Analog Still Big In Japan (bbc.com)

An anonymous reader writes: BBC News reports that Japan, the island nation famous for robotics, 4G phones, bullet trains and corporate tech giants, is actually run by fax machines, human traffic lights, and 4.2 million small to medium-sized companies. Wary of connecting to networks for fear of data theft and hacking, Japanese office workers average just half the productivity of their American counterparts. Whether this conservativism in IT can prevent automation and robots from replacing people remains to be seen. However, the use of cassette tape recorders, hand-written data disk mailers, and 1997-era e-mail systems with near zero storage definitely hurts competitiveness in the global market.

Comments

illogical summary

[rubycodez]

What proof is there that this hurts global competitiveness in any way? because it sounds right?

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

It hurts the Japanese corporations who are trying to globally compete in outsourcing labor and driving down wages.

Re:illogical summary

[ArmoredDragon]

If you're less productive then it means your costs are invariably higher than somebody else, including other countries with even higher cost of labor. That means you're going to have a harder time competing on product pricing. It also means that in the event of a labor shortage, your aggregate product output will be markedly reduced compared to your competitors, and the only way to improve is to improve productivity.

Re:illogical summary

[youngone]

There's no proof, and the "Global Competitiveness" crap in TFA is irrelevant to the millions of Japanese SMEs, because they are not competing globally.

The point of Japanese business is to keep the people of Japan working, and so they employ people to do jobs that machines could do cheaper, because if you lay them all off, they will be a burden on society.

I knew a guy who worked for his Japanese Father-in-Law's business for a couple of years, and was told on his first day to forget about doing anything smarter or better, but to make sure everyone was doing their job, because the company existed to provide jobs.

He quite liked Japan, but his Japanese wife became homesick for New Zealand, and they had to move back.

Re:illogical summary

[ajzimm3rman]

Because driving down wages is the goal here, of course. :---- |

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

If you're less productive then it means your costs are invariably higher than somebody else, including other countries with even higher cost of labor. That means you're going to have a harder time competing on product pricing. It also means that in the event of a labor shortage, your aggregate product output will be markedly reduced compared to your competitors, and the only way to improve is to improve productivity.

Or you could simply lead with quality, which is something people still travel to Japan specifically to seek.

Old-fashioned may mean inferior to most here, but to some, it's a sign of a well-worn and proven process. The Japanese seem to respect and embrace that.

And in the future when one employed American is responsible for providing for 30 others due to our massive outsourcing and automation efforts sucking jobs dry within the next 20 years, we might be yearning for the days of real jobs.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Not just that, but comparing "american productivity" to well pretty much any other country is just dumb anyway. It's already been long established that we work longer hours than nearly every other country in the world. Honestly, I'd love to have the same freedoms I enjoy in the great old USA and have the work life of the Eurpoeans

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

In modern-era Japan, YOU replace machines!

So, dear spellchecker...

Re:illogical summary

[phantomfive]

I read the article, and they offer no proof. It's a baseless assertion. This quote from the article made me laugh:

This is a country ... where big-name companies running 10-year-old software is the norm.

Better tell the author to never investigate America, he may discover that all his bank transactions go through software from the 70s.

Re:illogical summary

[ShanghaiBill]

The point of Japanese business is to keep the people of Japan working

The purpose of a business to generate profits for the owners. A beneficial side effect is the creation of goods an services. "Keeping people busy" is neither a purpose nor a benefit.

they employ people to do jobs that machines could do cheaper, because if you lay them all off, they will be a burden on society.

This is the Lump of Labor Fallacy. There is not a fixed number of jobs in an economy, and if people are doing inefficient busy work, then they are already a burden on society. They should be doing something that actually creates value.

A big problem in Japan, is that to open a new shop, you need to get approval from other shops nearby. The shop owners work together to veto any competition, or consolidation. So the result is a proliferation of tiny inefficient shops, millions of people employed in unproductive retail jobs, high prices for consumers, and a lot of time consuming shopping while going from store to store to find what you need.

Re:illogical summary

[Ol Olsoc]

If you're less productive then it means your costs are invariably higher than somebody else, including other countries with even higher cost of labor. That means you're going to have a harder time competing on product pricing. It also means that in the event of a labor shortage, your aggregate product output will be markedly reduced compared to your competitors, and the only way to improve is to improve productivity.

How exactly are FAX machines making your costs higher?

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Correct.

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Have you ever used a fax machine?

Other then that, the phone line fees, machine maintenance, paper...

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

"The purpose of a business to generate profits for the owners. A beneficial side effect is the creation of goods an services. "Keeping people busy" is neither a purpose nor a benefit."

No, that is the capitalist purpose of a business. It's possible that other people have different definitions as to the purpose of a business.

Re:illogical summary

[Harlequin80]

Really? I've never worked in Japan but I have visited it extensively and there are loads and loads of super-stores that carry absolutely everything. I can see this type of protectionism happening in small towns but I would find it surprising in the larger cities.

Also not read TFA, who does, but I wonder if this is per man hour or per employee or per $. The reason I ask is all my Japanese friends work CRAZY long hours and have crap leave entitlements.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

You sound like a Stalinist. The purpose of an association of people is whatever they damn please, not your quasi-religious goal of "profit".

As for the rest of your argument, a perceived inefficiency because nobody knows how to increase efficiency is practically equivalent to one deliberately introduced. As long as Japan is happy with its system, and doesn't require it to compete where relevant with external systems, there is no reason for it to change.

It's like wandering into 1850 with a digital computer and pointing out how so many people are suddenly a burden on society. Nope - they're exactly where they were two minutes ago, contributing to society. Maybe your computer gives them a version of society they prefer, or maybe not.

Re:illogical summary

[youngone]

The purpose of a business to generate profits for the owners

Not in Japan, not as an absolute.

The Lump of Labour fallacy is an unproven economics opinion. Not to be confused with a fact.

A big problem in Japan, is that to open a new shop...

This is not considered a problem in Japan.

Re: illogical summary

[Ol Olsoc]

Have you ever used a fax machine?

Other then that, the phone line fees, machine maintenance, paper...

Have on in my office, An all in one printer. `Works just fine, and is just one of the communication tools I use. Often very handy for legal documents.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

It takes 370 man hours to produce one fax on a fax machine. The second required fax entails 732 hours, because using it the first time emptied the fax toner, and no one knows how to replace it. Furthermore, the scarcity of knowledge requires the hiring of consultants to service the machine, which further requires hiring a consultant recommendation consultant, to weed through all the contract bids.

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Much easier than email

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

With some exceptions, the use of machines start as a competitive edge leaving the quality to manual labour but eventually machine produce became so good or even better than manual labour

I suspects that the reason Japan still use faxes and old OS(es)? is because the population is old and getting older

Old people do not like to change their ways, they become quite good at what they do by long years of practice and don't see a reason to change their ways and to learn a new skill set just to do the same job
They are conservative

Re:illogical summary

[LinuxIsGarbage]

I read the article, and they offer no proof. It's a baseless assertion. This quote from the article made me laugh:

This is a country ... where big-name companies running 10-year-old software is the norm.

Better tell the author to never investigate America, he may discover that all his bank transactions go through software from the 70s.

Or pretty much any company. My company has software dating from the 70's/ 80's / 90's running all the production equipment (some on 80's / 90's hardware). Go into a car dealership and there's a terminal window connected to VMS or IBM/360 system. The other day I was at the customer service counter of Walmart. I could see into someone's office, and there was a green terminal window connected to a VMS or IBM/360 system. Look behind the counter when you're at the check-in, or at the gate of an airport and likewise the airlines are all running VMS or IBM/360.

I don't even blink if someone is running WindowsXP based anything.

Re:illogical summary

[Darinbob]

Because... Internet! Social Media! CandyCrush! Don't be so 2014.

Re:illogical summary

[tsotha]

The purpose of a business to generate profits for the owners. A beneficial side effect is the creation of goods an services. "Keeping people busy" is neither a purpose nor a benefit.

That's the point of a public company, sure. But the purpose of a private company is whatever the owner wants it to be. If the owner thinks the social benefits are worth what he spends to employ extra people, then his business is serving its purpose. It should be pointed out social pressure on Japanese people in all aspects of life is stronger than it is in the US, and business owners aren't immune.

Re:illogical summary

[cayenne8]

And hey, one thing the Japanese have right about the analog love....Tube Amps for stereo.

Stereos that "glow"....sound so great, and look so cool in the room with the lights turned down low.

Easy on the ears and easy on the eyes.

:)

Re:illogical summary

[hcs_$reboot]

The point of Japanese business is to keep the people of Japan working, and so they employ people to do jobs that machines could do cheaper, because if you lay them all off, they will be a burden on society.

That behavior has deeper roots buried in Japanese culture. The big boom, the bubble, that catapulted Japan into the world's second largest economy in the 60's up to the 80's was mainly due to the after war (II) boost from the West (mainly American influence). But actually Japanese like to maintain and nourish the present state. Don't look at the past, don't try to anticipate the future. A zen garden. And yes, businesses in Japan are full of faxes, obsolete and old-fashion software, grandad management strategies... most of which are reminiscences from a past era which are, anyway, not really part of the true Japanese culture. Modern or traditional, which is better? To catch up with the world economy, modern certainly wins. But is it what most Japanese want? Certainly not.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Pressing the enter key is not a period.

Re:illogical summary

[Z34107]

There's no proof, and the "Global Competitiveness" crap in TFA is irrelevant to the millions of Japanese SMEs, because they are not competing globally.

Japan is on the edge of a demographics crisis. 25% of their population is over 65, compared with 59% that work. Having only ~2.36 people paying into public healthcare and social insurance for each person drawing out is not a good ratio, and with their notoriously low birth rates, is only going to worsen as time goes on.

In the meanwhile, Japan's racking up shittons of debt, and has to import nearly all of their energy.

So, what does this mean? It means productivity is really fucking important. If your aging population has fewer than 2 workers to cover each retiree, those workers better be really fucking productive or those healthcare costs are going to be an incredible burden. If you need to import 94% of your energy at great expense, you better put that energy to really fucking good use--i.e., be productive--or otherwise you're spending everything on coal and petrodollars instead of your own people. If your government debt is skyrocketing, but has fewer and fewer taxpayers to pay it down, those people better be really fucking productive or you're not going to have a government.

That latter point is especially important. Japan can get away with its debt load because of Japan's famously high savings rate--lots of people (or banks using people's savings) buying savings bonds means you can issue those bonds really cheaply. But, when people retire, they by necessity stop saving and start drawing on their savings instead. The government has double their yearly income in what's essentially an adjustable-rate mortgage, and the interest rates are going to skyrocket right as fewer people are there to pay it down.

Re:illogical summary

[hcs_$reboot]

Don't forget to mention that everyone is on Yahoo (Japan). But, nope. Reason is not due to an aging population.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Not just that, but comparing "american productivity" to well pretty much any other country is just dumb anyway. It's already been long established that we work longer hours than nearly every other country in the world. Honestly, I'd love to have the same freedoms I enjoy in the great old USA and have the work life of the Eurpoeans

> Honestly, I'd love to have the same freedoms I enjoy in the great old USA and have the work life of the Eurpoeans

The obvious way to do that is to raise taxes on the rich.

The obvious truth is that will never happen in the USA. Not while the Republicans have anything to say about it.

Re:illogical summary

[Snufu]

Newer is not always better, and quite often the reverse it true. In many cases, "They don't make 'em like they used to" is fact, not nostalgia.

Re:illogical summary

[JoeMerchant]

Or, we could, you know, pay people to do other things?

If food, clothing, shelter, health care and education are covered - why not pay people to landscape, create art, design, waste resources on sentimental projects like restoring old cars and houses, make billion dollar movies, etc.? We're already doing a lot of this, if the people sitting on their cash hoards were somehow incentivized to support more of it, we'd have less poverty and more cool stuff.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Having visited Japan on work several times, I must say:

(1) the original article is bang on
(2) the purpose of large japanese enterprises is to employ young japanese graduates - for life if possible. profit or shareholder value are not *in reality* the purpose of japanese enterprise.
(3) productivity, and for that matter agility, are totally foreign in japanese large-enterprise work culture
(4) use of ancient IT, and shoe-horning of modern IT into ancient and pointless business processes, is the norm.

Japan will never recover its status as world-leader because its culture, not its arbitrary/current situation, are what drive its problems.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

japanese work hours *are* crazy long.

plus super long commutes in major metro areas make life quite difficult.

but .... that doesn't make them productive. they are just mindlessly following old, tired processes and sucking up to management in a rigid hierarchy. they aren't *producing anything* during those long hours. They are very hard-working and often intelligent but their work does not generate much.

Re: illogical summary

[Catbeller]

A corporation, being a government-granted license to avoid personal responsibility for one's actions, is not free to do whatever it wants for some self-defined goal of endless profit. That notion started around 1970. A corp is not a castle, and its true purpose is determined by the society that granted it its privileges. That has been understood for centuries, until, as I said, around 1970.

Re:illogical summary

[khallow]

But actually Japanese like to maintain and nourish the present state.

Sure, they do. While things have been worse in living memory, you have to wonder how everyone takes the economic stagnation of the past 25 years and the aging of modern Japanese society? Is everyone "we didn't need that leading first world society anyway" like some of the posters on Slashdot insist or are some of them a bit concerned about the way things are heading?

Don't look at the past, don't try to anticipate the future.

Which is nice when anticipating the future doesn't have any value. When it matters a lot, well, you need a better approach.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

I would trust an old mainframe. I know I can't trust Windows.

Re:illogical summary

[ArmoredDragon]

Or you could simply lead with quality

Only to a certain extent. When you apply "lean principles" (google it) you simultaneously increase productivity AND quality. The practice behind lean principles is the following:

- Always look for ways that you can reduce the number of manual steps in manufacturing
- Fewer manual steps means fewer incidence of human error, leading to lower defect rate (a defect is defined as anything that negatively impacts customer perception of the product) leading to higher quality
- Time to production is reduced, human labor cost is reduced and/or labor time is free for other tasks, such as increased output
- Price is reduced

Re:illogical summary

[ArmoredDragon]

How exactly are FAX machines making your costs higher?

Probably because electronic form filling allows you to skip the steps of printing, handwriting, and then scanning each document, in addition to the dial and handshake, and the transmit time, and remember, time is money. Furthermore it reduces material waste and reduces the need for data entry and/or transcription.

And then of course, since fax machines involve moving parts and in most cases ink/toner, there's added time and cost involved in routine maintenance tasks.

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Have you ever used a fax machine?

Yes and we unplugged the POS when it become so overwhelmed with advertisement spam that legitimate business communications were being delayed far too long. Perhaps Japan has a regulatory environment that precludes FAX spam but the deregulated phone industry of the USA offers no such safe haven.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

So the result is a proliferation of tiny inefficient shops, millions of people employed in unproductive retail jobs, high prices for consumers, and a lot of time consuming shopping while going from store to store to find what you need.

Sounds primed for disruption. Where's Amazon Japan when you need it?

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

It's possible that other people have different definitions as to the purpose of a business.

That may be. However, if an organization fails consistently to earn a profit, it's not really a business or at least not according to most taxing jurisdictions around the world. If such a rule was not in place, people would be writing off their hobbies, living expenses and anything else as "business expenses" on their taxes and if there's one thing that governments everywhere hate, it's unpaid taxes.

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

old farts cannot innovate. japan was once young and hungry. now geriatric. thats all.

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

even castles needed some sort of loyal peasants to feed the castle dwellers ( burgers).

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

given that many countries gravitate to sodom amd gomorrea, japan may reconsider praying to god mammon.

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

skilled and motivated japanese samurai style workers can compete with anyone, including rah rah mericans full of half knowledge.

they currently do not need to improve, because they are still so good.

Re:illogical summary

[vakuona]

How exactly are FAX machines making your costs higher?

 

Probably because electronic form filling allows you to skip the steps of printing, handwriting, and then scanning each document, in addition to the dial and handshake, and the transmit time, and remember, time is money. Furthermore it reduces material waste and reduces the need for data entry and/or transcription.

And then of course, since fax machines involve moving parts and in most cases ink/toner, there's added time and cost involved in routine maintenance tasks.

Or maybe it discourages them from sending pointless and avoidable communications, such as emails!

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

A corp is not a castle, and its true purpose is determined by the society that granted it its privileges. That has been understood for centuries, until, as I said, around 1970.

You seem to be misinformed, perhaps you should ask your history teachers for a refund?

Re:illogical summary

[l0n3s0m3phr34k]

"Look behind the counter when you're at the check-in, or at the gate of an airport and likewise the airlines are all running VMS or IBM/360" actually, no they don't. My clients at work are the "major airlines". The systems behind the curtain are far more complex than a single system. IBM Z-based mainframes (running TPF), Solaris, Windows from 2000-2012, RHEL and VMware...these systems are clusters of VMs and hardware across the entire planet. Those baggage systems connect back to mainframes.

Re:illogical summary

[EvilAlphonso]

There's basically no incentive to be productive if you don't own the business. Salaries have been stagnant for a long long time, a large segment of the workforce is on temporary contracts and promotions are rarely (if ever) based on performance. Also, roughly 25% of the workforce is on a dead-end career track... office ladies.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Who is we?

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

fax machines involve moving parts and in most cases ink/toner

What fax machine uses ink? Most of them use thermal paper.

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Move to Australia then. More freedoms that the good ol USA, a higher standard of living than almost everyone, and better beaches than Europe.
No, stupid metadata retention laws don't count as an argument against freedoms. I'd take the freedom to not have kids gunned down at school or being massacred at a movie theatre over some metadata nonsense any day.
The USA would be ok if it wasn't so violent, have armed lunatics everywhere and if it's health, educational and work systems weren't so awful.

Re:illogical summary

[AmiMoJo]

I'm guessing you have not spent much time in Japan. The rules on opening new shops are great. They keep shopping areas from becoming clones of each other. Most UK towns are indistinguishable now, having the exact same set of shops and cafes as everywhere else. Japan has avoided that by giving local businesses a voice.

Yeah, it's less efficient. It's also qualitatively better. It's no longer a race to the bottom to see who can provide the cheapest parking, because that's the only differentiator. Areas have character and unique shops to visit. You can get personal service and unique goods. It's so much better than the alternative it's hard for me to convey.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

The purpose of a business to generate profits for the owners. A beneficial side effect is the creation of goods an services. "Keeping people busy" is neither a purpose nor a benefit. [...] There is not a fixed number of jobs in an economy, and if people are doing inefficient busy work, then they are already a burden on society. They should be doing something that actually creates value.

So the purpose of a business is to create profit for its owners and the purpose of individual people is toe create value? Value for whom? If you don't create value the burden is on society, you state[*], so I assume you mean value for society. Do you really create value for society if the purpose of your work is to fill the pockets of business owners and the creation of goods and services is merely a side effect? Wouldn't it be far more efficient for society as a whole to focus on what is useful for society, the goods and services?

When I was young I was taught (not in the US, in the Netherlands) that the purpose of a business is to add value to a market. That makes sense to me. If the business is just a profit generator for the owners then it seems to me the shareholders are the real customers, and what is called customers are something to be exploited. It's clear that many businesses operate that way, nowadays. But the effect is that the shareholder customers essentially pay money to buy more money, while society is being exploited to finance that. That strikes me as a ridiculous model that probably won't be sustainable in the long term (by which I don't mean just a few decades).

What you see as the purpose of a business may not be of all places or all times. Perhaps Japan has cultural values that are so different from what you're used to that what works best in their society is very different from what you're used to as well. Don't assume that what you're used to is the only thing that could possibly work, there have been highly succesful cultures in the past that were not based on modern capitalist ideas, and there may be in the future. How a culture views things has a large influence at how it behaves. Keep an open mind.

[*] Ants don't seem to think so. Up to 60% is idle at any time, and 20% never does any work at all. What happens when you remove those 20% is still being studied, but it wouldn't surprise me if it turns out that 20% of the remaining ants will stop working, simply because so much productivity is not needed to sustain the nest. Perhaps ants aren't focused on maximizing productivity but on continuity.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

> The purpose of a business to generate profits for the owners.

This doesn't even ring true in the USA. The original tenet of protestantism was that people shall enterprise for their own profit and the world's benefit.

Protestantism holds that not exploiting your creativity to make the world a better place is a disgrace against the Lord who granted you such abilities and misery is associated with catholicism. Misery can happen through inactivity or lazyness to innovate, thereby leaving the world an undeveloped and unconquered place, where people suffer from lack of earthly goods and diseases and spiritual/scientific darkness, without knowledge and education for all. Misery can also happen via man exploiting man without mercy, which catholic feudalism had done. Protestantism is diametrically opposed to both lack of education and feudalism.

The purpose of a business is to make the owners proud of their achivements in their life standards and the good standing they achieved within the society. These are signs of predestination. If you concentrate on profit only, you will not have a good standing in the eye of the majority society and only a minuscule minority will say you are predestined for Heaven.

Re:illogical summary

[AmiMoJo]

Japan has this interesting duality where on the one hand people are replacing perfectly good stuff with the latest model because it has some extra features, but on the other hand they will keep ancient technology going because it works and out of nostalgia.

If you walk into a big electronics shop like Yodobashi or BIC you will find the latest 80" 4K TVs along side tape decks. 3D printers next to fax machines. Attempts have been made to replace some of these. For example people like stamping things with their personal stamps, a bit like putting your initials on stuff in the west to say you have checked it. So paper documents are still important. Attempts to create electronic stamps have been made but a lot of places still use faxes.

The whole of Japan is like this. You can be walking through an ultra modern district full of high end shops and apartments, and then find a little area with a 500 year old shrine and a little cafe that has been there since the 1920s.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

> my Japanese friends work CRAZY long hours

They do because it is considered anathema to leave as long as the boss is still in the office, the utmost act of disrespect. You wil be swapping windows arond the screen mindlessly or recalculate an Excel sheet 5000 times to spend the time appearing to be working. When the boss is about to leave you will carefully listen if he invites the workforce to have an evening sake drink out. You will join and arrive home maybe 02:30AM, but if you absolutely, totally cannot join in for undisputable "vis major" resons, bow so much your forehead reaches your shoes and apologize to the boss and then to your collegues for 5 minutes straight.

Your wife is a living doll of finest porcelain, full of cute and kindness and you would spend all your strenght inside her and carry her around on your palm all the time. But in a few years you two will be totally alienated, cause you will barely see her, maybe for half a day per week if you are lucky. Arriving home from after-work drinks at 02:30AM you won't have the strenght left to give her what ladies regularly need. If you are unlucky, you will see her once per month, because the company or ministry relocates you, the loyal employee to a remote place where affordable family housing and a good school are unavailable for your kid (rarely kids), so she stays behind as a housewife. The kid(s) will grow up to become emo and/or hikikomori and commit suicide by the time turning 31.

Re:illogical summary

[serviscope_minor]

This is not considered a problem in Japan.

I expect some people consider it a good thing in fact. I suspect they don't have the problem that the UK does that more or less every highstreet is completely identical with an identical range of stuff.

Re:illogical summary

[justaguy516]

The first step is to be amended as
- Always look for ways that you can reduce the number of manual steps in manufacturing WITHOUT sacrificing design objectives and material (input) quality.

Which is much harder than it sounds. Typically people do the first part, sacrifice the second, then end up with a cheaper and inferior product. Whereas the Japanese, Swiss, German and other manufacturers of quality are very careful about these 'low-hanging' fruit.

Re:illogical summary

[justaguy516]

The purpose of a business is to sell products to customers at a profit. When your own workers are your own customers, paying them less means eating away your own customer pool.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

a simple process analysis on every day life in Japan, at least as a foreigner living there in the 2000s was that everything was hopelessly bureaucratic, paper intensive, and everything had long lead times. If I recall correctly, it took me a month to get internet and they slow mailed the router to me to setup. So, most of that wait time was internal to the internet service provider. I also recall having to go from bank to bank for stuff related to renting and utilities. It has been a few years so I recall specifically what all the trekking about was for anymore. Still, it was Not as bad as Italy but certainly not as streamlined as South Korea.

Re:illogical summary

[towermac]

Dang. You should write for a living.

(Obviously no mod points here. I let them expire, and never have them when I need them.)

Re:illogical summary

[Sique]

There is no problem to build a completely silicon/germanium based amplifier which glows and has better characteristics than a tube based one. You might need more elements to do so, but as silicon is small, cheap and quite frugal on electric energy, while tubes are not, operational amplifiers have better characteristics and less energy consumption than tube based ones.

Re:illogical summary

[Sique]

As I am working in the phone industry, I can tell you, that the thermo fax is long gone. All modern fax machines use simple printing paper and have either a laser printing engine or a normal ink jet one. Thermal paper today is mostly used to print paper receipts at POS systems, but not much somewhere else.

Re:illogical summary

[gargleblast]

Stereos that "glow"....sound so great, and look so cool in the room with the lights turned down low.

Smiley face noted but there is nothing cool about fake vacuum tube amps.

They sound warm. And at least part of the reason is Synesthesia.

Re:illogical summary

[jellomizer]

Higher paper and consumables.
Data is sent as image making it harder to index and catalog.
The mechanics of scanning analog sending and printing can cause a lot of errors in the stream.
Poor quality means less detail or bigger text.
Having to translate a bad fax.

Facing sucks. I work at a hospital I know. It is hard to force people off the habit.

Re: illogical summary

[towermac]

Wow.

The government-granted license is simply legal recognition of the fact that individuals can't accept responsibility for actions taken by a large collective of people. It is not plausible or logical that the owner(s), CEO, assembly worker, etc; can be legally responsible for the actions of others. They can only be held accountable for their personal actions in a fair and just society. And indeed, that 'government-granted' license does not protect individuals from personal malfeasance.

And since a corporation is simply people, they should be however free regular people are. And around here, people do not have their 'true purpose determined by the society that granted it its privileges', they just get to exist, and do whatever the hell they want to do. (within the law, of course)

Get a grip man. Dang. If it helps, you're right about the US peaking in 1969.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

millions of people employed in unproductive retail jobs

From a non-capitalist point of view, this reads as "millions of people employed". Period.

high prices for consumers

Japan has been stuck in deflation for 20 years or so while the salaries are about stable, so I don't know what your talking about. Plus food is cheap (at least compared to Western Europe).

Re:illogical summary

[Applehu Akbar]

At least the Japanese have an excuse. The kanji writing system made word processing systems more expensive and difficult to implement than in any other society. In our society, the fax machine hangs on in lines of business where documents have to be signed by hand. Though public key signing has been available for a generation, law evolves at tectonic speed.

Re:illogical summary

[Applehu Akbar]

"plus super long commutes in major metro areas make life quite difficult"

It might take you two hours to commute in from Choshi or Saitama, but you are spending that time on a train. You can do other things, even if your line is so crowded that the other thing is folding a newspaper to the size of a postage stamp and holding it over the heads of a standing crowd.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Hey look everyone! A time-traveller from 1994! Check out his neon winter jacket and feathered hair! Hahahaaahahahah!!!!!

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

It's MY money. MINE! MINE! Those 30 unemployed people can just go start their own companies! Nobody's allowed to take MY money just because no one need them to work and they're starving!

Now put down those torches and pitchforks and get off my lawn!

Re:illogical summary

[Stuarticus]

While the article is right that many devices use fake tubes it is wrong about the heater element, 12AX7 tubes use a heater voltage of 6.3 or 12.6V the HT should be over a hundred volts the exact voltage depending on your operating point. So it is entirely possible to run a valve glow from a 12 volt supply, in fact it's almost perfect.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

The poster is an idiot because even in (supposedly) capitalist countries like the U.S., even we have non-profit and not-for-profit. In addition, companies don't necessarily have "owners" rather than shareholders. This is the internet. Lots of people simply don't know what they're talking about.

Re:illogical summary

[angel'o'sphere]

Hm, how should we call your fallacy then?
I could make an wikipedia article called the "ShanghaiBill Fallacy", pointing out how false your asumtions are in general and particular regarding Japan ;D
I suggest you google a bit around how many jobs in Japan exist that are mainly done to "keep people bussy" and to "preserve tradition or culture"

That goes from rice farmers over fletchers (arrow smithes), bow crafters to fisher men that "hunt" with a crane (the bird) from a boat for fish down to anything that is "old" or to young ladies at the door of shopping malls shouting a welcoming "Onegai Shimazu!!!!" at each visitor/customer.

Some of those jobs are so rare but considered so important that the person conducting it is considered a "national treasure". Unless those people are old and have educated a successor, they are often not even allowed to leave the country. That covers e.g. the highest priests of shinto, the emporers sword smith etc. If one of those guys indeed can leave for a trip, then they are usually very short and they get an escort of two or more people.

Anyway, Japan is a land of contrasts. Highest amount of robots. Plety of small shop owners have an industrial robot in the garage and craft stuff on demand for e.g. the car industry.

Traditional shops for weapons or clothing etc. are in the middle of Tokyo or Kyoto. If the owners would only be interested in making money: they simply would sell the shop. The location and the "ground" alone is usually worth in the range of two to three digit millions of dollars.

Re:illogical summary

[Stuarticus]

I'd also point out they sound warm because of the even order harmonics and the ability to push a lot of bass not synaesthesia. There's a good explanation here:

http://education.lenardaudio.c...

I also find the article linked to about the z-vex half watt nano head being able to power a Marshall 4x12 stack pretty hilarious (it's only 20dB quieter! Don't worry about bass it's over-rated). I'm not sure engadget is a reliable source of information on this particular subject.

Re:illogical summary

[angel'o'sphere]

How do you sign a letter in Japan?

You seal it. How would you seal an email? Honestly? No need to get nerdy, we are not talking about PGP signatures ...

You can't seal an email, period.

So after you are done with the letter, which might be typed in Kanji and Kana at a computer, you print it. Then you seal it. Probably several people have to seal it.

Then you fax it to the destination, and then: you either courier it (another useless job would a westerner say) or send it via post mail.

How do you want to be considered serious if you are not even signing/sealing your letters and deliver them "in style"?

The faxes are just the short cuts so that the "working force" already knows what to do while the boss is taking his time to wait for the official papers.

Also the claim that Japan has no modern email is completely idiotic. Ofc. they have. However it might be they use it more intensive with the outside than inside of Japan, no idea.

Re:illogical summary

[Muad'Dave]

I was going to comment on the site about this very issue, but of course there was no 'report problems' link.

For tubes that follow the RETMA naming scheme, the filament voltage is the first set of numerical digits in the name. As you said, 12AX7 has a 12 volt filament.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

The purpose of a business is that what ever reads in the statement of business. More often than not they contain non-material values, and the purpose of generating profit to the owners and investors is only a beneficial side effect.

Re:illogical summary

[luis_a_espinal]

At least the Japanese have an excuse. The kanji writing system made word processing systems more expensive and difficult to implement than in any other society. In our society, the fax machine hangs on in lines of business where documents have to be signed by hand. Though public key signing has been available for a generation, law evolves at tectonic speed.

I've been in Japan, and I've not seen any of these supposed impediments due to Kanji. They have software that handles that just fine. It has been a solved problem for quite a long f* time going all the way to mechanical typewriters and printing blocks.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

"There's basically no incentive to be productive if you don't own the business. Salaries have been stagnant for a long long time, a large segment of the workforce is on temporary contracts and promotions are rarely (if ever) based on performance."

Sounds disturbingly similar to the US.

Not caring is a very logical response to having no incentive. Yet, the "logical" conservative will harp on the "emotional" liberal for pointing this out. Like many (but not all) problems, this one has a very easy solution that simply won't be tried because reasons.

Re:illogical summary

[luis_a_espinal]

How exactly are FAX machines making your costs higher?

Probably because electronic form filling allows you to skip the steps of printing, handwriting, and then scanning each document, in addition to the dial and handshake, and the transmit time, and remember, time is money. Furthermore it reduces material waste and reduces the need for data entry and/or transcription.

And then of course, since fax machines involve moving parts and in most cases ink/toner, there's added time and cost involved in routine maintenance tasks.

Write paper in Kanji-capable word processor, or a JIT-kana-to-kanji processors (surprise, those highly industrialized Japanese folks actually solved that problem a long time ago). Then print, then fax fax. Or guess what, print directly to fax (you can do that in Windows, cool, I know!).

I really want to know if the people commenting in this tread have ever set foot in Japan. I wonder because there is a lot of BS being passed as opinions or technical observations on the subject.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Sure, they do. While things have been worse in living memory, you have to wonder how everyone takes the economic stagnation of the past 25 years and the aging of modern Japanese society?

Oh, they've taken it in stride. Just like how in the Western nerd culture has become commercialized, the Japanese have embraced catering to their consumer culture full of NEETs an Otaku. That stuff even got exported to the west, with "weaboos" being the more modern slang name for Japanophiles.

Apparently even the government embraced exporting their culture as a soft power.

I suspect the Japanese view their economy and birth rate similar to how you view climate change. Even if they think it's a problem, they are in no hurry to do anything to fix it.

In fact, they are doing things that are the opposite of fixes. For example, a few years back they pass a law to regulate (read: ban) certain naughty picture books in Tokyo. The social conservatives must've thought if the kids didn't have p0rn they might go date real girls and find real jobs (their part time job that sustains their hobby doesn't count!). Joke's on them as p0rn has always been with us and the kids will find them nonetheless (have they heard of the Internet?), and the ban simply hurt their economy by hurting the publishers and artists, the people who had those "real" jobs.

Re:illogical summary

[luis_a_espinal]

I mean, FFSK! This is what my wife uses in MS Word to write Kanji and Kana. I've set up her laptop (and somewhat similar in her Android tablet) to allow her to write Kanji:

https://support.microsoft.com/...

Re:illogical summary

[Ol Olsoc]

Probably because electronic form filling allows you to skip the steps of printing, handwriting, and then scanning each document, in addition to the dial and handshake, and the transmit time, and remember, time is money.

Maybe most folks are in a different world, but when I've served as Executor of wills, and enter the legal world, the lawyers wanted faxes with signatures, and even when I made a withdrawal from a Tax deferred account recently, I needed to fax a lot of signed forms to lawyers and accountants.

And yes, it seems weird to get a pdf emailed to you, then you fill in and sign it, then fax it back. But it's their rules, so I do it that way. I have to have a printer and a scanner, I have to have a phone line, so the costs and time of having a fax in the printer and the time to send it is pretty inconsequential.

Re:illogical summary

[Ol Olsoc]

Higher paper and consumables. Data is sent as image making it harder to index and catalog. The mechanics of scanning analog sending and printing can cause a lot of errors in the stream. Poor quality means less detail or bigger text. Having to translate a bad fax.

Facing sucks. I work at a hospital I know. It is hard to force people off the habit.

But when the people you are dealing with use signed faxes? I don't use my fax portion of my machines unless requested. And since some of the people I deal with want faxes, I would lose a lot of time and money travelling to a place that had a fax and back.

The technology is ancient. But unless I'm going to change the lawyer in say, my father's will, or give up a sweet interest rate in order to not use a fax machine, - I'm not going to worry about it too much. I'll fax them the signed documents they want, then go about the rest of my life, fat dumb, and happy.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

"The purpose of a business to generate profits for the owners. A beneficial side effect is the creation of goods an services. "Keeping people busy" is neither a purpose nor a benefit."

No, that is the capitalist purpose of a business. It's possible that other people have different definitions as to the purpose of a business.

See also credit unions and co-ops (like REI in the US and MEC in Canada). Good example in Spain:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondragon_Corporation

Re:illogical summary

[cayenne8]

There is no problem to build a completely silicon/germanium based amplifier which glows and has better characteristics than a tube based one. You might need more elements to do so, but as silicon is small, cheap and quite frugal on electric energy, while tubes are not, operational amplifiers have better characteristics and less energy consumption than tube based ones.

But they aren't as pleasing to the ears with the various order harmonics, and they don't clip in the same fashion as real tube amps.

No one that is wanting really nice audio gives a damn about saving power or efficiency. If you can afford a nice hi-fi set, you can afford the power bill that comes with it pretty readily.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

IF there is no profit, there is no business.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

> There's no proof, and the "Global Competitiveness" crap in TFA is irrelevant to the millions of Japanese SMEs, because they are not competing globally.

Everybody is competing globally, even if they don't realize it.

Those shop owners absorb labor and resources from both their local and regional economy. Also the direct and opportunity costs for the economy as a whole for this sort of reported pervasive inefficiency has a significant cost in the overall productivity of labor - as many people doing something very inefficiently means that that there are fewer individuals contributing to the general economy at a higher level. That actually affects both them as individuals, but also their community as there is less economic activity (they're making their neighbors poorer), and the country.

With global competition, capital and resources are automatically allocated to world regions where efficiency is highest. So there's the additional cost of being increasingly being disconnected from the wider global economy and ending up a backwater.

It would be nice if large numbers of people could do whatever they want and have no effect whatsoever on the wealth of their neighbors or country, but things just don't work that way.

Re:illogical summary

[khallow]

In fact, they are doing things that are the opposite of fixes. For example, a few years back they pass a law to regulate (read: ban) certain naughty picture books in Tokyo. The social conservatives must've thought if the kids didn't have p0rn they might go date real girls and find real jobs (their part time job that sustains their hobby doesn't count!). Joke's on them as p0rn has always been with us and the kids will find them nonetheless (have they heard of the Internet?), and the ban simply hurt their economy by hurting the publishers and artists, the people who had those "real" jobs.

I think such things are a good indication of who really plans for the future. Here, we have 25 years of economic stagnation and a government obsessing over naughty bits rather than fixing big problems.

Meanwhile we have a bunch of ideologically bound slashdotters going sour grapes over Japan's economic situation. If their beliefs resulted in economic bounty in Jaoan, you can bet they'd be bragging about it. But since it doesn't, they're speaking of the lack of need for doing useful work or having a viable economy. I don't have respect for people who ignore awful consequences of their beliefs.

I suspect the Japanese view their economy and birth rate similar to how you view climate change.

And since you mentioned it (and since I feel like, once again, rubbing peoples' noses in the problems they create), let's consider the "opposite of fixes" in climate change. For example, Germany and Denmark have doubled the price of their electricity without making a credible or measurable change to humanity's impact on climate. This is the myopic foresight of the people who believe climate change is a big deal.

Meanwhile my suggestion to do nothing for a few decades will do more to help fix climate change by making humanity wealthier (and as a result, less fertile, more caring about the environment, and more capable of doing something effective about climate change). It's like a cruel parody of an enviroflick movie where the roles are reversed, the cigar-smoking, greedy businessman is helping the environment while the do gooder, hippie hero is unintentionally killing off the wildlife.

Re:illogical summary

[Coren22]

the fax machine hangs on in lines of business where documents have to be signed by hand.

Even there the fax machine is dying. Mortgages are done by scanning and emailing now rather than fax because the quality of faxes is too low to use properly.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

Write a check right now for 25% of your income and hand it to the nearest homeless person or you're a hypocrite.

Re:illogical summary

[david_thornley]

I think having people doing busy work is probably worse for the economy than just paying them, since it interferes with their ability to get into productive work.

Re:illogical summary

[erapert]

Country X will never improve because its culture, not its arbitrary/current situation, are what drive its problems.

Fixed.

Also, the corrolaries:

Sports team X will never improve because its culture, not its arbitrary/current situation, are what drive its problems.

The slothful and indolent will never improve their situation because its their mindset, not their arbitrary/current situation, which drive their problems.

Racial group X will never improve because its culture, not its arbitrary/current situation, are what drive its problems.

It's culture. It's all about culture. That's why it's so distressing to [social group X who "hates" or "fears" group Y] to see the moral degeneracy of our society. Sometimes they have a point. Sometimes not. Sometimes it's what's unpopular to admit in public that's what the public really needs to hear.

The ancients were wise to whisper into the emperor's ear "memento mori" but perhaps it could be generalized to "meministine quis sit invidiosum" (I'm an ignorant savage and I know absolutely nothing about latin so I used Google translate)

Re:illogical summary

[david_thornley]

The fact that those are not seen as problems means Japan's economy can never be as efficient as it could be.

Re:illogical summary

[erapert]

Also not read TFA, who does, but I wonder if this is per man hour or per employee or per $. The reason I ask is all my Japanese friends work CRAZY long hours and have crap leave entitlements.

Maybe it's because they're so inefficient.

Re:illogical summary

[david_thornley]

There's a difference between "keeping people busy" and "preserving ancient traditions". One of those provides actual value to society.

Re:illogical summary

[phantomfive]

You can be walking through an ultra modern district full of high end shops and apartments, and then find a little area with a 500 year old shrine and a little cafe that has been there since the 1920s.

And that little cafe is probably the best in the area.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

A time-traveller from 1994!

You mean like the fax machines that are the very topic of the story?

I know it's difficult for someone with your special needs, but try to keep up.

Re:illogical summary

[stoatwblr]

"But they aren't as pleasing to the ears with the various order harmonics, and they don't clip in the same fashion as real tube amps."

If I'm listening to a recording, I don't _want_ distortion. Soft-top clipping (which mostly gives even-harmonic distortion) may be more pleasing to the ear than hard clipping (which pushes odd harmonics) but it's still distortion.

On the other hand, if there's a guitar (or other instrument) plugged in, distortion is an intrinsic part of the overall sound. Otherwise you might as well just have 1960s Joan Baez wound up to ear-bleeding volume.

Re:illogical summary

[metrix007]

You know what this is? The problem with Japan and other countries with stupid cultural traditions such as this?

A lack of willpower.

It is so fucking stupid to waste your life because you've been raised to think that it is right to do so. To pretend to work for 3 hours because to leave early is an act of disrespect? Fuck that. If these people had any will, any ability to think for themselves, they would realize it doesn't make sense to waste your life like that. Go home, relax, or learn a new skill so you can get the fuck out of such a backwards workplace or country.

Re: illogical summary

[stoatwblr]

"the deregulated phone industry of the USA offers no such safe haven."

Did someone repeal the Telephone Consumer Protection Act (TCPA) when I wasn't looking? It was enacted specifically because of fax spam and making a claim under it is about 10 minutes work (note the company being schilled for, file a small claims action against them, claim triple damages if it's wilful - easy $1500)

Re: illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

That was an awesome impression of, unfortunately, about half the electorate in the US.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

I think such things are a good indication of who really plans for the future.

Meanwhile we have a bunch of ideologically bound slashdotters going sour grapes over Japan's economic situation.

Who are you talking about, specifically?

The slashdotter above us, hcs_$reboot, actually recognizes that the Japanese aren't very keen on planning for the future ("Don't look at the past, don't try to anticipate the future"). I supplied further evidence in how their government is more concerned with chasing after naught bits.

So who are these ideologically bound slashdotters you are speaking of who are calling sour grapes?

Glancing at the thread as a whole, I actually see more people who are ideologically libertarian (very common on slashdot). The Japanese, as a free people, choose to not pursue efficiency and productivity, they reap the consequences (Lost Decades), and slashdotters are defending their right to choose that way of living, even if some of them may not agree with it.

I don't think being able to defend the freedom of people you disagree with is a sign of being ideologically driven. Unless the ideology is liberty.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

It's also the mercantilist purpose of a business. More generally, the concept of a business was invented to generate profits for the owners. And if you look back to mines in ancient Greece, that idea is hardly new. The conveniences of legal personhood has indeed led to "businesses" which exist for other reasons such as charity, but that usage is fairly new and still the exception. Classically you'd incorporate as a trust if you weren't doing business with the intent of profit.

Re:illogical summary

[metrix007]

A downmod? Why? What I said is true, although maybe not PC...

Re:illogical summary

[metrix007]

Sealing an envelope is stupid, when better, more advanced technological alternatives exist.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

The giant red stain on your bedsheet is.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

You mean, http://www.amazon.co.jp/

Re:illogical summary

[khallow]

The slashdotter above us, hcs_$reboot, actually recognizes that the Japanese aren't very keen on planning for the future ("Don't look at the past, don't try to anticipate the future"). I supplied further evidence in how their government is more concerned with chasing after naught bits.

There's a difference between not wanting something and being unable, here due to incompetence at the societal level, to get something. That's the core distinction at the heart of the idea of sour grapes. Here, both you and hcs_$reboot assume that Japan and its citizens want the current state of affairs rather than try for something better. But from the article, the current state of affairs is pretty nasty: work long hours and get about half as much done in that time as a US worker could. Does anyone here really think the Japanese like to work about as hard as a US worker does and only get half as much done?

I don't think Japan wants this even a little bit. But they got caught in a trap of their own making with poor productivity, eye-popping debt loads both private and public, a destructive subsidized postal savings system, and a complete derailment of the strategy that made them a major industrial power in the first place. It's 25 years of slow decline.

I think this wouldn't have happened, if the grown ups who had built up the Japanese miracle were still in charge. They were used to making tough choices and rebuilding a country from rubble. But those guys died off long ago and now, it's the children in charge.

So who are these ideologically bound slashdotters you are speaking of who are calling sour grapes?

First, anyone who assumes Japan wants the current situation. Then there are people who assume that either this state of affairs won't hurt global competitiveness (which seems wrong) or global competitiveness just isn't that important (classic developed world whistling past the graveyard which has been wrong for 60 years and counting), both exhibited in the thread I linked.

Re:illogical summary

[MiSaunaSnob]

HIPAA has an exemption for faxes so for medical stuff its simply easier and safer from a compliance standpoint to fax. insurance companies also really like to force you to fax to them, I suppose it is because they do not want to have to deal with a 100 different implementations of secure email and file sharing because each practice and clinic has a different one.

Re: illogical summary

[tsotha]

There's no reason to believe we're talking about a corporation at all. The father-in-law may be the sole owner of the business, and were he in the US he might want to incorporate for liability reasons. But Japan isn't the US.

Which leads to the second point: It isn't reasonable to make sweeping generalizations about the details of corporate law, as it varies significantly from country to country.

Re:illogical summary

[angel'o'sphere]

It is not the envelop, you stamp your seal on the letter besides your signature. If you even sign it.

Re:illogical summary

[metrix007]

Yeah, that's my point. Seals can be faked. Why not use a more advanced, modern alternative that can't be?

Because Japan likes living in the past, that's why.

Re:illogical summary

[ToddInSF]

That kind of bogus and fallacious advice can cut different ways. Funny thing about people that say that kind of shit; they tend to be big hypocrites themselves.

Re: illogical summary

[rubycodez]

My officejet does faxes, while most of the time acting as printer and scanner. Paid $120 for it over ten years ago and it uses same phone line as my landline phone. some places still want faxes, so I plug in the phone line and fax. *shrug*

Re:illogical summary

[rubycodez]

You need to watch God explain to Cartman that ass-bleed is not a period; only women have periods

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

"They don't make em like they used to" is part truth (through things like "value"-engineering), and part survivorship bias.

I'd take pretty well any modern car over a pinto, for example. You don't see a lot of pintos and gremlins around to remind you how shit things really were, you only see the cars worth saving.

Re: illogical summary

[Noah Haders]

cool story bro. In the time it takes you to send or receive a fax, I just responded to a dozen emails. Feel the burn!

Re:illogical summary

[Aereus]

I'm fairly proficient at using the IME on Windows these days, but the on-screen one for Android requires a lot more effort. Completely different layout to memorize, have to press/swipe to get most kana, and then choose the kanji you want from the choices provided. Granted, over time it learns which kanji to bring to the front of the list, but it's still extra steps.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

"The purpose of a business to generate profits for the owners."

So says the heads of the Yakuza.

Re:illogical summary

[hooiberg]

Seconded. I also want to know.

Re:illogical summary

[angel'o'sphere]

Sure a seal can be faked.
So can a (hand) signature.

Why not use a more advanced, modern alternative that can't be?
What would be the point in it? Are you going to make a fake tax declaration for me and seal it with a faked seal resemblng mine?

Are you going to make a contract in my name with Boing oblieging me to buy 30 planes?

Using my seal is not only a crime but will be found out rather quickly.

Because Japan likes living in the past, that's why.
So does the rest of the world in many regards as well :D

Re:illogical summary

[RockDoctor]

Do you see that as a problem? And, if you're not Japanese (or a Japanese tax payer), does your opinion matter?

Re:illogical summary

[david_thornley]

That's not a problem as far as I'm concerned, and my opinion doesn't matter. I'm just making an observation.

In my observations, most people tend to want more stuff, or at least the ability to buy it, and that is a problem for Japanese people who do. It also reduces Japan's international influence. I would not like that attitude in the US.

Re:illogical summary

[Anonymous Coward]

There is no guarantee that calculated productivity of US worker means anything useful in the first place and why would it. Optimizing for one parameter only is bound to cause problems elsewhere but this cannot be explained to excel sheet masters.

Re:illogical summary

[rubycodez]

You are not considering the situation where countries are forced to compete either with slavery or workers who have very harsh and unsafe conditions. Business should not be done with such places, yet the USA snubbed good ally to do business with China, for example

Re:illogical summary

[RockDoctor]

Perhaps if you didn't live in the US, you might have a different attitude. Which doesn't make you wrong. Nor does being in America make you right, contrary to much American internal propaganda.

Re:illogical summary

[david_thornley]

Obviously, a lot of people in Japan have a different attitude. Nor am I either wrong or right in my attitude. I do stand by my statements, but how significant they are is subjective.

Re:illogical summary

[rubycodez]

False, there are legal requirements for e-signing that cannot be met by merely scanning and emailing. Look up the facts before vomiting bad legal advice

How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

Last I checked, fax machines were digital data streams....

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

The thing you send, and the thing you receive (written/printed sheets of paper) are analog. You'd have to digitise the documents before you could e.g. make them searchable or whatever. So yeah, pretty analog, as analog in fact as if you sent the same documents by snail mail, even though a digital data stream is involved in the transmission process.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[hawguy]

Last I checked, fax machines were digital data streams....

Sent via the user's analog phone line.

Re: How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

So it's as analog as a 4g cell phone. Your sending sound(not really, but that is your argument not mine) and receiving sound which is analog.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Harlequin80]

Who the fuck has a business grade fax machine that prints? Even your dodgiest multifunction fax / printer will email a received fax as a pdf. Same with standing in front of a fax machine and feeding in the pages. The only reason you would ever do that is if you had to sign a document.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[sound vision]

802.11g travels through analog air. It's still digital.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Dorkmunder]

not in a HIPAA complient environment where is not allowed. Faxing from paper is still the main way to pass patient info around. The 1970's never looked so good.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[ColdWetDog]

I take it you've never worked in a hospital. Or a law office.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Harlequin80]

Law office, no. Hospital, yes. In the hospital I worked at all faxes are automatically converted to pdf on arrival and are delivered to the relevant person via a specific piece of software which centralises all documentation. If the documentation is testing results these are attached the the relevant patients file and other relevant doctors are copied in (ie specialists).

While there is a shit tonne of paper records generated in a hospital faxes definitely are not one of them. Of courses this will totally vary on where you live in the world.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Harlequin80]

This is a big difference between the US and Australia.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[hcs_$reboot]

Everything digital is analog at some point.

Re: How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

Didn't the early (pre 1990s) fax machines use analog simaler to Slow-Scan TV used by ham radio operators?

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[fustakrakich]

An MFP uses a regular phone line for FAX, not the WIFI

Re: How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

Earlier fax machines used analog, and though the Wikipedia article is unclear, it seems support for them were dropped in the mid 1990s

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fax

That said, I wouldn't be suprised if there are atleast a handful still being used on a daily baises. You will be shocked at just how much old stuff, including shitboxes held together with chewing gum and bailing wire you couldn't get new parts for for decades are still being used out there in offices worldwide.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

One's full of niggers, the other's filled with abos.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, and they're both full of racist cunts.

Re: How is a fax machine analog?

[Catbeller]

The entire internet once lived on analog wires.

Re: How is a fax machine analog?

[hackwrench]

The analog portion that matters is the paper and ink, not the phone line, though technically these days they aren't needed to send a fax. I send faxes by using a free fax service that I upload a pdf or image file to.

Re: How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

I wonder how much energy is being wasted with some of these old "shit boxes". I mean, a modern laptop probaly uses and wastes far less electricity than some old 286 desktop with a 30 Megabyte MFM hard disk from 1987 even though it is thousands times more powerful and can do things like crunch data in the background while the user works in Powerpoint to boot.

Re: How is a fax machine analog?

[RightwingNutjob]

Still does. Light is a continuous electromagnetic (or probability amplitude) wave travelling through a glass waveguide.

Re: How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you a Nigger or an Abo ?

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

By that criterion, everything is analog and there's no such thing as digital.

Hint: it's about the signal, not the medium...

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

If you write and send some text in e-mail, the recipient can read it, directly copyedit it on-screen and send it back in a corrected version without delay, since it's a fully digital process.
If you handwrite, typewrite or print out a document for sending through fax, the recipient would have to OCR scan it or re-type it manually (both processes likely involving high single digit percentage of transcription errors), before he/she can make corrections to the probably slightly compromised text.
Then it would need to be printed out for sending back via fax and then, if you want to make a 2nd round of corrections and consult on that ... wish you good luck! All that inconvenience happens is because fax is analogue.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

"The thing you record, and the thing you hear (sound waves) are analog. So a CD is as analog in fact as if you recorded the same music by 1'' tape."

See how silly that is?

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[metrix007]

What is? Australia still mandates fax for many things. No difference in that regard, if that is what you were referring to.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Anonymous Coward]

Jesus Christ, will you idiots learn what "digital" and "analog" mean before you open your mouths?

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[Harlequin80]

My exposure to faxing for records in australia was electronic to electronic. So while the document passed through fax it was soft sent, and then received in electronic format. It never got printed out at the recipients end.

Re:How is a fax machine analog?

[metrix007]

Hmm. I immigrated out of Oz a few years ago, but up until then there were still various agencies and businesses that would *only* accept fax, citing email as insecure....sigh.

If it ain't broke...

[Anonymous Coward]

Japanese industry seems to be doing just fine. Why replace working systems simply for the sake of replacement?

Re:If it ain't broke...

[Anonymous Coward]

Higher profit margins through driving down wage standards.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[ajzimm3rman]

Basic Economics teaches us, that driving up productivity increases wages. SO your analogy is false sir/ma'am.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M]

Your knowledge of "basic economics" is bullshit and worthless. You can drive up productivity with machines, which cuts jobs and replaces skilled workers with less educated people at lower wages.

Fight for your bitcoins!

Re:If it ain't broke...

[Harlequin80]

Don't forget the creation of jobs which are higher skilled to maintain, install and program the robots.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe in a fantasy world where corporations aren't perpetually trying to pay their workers lasts for more work.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[Garfong]

Which is why the average person now is less educated and less well-paid than the middle ages.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't forget, Japs make the best neutron moderators, so standing around doing nothing is an honorable profession.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[Anonymous Coward]

Which is a complete fallacy. It takes a tiny percentage of the labor to maintain, install, and program the robots than the jobs they are replacing.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[thinkwaitfast]

Works for google.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[orlanz]

REALLY? I think you are taking for granted a TON of knowledge that is considered "general" and "common sense" that the middle ages would have thought was specialization.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[Garfong]

Like reading and writing?

I know sarcasm is often harder to pick up on in text, but I thought my comment was ridiculous enough that the sarcasm would be obvious. Oh, well.

Re:If it ain't broke...

[orlanz]

My apologies, I should have included a 3rd brain cell in that reading comprehension. In hindsight, that is funny.

What is the definition of "productivity"

[rsborg]

Does productivity count if you're offshoring and outsourcing everything and not growing your job/revenue/tax base (by also allow those offshore/inverted operations to avoid paying taxes) ?

Sounds like eating your seed corn to me.

Re:What is the definition of "productivity"

[Ol Olsoc]

Does productivity count if you're offshoring and outsourcing everything and not growing your job/revenue/tax base (by also allow those offshore/inverted operations to avoid paying taxes) ?

Sounds like eating your seed corn to me.

It's the Job Creators creating Jobs.

They just forgot to tell you where those jobs were going to be. Oopsies!

Re:What is the definition of "productivity"

[DigiShaman]

Yes, and when you have no opportunities or able to feed your animals, you get rid of them. In our case, young unemployed adults will be drafted and sent off to fight in WWIII.

Re:What is the definition of "productivity"

[war4peace]

Or, on a personal level, if my boss is giving me 2h worth of work every day, is my productivity bad or good?
It's both, as a matter of fact. What I achieve in 2h would take a colleague 10h worth of manpower, so my productivity is awesome. At the same time, slacking for 6h means my productivity sucks, although that's not my fault to start with.
Now, if my boss gives me enough work to keep me occupied for 8h, that amounts to 5 times what my colleague could achieve, but I'm paid the same salary as my colleague (in reality, I'm actually being paid less). So... how do you measure my productivity?

Faxes are not analog

[Anonymous Coward]

The image is discretized and the protocol is digital.

Those metrics don't matter

[Anonymous Coward]

They are still #1 in schoolgirl tentacle rape porn.

Re:Those metrics don't matter

[Anonymous Coward]

and technically, that *is* digital too!

The land of ATMs on holiday

[Neo-Rio-101]

Japan is also a country where the ATMs close after hours, and where cash is still used exclusively for most things.

It's also a country where your girlfriend will get upset if you don't take her to KFC on Christmas eve, followed by a love hotel,... but I digress.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[irrational_design]

So, greasy chicken* + love hotel = ... Nope, I definitely don't want to go there.

*Since it's Japan, this is probably greasy squid.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M]

Cash is still used exclusively for most things? In the country where you can pay for the bus and vending machines with your cellphone?

Fight for your bitcoins!

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

Wells Fargo ATMs close in San Francisco after hours as well so it's not just Japan.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

Japan is also a country where the ATMs close after hours, and where cash is still used exclusively for most things.

It's also a country where your girlfriend will get upset if you don't take her to KFC on Christmas eve, followed by a love hotel,... but I digress.

You think KFC and chill is weird in Japan? Try dragging a whole fucking tree from out in the yard to live in our house for a month where we lay gifts around it. Then we hang ornaments and candy can...wait, wait, wait! Where are you all going? I haven't even gotten to the weird shit yet about Zombie Jesus and flying reindeer...

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[SvnLyrBrto]

To be fair, though, in Japan your chances of getting mugged and your cash stolen are about as near to zero as is statistically possible. And, should you lose your wallet full of cash, the chances are about 99% that it will be turned into the police (Who operate some truly astoundingly massive lost & found warehouses.) with the cash left untouched.

Given that the country, unlike the US, generates remarkably few thieving bastards; the motivation to adopt cash replacements is somewhat lower.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Harlequin80]

Rubbish. You may find one or two atms that are in a building that closes after hours but I have been there many many times and the ATMs work fine at 2 in the morning.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

> KFC
> followed by a love hotel

Hentai!!!

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[kamapuaa]

I don't think thievery is much of a motivation. People in the US generally carry $600 cell phones and quite possibly $5000 weddings rings on them, after all. Cards are just easier, and secondly they provide a record of purchases.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[hcs_$reboot]

It's also a country where your girlfriend will get upset if you don't take her to KFC on Christmas eve

Maybe because your girlfriend was 16? But I digress..

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

This is true, I've had hundreds of dollars in a dropped wallet returned to me. As have others Japanese or Foreign.
Also ATM's run 24/7, at the convenience stores, so Neo-Reo is incorrect about this... but totally on the money about KFC and love hotel!

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[tsotha]

It has nothing to do with crime. The difference is if you try to use a personal check in Japan people will look at you like you've grown a third eye. It's only been in the last generation or so that employers stopped paying their employees in cash.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Neo-Rio-101]

I dropped my wallet in Japan once and I did get my wallet back... but the money was stolen.

So I guess I'm in the 1%

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[TheSync]

I dropped my (~$150) Shinkansen ticket in Tokyo Station, and someone picked it up and ran off with it...

Re: The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

or buy used school girl panties from vending machines. (no this is not a joke, and yes, this turns my stomach)

Re: The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

Not to mention people let the tree dry out, and a spark causes it to turn into a raging inferno in seconds that can't be put out. Countless people have died from this.

  I am suprised more people don't use the far safer artificial trees. They look real now (even the one we had from the 1970s looked decent), so why are people still dragging a huge pile of volitile kindling into their homes every year?

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

they charge extra after hours, unless you go to an atm that caters specifically to foreigners who expect not to pay a fee for after-hours usage, like citibank atms.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[PrimaryConsult]

Actually, yes.
I've visited twice. Stumbling on places that took a credit card was rare. Finding a place that took an American (non-chipped) card was almost impossible. Yes, large overpriced places of course take cards, but the places where the common man actually shops and eats, cash only. Compare to NYC where even the independent $1 pizza joints and $5 t-shirt shops take cards.

Now, the best reason I can think of for this is the credit card transaction fees - there *are* electronic payment forms but they are all in the form of preloaded debit cards [where the balance is stored on the card], including at least some forms of the cell phone method. I loaded cash onto my SUICA and EDY cards and between the two of them, I was able to be reasonably cashless there, but that's really a major-city-only thing.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Neo-Rio-101]

That's the scary thing: she was 30 at the time

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

I have seen this happen, in Akihabara, Tokyo. In a busy shop where you basically shuffle up and down the stairs to go between floors, someone found a (expensive) phone lying on the ground and put it on top of the enclosure for the fire extinguisher.
When I came down the stairs about fifteen minutes later, the phone was still lying there, waiting for it's owner. The shop was so busy that more than a hundred people must have passed that spot.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

So she had a lot of time to tone down her expectations with you.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[r0kk3rz]

Given that the country, unlike the US, generates remarkably few thieving bastards; the motivation to adopt cash replacements is somewhat lower.

Actually its due to their cultural mistrust of banks (who can blame them). However, they are starting to use electronic subway cards as a payment method, for things like vending machines and convenience stores, but rather than anything associated with a bank, your mass transit company has your account.

Also, its not that crime is low in Japan, its that honesty is high, and that the overwhelming majority of people will go out of their way to do the right thing

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, it's nice when family units don't break down, isn't it?

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[serviscope_minor]

Try dragging a whole fucking tree from out in the yard to live in our house for a month where we lay gifts around it...Zombie Jesus...

That *IS* weird. I don't know anyone else who celebrates Christmas at Easter time.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[GuB-42]

The banking system is broken in Japan. This combined with low crime rates favor cash use. It isn't that bad actually. And you can now find ATMs in many convenience stores, which are open 24/7. Most accept Visa and Mastercard now.
As for Christmas, one must understand that it is not part of the Japanese culture, it is no more important to them than Grandmother's day. Businesses like KFC took it and made it info some kind of a commercial remake of St Valentine's Day.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[rhazz]

That's better than the status quo over here, where they charge extra 24/7.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Grishnakh]

Also, its not that crime is low in Japan, its that honesty is high, and that the overwhelming majority of people will go out of their way to do the right thing

Interesting that honesty is so high there, since there's almost zero Christianity. Whereas here in the US, much of the population is Christian (and before the last few decades practically everyone was Christian) and people here have always been lying, thieving bastards.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[AmiMoJo]

The thing about cash being kind is rubbish too. Credit cards are widely accepted, but the big cash replacement is contactless stored value cards like Suica, and contactless phone payments which they have had for over a decade. People in the west think that Google Wallet/Apple Pay is new and exciting...

KFC seems to have mostly given up in Japan, with most branches closing. To be honest I don't pay much attention to it, because I don't eat my food out of a bucket.

Re:The land of ATMs on holiday

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah but she was dating a slashdotter. Not a good sign, ever.

Don't target the systems then.

[Anonymous Coward]

Target the employees looking for more in life. Target those who have a grudge, those with embarrassing secrets.

If it's worth the risk, it can be acquired for a sum.

NSA Ops article

[Anonymous Coward]

In reality our NSA is upset about this and doesn't like it.

So we're going to hear how they aren't competitive and how behind they are until they correct their attitude and get back to using spy-approved tech.

You know... like Russia went back to typewriters to gain an edge over the NSA.

small and medium business

[iggymanz]

who said a country needs to have x percentage of GDP be by large corporations? the one percent?

Re:small and medium business

[PPH]

Not just Japan. Look up mittelstand.

Large conglomerates are mainly a US creation. A concept created by Wall Street to keep CEOs shuffling operating companies around while the financial consultants skim off exorbitant fees for financing that activity.

Re:small and medium business

[Anonymous Coward]

Large conglomerates are mainly a US creation. A concept created by Wall Street to keep CEOs shuffling operating companies around while the financial consultants skim off exorbitant fees for financing that activity.

Not quite. Their friends in Korea had the same idea.

Re:small and medium business

[rsborg]

Not just Japan. Look up mittelstand.

Large conglomerates are mainly a US creation. A concept created by Wall Street to keep CEOs shuffling operating companies around while the financial consultants skim off exorbitant fees for financing that activity.

What do you think the British East India Corporation was? Where do you think Hollywood got the idea of Weyland-Yutani corporation from? The idea of a large conglomerated colonial corporation (completely outsourced ruthless governance) isn't an American creation, it's existed for centuries.

The other day I read "The Count of Monte Cristo" - very readable even in today's standards (except the part where he goes to Rome - got lost there). It even detailed how the wealthy even relied on financial derivatives as well as orchestrating a stock trading pump & dump. That book was written in 1844.

Re:small and medium business

[Anonymous Coward]

You think that's bad? The first modern company (Dutch VOC) introduced shares in 1602. Buying VOC shares on margin started in 1603.

As for ruthlessness: the annual return on capital was 40% but mortality on board was 15% heading east and 10% returning - that's per trip! Leave with 200 sailors, reach Indonesia with 170, return with 150.

Re:small and medium business

[iggymanz]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Re:small and medium business

[iggymanz]

resources that could be mass produced with unskilled labor

It worked for Battlestar Galactica

[Sowelu]

I'm not sure what I'd even put in the comment text, here. It seems kind of redundant.

Japanese Phones

[Anonymous Coward]

Japan isn't really well known for 4G phones. They are actually probably behind a ton of other developed countries when it comes to smartphone adoption, its kind of a new thing. I think they had super good phones in the 90's / 00's, but when the smart phone crazy came around they just kind of stalled out. They had such cool stuff but they wanted to keep japanese phones weirdly domestic only (not exporting the coolest stuff) and everyone seemed cool with it. That means tons of people there still use flip phones and WAP / i-mode (like WAP) websites that while were super cool 10-15 years ago, are really freaking old and ghetto looking now, but yeah, its still a thing there.

Re:Japanese Phones

[Anonymous Coward]

Still better than responsive javascript crap.

Re: Japanese Phones

[blinkingblythe01]

But they often have unusual features like real built in television tuners, but yeah, with the likes of Amazon and Hulu available and free streaming video on countless web sites, this feature seems a bit medieval. A phone with a TV tuner impressed me in 2006, now, not so much

Re: Japanese Phones

[PrimaryConsult]

HDTV tuners would be great over here... the TV signal is more reliable than the cellular data one, and wouldn't use data while providing a crisp picture. Probably require less processing power too.

I was disappointed to find out that Japan's and the US's HD formats ware different enough that those tuners wouldn't work here...

Re: Japanese Phones

[Grishnakh]

I've read also that Japanese cars frequently have TV tuners built in, so you can watch TV on the in-dash LCD screen.

discretized?

[Anonymous Coward]

Discretized? DISCRETIZED?! What the hell does that mean?

Re:discretized?

[sound vision]

Made discrete - what you would probably call "ones and zeroes", that is, digital.

Re:discretized?

[Anonymous Coward]

"Discretization concerns the process of transferring continuous functions, models, and equations into discrete counterparts." The image is a two dimensional continuous function, but it is sampled at a finite number of discrete positions, not continuously at infinitely many positions. The discrete measurements are then quantized to make them suitable for being handled by a computer. Sorry to go all computer science on you.

Re:discretized?

[ShanghaiBill]

Discretized? DISCRETIZED?! What the hell does that mean?

It is the past tense verb form of "discrete". Any noun can be verbed.

Re: discretized?

[Anonymous Coward]

No No! It is actualy deanamorphtransmogrifidulated! Please, get the terms right people!

Productivity of office workers?

[gweihir]

How do you measure that?

And while I am no expert, it seems to me that apart from some nuclear and banking problems, Japan is doing fine.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[radish]

Well a lot of their biggest companies are in real trouble (ex Sony). They also have an extremely high suicide rate (double the US). I have no idea if any of this is related, but the comments I've read about people doing menial jobs which could be automated simply to keep employment up sounds like a recipe for depression, and I doubt it's sustainable. People know when their job is actually useful and feeling like you're not doing anything worth while is incredibly demotivating.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[Harlequin80]

Suicide rates in Japan have not changed dramatically over the past 50 years. There is some linking of movements to their economic prosperity but it has always been higher than the US. I don't believe it has anything to do with make work and more to do with face saving and their perceptions of honour.

As for other indicators, unemployment has been decreasing in Japan steadily since a peak in 2009. I'm sure that doing crappy jobs is demoralising, but I would argue doing no job and hence not being able to afford to live would be worse.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[techno-vampire]

As for other indicators, unemployment has been decreasing in Japan steadily since a peak in 2009.

If Japan measures unemployment the same way as the US Government does, that doesn't mean a thing. In the US, if you're not receiving unemployment benefits, you're considered to have "left the workforce" and aren't counted as unemployed. And before you start in with the partisan politics, this practice goes back at least thirty years, if not more, regardless of which party is in charge.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[KingOfBLASH]

Japan actually has a history of embracing death and suicide in its culture. It's a bit wacky, but sometimes you're supposed to kill yourself if you're a good traditional japanese (and I have references!)

Read the book Shogun by James Clavell for an interesting perspective on it. It really shines a light on a non-western perspective, where death is something to be embraced at the right time (and that it's important to die a good death), as opposed to something that should be avoided at all costs.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[Harlequin80]

Nothing partisan.

To go with the unemployment rate the participation rate, which is the base for the unemployment rate, has also been climbing. So a greater % of the population are seeking work and a smaller % of those people seeking work are unable to find it.

Re: Productivity of office workers?

[Anonymous Coward]

The idea that unemployment rates in the US is only the number of people receiving unemployment benefits is flat out false. The rates are based on a complicated survey system, heavily detailed already online.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[techno-vampire]

Thank you. I'd added the bit about getting partisan to avoid having this devolve into a flame-fest with people blaming whichever party they think is evil.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[Anonymous Coward]

A higher suicide rate than the US, this is true. But a MUCH lower murder, shooting, raping, stealing, school shooting, baby shooting, toddler shooting rate than the US. They also live longer, are not as fat and have better broadband.

Their standard of living is also higher.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[Harlequin80]

All good. I'm not American so I don't get the whole Democrat vs Republican crazy thing. I just like to sit back and eat my popcorn.

I have to say though, from the outside looking in, American politics is fucking insane!

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[techno-vampire]

Well, just assume that you have one major left-wing party, one major right-wing party and any other parties you have are two small to get enough members elected to your legislature to make a big difference, or as head of state. And, right now, we're in the middle of one of our bouts of dirty politics so that what a candidate stands for is less important than how badly they can smear their opponents.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[Harlequin80]

Oh I get that part of it. But even your left wing party is more right than the right wing party here. It also appears that wedge issues like guns and abortions make up a crazy amount of the political discourse and then you throw in the tea party which just makes my head hurt.

I like visiting the US but every time I do I come back a little more left wing then when I went there. There are some truly amazing opportunities there but the number of people that just seem discarded by US society is scary. I think that unless something is done to improve the lot of the people at the bottom of the pile the US will start seeing more and more major social clashes like Ferguson and it will really start to damage the country as a whole.

If you compare it to Japan, they are a society first, individual second country and while individuals may not have the same scope to be mega rich like they do in the US you can walk anywhere in their cities and feel completely safe. Go to the US and you want to make sure you stay in the right areas otherwise you are in real trouble. You can make it big in the US like nowhere else but that has its costs.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[speederaser]

To go with the unemployment rate the participation rate, which is the base for the unemployment rate, has also been climbing.

Sorry, no. The labor participation rate has been in a steady decline since 2008. Almost like we're in a depression or something.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[Harlequin80]

I wasn't referring to US participation rate. Japanese participation rate is climbing. Not quite back to it's 2007 levels but a long way up from the trough.

http://www.tradingeconomics.co...

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[Anonymous Coward]

They also have an extremely high suicide rate (double the US).

Uh, yea, that's not "an extremely high" rate just because it's double the US's rate. As others have commented, it probably has more to do with Japanese culture.

People know when their job is actually useful and feeling like you're not doing anything worth while is incredibly demotivating.

Sorry to break it to you, but ~90% of jobs aren't really useful in a meaningful sense. Once we got to the point of agriculture being done by ~2% of the population, the amount of people to make really useful things basically dropped dramatically. Hell, we overproduce so much food that even some of that 2% isn't useful.

Besides, one really shouldn't try to derive one's self-worth from work.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[EvilAlphonso]

If you compare it to Japan, they are a society first, individual second country and while individuals may not have the same scope to be mega rich like they do in the US you can walk anywhere in their cities and feel completely safe. Go to the US and you want to make sure you stay in the right areas otherwise you are in real trouble. You can make it big in the US like nowhere else but that has its costs.

Yes, when I lived just outside of Osaka I would routinely jog through the "seediest" part of town in the middle of the night or in the wee hours of the morning. I never ran into trouble. I wouldn't even dream of doing the same thing in the US, or even in large parts of Europe.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[Spinalcold]

In the west we are just starting to understand some of those ideas. For example, in Canada the supreme court has ordered the government to come up with a law about assisted suicide, they say it is a right for a patient that is unable to do it themselves. The Liberal government is supposed to have 6 months to make the law (may be extended since it was supposed to be the Conservatives to do it, but they wouldn't touch it). This type of suicide is not wacky, I would argue that our idea of death IS wacky.

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[KingOfBLASH]

Well Japanese suicide customs go beyond assisted suicide. I remember one example from the book: someone killed themselves as "death testimony." Basically the idea was they were giving witness (like in a court of law), and this was a way to prove they weren't lying. Or the idea that once your purpose is spent you should die (even if of full body and mind)

There's other, more complicated examples, that would be hard to explain if you haven't read the book

Re:Productivity of office workers?

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually is has changed. In 1998, it spiked due to the financial meltdown and the removal of jobs for life (in general). Unfortunately this is when the WHO did its first survey which cause people to permanently have the idea that Japan has a crazy suicide rate. It is still high, but there are other countries with much higher rates.

One thing that most people don't quite understand about suicide in Japan is that quite a high percentage of suicide is in the elderly. It is extremely common for a husband to commit suicide if his wife dies. In the 5 years I worked at an office in Japan, at least twice a year someone would announce in the morning meeting that one of their parents committed suicide as they weren't enjoying life. Then they inevitably apologize for taking the 2 days off work to travel to the funeral.

Japan is kind of a strange place to imagine if you don't immerse yourself in the culture. People are indoctrinated into that culture from a very early age and are very proud of it. Being able to endure a hardship is particularly valued, so even if your job is boring, you can feel good that you have applied yourself to it with all your effort. Children are even lectured (repeatedly) about how important menial jobs are. Even if you work in a 7-11, your smile might brighten the day of a super important business person who wanders in for a cup of coffee. You can lift a burden from him and allow him to succeed.

I love Japan and I love the way it thinks. It seems ridiculous sometimes, and naive, and horrible (you can never tell who likes you and who is just being nice -- because everybody is nice... all the time)... It is downright fascist at times (in a financial sense) as people believe the old guard deserve their rent taking. But it works in its own way. From American ideals, though, I think many find it almost evil at times...

They'll be better prepared for Cylon attacks

[elrous0]

Still need to work on their Godzilla preparation, though

Re:They'll be better prepared for Cylon attacks

[Ol Olsoc]

Still need to work on their Godzilla preparation, though

Put Gojira back to being a man in a rubber suit would be a good start.

BSG?

[Synesthes]

Sounds like Battlestar Galactica. Oldschool equipment, non-networked systems.

Seems quaint. Until you realize that they were the only ones that survived.

Aging population

[Anonymous Coward]

The obvious reason is because of the average age of office workers in a country with one of the lowest fertility rates. There are few young people and even fewer in business since they have a problem with young people becoming NEETS, hikikimori or those happy with being a part time worker.

Um... Japan's industry is doing horrible

[rsilvergun]

now, the Chinese factories that make all their stuff are doing pretty good, and a few guys at the top do well. But the rest of Japan has been in recession (depression? we're not allowed to talk about that) for 20 or 30 years since their bubble burst in the 90s. I knew it was bad when they started outsourcing animation to South Korea to save money...

Re:Um... Japan's industry is doing horrible

[Tablizer]

But the rest of Japan has been in recession... for 20 or 30 years since their bubble burst in the 90s.

That's because it was an unsustainable bubble, not unlike the dot-com bubble. It's true their GDP has been flat for many years, but they have low unemployment. They can't buy more over time, but at least they have jobs. Busy and stable and plenty of sake; life is good. We got financial roller-coasters and 9/11 panic.

I knew it was bad when they started outsourcing animation to South Korea to save money.

USA co's do that in both good times and bad. How does that make it a "recession"?

Re: Um... Japan's industry is doing horrible

[Anonymous Coward]

China is also eating Japan's lunch. Infact, China is eating everybody's lunch.

Re: Um... Japan's industry is doing horrible

[Anonymous Coward]

...and they have the made up statistics to prove it!

Re:Um... Japan's industry is doing horrible

[Anonymous Coward]

Why do you end all of your posts with an ellipsis? Do you have a mental disease?

Re:Um... Japan's industry is doing horrible

[Anonymous Coward]

i hear a certain "tentacle business" is doing rather well...

Re: Um... Japan's industry is doing horrible

[Anonymous Coward]

> China is also eating Japan's lunch. Infact, China is eating everybody's lunch.

They do have 1.3 billion mouths to feed.

Not neciecrily a cause and effect relationsip

[Anonymous Coward]

"Japanese office workers average just half the productivity of their American counterparts. " and their "conservativism in IT" are both stated but there is no evidence given to think that they are linked in the slightest, only anecdotes. It does seem likely that some of the issue is associated with technophobia but tech associated time-wasting may well cancel this out often enough, there is no reason not to think that most or nearly all may be directly caused by other issues, an obvious one being culturally encouraged overwork -
http://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2014/12/working-hours
(and this both stops at 72 hours witch is "normal" in some industries and is calculated for British companies which lack "enforced socialisation". The data is also for simple manual labour, it is my understanding that thinking type jobs, even "simple" office jobs or the more complex tasks in modern manufacturing, produce more drastic, even negative, curves)

I don't know why

[Anonymous Coward]

But Japan LOVES fax machines.

Analog?

[PPH]

In Japan? I don't think so. Most of the pictures I've seen from there have some pretty distinct pixels.

My Trip to Japan

[labnet]

My first overseas trip was to Japan some 25 years ago. The (business) trip was organised in a hurry, so I only had a Visa card and $50. I thought since I was going to one of the most advanced industrialised countries in the world, this wouldn't be a problem.
Well, arriving in Nagoya, was like arriving in to a 1960's hospital ward. The only way of changing my money was lining up for the government money changers, and there were no facilities for getting cash out with my Visa card. So I changed my paltry $50 into Yen.
I thought, how am I going to get to my hotel? Well there was this huge ticket machine for the train. It must of had 300 buttons; all in Japanese. I flagged down a pilot and asked him to get a ticket for me, which he did; but then I thought; if I get this wrong I could end up in the middle of nowhere.
I had one contact number for the guy I was to meet up with. I found a public phone booth, and coins from the vending machine, but no idea which coins to put in to the phone to make a call or even what part of the international phone number to dial. I had to flag down a Japanese lady, held out my hand with the coins, showed her my number, and thankfully she was able to dial the right number though to an English speaking concierge. Thankfully my contact was in his room and through his optimistic sweedish/english told me to just catch a cab and he would meet me and pay for the cab.
Well the cab line was something to behold. Hundreds of early 80's Toyota crowns; all the drivers wore white gloves, the seats had whitelinen cloths on them. What suprised me though, was the trunk and passenger door were controlled by levers by the driver! I hoped in a cab, and said the hotel name MiyakoNagoya and I get a grunt back Miagonagooya Hi. I repeated it to make sure, and off we go. The speed limit is only an advisory to the driver. I'm watching the taxi meter click over the total value of Yen in my hands, and started wondering what a Japanese jail cell might look like.

I had many many other adventures on that working week in Japan. It is a great country, but back then its banking system was fairly backwards.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[bahstid]

Actually you could almost exactly be describing a trip this year rather than 25 years ago. The only change is that you *might* be able to get money using an overseas Visa Card at a 7eleven now, but that only started in the last 2 years.... Funny thing is you'd actually be at an advantage over someone with a local bank account - after 7pm my card is useless! Then again, we can put coins in our ATMs!

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Harlequin80]

Japan has changed dramatically over the last 10 years (the gap between my first and most recent trips there) and they are hugely more accommodating of foreigners then they used to be. Back 10 years ago there were signs in Kyoto saying "No Gaijin" on restaurants. Now the buses around Kyoto have english commentary as you come up to each stop.

The same changes have occured to their banking system. 10 years ago 7-11s were the only place in Kyoto that would accept non Japanese bank cards. Now everywhere does.

Also if you live there you tend to sign up for things like pasmo and have an app on your phone. Pasmo is like an oyster travel card but it works in loads of places from vending machines to restaurants. That is kind like the future, tap your phone on the reader and away you go.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[kamapuaa]

Wow, what I great story! Tell us more about your adventures in this moon-man-land! I bet you had a really hard time finding a decent cheeseburger!!!

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Anonymous Coward]

In summary, 25 years ago you went to a country on the other side of the planet and were shocked that things were different there, and all these years later you haven't grown up enough to understand that "different" doesn't mean "backwards".

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Jack Griffin]

Well the cab line was something to behold. Hundreds of early 80's Toyota crowns

The taxis are like London cabs, new cars but of a classic design.
The older boxy shape is a lot more practical than modern raked pillars that prevent ease of access.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Tablizer]

I'm watching the taxi meter click over the total value of Yen in my hands, and started wondering what a Japanese jail cell might look like.

Hey, you have to finish the story. What did the driver do when you couldn't cover?

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Anonymous Coward]

Freshness Burger all the way bro

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Anonymous Coward]

It must of had 300 buttons; all in Japanese.

Hmmm... I know what it means to "have had" something... For example, "I have had many adventures in Japan."

I'm less clear on what it means to "of had" something.

"I of had many adventures in Japan"?

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Anonymous Coward]

I call BS. Must be your bank.
Everyone I know has withdrawn from 7/11's or Lawsons for 10 years +. Cirrus/MC/Visa/etc.
If you get really stuck, the post shops also support a number of different international cards.
Almost all train signage/maps in Tokyo or Osaka is in English as well and all train/subway machines I used had English options.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[brewthatistrue]

"I had many many other adventures on that working week in Japan"

Yup, stories waiting to be told.

Thanks for sharing the first one. Not sure why people are so offended.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Anonymous Coward]

"must of" is a mistaken transcription of the spoken English contraction "must've" which is short for "must have".

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Anonymous Coward]

What suprised me though, was the trunk and passenger door were controlled by levers by the driver!

Automatic taxi doors is a japanese invention and much older than one might think. I think it's from the late 50s. It's even more impressive when you know how it works. Inside the door itself there is a piston and it is moved back and forth with vacuum and the driver can open and close by controlling which side to place a vacuum.
The really clever bit is the source of the vacuum. When the engine is in the air intake phase, the piston moves downward and creates a vacuum in the cylinder. Air rushes in through an open valve, hence the term "suction engine" (as opposed to turbo charged, which has a compressor like device to push in air). This mean the pipe between the air filter and the valves will contain a vacuum, which is stronger the closer it is to the valves. The door gets the vacuum from a pipe, which is attached to that part of the engine and as close to the valves as possible. This creates a "compressed air" door system without a compressor, which makes it cheap both to build and maintain. It's also fairly lightweight, which is good for the fuel economy.

The idea for the door was originally due to safety. Back in those days, the driver got out to open the door as they should be nice to the customers. This meant they had to get in and out on the traffic side of the car on busy roads and they occationally got hit by other cars while doing so. If he could just pull a leaver and not go into traffic then it would be less dangerous to be a taxi driver.

I hoped in a cab, and said the hotel name MiyakoNagoya and I get a grunt back Miagonagooya Hi. I repeated it to make sure, and off we go.

The last word would be "hai". It's usually translated as "yes", but in this case I think it would be more correct to translate it as "confirmed" or "I get it". It might also be understood as "please confirm", which you did. Congratulations you actually managed to have a conversation in a language you don't understand, though I guess it's a bit of a universal language that you get in a taxi and say the name of your destination.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[labnet]

Yeh, I shouldn't of left you hanging there.

The cab driver found the right hotel the first time. I signed to him to wait and lucky the sweedish guy was there a 10,000 yen note.

I'll tell another story form that trip.
I was trying to diagnose a fault with a custom air-conditioner on a special train that used ultrasonics to do real time analysis of the rail track (looking for cracks and other faults). We had spent a long day out and were coming back into the shunting yards to park the train in the shed. These yards are huge and you need to cross dozens of rail switches. The two Japanese drivers kept stopping before each switch point and have little conversation which other. This was getting very tedious, so I asked the interpreter to ask what was going on. The drivers turn to the interpreter, and they say something in Japanese then laugh hysterically among themselves. I look to the interpreter and he says 'They are being extra safety cautious today'. In other words, having some train driver fun.
The sense of humor in Japan is priceless, as is the seriousness and honor with which they do their jobs. I remember watching some of their TV where the traffic debris collectors would have flag waving lessons, so they all wagged their safety flags the same way.

Japan is a terrific country. I was back there 2 years ago with my family to ski; and it still has all that quirkiness from 25 years ago, but with a lot more English signs now.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Anonymous Coward]

Yep. When I was in Fukuoka for a conference late last year it was pretty much the same. Visa at 7/11 and the Post office to get Yen out. Used Yen pretty much everywhere else.
Taxi drivers still where the white gloves and drive crowns, with lever operated doors.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Anonymous Coward]

bullshit, dude. citibank atms always accepted foreign atm cards, and they had those in kyoto. the post office also accepted non-japanese atm cards.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Tablizer]

Thanks!

Re:My Trip to Japan

[bahstid]

Dunno that its worth replying to ACs, but anyway... just FYI I've lived here for the past 15 years and have been involved in the hotel industry for the past 7 of of those, so have quite broad experience trying to assist guests in getting hold of cash. Even to the point of doing things like exchanging Paypal payments for cash after driving them to all the usual suspect ATMs in town. I'll give you that it was a little hyperbolic in the sense that although the 711 service has been available for longer, its only in the past 2years that we've really been able to list it as an option for getting cash in our correspondence - before that we had to have a highlighted warning in our emails cautioning people to bring cash. For example 3 years ago ALL Mastercard service was discontinued for about 8 months through 7-11. A significant proportion of Post Offices don't even have ATMs and its only the main ones that are open until 7pm, with most closing at 5. Banks transfers, even between accounts on the same local bank will only happen during business hours, excluding Saturdays. My local bank ATMs all close at 7pm and despite the 7-11 ATMs, of my 3 Japanese bank accounts, there's only one that I can actually draw money from between 7pm and 7am. There's quite a bit more to Japan than the Tokyo/Osaka experience...

Re:My Trip to Japan

[angel'o'sphere]

A friend of mine had a similar experience regarding both credit cards and eomplyed people that are not really working.

He lived in the 90s in Tokyo. Trying to use a credit card to either draw money from an ATM or cash money at a bank, most banks simply waved him away.

Finally he found a bank where thy tried to help him. When he tells this story it always sounds as if he had spent hours in that bank, which he likely has indeed.

He was let in a room. Several rows of desks with employees sitting with the back to the door, each row like 6 - 8 "clerks", majourity female, doing paper work.

On the other side of the room several old guys with their own desk each doing nothing, facing to the clerks and the door.

A secretary took his credit card (a german master or visa) and brought it to one of the clerks. With lots of "oooO!" "Sooo desu!" "ahhhh!" they investigated the card and it moved along the row of desks. Then it was given to the next row in front. After quite a while, when the card had the secretary took the card to one of the bosses where the "investigation" was repeated and my friend was finally waved forward and got told: they know what card it is. And they knew a bank somewhere in town which would likely let him cash in money on the card. They organized a cab to bring him there ...

Well, most of the clerks where kind of office fillers. The point basically is, a boss is not a real boss (his position would be not honoured) if he had not an adequate amount of subordinates.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[AmiMoJo]

One PROTIP for foreigners wanting to use bank/credit cards in Japan, sometimes you have to ask them to use PIN authentication ("anshou bango"). By default some shop staff will try to get you to sign for stuff, and at least with UK cards that are all chip&pin it doesn't work.

For small amounts you might not even need a PIN, they will just authorize it.

Re:My Trip to Japan

[Agripa]

The really clever bit is the source of the vacuum. When the engine is in the air intake phase, the piston moves downward and creates a vacuum in the cylinder. Air rushes in through an open valve, hence the term "suction engine" (as opposed to turbo charged, which has a compressor like device to push in air). This mean the pipe between the air filter and the valves will contain a vacuum, which is stronger the closer it is to the valves. The door gets the vacuum from a pipe, which is attached to that part of the engine and as close to the valves as possible. This creates a "compressed air" door system without a compressor, which makes it cheap both to build and maintain. It's also fairly lightweight, which is good for the fuel economy.

Manifold vacuum is very commonly used in gasoline engines for operating things like power brakes and the climate control vents.

Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[trout007]

Funny how the economy became frozen in time when they stopped becoming more productive.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[Anonymous Coward]

And yet despite that it is still doing about as well as the glorious "Crony Capitalist-run" USA.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[Darinbob]

Because the US economy sucks. Unless you're a crony capitalist. The media doesn't see this because they see economic reports that look good, and when they see that wages in the US have not increased even though the economy "grew" they shrug it off as an interesting side note.

The US economy is about increasing the wealth of the owners and not at all about increasing wealth of the workers or their spending capacity. Grow, grow, and keep growing, even if that means being a traitor. Sure, sell goods and products to third world countries, but don't sell off the jobs.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, if you measure "productive" to mean the narrow and stupid definition of continually increasing GDP.

Japan doesn't have that. They just have full employment, health care for everyone, a decent wage for practically everyone, pristine roads and public works, the ability to actually enjoy their lives with some disposable income when they're not working, and no fear of being gunned down by crazed disgruntled disenfranchised people every day.

If this is a "lost decade", we should all be so lucky.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[Anonymous Coward]

The US economy has it's warts, as all economies do, but I think that the comparison against Japan is still quite favorable. From all that I'm acquainted with the economic situation in Japan, based upon my readings over the years, they've basically had moderately severe deflation, despite the central bank conducting periodic exercises in money creation to prop up the exchange rates and protect their export markets, while at the same time having very low growth and a drastically shrinking population of prime working age people. Finally, the practice of cross-ownership of corporations and bad loans given between friends in the corporations and banks has created hoards of zombie banks with mountains of bad debt on the books that cannot actually be admitted to without losing face and causing a disaster and yet everyone knows the loans are crap and will either not be payed back or payed back only in the far future with massively devalued Yen. In Japan, for these reasons and others, they've had 2 lost decades in a row and are working on a third. If had a choice to be a twenty something in Japan or the US today, the US still wins hands down in my book.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[__aanfwt7763]

ah, an informed putdown of someone's opinion. harsh and to the point, and coming from a place of zero knowledge. i love it when people like you who know nothing about a subject provide their strong opinion to counter someone else's. being an american who's traveled the world, lived in many countries, including japan, and who speaks 5 languages, I can provide my opinion based on, you know, knowledge. the japanese live miserable lives, work 12 hour days including weekends, fuck hookers daily, chain smoke, get trashed drunk after work and pass out at the train station, and live shitty shitty unhappy lives. the healthcare doesn't help with their depression-caused high rate of suicide. if a japanese person had the comparatively easy and laid back work and earnings of an american, they'd be happy to take it, but they don't have the option. that's from someone who's lived there. you on the other hand, well, I love people like you. once you open your mouth it takes 2 seconds to recognize you as a fucktard and ignore you after slapping your stupid ass down. knowledge is power. get some, idiot, before correcting people.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[Anonymous Coward]

From my experience there, I say they chose an excellent point to become "frozen". They're employment rate is high, their educational level is high, their crime rates are extremely low, and they have a high standard of living.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[Anonymous Coward]

...and who speaks 5 languages...

Is your grammar, capitalization, and punctuation as bad when you write any of the other four languages?
You're either trolling, an idiot, or both.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[trenien]

Without being as aggressive fakekuck39, I do think you're losing sight of the "slight" problem Japan has : overworking.

The reality is that, except when there are hard laws that prevent it (such as for people working in factories), the average Japanese worker does something like 4-7 hours overwork per day (and quite often they'll have to come on weekends too, if they have any kind of management position). At the heart of that is a combination of conservatism (let's keep this way of checking up for mistakes, never mind the fact it's been obsolete for at least 20 years and there are another two in use at the same time, one of which is also obsolete, albeit not quite as much), social pressure (you better be there to work late, and if you finish early, find someone who hasn't to give them a hand, don't ever think of going home because you're actually know how to do your job within a reasonable amount of time) and sheer inability of knowing what to do with yourself if have free time. About that last, from primary school onward, everything is done so that people do not learn to have and enjoy long amount of free time.

The end result ? Japan is the first wealthy country to see its population numbers go down (it started in 2007, if I'm not mistaken). It's come to the point where the utra-conservative, very pro-business Prime Minister Abe urges people to stop with the long hours and go home (because sex : after 15 hour days going on forever, you do tend to lose interest in favor of a simple pillow).

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[rhazz]

Not everybody believes that a growing economy is the cure for all ailments. I wonder if this belief mostly afflicts people who own stocks.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[luis_a_espinal]

Funny how the economy became frozen in time when they stopped becoming more productive.

If by funny you mean untrue, then yes. The economy froze because of the big real state bubble apocalypse of the late 1980s, an ineffective government economic policy (not a problem specific to private enterprises) and currently a population decline. Have you ever been to Japan? I have. Internally they are doing fine, more than fine. Quality of life and purchasing power for the average individual has not decreased, and it will remain high for at least 30 more years (by various estimates.)

Shit, I wish we could say the same.

The thing that has become frozen in Japan is international expansion. Internally, the economy is doing well. And Japanese companies will always be less effective than, say, American companies (when we measure them from a cost-savings POV) because Japanese companies, large or small, see themselves as providers of jobs, first and foremost (profit generation comes second.) Japanese companies will not lay off people the way we do. They'll try cut benefits or cut hours. In general they'll prefer to go down with the ship than to try to save the company by laying off employees.

They stick to that, and so far it still has worked well for them. I don't know about you, but I prefer that. If I weren't too old to buy property in Japan, I would have relocated my family and I to Tokyo a long time ago.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[MrL0G1C]

Japan is the first wealthy country to see its population numbers go down

The only reason UK population is not declining is because of net immigration, I expect the same is true for many EU countries.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[trenien]

That's part of Japan's problem : they don't want to have more immigration. In fact, they're doing all they can so that they won't need it (why do you think Japan's robotics are so advanced?)

Of course, that's probably a pipe dream, and they will have to accept more immigration as time goes on (they already have a rising problem with the number of old houses that belonged to people who died and that nobody wants). At the current rate, the population is going to drop from its current 120 millions to a mere 80 millions.

That said, you do raise a good point, which begs the question : how much of UK's (and other's) natality problem is actually because of the push toward an ever longer workweek (for an ever shittier paycheck)? I don't believe Japan has the exclusivity on this one, unfortunately.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[lsatenstein]

Japan is the first wealthy country to see its population numbers go down

The only reason UK population is not declining is because of net immigration, I expect the same is true for many EU countries.

The same is true for the USA. Without the Mexican's, legal or otherwise, the population would be in decline. It is these hardworking people that keep the 1.2 children per family statistic at not dropping to a lower number.

In Europe, it is the immigration from Muslim countries that is bolstering the rate to 1.2 children/family.
Time to think that money and being part of the 99% is the reason for a low USA birthrate.

Maybe too, the reason for the low birth rate is that there are too many adult toys, such as cellphones that last 3 years, laptops that fail a few months after their guarantee lapses, a new leased car every three years, chasing after fashionable clothing, and health care costs.

Re: Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[Anonymous Coward]

These days immigration is a net loss fit just about every society. Western nations have declining birthrates because that's what happens when you have people existing to serve the economy and not the other way around.

You end up with only people who can't do the math of what raising a kid costs relative to their declining pay actually having any. People staring at much lower standards of living than their parents tend to not have so many children.

Sad really. people who have big families are, in too many cases, the ones who cause the most destruction to modern societies, and the ones who could offset that don't.

For those who don't speak in nuanced terms, low skilled immigrants who think the nation they forced themselves on owes them something drag us all down.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[__aanfwt7763]

it's about the same in all the languages. Not when I'm writing something at the office or a paper, but in standard conversational relaxed language, where you type fast while watching tv and don't read over anything - yeah, about the same. as for all of us normal people. you're free to proofread your post, spell correctly, take about 5 times the time I take to type mine, and make it perfect. and that is what makes you, also, a douche, bag, comma. fuckin gloser. get a life. actually, don't. keep being an annoying little fuck with nothing interesting to say, and focus on your capitalization and commas. it makes it easier for people like me to get pussy. pussy. this is a half-attention-span fucking little blog, not a newspaper article. in fact, why don't you correct people's posts for proper grammar, repost them, you know, just to make sure it's correct. that's about the most useful and interesting thing in your life. me, I got better shit to do.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[RockDoctor]

I don't know about you, but I prefer that. If I weren't too old to buy property in Japan, I would have relocated my family and I to Tokyo a long time ago.

Waiting for the "Mericuh, Right or Wrong" branch of the KKK to doxx you to Anonymous now.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[Anonymous Coward]

"Overwork" doesn't mean they're actually doing anything useful. It's face time only to please the boss and peers.

Re:Lost Decade (now going on 3rd decade)

[luis_a_espinal]

I don't know about you, but I prefer that. If I weren't too old to buy property in Japan, I would have relocated my family and I to Tokyo a long time ago.

Waiting for the "Mericuh, Right or Wrong" branch of the KKK to doxx you to Anonymous now.

Hmmm, mkay, then?

I bet

[CanadianMacFan]

Sony wished they had of stayed with writing things on paper and faxing them.

Traffic lights

[CanadianMacFan]

Having someone direct traffic isn't such a bad idea. Yes it's expensive and sucks for the person when the weather is bad. But they can respond better to the traffic to keep it flowing better. How often are you stuck at a red light and there's no traffic in the other direction? Around here they use police officers when the lights go out or there's an accident. If they did the same thing it would create a big positive police presence. The officers would be out of their cars and in the community interacting with the people.

I'm not saying that we should do it, just that it may not be as daft as it first sounds.

Re: Traffic lights

[Anonymous Coward]

Mythbusters tested traffic cops vs 4 way stops vs roundabouts. Roundabouts won, but traffic cop lost by a wide margin

Re: Traffic lights

[Anonymous Coward]

Mythbusters didn't test the japanese approach. They directed traffic in a normal intersection. Japan has human traffic lights when parts of a road is closed due to construction or similar. Imagine having a road with just one lane and there is a traffic light in each end. In the west it would be ruled completely by a timer and totally disregarding the current traffic. In Japan there would be a man controlling the traffic in each end. He can then say something on the radio like "queue gone and I closed the road. Last car is a blue Honda". In other other end, the other guy opens the road once the blue Honda passes and led the cars drive through until the queue is gone and they repeat the closure procedure. This mean because they use their eyes and a bit of brain power, they reduce idle time when changing direction of traffic compared to a timer based signal system and a higher number of cars can pass each hour.

I'm not aware of any regular human traffic lights in Japan. They are all there for temporal reasons due to abnormal traffic or abnormal road conditions. In fact they are mandatory on all closed lanes. This has the bonus that once they close the lane, they hurry to finish. If they need two men stationed there around the clock, they do not take a one month break from their work like it happens in the west. In fact it can be way more than a month. A bridge over the railroad has been removed near my parents' because trains needed a higher ground clearance and a number of bridges had to be raised. It has been gone a year with no easy alternative and nothing happens. It looks like they will start construction of the new one around 18 months after they removed the old one. I'm quite sure that wouldn't be possible with japanese laws, which required human traffic lights to redirect the traffic around the clock. It's still completely unacceptable as it cost each car around 20 minutes to pass and the new trains will not show up for years, meaning the railroad don't need extra space until way after the new bridge is installed.

Survivalism

[Tablizer]

hate to connect their computers to the outside world. They fear data theft and hacking

They may have the last laugh as their overseas competitors are hacked and vandalized into bankruptcy.

When the electricity is out, the dude with the candle is a god-send, not a "Luddite".

It's also the culture

[spauldo]

Japanese business culture is weird.

I didn't have to deal with it a whole lot myself, but I have had some dealings with it, and know people who have had more.

First, there's the whole sempai/kohai system. Basically, that guy that was hired five minutes before you? Yeah, you're his bitch. But that's OK, 'cause the guy we hired five minutes after you is your bitch. Shit rolls downhill. You try to make it up the ladder so you're the one doing the shitting rather than getting shit on.

Then there's appearances to consider. The guy that finished all his work for the week and went home at the end of the day? Bad employee. The guy that spent all day playing minesweeper and put in overtime (to play more minesweeper)? Good employee. Results? Who cares?

And when the end of the day (and overtime) is over, time to go home, right? Nope, now it's time to "bond." Which means it's time to go to the bar with the coworkers and get drunk. Oh, and the sempai/kohai thing is still in effect. You're allowed to loosen your tie. Maybe.

I'm sure not all businesses in Japan are like this, but I've seen some that are, and I've heard of more.

Re:It's also the culture

[Anonymous Coward]

First, there's the whole sempai/kohai system.

The senpai/kouhai system isn't horribly by design. I think it borrows from Confusious's concept of how people should behave. Follow your master is the baseline and the longer you worked, the more experience you have. In other words it's a system, which honors experience. However Confusious also wrote how relationships should go the other way. The master should treat his his subjects as his children. Teach them what they need to learn and ensure that they have a good life. Japan seems to have forgotten about the last part, at least in some places as the system is exploited by the seniors to exploit juniors unreasonably. Confusious also wrote on what to do if that happen and that is to replace the corrupt leader.

And when the end of the day (and overtime) is over, time to go home, right? Nope, now it's time to "bond." Which means it's time to go to the bar with the coworkers and get drunk. Oh, and the sempai/kohai thing is still in effect. You're allowed to loosen your tie. Maybe.

That's a pretty good example of exploitation. The last to be hired is responsible for filling the glasses of everybody else, meaning it easily ends up as 5 people drinking and enjoying themselves and one person keeping watch over all the glasses and not enjoying himself. In other places each person is only responsible for filling the glass of his immidiate senior, in which case all but one has to watch a single glass and then there are places, where people are responsible for their own glass. Also in some places you are expected to go drinking with the rest and in some places it's a free choice where it might even be common not to go drink at all.

I wouldn't blame the senpai/kouhai system to be bad by default. The result is bad if people exploit it for personal gains, but any system is bad if somebody exploits it for personal gains at the cost of others.

Re:It's also the culture

[Anonymous Coward]

The guy that finished all his work for the week and went home at the end of the day? Bad employee. The guy that spent all day playing minesweeper and put in overtime (to play more minesweeper)? Good employee. Results? Who cares?

This happens in the US too, except instead of minesweeper, the employee works slowly or is pretending to be working. I imagine employees in all countries play these sort of games.

Re:It's also the culture

[angel'o'sphere]

Sempai/Kohai relation ships/roles are not that simple.
True is that the younger one "serves" the "older one", e.g. fetching the newspaper or getting food etc. or gets told what to do. On the other hand the Sempai (the older) is supposed to teach the younger one and introduce him into the work or what ever.
This cultural phenomen goes into every matter of life.
In the simplest form, to understand for westerners, it is in martial arts dojos. The older ones are in fact teachers, not in the sense of "sensei" - the martial arts instructor - but about etticette, what to do, what not to do, where to sit, where not to sit, how to dress properly, how to treat weapons etc. (e.g. it is frowned uppon if you use a wooden sword as "walking" stick and leaning on it while standing)

And instead of the typical western situation where one comes to an "unfamiliar place" and feels uncomfortable, in jap. most of the time a "sempai" will show up and will find one of "his kohei" (he he he) and tell him to take care of the visitor(if that kohai is not smart enough to do that by himself, because: towards the visitor that kohei is the sempai).

However: in some situations the visitor might also be completely ignored, e.g. if he enters the "wrong club" or "wrong restaurant".

Another typical thing e.g. is one of the older ones in a traveling group will likely be responsible for all tickets, passports etc. Just because one alreadyhas been in a foreign country he is supposed to be supperior to the other travelers and more or less by peer pressure put into the "Sempai" role.

Re:It's also the culture

[metrix007]

You know, this sounds like bullshit, but it isn't....Japanese culture, or many aspects of it are fundamentally broken.

Their culture is not sustainable, and we are going to see it drastically change or implode in the next decade.

I remember one thing that stood out to me, is it is frowned upon to question seniors, or to do something that goes against the family or may lead to embarrassment.

That's exactly stagnation happens because it discourages innovation and progress, not to mention at a more basic level, critical thinking and reasoning.

Re:It's also the culture

[angel'o'sphere]

Japan actually is very progressive.

Just look at Art, Music, Movies, the street life etc.

On the other hand the states are on the decline since the Korean war.

I guess it is just a question which nation declines faster.

Re:It's also the culture

[metrix007]

Progressive how?

Creating art is not evidence of progressive thinking.

Culturally, is it not true that things that embarrass the family are frowned upon? Speaking against elders is frowned upon, even if and when theya re wrong?

Because that doesn't encourage progressiveness, it encourages the opposite.

Re:It's also the culture

[angel'o'sphere]

Culturally, is it not true that things that embarrass the family are frowned upon? Speaking against elders is frowned upon, even if and when theya re wrong?

Depends on the context. Most young japanese don't adhere to those habits anymore.
Perhaps you should look at the lifestyle in Japan a bit closer :D e.g.street life.

Re:It's also the culture

[spauldo]

I'm on shakier ground here, but the impression I got (from some discussions in bars, mostly) is that Japanese people have a period of their life where it's more or less OK to go out and be wild. It's mostly the early to mid 20s, but it's not a hard-set rule.

Once you get a bit older than that, you're expected to take your place in society and live a more conservative lifestyle.

Just like anywhere, there are people who don't fit into the system. Some do well, and some don't. I never got deep enough into the culture to really know what kind of blowback those people get, though.

Reminds me of the earthquake and tsunami

[Solandri]

In order to get the latest news from Japan, several stations in the U.S. were carrying live video feeds from Japan. I was expecting awesome interactive 3D computer graphics using green screens to create a pseudo-holographic experience. Instead the weather report was a cloth map of Japan with felt cutouts of clouds, the sun, and numbers for the temperature velcro'ed on. The weatherman (woman) pointed to these using a pointing stick (hadn't seen one of those since the 1990s when they started being replaced by laser pointers). When covering the Fukushima accident, they'd gone to the trouble of recreating the entire facility in model scale using painted cardboard. It was damn good, would've made any model railroader proud, but was such a throwback to the era before computer graphics.

Re:Reminds me of the earthquake and tsunami

[rhazz]

Maybe the Japanese stations you watched just have lower graphics budgets than your average US station. One might hope in Japan they spend more money researching the facts rather than making it entertaining. Reminds me of CNN's 24/7 coverage on Malaysian airlines conspiracy theories, which was not improved at all by the CGI-animated cartoons they used to portray them. Entertaining and flashy is not necessarily better, especially when it comes to reporting the news.

translation from the English

[PopeRatzo]

When you hear the word, "competitiveness" from a corporatist mouthpiece like the BBC, run for the hills. It can be loosely translated as, "you should be working for scraps of bread and slices of onion, peasant."

Quality over Quantity

[Anonymous Coward]

You know what? I'll let the products speak for themselves. The very best vehicles I've ever owned were Honda/Acura and Nissan. I have one of each that are 10 years old and have over 150k miles. They are still terrific vehicles. Solidly designed. Solidly built. My 2014 Ford on the other hand that is full of non-sensical techno bullshit like MyFord Touch and interior lights that change color and a "automated manual" shit its clutch at 12k miles and it took Ford 10 weeks to replace it. Yeah, how about that productivity. I'll take the FAX please.

It's the point of this article

[rsilvergun]

that their low unemployment is artificial? Their economy is full of make work jobs that can be eliminated anytime someone decides their tired of paying for it. As for animation, it's a much more respected industry / art form in Japan than it is here. Osama Tezuka, Leji Matsumura and Hayao Mizaki are practically national heroes. You generally don't outsource something like that. It'd be like hiring a cheap Mexican version of Steven Spielberg. Good for a laugh on the Simpsons but you'd never really do it...

Re:It's the point of this article

[Tablizer]

Their economy is full of make work jobs

So far it works; don't knock it unless you want to sell the idea that more stuff is better than jobs to folks. Our econ is tilted toward stuff over jobs.

As far as animation, some South Korean animators are known to be quite good in part because S. Koreans culturally show emotions more so than Japanese and thus are more skilled (familiar) with human expression. It's not just cost.

Re:It's the point of this article

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not artificial when people are getting money for the pretend work. It's kind of like an alternative to getting paid directly by the government in foodstamp and what not.

Re:It's the point of this article

[Anonymous Coward]

Tezuka, Miyazaki, Matsumoto: all directors/writers, not the shlubs who are doing the in-betweens. Those folks are all in Korea or the Philippines because it's low-skill labour. That got outsourced as soon as it was viable to.

Employment

[Anonymous Coward]

I suspect much has to do with regulations targeting employment. Japan's government is committed to 100% employment. I lived there a couple years and it permeates everything. Imagine driving into the Costco parking lot. Imagine several parking attendants in classic reflective crossover belts. Imagine going to the DMV and getting your registration book stamped by 6 or 9 different bureaucrats (with physical ink stamps, carefully rolled into place). The number of things that you see being done manually with painstaking attention to detail is mind boggling.

Re:NIIKE TN pas chr TN requin femme

[DeathElk]

Possibly fourteen, but only after Wednesdays.

country full of old people

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a country full of old people with old people's mindset. Of course it's like that.

Oh No!

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a disaster! The board of directors and stockholders gets to hear the CEO's great new idea before the US government does!

Well, something is amiss with Japan's economy

[dlenmn]

Look at a plot of GDP per capita over time for Japan. It has basically gone nowhere since 1990 (there's been some up and down but the trend is basically flat). Japan had a notably higher GDP per capita than the USA in 1990. The current situation is reversed by roughly the same amount.

Now, is this proof that old technology is to blame for Japan's famously stagnate economy? No, but it's telling that Japan has both 1990 technology and 1990 GDP per capita. In contrast, the USA has been continuously modernizing its technology and GDP per capita has followed suit, and a lot of the US economy's growth has been in the tech sector.

So yes, they have no proof, but it does sound about right.

Re:Well, something is amiss with Japan's economy

[angel'o'sphere]

Japan slammed into that 1990s depression for two reasons: they had a credit bubble which basically was interwoven with most economical areas (housing/building/real estate, industry, education etc.) and secondly they got actively destroyed by american banks.
Afterwards they concentrated on themselves ... exporting high tech and standing out of the way of the american banks.
Bottom line the Japanese have no real trouble right now. I have never seen more jap. Tourists outside of Japan since the last decades.

Prove it.

[WOOFYGOOFY]

"However, the use of cassette tape recorders, hand-written data disk mailers, and 1997-era e-mail systems with near zero storage definitely hurts competitiveness in the global market."

As others have said, prove it. Japan is a technologically advanced, developed nation with an extremeluy high standard of living. It's people are well educated, well behaved and live long and happy lives.

Just because they haven't drunk every last drop of KoolAid a lot of other nations have drunk, how does is equivalent to an nation of uncompetitive laggarts?

Frankly, their perception of the plausible negative consequences of digitizing everything is grounded in facts and their reasoning is sound. So they act in accord with their better judgment. And for this they're critized. Give me a break.

Employ everyone digging ditches!

[dlenmn]

so they employ people to do jobs that machines could do cheaper, because if you lay them all off, they will be a burden on society.

Why wouldn't they be able to find new jobs? Does society really benefit when you keep employing people to dig ditches by hand when you could just use an excavator? Why focus on making jobs rather than making progress?

Note that Japan has a _lower_ labor force participation rate (the number of employed people as a fraction of employable people) than the US (59.6% vs 62.5%). So even if Japan is not replacing people with machines in order to keep people employed, the result seems to be fewer people employed!

This effect is not news to economists, although it can be counterintuitive. The focus on keeping jobs at the cost of technological progress is known as the "make work bias", and it really isn't beneficial for anyone in the long term. See this for an economist explaining the situation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

Re:Employ everyone digging ditches!

[EvilAlphonso]

Possible reasons:

• Roughly 25% of the workforce is on a dead-end career track... office ladies.
• The women participation in the workforce drops massively once they marry and give birth.
• 70% of the female workforce will exit the workforce for a decade or more after child birth, a large segment of those will actually never come back.
• 54% of the female workforce is on temporary/interim contracts, compare to 19% for males.
• A woman will earn on average 60% of what a man would earn in the same role.

Re:Employ everyone digging ditches!

[Anonymous Coward]

Interesting, no feminist bitches or pussy guys around...

Lets redefine some more numbers!

[Narcocide]

5,242,880 bytes now equates to "almost zero."

Japan has Problems but Not Driven by Technology

[Koreantoast]

The Japanese economy does have some significant problems, but it's driven by broader structural challenges versus their decision to use fax machines instead of email. Their economy has stalled for about twenty years, effectively shrinking over time. While unemployment has been kept low, it's come at the expense of economic growth and stagnant wages, leading to shrinking household buying power as inflation grows faster than incomes. Meanwhile, the global marketplace has become more and more competitive, making it even harder for Japan to restart their export-driven economy. Lots of really smart people debating on how they got there and how they can break out, but so far, the Japanese government efforts to try and spend their way out has only led to massive public debt. In short, Japan has much bigger problems that modernizing IT isn't going to solve.

Untrue

[Anonymous Coward]

Japanese office workers average just half the productivity of their American counterparts

Impossible. AniMoJo says everything in Japan is brilliant.

FYIF

[Anonymous Coward]

Hello,

The original submission made by me, included a crucial phrase Slashdot censored blank, despite it being in the original BBC article. Quoted from my draft:

"Vary of connecing to networks for fear of data theft, hacking and influence of the abroad they don't want to know about, the average japanese office has just half the productivity of an american counterpart."

Fear of the abroad they don't want to know about is a very real and important aspect of japanese culture! The rising sun island people just want to be left alone nowadays, since colonialism brought them ruins and the world considers them weird (even perverted), while they consider the world disorderly, disrespectful and impolite, as well as untidy. They don't want immigration, they don't even want the many 2/3/4 gen japanese back whose ancestors have been emigrating to South America since about 150 years ago, as they could bring with them influences of a lesser culture (i.e. hispanic lazyness, corruption and infighting are infamous).

Therefore, it was silly to censor the original submission without Slashdot editors reading the original BBC article.

And how does Africa compare to Japan?

[Anonymous Coward]

Surely it's exactly the same, since there are no differences between races?

Generation gap?

[brunokummel]

Not actually a surprise if you consider the average age of the population: 45+ !

Why Sony is in trouble

[Zontar_Thing_From_Ve]

Well a lot of their biggest companies are in real trouble (ex Sony).

Well, my opinion on why Sony is in real trouble is that the company is actually in effect run by the Americans who dominate the entertainment (music, movies and TV) side of Sony who view all of humanity as thieves looking to steal Sony's entertainment property and who have consumed so many resources and effort to stop the "thieves" that the rest of the business that used to actually be good can no longer be good any more. Sony is no longer interested in making useful products so much as they are completely and utterly obsessed with stopping you, dirty thieving human, from getting their music, movies and TV shows without paying for them.

Imagine 40+ years ago

[Zontar_Thing_From_Ve]

The story about the trip to Japan 25 years ago made me think of something. Approximately around 1970, Soviet film director Andrei Tarkovsky and Japanese film director Akira Kurosawa became friends and Soviet authorities allowed Tarkovsky to go to Japan to visit his friend under the official guise of doing a small amount of location filming for his upcoming film, "Solaris". Tarkovsky brought a very small film crew with him and they shot some footage from inside a car of just driving around the major highways and tunnels of Tokyo. There's a 10-15 minute segment of the film that uses the footage and the segment is known as "The city of tomorrow" segment. Even after all these years I have to admit it still looks somewhat futuristic.

As far as backwards banking systems go, Ukraine's was pretty bad in the previous decade. I assume it's better now, but I was last there about 9 years ago. I never used an ATM there - ever. I always brought enough cash with me to cover to my expenses during my stay. I read too many first hand accounts of travelers who used ATMs that actually were run by the mafia and they simply collected your bank and pin info and used that to try to drain your account. The authorities could not be bothered to do anything about this. And this was in major cities like Kiev and Odessa. If you went to any place other than the very largest cities, the stories were that if you ever found an ATM it probably wasn't going to be connected to any international banking network, but at least you didn't have to worry about the mafia running it to try to steal your money.

Sigh...

[fullback]

I've lived in Japan for almost 25 years. Here we go again with another new-to-Japan reporter writing about things they don't understand completely out of context. And even outright nonsense...

Re:Sigh...

[metrix007]

I'm sorry you have to live in such a backwards culture.

Not really.

[luis_a_espinal]

It hurts the Japanese corporations who are trying to globally compete in outsourcing labor and driving down wages.

Bullshit. Japanese corporations (think Honda, SATO, Rakuten or Mitsubishi Heavy Industries) operate at a different level from the myriad of small companies that dot the Japanese eco-landscape. They use e-mail, they fax (and like anyone else, they can route those faxes into a digital format.) I do not see Honda having a hard time competing against VW, Kia or Ford, do we?

I've been in Japan, and the things that always amaze me are 1) the number of small businesses, 2) the very liberal zoning laws (you can pretty much open any business you want within a residential area, with some limits obviously), and 3) customer/provider loyalty.

Number 3 is very important, more than anything else. The whole Walmartization thing just doesn't happen in Japan. My mother-in-law in Kawasaki would buy her new Smart TV (a Toshiba IIRC) from a small mom-and-pop electronics shop in her neighborhood. She could well go to a large consumer electronics retail store like Yamada Denki to get the same stuff (perhaps even better and/or at better price), but she won't.

Japanese customers stick to the businesses they have been using - they stick to what they know has worked well for them (reliability -> loyalty) even if they have to pay more. And businesses go out of their way (perhaps too much in a cost-effective way) to ensure they retain their life-long customers' loyalty.

Case in point, every other year, my wife goes to this optics department to fix the frames of her reading glasses, which she bought from the store years ago. The store technicians do so, free of charge, no questions, ask. They fix the frames, don't charge anything, and genuinely bow and thank her, WITH SINCERITY, for coming to the store. Next reading glasses, she will buy them from them. She will wait a year or two till her next trip to Japan if necessary.

Loyalty goes both ways. And it serves them well in their economy. Japan is being afflicted by many things, an inflexible financial system, a convoluted small-business loan system, the lingering effects of their real state bubble, and population aging. But with all that, the purchasing power and quality of life enjoyed by the average Japanese worker or household has not been affected by the economic slum (only international expansion has, internal consumption and production remains the same.)

I'm sorry, but this "ZOMG analog" argument, I don't see how it negatively effects the still thriving small businesses in Japan. In Japan, they strive for quality, and they stick to what is known to work. Sometimes too much since that can have an ill effect on innovation, but it is hard to see "lack of innovation" and "Japan" in the same sentence.

Re:The land of different immigration policies

[Anonymous Coward]

They also have very different immigration policies, and people can't just walk or swim into the country.
Send them a few million from equatorial countries and that may change.

False equalities are boring

[Anonymous Coward]

"Japanese office workers average just half the productivity of their American counterparts"

Please define productivity, especially in the US where "products" are now barely produced and "work" is mostly moving paper and ideas....
You just can't compared Work productivity between two countries without the baggage of Education, Social Life and Wealth/Poverty assessments, never mind the differences in populations and culture etc...This is just more nonsense from the people that want us all to work twelve hours a day on a tablet.....

Wow their Christmas is great

[Anonymous Coward]

That's much better than here where try start advertising it two months early, spend hundreds of dollars to make people angry jealous and greedy, and feel like an asshole at the end of it

Obligatory Tom Waits reference

[RevWaldo]

I got the style but not the grace
I got the clothes but not the face
I got the bread but not the butter
I got the window but not the shutter

But I'm big In Japan
I'm big in Japan
Hey, but I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan

I got the house but not the deed
I got the horn but not the reed
I got the cards but not the luck
I got the wheel but not the truck

But hey, I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan
But hey, I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan

I got the moon, I got the cheese
I got the whole damn nation on their knees
I got the rooster, I got the crow
I got the ebb, I got the flow

I got the powder but not the gun
I got the dog but not the bun
I got the clouds but not the sky
I got the stripes but not the tie

But hey, I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan

Hey-ho, they love the way I do it
Hey-ho, there's really nothing to it

I got the moon, I got the cheese
I got the whole damn nation on their knees
I got the rooster, I got the crow
I got the ebb, I got the flow

I got the sizzle but not the steak
I got the boat but not the lake
I got the sheets but not the bed
I got the jam but not the bread

But hey, I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan
Hey! I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan
I'm big in Japan

.

Coren22 proven a TROLL

[Anonymous Coward]

See subject - OR did you NOT say this:

"Maybe I should change my signature again just to rile him up some more." - by Coren22 (1625475) on Tuesday November 03, 2015 @10:07AM (#50855451) FROM http://slashdot.org/comments.p...

behind my back (since I can't see signatures) like the punk you are & KGIII noted it:

"In an earlier thread, I saw that APK quoted your signature" - by KGIII (973947) on Monday November 02, 2015 @10:22PM (#50852845) FROM http://slashdot.org/comments.p...

Which I COMPLETELY SHUT DOWN due to your lies about me on AD + DNS (GPO too from my security guides which I see you've read, that are geared to single stand alone machines no less NOT networked ones but I advise vs. using external DNS with AD there too, here) -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p...

---

* You're a disgusting LIAR & burying yourself ALL THE MORE for me... thank you!

APK

P.S.=> The beatings WILL continue libeling liar... much to YOUR OWN dismay, & you've only brought it on yourself (signatures? what a punk... man to man, I've shown how technically inept you are, & I doubt you're what you CLAIM to be in MCSE, SystemEngineer, & Security - most posts that are that 'beating' on you show QUITE otherwise)... apk

Coren22 proven a LYING punk

[Anonymous Coward]

"APK doesn't think that DNS servers are worth running and seems to believe that somehow Microsoft Active Directory can run without DNS." - by Coren22 (1625475) on Tuesday October 27, 2015 @12:58PM (#50811615)

Where'd I say AD will run minus DNS Coren22? I've said AD = internal network DNS dependent as far back as 2007 http://forums.tweaktown.com/wi...

(Searching this in BOLD "To warn users who have ActiveDirectory/AD LAN-WAN setups to NOT use external DNS servers!" referring to OpenDNS suggestions for those using AD stupid in the POSTS BEFORE IT in my security guides for users (geared to stand alone single machines no less), & right there on that page proves it stupid - so even if you posted as myself someplace here on /. "impersonating me", I have your ass NOW, shithead!)

I've also stated MANY TIMES I use remote DNS in OpenDNS @ home (but not @ work on AD networks + exchange/outlook: Free OpenDNS model doesn't work with AD dependent Exchange + Outlook specifically you lying little imbecile).

I also don't hardcode in "every site there is under the sun" is why, so I have to use DNS, but OpenDNS & rarely.

I also RARELY MISS A LOOKUP since I put where I spend a good 95++% of my time online in my favorite sites into hosts @ the TOP of hosts for utmost LOCAL FASTER RESOLUTION SPEEDS and more reliability vs. Open DNS (not OpenDNS) resolvers being abused, Kaminsky redirect poisoned DNS servers (of which 99.999% of ISP DNS are not proofed against to this very day even though a patch exists which OpenDNS uses), rogue DNS servers, and yes ROUTERS with bushwhacked by malware DNS settings (happening a LOT lately).

Hardcodes in hosts are faster than remote DNS, waste less resources than local dns in power, cpu cycles, RAM, & other I/O by FAR considering ALL THE PARTS of such a setup in programs, data, I/O, & power (especially if setup as a separate machine).

APK

P.S.=> You're a disgusting liar... apk

Coren22 "security guru" wannabe fails security

[Anonymous Coward]

YOU say "hosts=bad" (but they add security, speed, & reliability) & bitch on admin privelege to UPDATE vs. threats:

"So, have you figured out why privilege escalation is a bad thing yet?" - by Coren22 on Tuesday September 22, 2015 @05:15PM (#50577809)

Hypocrite - You use admin priv admitting it

&

How else can I programmatically update hosts minus it in Windows?

---

"Of course it requires elevation to write to the hosts file" - by Coren22 (1625475) on Wednesday September 23, 2015 @05:35PM (#50585879)

You FINALLY later admit there's no other way!

FACT:

Even MalwareBytes AntiMalware (best one) DEMANDS you use admin privelege (you saying it's "bad" too?) it can't do its job fully otherwise, like many security tools do!

---

Aryeh Goretsky NOD32/ESET says hosts = good security-> http://it.slashdot.org/comment...

Oliver Day (Symantec) does-> http://www.securityfocus.com/c...

MalwareBytes' hpHosts hosts & recommends my APK Hosts File Engine 9.0++ SR-2 32/64-bit-> http://hosts-file.net/?s=Downl...

---

* HOW MANY SECURITY PROS DO I NEED TO KNOCK THE CHOCOLATE OUTTA YOU?

---

Those security pros INCLUDE me: I work w/ guys from malwarebytes' hpHosts on a regular basis!

I've professionally worked for decades as a combined domain-wide network admin & software engineer since 1994 (Even showing you HOW to migrate a hosts across an enterprise-> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )

I've also been securing computers + WRITING GUIDES using CIS Tool (who took fixes from me http://slashdot.org/comments.p... - bonus) http://www.bing.com/search?q=%...

You told me you learn from guides?

I write good ones that MILLIONS USE & was PAID FOR IT http://pcpitstop.com/news/winn...

+ WARES TO PROTECT USERS that are endorsed & hosted by security pros -> http://hosts-file.net/?s=Downl...

You did all that? No!

(& that's ONLY a SMALL part of what I could put out)

APK

P.S.=> You're all TALK -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... & a "ne'er-do-well" in security... apk

Coren22's desperation, lies, & libel

[Anonymous Coward]

"I guess we should avoid your crap, it looks like it is marked as malware. Good luck getting that removed." - by Coren22 (1625475) on Monday November 02, 2015 @03:52PM (#50850445)

False positive: I've wrote 'em long ago, no response vs. 60++ REPUTABLE sources (not nobodies) below that fries you Coren22!

Is that your fake site for more lies Coren22?

Lying about me LIKE YOU DID HERE punk -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... ??

---

MalwareBytes' hpHosts Admin (MalwareBytes employee) hosts & recommends it -> http://hosts-file.net/?s=Downl... & MalwareBytes = BEST antivirus per this VERY recent testing of them all http://www.av-test.org/en/news...

&

It's safe proven by 57 antivirus programs recently in BOTH its 64-bit model https://www.virustotal.com/en/...

+

Its 32-bit model too https://www.virustotal.com/en/...

More "SALT IN YOUR WOUNDS" -> http://f.virscan.org/APKHostsF...

APK

P.S.=> /.'ers say my work is good too:

"his hosts program is actually pretty good" - by xenotransplant (4179011) on Monday August 10, 2015 @03:34PM (#50287195)

"I like your host file system." - by Karmashock (2415832) on Wednesday September 09, 2015 @03:57PM (#50489401)

"APK is kinda right... I've given up on JS based adblocking and gone to blackholing in /etc/hosts, just like it was back in the 90s. The computational load has gotten intolerable for any ad-blocking using JS. I've tried his hosts file generating software. It works." - by bmo (77928) on Thursday October 15, 2015 @11:30AM (#50736071)

"his hosts tool is actually useful for those cases in which one does indeed want to locally block stuff outright while consuming minimum system resources" by alexgieg (948359) on Friday September 25, 2015 @09:57AM (#50596461)

They still haven't recovered from 1990

[dlenmn]

Bottom line the Japanese have no real trouble right now. I have never seen more jap. Tourists outside of Japan since the last decades.

Regardless of the cause of Japan's 1990ish mess, the fact is that their situation has not really improved since. Seriously, their GDP per capita has gone nowhere over the last two decades; your anecdote about Japanese tourists doesn't disprove that. Japan is still a wealthy country because they were ahead of the curve in 1990, so there have always been a lot of Japanese tourists.

I've spent a lot of time in Japan

[Anonymous Coward]

Using these "legacy technologies" DOES NOT hurt their competitiveness. This is yet another moronic, ethnocentric racist bull shit claim and assumption. The writer is obviously a dogmatic adherent to the religion of progress and not fact or or reality-based in any way, shape or form.

The fact of the matter is that with Japanese, it's FASTER to use fax machines for any "written" telecommunications. A Japanese can write a note on paper and fax it 10x faster than it would take to either 1) write in Japanese using the 3 different language fonts of the language, or 2) write in English which is a second language to most. This is a long established fact!

It's pretty damn obvious that the article writer either has NEVER BEEN TO JAPAN, or has never closely examine why these technologies are used in the context of the Japanese language.

Something similar is also true about Chinese though not quite as extreme.

Japan is having economic issues but it has NOTHING to do with using Fax machines. Instead it's because of:

Economic contraction due to demographic change: the population is declining; >50% of the population is over 50 yo. Economic growth is predominantly determined by population: grow population and you get economic growth. collapse population and you get economic decline

Speculative Market Bubbles: Perhaps inspired by the US or just by normal human greed, the Japanese economy was cratered by real estate speculation in 1991.

Too Big To Fail: Japan had a "Too Big To Fail" policy long before the US after the Japanese real estate crash in the 1991. And sadly the US ignorantly took all the wrong lessons from it thinking it's a hunky dory thing to do the same thing. The fatal flaw: Japan had an unusually high savings rates which floated the moribund economy until just a few years ago, and then, when savings were finally exhausted, Japan rapidly went down hill just like the US after 2008. During the TBTF time, Japan was in a zombie state and it never rose again economically because TBTF prevented bad investments from being cleared away. Yes doing so would have caused the loss of long-standing banks and businesses, but that would have been a transient problem only. This historical example is why people predicted the US real estate bubble crash would happen and that TBTF would be a spectacular failure that would create an American Potemkin/Zombie Economy like Japan. They were 100% right - that's exactly what has happened!

Quantatitive Easing: Japan unfortunately has chosen to use quantitative easing just as it's original TBTF policy exhausted the nation's savings. If they'd only liquidated the large banks that SHOULD HAVE FAILED in 1991, the savings rate of Japan at the time would have made the economic effects relatively mild. But they didn't and so now they've reached the same point that the US was in 2008, and so they then tried the same failed QE policies to "jump start the economy". And exactly the same Epic Fail has happened in Japan that happened in the US: it didn't work and now things are even more fucked, just like the US.

None of this has anything to do with using faxes and tape machines. The Japanese language has not changed. And it wasn't any different during Japan's meteoric technology run-up from WWII until the 1991. For 20 years, the Japanese were eating American's lunch technologically just using fax machines. But more importantly, it's still easier to write messages on paper and fax them today than it is to enter the Japanese 3 character sets into a computer to send an e-mail or text.

I'll still trust a Japanese bullet train over any other. I'll still trust Japanese engineering over most others (German, sometimes American, sometimes Taiwanese excepted). Just because you are all buzz-word compliant and using the latest inventions DOES NOT mean you are automatically good or superior at engineering and technology. Just talk to anyone who works at Facebook or Twitter: they know next to nothing about technology, they contribute nothing to the world's most pressing problems and they couldn't engineer their way out of a paper bag if their lives depended on it.

FTTH in 2000 w/ 100Mb/100Mb for $56 mo, not buying

[Anonymous Coward]

Japan, thanks to government intervention with NTT, in 2000 got Fiber To The Home (FTTH) with bandwidth upstream/downsteam of 100Mb/100Mb (Symmetrical and Synchronous) with NO THROTTLING because of an "UP TO" fake promise. So sorry, not buying this garbage.

By 2006, they had 1GB/1GB available for $52 per month...thanks to competition the price went down.

None of which would have been possible without the de-regulation of Nippon Telephone and Telegraph. Yes they fought it and lost.

Compared to USA when in 1976 the Telecommunications Act was soundly defeated via weakening (and making unenforceable) by the Telcos of the day. Had the US government intervened, more strongly and more effectively, at that time, US Consumers would have had the same bandwidths up/down by the year 2000.

Because they did not intervene...it's 2015 and less than 30 cities in the USA have true Fiber To The Home...a fiber link from the switching station to the home, without intervention of any other inferior technology (FTTP, FTTN, PONs, etc...) that allows the Cable Companies, Telcos and Wireless companies to continue their scarcity myth that denies us service while inflating their purses. It is pathetic.

People are angry at VW for cheating on the emission test, where the software turns off during the test and turns back on letting the car pollute after the test has finished.

Yet Cable companies, Telcos and Cellular companies have been doing exactly the same thing, sans pollution, with their bandwidth for over 30 years now.

A DD-WRT, OpenWRT or Tomato firmware enabled firewall/router will show the cable company's pipe fully open during the speed test and clamp right back down to a very tight miserly throttle of upstream and downstream bandwidth the millisecond that fake speed test finishes. It is the same thing folks!

So if you are mad at VW, you should be really angry at the Telcos, Cable Companies and Cellular companies, all of whom throttle bandwidth lying to consumers that someone in every neighborhood, in every city, in every county, in every state of the USA is stealing content, movies, music, etc... and thus they are justified in throttling service to below 'the official definition of Broadband'. Granted that definition recently increased from 768K to what 10MB or 15Mb, which very few providers allow over their throttling.

So if you are angry, point it in the right direction.

Now that Ultra High Def TVs are coming to market that recommend at least 8MB or 10Mb of bandwidth to work, it will be interesting to see how things change.

The average cable company throttles that 'UP TO' bandwidth promise in their marketing of 20Mb/4MB (downstream/upstream) to less than 300Kbps/100Kbps.

Buying 'Burst Mode' or paying $10 - $20 extra a month for higher bandwidth did not alter their throttling at all. Of course without the right firmware in your firewall/router you can not even see your bandwidth in real time to see this throttling, thus most people who say I got XMB of bandwidth because of their false Speed Test (provided by the company of course) don't know any better anyway.

You want bandwidth, move to one of the Google Cities or other cities that have true FTTH Internet access or forget about it.

There is not a single Cable company, telco, cellular company that does NOT throttle, not even Verizon FIOS or AT&T whatever...they all throttle because it is in their interest to do so. They can charge you more for less...its the American way.

As for the comments to article, loved learning about Japan, the businesses restrictions and more...very informative, thank you everyone who shared.

Did you all know that there are 14 states where the Republican/Tea Party/Freedom Caucus members have passed laws preventing good ole American competition with Broadband? It is true and I am not a Democrat...just stating FACTS. Not a Fascist either...which is what many American Capitalist really are if you look at the definitions of terms like Socialist, Communist, Fascist, Democrat, Republican, etc.... There are even more states limiting Fiber To The Home and other methods of improving bandwidth to consumers. Shame on those oligarchies.

Some subtle cultural issues

[NitWit005]

I'm a software engineer in the US, and I've worked at firms with Japanese customers. There are definitely some cultural quirks that you don't see anywhere else.

My current firm has several Japanese customers (and one US bank) paying to keep old Internet Explorer support, and to keep some old versions of the user interfaces alive. Not a small amount either. Their view appears to be that changes to the software product would require retraining people. If you view retraining someone as costing 1000USD per headcount, and you have thousands of employees, then it's a very substantial cost.

Now, part of me says, they're right. Retraining people is "Doing the right thing (TM)". You'll similarly find that the Japanese are the only ones reading our manual, to the point that Google searches in English hit the Japanese pages of the documentation, because they are the only ones with search click-through. Again, "Doing the right thing (TM)". Except, all that training and diligent reading of the manual is a total waste. Everyone else just clicks around, figures things out, and maybe gets help from a coworker or gives us a call.

It seems that Japanese firms are rather burdened by a desire to follow a costly formal process of moving forward. An attitude that would be great for a nuclear power plant, or maybe a bank, but not so good for a normal business.

No credit, no problem

[Imazalil]

Is being primarily cash-only (SUICA being an extension of this) such a bad thing? Sure, credit is convenient, but as we've seen over and over again, people can't really be trusted with it.

With the spread of SUICA into convenience stores and other not high cost places like restaurants, Japan might be able to cut out banks all together from day-to-day live, and I think that would be just great! Yes the services banks provide have their place, but paying 5 bucks a month for a crappy 10 transaction chequing account where you worry about what special order your deposits and withdrawals will be processed is not what I would call progress.

APK

[Anonymous Coward]

Stop. Please, just stop it now.

And go and see a doctor.