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UK Government Proposes Minimum 10Mbps Broadband For Poor (thestack.com)

An anonymous reader writes: The UK's Local Government Association (LGA) is proposing a social tariff to ensure that minimum broadband access of at least 10 Mbps is available to all UK citizens at an affordable price. Last November, Parliament announced that it would begin work on a Universal Service Obligation (USO), which would grant all citizens the right to request broadband service with a minimum 10Mbps. At the time, Prime Minister David Cameron said, "Access to the Internet shouldn't be a luxury; it should be a right -- absolutely fundamental to life in 21st century Britain." Research by Ofcom in 2014 showed "marked relationships between socio-economic deprivation and [poor] broadband availability in cities". Similar results have been found in rural areas, which means that the demand for increasing broadband service to a minimum level may be high among people with lower incomes.

79 comments

  1. Ughh. by galabar · · Score: 1

    "...marked relationships between socio-economic deprivation and [poor] broadband availability in cities"

    Face, meet palm.

    1. Re: Ughh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Section 8 housing here in Kansas City gets Google Fiber for free while I have to pay 70$ a month for it.

    2. Re:Ughh. by thinkwaitfast · · Score: 2

      From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs

    3. Re: Ughh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What about a sizable group with large needs and little ability?

      Just curious

    4. Re: Ughh. by myth24601 · · Score: 1

      It is always easy to spend other people's money.

      --
      No matter where you go, there you are.
    5. Re: Ughh. by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      The Powers That Be suggest a [short] lifetime of GMO'd poptarts followed by [inexpensive] assisted suicide...

    6. Re: Ughh. by Blaskowicz · · Score: 1

      I tried to come up with my own money designed and drawn by myself, but people weren't impressed.

    7. Re:Ughh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Suddenly my needs just got bigger and my ability greatly reduced!

    8. Re: Ughh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What about a sizable group with large needs and little ability?

      Just curious

      As some grandparents (those born between 1900 and around 1940) might say: "Learn to CURB YOUR URGES!"

    9. Re:Ughh. by drsquare · · Score: 1

      What exactly are you croaking about?

    10. Re:Ughh. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, really. Don't you just love Big Brother? "Social tariff"; f*** me.

      WhyTF is it that the answer to even the tiniest problem in the UK always begins with, "The Government should..."?

  2. 10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because that's really fast..?

    What am I missing.....................???

    1. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Enough for streaming 1080p videos, I guess.

    2. Re:10MBps by houstonbofh · · Score: 2

      What am I missing.....................???

      The fact that many people are limited to 3mbps DSL or satalite...

    3. Re:10MBps by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      Because that's really fast..?

      At 10MBps, I can get work done while my kids are streaming a movie. That is fast enough.

    4. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I live in Seattle, and I would kill for either 3 Mbps or satellite. I live on the north side of an apartment building, so I can't get satellite access. Plus, even if you have access to the sky in the south, since we're 250 miles north of Toronto, you usually still can't get it to work since you have to aim the dish so low to the horizon. CenturyLink claims to offer 1.5 Mbps DSL to my block, but they can't get it to work reliably enough and can't get permission to replace cabling under the street. I'm stuck with dial-up.

    5. Re:10MBps by thinkwaitfast · · Score: 1

      What type of work?

    6. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Still on 5MBps here in Canada, monthly cap 30GB, ISP is charging nearly CAD$50 for it.

    7. Re:10MBps by unixisc · · Score: 1

      Seattle is 250 miles north of Toronto?

    8. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And what type of movie ? And - to be accurate - what's the children name ?

    9. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      In my German town, we have an offer for 100Mbps symmetric fiber to the home for less than $40/month (200Mbps symmetric for an extra $10), but we'll only be able to get it if 40% of households subscribe. You wouldn't believe how difficult it is to get people to switch.

    10. Re:10MBps by CohibaVancouver · · Score: 1

      Yep - But more like 300 miles.

      Seattle is at 47.6062 degrees N

      Toronto is at 43.6532 degrees N

    11. Re:10MBps by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      Compared to the average in the US, yes.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    12. Re:10MBps by unixisc · · Score: 1

      'North of' means that if you start at Seattle and drive/fly north some 300 miles, you'll end up in Toronto. Although that's not the case - Toronto is some 2600 miles east of Seattle.

    13. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's the problem with getting satellite internet to work? Have you tried http://www.dishpointer.com/ to find a place to mount the dish?

    14. Re:10MBps by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      It will be "up to" 10Mb. If your crappy old BT copper phone line can only manage 2Mb, too bad.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    15. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My thought exactly. I pay $25 for 5Mbit and don't even care for more. If it's a free thing for the poor, which isn't a terrible idea, why not start at a more reasonable goal, like getting some kind of Mbit service to everyone. Speedups can come after that.

    16. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're still paying the cartel I see. I'm also in Canada and pay $25 for 5Mbit with a 300G cap. Another $5 removes the cap, and another $5 gives me a static IP.

      It's Cable from TekSavvy. DSL tends to be a bit better but has a cartel-imposed high dry-loop fee, so is more expensive.

    17. Re:10MBps by aicrules · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure how Toronto got into the original explanation, but Seattle is closer to the north pole than Toronto. If you drive 300 miles north of Toronto and then west, you'll hit seattle. If you drive 300 miles north of Seattle and head east, you'll be 600 miles north of Toronto when you occupy the same Longitude

    18. Re:10MBps by unixisc · · Score: 1

      Okay, but that's a pretty bizarre definition of 'north of' or 'south of'. I have no idea why AC mentioned Toronto

    19. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What? What part of the word "minimum" don't you understand?

    20. Re:10MBps by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 1

      The poor should be able to stream 4K porn just like everyone else.

    21. Re:10MBps by JesseMcDonald · · Score: 2

      Okay, but that's a pretty bizarre definition of 'north of' or 'south of'.

      Actually it's quite standard, especially when (as in this case) the context makes it obvious that the relevant factor is the difference in latitude.

      --
      "The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat
    22. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The comment was about pointing satellite dishes. If you're far from the equator, all satellites are at a low elevation, because geostationary satellites have to be positioned over the equator. Being far north means you're more likely to have obstacles in the path of the signal. The comparison should have been "further north than Toronto", not "north of Toronto", but it was clear from context what the other AC meant: Toronto is far north, and Seattle is even further north than Toronto, so satellite dishes point low in Seattle.

    23. Re:10MBps by AHuxley · · Score: 1

      Re What am I missing .. ?
      The physics of FTTX with X been lots of very long POTS networks i.e. wireline.

      --
      Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
    24. Re:10MBps by Blaskowicz · · Score: 1

      Some countries have "speed tiers" for DSL courtesy of the ISP, but some countries don't. Fixing a broken phone line here and there or simply enticing people to sign up will bring a lot of people to 10 to 15 megabits on ADSL2+. Rural 4G in some places might do it. If you have to bring some new fixed Internet, that will be fiber which is at least able of 1 Gbps. So there isn't a lot of point in trying to bring 1 Mbps to unwashed masses. Sure, let me show you my tax receipt and build me a T1 for free and I'll like it, but even 100/10 fiber will be vastly cheaper.

    25. Re: 10MBps by avelyn · · Score: 1

      3mbps satellite? I pay $70/month for "10 mbps" which actually gives me about 70 kbps. Only option for me, living at the intersection of buttfuck and nowhere. .5 mbps would be a huge relief. Dialup speeds on the modern Internet suck so much. Fuck you very much, exede satellite Internet.

    26. Re:10MBps by Blaskowicz · · Score: 1

      In a north facing flat, you find yourself unable to have line of sight with the goddamned Sun. Neighbours may also call the cops if they see you trying to climb the roof, and running the cable from what you've put on the roof be it solar panel or satellite dish to your window is untidy.

    27. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In a north facing flat, you find yourself unable to have line of sight with the goddamned Sun. Neighbours may also call the cops if they see you trying to climb the roof, and running the cable from what you've put on the roof be it solar panel or satellite dish to your window is untidy.

      IF that creates a problem, then the problem is the cops, not the neighbor. If I call the cops to report you are an alien lizard bent on global domination, they will hang up or check on me, not you. Unless you are Hilary, then it goes up on Breitbart to be repeated by Trump as a word salad with "Some people are saying, I don't know, but there's a lot of shady things...".

    28. Re:10MBps by Bender+Unit+22 · · Score: 1

      I don't even think, I would want to watch 4K porn. Sometimes better resolution are not your friend.

    29. Re:10MBps by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      What type of work?

      Email, Stackoverflow, and light browsing for work. Slashdot for goofing off.
      If all of that works, even if someone in my family is watching a movie on Netflix, then I'm good.

    30. Re:10MBps by Blaskowicz · · Score: 1

      Well, if not the cops I would expect they call the fire brigade instead.
      Now, if you have one of those new-fangled buildings with a very flat roof and stairs or a trap door to access it, that'll be easier, maybe just a trespass.

    31. Re:10MBps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, if not the cops I would expect they call the fire brigade instead.
      Now, if you have one of those new-fangled buildings with a very flat roof and stairs or a trap door to access it, that'll be easier, maybe just a trespass.

      Ah, well if you don't own your residence, then yes I suppose it would be an issue. But then you should be calling the building management, not the government as you are dealing with a private contract. Trespass calls to the police/security should be for people not authorized on the grounds at all.

      -A Reasonable AC.

  3. I'm not poor and I can't get that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The wife and I both make 6 digits each and the best I can get is 3mbs.

  4. I'd be happy by johnsmithperson123 · · Score: 1

    If we could get anybody but Comcast with that speed. Really, I think internet should be and will be a utility akin to electricity.

    1. Re:I'd be happy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wish that as well, I'm forced to use them because there is no other option where i am.

  5. Um by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Um can we have a decently funded NHS Instead?

    1. Re: Um by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's cheaper to give the poor internet connections to look up diseases and order dodgy meds that they think might work on their broken hip.

  6. Sure... by Kindaian · · Score: 1

    But how about making sure everyone has that at least?

    With no contention?

    1. Re:Sure... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      At whose expense?

  7. Or, how about, letting them eat, cake? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Or, maybe, issue them, internet-capable devices, first and four, moist.

  8. Upper class gets 100 Gbps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    At the elite institutions, they wired all the campus locations for 100 Gbps and a minimum of 40 Gbps, so 10 Mbps is 40,000 times slower

    1. Re:Upper class gets 100 Gbps by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 1

      You are either a moron, or just ignorant. Here is the information you need to become less ignorant.

      You'er probably thinking 100 Mbps, not Gbps and it is more likely to be 1 Gps and not 100Mbps. 10Gpbs is largely impossible on most wiring, unless you're dealing with fiber (which I doubt you are). While there is a chance you can be using faster connection than 10Gbps speeds, it is highly unlikely as those are very expensive, are always fiber, and almost exclusive to data centers.

      Someday, we'll see those speeds to the desktop, just not today.

      --
      Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
    2. Re:Upper class gets 100 Gbps by Kindaian · · Score: 1

      Well, i will leave my inteligence alone to myself.

      I was refering to the "10Mbps" that the article refered.

      In case you don't know, I can inform you that there are plenty of people that would be happy to have 5Mbps in UK.

      Actually there are areas, like Island of Dogs in London, where you are lucky if you get any connection at all, just because the phone exchange is overloaded and there is no more capacity on it for years.

      So yes, there are issues, and yes, internet in UK is crap comparing with other civilized countries.

      Now regarding the cables not supporting, depends on the cables.

      In case you didn't know either, some areas have cables not of copper, but of aluminium (which was way cheaper at the time, and worked for normal voice, but it's %£%£$% for internet).

      So your milleage does vary a lot.

    3. Re: Upper class gets 100 Gbps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Presumably you mean the Isle Of Dogs (nobody, nowhere, ever calls it 'Island', first giveaway), that bit on the north side of the loop in the Thames that contains both Milwall and Canary Wharf. Its home to several major datacentres, with several more in the process of being built, and news that its hard to get a decent connection speed there is new to me. But then what do I know? I only have several friends who live there all with decent home broadband.

    4. Re:Upper class gets 100 Gbps by WillAffleckUW · · Score: 1

      I think he means internet 3, which is at all top tier research universities in the US and UK. They do switch design, which is why you're hearing about 100 Gbps switches commercially available today, and they have quite a few 40 Gbps ports throughout almost all top tier campus locations.

      --
      -- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
    5. Re:Upper class gets 100 Gbps by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 1

      Right, but the AC was comparing Peering connection (100Gb, 40Gb, 10Gb) to end user connection (10Mb). Those are not the same.

      --
      Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
    6. Re:Upper class gets 100 Gbps by WillAffleckUW · · Score: 1

      Valid criticism. However, I'll be honest, I always could afford a T1 line at work and at home.

      People in Africa spend 1/8th of their income on cell phones and charging them.

      One-eighth.

      To you it's only $20, to them it's half of what they make in a week.

      To them, 10 Mbps is not bad. But it's still a fraction of what the rich can afford (but choose not to).

      --
      -- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
  9. Like last time? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    This reminds me of the last time the British Government mandated a technology to the masses. The TV.
    Where they allowed even the poorest of people to borrow money from banks just to be able to buy a TV. NO OTHER LOAN WAS ACCEPTED!.

    They REALLY wanted the masses to be propagandized, enough to bank on it.
    The same might be happening here, though id hazard a guess that most people already have internet access of some kind already.

    1. Re:Like last time? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Propagandized, the BBC? Please, not all world is USA.

    2. Re:Like last time? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And don't forget the monstrous, ongoing theft that is the TV License.

  10. thew most important detail left out. by nimbius · · Score: 4, Funny

    Here in the UK we've taken into account internet for those unfortunate souls who may have had such access terminated in their home or residence unexpectedly. If you've recently experienced this issue, say, at the hands of an embassy or rather during, say, a political asylum against a rather simple investigation that is in no way a witch hunt with the potential to result in extradition to an island torture camp, the UK government has a solution.

    simply leave the embassy, and walk directly toward the van marked "Internet." We're also offering free stainless steel bracelets to the first customers.

    --
    Good people go to bed earlier.
  11. More than generous! by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

    10 Mbps for the lot of them to split...bloody peasants.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  12. Oh wunnerful by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...which means the UK government will deploy their free broadband 10 years after UK ISP's read the headlines and abandon any cheap broadband packages.

  13. People on slashdot have high demand for bandwidth by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Traditional web pages with text and moderately sized pictures, can be satisfied with 1 mbps, especially with the use of multiple tab browsing while pages load. Is downloading video really 'essential'? This is slashdot, where people want to do high bandwidth stuff.

  14. Question about computers by techdolphin · · Score: 1

    Who pays for the computers so the poor citizens can access the internet?

    1. Re:Question about computers by techno-vampire · · Score: 1

      The rich, of course, assuming that there are any left who haven't moved to a country that's dedicated to confiscating everything they've got to buy votes from the poor.

      --
      Good, inexpensive web hosting
    2. Re:Question about computers by sims+2 · · Score: 1

      Here in the US you can get a hotspot with unlimited* data on sprint for just $195/yr
      *deprioritized after 23GB

      --
      Minimum threshold fixed. Thanks!
    3. Re:Question about computers by mongothesecond · · Score: 1

      Is there anyone in the US between the ages of 5 and 85 who doesnt have a cell phone that can browse the internet? I kid, a little.

    4. Re:Question about computers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Here in the US you can get a hotspot with unlimited* data on sprint for just $195/yr
      *deprioritized after 23GB

      Link? You can put your obfuscated referrer code in the post if you want.

    5. Re:Question about computers by Blaskowicz · · Score: 1

      I would have say, just pick up a desktop on the streets on your way home, but if it's fully working the OS on it has become even more worthles than it used to (Windows XP, or later Windows already full of malware).

      As another who beat me to it says, the poorest tend to use a smartphone now. So if you don't have a smartphone, be glad you can afford it lol.
      Also why I find those phones despicable. You can buy a $50 one or a $80 one, but to stay afloat on security updates you'd have to buy one every year as soon as it comes out, and that's probably highly generous.
      If you still use Vista, that may have more life left than a cheap phone you'll buy tomorrow.

  15. Food and shelter? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Might be good if food and shelter were also guaranteed at an affordable price.

  16. Re:People on slashdot have high demand for bandwid by sims+2 · · Score: 1

    I tend to download video more often when the connection is too crap to stream.

    --
    Minimum threshold fixed. Thanks!
  17. Out of date by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think you will find David Cameron is no longer Prime Minister in the UK.

  18. UK Rural Poor by nukenerd · · Score: 1

    Similar results have been found in rural areas, which means that the demand for increasing broadband service to a minimum level may be high among people with lower incomes.

    I live in a rural area of the UK (my speed is 2.2 Mbps) and the issue is not being able to afford no better - that is all that is available down the end of a long copper line.

    The are going to have to do a lot of road digging to put in cable before anyone around here gets any better, rich or poor.

    And in rural UK the well-off outnumber the "poor". Most agricultural jobs have gone and the poor have gone to live in towns; their cottages have mostly been modernised and extended for better-off commuters. I live in what was once a forrester's cottage for example, extended to three times its original size.

    1. Re:UK Rural Poor by Dagger2 · · Score: 1

      I live in a rural area of the UK (my speed is 2.2 Mbps) and the issue is not being able to afford no better - that is all that is available down the end of a long copper line.

      A&A can double that.

      It'll cost extra, but you did say that the cost wasn't the issue...

  19. A simpler solution? by argStyopa · · Score: 1

    It's miserable and unfair to be in poverty. And simply giving them broadband will not solve that. Therefore I offer a simpler solution:

    Why not just mandate that the poor "not be poor" anymore?
    We should just give them all say, $100,000 per year, and then nobody will be poor and everyone will be happy.

    That should work just fine.

    --
    -Styopa
  20. Re:People on slashdot have high demand for bandwid by Blaskowicz · · Score: 1

    Even video can be done in some manner at 1 Mbps, except some live streaming that doesn't offer a low enough quality.
    But well, not owning any TV is a lot more common nowadays, now that analog broadcast was switched off (In France, they've doubled down by ceasing digital SD broadcast, so the dingy little tuner boxes and second remote have returned)

    Also, 1 Mbps doesn't really exist except for some rural lines (nothing really wrong with e.g. Seattle's DSL, it's just that 65 year-old-phone lines are rare outside the US) ; if you've got 1 Mbps it's likely because you're mooching from some wifi hotspot that will have availability problems. Congestion may mean pings less than 100ms are only achievable at 3 AM. For UK in particular, I guess rain and mist ruin it pretty often.
    1 Mbps up/down with 100% availability and low ping and zero jitter would be pretty nice actually, although still not usable for everything.

  21. First they will need to... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Make rural infrastructure capable of 10Mbs