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The Missing Piece of the Smart Home Revolution: The Operating System

An anonymous reader writes with this story about who will lead the IoT revolution, and whether it will follow in mobile's footsteps. "As these technologies sense and and react to changes in your environment, there are obvious parallels to computer operating systems, which receive input and return output. What does the 'operating system' for the smart home of the future look like? Alex Hawkinson is trying to help answer that very question. The founder and CEO of IoT company SmartThings is not only a leader in the market, he’s a consumer. He suggests there won’t be a singular, cohesive operating system for your home, that this stuff isn’t one-size-fits-all. 'I think it’s up to everyone to determine their own bits,' Hawkinson said. 'Some people love cameras in house, my wife wants none. It’s up to your preferences.'”

171 of 252 comments (clear)

  1. Not so sure about this... by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Networks run by professionals can't keep the hackers out, and I want my home to have an operating system? I'm not intereested in my appliences sending me text messages, and my furnace is already on a fairly sophisticated timer. For me, at least, the answer is "no" - for the time being. I really don't see any show-stopping need beyond "wow, my house is wired!"

    --
    If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    1. Re:Not so sure about this... by epyT-R · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Your mistake is in assuming that wired homes will serve their occupants. They're meant to serve government and civil authorities at the occupant's expense. Note: I avoided using the term 'owner' on purpose.

    2. Re:Not so sure about this... by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Your mistake is in assuming that wired homes will serve their occupants. They're meant to serve government and civil authorities at the occupant's expense. Note: I avoided using the term 'owner' on purpose.

      Makes me think of "smart meters".

      --
      If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    3. Re:Not so sure about this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Your mistake is in assuming that wired homes will serve their occupants. They're meant to serve government and civil authorities at the occupant's expense. Note: I avoided using the term 'owner' on purpose.

      Makes me think of "smart meters".

      What it _should_ be making you think of is the "telescreen" from the book "1984".

      /

    4. Re:Not so sure about this... by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      Exactly. Some external conflagration of agendas will battle over the setting of your thermostat, what food you store/eat, how much electricity you use, what you can access on the net, etc. I'll pass. I immediately thought of that 'smart' wall outlet by sony. Who wants to be micromanaged like that?

    5. Re:Not so sure about this... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 2

      Never forget, 'Internet of things' and 'Smart Home' are nothing but polite synonyms for 'Consumer SCADA'. And we know how well that stuff handles security.

    6. Re:Not so sure about this... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I think that you underestimate the role of the private sector in the process.

      The crowning genius of free-market surveillance states is how much of the (otherwise expensive, arduous, and likely to be resented) work of surveillance can be left to private sector self interest to implement and market, with the state needing only to subpoena up the results and do relatively small amounts of supplementary spying(even this often accomplished in no small part just by buying the access).

      Data provided by 'smart homes' will end up with the feds, in due time; but it'll be picked clean by every scumbag marketing weasel in the business first. Best of both worlds!

    7. Re:Not so sure about this... by pepty · · Score: 1, Insightful

      The government won't care unless you've figured out a way to use your refrigerator to dodge taxes. The interested parties will be private and very much for profit.

    8. Re:Not so sure about this... by epyT-R · · Score: 1

      I didn't mean to understate either. Perhaps I should've rephrased. Private entities have as big an interest in our minutiae as the state does.

    9. Re:Not so sure about this... by stephanruby · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Networks run by professionals can't keep the hackers out, and I want my home to have an operating system? I'm not intereested in my appliences sending me text messages, and my furnace is already on a fairly sophisticated timer. For me, at least, the answer is "no" - for the time being. I really don't see any show-stopping need beyond "wow, my house is wired!"

      I couldn't agree more.

      Give me a gadget that can tell me when my washer/dryer is finished. It can be wireless/bluetooth-like, because washers and dryers are usually just far enough, that you can't really hear their buzzer when they're done, but connect that same gadget to the cloud, and you've lost me permanently as a potential customer. Don't give me what I don't need. Do not give me what I don't want. For instance, I already have a smart meter, but this is certainly not because I was given a choice. If I wasn't such a helpless sheep, I would have destroyed that smart meter as soon as I noticed it.

      Also, do not build that gadget into the washer/dryer itself and do not embed a tablet or anything too complex like an OS into an appliance. Just like I do not trust Ford to make good and cost-effective built-in gps units with free regular updates, I do not trust a washer/dryer manufacturer to make a good reliable gadget that's easy to fix, or easy/cheap to replace, or can even be easily kept up-to-date, compared to my own dedicated phone, or my own dedicated tablet, which I tend to replace much more frequently.

      Also please take into account, that when I move apartments, I usually don't take the washer and dryer with me, nor the fridge. The same goes with some people who actually own homes and move from house to house. Some people do, but not everyone moves in/out with their large appliances. Do not limit the market for your goods to such a small subset of people.

      If you want to do something useful, just get out of my way, or make room for my things. It would be nice if my tablet could hang on top of my stove, or on top my fridge. It would be nice if it could be protected from potential splashes, or from heat or smoke, or smudges. It would be nice if my tablet could easily be charged from its stand. And it would be nicer if the form factor of the fridge/stove was flexible enough that it could adapt to a wide range of devices, from my small old recycled re-purposed android phone to the latest and greatest tablet out there, whether it be my device, or the device of a family member/friend visiting me for a day.

    10. Re:Not so sure about this... by Noah+Haders · · Score: 2

      you know, I have to say meh? Apple has sold 800 million ios devices sold worldwide. even if we put an ios controller in every US household, it only increases the ios attack surface by 15%. Also, considering iphones and ipads already have access to emails, passwords, everything else, there wouldn't be a crazy amount of additional value in people's refrigerator use.

      So I would say the summary and article are dusted off from 2012. The smart home OS of the future is the mobile OS. Apple has their Homekit systems. I'm sure Google is thinking of something too.

    11. Re:Not so sure about this... by Bob9113 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Data provided by 'smart homes' will end up with the feds, in due time; but it'll be picked clean by every scumbag marketing weasel in the business first. Best of both worlds!

      Don't forget the Internet savvy burglar class that is coming. These smart device companies aren't spending their angel funding on security. Casing houses is quickly going to become a service available on the darknet; for a fraction of a bitcoin, crackers with giant databases of IoT surveillance data will tell the burglar which houses in the target area are unoccupied during the hours they specify. Tapping the camera signals will let the burglars pre-plan which stuff to grab. For a premium price, they'll disable the alarms, unlock the doors, and open the garage.

      And my freaking homeowners insurance will go up, while Harry Hairstyle the scumbag CEO's stock will continue to soar into the stratosphere, because he won't be found negligent, and the homeowner who trusted him won't be found stupid.

    12. Re:Not so sure about this... by Bengie · · Score: 1

      You assume those networks are ran by professionals. They may work for a company, but rarely do you hear about a professional place getting hacked.

    13. Re:Not so sure about this... by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

      or just say you did not buy that at whole foods so in till you only put food from there in your fridge will stay in off mode.

    14. Re:Not so sure about this... by hodet · · Score: 1

      Ya no shit. Store all your settings and access all these devices from the cloud. No thank you. Now the "Intranet of Things" interests me somewhat and most of the interesting stuff is happening in the do-it-yourself space. People are doing incredible things with RaspberryPi's and Arduino's and other variants and they are posting their code publicly so anyone can hack around.

    15. Re:Not so sure about this... by Noah+Haders · · Score: 1, Troll

      Makes me think of "smart meters".

      I'm sorry you don't care about energy efficiency and renewable power. I suppose it's easier for you when 80% of your electricity comes from coal and the plants run 24/7. Some of us want to maximize the use of renewables, which requires demand shaping, and reduce the total number of kwh. you know, for kids.

    16. Re:Not so sure about this... by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 1

      You assume those networks are ran by professionals. They may work for a company, but rarely do you hear about a professional place getting hacked.

      It's easy to make statements like that, but from a factual standpoint, you'vr got nothing to support your view.

      --
      If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    17. Re:Not so sure about this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Or the smartphone from real life.

    18. Re:Not so sure about this... by cas2000 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      it's funny how libertarian nutters believe in the exact opposite of what happens in reality.

      in the real world, governments - i.e. providers of socialised health care/health insurance - don't give a fuck about what you do or eat, they provide the health care you are entitled to (i.e. whatever you need without regard for your finances) no matter what you do.

      private health insurers, on the other hand, leap at any excuse to get out of their obligations - if there's anything, no matter how tiny or how irrelevant they can use to blame the patient for their misfortune, then they'll use it.

    19. Re:Not so sure about this... by Kuruk · · Score: 1

      That is because we have dinosaurs as options with old systems. How about some company make a secure OS so we can all forget dos and OS 9 and even unix.

      At this point users need security not speed. PC's are faster than any average user needs. They're full of holes but that stupidity lets anyone in.

      And i'm not talking about a company taking control of peoples devices to keep them save...Make a safe OS everyone can use thats open.

    20. Re:Not so sure about this... by jandersen · · Score: 1

      Hah, yes, I was about to say that the missing piece of the 'smart' home is - the need for such a thing. I don't fall for the hype about how great it would be to control my dishwasher or heating with my mobile (I mean, really? Why would I want to do that?). Likewise, I don't fall for the nonsense about 'the government' wanting to intrude on my privacy - I can't see why they would, for one thing; I am worried about the grubby hands of private businesses, whose staff are not even vetted to the standards required for public office, and whose leaders seem to be above the law in most cases.

    21. Re:Not so sure about this... by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Makes me think of "smart meters".

      Wow, that sounds like a hacking opportunity waiting to happen.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    22. Re:Not so sure about this... by davester666 · · Score: 1

      And also manufacturers. Everybody is getting into this game where the manufacturer believes the person buying their widget [car, phone, toaster, heart monitor] didn't pay enough for it, so it has to be connected to the companies server, so they can track how the device is being used and sell that information to whomever comes by with a dollar.

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
    23. Re:Not so sure about this... by vtcodger · · Score: 1

      > Networks run by professionals can't keep the hackers out, and I want my home to have an operating system?

      Exactly. For the most part, the ideal operating system for the home is probably the human brain augmented by some switches and simple (repairable) MECHANICAL timers like those on dishwashers.and washing machines. For the most part, the digital hardware in my house sucks. The interfaces are, for the most part, poorly designed, non-intuitive and not especially reliable. There is entirely too much of it. It has, on average, not brought me joy and/or happiness. I do not expect that situation to change.

      That said, there is a case for limited automation of some homes for purposes of allowing the temporarily or permanently handicapped to survive without live-in helpers. But for the general public. It's a bad idea that will be probably be badly implemented.

      HINT: If some semblence of security is desired, do NOT connect the home electronics to the internet. Things like home entertainment, "phone" and perhaps fire/intrusion alarms that need a connection to the outside world should be separated from any home network by a healthy air gap.

      --
      You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
    24. Re:Not so sure about this... by vtcodger · · Score: 2

      > I'm sorry you don't care about energy efficiency and renewable power.

      Get back to us when you have renewable energy that works. Corn ethanol is, for the most part, an expensive, agricultural support program that converts hydrocarbons like petroleum and natural gas into a mediocre fuel. Wind and Solar for the most part require hugely expensive (and probably environmentally destructive) buffering -- think hundreds of billions of dollars -- to interface their intermittent output to a reliable power grid. Hydro power is actually OK technically, but it's environmentally destructive, and simply isn't available on the scale needed to support even the most energy efficient modern society -- not enough precipitation. Not enough suitable sites. Nuclear is fine on paper. But the evidence that nuclear plants will be managed at times by nitwits is pretty strong and we do not have a fullproof design for nuclear plants that can safely be run by nitwits.

      Energy efficiency is fine. Seriously. And the US and Canada in particular could do substantially better than they do. But in my experience, few advocates of energy efficiency have realistic ideas of how to achieve it or even of what can realistically be achieved.

      --
      You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
    25. Re:Not so sure about this... by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Smart meters are used by the utilities to save money and improve conservation. The government is not involved at all except to provide stimulus funds.

      And no, they don't cause cancer either, or headaches, or higher rates, or mind control.

    26. Re:Not so sure about this... by Richard_at_work · · Score: 2

      Oh for fucks sake, Slashdot really has become another shitty conspiracy theory site :/ I've seen some shit on here thats worse than what you can find on AboveTopSecret.com!

    27. Re:Not so sure about this... by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 1

      Apple seems to think so, but I disagree. As the name implies, a Smart Home has a "smart" agent sitting somewhere, handling things. An intelligent hub. Your mobile phone is not that hub, for 2 simple reasons: you're not always at home, and not all automation centers around you. In home automation terms, your phone is merely a remote control with some geofencing added, and that barely qualifies as HA.

      What I can see is an Apple TV with HomeKit acting as some sort of hub.

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    28. Re:Not so sure about this... by Tom · · Score: 1

      This one million times.

      I'm so amazed at this mantra of "corporations good, government bad" that gets repeated ad nauseam in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary that I'm about one inch short of deciding that the entire USA is some kind of religious nutjob cult to the god of imaginative economy.

      I don't want government nor private corporations into my house to watch me 24/7. But when I think about the potential consequences, I'm more afraid of corporations and what they would do with it than of the government.

      --
      Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
    29. Re:Not so sure about this... by Chaos+Incarnate · · Score: 1

      They either cause higher electricity rates, if the utility is footing the bill, or they cause higher tax rates, if the government is footing 100% of the bill. Either way, I'm paying, and not getting anything for it.

      And if you think the utilities are going to install these things and not use them as an excuse to raise rates, you're dreaming.

      --
      Benford's Corollary to Clarke's Law: "Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced."
    30. Re:Not so sure about this... by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 2

      Kind of sad how every topic on home automation here degenerates into posts around:
      1) Hackers taking over your home and setting your dishwasher to Eco mode!
      2) "The man" knowing about when you shit / shower / shave!!
      3) But I don't even know why I would want a smart home!!!

      Not that these aren't valid points, but they don't have to be raised over and over again; why not stick to the topic? In this discussion I see perhaps 5 on-topic posts, the rest just regurgitate the above 3 points. Sorry, just had to get that off my chest.

      For the record, I'm a home automation (which is NOT the same as IoT, by the way) enthusiast. It's a hobby (and a tiny side business of mine), and I consider the field of home automation to be firmly in the hobby / exploration stage as well: it is still too complex, potentially insecure, it requires a fair amount of knowledge and dedication to make it work and to maintain it, so it is not ready for the general public yet. Standards, and perhaps a home automation OS, could help in that regard. Developing and maturing these can also help address points 1 and 2. Security is a fairly hot topic in the HA community and some standards like Z-Wave are being made more secure.

      As for point 3: automating my home has resulted in a lot of convenience, and it saves money. However, your average man in the street would probably not consider the effort involved in setting it up worth his while. Yet. In a few years, that will change.

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    31. Re: Not so sure about this... by umghhh · · Score: 1

      Sorry to bring it to you but for this you would need an automated system to sip trough the information and ask you only in rare case of doubt for decision or else you are going to do what all other users of software do - press appropriate key to get rid of the warning or disable warning after the first time already. While such automated systems are possible to make by your self you will have to tweak it for each new appliance having slightly different set of APIs and then maintain the whole lot because the upgrades will surely introduce changes that your systems did not foresee etc. Automatic upgrades will require your attention etc. You can of course switch to bought in privacy and security protection suite from the market leader but uhum how is that going to save you if they are hacked by some criminals on request of NSA etc.
      It is increasingly close to impossible to live a normal life and stay out of reach of digital criminals hunting for your data and money. It is like musical chairs but you participate as soon as your mobile and more often when that of your neighbour is on. The digital equivalent of missing a chair is when your data is stolen and misused by privet and state criminals.
      1984 is already there only we do not notice because there is not one but a legion of different organisations, mostly private, that dig into your life every second.

    32. Re:Not so sure about this... by umghhh · · Score: 1

      So what is your point exactly - that iThings are inhackable or that they are hackable but they are not popular enough to make a difference or what exactly?
      What I see a problem with is, that increasing the amount of devices having mostly crappy software inside does not stop. TV sets usually call home (i.e their makers) or else you cannot use some of their functions, the same will happen with the rest of appliances. The problem is not with all but with some of the users who will be abused - trough misuse of the processing power and storage capacity as well as of your connection etc. The increase of attack surface is inevitable. I am rather pessimistic about the remains of our privacy and wealth. IN wild west as well as in middle ages it was not whether you were robbed but whether you survived a robbery and whether you could recover from it. It seems we are getting or already are in a digital version of that. Having more digital shit at home is not going to help much.

    33. Re:Not so sure about this... by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 1

      I have probably already recovered the outlay of the bits actually involved in the money saving part (not all of them are). And if I started from scratch today, I could probably put together the same setup for 2/3rds of the cost.

      Recover my time spent times a reasonable hourly rate? No way. But as I said, it'll probably take a lot less effort in the near future.

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    34. Re:Not so sure about this... by AmiMoJo · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Can you explain exactly what is wrong with smart meters?

      I work in the water industry where such meters are used. Water companies like them because they reduce costs - no need to send people out to read a little display any more. The regulator has forced the water companies to pass on the savings to the consumer.

      There is a privacy aspect, but anyone who understands how the water network works will realise that the concerns are overblown. The smart meters report back very little information, because if they all used up a lot of bandwidth there wouldn't be enough to go round (M-BUS/433/868/915MHz) or would cost too much (GSM/3G). Typically they just report back the current meter reading, or at most a few data points per day. The companies don't need more because they already have monitoring equipment installed on every pipe and facility in their network. If one street starts using more water than expected they will know about it within hours and send someone to find out if there is a leak. Typically 30-40% of the clean water in the network is lost to leaks, so fixing them is a pretty big deal.

      Even if they could tell when you are flushing your drugs down the loo, the metering system isn't real-time and there would be no way to know you were not just taking a dump. Their only interest is billing you.

      Electricity is similar. They could try to monitor you with the smart meter, but it would be a lot easier to just install something at the sub-station or point a thermal camera at your house.

      Can you point to any practical uses for or attacks on smart meters?

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    35. Re:Not so sure about this... by GTRacer · · Score: 2

      A full day and nobody's commented? OK, then..

      * Your schedule could be established with power and water cycles - known empty home would be more interesting to thieves
      * From above, if your insurance company determines you keep odd hours they may find that to be higher-risk and adjust your rate
      * Law enforcement may be interested if your power and water usage continuously exceeds the requirements for the number of occupants - are you running a grow room? Warrant time!

      I'm not necessarily paranoid enough to expect these outcomes, but I *am* jaded enough to expect humanity to fail us in such a manner.

      --
      Defending IP by destroying access to it? That makes sense, RIAA/MPAA. Go to the corner until you can play nice!
    36. Re:Not so sure about this... by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Wasn't Trendnet sanctioned by the FCC over this kind of thing? It seems like there is punishment for failures, although arguably not enough.

      The key will be creating demand for security with consumers. Once they realize it is important they will look for it, and companies that fail to deliver will suffer as a result. Hopefully with events like the recent celebrity iCloud hack getting a lot of publicity we won't have to wait too long.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    37. Re:Not so sure about this... by spire3661 · · Score: 1

      But i really like being able to see my daily power usage....

      --
      Good-bye
    38. Re:Not so sure about this... by spire3661 · · Score: 1

      Except that power companies are government regulated monopolies.....

      --
      Good-bye
    39. Re:Not so sure about this... by spire3661 · · Score: 1

      If users cant reasonably secure their own services they shouldn't be running them! All the power and none of the responsibility is a recipe for disaster every time.

      --
      Good-bye
    40. Re:Not so sure about this... by bickerdyke · · Score: 1

      Get back to us when you have renewable energy that works.

      http://hardware.slashdot.org/s...

      http://hardware.slashdot.org/s...

      Of course solar only won't work without that ridicliously amount of buffering, but combined with
      * wind power,
      * a huge production area with diverse enough weather conditions (Europe, plans to include Africa),
      * a well connected multi-national electricity grid that levels out supply and demand between differnt countries and is in place for decades already,
      * coordination of already existing (and growing) buffering capacities (everything that needs to be "charged", "cooled" or "heated" already offers limited energy storage),
      * actual demand shaping,
      * increasing energy efficiency,
      * covering usage peaks and with locally installed power generators (like what Lichtblick tried)
      it should reduce the missing buffering capacity to something that can be handled.

      Assume each of the above measures shaving just 5-10% of the peak load, add the ca. 25% of overall electricity already produced by renewable energy (keep in mind that these numbers are for Jan/Feb. Solar prodiction is at its lowest) and IMHO we're on our way to get something working.

      Just don't expect one single technology to provide 100%.

      --
      bickerdyke
    41. Re: Not so sure about this... by Orange+Crush · · Score: 1

      "No true Scotsman..."

    42. Re:Not so sure about this... by twistedsymphony · · Score: 1

      I wouldn't call ethanol "a mediocre fuel". Lots of people who are into performance tuning cars are going out of their way to run E85 because it's better than normal fuel by most measures. I'd love to run it just for the performance benefits but sadly there isn't a station in my state that sells the stuff.

    43. Re:Not so sure about this... by Bob9113 · · Score: 1

      The key will be creating demand for security with consumers. Once they realize it is important they will look for it, and companies that fail to deliver will suffer as a result.

      I like the idea, but I'm skeptical. I feel like security is too similar to, say, sturdiness of furniture -- like a hardwood wardrobe; it is not reasonable to expect the silent hand of the free market to understand why mortise and tenon joinery is worth the price compared to pocket screws, even on high end furniture. So my Dad's incredibly nice hardwood bedroom set that I just moved is already falling apart. Security, like quality construction of durable consumer goods, has an actual market price below the theoretical free market price if there were ideal consumers.

      Even if it didn't, I think security has characteristics of an externality. Poor security leads to a fertile breeding ground for burglars, much as lack of immunization creates a breeding ground for disease. If that is true, good security should be socially rewarded and poor security should be socially punished -- even if each transaction were long-term rationally self-interested and well-informed.

    44. Re:Not so sure about this... by Casualposter · · Score: 1

      The meters are designed to allow the utility company to remotely manage your electrical usage. Don't pay your bill on time? - no need to send someone out to your house to shut off the power, the meter will do that automatically. The utility company didn't apply the payment on time? Power shut off until Monday afternoon when the sole remaining human in customer service can fix the issue. The other effect is to remove the actual person reading the meter. With remote management, the meter is read by software, thus eliminating two jobs with a software/hardware installation. This is certainly not about renewable energy. The coal and natural gas based utilities have zero interest in renewable energy - it reduces consumption of the electricity they generate.

      The ancillary data is that they will know rather precisely when everyone is home and when everyone is out. Since the data may or may not be very well secured (and how is the homeowner or occupant going to know?) -this data can be used by criminals to facilitate burglary. Not to mention the fun that other people can have by hacking into the system and turning power off at random.

      --
      Creative Spelling Copyright (2002). May use without Persimmons
    45. Re: Not so sure about this... by Casualposter · · Score: 1

      The meter will reside on the utility company's side of the connection and won't be owned by you. The smart meter probably won't even let you look at what it collects. The utility may or may not allow you to view your moment by moment usage, but they don't have to.

      --
      Creative Spelling Copyright (2002). May use without Persimmons
    46. Re:Not so sure about this... by Casualposter · · Score: 1

      The practical effect would be to turn the power off. Do that around the time most people are busy at home and watch the fun as evenings are ruined! People do this now which is why there are locks on the breakers outside of most apartment complexes.

      --
      Creative Spelling Copyright (2002). May use without Persimmons
    47. Re: Not so sure about this... by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      The power generated by solar and wind isn't sufficient to travel long distances. This is an unrealistic dream. Let's use a reliable renewable source of energy that isn't as destructive, doesn't require massive amounts of land mass, costly maintenance etc. Like generation 4 nuclear reactors.

      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
    48. Re:Not so sure about this... by hawguy · · Score: 1

      Can you explain exactly what is wrong with smart meters?

      With enough resolution, smart meters can tell the water company whether you've been a Good Citizen and installed low-flow shower heads and toilets. And with dual-flush toilets (one button for #1, one for #2), they can tell how many times you pee and crap in a day. And they can tell how many people are staying at your house. And when you do your laundry. And when you do the dishes.

      If they want to install leak detectors, why can't they install them on their own equipment? If they are losing 40% of their water to leaks, then they can probably wait 30 days to reconcile their usage data with my usage data to discover a leak in my neighborhood, they don't need it in realtime.

      Electricity is similar. They could try to monitor you with the smart meter, but it would be a lot easier to just install something at the sub-station or point a thermal camera at your house.

      They can't monitor me with anything at the electrical substation, my usage is mixed in with thousands of other customers with no way to isolate it. While they could sit outside of my house with a thermal camera, that doesn't sound easier than making me pay for a smart meter that they can use to get the same data for the entire city at once, and then sort out the "bad citizens" that need further monitoring.

    49. Re:Not so sure about this... by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      The practical effect would be to turn the power off.

      Smart meters are just that - a meter with some smart features, not a switch. They can't turn the power off remotely, they don't have a built in switch to do that.

      Think about it - it would be pointless having the switch in the meter, because the meter is usually on someone's property and they could simply deny the electricity company access to it or turn it back on themselves. If the company wants to cut someone off they have to do it elsewhere.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    50. Re:Not so sure about this... by firewrought · · Score: 2

      If you think the utilities are going to install these things and not use them as an excuse to raise rates, you're dreaming.

      By all means, write your PSC, but before you do, don't forget about the O&M savings from (1) not having to pay meter-readers and (2) not having to do as many truck-rolls for other reasons. That's a bundle, esp. when gas prices go back up. There's also (3) better theft prevention (they can tell when someone swaps a meter or tries to install it upside-down) and (4) alternative rate plans (typically targeted at EV owners).

      Finally, automated metering can/should give you a faster outage response: they can immediately see everyone who has lost power (without waiting for phone calls) and dispatch crews in the most efficient manner possible.

      Disclaimer: work in the biz, though not directly with automated metering.

      --
      -1, Too Many Layers Of Abstraction
    51. Re:Not so sure about this... by vtcodger · · Score: 2

      > I wouldn't call ethanol "a mediocre fuel".

      Ethanol has low energy density and doesn't burn efficiently in a conventional engine. It's true that it burns slowly and thus can be used in a high compression engine. But then you can't burn gasoline or gases like methane, propane, etc in that tengine. As produced and used in the US it's pretty much a fiasco.

      (But it's OK to drink in moderation if you're so inclined).

      --
      You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
    52. Re: Not so sure about this... by plover · · Score: 2

      People are all panicky about smart meters, and they imagine they're some kind of Big Brother device that reports on their TV watching habits, or know exactly what kinds of subversive web sites they visit based on their power usage, and report their pr0n habits to the gubbamint. But "smart meters" are not "omniscient meters". They just measure your home's overall consumption of electricity, same as your current meter.

      Smart meters essentially work like what you're talking about. The difference is they are in near constant communication with the utility, so they broadcast a rate schedule to your home's appliances that advertise the current and near future electric rates, and they can report overall house consumption on a near-real-time basis. And that's about it.

      The utility can predict "At 4:00 today it will be very hot, so we will be bringing on supplemental generators at that time to meet all the extra A/C demand." They also know that regular electricity normally goes for $0.08/kWh, but supplemental generators cost them $3.00/kWh. They then tell the meters the rate schedule for today is $0.50/kWh from 12:00 to 3:00; $0.60/kWh for the first 2kW from 3:01 to 8:00, but $5.00/kWh for everything above 2kW; and $0.20/kWh from 8:01 to 12:00. The meter then announces the price schedule to your home appliances. You may choose to have your washing machine configured to run only if the cost of your electricity is less than $0.25/kWh; you may have your thermostat set to reduce air conditioner use when the cost is greater than $0.75/kWh; and you may set your electric water heater and pool pump to switch completely off if the cost is greater than $1.00/kWh. It's all your choice, how you want to manage your consumption remains up to you. You simply have to know you'll pay more when overall demand is greater.

      Your electricity usage today is not a secret. Your meter already reports usage to your utility company so you can pay for what you use. But today, your dumb meter can't tell what time of day the electricity was consumed, and it doesn't know the rate in effect when you consume it, so your utility company has to front-load everyone's rates with the predicted cost of supplemental generation, the future cost of fuel, etc, and they only change the rate on a monthly or annual basis. What will change with smart meters is the rate you pay will depend on the rate in effect when you consume it; the meter will know the current rate and you will be charged accordingly. Even after smart meters roll out, how you choose to use the energy your house consumes is still up to you, and whether or not you're spending it on a dishwasher or indoor pot-growing farm is still not the utility company's business.

      --
      John
    53. Re:Not so sure about this... by LessThanObvious · · Score: 1

      We are not having an IoT revolution just because corporations smell enough blood in the water to try and start one. I don't place any value on my house being able to automatically put lube and tissues on my shopping list because the cloud can track the frequency at which I whack off. In order for the IoT to be sanely implemented there needs to be a safe secure OS with security and privacy controls at the heart of it that is local and 100% user controlled. If the intelligence is in the cloud then they get the data and once again we are the product. Yes, I realize it isn't rational to be angry about products that I'll never own, but security and privacy is a bit of religion. It isn't always rational.

    54. Re:Not so sure about this... by MrL0G1C · · Score: 1

      My objection is that they're called smart meters, an actual smart meter would do something useful for the consumer like have a wireless webpage showing current and historical usage to help the consumer cut usage. It would also be very handy for detecting slow leaks.

      How many water companies have analysis software that looks for slow leaks and then informs the consumer if they think they have one?

      --
      Waterfox - a Firefox fork with legacy extension support, security updates and better privacy by default.
    55. Re:Not so sure about this... by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      A lot of utilities do add extra fees, but most do this as a one time charge. I agree it's stupid. It's like charging more for an automobile because they bought some robotic assemblies, even though the overall cost is reduced. The utilities want to grab some money, and in the absence of real competition they'll do what they can to maximize profits. Many states have a commission to oversee this, but often when a utility requests to add an extra fee the regulators roll over and do what is asked.

      And another reason is that utilities are really backwards and are having trouble moving out of the fifties era way of doing business. They've had their guaranteed profits for so long that they haven't modernized. For example, if the analog meter dial has 5 digits then they demand that the smart meters wrap around the readings at 5 digits also so that it doesn't confuse the billing system software. Utilities are also risk averse, it takes a very long time for them to approve changes to software or security.

      The big thing I think most utilities need is not necessarily the smart meters but the smart grid, because right now many are flying blind without even knowing how much electricity is on the grid, unable to detect faulty equipment or loss of power efficiency. They could increase profits and increase efficiency at the same time.

    56. Re:Not so sure about this... by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Government regulated does not mean it's the government. Is the fear of the government so pervasive now that any regulation automatically means that the company being regulated is also evil? The actual problem is that the regulators are weak and there is a huge amount of regulatory capture going on. If the utility wants to increase fees they ask the regulators if they can do so, and most of the time the regulators say yes. There's a scandal now with PG&E where there is evidence of the utilities commission being too cozy with them.

    57. Re:Not so sure about this... by cas2000 · · Score: 1

      i can say that because i have real world experience rather than just libertarian fantasy dreaming - i've lived my entire life in a country that provides socialised health care, and it works exactly as i said: they provide the health care to everyone with NO attempt to weasel out of obligations. anyone here can go to a doctor or to hospital without having to worry about whether they can afford it or not.

      people get the treatment they need without any lifestyle or morality or financial checks.

      furthermore, medications are both price-regulated and subsidised so that nobody pays more than about $37 for a month's supply of any drug (or about $6 if they're a pensioner or on the dole).

      i know all this for a fact because a) i live here and have benefited from it, and b) i'd be dead several times over (and my family would also be hundreds of thousands in debt) if i lived in some healthcare hellhole like the US rather than a civilised country like Australia. or the UK. or Cuba.

    58. Re:Not so sure about this... by MooseMiester · · Score: 1

      I was completely with you until you implied there's a distinction between the hackers and Harry the scumbag CEO. Hacking itself has become a business.

      How do I know this?

      Because we run a farm of web servers, and because we're small we take on all kinds of clients. Some of them have politically sensitive and/or controversial content. And no, we don't host porn sites. Anyway, a few of these sites have come under attack that is clearly the work of a human, not a robot. Given the time they invested, and some of the real time fights we had with them, these folks are clearly getting paid, nobody spends days and days harassing a web site across a dozen or more proxy servers just for fun.

      As to marketing weasels being scumbags, yeah, but they are a necessary evil, no sales, no paycheck, no time to post on slashdot, ya know?

      --
      Murphy was an optimist
    59. Re:Not so sure about this... by MooseMiester · · Score: 1

      But this isn't what happens at all. In the real world governments steal from one program to pay for another one that stands a greater chance of getting today's politician elected. So they drive the payments to providers to the lowest possible level, resulting in all customers getting the absolute lowest level of service. Corporations are beholden to their stockholders. So they offer different levels of service at different prices, because that's what the market wants, but at the end of the day they have to make a profit (e.g. provide an adequate return on the investment made by the stockholders) or they go under.

      In the real world government is all about grabbing the maximum amount of money to buy the most votes for the party in power, because they want to stay there. Which is why the other party is ALWAYS portrayed as evil beyond evil. So of course they want you to believe that the competition is heartless and evil, duh. Corporations are not inherently evil, but they are far more predictable...

      What you have do is not be swayed by the emotion targeted marketing that both groups use against ignorant people with great effectiveness. Politics is sales and marketing, they are one and the same. To pretend that one form of sales and marketing is evil, and one is benevolent, is very naive...

      --
      Murphy was an optimist
    60. Re:Not so sure about this... by MooseMiester · · Score: 1

      Cuba is a civilized country? Previt Tovarich! I hope your handlers pay you well.

      Yes, this is a sarcastic comment. And you deserve it.

      --
      Murphy was an optimist
    61. Re:Not so sure about this... by plover · · Score: 1

      I have been building my home automation system since the first iteration of Vera came out (still using my original Vera controller, which is woefully underpowered.) I initially bought it to control the plant lights by having the duration of supplemental lighting follow the duration of the actual day, providing seasonally appropriate lighting which causes the plants to bloom on schedule. It has been much more reliable at keeping track of the time than I ever was, and our plant growth has been much improved as a result. That was the initial outlay; further additions included automating lights, coordinating indoor and outdoor lighting without having to rewire the house, and the additions of temperature and water sensors. In terms of money, though, I don't know that any of those qualify as a "savings". At best, they've been a cost avoidance (one of the sensors alerted me to a water leak before the basement flooded.)

      In terms of my time spent, like you, it's a hobby for me. I'm learning what works, what doesn't, and playing with various things to see if I get interesting or valuable results. Home automation has long claimed to have potential, but it's going to take a lot of real world examples to prove it.

      --
      John
    62. Re:Not so sure about this... by spire3661 · · Score: 1

      Users secure their cars with insurance.......However if you drive your car to a bad neighborhood leave the keys in it, they arent going to cover your loss if it gets stolen. See where user responsibility comes in?

      --
      Good-bye
    63. Re:Not so sure about this... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

      It doesn't help that 'security' is a fairly hairy thing to attempt to judge a product on. Race-to-the-bottom is bad enough for things like build quality(which the layman has some ability to judge sensibly; but which doesn't show up as neat numbers on the spec sheet or the price tag); but boiling down how secure a complex device(much less several working together, probably tied to at least one 'cloud' service) is painfully nontrivial. The only really succinct security advice(conveniently, happens to be widely applicable!) is "Totally fucked, run away screaming."; but somebody looking to actually buy something is going to either disobey that advice or select an unvetted product sooner or later, which doesn't help much.

    64. Re:Not so sure about this... by causality · · Score: 1

      If users cant reasonably secure their own services they shouldn't be running them! All the power and none of the responsibility is a recipe for disaster every time.

      That's exactly how I feel, which is why I don't take on such a project without first learning how it works, how to properly administer it, how to secure it, what the threat models are, etc. I would go so far as to say this is simply called being an adult person. The users who refuse to learn (as I've mentioned before) remind me of the child who really wants a kitten because they're cute, but doesn't want to be bothered changing its litter box and feeding it. This is where decent parents instill the notion of personal responsibility, the idea that if you truly want something you must also accept the costs that come with it.

      Most of what is commonly called "stupidity" or "cluelessness" is really just childishness. It's why you see such annoyed protests from average users instead of genuine curiosity and fascination when you dare suggest they should, at the very least, have learned the basics. This is a self-reinforcing mentality that does not acknowledge and overcome its own faults. It will not self-correct because that would contradict its coveted instant gratification. Instead, it plays blame games.

      This kind of thing being so widespread is also why we have the kind of government that we do today.

      --
      It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Einstein
    65. Re:Not so sure about this... by Bob9113 · · Score: 1

      Yeah -- totally agreed that the "how" of it is very hard. I'd consider it a giant leap forward to just get society to agree that it's a worthwhile objective, and move on to discussing whether and how to practically implement a solution.

  2. Black Mirror by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Black Mirror recently did an episode that had an interesting take on this. It's interwoven into the second part of the episode.

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Christmas_(Black_Mirror)

    If you haven't seen the rest of their stuff (two seasons, 6 episodes + the xmas special), it's highly recommended.

  3. I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by Harlequin80 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is a terrible article. Seriously it is a press release for this company and it says NOTHING. Not only does is say nothing it is full of blatant crap.

    Since when does your light bulb and your sensors in ANY WAY contribute to what you OS is?!??!?!?

    I'm really at a loss of where to go for what Slashdot used to be. Soilent news isn't there yet. I must be dumb because I can't figure reddit out.

    I still come here and every now and again there is something good. But it's getting less and less.

  4. No by Mikkeles · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This is total nonsense and irrelevant to home automation.

    --
    Great minds think alike; fools seldom differ.
  5. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 1

    Thanks for the comment about Soilent News, didn't know they existed. No, I can't figure out Reddit either.

    --
    If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
  6. Linux does fit in everything down to $5 WiFi SOCs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I'm thinking people are really talking about what is actually the applications layer.

    Why even talk about home automation as if it is new and different, isn't it just a subset of process automation and control?

  7. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by bouldin · · Score: 4, Insightful

    There has been a lot of this lately.. CEOs of companies with cutesy names like "SmartThings" and "Eyeotee" pitching their bullshit visions to posture as "thought leaders."

    We have had internet-enabled devices for some time.

    The only revolution here is that big business is trying to monetize your entire life, daily routines and all. They want you to trade all of your security and privacy for a crumb of convenience.

  8. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    What is missing from the 'automated home' is a amazing use case. The light switch is freeking dead simple. You have to beat the light switch in usability and that is fairly hard to do as you cant make it much simpler. Also every one of these companies that think they have cracked the nut do one thing. They *all* have vendor lockin and a monthly fee on top of it. Not one is open about the standard or wants to actually connect to other items. They only want to connect to their ecosystem. Then on top of that they are all amazingly mediocre to bad at what they do. If they come up with a compelling use case and are willing to let anything connect to them. The OS will come out of that naturally. Probably some linux derivative.

    reddit is just a popularity contest of drivel though it is sometimes a smudge better than here. I read it a lot but most of the time never make it past the first couple of pages.

    You are right about soylent. Basically they have a serious lack of good stories. With basically 3 people controlling the input queue. Which is what this site suffers from too.

  9. Which OS? by AchilleTalon · · Score: 4, Insightful

    QNX if BlackBerry does the right steps right now. Next question!

    Okay, I will explain. Because QNX has the track records, the reliability, the realtime features, the small footprint, the legal backing required to win there. If a house accidentally burn down to ground, with or without fatalities, the OS provider may be liable for such an accident if someone can demonstrate a glitch, bug, malfunction, etc of the OS is at the origin of the fire. It is not a playground for kids and QNX is well in advance to any other racers.

    --
    Achille Talon
    Hop!
    1. Re:Which OS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I have been a QNX developer for over 30 years - I have serial number 7. It is used in nuclear power plant controls (a meltdown will really ruin your day), jet fighter fly-by-wire controls (oops - I said go left, and the plane went somewhere else - crash), the space shuttle, phones (Blackberry), and automobile control as well as entertainment systems. The company I worked for for almost 20 years used it to control manufacturing plant manufacturing cells and conveyor systems (GM, Ford, and others) and semiconductor fabs as well as robotics and the US Navy RAMP project to run the various equipment used to build printed circuit boards and machine parts like engine drive shafts for repairing Navy ships. I would use it in a second for a home control system. Why? As AchilleTalon said, it has the track record, reliability, and is real-time. It is a micro-kernel architecture so it only needs the stuff you need to run. It also has integrated networking if you need, and can coordinate the systems in a very large environment without a lot of programming fuss.

      FWIW, these days I am a professional Unix/Linux developer (since about 2000), and have used embedded Linux (Debian) for near real-time warehouse systems to control conveyor systems. It is adequate for that, and works well to integrate with PLCs (I wrote a lot of PLC control systems for QNX), but it isn't "hard" real-time. My favorite self-quote is that "sometimes, real fast is ALMOST as good as real time!". :-) If a fire starts in your home, you want the system to respond appropriately in milliseconds, and not be stuck waiting for some other kernel operation to complete. Even so-called "real time Linux" is not hard real time - it cannot guarantee deadlines for critical code.

    2. Re:Which OS? by Nutria · · Score: 1

      if a fire starts in your home, you want the system to respond appropriately in milliseconds,

      Given the time it takes for people to become alert from a deep sleep, the time it takes a telephone to be automatically "dialed" and connected, and the fired trucks to arrive, ISTM that a 5ms response to a fire alarm signal is no more needed than a 500ms response. OTOH if houses were nuclear powered or flew at 1000 MPH then 5ms response times might actually be considered slow...

      --
      "I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
    3. Re:Which OS? by bloodhawk · · Score: 1

      what exactly in a house requires a real-time OS?

    4. Re:Which OS? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      if someone can demonstrate a glitch, bug, malfunction, etc of the OS is at the origin of the fire

      How could the OS cause the fire? What kind of light fitting / smart gear do you install which could potentially burn your house down? If the OS turns on everything in the house and leaves it on the person liable is still the one who decided to install and way overload the house.

      If you're installing things that could potentially burn your house down then you're doing something very wrong.

  10. Re:Linux does fit in everything down to $5 WiFi SO by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 3, Interesting

    It's an obnoxious habit; but I think that they are using 'operating system' in the relatively-weak-analogy sense of 'the bunch of software that sits on top of the nightmare hell-world of your hardware and presents a vaguely sane set of abstractions and standardized interfaces'.

    The actual implementation will, as you suggest, be a combination of mostly already common OSes baked into the device firmware, along with a bunch of applications that attempt to present some sort of coherent and usable interface to the whole mess; but using 'operating system' to describe the mechanism that performs hardware abstraction and standardization isn't totally insane, just gratuitously obnoxious.

  11. Darned hard set of problems by davecb · · Score: 1

    Similar in principle to the confidentiality problems that lead to the orange book, and at least as hard as the byzantine generals problem.

    I suspect one needs a trusted system to make sure only the owner issues commands with the right key, and an independent intelligent system to figure out what happens when you add a device and give it a command. Plus lots of hard work figuring out what basic set of rules you need to preserve...

    In the short run, expect to "introduce" things to one another, and select what they can do from a restricted and pretty unintelligible menu. Probably using Windows, and probably hacked soon after release.

    --
    davecb@spamcop.net
    1. Re:Darned hard set of problems by davecb · · Score: 1

      Bluetooth is one example: having a device that creates private and public keys for pairs of devices is another.

      --
      davecb@spamcop.net
  12. UBOS by jernst · · Score: 5, Interesting

    We're building a new Linux distro called UBOS for this. It's pronounced You-Boss :-) because there are no backdoors, tie-in's to somebody else's cloud strategy etc. For users, it focuses on making it a lot simpler and less labor-intensive to run web apps at home, and for application developers, it becomes a lot easier to deliver web apps to their users who may not have time (or knowledge) how to provision a database or configure a web server or re-installed apps every time they get updated -- because if we can do that, we don't need somebody else's cloud, and we can be independent netizens doing "indiependent IoT" in our homes http://ubos.net/

    1. Re:UBOS by jernst · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It's very close to Arch Linux. Inheriting rolling release, current versions of packages etc. But we want to do more QA before releasing packages so we can avoid that the user has to "manually fix" app installation problems which doesn't really work for headless, keyboardless devices in home automation etc. And we built a lot of management code on top of package management (pacman) so that the user never has to edit /etc/ or other configuration files, or provision a database, or figure out which files to back up etc. E.g. here are some of the things that the "ubos-admin createsite" command does: http://ubos.net/docs/developer...

  13. Great, more items to ransomware! by BUL2294 · · Score: 4, Informative

    After reading a few Slashdot articles ago about ransomware, and given what can happen via hacking such devices, the last thing I want is more of my home-based devices going online. The last thing I want is for my IoT thermostat (of which many exist already) to get hacked. I can see the thermostat's screen now...

    "We turned your thermostat up to 85 degrees and you can't change it. We want $5000 worth of Bitcoins in 72 hours--or we find out if your furnace perpetually on full-blast will burn your house down. Think we're kidding? We also know that you have an [some brand name] WebOS-based TV (it was easy--the IP address was the same as your thermostat) and an [some brand name] Android-based refrigerator that we also pwned. In 24 hours fridge will be set to 50 degrees spoiling your food, and in 48 hours your TV will be permanently stuck showing random videos from Xtube. So, your only options are to pay us or cut off power to your house--but when it comes back on, we still own your pwned devices! Good luck replacing the devices we pwned but didn't mention here... TIMER: 71:59:59...71:59:58...71:59:57......."

    Seriously, I'm not for government regulation in a competitive landscape, but such devices, especially given their manufacturers will abandon writing security updates for them--6 months after the new model comes out, are ticking time bombs... I'm not about to replace my oven, furnace, dryer, refrigerator, thermostat, dishwasher, home security system, TV, toaster, and toilets every 3-5 years because someone thinks such devices should be IoT and wants to gather even more "big data" about me...

    --
    Windows 3.1x calc: 3.11 - 3.10 = 0.00
    1. Re:Great, more items to ransomware! by Shados · · Score: 1

      Most of the useful home automation things have "dumb" interfaces. That thermostat is still only playing with the same 4-6 wires as any other thermostat does. If shit happens, I can pull my Nest (its not screwed in, you just hook it up to its base). If the A/C or heat was on when I pulled it out, all I need to do is have the 2 correct wires touch each other to turn it off. Or i can just flick the breaker.

      The critical thing is that the "smart" piece be easily replaceable/serviceable. Now an issue with the Nest is that if someone malicious get physical access to it, they can root it and you'll never know any better. I need a way to easily checksum its content. and ideally, everything should be on a chip I can easily replace for cheap.

      If I have a fridge thats smart, the "computer" should be replaceable. I should be able to push a physical button in the back and the thing should just pop out so I can replace it/upgrade it without replacing the whole fridge. That also mean we need some kind of standard for that (thermostats are nice because there IS a standard...)

    2. Re:Great, more items to ransomware! by Shawndeisi · · Score: 1

      "Hey, thanks for fixing the IP conflict man! *shuts off breaker and gas line to furnace, replaces thermostat*"

  14. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by HornWumpus · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Lately? You must be a kid.

    Idiots have been pitching smart refrigerators, thin clients everywhere etc for decades now. I'm looking at you Ellison.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  15. Advertisers by Tony+Isaac · · Score: 1

    The only people who want a "smart home revolution" are advertisers. They would love to be able to show you advertisements on your refrigerator, stove, thermostat, and everywhere else.

  16. The article by phantomfive · · Score: 1

    I read the whole article (yes, heresy) and the author doesn't even know what an operating system is. He thinks the OS is what made the iPhone and Android take off, even though both those OSes were around for a decade at least.

    I was thinking of something exotic like a research-project-distributed-OS, but that's not it at all. It's mainly talking about what features will be in the IoT. It got one point right.....towards the end it points out that consumers don't really see a need for the IoT.

    --
    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    1. Re:The article by Noah+Haders · · Score: 1

      I read the whole article (yes, heresy) and the author doesn't even know what an operating system is. He thinks the OS is what made the iPhone and Android take off, even though both those OSes were around for a decade at least.

      lolwut?

    2. Re:The article by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Which part, that those OSes were around for a decade, or that the author doesn't know what an operating system is?

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    3. Re:The article by Noah+Haders · · Score: 1

      OMG you're right the iPhone was released eight years ago I am so oooooooooold.

    4. Re:The article by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Even then, the primary difference between OSX and iOS is the different GUI toolkit. Under the covers it's still the mach/BSD OS.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    5. Re:The article by necro81 · · Score: 1

      I read the whole article (yes, heresy) and the author doesn't even know what an operating system is.

      The author lost a lot of credibility when he (she? the name is Dylan, which is slightly ambiguous as a first name) included this gem:

      Nest has since released an intelligent CO2 detector, called Nest Protect.

      Nest Protect is, first and foremost, a smoke detector / fire alarm. It can also monitor for carbon monoxide, but the author apparently failed high school chemistry.

  17. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

    When I was a kid we had to get up to turn off the lights. We also wiped our butts with paper, using....our hands.

    Our grandparents claimed they had to get up to change the TV channel. TV was kind of a primitive net, but they all had to read the same pages at the same time (or something).

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  18. Re: With GOOGLE - NEST at the helm by dishpig · · Score: 1

    Skip ad in 3 seconds...

  19. Re:OS:i do not think it means what you think it me by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

    'OS' definition typically includes device abstraction (drivers or at least driver interfaces), which might be what they are babbling about.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  20. Re:Linux does fit in everything down to $5 WiFi SO by jrumney · · Score: 1

    $5 WiFi SoCs are not everything.

  21. Well, no.... by dimko · · Score: 2

    Modularity, stability, documentation(when all fails, source code is documentation on it's own), ease of configuration. All of those one way or another lead to OSS OS. So *n*x. And, it's probably going to be Linux at the end of the day, could also be Android, as a flavour.

  22. Real-Time OS vs. Home Automation Needs by billstewart · · Score: 1

    QNX and RTLinux and such are great if you need sub-millisecond response for your home automation systems. You don't. If you do, you're doing it wrong.

    If your Internet-O-Things devices have spinning motors driving sharp-edged blades, you should be using hardware or at most electrical methods to do automatic stopping. If your electrical things use high voltage that might be exposed to people, you should be using ground fault interrupters on them. If you've got voice-operated instructions, they may need to process sound quickly, but you should buffer it if there's anything really critical. If your vacuum-cleaner robot scares the cat, responding in 100ms should be good enough (it'll probably have more mechanical inertia than that.) If your hot tub thermostat is sampling temperatures every millisecond, it'll be ok if the controller misses a few seconds worth of samples, as long as you don't do something stupid like treat missed samples as "0".

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  23. None by Areyoukiddingme · · Score: 1

    If the "things" in question have an operating system, they're both too expensive and too vulnerable to being hijacked. Most of the "things" in an internet of things (the Smart Home from 2 decades ago, go X10!) need to be as simple and dumb and therefore cheap as possible. Most are the functional equivalent of a single sensor or a single switch. They had better not have an operating system. They need to be as dirt simple as possible, so they're cheap to acquire, cheap to install, cheap to replace if they fail or get struck by lightning, and most of all, do my bidding and not someone else's.

    So no OS. It can run a micro IP stack like IPic (all 256 bytes of machine code) and the barest of bare bones beyond that, and that'll do just fine.

  24. Nossir. Whatever you're selling, I don't want. by PopeRatzo · · Score: 3

    "Smart Home Revolution" = Hype

    How's about I let the industry know when I need some part of my house to be "smart"? I mean, I understand the consumer era is all about creating a "need" out of something that nobody ever realized they wanted, but what do you say we take a little break until we can see some proof that we can stop hackers before we turn our homes into honeypots. Better yet, how about we take a break until we can figure out how to keep consumerist economies from destroying the world?

    My coffee maker with a timer control is as smart as I need my house to be, and I went to Edmund Scientific and bought a little mechanical timer to get the job done. The only way to hack it is to come into my house and move the plastic pins around. And even then, I doubt I would miss it if it disappeared tomorrow.

    --
    You are welcome on my lawn.
    1. Re:Nossir. Whatever you're selling, I don't want. by Shados · · Score: 1

      The thing here is you have a chicken and egg situation. For these things to be useful, they need to integrate with each other. A few pieces are useful as is (ie: the wifi thermostats, or the automated blinds), but a lot of them are useless without integration (if I have a fridge keeping track of my groceries, if it doesn't integrate with something that lets me carry that shopping list around, its useless. The smart smoke detectors are worthless if they don't integrate with the alarm system, etc).

      So stuff has to be built to hit a point where there's enough pieces available, and that are proven to work well, to do something meaningful.

      So the only reasonable thing to do is to push them out to early adopters to play with as guinea pigs, get burnt, and repeat until things are solid.

    2. Re:Nossir. Whatever you're selling, I don't want. by houghi · · Score: 1

      How's about I let the industry know when I need some part of my house to be "smart"?

      I remeber when we something similar about cellphones. Not smartphones, cellphones. And yet here they are.

      The same will be happening with houses. They will be pushed to us until we, as consumers, finally understand that we must have it. After that we will say how it was our choice and how great it is.

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    3. Re:Nossir. Whatever you're selling, I don't want. by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      I remeber when we something similar about cellphones. Not smartphones, cellphones. And yet here they are.

      No, "we" didn't say the same thing about cell phones. The utility of portable telephones was obvious from the very beginning. I'm pretty sure the guys who were wiring up the communities around the Adirondacks for telephone service thought, "Gee, it would be nice if we could do this without wires".

      Smart homes, on the other hand, which is basically a marketing ploy of Big Data, are not interested in your convenience. They are interested in making you and your home consumables.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
  25. Protocols by Dan+East · · Score: 4, Insightful

    No, it's not the OS that's needed, but the protocols. For example the Internet is not an OS - it is a set of protocols built on protocols with more protocols running on top. What is needed for home automation is the protocols allowing a "dumb" device like a sensor or button to be able to connect to something that unifies everything together and lets them communicate. What OS, if any, is running on the devices doesn't matter.

    --
    Better known as 318230.
    1. Re:Protocols by calidoscope · · Score: 1

      Very much what I was thinking. Get the protocols done right and who cares what processor or OS is in the device.

      --
      A Shadeless room is a brighter room.
    2. Re:Protocols by Tom · · Score: 3, Insightful

      No, it's not the OS that's needed, but the protocols.

      Literally my first thought on reading the summary: "Someone doesn't know what an OS is."

      In a properly engineered environment, the OS of the individual components shouldn't matter.

      --
      Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
    3. Re:Protocols by Tom · · Score: 1

      You're right, it's not that the OS doesn't matter at all. If you run your home on any kind of windows, I believe you are incredibly smart because you just made sure that if you're ever accused of a crime, you'll be among the 1% that can make the insanity defense work.

      But for the question of connectedness and building a smart home infrastructure, the focus should not be on choosing the right OS, but on defining the right protocols. Once that is done, the right OS will win by merit. But if you go about it the wrong way and look for picking the right OS first, then you'll create lock-in effects and very soon the right OS will become the wrong OS.

      --
      Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
    4. Re:Protocols by See+Attached · · Score: 1

      Yup. Protocols. Not the Home OS... this reminds me of the NOS battle of the 90's... which was more about TCP vs. IPX/SPX .. generally network protocols. Ideally, any OS should participate in the mix, but, those that spew these garbage acronyms are just trying to win some sort of battle. This is not as awful as the IoT (Internet of Things) acronym. that's an even more inappropriate ChOW (Choice Of Words). (see how I did that, I just made up a silly acronym).

      --
      Time for a new Political party in the US (or two!) One is off the rails Other cant pony up a leader.
  26. Re:It could be Linux and I still wouldn't touch it by Cantankerous+Cur · · Score: 2

    I’m sorry Dave, I’m afraid I can’t do that until you insert two bitcoins.

  27. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by Noah+Haders · · Score: 2

    idiots have been pitching alternating current for years now. I'm looking at you Edison.

  28. Smart home revolution explainer by WaffleMonster · · Score: 1

    This is some funny shit.

    http://edition.cnn.com/videos/...

  29. More important than the OS - by Black+Parrot · · Score: 1

    Don't forget the British Charm Unit, asswipe.

    --
    Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
  30. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by Noah+Haders · · Score: 4, Informative

    What is missing from the 'automated home' is a amazing use case.

    my brother and his wife just had their first baby, and when it came time for the wife to go back to work they got three dropcams and put them throughout the house - living room, nursery, and a third place I forget. Now they can check in at any time of day to see what the baby is up to and what the nanny is doing. I agree, it's weird. But it gives them peace of mind and the nanny knows about the camera, so the system works for them.

    For many people, "Allows me to check on my infant daughter" is an amazing use case. Consider the all-in was $600 for three cameras, plus $20/month for hosting. Connects to the existing wifi system, no wires to run. Monitored through an ipad or iphone app, which they already have. For me it woudl be super creepy, but it works for them and they love it.

    So you may not see a business case here, but for many people (perhaps millions) the combination of utiity plus low cost plus easy setup plus easy use will be very compelling, even considering the tradeoffs.

  31. Re:With GOOGLE - NEST at the helm by Noah+Haders · · Score: 1

    NEST had to recall their fire alarms...

  32. Re: With GOOGLE - NEST at the helm by WaffleMonster · · Score: 1

    Skip ad in 3 seconds...

    Don't recommend skipping the ad. If you do it automatically cycles compressor back on it shut off 3 seconds ago so you could better enjoy the ad (for new HVAC equipment).

  33. What are manufacturers using now a days? by clovis · · Score: 1

    I haven't kept up, but TRON used to be the dominant embedded OS. Has it fallen by the wayside, and if so, what's replacing it?

  34. You beat me to it. by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 1

    IMHO the smart home OS will look like QNX.

    It might not BE QNX, but it will at least look like it.

    QNX is doing just what is needed, and has been for decades. It's about the most rock-solid OS out there. It's tiny and fast.

    (What little I've seen of it reminds me of what "super" - my clone of Wiser's clone of the core of Dkikstra & Riddle's T.H.E. - might have evolved into if it were oriented to being invulnerable to failed or hostile tasks rather than being completely dependet on the tasks it supports being well behaved and perfect.)

    --
    Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
    1. Re:You beat me to it. by Megol · · Score: 1

      While you are right the reason QNX is a good solution isn't really that it's small and reliable, the reason is network transparency and composability.

      With QNX (or a similar system design) one could make every device at home a part of one common system where e.g. one could play a game via a smartphone, a TV or a tablet while actually running on a gaming machine/console. One could start a process like video compression and it would transparently be done on the fastest device. It would also (with some extra support) be possible to move tasks between devices in such a way that one could transfer a snapshot to ones smartphone before leaving the house - so one can continue running it while disconnected. When later coming home the task could again be transferred to another device with more performance.

      The big problem with such a system is that it's hard to secure.

  35. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by zugmeister · · Score: 1

    On the off chance you aren't deliberately tossing out a red herring...
    You will find very few people arguing against improved devices or superior efficiency. The problem arises when your "smart" devices start collecting and distributing information about you over the worlds largest information interchange network. Do you see how that could be objectionable to some people?

  36. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by KermodeBear · · Score: 2

    I also don't "get" Reddit. The pages give me a headache, it's a mess. The moderation system also sucks (just up and down) and looking at what gets modded up there... Slashdot is still way, way better.

    --
    Love sees no species.
  37. Western Consusmer: The Lie. by Rob_Bryerton · · Score: 1

    Yeah, pretty much different types of "media" and "news outlets" exist to create markets where there are none. This is done in order to keep the gears of industry turning, selling you crap that you don't need.

    Buying things will not make you happy.

  38. He's not quite found the problem yet by Casandro · · Score: 1

    It seems like he's still in the "I'm not satisfied" phase of solving a problem, unfortunately it's unsure if he'll ever reach the "I've understood why I'm not satisfied" phase.

    Simply put, in order to derive any meaning full use out of those systems you need to be able to program them. And to be able to program them, they need to have as simple as possible interfaces. If I'll have to read into some complex programming language like Java I'm not going to bother.

    It needs to be something simple like sending "show status" over a socket to the device and it'll return with it's current status in a simple non-XML or JSON format. And devices should be able to emulate multiple protocols. So people can choose the simplest one with the functionality they need or the one they are most familiar with.

  39. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by Fwipp · · Score: 2

    Bigots are far better but good luck trying to find one.

    Are you sure you know what the USA is like?

    (Unrelated, I totally agree with you about the faucet controls).

  40. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Idiots have been pitching geometry for years now. I'm looking at you, Euclid.

    --fyngyrz (anon due to mod points)

  41. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by gl4ss · · Score: 1

    *Why don't we have two faucet controls, one for temperature and one for stream force? Instead we get two dials each mixing both attributes or one control mixing everything.*

    because not too many people want electrified active mixing faucets.

    you can buy them if you want to. that shits expensive though.

    --
    world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
  42. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by thegarbz · · Score: 1

    You have to beat the light switch in usability and that is fairly hard to do as you cant make it much simpler.

    Usability and simplicity are not the same thing, and upgrading the common light switch is not a new idea *CLAP CLAP*.

    The fact is there are many use cases for equipment that can be remotely monitored and controlled, even if that equipment is usually run by something as dead simple as a switch. Here's some things I use mine for:

    - When sitting down at the movies I don't need to crawl through a dark living room to get back to my seat, I can switch the lights on and off remotely. I even tried integrating it with the play button on my media centre but it was flaky.
    - We have one room in the house with multiple entry points, the choice was pay an electrician to install a 3-way switched light, crawl through the room in the dark to one of the other switches, or just put in a smart switch at one of the points and link it to a door sensor. A cost winner right there when you see what electrical work is worth.
    - I'm going to China in 4 days. When I do I'll set my house in a way where after a certain time some lights will randomly come on and off in various rooms, while a few main rooms stay lit. No it won't stop a crafty thief but it will deter a lot of potential would be thieves from approaching when they think the house is occupied.

  43. Hack My Home by tquasar · · Score: 1

    The heat set to 100, the A/C at minus 30, yeah. That's what I want.

  44. Not sure what it looks like by cstacy · · Score: 1

    Not sure what the operating system of the smart home *looks* like, but it sounds like Pierce Brosnon.

    http://seekcartoon.com/watch/2...

  45. Up to me? by drolli · · Score: 1

    Fine! I dont need cameras. I dont need a networked Fridge. I dont need a networked lighting setting. I dont need to look up the curve of my heating over the year in the internet.

    IMHO the machines should be as dumb as possible. Heating/AC should have a timer. (Oh, wait, it has that already for the last 20 years). The energy savings you can achieve by not starting your heating/AC at the same time but "just before you come home" are not so high.

    So yeah. MCUs with 128bytes of ram, no network connection, and a power consumption in the muW-mW range without any OS work for me. If you really are interested in comsumption data, make a fucking SD slot - if i write 1kB every minute for 1 year, a 1GB card is only filled to 50%.

  46. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by reikae · · Score: 1

    Glad that it works for your brother's family, but I'm not sure how a few webcams is an "automated home".

  47. Re:Linux does fit in everything down to $5 WiFi SO by gl4ss · · Score: 1

    he's talking about user interface and machine to machine interfaces in the article, I reckon. that's what he thinks the operating system is... a system for operating the internet of things.

    --
    world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
  48. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by vtcodger · · Score: 1

    "What do you use now? Shells? Toilets and faucets haven't advanced in the USA. Why don't we have two faucet controls, one for temperature and one for stream force?"

    A pet peeve of mine actually. When I was a kid in the 1940s and 1950s, showers and baths had two controls -- one for hot water and one for cold. Possible, if not especially easy, to get the temperature and flow you desired. Since then, that system has been replaced by four dozen variants of single knob controls. All of which suck and none of which work as well as the ancient two control system. Your idea would probably be even better and seemingly would not be hard to implement.

    --
    You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
  49. Re:OS:i do not think it means what you think it me by GNious · · Score: 1

    Yeah, abstraction-layer, that hides the "ugly bits" of each manufacturer's implementation is very much required - I opted to "roll my own", writing a Qt5-based library that detects various (networked) products through manufacturer-specific protocols, and then presents a standard interface for each type of device (e.g. "Smart Light" interface to "LIFX Light", "Hue Light", "Holi Light" etc...)

    2 "small" issues is finding time to write support for each protocol, and getting support (products, specs) from each manufacturer

  50. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by Darinbob · · Score: 1

    The mass media as well as tech companies have redefined the term "operating system". It's been fuzzy this way for awhile. The company I'm at added "OS" as a suffix to a suite of services, including one part that actually uses an third party operating system but also the back office servers and the like. It's a marketing term. Similar to some smart phones, the "OS" is no longer the kernel there but instead refers more to the API or suite of applications. I suspect the average person on the street thinks that Notepad is a part of the Windows operating system too.

  51. The simpler, the better by petes_PoV · · Score: 1

    All an operating system does is file (and secure - more or less) data and schedule/manage tasks: some at given times and optionally concurrently.

    An IoT or "smart house" has little need for anything more than a state machine with local in-RAM data and possibly the means to interact with other IoT's within the same house. There are many solutions to this that have been around for years. Whether that involves 432MHz Tx/Rx modules, I.R. or the overkill and high power needs of a WiFi on a chip such as the ESP8266.

    My own preference would be for as small a footprint as possible, with very little additional cruft -- even encryption would be too difficult for the average homeowner to manage (as evidenced by the parlous state of home PC security - even with the "can it get any simpler" functions of WPS) and therefore physical security would be the preferred path: not letting any signals out of the house. Have whatever sensors and controls on a I2C bus and get the unit price down to $5, so the units are both disposable and interchangeable without any need for reconfiguration.

    --
    politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
  52. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 1

    The article is poorly written but there are some valid (and amusing / scary) points of view made. The author doesn't know what an OS is, clearly. But Hawkinson (the SmartThings guy) is right that there isn't going to be a one-size-fits all solution to home automation, there will have to be something to integrate disjoint subsystems. According to him, your system needs to be open to be fully useful, and I agree. However I am not sure that SmartThings is going in the right direction.

    There's a few things to keep in mind in home automation:
    - No vendor is ever going to manufacture and sell all the kinds of "connected" devices you will want. You're going to be mixing brands.
    - The standard you pick will not be available on all your devices. When you choose an A/C unit, you don't want your choice to be limited by the HA standard it happens to support. Be prepared to deal with multiple HA protocols.
    - No home automation vendor is going to write a driver or plugin for every conceivable device. And no equipment manufacturer is going to supply drivers for their products on every conceivable HA hub. Choose open systems with an active community

    Open systems allow you to deal with these issues. One such is Vera (based on the proprietary Z-wave protocol), and its success is partly due to the fact that anyone can write and publish plugins for non Z-wave devices. Nest, Philips Hue lights, homebrew Arduino-based sensors, even your Ethernet capable Japanese massaging toilet are supported by Vera as native devices once a plugin for them is written. It's also a popular system because it isn't cloud based (there's a remote access capability through their servers, but it's optional). In TFA, that tool Dahlberg (of Arrayent) sees the cloud as the great solution to the integration and interoperability problem. Sure, I can see something like IFTTT acting as an integrator for different technologies, but I seriously don't want that stuff in the cloud, and I don't see a compelling reason for it to be there. Most serious HA enthusiasts are very wary of such developments.

    I like the idea behind OpenHAB; they don't want to build yet another home automation hub, but be a "hub of hubs". In a reality where you are likely to have multiple HA systems and standards in your home, OpenHAB centralizes the intelligence and provides a unified interface, and uses the existing hubs as dumb communication channels. This is kind of what TFA was on about with their "OS for the home".

    --
    If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
  53. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by Parker+Lewis · · Score: 1

    How will they feel when discover that government and anyone with low hacking skills can watch the baby too?

  54. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by reboot246 · · Score: 1

    I thought 'OS' meant "Oh, Shit!".

    Makes a lot more sense than "operating system".

  55. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

    I'm in for the cat videos. It's fascinating, disturbing and occasionally hilarious to watch what your master^H^H^Hcat gets up while you are away.

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  56. What does the 'operating system' look like? by QuietLagoon · · Score: 1

    Well, at the current rate, the OS will be little more than a data delivery system as google, et alia, harvest all manner of data about the occupants of the smart home, and sell that information to other companies.

  57. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by spire3661 · · Score: 1

    Slashdot is way way smaller....and serves a much smaller slice of internet users.

    --
    Good-bye
  58. Re:Linux does fit in everything down to $5 WiFi SO by spire3661 · · Score: 1

    The difference being that its not jsut geeks and the rich that are now buying this stuff now. Thats why we are talking about it from this angle. Keep in mind we have LEGIONS of people with devices in thier hand that they have absolutely no clue how it actually works. That is what is new and different.

    --
    Good-bye
  59. Re:Linux does fit in everything down to $5 WiFi SO by goose-incarnated · · Score: 1

    Hang on, where are you getting a WiFi SoC that runs Linux for $5?
    (I'm not being facetious, I'd really rather like to know)

    --
    I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
  60. My smart meter saves me money by langelgjm · · Score: 1

    For a tech website, Slashdot has a lot of luddites, but we already knew that. My smart meter saves me money, and the privacy consequences aren't really that dire. Definitely far less than what your credit card bills reveal.

    --
    "Anyone who [rips a CD] is probably engaging in copyright infringement." - David O. Carson
  61. Seems a rather broad analogy by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 1

    As these technologies sense and and react to changes in your environment, there are obvious parallels to computer operating systems, which receive input and return output.

    I wouldn't say that "receiving input and returning output" is one of the defining qualities of an operating system.

    --
    systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
  62. Just replace your thermostat. It's easy. by langelgjm · · Score: 2

    "We turned your thermostat up to 85 degrees and you can't change it. We want $5000 worth of Bitcoins in 72 hours--or we find out if your furnace perpetually on full-blast will burn your house down.

    You do realize that virtually all consumer thermostats use a fairly standard interface, and they can be swapped with one another, right? This includes the Nest/Ecobee, etc. If someone threatened me like that, I'd laugh at them, disconnect the thermostat from the wall, and attach a cheap replacement.

    --
    "Anyone who [rips a CD] is probably engaging in copyright infringement." - David O. Carson
    1. Re:Just replace your thermostat. It's easy. by anjrober · · Score: 1

      to langelgjm's point, my nest connects to my furnace with 2 wires. one is red, the other is white. if you connect the wires, the furnace turns on. if you disconnect them, it turns off. this is not rocket science people.

  63. let me paint you a picture by Versa · · Score: 1

    Let me paint you a picture. Your house graphs the indoor and outdoor temperature with mrtg along with when your furnace or AC was on. It graphs the per outlet electricity usage on a minute by minute basis. Both graphs can go back for years. Your hallway and bathroom lights turn on and off automatically based on motion sensors, only they are smart enough to know that if you get up after you go to sleep you want hte lights to only come on at 50%, not 100%. Your doorbell rings and you get emailed on your smart phone with a picture of the front door of your house. Your house plays a warning tone on your bedroom speaker you to let you know your teenager's window was opened after 10pm on a weekend night. The camera system notices someone pulling into your driveway and pops up a picture in picture of the driveway on your tv while you are watching a movie. You decide to come home from work early so you login from your phone and turn the thermostat setback off, to warm the house before your arrival. These are some of the things you can do with a 'smart' house. pick and choose what you want to install.

    1. Re:let me paint you a picture by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      Let me paint you a picture.

      OK, I love pictures.

      Your house graphs the indoor and outdoor temperature with mrtg along with when your furnace or AC was on. It graphs the per outlet electricity usage on a minute by minute basis. Both graphs can go back for years.

      You can just kill me now, thanks.

      Your house plays a warning tone on your bedroom speaker you to let you know your teenager's window was opened after 10pm on a weekend night.

      Because I raise my teenager like a veal in a hermetically sealed room. If she's opened the window, it means she wants fresh air. I don't need my house to parent for me.

      These are some of the things you can do with a 'smart' house. pick and choose what you want to install.

      Except, you're not going to "pick and choose" what you want to install. It's going to be a package deal and all of it will require an account where the data is stored in the cloud and the activities of my teenaged daughter are being sold to the highest bidder, ostensibly for market purposes.

      Friend, how hard is to turn on a thermostat? You realize there are thermostats with timers on them for people who are away from their house for a long time, and they don't require an IP address or account with iPrison.com.

      If the "Smart Home Revolution" has been prioritized ahead of personal jet packs and a robot to go shovel my driveway, there's something seriously wrong. No, scratch that. I'd rather pay the teenager who lives next door who crawls out his bedroom window every night to go smoke weed with his friends to shovel the driveway. I mean, he's got to be able to pay for his weed somehow.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    2. Re:let me paint you a picture by Versa · · Score: 1

      Your house plays a warning tone on your bedroom speaker you to let you know your teenager's window was opened after 10pm on a weekend night.

      Because I raise my teenager like a veal in a hermetically sealed room. If she's opened the window, it means she wants fresh air. I don't need my house to parent for me.

      Think of it like a firewall. If I want the kids to go out, I tell them they can go out the front door. If they go out the windows, that is opposite of parental authority.

      These are some of the things you can do with a 'smart' house. pick and choose what you want to install.

      Except, you're not going to "pick and choose" what you want to install. It's going to be a package deal and all of it will require an account where the data is stored in the cloud and the activities of my teenaged daughter are being sold to the highest bidder, ostensibly for market purposes.

      Except I did pick and choose all of those, installed piecemeal over the last 15 years. My house already does all that and none of it goes out to a cloud account. All of it stays on my personal server that has a firewalled + snorted web interface to the outside world for my access alone.

      Friend, how hard is to turn on a thermostat? You realize there are thermostats with timers on them for people who are away from their house for a long time, and they don't require an IP address or account with iPrison.com.

      I have a large house and I am lazy, If I am in the basement and I decide to kick the heat up 3 degrees, I can do it from the comfort of my sofa.
      Again, pick and choose what interests you. If its not your cup of tea, great. If you cannot see why someone else might like some of these features I don't know what to tell you.

      If the "Smart Home Revolution" has been prioritized ahead of personal jet packs and a robot to go shovel my driveway, there's something seriously wrong.

      Shovel? The next thing on my list is a heated driveway, not a robot. heated driveways have been around for 20 years, and cost about the same as a snowblower, if you are installing a new driveway anyway.

    3. Re:let me paint you a picture by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      If I want the kids to go out, I tell them they can go out the front door. If they go out the windows, that is opposite of parental authority.

      But your "Smart Home" doesn't tell you when your kid goes out the window. It tells you when your kid opens a window.

      If I am in the basement and I decide to kick the heat up 3 degrees, I can do it from the comfort of my sofa.

      Oh good. We need more ways to keep people from every having to get up off the sofa. Because if there's one thing that we don't do enough of, it's sit on our asses.

      Shovel? The next thing on my list is a heated driveway, not a robot.

      I've thought about that, but it's not that great of an idea where I am. I don't know if you live in a place that just sees a dusting of snow, but here in Chicago, a heated driveway is a perfect way to get huge ice dams on your yard and in the street in front of your driveway. Assume your driveway is 8' x 60'. Six inches of snow covering that driveway (like we're gonna get tonight) is a whole hell of a lot of water. Unless you design some really good drainage (also heated), that's a lot of water that has to go somewhere else to freeze (it'll be -5F tomorrow).

      But "heated driveway" does not mean I need the heating element to be connected to the Internet. Instead, how about setting it up so that a call to a certain phone number triggers the heater? My problem is not so much with all the whiz-bang technology involved in the "smart house", it's the fact that we know for certain it's all going to become part of Big Data and will have all the associated risks.

      I'm sorry, but I just got done reading an article about these new "stingray" mobile cell towers that are being used to spy on people who are not suspects in any crime. My main concern about any new convenience technology is whether or not it can be used against me. Because if it can, it will.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    4. Re:let me paint you a picture by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      Here's the article I just read: http://arstechnica.com/tech-po...

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    5. Re:let me paint you a picture by Versa · · Score: 1

      I live in Iowa, we got 7 inches of snow today, the guy 1 block down from me has a heated driveway, he has no frozen water issues that I can see, but I haven't asked him. Concrete is porous, the snow probably leaks slow enough to seep through the concrete to the unfrozen ground below.

      I agree on the stingray issues, etc. Which is why I bought one of the few thermostats that does not talk to its corporate website, it talks to my server and my server alone. Same with my home automation server and the Zwave switches and motion sensors and the electrical stats are down in house as well. Most of the consumer friendly thermostats, home automation stuff, and electrical trackers agreggate this info at corporate HQ and present a nice friendly website to the consumer, while stealing the data and selling it. But there are options that do not do that.

    6. Re:let me paint you a picture by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      I just remembered there's a plumbing company not far from me that put heated pipes under their sidewalks and parking lot. It's a pleasure walking the dog past that place in the winter because there's going to be at least half a block I'm not going to be sliding on ice or trudging through slop. I guess I've never noticed any big ice buildup there, so the drainage must be really good. I get big ice dams in my yard from the ice melting off my roof, but that's probably because this is a 125 year old house and they weren't really thinking about drainage back then. They had bigger worries like how to run the natural gas lines for the lights.

      When I think "Smart Home", I get a picture in my head of these packages that are going to be sold to people by companies that are "partnered" with Apple or Google or Facebook or the NSA/FBI/etc. People like you are always going to be a step ahead because you're not waiting for someone to put in a package you can just log into online and have Big Data manage your house for you.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
  64. Slashdot pedantry ain't what it used to be by simpz · · Score: 1

    Surprised that no one pointed out (or no one I can see) that the article says "Nest has since released an intelligent CO2 detector, called Nest Protect". This would be a Carbon Dioxide detector, when we know Nest has a Carbon Monoxide detector i.e. CO not CO2.

  65. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by CrimsonAvenger · · Score: 1

    Why don't we have two faucet controls, one for temperature and one for stream force?

    What, you don't? My shower has a knob you rotate to adjust temp, and push/pull to adjust flow. The motions are completely disjoint....

    --

    "I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
  66. What to do with a p0wned meter by davidwr · · Score: 1

    * Profile a specific target's electricity use (discussed above)
    * Cut off power at a specific time (discussed above)
    * Get the meter to report slightly higher usage than actual, to defraud the customer
    * Get the meter to report slightly lower usage than actual, to defraud the electricity company (or for the lulz)
    * Get the meter (or many meters) to report obviously false readings to lower consumer confidence in the devices, cost the electricity companies lots of money, to raise awareness that such devices can be hacked, or just for the lulz
    * Other reasons???

    Note to anyone even thinking about hacking a meter without permission of all affected parties: Don't. Not only is it almost certainly a crime, it's just bad form. It's also probably not so hard that anyone over the age of 14 will think "d00d, that guy has skillz" when your "hack" becomes public. More likely, people will think "dude, that was lame." If you really want to hack an electric meter, buy one, hook it up to your testbed environment (you DO have a testbed environment, right? right???) and hack away.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
  67. I think the land mass around Chernobyl... by publiclurker · · Score: 1

    is pretty large, but you seem to think all you have to do is call each and every failure a one off

    1. Re:I think the land mass around Chernobyl... by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      I think the land mass around Chernobyl

      1) Charnobyl is not a generation four reactor.
      2) it was a weapons grade uranium enrichment centre and continued operations for enrichment and power generation until December 1995 with no further incidents.
      3) Pripyat is still alive and well today (many people snuck back into the town despite warnings), it has a booming tourist industry (mostly showing off a few blocks of flats and a closed down theme park from soviet rule).

      you seem to think all you have to do is call each and every failure a one off

      No, I think the 1970s and 1980s hippies that forced the U.S. government to stop funding and research into additional safety systems through passive cooling methods resulted in stagnation of the technology which had international consequences because international nuclear research were head quartered in the U.S.

      All nuclear meltdowns were a result of the reactors overheating. Even the latest Fukushima was the result of an active cooling system not having a backup power supply (despite international regulations and knowing the area was prone to natural disasters).

      If you're concerned about landmass, natural disasters, security, nuclear waste, nuclear weapons. This is what you do:

      Build a generation four nuclear reactor (with all it's passive safety systems) on an offshore platform. Offshore platforms are not prone to natural disasters. There is no landmass consumption. They are easy to secure from the stand point that you can develop the platform as secure as you need it to be. The power generation capabilities of a nuclear power plant go far beyond that of any other power source we have access to, so there isn't a big issue transporting power using sea cables. You have an additional safety system where the water surrounding the reactor can be used as yet another passive cooling system. Using the generation four reactors, we can use the nuclear waste that has accumulated over the years for the reactor. We can even reuse that nuclear waste repeatedly until it is no longer nuclear waste. If we want to get rid of nuclear weapons, we can reuse the nuclear content from the weapons to power our cities (I heard a figure that reusing the nuclear waste the UK has, we could power the UK with predicted power growths for the next 10,000 years easily with just nuclear waste).

      On top of that, there is a lot of money to be saved at this point and we are able to bring back industries to our countries that rely purely on power consumption and endorse a cleaner environment by looking at electricity centric production systems with cheap, clean energy.

      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
  68. Corn ethonol vs. fossile fuels vs. solar+battery by davidwr · · Score: 1

    Direct solar = almost immediate use of the sun's energy.

    Direct wind = storing the sun's energy for minutes, hours, or days, occasionally longer

    Solar or wind + electric-company's battery/supercapacitor/hot-water/other-short-term storage = storing the sun or wind for a day or so.

    Corn/grass ethonol = storing the sun for a few weeks or months.

    Tree ethonol = storing the sun for a few years/decades.

    Peat fuel = storing the sun for a few decades to millenia.

    Most fossil fuels = storing the sun for 10,000-1,000,000,000 years give or take

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
  69. How about an acoustic relay? by davidwr · · Score: 1

    How about a device that listens for the dryer buzz and when it hears it, buzzes with a slightly different sound.

    Put a few of these around your house and you'll be able to "hear" the dryer buzz without using any radio spectrum or signal-transmission wires.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
  70. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by DanielOom · · Score: 1

    Who cares about the Operating System, as long as it's cheap, reliable, and trivial for the consumer. It's more about the network and the high-level protocols that will define how devices cooperate or if we have to wait for a vendor to monopolise the market.

  71. and poisoning the ocean is perfectly OK by publiclurker · · Score: 1

    because you don't have to see the damage and can pretend that it doesn't exist when your next one off inexplicably occurs.

    1. Re:and poisoning the ocean is perfectly OK by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      because you don't have to see the damage and can pretend that it doesn't exist when your next one off inexplicably occurs.

      Tell me exactly how a generation four reactor is going to have a melt down.

      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
  72. Re:That must be an interesting relationship--- by Kiaser+Zohsay · · Score: 1

    Bitter much?

    --
    I am not your blowing wind, I am the lightning.
  73. Re:Scifi by Tom · · Score: 1

    Robocop is not even close to a corporations-rule-the-world dystopia. Try cyberpunk. WTF happened to /. that people bring up a stupid 80s movie instead of Gibson and Sterling.

    --
    Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
  74. Try one of those will never happen things by publiclurker · · Score: 1

    that happen to earlier reactors. Especially if you are ignorant enough to stick it on a platform in the middle of the ocean. Don't worry, I'm sure you'll have plans for a generation five reactor as soon as the oops happens.

    1. Re:Try one of those will never happen things by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

      Try one of those will never happen things

      Ah, so you're a 2015 hippy.

      Scientists were well aware that if the active cooling systems were shut down, suffered a powerless, sensors damaged, a meltdown could occur easily. There are no melt-down counter measures that can be shut down in generation four reactors.

      Especially if you are ignorant enough to stick it on a platform in the middle of the ocean.

      Because apparently oceans cause melt downs, you really have convoluted logic.

      Regardless, you have failed to answer the question and repeatedly ignored answers to your points, completing not acknowledging anything. You're a waste of time to talk to.

      I am not interested in your red herring and strawman arguments. You can move the goal posts all you want, but I have sufficiently countered each post; which shows your clear lack of understanding on the subject matter.

      --
      Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
  75. Re:I'm at a loss. And I RTFA by MooseMiester · · Score: 1

    Agreed but the Politicans are just as guilty as rebranding the same old shit under a new and improved name and then pretending it's new....

    --
    Murphy was an optimist