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Lenovo Saying Goodbye To Bloatware
An anonymous reader writes: "Lenovo today announced that it has had enough of bloatware. The world's largest PC vendor says that by the time Windows 10 comes out, it will get rid of bloatware from its computer lineups. The announcement comes a week after the company was caught for shipping Superfish adware with its computers. The Chinese PC manufacturer has since released a public apology, Superfish removal tool, and instructions to help out users. At the sidelines, the company also announced that it is giving away 6-month free subscription to McAfee LiveSafe for all Superfish-affected users.
More superfish?
I don't understand why people call it "bloatware". This helpful software does many useful things for the user. It essentially subsidizes your $1000 computer into a more affordable $500 or so machine!
The manufacturer gets money for the installation, and you get helpful software that reduces your costs!
What would people do without search aggregators, browser toolbars, download accelerators, etc?
Maybe people should pay the full cost of the software that comes on their machines. Suddenly your "bargain" $350 "bloats" up to a $700. How about paying the full cost for Windows? How about paying the full cost for say hotmail access?
Software isn't , and shouldn't always be "free".
There should be an option for a "bloat" free computer, with the user paying the full cost for software.
I am a clever Linux person, right!
We all win with at least a single computer maker stopping the insane practice of selling their customers instead of selling TO their customers.
excitingthingstodo.blogspot.com
It'll make the Chinese Government's spyware work faster!
See NSA? You guys are behind the time!
...if you read the press release, it's almost like Lenovo is saying that are shocked that Superfish was on their products. This would have been a lot more laudable if they had come to this road to Damascus experience for altruistic reasons rather than as flagrant corporate damage control for getting caught doing something pretty awful to their customers.
They need to get rid of all the obvious crap before Western consumers stop buying their laptops altogether and the back doors and data harvesters hidden deep in the hardware by the intel arm of the PLA stop being carried into every Western home and workplace.
If Slashdot were chemistry it would look like this:Cadaverine
They make great hardware, but getting rid of Nitro PDF is particularly annoying, it UAC's more than once, plus Sugar Sync, which even having on our systems violates a client agreement. Crapware needs to die, and die now. I do my best to work from a factory image, hardware seems to be so much easier to deal with that way, but Lenovo makes it quite an annoyance.
The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
I mean, really...Windows 8.1 needs how much memory again? 2 gb for 64 bit? Wow...that's bloat.
Have you read my blog lately?
Spock is gone .. Windows is releasing another OS . Lenovo is making thinkpads .. Times have changed .
Additionally, we will offer Lenovo PC users affected by this issue a free 6-month subscription to McAfee LiveSafe service
Sounds like more bloatware to me. Who needs crapware working for only 6 months and then nagging you to purchase the full version or your computer will be at risk?
We are starting immediately, and by the time we launch our Windows 10 products, our standard image will only include the operating system and related software, software required to make hardware work well (for example, when we include unique hardware in our devices, like a 3D camera), security software and Lenovo applications.
So, you're still going to be shipping it with trial versions of bloatware McAfee or bloatware Norton or whatever, plus your Lenovo-branded applications (which are really just re-branded bloatware ad-servers disguised as "handy applications for running your 3D camera!"). In other words, it'll be "bloatware-free" except for all the bloatware you're still going to pre-load onto it. Thanks, Lenovo!
"Tell me doctor, with all of your defenses, are there any provisions for an attack by killer bees?"
I help students with their computers at work, and I'm shocked at the amount of bloatware I see on the Windows laptops they bring me.
Microsoft needs to crack down on its OEM contracts and help give people an experience closer to what you get with OS X. Every Windows laptop should act the same when you turn it on for the first time.
It would be nice to see Lenovo go a step ahead in the consumer market and not just stop with shovelware, but maybe bundle some security features with their products. This would go a long way to fixing their black eye in the press:
1: A TPM chip shipped off and disabled (as per the spec) on all machines would be useful. Windows Vista and newer can take advantage of this and offer solid encryption that is highly resistant to brute force attack.
2: Add clientside encryption to Reachit with a public format, perhaps getting other vendors on board. This way, users have cloud access... but files are transparently encrypted, similar to BoxCryptor.
3: Have a small SSD read-only volume with a custom WIM present for install media as well as drivers. This way, if a machine needs to be reinstalled from scratch due to a HDD or SSD replacement, this can be done anywhere, and no OS media would be needed. This also is useful for recovery as well, especially if there is a way to get to a PE environment which can be used to save off files, run an offline AV scanner, or fix a haywire application.
4: Add firewalling onto the NICs themselves. Around 10 years ago, some nVidia motherboard chipsets had this capability where the onboard NICs were intelligent enough to have the ability to have their own rulesets. This was quite useful, both to keep the OS protected with IP blacklists, as well as to limit the damage a compromised OS can do (for example, block all outgoing port 25 traffic.) As an added benefit, if someone is worried about vPro or other "ring -1" management tools, those can easily be blocked at the NIC.
Follow this through and my next notebook may still be a Thinkpad. I will be watching.
Guys, the parent is saying that stupid companies that think that putting bloatware will increase sales are just making hardware cheaper for most of us.
I have no problem buying a bloatware infected PC and cleaning it or helping my neighbor clean it while - frankly - screwing over the dumbass MBAs who thought it's a god idea.
See, bloatware is an illusion that very stupid software vendors use to subsidize hardware.
I mean really, isn't is great? A few hundred bucks for hardware that would cost over a thousand (compare to Apple) and we'd just put what we want on it?
What a great way to get a Linux PC than to get some bloatware Intel thingy, clean it out, and put Linux on it!
Shut up guys.
Seems to me that "outing users", in the form of leaking their personal info without consent, is what got Lenovo in trouble in the first place.
Canonical works closely with OEMs to certify Ubuntu on a range of their hardware.
I've always wondered why manufacturers reinvent the wheel when it comes to bundled utilities. Why does Lenovo develop its own power controls, wireless manager, driver updater, display management, etc when there are standard OS utilities to handle these things? Isn't it sort of a waste of their time? It's always fun when the 3rd party utils start fighting with the native OS tools for control.
Lenovo doesn't let you buy a ThinkPad without an OS. You are forced to pay the Microsoft tax for Windows bloatware and cannot get a refund. I think that is Microsoft's fault for forcing OEMs to not allow any other OS (including no OS) if they want OEM pricing. I bet their reasoning is that if you buy a computer with no OS, that is because you want to install a pirated copy of Windows.
CEO: This Superfish incident has put our credibility in the toilet. Even corporate customers are looking askance at us now, and we didn't put it on their computers. Suggestions?
Executive 1: Lay low until it blows over.
Executive 2: Hire a new PR firm.
Executive 3: Start a social media campaign.
Genius executive: Maybe we should promise not to do stuff like that anymore.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
"...No more computer full of bloat."
Anyone with sense already said goodbye to Lenovo. They should have doubled down on the bloatware; then at least they'd make money from the bloatware manufacturers.
The first thing I uninstall is McAfee. That piece of crap wedges in a VB script interpreter that breaks many of the software installers I have to put on my machines to make them useful. THE worst anti-virus product ever.
It also claims that SAP/Sybase ASE is infected, and deletes critical files from the install.
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
http://www.apple.com
>> the company also announced that it is giving away 6-month free subscription to all Superfish-affected users
A 6 month free subscription to what? If there is anything on the PC they ship that needs a subscription then it seems clear they havent in fact gotten rid of all the bloatware.
They come with Windows OS pre-installed, so they are still jam packed with bloatware!!!!
If they were serious they would dump BIOS whitelisting and disable Intel AMT while they were at it.
I doubt they're serious and this just a pathetic attempt to recover from what has been an absolute PR disaster. Unless the above 2 actions are taken I will never spend another penny on a Lenovo product.
Sad too because usually they have nice laptops.
Some people like having software available. They want to buy a machine and go. That said, what they could do is have an interface for e.g. https://ninite.com/ so people who are able can install what they want.
The issue is that the majority of people will have no idea what yo install or how to do it.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
all my posts were removed from their forum, because, well, they were incriminating to Lenova (and just nasty). So I will unload here.
FUCK LENOVA!!!!
They took a great brand, IBM thinkpad, and ran it in to the ground.
I have an old T21, that is looking so good on the shelf because I am pretty certain (within reason) that it is secure. One of the first, and only computers, designed for Linux/Unix, takes abuse I can not even imagine, and everything WORKS with no tricks or marking bullshit.
Lenova owes me, a LINUX USER, a refund on my complete windows license. Full stop. Do not pass go. do not fucking waist my time with your VIRUS infected copy of windows. I did not want it, but you infected my computer and compromised my ability to use your computer by forcing it on me.
I bought two lenova computers, one thinkpad line, one flex line. I will never, ever, pull either computer out in front of client again, just because of the PR. My clients expect high data security. The conversation alone, will cost me more than I paid for those computers.
I luckily only kept a windows partition on the thinkpad (just in case there was some emergency), but have only started it once. I had the good sense, to wipe, completely, without even starting the windows on the FLEX consumer system (looked like windows and lenova partitions shit all over my hard drive).
The reputation of the fuck up still impacts my ability to use my LENOVA notebooks in my day to day business, in spite of using linux on every computer in my company (I even block network connections from windows computers). It takes one client to recoil or hesitate at the sight of a Lenova laptop in a meeting, to fuck me.
Shit, if the drivers worked, I would not even be using linux on those computers. I would be using some form of BSD. So, the brand alone, is now banned from my network, and definitely will never be purchases again.
Meanwhile, I wait eagerly for the class action law suits to sort out which one is going to be the prime class action law suit.
It is the same as ads. You pay more to get the Kindle without the ads...
Whats the bet that the "Security Software" they refer to includes those crappy limited trial versions of software from McAfee and Norton, the stuff that is impossible to uninstall and gives you endless nag screens pushing you to give them money? (nag screens that used to be good at getting idiots to part with their money but now thanks to scams and fake anti-virus products and stuff that all their geek friends keep telling them about are more likely to get those same idiots to assume they are bogus and ignore them)
Those things are some of the worst offenders when it comes to bloatware.
We had to remove Lenovo from our approved purchases list.
Lenovo should have anticipated a negative reaction
to their Fishy spyware.
They are banned from purchase.
Still, new hardware is reformatted and fitted with our own install image.
Lenovo should have never altered base windows installs.
Toxic bloatware will indeed be toxic to Lenovo's revenue.
Dare I hope this will come true? I remember Sony laptops used to offer a "wiped" install on some laptops, with a clean win7 install, no Sony or bloatware software (cue windows is bloatware jokes... you're not funny). I was going to get a Sony, mostly for that reason (they were comparable to other laptops in every other respect).
Using an ad blocker is cheating. It is roughly the same thing as wearing panties under miniskirts. Or eating the bait without swallowing the hook. Do you think tackle pays for itself? If you are too cheap to buy trousers, do you think you have the right to cover your ass?
Bloatwear, No wee need to concentrate on our hardware backdoors instead.
And good riddance.
No I will pay the full cost thank you just please don't put that shit on my machine
My last laptop I bought was from System76 with no bloatware anywhere. Just the OS and applications. I fired it up and went right to work Wonderful. It was even came cleaned of Windows with a nice fresh copy of Ubuntu.
If I remember correctly, TPM arrived around the same time as the trusted computing travesty. You remember... Microsoft decided that programmers could not be trusted to write in assembler, so instead we would all be restricted to using Microsoft tools that generate pseudo-code which subsequently gets executed by a new emulator/runtime. The runtime of course does run in native code... Oh yea, Microsoft can be trusted to write in assembler, just not anyone else. Then they decided the best language for coding in the dot net environment was visual basic. They tried to prove that by using it for their next OS and that was Vista.
But back to the bloatware. I have heard it said that if the vendor didn't bundle the bloatware, we would have to pay full price for Windows. Back when a PC costed $5,000, it was understandable that the OS might cost several hundred dollars, and even that a repair might be worth actual money. By the time eMachines were available for about $300, Microsoft had sold an immense number of copies of Windows and I would have expected economy of scale to have brought the price down over time. End users don't want to pay almost as much for a copy of Windows as their computer cost
With as heavy a load of viruses as Windows software seems be infested with, machines today are the most healthy when loaded with the base operating system, and updated to the current level. Virus protection would ideally be provided by Microsoft themselves. We have experienced many years of system sluggishness caused by anti-virus software that wasn't very well integrated and struggled with the OS. (norton...)
After that the average user wants the usual web browser and email program, and of course some multimedia. More advanced users want those productivity applications like word processing and spreadsheets. Then of course there is the temptation to load games as well. In all these cases, experience indicates to source these programs from known vendors. After all this is loaded, there is a good change you may know what is going on with the machine. Any questions you have about the software are likely things you have encountered before and accepted as interesting but not dangerous.
Beyond that comes complete chaos. Tons of unknown DLLs and background processes you have never heard of before, and the OS becomes somewhat sluggish, making you wait longer than you previously had to. Annoyingly so.
If we use computers to put our information in orderly form. It seems to me the bloatware ruins all that, like enabling some form of shuffle mode in the OS. Of course if you need a new hobby, you can look in the task manager at the running services and google them, 1 by 1.
I say, good for Lenovo. I dislike bloatware. Of course I dislike Windows as well. I consider it a form of bloatware too. But that is another story.