing content to more outlets.

There's very little fracturing between Netflix and Amazon now -- both have some self-produced shows and both have a handful of exclusives. Amazon is probably paying a dear price to get HBO content exclusively.

It's probably the reason Amazon and Netflix are getting big on self-produced content. It may be cheaper to produce a good show yourself and have an exclusive than to buy them from content providers.

Re:Stupid

[ganjadude]

I have not really messed with PLEX yet. XBMC with the XBMC hub wizard installed is pretty much functional out of the box, and works on damn near any hardware these days. its one of those things ive been using for so long that it does everything i want it to do so I havent bothered looking at anything else.

Would you mind telling me some of the differences between the 2 platforms?

Re:Stupid

[jedidiah]

Yes it is stupid because computing devices are all about network effects. This applies equally well to game consoles and web services. NO ONE is going to want to be restricted to your hardware for something like this. Apple may be able to pull off that kind of nonsense but Sony just doesn't have the chops for it.

Plus the Apple examples includes other devices and an ecosystem that's well established already.

All Sony has is a relatively overpriced game console.

Sony's service should be EVERYWHERE including Android phones and Rokus.

Re:Stupid

[nine-times]

I just worry that all these Netflix wannabes is going to fracture the content market (with content being hopelessly split amongst competing streaming services thanks to a morass of exclusive deals).

I think that's the goal here. The content owners have had a sweet deal for years, making money from a lot of different angles. They got people to pay for cable, pay for HBO/Showtime, got them to buy DVDs, and got money from advertisments packed into each of these distribution channels (plus cross-promotional marketing and all kinds of other silliness). Now, after decades of figuring out every little spot they can pull money from, the market changes, and people's expectations change. At this point, people really want (and kind of expect) to be able to get all of their media from streaming, whenever and wherever they like. It totally screws up the business models for the content owners, and it destroys the business models for all the other distribution channels.

So these businesses have been getting clever on how to fight back. One of the methods is to hamper the Internet's ability to function as a distribution medium. They're in league with the ISPs, and both are working together to prevent anything resembling real competition in that market. Meanwhile, they've dragged their feet in providing real broadband internet, and they've fought against net neutrality, and they've choked the distribution points that would allow digital media from being reliable (e.g. the Netflix/Verizon kerfuffle).

One of the other pieces of their strategy is to prevent any company from being able to provide anything resembling a "complete library" of TV shows or movies. Each media company splits their library. They give some things to Netflix, some things to Hulu, some things to Amazon, some things to Crackle... etc. They might provide most of the same content to both Netflix and Amazon, for example, but they make sure to provide each with exclusive content, so that if you want to be able to watch whatever you want to watch, you need to pay for both. So while having a "decently sized library" will cost you $9/month, getting "something close to a complete library" will cost $100/month (or whatever the number is) because you have to sign up for several different services. And then, even then, they'll hold back some high-demand content (e.g. Game of Thrones) so that you still need to get cable and premium services to watch what you want to watch. This serves two basic functions: (a) It makes cord-cutting more frustrating, since you can't rely on any set of services to have all the content you want; and (b) it milks extra money from consumers.

And don't think for a second that it's accidental. All this stuff is part of a coherent strategy on the part of a cartel that includes the media companies who own/produce the content and the ISPs and cable companies that distribute it.

However, with the "exclusive content" stuff specifically, there is an additional contributing factor. A lot of the people who rise to positions of power in many companies are from marketing and sales. Marketing people need to justify their existence, which means that they have to come up with clever ideas and special promotions, and bla bla bla. Some of this stuff is clever. Some of it is even kind of nice for consumers. However, for the lazy marketing person, the easiest thing to do these days seems to be to develop a cross-promotional deal of some kind, or exclusive rights for some distribution channel. A lot of times, these deals are stupid and a waste of time. They don't necessarily lead to an increase in sales for anyone, but nobody cares because it's just the stuff that marketing people do, and marketing people run the world. But then also, things like "exclusive rights" can be leverage for getting other concessions, e.g. "We'll give you exclusive rights to this big hit movie, but in return, you agree to..." whatever.

Re:Stupid

[ArcadeMan]

Sony's test launch is limited to the PS3 and PS4 and their selected areas are limited to New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles.

Netflix works on a lot of devices from a lot of companies and has subscribers in over 40 countries.

Isn't Crackle owned by Sony anyway? If their "new" service is anything similar, be prepared to view the same stupid two or three ads, every 10 to 15 minutes, cutting right in the middle of scenes with no proper "insert ads here" timing while trying to watch a movie.

Re:Stupid

[Solandri]

The real danger is that Sony is also a content producer (Columbia TriStar). Them fiddling around with a distribution method means there's a risk they will pull their film library from other distributors and put it exclusively on their own network. Want to stream movies like Lawrence of Arabia and The Shawshank Redemption? I'm sorry, they're only available on Playstation Vue. (Netflix is no exception - they produce House of Cards and it's available exclusively via Netflix)

This sort of vertical integration really distorts the market. Microsoft refusing for years to release Office for Android and iOS because they wanted to protect their Windows franchise. Verizon playing hardball with MVNOs so they can retain claim to the title of best mobile network (imagine if the companies who owned the cellular towers were different from the companies which provided the service), Cable companies trying to control and charge extra for the data that goes through their exclusive pipes, etc. I can understand the integration if nobody else is willing to offer the product/service to your satisfaction. But if there are lots of competitors out there providing the service, it should be illegal to blatantly withhold your product from all other services except yours.

Re:Stupid

[ArcadeMan]

There's no such thing as Amazon Prime and Hulu outside of the U.S.A.

Netflix is in 40 countries.

Re:Stupid

[drinkypoo]

XBMC is a player. Plex is a player, sure, but it's also a server. It transcodes your media and hands it off to other Plex clients, and more importantly it serves metadata to Plex clients so that they don't have to fetch and store it locally — the main weakness of XBMC in an environment with more than one player, IMO. You can copy media information between systems manually, and maybe someone has a plugin which does this by now, but I haven't seen it. In theory, a distributed filesystem would do this job for XBMC, but I don't know if XBMC would crap itself if two clients tried to update the library at once. I would guess yes, but I don't actually know.

There is a Plex client for XBMC. Last I checked, it worked most of the time without exploding.

The downside to Plex, obviously, is that it requires a powerful server. Using XBMC lets you stuff your files onto any meager system. But let's say you've got an Xbox 360 in your house. You could run the minidlna server on an extremely limited server (if you can get it to build on a modern platform) but obviously you won't have any transcoding in that situation, so you'll only be able to play a handful of the common codec/container combinations. If you had a more powerful server and used Plex, then you'd be able to play everything on the machine. If you don't want to use Plex, you can get the same functionality with PS3MediaServer. It both provides a DLNA server which will hand files to the 360, and transcodes (and handles container formats) so that the files are playable. It has a fairly large install footprint, however, as it's a Java application and it comes with copies of all the popular transcoding applications so as to ensure their versions. So you might as well run Plex, and enjoy their XBMC-esque client.

Re:Stupid

[shadowrat]

ha ha! this was my first thought after reading the summary. I have no playstation. i'm sure as hell not going to be swayed into buying one just to watch movies and tv.

Re:Stupid

[tlhIngan]

I just worry that all these Netflix wannabes is going to fracture the content market (with content being hopelessly split amongst competing streaming services thanks to a morass of exclusive deals). It's fine now, with just Netflix and Amazon Prime being serious contenders (and Hulu's half-assed effort pulling up the distant rear). But I see a possible future where I've got 300 different streaming services on my box, all of them wanting a monthly fee--and with me trying to remember which one of those 300 has the movie or TV show I want to watch tonight.

That's the point. No one provider will "have it all" and the content producers have intentionally done it this way. The movie industry saw what iTunes did to the music industry when it basically became the way to get music and the immense power Apple had to force the industry to accept its terms.

So the movie industry is intentionally splitting their catalog across multiple services - Netflix gets some, Amazon gets others, etc., so no one of them will end up being a monopsony.

As for finding which one of the servers? Multi-library search should be available on popular devices. I mean, the Xbox can do it (it you search for a movie or TV show, it'll show you which providers have it), and I think Amazon's FireTV can too as well.

Re:Stupid

[jedidiah]

> XBMC is a player. Plex is a player, sure, but it's also a server. It transcodes your media and hands it off to other Plex clients, and more importantly it serves metadata to Plex clients so that they don't have to fetch and store it locally â" the main weakness of XBMC in an environment with more than one player,

Not a big deal really.

XBMC is the gold standard when it comes to metadata management. So the fact that you have to do it n+1 times is really not a problem.

The lack of a central repository means that you can't do cool multi-room stuff. However, I am not sure that Plex does any of that either. Meanwhile, it's central metadata server is an unbelievable pig and resource hog. It's an amazing disaster to behold.

The main value of Plex is that it will accommodate that $60 streamer that has crap hardware that can't really decode anything.

Re:Stupid

[spire3661]

NO! They are different. Plex is better at streaming, but XBMC is the better local client. I like Plex but i cant stand the sync shit. Just give me direct access to the damn file. Paying for penetrating the firewall is pretty annoying too, but i have lifetime so whatever.

Re: Stupid

[spire3661]

Just use cash, its infinitely easier than all this nonsense.

Re:Stupid

[TheSync]

Netflix is no exception - they produce House of Cards and it's available exclusively via Netflix.

No, "House of Cards" is produced by Media Rights Capital and licensed for initial distribution through Netflix.

In Australia, "House of Cards" was shown on Showcase, a Foxtel-owned premium cable channel. In New Zealand, it was shown on TV3 broadcast channel. In India, it was shown on Zee Cafe cable channel, and in Latvia is was on LNT. It also has been released on DVD and Blu-ray.

Want to stream movies like Lawrence of Arabia and The Shawshank Redemption? I'm sorry, they're only available on Playstation Vue.

"Shawshank Redemption" is on Amazon Instant Video, Blockbuster On Demand, M-GO and Redbox Instant.

By the way, Comcast also buys early access to Sony films, including American Hustle and Captain Phillips.

Even on TV networks, companies swap content and distribution. For example, "The Mindy Project" is produced by NBC Universal, but distributed on the Fox broadcast network. "How I Met Your Mother" was produced by Fox, but distributed initially on the CBS broadcast network.

I think you underestimate the desire of Hollywood to distribute TV shows and movies through all appropriate mechanisms, though at the appropriate time and price points, in order to maximize revenue.

Re:Stupid

[fistfullast33l]

I have a plex server running on my headless linux server, and I'm not exactly sure that I'd call it a resource hog. I use it to watch TV and movies that I've ripped from BluRay, as well as some downloaded shows. I'm incredibly happy with it. I run it on a machine with a web server, mongodb database, and obviously my sftp server. I never really notice massive performance hits on the machine.

Sync is a bit of a pain to deal with, but once you figure out how it works (it's a 3 step process and the client never tells you what step you're on) it's manageable. I usually queue 4 things to sync, let it run overnight, and in the morning I'm good to go. Online content (Daily Show, Conan, etc.) can sync, but sometimes it's not supported so that's a bit frustrating. Syncing 6 movies to your iPad for a long flight is a huge improvement over the memory cards I was using for my Vita before.

The big thing, which apparently they're finally working on, is that it doesn't support music playlists in the client. I've never seen such a thing. How do you have a music player without playlists? It's my biggest complaint about Plex. But as I said, they're working on it....slowly...should be here by 2020. I'm using the music player that came with my phone in the meantime.

Re:Stupid

[thaiceman]

XBMC is an inferior media platform when compared to Plex.

You understand that the front end media player for Plex is an XBMC fork right?.. If it wasn't for the server/transcode features Plex would be just a shiny skin on the same essential core.

As someone mentioned above Plex is great till you throw 50k songs at it and another 5-6k videos into it then its true colors start to show as it munches through any/all available ram and it brings your normally fine machine to its knees.

Re:Stupid

[robbyb20]

I dont think you have to pay to get access outside network. you have to pay to let other people get access so you can share, no?

Re:Stupid

[Spazmania]

Now I understand why Sony is on the verge of bankruptcy. Late to the party with underwhelming products.

Re:Stupid

[gfxguy]

That may be, but I agree with the GP... what you've described is already a problem, where you need to competing services to get all of the content, despite the fact that 90% of it overlaps. Now imagine Sony content (including TV shows and several motion picture companies they own as well as libraries of content from studios like MGM, which they acquired a while back) only being available from Sony.

Re:Stupid

[LessThanObvious]

Don't worry, slowly but surely other companies will accept that the time to compete with Netflix was 2003, not 2014. Live streaming is a good area for others to focus, but not if it has to happen from a specific hardware platform. I do like what PBS and some other networks have done, and I appreciate the online availability, it's just hard to monetize. There is room in the market for multiple players, but even Amazon Instant Video has so so far disappointed me. When the say 40,000 titles available to watch on Amazon I have to wonder if they are including the pay per view titles and not just the Prime eligible. I got Prime for my grandmother since it was easier to give as a gift for a year, but I'm not impressed with the selection or the interface of the iPad app. I knew the fight was done the day I bought a Blue-ray player with a dedicated Netflix button on the remote. For that industry, getting the status of a dedicated button was like when Google became a verb. Yahoo! was dead the moment the mass media started using "Google" as the verb for search instead of "Search" or "Use as search engine". When I did the gift for Grandma I also noticed that my relatives could not grasp "Prime is just like Netflix". It was like "Netflix" was in English and any other service was something foreign they couldn't grasp.

Re:Stupid

[drinkypoo]

Plex is a player, sure, but it's also a server. It transcodes your media and hands it off to other Plex clients

Trying to solve problems that don't exist.

Ah yes, the classic "It's not a problem for me, so it's not a problem" coward.

I have media which I can't play on my Xbox 360 without transcoding. Sometimes I want to stream it to the 360. I need Plex or PS3MediaServer to accomplish this. You may not want to do this. That's fine. Shut up, and go away.

Re: Stupid

[pauljlucas]

Just use cash, its infinitely easier than all this nonsense.

Before heading out, you have to check whether you have enough cash on hand. If not, you have to stop by the ATM. To pay, you have to pull out your wallet and look through it for the required bill(s). If you pay with large bills, the cashier may opt to examine the bills carefully to ensure they have the necessary security measures signifying that they're genuine currency.

If you choose to pay the exact amount, you also have to pull out coins and pluck out the required ones. If you didn't use coins, then the cashier has to give you change back. You have to accept the change putting the coins in one place and the bills, if any, in another. You should also count the change to ensure the cashier gave you the correct amount.

Yeah, that's so much easier.

how are they competing with netflix?

[thaylin]

The service is expected to allow users to save their programs for up to 28 days.

Sounds like they are competing with a dvr.

Re:how are they competing with netflix?

[tepples]

When do TiVo's patents on key DVR features expire?

Will it be live tv?

[Tyr07]

Either they're offering direct TV options through the net, comparable to cable, with saving the program for 28 days, or they plan to charge per show.

Micro transactions are not going to work on everything. In fact, they only work with things provided for free that happen to have microtransactions to get ahead further like video games.

They probably want you to rent shows. Good luck Sony.

crackle

[BradMajors]

Sony already has a TV service for the playstation. It is called crackle and it sucks: http://www.crackle.com/

Re:crackle

[Wootery]

Still no explanation as to why they closed the UK version in April.

Re: crackle

[ArcadeMan]

If can be free and still suck. Last time I tried it, the ads were inserted in the middle of a scene and it was the same two or three ads being played all the time. Ads are supposed to be informative, not brainwashing.

Also, unlike what AC is saying below, Seinfeld is not available (at least in Canada).

Look I love my PS4, but...

[NotDrWho]

It won't work with my universal remote. So I'm just never going to use it for streaming. Roku, AppleTV, etc. work just fine for that, and have way more apps and less complicated interfaces.

Cue legal action from a UK cinema chain

[Grench]

There's a cinema chain here in the UK called "Vue"; they have over 80 cinemas as far south as Plymouth to as far north as Inverness. And those are just the ones with Vue branding - they own cinema chains across Europe under different trading names. I wonder if they're thinking of rebranding them all Vue right about now... They have the right to, and hell, I might be tempted to, if I was in their position.

I can't see them permitting an online streaming movie product (in the UK, at least) under that name, without at least getting some revenue from Sony for the name, or without being beaten down by Sony lawyers in a bitter dispute. Possibly pan-European, if they did suddenly decide "all of our cinemas are going to be called Vue now".

Also, echoing what others have said - forget trying to compete with Netflix (or whatever Amazon's LoveFilm service is called these days) unless your product can:

1) work in a web browser on any platform, like Netflix
2) have a wider selection of media than Netflix
3) offer this choice for less money than Netflix

It's just pissing money into the wind if they don't make a product that meets all three of the above goals. Sony knows how to make a lot of money from home entertainment, but they know how to lose a lot too.

Re:Cue legal action from a UK cinema chain

[ArcadeMan]

1. work in a web browser on any platform or on hardware platforms from multiple vendors.

Frankly I still find it hard to believe that so many people watch TV shows and movies on their computer, in a web browser on top of that. The living room and big screen TV is a better choice than sitting at your computer desk or on a sofa with a laptop on your legs.

Re:Cue legal action from a UK cinema chain

[jedidiah]

> Frankly I still find it hard to believe that so many people watch TV shows and movies on their compute

Have you looked at the back of a computer in the last 5 or 8 years?

They include HDMI ports now.

Once TVs went digital, the distinction between a computer monitor and TV blurred something considerable. Projectors have been very accommodating to computers too (and for much longer).

Re:Cue legal action from a UK cinema chain

[ArcadeMan]

I don't count using the computer as a playback device only as "watching on the computer". You're still watching on a TV.

This explains the lack of dlna services

[Bonzoli]

Sad because that one feature would have upped their sales quite a bit.

The problem with corporations.

[Tyr07]

I figured it out.

This is them whenever they see money, period. mine!

Re:The problem with corporations.

[cdrudge]

I figured it out.

This is them whenever they see money, period. mine!

Really? Who would have ever have though a corporation would want to make money.

Re:The problem with corporations.

[ArcadeMan]

There's a different between wanting to make money and thinking that the money should be yours just because you feel entitled to it.

Re:The problem with corporations.

[ArcadeMan]

There's a difference*

Seriously, Slashdot should at least allow edits within 60 seconds of posting.

So no Netflix for PlaystationTV boxes?

[Gibgezr]

If so, they may have just lost a sale. I was considering a PlaystationTV, but I don't know if I want to pay that much just to play Vita games and watch Crunchyroll on my TV.

Re:So no Netflix for PlaystationTV boxes?

[ArcadeMan]

Crunchyroll is available on Apple TV, as well as Netflix.

Re:So no Netflix for PlaystationTV boxes?

[Gibgezr]

Yes, and there is Roku etc.Unfortunately, none of them play Vita games.. I have a slew of devices ar home that can run Netflix/Crunchyroll, but was considering a PlaystationTV because it would be a tiny, highly portable device to lug to the camp in the summer etc., and I have Vita games that I could enjoy on it (I don't actually enjoy playing them on a Vita near as much as I would on a TV).

If all I want is a small Netflix/Crunchyroll box, I can just go buy a Chromecast or Roku stick or something (Walmart sells several devices like that in the "under $40 range"), and stream from my laptop when on the road. It would have been worth the larger pricetag to be able to enjoy Vita games as well, but no Netflix is a deal breaker.

Not a Netflix competitir

[Anonymous Coward]

This article is mis-titled. Vue is not a Netflix competitor, it's a cable TV competitor. We're taking about live TV channels people.

Re:Not a Netflix competitir

[jandrese]

Have you seen Netflix lately? They've got more TV shows on there than movies. Their original content is all episodic series too.

Re:Not a Netflix competitir

[jedidiah]

I would characterize Netflix as those 32 channels on your 500 cable channel bundle that are dominated by old reruns.

Likewise, if you are patient enough you will see older original content from HBO and non-premium cable-only channels.

That leaves "current stuff" and sports.

Re:Not a Netflix competitir

[tepples]

"Live TV channels" is a code word for "sports".

End of netflix on PS

[CimmerianX]

I can almost 100% guarantee that Sony will pull the Netflix functionality from all PS models.

Just like how the PS4 will no longer stream from a home media server because they started to offer their own streaming music service under the guise of "it's a more intuitive and streamlined process for the customer', we will see sony replace netflix with Vue citing the same bullshit.

Don't think they will? How's your PS3 linux partition? Oh wait, sony made that disappear when it suited them too.

Re:End of netflix on PS

[gstoddart]

Well, really, this has been Sony's MO for years -- they are entirely about vendor lock in, pushing their own proprietary crap, and refusing to use anybody else's technology.

Which is precisely why many of us won't buy anything from Sony.

Between Beta, their mini disc format, stripping Linux functionality from the PS3, and now this ... Sony has more or less demonstrated them to be entirely "our stuff shall have supreme dominance at the expense of the consumer".

Sorry Sony, not interested in your crap, and haven't trusted you for 15+ years.

Re:End of netflix on PS

[hodet]

I don't own a PS but they seriously disabled connecting to a home media server? Why people suffer these locked in solutions is beyond me.

Re:End of netflix on PS

[drinkypoo]

I don't think they will, because linux on PS3 affected few of their core gaming users, but removing Netflix would affect many of them. Also, antitrust. Besides, the competition has embraced multiple streaming services — Microsoft has their own service, but that hasn't prevented them from supporting several others. If Sony kicks off the competition, they'll be the only ones to do that, and they'll lose all but the most diehard franchise customers.

Re:End of netflix on PS

[ArcadeMan]

Sony doesn't always take stuff away from us though. Remember that free rootkit a few years ago?

Re:End of netflix on PS

[Svartalf]

There is a reason I am keen on seeing if Valve can manage something with SteamBox/SteamOS/Linux. I'm a bit tired of the BS and lies about this stuff.

Re:End of netflix on PS

[Svartalf]

It's still a hack and a workaround there. Just because it works "okay" and it's "easy" doesn't mean the yanking of the functionality in the PS4 isn't problematic. I know I'm waiting for a critical mass of PS4 titles before I contemplate a move- and with GoogleTV or an Android HDMI stick, it became stupidly easy to do the others. It's another box, but still- Sony's not getting me to sign off on this crap and at the rate they're going I might just give the PS4 a pass as well.

Re:End of netflix on PS

[drafalski]

same as my blu-ray collection - non-existent

Re:End of netflix on PS

[CimmerianX]

yep... based on past actions of Sony. Totally unfounded....

Re:Headline is wrong...

[jandrese]

The big problem is that Sony has a built-in conflict of interest from its Movie division, and will never be able to offer a service as good as Netflix. There will always be internal pressure to not have other studios in there or to put onerous DRM in place.

Re:Never Again

[ganjadude]

people say that every 5 years. remember when they took linux away from the PS3? or the rootkit fiasco? Yet people keep buying them

Sony Pictures

[tepples]

All Sony has is a relatively overpriced game console.

And Columbia Pictures.

Sony's vendetta against Universal?

[tepples]

[My Sony console] won't work with my universal remote.

Of course it wouldn't. Universal and Sony have duked it out in court in the past. Sony has even co-produced and distributed a movie about the dangers of a Universal remote.

Re:Never Again

[The Grim Reefer]

I will never again buy a Sony product, I wonder how many other people feel the same way?

I'm sure plenty, but I'm not one of them. Sony has done some colossally stupid things in the past. rootkit on CDs, the other OS removal on the PS3, exploding batteries, and a bunch of other crap. The thing is, is that there are few to no other companies the size of Sony that haven't done as much or worse.

If you were to boycott every company that's done something incredibly dickish in the past, you'd be living in a cardboard box down by the river. No, probably not as I'm sure the company that made the box probably dumped toxic crap in a river at some point in its past.

I don't really play console games. And if I did I'd be buying the console for games, nothing else. I don't agree with what they did in regards to the Other OS option on the PS3, so I didn't buy one.

But when I bought my last two TVs the Sony XBR models had the best picture (as far as I could see) and options I wanted. So that's what I got. Their ES line of audio equipment has as good of sound as any (to my ears) in a price range that I'm willing to accept. So I have several ES products.

When I decided I wanted to use the 3D capabilities of my TV, I wasn't willing to update my receiver too, and Panasonic was the most reasonable option for a Bluray player with 2 HDMI ports. So I went with Panasonic.

If a company (or even a person) does something stupid and you hold it against them even if they've done something right afterward. What incentive is there for them to change? If I did something cruel to you and then recognized my mistake and treated you kindly afterward. But you kept holding that one mistake against me. What incentive do I have to care about you? Or are you 14 years old and believe that Beelzebub, Sauron, and Voldemort sit atop a tower at Sony and plot the end of days.

Or perhaps Sony's gimmick could be "first"

[tepples]

The big problem is that Sony has a built-in conflict of interest from its Movie division

Conflict of interest can be turned into a synergy. Would "All new Columbia Pictures releases before Netflix gets them" be compelling to anyone?

There will always be internal pressure [...] to put onerous DRM in place.

It's a major game console. There's already "onerous DRM in place." This dates back to the Nintendo Entertainment System of the mid-1980s, which added digital restrictions management to avoid the situation where poorly balanced games for Atari 2600 were causing a deep recession in the North American video game market.

Re:Or perhaps Sony's gimmick could be "first"

[ArcadeMan]

E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial: The Next Generation

Re:Or perhaps Sony's gimmick could be "first"

[jandrese]

That undercuts the existing deals in the Movie division, which is why it won't happen. People spend a lot of movie to get media a few weeks before other competitors, you can't just have the company create a competitor and then give them preferential access. There is a huge complex web of relationships with every release. If this were an easy problem every studio would already have their own version of Netflix for their own releases, but such a service would necessarily be slower, more expensive, and more DRM encumbered than the existing channels to avoid undercutting their existing partners. The middlemen demand their cut.

Sony v. Tenenbaum

[tepples]

Download all the TV / Movies / Music you want. Keep it forever.

Or at least until you need to sell the hardware to pay thousands of dollars in statutory damages per work after Sony smacks you down in court like it did Joel Tenenbaum.

Re:Sony v. Tenenbaum

[jedidiah]

More people win the lottery than have been subjected to that kind of penalty.

Most people aren't even aware that this has happened. So there isn't even the outside chance that it will act as a deterrent for the general population.

Works on non-sony devices

[HalAtWork]

No, Sony's service works on iOS devices and they plan on rolling it out across other non-Sony devices.

Re:Never Again

[Wookact]

I don't. If other people do I don't really care. I haven't bought anything made by Sony since the Linux fiasco.

Re:Never Again

[ganjadude]

I dont either, im just saying in general all these poeple bitching about it will bitch until something else catches their attention and go right back to buying from sony

Preview of Sony's set-top box

[ArcadeMan]

I was able to find a video about Sony's upcoming set-top box.

Re:As if this is going to work! Crackle?

[Svartalf]

I wouldn't put mine to the curb because I'm still playing game titles on the console. Having said this, the world being awash in $100 and less boxes that do a better job of Netflix (AND the others...), it's also awash with devices that with a decent BT game controller or similar can manage just shy of the PS3 titles as well.

It's not a wise move on their part. Google's going to eat their lunch if they do this.

Simplicity in packaging...

[Junta]

xbmc can do what plex does... if you mess with advancedsettings, apply a ton of special filename recognition patterns, set it up to store things in a shared sql database, and trick it into having an instance running somewhere headless and prod it to update library ever so often. For plex, they have a naturally headless server that takes care of all of that.

On the flip side, there is a gob ton of stuff I can do with xbmc that I can't with Plex. One painful one for me is integrate with my mythbackend *kind of* (still missing the closed captioning of ATSC streams, only mythfrontend seems to handle it).

I think my ideal world would be for xbmc to have a headless, auto-indexing library server that shares it's 'advancedsettings.xml' in a more trivial fashion and subtitle support for ATSC streams. The etensibility and community of xbmc with the simplicity of Plex and a tiny amount of capability from mythfrontend that is lacking...

Epic Fail

[RudyHartmann]

The once proud technology behemouth, Sony, has failed at nearly every lame attempt they've made on everything lately except the PS4. This will probably backfire on them as well as many of the other brilliant ideas they've had. Instead of trying to be an "also ran", they should start innovating again. But it's probably already too late. Somebody should just hand them a shovel.

Re:Never Again

[robbyb20]

The difference being that organized religion doesnt offer evolving products that meet certain needs. Sony offers products with different and new capabilities. Whos to say that they dont come out with a product that someone who swore off Sony might want. With religion, nothig changes and you know what you get right with each one since they all only offer one product that doesnt evolve(much).

In other news Sony announces Vue's closing in 2016

[EmperorOfCanada]

In other news Sony announces Vue's closing in 2016. I have this feeling that they won't be able to leave their 20th century media ideals behind. They will be young, hip, attempt to appeal to millennials but in the end will do stupid things like release the best stuff on BlueRay first. I am also willing to bet that there will be an element of nickel and diming where they have normal, premium, super premium, special event fees, and all kinds of weird location related blackouts.

Basically it will be a bunch of boomer MBAs who have spreadsheets that will "prove" that they can return to the 20th century when the customer had little choice.

Basically think of when Rupert Murdoch bought MySpace. It was on the rocks but they shot it right in the face 5 minutes after buying it. I suspect this one has been shot in the face while still in the womb.

Re:Headline is wrong...

[jedidiah]

No one would want to offer it to you. They want you to pay a pretty penny for anything that constitutes a "decent selection". At best they will want a hefty rental fee out of you and you may be lucky to even get that. Some of the new movies don't offer a rental option at all. You're stuck "buying" it on the streaming services and at a price comparable to the physical media.

Netflix is already close to as good as it can get with a subscription service. I'm not sure they could do much better even with a much more expensive rate.

The studios just don't want to give up the new material for cheap.

Re:Never Again

[almitydave]

The difference being that organized religion doesnt offer evolving products that meet certain needs. Sony offers products with different and new capabilities. Whos to say that they dont come out with a product that someone who swore off Sony might want. With religion, nothig changes and you know what you get right with each one since they all only offer one product that doesnt evolve(much).

Right, I think religions really need to spice up their offerings. Eternal happiness plus UNLIMITED VIDEO STREAMING!! Now that's a deal!

De facto a la carte cable

[almitydave]

I welcome another streaming service. Why? Because it increases the alternative options for cable customers. Consider:
Netflix ($9) + Hulu Plus ($8) + Amazon Prime ($8.25) + Sony ("competitive") = ~$35
Comcast's Digital Preferred (where I live): $86 (not counting taxes) + $10 HD fee + $8 DVR fee = $104

There's some overlap with the streaming services, but each one offers something a little different, and customers can get a pretty broad selection. Combine with ad-hoc Redbox rentals for hardware viewing of recent releases and the upcoming HBO Go offerings, digital cable television as a value proposition becomes less and less appealing for many customers.

The single biggest draw for cable IMHO is live sports - and ESPN currently offers a similar deal to what HBO is moving away from. I think as internet streaming reaches critical mass, content providers like ESPN may decide that their exclusive contracts with cable companies are a liability. Another important issue is advertising dollars - cable-company provided DVRs allow viewers to skip commercials, whereas live streaming doesn't currently allow that, so commercials on streaming video may start to look more lucrative than on TV.

Re:De facto a la carte cable

[codepigeon]

I welcome another streaming service. Why? Because it increases the alternative options for cable customers.
Consider:
Netflix ($9) + Hulu Plus ($8) + Amazon Prime ($8.25) + Sony ("competitive") = ~$35
Comcast's Digital Preferred (where I live): $86 (not counting taxes) + $10 HD fee + $8 DVR fee = $104

Lets project that into the future:
Netflix ($9) + Hulu Plus ($8) + Amazon Prime ($8.25) + Sony ("competitive") + Comcast SuperFriendlyLoveCustomer Internet service ($86) + Comcast Modem fee ($10) = ~ $131

Yeah, I am looking forward to the future /s

Re:De facto a la carte cable

[almitydave]

I didn't include the cost of internet, since for me personally, that part would be the same either way; others may have a choice of ISP (Comcast/DSL/FiOS/Google). Perhaps you're suggesting that Comcast will raise their internet access prices, and that may in fact happen; but it's hard to factor into a services comparison like this. It's worth noting that Comcast gives a ~$20 "discount" on their internet access for also subscribing to digital cable, so that would need to be added as well. And at $10/mo for modem rental, it makes a lot of sense to buy your own - it will pay for itself in fairly short order.

Re:Never Again

[robbyb20]

Or, you know, a whole new deity. Adding a feature to existing hardware like the video streaming thing isnt that amazing and frankly, isnt going to make anyone jump on board. That new PS they just released might...

Take on Netflix with that?

[GNious]

Netflix has branched into countries outside of the US already - Playstation Vue is for "select customers" in 3 US cities?

Add in the platform limits (PS3/PS4 vs everything), content (Netflix has a semi-decent selection already) and name recognition (Netflix is known globally as TV), and this thing is much too little, much too late.

Re:Never Again

[ttucker]

people say that every 5 years. remember when they took linux away from the PS3? or the rootkit fiasco? Yet people keep buying them

I have not bought any Sony hardware since the rootkit fiasco.

Re:Never Again

[Sarius64]

The problem is XBoxOne is a piece of crap compared to the PS4. If it were even close I'd probably buy the XBox.

Re:In other news Sony announces Vue's closing in 2

[Pubstar]

Didn't Justin Timberlake buy MySpace?

Re:Never Again

[ttucker]

The Xbox 360 is just a Netflix machine to me, that happens to also have stripped down versions of Minecraft & Fallout 3 built in. Since consoles are all garbage compared to computers, it seems contentious to compare them based on hardware quality. All that really matters in the console world is what you are allowed to run on them.