Tim Sweeney Dislikes Windows 10 Cloud Rumors, Calls OS 'Crush Steam Edition' (arstechnica.com)

Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 10:42 · Score: 0, Redundant

Yet nobody seems to attack Apple for exactly the same view on their iPads. Remember that's what they're targeting here - iPad-type use, not computer type use.

Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by ArmoredDragon · 2017-02-01 10:52 · Score: 4, Informative

TFA is either biased or uninformed though; ChromeOS supports side loading and is open source, so there really isn't any reason why third party app stores couldn't be used.
Sweeney may be correct in that even if Microsoft allows side loading, they can revoke it at any time and there's nothing anybody can do about it.
And yes, this likewise would be more comparable to the Apple model. Arstechnica seems to routinely be biased against Google though, so it would make sense if they just wanted to pick on ChromeOS.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:00 · Score: 1

The difference is users expect something called Windows to run real Windows software, not worthless garbage apps. iPad isn't called "Mac Tablet".
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by houstonbofh · 2017-02-01 11:03 · Score: 1

That is the point. If you want a walled garden, others do it better. Windows was for people that wanted a general purpose computer. Key word "Was."
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by ShanghaiBill · 2017-02-01 11:40 · Score: 0

Yet nobody seems to attack Apple for exactly the same view on their iPads.
1. People attack Apple about this all the time.
2. Most people that buy iPads see the "walled garden" as a feature. They are specifically looking for something safe for their 5 year old to learn phonics. When people buy Windows laptops, they are expecting a general purpose computer.
Anyway, if you haven't read TFA, don't waste your time. The whole article consists of quoting Tim Sweeney, and they explaining why everything he just said is full of crap ... so then why bother to quote him? It is a pointless non-story.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by AvitarX · 2017-02-01 11:41 · Score: 4, Funny

I really wish they'd release steam for Android.
Some basic level of curation, better community for reviews, cross PC and Android purchases, I suspect instead Steam will go away as he fails to compete in a market he created (effective online distribution games store).

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Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by mrchaotica · 2017-02-01 11:43 · Score: 1

Sweeney may be correct in that even if Microsoft allows side loading, they can revoke it at any time and there's nothing anybody can do about it.
The real issue here is that it should have never gotten to the point where the vendor "allowing" something or not was possible in the first place. The owner of a device -- i.e., the user -- should have 100% complete control over every aspect of that device, full stop. All DRM should be illegal!

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Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by hattwj · 2017-02-01 12:07 · Score: 4, Insightful

Pedantic much? Its the owner of the machine, not the manufacturer of the software that should be in control.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:12 · Score: 0

Pedantic much? Its the owner of the machine, not the manufacturer of the software that should be in control.
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Opportunist · 2017-02-01 12:25 · Score: 2

It has to do with expectations.
When you hear Windows, you expect a general purpose operating system.
When you hear iPad, you expect a touchscreen that can run whatever apps Apple approves.

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Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by im_thatoneguy · 2017-02-01 12:29 · Score: 0

even if Microsoft allows side loading, they can revoke it at any time and there's nothing anybody can do about it.
Even if Microsoft allows Win32 apps to be installed on Windows XP, they can revoke that ability via an update at any time and there's nothing anybody can do about it.
The logic here is completely false. Microsoft can do *ANYTHING* to *ANY* version of Windows and there is "nothing anybody can do about it". That's as true of Win32 as it is of UWP.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:37 · Score: 0

TFA is either biased or uninformed though; ChromeOS supports side loading and is open source, so there really isn't any reason why third party app stores couldn't be used.
Sweeney may be correct in that even if Microsoft allows side loading, they can revoke it at any time and there's nothing anybody can do about it.
But consider it in the context of the average Chromebook user, they aren't going to be side loading 3rd party app store programs and they certainly aren't going to be installing a custom ChromeOS build if Google were to decide to halt side loading in the official version.
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by jxander · 2017-02-01 12:42 · Score: 1

Because Apple did it the smart way. They started small and worked up from there. No one was REALLY bothered by software limitation on a phone. It's just a phone (at least back in the iPhone 1 days), and there are alternatives that are available if it really bothers you. Then they moved up to the pads, which were basically just bigger phones, so yeah, I suppose that's OK, too.
Plus, Apple has been software restrictive from day 1, so it's not really a bit surprise that their next device is a bit more restrictive
Microsoft fails on both counts. They don't have a (successful) phone line to get people acclimated to the "app store" mentality, and their desktop OS has been the Wild West for decades. Got an exe? Fire it up! Recent versions of Windows might bitch about the installer being unsigned or whatever, but it'll still run. From games, to Libre/Open office, to virtual desktop dancer girls... any random jackhole could compile a program to run in windows.
To try and pull a hard 180 will not sit well with people. Even if it doesn't come to pass, even hinting at that direction will raise ire. It's worsened by the fact that it very much feel like MS is trying to use their near-monopoly on game-playing computers to ram their app store down our throats. No one likes it?? Well, too bad. MS will MAKE you like it.

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Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:59 · Score: 0

The owner of a device -- i.e., the user -- should have 100% complete control over every aspect of that device, full stop.
Then go and fund open hardware development and run a fully open source operating system on that fully open hardware. The problem is people like you who whine and complain but don't actually *do* anything.

All DRM should be illegal!
It doesn't have to be. Stop supporting that model en masse and it will go away on its own, instead choose CC licensed content and contribute to funding it or spending your time helping out. It's not free of cost to produce this stuff.
But again you don't want to actually *do* anything so you just continue to support closed hardware vendors, closed software vendors and the model that produces DRM content.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:00 · Score: 0

Wrong. And might I add that you're a stupid motherfucker (Trump voter, perhaps?). Indeed, you own the hardware, but you do NOT own the software. You never did.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by im_thatoneguy · 2017-02-01 13:05 · Score: 2

I really wish they'd release steam for Android.
Except that Android is in practice as locked down as Windows is since nearly all apps require Google services and you can't re-compile Android with Google services including the store.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:07 · Score: 0

Perhaps, then, the issue is the name. If the Microsoft marketing dept have a brain, they'll call this product something like .. "Microsoft Handheld", "Microsoft Book", "Microsoft SurfaceOS", "Microsoft StoneOS"... or something like that.
In a sense, this is what they SHOULD have done with the original Surface RT devices (the 2012 ones, not the big interactive things) - if they'd been released with "SurfaceOS" instead, were a pure UWP device (i.e., no conventional desktop at all, not even for specially compiled copies of Microsoft Office) and had been released at a much MUCH more reasonable price-point, maybe the Surface RT devices would be around today.
I believe the 'not one thing, not the other' of Win 8 made this bad territory for Microsoft.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by ArmoredDragon · 2017-02-01 13:19 · Score: 4, Insightful

Except that Android is in practice as locked down as Windows is since nearly all apps require Google services and you can't re-compile Android with Google services including the store.
That doesn't seem to stop Amazon from running its own app store or distributing its own non-Google fork of Android.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by mrchaotica · 2017-02-01 13:24 · Score: 1

Then you say it should be illegal for the owner to have 100% control over their stuff...
The copyright holder is not the owner. The Public Domain is the owner; the copyright holder is just borrowing it.

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"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by ArmoredDragon · 2017-02-01 13:26 · Score: 2

Even if Microsoft allows Win32 apps to be installed on Windows XP, they can revoke that ability via an update at any time and there's nothing anybody can do about it.
Are you high? If you revoked the ability of XP to run win32 applications, then what exactly would it even be able to run? There's no such thing as UWP for XP. Same is true of 7.
Furthermore, UWP was designed from the ground up for sideloading to be impossible and then only enabled after an update because nobody wanted to touch it so they're hoping that they can get at least some interest besides the zero interest it currently has.
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:26 · Score: 0

Windows is about openness and freedom (although Linux is arguably more). Apple has always been a lock-in.
Perhaps Apple's financial success is causing many companies to evaluate if freedom is really worth it..
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by ArmoredDragon · 2017-02-01 13:31 · Score: 1

But consider it in the context of the average Chromebook user, they aren't going to be side loading 3rd party app store programs and they certainly aren't going to be installing a custom ChromeOS build if Google were to decide to halt side loading in the official version.
That's a totally moot point; the author was arguing that the only way Microsoft could match Chrome OS is to block the ability for third party stores to work because they can't work in Chrome OS either, but that whole premise is false to begin with. If somebody like Steam wanted to create a third party app store on Chrome OS, they very well could. However Microsoft does have a precedent of creating an OS (see Windows RT) where third party stores are just flat out impossible.
Furthermore, even if it wasn't moot, third party stores on Android are quite prevalent, and some of them (i.e. Amazon) make decent money doing it.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:37 · Score: 0

If you revoked the ability of XP to run win32 applications, then what exactly would it even be able to run?
They could say you can only run .Net applications for example.

Furthermore, UWP was designed from the ground up for sideloading to be impossible and then only enabled after an update because nobody wanted to touch it so they're hoping that they can get at least some interest besides the zero interest it currently has.
Right. The people wanted it so that's what Microsoft did, if everybody is using their platform and side loading steam with the side effect of also using UWP apps from the store then they are hardly going to remove side loading capability. Nobody gives a shit about the OS, they want to run their programs, if their programs suddenly don't run then they will use an OS on which their programs *do* run.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:47 · Score: 0

That's a totally moot point; the author was arguing that the only way Microsoft could match Chrome OS is to block the ability for third party stores to work because they can't work in Chrome OS either, but that whole premise is false to begin with.
Third party stores don't work in ChromeOS unless you dick around with it to put it in developer mode and then change the security settings to enable unknown sources. In any case why would Microsoft not do something similar? Especially since when they tried the lockdown last time it ended in the utter failure that was Windows RT.

If somebody like Steam wanted to create a third party app store on Chrome OS, they very well could. However Microsoft does have a precedent of creating an OS (see Windows RT) where third party stores are just flat out impossible.
They also abandoned that platform because it was a dismal failure in large part due to the inability to side load applications which is something they even changed the UWP to allow. They also have a precedent of listening to their customers and making changes on that basis, i.e. Xbox DRM.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:58 · Score: 0

The kind of person who would want steam would never buy a windows cloud computer because the hardware would be built for battery life, not gaming, so most steam games would run terribly anyway. As a gamer, I would consider it a novel computer like I do Chromebooks.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by AvitarX · 2017-02-01 15:28 · Score: 1

I don't mean SteamOS Mobile, I mean Steam for Android, but also have it be a marketplace (they have a buggy app already).
Android, in practice, let's me install apps from Humble Bundle App, and from the Amazon store too.
I want Steam on my Android so I can buy a game like World of Goo, and play it in both places, and that stupid knock offs won't be in the store (which I assume Valve's level of curation handles). A place for reasonably prices pay apps not to get drowned out by garbage.

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Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by AvitarX · 2017-02-01 15:30 · Score: 1

It also doesn't stop Amazon from having an app store available for my non-forked android (to be fair, it sounds like Valve would be allowed to do this too, it would simply have to only include universal executables).
My point is that Valve is crying about a platform they won't have access too, and yet clearly doesn't actually seem to care.

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Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 15:45 · Score: 0

Epic Games is not Valve.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Man+On+Pink+Corner · 2017-02-01 15:48 · Score: 3, Insightful

Microsoft is convinced that the name "Windows" actually carries some goodwill with consumers. Where they got that idea must be one of the best-kept secrets in the business world. The only time most people have ever heard of "Windows" is when their computer breaks and they have to call someone to fix it, either at work or at home.
The "Windows" brand has negative consumer value. Until someone at Microsoft wakes up and realizes that, they will continue to churn out flop after flop, from mobile phones to locked-down iPad competitors.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 16:02 · Score: 1

Wrong. And might I add that you're a stupid motherfucker (Hillary voter, perhaps?). Indeed, you own the hardware, and while you do not own the software, ownership of one component should not give you the right to do whatever you want to other components owned by other entities. It's no different than lease (notice I did not say ownership) of a toyota gives toyota motors or the dealer the right to impose themselves on your rights. Many DRM schemes purposely break other hardware/software, and impose themselves on systems in ways that are draconian to say the least.
Note use of the word 'should'. This implies a moral argument, which was what you were responding to. You chose to treat it as a statement of incorrect fact to get around having to argue against his point.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by AvitarX · 2017-02-01 16:21 · Score: 1

Oh wow, that makes the guy seem even crazier to me I think.
I missed that detail here (and when he ranted in the past), my brain filled in details from context that were wrong it seems.

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Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Grieviant · 2017-02-01 16:38 · Score: 1

That would be because Peter Bright is one the biggest Microsoft shills alive and has managed to cultivate a small army of fanboys that fawn over everything MS does while taking a dim view of their main competitor.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by bondsbw · 2017-02-01 17:09 · Score: 1

UWP was designed from the ground up for sideloading to be impossible and then only enabled after an update because nobody wanted to touch it
Sideloading was possible in the first release of Windows 10, which was the first OS containing UWP.

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Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by exomondo · 2017-02-01 17:12 · Score: 1
and their desktop OS has been the Wild West for decades. Got an exe? Fire it up!
So was Apple, then they introduced GateKeeper and it wouldn't let you run executables until you go in to the settings and explicitly say you want to run unsigned code. In settings you had:
- *App Store
- *App Store and Identified Developers
- *Anywhere (can't quite remember the wording of this one since it's now gone)
But in Sierra the only options are:
- *App Store
- *App Store and Identified Developers
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Gussington · 2017-02-01 19:40 · Score: 1

And yes, this likewise would be more comparable to the Apple model.
This is what I don't get. If MS go more like Apple then I may as well buy Apple. The reason I stick with MS is the precisely because it works with most non-MS things.
Microsoft's strength is that they live in the happy place between locked ecosystem like Apple, and warts and all hairy old Linux. Seems a poor choice to give up the market segment they dominate to try and play me too with Apple or Google. Did they not learn from the Windows Phone disaster?
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by JabrTheHut · 2017-02-01 23:10 · Score: 1

I just checked, as I haven't moved to Sierra yet. No, it'll still let you open any app you download, you just have to double-click on it, go to security in the settings app and click on "open anyway" the first time.

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Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 00:42 · Score: 0

Copyright is not ownership, you little shits. It never has been. It's a temporary privilege granted by government restricting the privileges of the public domain (being the actual "owner" of all "IP").
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 01:23 · Score: 0

Tim Sweeney also created Unreal Tournament and ZZT, two of the best games besides Quake.
He also created Unreal Engine which is the engine behind a not insignificant number of games distributed on Steam. Though he doesn't represent Valve, he does have a vested interest in the success of their platform (and the success of open platforms in general).
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Cederic · 2017-02-02 02:31 · Score: 2

But again you don't want to actually *do* anything so you just continue to support closed hardware vendors, closed software vendors and the model that produces DRM content.
That's nonsense.
I refuse to buy Apple devices because they're locked down. That hasn't stopped millions of idiots buying them, and as a result skewing the market so that some software or other features are only available on Apple devices.
If I refuse to buy a Windows 10 device because it's locked down, that wont stop millions of idiots from buying one anyway, and skewing the market so that the games I want to play are only available on Windows 10 devices.
My options here are very limited.

Then go and fund open hardware development
Sure. Could you loan me four billion dollars please, I'm not sure I have that much in my bank account at the moment.
Get fucking real.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by JustBoo · 2017-02-02 02:54 · Score: 1

[...] Did they not learn from the Windows Phone disaster?
No... no they did not. "“Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it.” Unbridled greed and a lust for power helps create the conditions to willfully "forget."
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by UnknownSoldier · 2017-02-02 03:14 · Score: 1

OSX 10.10 System Menu > System Preferences > Security & Privacy

Allow apps downloaded from: ( ) Mac App Store ( ) Mac App Store and identified developers (x) Anywhere

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Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 06:29 · Score: 0

Which apps require Google services aside from Google's own apps? I haven't run into any.
I use stuff from F-Droid and Amazon just fine.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 06:50 · Score: 0

The Unreal Engine is used by so many games because of its non-restrictive license terms and the power of the engine. Epic Games pretty much controls all of gaming on every single platform.
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by exomondo · 2017-02-02 09:18 · Score: 1

Not quite sure what you are trying to say. What you listed there is what I already listed, the options that used to exist. Perhaps you aren't aware but OSX 10.10 is not the latest release, macOS 10.12 (Sierra) is and the "Anywhere" option does not exist anymore.
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by exomondo · 2017-02-02 09:21 · Score: 1

I just checked, as I haven't moved to Sierra yet. No, it'll still let you open any app you download, you just have to double-click on it, go to security in the settings app and click on "open anyway" the first time.
What do you mean "No", that's exactly what I just said: it wouldn't let you run executables until you go in to the settings and explicitly say you want to run unsigned code. And in Sierra the "Anywhere" option does not exist anymore, they're certainly moving toward an "authorised" application model.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 09:31 · Score: 0

I refuse to buy Apple devices because they're locked down. That hasn't stopped millions of idiots buying them, and as a result skewing the market so that some software or other features are only available on Apple devices.
So we should just give up on the FOSS and software/hardware freedom efforts because it's too hard. The problem is that by and large (with the exception of Linux) the FOSS hardware and software that is available is crap and it is way behind what the proprietary vendors produce. You can make out like things like DRM are a big deal but the reality is that they aren't.

If I refuse to buy a Windows 10 device because it's locked down, that wont stop millions of idiots from buying one anyway, and skewing the market so that the games I want to play are only available on Windows 10 devices.
Then don't whine about it, if you can't convince people that your model is better and worth the effort then it probably isn't and characterizing them as "idiots" is obviously a poor start particularly if you're just going to go along with them anyway and buy a Windows 10 device so you can play those games.

Sure. Could you loan me four billion dollars please, I'm not sure I have that much in my bank account at the moment.
Get fucking real.
Hey if you can't make a compelling case for crowd funding then perhaps the "idiot" is you.
Either put up or shut up, you've indicated you can't do the former so just do the latter.
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by UnknownSoldier · 2017-02-02 10:07 · Score: 1

> Not quite sure what you are trying to say. What you listed there is what I already listed,
I was just independently verifying what it looked like in previous versions via text since I didn't feel like to linking to an external screenshot image in case others weren't aware.
> Perhaps you aren't aware ...
Yes, I'm perfectly aware of Apple's shenanigans.
> macOS 10.12 (Sierra) is and the "Anywhere" option does not exist anymore.
It does still exist, it is just hidden by default (which is dumb.) On sierra one must use the command line to disable GateKeeper and reboot for it to be active:

sudo spctl --master-disable
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 10:14 · Score: 0

The "Windows" brand has negative consumer value. Until someone at Microsoft wakes up and realizes that, they will continue to churn out flop after flop, from mobile phones to locked-down iPad competitors.
Wow, I wish I could churn out a $20 billion annual revenue "flop".
Re:Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by exomondo · 2017-02-02 10:22 · Score: 1

> macOS 10.12 (Sierra) is and the "Anywhere" option does not exist anymore.
It does still exist, it is just hidden by default (which is dumb.) On sierra one must use the command line to disable GateKeeper and reboot for it to be active:

sudo spctl --master-disable
What I mean is the option isn't there anymore, it certainly looks like Apple is moving toward an authorised applications model.
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by Man+On+Pink+Corner · 2017-02-02 12:10 · Score: 1

What part of the Windows franchise is earning $20B/year, except desktop OSes that people (think they) have no choice but to buy?
Re: Meanwhile in the Apple ecosystem on iPads.. by bickerdyke · 2017-02-03 02:24 · Score: 1

The real issue here is that it should have never gotten to the point where the vendor "allowing" something or not was possible in the first place. The owner of a device -- i.e., the user -- should have 100% complete control over every aspect of that device, full stop. All DRM should be illegal!
We had it that way in the good ol' days of DOS. But still users flocked to AppStore when the iPhone came out like stray cats would run to a leaking milk truck! So what happend back then, when users could install anything they wanted without restrictions?
BonziBuddy!
And not much has changed since then. Go to Joe Sixpacks PC and you'll find tons of malware, adware and who knows what. A friend had so many search bars in his browser, he couldn't see anything of the website anymore.
As nice as the idea of the free PC is, you have to give credit to the fact that users want curation. Not in a traditional sense that it is a positive selection of what to see or install, but even more in terms of what NOT to install.

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bickerdyke

WALLED GARDENS by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 10:43 · Score: 0, Insightful

Only Apple is allowed to build a walled garden, everyone else is evil.

Re:WALLED GARDENS by Opportunist · 2017-02-01 12:26 · Score: 2

Not quite.
I can easily avoid Apple and its walled garden, so it doesn't bother me that they build one.
It's way harder with Windows.

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Re:WALLED GARDENS by Pinky's+Brain · 2017-02-01 13:53 · Score: 1

Apple only did it on the iPhone/iPad ... Microsoft thought it was a good idea to try to use the same model on PCs.
Microsoft should spend less time trying to imitate Google and Apple poorly.
Re:WALLED GARDENS by ThomasBHardy · 2017-02-01 17:05 · Score: 1

I believe it's a matter of context.
To me, my handheld devices are appliances. my expectations of them are connectivity, flawless operation and and a constant deluge of new apps to amuse myself with. I'm happy to live within the Apple walled garden for this class of device. I don't want to spend any time worrying over the various security and abuse topics for these devices like I would for a truly open system
My desktop systems however, for these my expectations are for unfettered use as I see fit, with open ended ability to install, use or create any application I choose to.
So there are cases where it's not just a brand loyalty, but rather a contextual separation that drives some of the differences in perception between some walled-off ecosystem and desktop systems.

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Re:WALLED GARDENS by JustBoo · 2017-02-02 03:06 · Score: 1

Apple only did it on the iPhone/iPad ... Microsoft thought it was a good idea to try to use the same model on PCs.
Microsoft should spend less time trying to imitate Google and Apple poorly.
So MS is heading to be the OS analogue of Firefox. Huh. (As I type this into my "frozen" v.42.0 Firefox browser.) Turns out all these amazing "new idea free-thinkers" in the upper echelons are really just sheep following each other around in an endless circle.

And Steam is a better model???? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 10:46 · Score: 0, Troll

Cloud gaming provider with builtin DRM hates cloud OS provider with built in DRM, HOLY SHIT THIS IS NEWS

Re:And Steam is a better model???? by mattventura · 2017-02-01 11:37 · Score: 2

builtin DRM
Publishers on Steam can choose to have no DRM whatsoever on their game. Blame the publishers, not Steam.
Re: And Steam is a better model???? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:07 · Score: 0

I believe he was referring to Epic Games, not Valve

Embrace And Extend by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 10:47 · Score: 0

lives.

Remember, kids by 93+Escort+Wagon · 2017-02-01 10:48 · Score: 5, Insightful

Windows ain't done until Steam won't run!

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Re:Remember, kids by PPH · 2017-02-01 10:57 · Score: 5, Interesting

"DOS isn't done until Lotus won't run."
It's been that way since the beginning. VCs (with the guts to risk pissing off the Monster from Redmond) would often ask a start-up what their contingency plans were in the event Microsoft would cripple their app. Or offer their own 'free' version bundled with the OS.
To be fair; this isn't about Microsoft killing Steam. It's probably more like selling it through the Windows Store. "You wanna do business in my town? You gotta give me a piece of da' action, see?"

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Re:Remember, kids by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:06 · Score: 1

After decades I have yet to see proof Microsoft actually did any of this.
And Lotus 123 ran just fine with every machine on which I used it.
Sweeney is full of it as are most MS haters.
Re:Remember, kids by mrchaotica · 2017-02-01 11:46 · Score: 1

To be fair; this isn't about Microsoft killing Steam. It's probably more like selling it through the Windows Store.
So, killing Steam then? Because selling an app store in an app store doesn't make any goddamn sense.
(Not that killing Steam is a bad thing, mind you -- all DRM'd app stores are evil, including third-party ones.)

--
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Re:Remember, kids by darkain · 2017-02-01 11:46 · Score: 1

You must be living under a rock then, anon.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/....
Re:Remember, kids by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:52 · Score: 0

Not happening. All this bullshit comes from Tim Sweeney. Epic games hasn't made shit in the past 15 years and has spent the rest of their time selling off assets left and right. Tim Sweeney is trolling with he hopes of trying to stay relevant.
Re:Remember, kids by aliquis · 2017-02-01 13:22 · Score: 1

For them to force me away from Steam they would also have to figure out how to break the idea that one only get a license from one place and don't own a product and won't get access to the same product from other services..
Because by now I'm so heavily invested into Steam content that not using it is out of the question as long as I don't get access to it all on the alternative platform too.
Re:Remember, kids by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:26 · Score: 0

You must be living under a rock then, anon.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/....
Which doesn't mention anything about Lotus not running
Re:Remember, kids by hairyfeet · 2017-02-01 23:33 · Score: 1

Except this doesn't have a damned thing to do with desktops or Steam, this is MSFT's answer to ChromeOS.
Google has been eating MSFT's lunch in the education center because having a system that is locked down, doesn't allow the user to install programs except from a third party controlled appstore, and is trivial to restore back to original state if things go wrong? Is VERY appealing when you are dealing with a bunch of kids that don't know shit and will install any crap app that promises them some game.
All MSFT has done is taken Win 10 and stripped it down and made their own ChromeOS...big whoop. If you need a real desktop you don't buy ChromeOS lappy and you wouldn't buy this either because its not for you its for a completely different market for different groups with different needs.
As much as I hate Win 10 (won't go anywhere near that spyware buggy as fuck POS) Sweeney really needs to stop wetting himself and pull up his big boy pants and stop having baby fits over something that has fuck all to do with desktops, its an OS to get MSFT back into the educational market...again big whoop.

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ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
Re:Remember, kids by jeremyp · 2017-02-02 00:19 · Score: 1

That doesn't support your case at all. There's only one mention of Lotus on the page and it has nothing to do with crippling Lotus 123 from a technical point of view.
In fact, Lotus did it to themselves by failing to provide Win32 versions of their applications in a timely fashion.

--
All I want is a secure system where it's easy to do anything I want. Is that too much to ask ~~ Randall Munroe
Re:Remember, kids by JustBoo · 2017-02-02 03:09 · Score: 1

FAKE NEWS.
Re:Remember, kids by Spamalope · 2017-02-02 04:50 · Score: 1

Win32? What's that have to do with DOS? This happened in the 80s. Through at least the early 90s, when MS released a new product competing products were likely to start having 'issues'... like clockwork...

As I recall it was discovery in the Comes case vs MS that proved it. They'd had meetings to brainstorm ways to make competing software have continuous 'difficulties'. Through the 80s MS hadn't updated their operating system. Dos 3.3 needed all sort of helper software to be able to function with a network, mouse or any other driver. You'd use up the 640k of low memory and your application or game couldn't run. You needed a memory manager at least to be able to use the 640k-1024k area for the device drivers and to provide a memory interface to higher memory addresses. MS Dos 4 failed completely (early Vista?).

Digital equipment stepped in and made an advanced Dos that MS never reached feature parity with even with MS Dos 6 ( Dr. Dos ). Demand for storage had skyrocketed but hard drive pricing was stagnant. Processors had improved, so Stack made an innovative transparent hard drive compression system that loaded like a SCSI drive. Awesome stuff. So, MS created software that reported fake error messages if you used Dr. Dos and release MS Dos 6 with drive compression allegedly stolen from Stack. MS stalled the lawsuit from Stack until they ran out of money and folded. They tried that with Dr. Dos, but a lawfirm deep pockets managed to buy Dr. Dos and pursue the case. MS had been putting information about anti-competitive unlawful behavior in writing, which came out in that case. MS was behaving that way. It looks like MS sought single product profitable companies without a big cash reserve that couldn't complete a lawsuit if MS cut off their sales. Then take the product in some way, alter the OS to keep crashing with the victim product and use leverage with the sales channels to cut off opportunities to make sales. (later example - MS threatens to withhold Windows licenses from Compaq during Christmas if Compaq doesn't remove Quicken and replace it with MS Money on all PCs)
Re:Remember, kids by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 10:45 · Score: 0

Steam games don't have DRM by default. Blame the publisher.

Microsoft is making Steam worse? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 10:49 · Score: 0

Why won't Valve work to make it better? The non-big screen client hasn't seen a major update in forever, despite it demanding to update every time I look at it. Have you tried to use any of their Shift-Tab functionality on a 4K display? Now I understand why some users stuck to 1024x768 for so long.

Re:Microsoft is making Steam worse? by mrchaotica · 2017-02-01 11:49 · Score: 2

Why won't Valve work to make it better?
Because it would be AGAINST THE LAW. If Microsoft implemented DRM to disallow running non-"approved" programs and didn't "approve" Steam, Valve would have to break the DRM to make it work. Breaking DRM is a felony.
The DMCA and CFAA are assaults on the right to own property itself, because they subjugate the owner (of the computer)'s wishes to that of the copyright holder.

--
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Re:Microsoft is making Steam worse? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:04 · Score: 0

Valve can't dictate UWP policies, how do you expect them to fix the OS?
Re:Microsoft is making Steam worse? by gweihir · 2017-02-01 12:41 · Score: 2

If it works, don't fix it? You know, one of the most fundamental engineering principles?
Steam is essentially a package manager, launch-menu and a shop. It works. If your fancy, gold-plated uber 4k display (Why are you not on 8k? Obviously you are a lamer...) does not give you the best experience for that, then that is a very minor thing because this is not an application you use intensively.

--
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.

What kind of story... by Notabadguy · 2017-02-01 10:53 · Score: 5, Insightful

What kind of hack news site PICKS UP AN UNFOUNDED RUMOR...then runs a story on the unfounded rumor just to discredit the author of the rumor based on previous rumors.

What..the fuck kind of news for nerds is this gossipy whining?

Re:What kind of story... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:03 · Score: 1

It's the kind that you love so much that you registered an account and posted on the articles you hate, for YEARS, only ever contributing to /. ad revenue in the process.
Complain all you want, until you take your business elsewhere, you're part of the problem too.
Re:What kind of story... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:42 · Score: 0

He says with his seven digit user id.
Re:What kind of story... by evilviper · 2017-02-01 11:56 · Score: 4, Insightful

What..the fuck kind of news for nerds is this gossipy whining?
This site hasn't called itself "News for Nerds" in quite a few years now. Just look around and try to find that tag-line... It's long gone.
It's been one non-stop decline ever since the "Politics" section was created. First Sourceforge, then Dice, and now BizX have had no interest in the site's origins or credibility, and are only interested in the large audience they can abuse to drive-up ad impressions. Even clicking through to complain about what a shithole this place has become, is PROFIT for them, so they will keep it up. The trolls are profit, the paid shills are profit, the flood of crap on the front-page that has people yelling at their screen is profit for them. And that's the only thing they care about.
Sure the audience has continued declining, sure this place is a joke, sure in the long-term it's an increasingly less valuable property for the change, but they're going to cash-out as much as they can, as soon as they can, and not worry one bit about the smoldering ruin that's left.

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Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
Re:What kind of story... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:43 · Score: 0

This made it through Slashdot's Firehose.
That means it's not the news site, it's you and I who accepted this story.
If you don't like it, use the Firehose to upvote better things.
Re:What kind of story... by Trogre · 2017-02-01 13:16 · Score: 1

That's simply not true.
"News for nerds, stuff that matters" is still there in the title bar on the front page. It just doesn't make part of the logo any more.

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"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
Re:What kind of story... by rtb61 · 2017-02-01 13:20 · Score: 2

This is the kind of news people are forced to resort to, when corporations like M$ a lying pieces of shite. Lie, lie, lie, it's all they do, they are disgusting. Now they biggest lie of all, they have the right to install software on the computer that you bought, that you paud of the OS, against you will, against your rights, what a crock of shite. Basically screw M$ and it blatantly corrupt theft of user rights, it is the biggest abuse of the public by any corporation in history and being backed up by a corrupt US government.
No company has the right to force anything from you, not your energy, not you equipment, not your time, not your bandwidth and not your life (they do not own it and have no right to sell information about it). They are truly done as a corporation, something to be actively opposed and shut down.

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Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
Re:What kind of story... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:22 · Score: 0

fuck you we love fake news now... we are the left/sjw/snowflakes and you cannot stop us
Re:What kind of story... by ckatko · 2017-02-01 17:33 · Score: 1

Remember, #FakeNews is only Fake News if it comes from a conservative paper. Everyone else has a completely spotless record!
Re:What kind of story... by donaldm · 2017-02-01 19:07 · Score: 1

This is the kind of news people are forced to resort to, when corporations like M$ a lying pieces of shite. Lie, lie, lie, it's all they do, they are disgusting. Now they biggest lie of all, they have the right to install software on the computer that you bought, that you paud of the OS, against you will, against your rights, what a crock of shite. Basically screw M$ and it blatantly corrupt theft of user rights, it is the biggest abuse of the public by any corporation in history and being backed up by a corrupt US government.
No company has the right to force anything from you, not your energy, not you equipment, not your time, not your bandwidth and not your life (they do not own it and have no right to sell information about it). They are truly done as a corporation, something to be actively opposed and shut down.
I can understand "lock in" if you have a work PC since the company you work for dictates what type of PC you get as well as the operating system and applications you run on it. Obviously, if you are a senior Engineer then you can tell management to take a flying leap providing you can get your work done. Not many people have that luxury or power.
If you own the PC then you are quite correct you still have the right to decide on what operating system you put on it as well as the applications you run on it. If you have locked yourself into a proprietary operating system and applications then you have only yourself to blame.

--
There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
Re:What kind of story... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 23:20 · Score: 0

And therefor you claim that any fake news that you like must be wrongly classified by those evil liberals.
Meanwhile, CNN gets called Fake news (BY YOUR PRESIDENT), and you don't therefore believe that CNN is conservative.... Or that your pres is a liberal conservative-hating screw.
Right....
Re:What kind of story... by Feyshtey · 2017-02-02 00:36 · Score: 1

And then what kind of hack creates, and what other kind of hack fails to edit a /. summary that fails to mention a move like MS is making was (according to the article) targeted specifically at the Chrome education sector that desires the ability to lock down devices. That's a very key factor in this discussion that wasnt mentioned by the submitter or caught by the editors.

--
"But we have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it,..." - Nancy Pelosi
Re:What kind of story... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 01:27 · Score: 0

Might I suggest this as a suitable replacement ?
Re:What kind of story... by JustBoo · 2017-02-02 03:15 · Score: 1

What kind of hack news site PICKS UP AN UNFOUNDED RUMOR...then runs a story on the unfounded rumor just to discredit the author of the rumor based on previous rumors.[...]
]
Well for one, the Washington Post. And it's wholly owned by Jeff "Crazy Eyes" Bezos. Imagine that.
Re:What kind of story... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-03 06:29 · Score: 0

tl;dr: People can't, won't, and don't run websites for free.

But... by mindwhip · 2017-02-01 10:55 · Score: 1

.. they already have "a version of Windows [x] that can only install apps from the [Microsoft] Store" or Microsoft blessed disks and its called the XBOX [insert any version here].

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[The Universe] has gone offline.

10 cloud might have a place by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 10:59 · Score: 0

This won't be a popular opinion around here but I think the 'app store' model is a fine thing for consumers. They really do just want an easy way to get and use stuff. Average consumers are genuinely incapable of administering windows systems safely. (You and I can. But we're not average consumers) Jailed and isolated applications from trusted sources ARE safer because you can cryptographic ally ensure they are not tampered with.

Fortunately for Microsoft they have the money to bang at it for a decade until they finally get it right. UAP in windows 8/8.1 and RT was a complete shitshow. The store is a joke. The platform is a joke. The development environment was a clusterfuck.

Since windows 10 they've been improving things by leaps and bounds. Games actually work (And you can tab out of them in a blink, which is sort of impressive) and the store is less fuck-awful.

Windows 10 adds features and improvements with each major release and the UAP platform and the windows store do get better.

Know what would knock it out of the park? A UAP only windows that has certified 3rd party stores (Like steam) and INCLUDES access to free/oss applications. Microsoft could easily sacrifice some of that app store revenue to suck up marketshare. - This is, of course, all contingent on some big improvements to UAP.

Re:10 cloud might have a place by houstonbofh · 2017-02-01 11:08 · Score: 1

This won't be a popular opinion around here but I think the 'app store' model is a fine thing for consumers. They really do just want an easy way to get and use stuff. Average consumers are genuinely incapable of administering windows systems safely. (You and I can. But we're not average consumers)
The problem is that once they build it for the "Average Consumers" they take away everything else leaving the advanced users in the cold. Hence Windows 7 still being large, and Apple and Linux having some uptics. Of course Apple is doing their best to run off the power users too...
Re:10 cloud might have a place by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:10 · Score: 0

It's funny how Tim Sweeney has so much concern for Steam, and yet we never hear from Gay Ben about it much. I think Mr. Sweeney may have some other motive...
Re:10 cloud might have a place by blackest_k · 2017-02-01 11:41 · Score: 2

The best and safest way to make money from software is to be a gatekeeper
Google Apple MicroSoft Steam Facebook Amazon all gate keepers. Have you got an idea for some software a song to release a book to write? If you are successful these leeches will take 30% if not that is your loss. There is no downside being a gatekeeper.
Microsoft wants to muscle out Steam that is bad for us at least with 2 of them there may be competition. Better still when both are optional.

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Blarney Quality Restaurant, Plants
Re:10 cloud might have a place by UnknowingFool · 2017-02-01 12:14 · Score: 1

This won't be a popular opinion around here but I think the 'app store' model is a fine thing for consumers. They really do just want an easy way to get and use stuff. Average consumers are genuinely incapable of administering windows systems safely. (You and I can. But we're not average consumers) Jailed and isolated applications from trusted sources ARE safer because you can cryptographic ally ensure they are not tampered with.
So Windows Apps will have all the applications that an average consumer needs? Have you looked at the Windows Store? The selection and breadth of Windows Apps is a joke. The Windows Store does not even have Office, MS own flagship applications.

Fortunately for Microsoft they have the money to bang at it for a decade until they finally get it right. UAP in windows 8/8.1 and RT was a complete shitshow. The store is a joke. The platform is a joke. The development environment was a clusterfuck.
It still is. For many Windows developers, I don't think the Windows Store is much of a draw at the moment.

Since windows 10 they've been improving things by leaps and bounds. Games actually work (And you can tab out of them in a blink, which is sort of impressive) and the store is less fuck-awful.
Well when you low, anywhere higher is an improvement. "Games actually work" isn't much of a rousing mantra when they worked before.

Windows 10 adds features and improvements with each major release and the UAP platform and the windows store do get better.
At the same time, MS works diligently to crush those positive features by releasing ones that consumers do not want.

Know what would knock it out of the park? A UAP only windows that has certified 3rd party stores (Like steam) and INCLUDES access to free/oss applications. Microsoft could easily sacrifice some of that app store revenue to suck up marketshare. - This is, of course, all contingent on some big improvements to UAP.
That will never happen. MS wants to control everything about Windows after MS controls when your PC boots up after an update. Allowing a 3rd party store would be antithetical to that goal.

--
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
Re:10 cloud might have a place by stooo · 2017-02-02 00:13 · Score: 1

>> Re:10 cloud might have a place
That's right. it's place is here :
http://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws....

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aaaaaaa

...Crush Steam? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 10:59 · Score: 1

Well, at least that would pretty much guarantee the year of the Linux desktop.

Re:...Crush Steam? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 14:31 · Score: 0

That's why they have to do it slowly like boiling a frog
Re:...Crush Steam? by stooo · 2017-02-02 00:14 · Score: 1

So it'll be the decade of the Linux Gaming desktop ?

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aaaaaaa

When did Sweeny become Stallman? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:05 · Score: 0

It takes guts to stand up to a multibillion-dollar corporation that has a killswitch in its pocket for all your products.

As much as it pains me to take M$'s side . . . by mmell · 2017-02-01 11:07 · Score: 1

. . . not unlike their somewhat heavy-handed tactics in pushing Windows 10 out (and pushing out updates), this is actually Microsoft's best answer to the perception that their product is buggy and exploit-prone.

Let's set the wayback machine to the days of XP. Microsoft had to put up with a near-constant stream of complaints that many machines running XP were exploited and buggy. There was a lot of evidence to support this - but in many cases, the bugs and exploits were due to end-users not patching/updating their systems, making many old resolved exploits de facto zero-day exploits. In many instances, they were still being dogged by failures in downlevel versions of Windows. Support was similarly a nightmare, as even in enterprise settings they could not entirely count on end-users running a known version of Windows - oh, sure, "95, ME, XP", "Pro/Enterprise/Server" . . . but even within that specification there existed a whole spectrum of patch levels - even extending to some tiny subset of users actively preventing the installation of specific patches - decisions being made not by IT professionals, but often by end-users.

With Microsoft's forceful insistence that everyone upgrade to Windows 10 (and a similar coercion to apply all patches and updates), Microsoft can now be at least somewhat confident that the vast majority of desktop systems running their OS are running the same OS, patches and all. Granted, this leads to some real problems (such as the debacle surrounding the forced uninstallation of software Microsoft doesn't want running on their systems), but it also means that they don't have literally thousands of systems running Windows 8/Windows 10 which are vulnerable to an exploit they closed several months ago. It also means that when they hear about a bug or exploit, they can be reasonably sure that they haven't already fixed the problem once. Finally, it means that they don't have to rely upon end-user expertise to differentiate between valid software and Trojan horses (not that I entirely trust Microsoft in this regard, but then neither do I trust Google or Apple to do a perfect job in this respect).

A great number of people take great delight in pointing out every unpopular action by Microsoft - and often, they are right - but if you insist that Microsoft fix PEBKAC errors, you lose the right to complain about them removing en masse the end-user's ability to choose for themselves how their systems will be configured, patched and maintained.

Oh - I'll bet you thought that "My Computer" meant it was yours. The hardware is yours, the data arguably so. Licensed software is not yours - you just have permission to use it. This includes the OS if you're running MS-Windows. It's sort of like American freedom - you're willing to surrender some freedom to be kept safe, get used to not having your freedom anymore. Pick your poison, but don't cry like a child with a skinned knee when you can't have both.

Just to point out a relevant parallel - Google just pushed out an update to the Android Google Voice app client - and took away the widget. I was using that widget and I'm very unhappy with their decision. I've sent feedback to Google asking that they restore widget functionality to the app. This is only the most recent example of such activity by Google - where's the hue and cry over that?

Re:As much as it pains me to take M$'s side . . . by mrchaotica · 2017-02-01 11:55 · Score: 1

. . . not unlike their somewhat heavy-handed tactics in pushing Windows 10 out (and pushing out updates), this is actually Microsoft's best answer to the perception that their product is buggy and exploit-prone.
Who gives a shit? I'll take buggy and exploit prone over treating the owner of the goddamn computer as a hostile enemy and/or a slave to be exploited any day!
Any company who decides their copyright should overrule the device owner's actual property rights must be destroyed for the good of society.

--
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Re:As much as it pains me to take M$'s side . . . by Billly+Gates · 2017-02-01 12:06 · Score: 1

But what happens to the "personal" in personal computers? I shuddered 10 years ago when slashdoter LOVED iOS and Android but bashed Windows for control??? Really?!
With Windows you can at least talk to your hardware and do what you want on it. True it's harder due to security as security and UAC block things but you can work around.

--
http://saveie6.com/
Re:As much as it pains me to take M$'s side . . . by myrdos2 · 2017-02-01 12:19 · Score: 1

Oh - I'll bet you thought that "My Computer" meant it was yours.
It does.
The hardware is yours, the data arguably so.
The data is also mine. Who are these people arguing otherwise?
Licensed software is not yours - you just have permission to use it.
Sad but true. I have never seen such a clear-cut argument as to why operating systems shouldn't be licensed.
I've sent feedback to Google asking that they restore widget functionality to the app. This is only the most recent example of such activity by Google - where's the hue and cry over that?
Android isn't locked down, so you are able to choose a competing voice app. If Google's changes become too obnoxious, their user base will dwindle. In that way customers still have a small say about what goes on in their device. If you must get your apps only from the vendor-approved store, then you are completely at the vendor's mercy. There is no competition.
but if you insist that Microsoft fix PEBKAC errors, you lose the right to complain about them removing en masse the end-user's ability to choose for themselves how their systems will be configured, patched and maintained.
You are solving the problem of PEBKAC errors, but introducing tremendous ability for software vendors to harm you. You no longer have control over your own machine. You will pay what they tell you to pay, and put up with whatever they tell you to put up with. If they want to spy on you they will do so. If they want to insert ads into apps they will do so. If they want to move you to a subscription... etc.
I can see the appeal of such a system in constrained environments like school netbooks and gaming consoles. Much less maintenance. But it must never make its way into general-purpose computers. Especially now that much of our news, media and socializing is routed through it. No one company should have control over all of that.
Re:As much as it pains me to take M$'s side . . . by BlueTemplar · 2017-02-02 12:18 · Score: 1

Personal Computing is dead.
Welcome to the era of Platform Computing.
Enjoy our App Store, and don't worry, we'll take care of everything for you!

Windows store is to locked down for games by Joe_Dragon · 2017-02-01 11:09 · Score: 1

Windows store is to locked down for games (sandboxing) to work like stream and do they have any thing like the workshop?

Same kind that is making SoylentNews sick... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:11 · Score: 1

It's this BeauHD guy who posts crap like this to *BOTH* sites, and somehow the staff on each just let it happen (For the record, SN is probably a bit more friendly to the conservative crowd (outside a few LGBT/SJW types) than slash nowadays, but similiarly containing of sensationalistic crap from serial posters like BeauHD.

It's like Roland Paqpiquille(sp) and company all over again!

Re:Same kind that is making SoylentNews sick... by Notabadguy · 2017-02-01 11:56 · Score: 1

BeauHD is some next level shitposting though.
Re:Same kind that is making SoylentNews sick... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 17:37 · Score: 0

I always called him "Pickle pail" in my mind.

You can install SteamOS on Chromebooks by NotInHere · 2017-02-01 11:12 · Score: 5, Interesting

You can install Steam OS on Chromebooks, just as you can on Windows machines. Its just the game industry that needs to support Steam OS, and he isn't locked in to Microsoft any more. And no, he won't be locked into Steam OS either, because if they start demanding more, he can just clone Ubuntu himself and distribute his game as OS. As long as new computers will allow free OS choice, there is no problem.

Re:You can install SteamOS on Chromebooks by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:05 · Score: 0

As long as new computers will allow free OS choice, there is no problem.

This is akin to saying "if your landlord unacceptably changes your residential agreement, no problem, you can just move somewhere else".

Except, merely having to relocate all your physical goods to another home, is much -less- of an imposition of time loss than reinstalling all your applications and data for those which are available on Ubuntu, learning entirely new applications for your previously-known applications' functionality for those only with a category equivalence, and just going without the functionality with no Ubuntu equivalents.

A little more than "no problem".
Re:You can install SteamOS on Chromebooks by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:19 · Score: 0

As long as new computers will allow free OS choice
getting harder every day unless you build yourself. more and more systems from the major manufacturers are coming with "signature edition" of windows 10, which *requires* bios lockdown and cannot run anything else.
Re:You can install SteamOS on Chromebooks by Opportunist · 2017-02-01 12:34 · Score: 2, Insightful

At some point, though, it becomes less of a hassle to just move out and into another apartment before putting up with an abusive and batshit insane landlord any longer.
Especially if the new apartment is in a nicer neighborhood, has lower rent and better locks at the doors.

--
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Re:You can install SteamOS on Chromebooks by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 15:33 · Score: 0

+1 from parent poster.

But Tim's okay with iOS? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:15 · Score: 1

Tim's love and defense for Steam is admirable, but it's hard to take him seriously while he actively develops apps for iOS, which is the ultimate walled garden.

Re:But Tim's okay with iOS? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:56 · Score: 0

iOS didn't close up a previously open OS
Re:But Tim's okay with iOS? by Opportunist · 2017-02-01 12:34 · Score: 1

iOS is easy to avoid. Unlike Windows.

--
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Re:But Tim's okay with iOS? by tepples · 2017-02-01 12:34 · Score: 1

What was then known as iPhone OS closed up what was then known as Mac OS X.
Re:But Tim's okay with iOS? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 02:00 · Score: 0

When did iOS come to desktops and laptops?

Cloud version by phorm · 2017-02-01 11:21 · Score: 1

If it's running in "the cloud" I doubt people will be playing games on it anyhow. Some things are best done locally with appropriate hardwar.e

Re:Cloud version by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:26 · Score: 0

> If it's running in "the cloud" ...
I don't think that is is 'running in the cloud'. Microsoft have just stuck a trendy name on it. Microsoft wants to sell all the programs that will run on this from their Store.

Windows Vaporware Edition by fibonacci8 · 2017-02-01 11:26 · Score: 0

We get it, you vape.

--
Inheritance is the sincerest form of nepotism.

DO IT! Lock out every other means of install! by pecosdave · 2017-02-01 11:43 · Score: 2

I've been waiting for SteamOS to seriously take off.

For SteamOS to seriously take off DEVELOPERS HAVE TO EMBRACE LINUX.

For that to happen they need a good kick in the ass. Microsoft pissing them off would be a good kick in the ass. I haven't had a Windows machine since Win 2000 was still new up until about a month ago. I got tired of waiting for the promised Linux port of Giana Sisters Twisted Dreams, not to mention I'm really looking forward to South Park the Fractured But Whole, both of which are Windows only. I built a Wintendo with a monitor emulator plug so it just sits there and runs steam for Steam Casting to my Linux machine and the Steam Link I picked up for $20.

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Fails to understand? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:44 · Score: 0

I get the feeling the only one who "fails to understand" is the whore who wrote the summary. Seems to know everything about deepthroating though.

Steam needs some work by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:44 · Score: 0

How about they fix the Steam client so that you can read the text on a high resolution display? Many gamers now have 2K or 4K screens, and the text does not scale, which is very slack really.

Path to mobile by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:48 · Score: 0

Rumor or no, this sounds like a path for MS's continuing hope to become relevant in the mobile world. Too many business types trying to lead the way, rather than good solid useful tech. Build something useful and people will buy it. Try to predict and even dictate what you want them to want and you've drastically reduced your chance of success. Not to mention the horrible tech mess you'll create.

Did he not see Windows RT by jader3rd · 2017-02-01 11:54 · Score: 1

Didn't he raise the same fears about Windows 8 RT? Aren't they equally as valid now? Does he really think that the engineers building Windows are primarily focused on destroying Steam?

Re:Did he not see Windows RT by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:11 · Score: 0

No they're focused on usurping Steam

What to do when Win32 is deprecated by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 11:58 · Score: 0

...and UWP is all that will run on Windows? Presumably MS will start disabling sideloading on specific devices...

Re:What to do when Win32 is deprecated by gweihir · 2017-02-01 12:53 · Score: 1

Have one computer for whatever is only available on Windows, and a different computer for the rest. Sounds extreme, but I do not really see any other sane option.
I plan to lock Win7 into a non-networked VM with Office for the rare cases I have to work on a word-document, win10 on a separate computer only for gaming with no email or browsing except gaming-related, and a Linux-box for everything else.

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Until there's Visual Studio UWP Edition by tepples · 2017-02-01 12:21 · Score: 1

You might think Windows 10 Cloud would be ideal for a K-12 student. But then he takes a programming class in high school and discovers that neither Visual Studio nor any other major IDE with a compiler is available through Windows Store. What's he supposed to do then?

Re:Until there's Visual Studio UWP Edition by BlueTemplar · 2017-02-02 12:11 · Score: 1

I'm willing to bet that there will be a Metro version of Visual Studio within 5 years. Then Microsoft, with their own teams using Metro exclusively, will be able to ditch Windows for good.
Re:Until there's Visual Studio UWP Edition by Blaskowicz · 2017-02-02 15:18 · Score: 1

Then he should use an X server written in javascript, I suppose.
Re:Until there's Visual Studio UWP Edition by tepples · 2017-02-03 03:47 · Score: 1

And run the clients on what, particularly when a student's parents don't subscribe to high-speed Internet at home? In case you meant that the student should use an X server on a Windows 10 Cloud laptop to view an IDE running on an application server operated by the school through LTE tethering, that tends to run $10 per GB in Microsoft's home country. How much data per hour does an X server transfer when running a popular IDE?

On a dev mode Chromebook, data loss is the default by tepples · 2017-02-01 12:26 · Score: 1

You can install Steam OS on Chromebooks

How so? I thought installing another operating system on a Chromebook was possible only if the firmware is set to developer mode, and if the firmware is set to developer mode, it prompts whoever turns it on to press Space then Enter to wipe everything. Someone who picks up your laptop and turns it on won't know to press Ctrl+D or wait 30 seconds for the beeping to stop waking others sleeping in the same household. Instead, he or she will just do what the screen says, not knowing or not caring about the ensuing data loss.

What the fsck?!? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:28 · Score: 0

> "Sweeney also fails to consider what happens should the Chromebook threat go unaddressed: Chromebooks running Chrome OS will proliferate. These machines will not support third-party stores, they will not support Steam, and they will not support PC games at all."

Hi, MS minion, how has been your day? Good, I hope.

Android is also Linux and AFAIU a lot more closed than Chrome OS; I use F-Droid, could use other stores if I wanted and surely Steam will have no problem offering software for Android.

Did things change overnight and Chromebooks got more locked in than Android? Does Crouton not work anymore? (this is not good enough for me, but I find it a tad easier for running Linux than installing Cy... Legacy OS on an Android tablet).

That said, Sweeney is probably as old as I am and more knowledgeable than me about all that dirty MS Politics. He certainly does not need to be corrected on his perception of such "moves".

This has been going on since when? 1984?

Steam should have come to Linux 5 to 10 years earlier; now, they should work on their Marketing skills to get attention to Linux support just like those Humble Bundles of recent fame. Partnering with hardware makers to promote affordable powerful machines for the best games. I have a gamer daughter, I know what I'm talking about, and she's running Windows... the single person in the house who uses that "excellent" OS.

Adobe tried to be friends with Windows. Look what they got. Lie down with dogs...

Echoes of the 80's? by thinkwaitfast · 2017-02-01 12:41 · Score: 1

DOS ain't done till 1-2-3 won't run.

Short lived title by theendlessnow · 2017-02-01 12:46 · Score: 1

When Windows 11 is released the old release will be called 'Windows 10 Steaming Pile of Crap Edition'.

Fuck M$, Fuck closed source! by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 12:54 · Score: 0

Not buying games that cannot run on linux. Thats why steam on linux is awesome.

A game that only runs on win10 will never see any money from me.
Fuck the 10000000 remake of an old classic.

This is true by waspleg · 2017-02-01 13:06 · Score: 4, Interesting

for the moment. My percentage of games that will run under Linux is (very) slowly but steadily increasing.

Re:DO IT! Lock out every other means of install! by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:12 · Score: 0

While I agree with what you are saying - this could also spectacularly backfire.

Also as for ChromeOS before Android applications: by aliquis · 2017-02-01 13:18 · Score: 1

It's terrible and not competition to Windows!!

Turn Windows into ChromeOS and chances are I'll make the switch back to Linux.

Whatever turning Windows into something with Windows store only is enough for that .. Maybe. I unlikely want to lose all chance to tinker with the main computer so to say.

The openness of the PC is what make it so great. Talk all you want about closed source OS but the platform has been pretty accessible anyway... at-least relative what one could imagine by now ...

"The Sony home-computer!" ..

Steam App by b783719 · 2017-02-01 13:30 · Score: 1

Technically, Valve can create a Steam Android app store just like Amazon to distribute android apps.

Unfortunately, you can't do the same for Windows Store just like Apple Store wall garden.

As a digital distribution platform, Valve knew Steam would be cut off if Microsoft implement the Windows Store wall garden. It is no wonder they rushed in to create the SteamOS just in case things turn for the worst.

Take a fucking chill pill dude... by XSportSeeker · 2017-02-01 13:30 · Score: 1

As far as I know, the whole Windows 10 cloud rumors came from a piece of code that indicates that there might be a version of Windows 10 codenamed cloud...
Anyone that goes as far as assuming and then proceeding to cuss at a company because of speculative information leaked in a piece of code should be looked upon and considered a crazy paranoid maniac. Your agenda is showing Sweeney. Get yourself a better hobby, this one is unhealthy for you.

The Ars Technica article isn't doing any better on that front too.

Have people lost their critical reasoning and minds these days?

Re:On a dev mode Chromebook, data loss is the defa by NotInHere · 2017-02-01 13:39 · Score: 1

Interesting, didn't know of this. I've done some reading and apparently there is a "soft" developer mode and a "hard" developer mode. The "soft" developer mode invokes pressing some keys and buttons to install a different OS, the "hard" developer mode involves changing the BIOS write protect flag by turning a screw/setting a jumper and then flashing a new firmware (Chrome OS has open source firmware so this is possible). With hard developer mode I think you can simply edit the firmware source code (if there aren't edited versions out there) to remove that check. Its not easy but its doable.

Probably not something you'd want your users to do :). But it could be outsourced to some shop. You send your laptop in, they turn that screw, unlock the firmware, send it back. 20 bucks plus shipping.

Support development of WINE by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 13:48 · Score: 0

If Steam helped develop WINE Windows might not matter.

Crush Steam Edition? by Gravis+Zero · 2017-02-01 13:54 · Score: 1

I guess that makes the non-Cloud version Pound Sand Edition. ;)

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Re:DO IT! Lock out every other means of install! by supremebob · 2017-02-01 14:02 · Score: 1

Yeah, if Sweeney hates Windows so much, why doesn't his team put more effort in making Steam OS better? The last time I tried it a few months ago, it was still pretty rough and the game selection was pretty puny.

Vulkan by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 14:05 · Score: 0

Support it and maybe Linux will finally have a good push into being an acceptable gaming OS.

MS can't use DRM to lock out linux and even then by Joe_Dragon · 2017-02-01 14:08 · Score: 1

MS can't use DRM to lock out linux and even then no way that supermicro will lockout vmware or linux.

Support and use the Vulkan API then by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 14:10 · Score: 1

Then together with Valve (if they decide to make games instead of just selling them) Microsoft can crater into insignifacance and Linux variants can finally get a good push into the desktop OS of choice for gaming and general desktop PC for work or other entertainment.

You have Windows becoming an appliance by Pope+Raymond+Lama · 2017-02-01 14:46 · Score: 1

So -WIndows 10 cloud is about an appliance were the users can't even control which programs to run (previous instances of Windows Stores had virtually no apps) - and you have basically Ars Technica just licking Microsoft boots and endorsing it to very last bit. The only thing left to wonder is how much of Ars Technica revenue comes directly from Microsoft Marketing department.

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Shill... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 15:27 · Score: 0

What a bunch of bull... this article took a page from shill town. First, no, Sweeney wasn't incorrect in his claim, MS backed down (sort of). Secondly, ChromeOS is opensource and allows sideload. How is this an article?!

Gabe with Valve warned everyone this was coming... by rahvin112 · 2017-02-01 15:28 · Score: 1

Gabe with Valve warned everyone when Microsoft introduced the windows store that they'd eventually try to kill outside software distribution. It's the entire reason he built SteamOS. Tim and the other game company CEO's happily dissed SteamOS for years.

Microsoft is going to try to kill outside distribution. They might even succeed.

Bill Gates is worth $80 BILLION by Thrustworthy · 2017-02-01 15:54 · Score: 1

And there is no stopping him now. After getting a slap on the wrist for the browser wars we're still fighting that battle. He took down WordPerfect, Novell, SCO and Caldera. Ray Noorda's daughter committed suicide over it. Now there is no stopping him that he's Warren Buffet's new pinochle partner since Buffet became a widower.

Steam to become Windows Store by The_Myth · 2017-02-01 16:47 · Score: 1

So what does he want? Is he pissed that Microsoft didn't just use Steam instead of the Windows Store?

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Don't threaten my monopoly!!! by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 17:22 · Score: 1

So he's basically saying "It took me a lot of hard work to establish my monopoly and I would be pissed if Microsoft does anything that could perceptually threaten my monopoly"

Re:Don't threaten my monopoly!!! by Wootery · 2017-02-01 23:08 · Score: 1

Uh... Tim Sweeney is the founder of Epic Games. He doesn't run Valve.

Re:Gabe with Valve warned everyone this was coming by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 19:10 · Score: 0

Microsoft is going to try to kill outside distribution. They might even succeed.

They will succeed.

TL;DR for the excerpt: by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 20:19 · Score: 0

Some random bloke is criticizing Windows, but he's wrong because WINDOWS GOES TO 11.

No, this ain't a Microsoft shill. Oh, no.

Still Nadellas words resounding in my ears, that we should just "trust them". Why should we, again?

Tim Sweeny was incorrect, fine. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-01 23:12 · Score: 0

But it's less wrong than when Ballmer called Linux a cancer and MS were touting the GPL as viral. Lets keep it real: CEOs and the like say any old shit to prop up their business or bring another down, and we have to remember the adage "Those who live by the sword die by the sword". If MS had complained about Sweeney being wrong, it could have been "People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones".

Re:MS can't use DRM to lock out linux and even the by stooo · 2017-02-02 00:09 · Score: 1

Nice try but no.
MS can revoke Linux boot at any time with UEFI "secureboot" key revocation

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Re:MS can't use DRM to lock out linux and even the by Joe_Dragon · 2017-02-02 01:28 · Score: 1

but will super micro and others give in? Maybe dell but not for servers.

Re:MS can't use DRM to lock out linux and even the by Cederic · 2017-02-02 02:35 · Score: 1

I'm not sure even Microsoft could survive the resultant lawsuits.

Another way of looking at it by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 02:35 · Score: 0

I think windows wants a profitable App Store like Apple has, not necessarily to crush steam.

It all depends on whether Windows allows apps that sell other software.

Both the Apple's App Store and Steam have barred the selling of apps that include a store for selling content. (Apple shut down Comixology, Steam booted Dragon Age 2 for having a real money store.

So it wouldn't be unique to windows if they did do it...

That said, I would never install windows on a machine that didn't give me access to my existing Steam library. Absolutely no point.

Ooh, And How Do They Do That? by Greyfox · 2017-02-02 03:06 · Score: 1

And how exactly does Windows crush steam? Microsoft's strategy appears to be to make the user's computer increasingly inconvenient to use, to the point where even non-technical users are starting to realize that their operating system choice is a problem. In the mean time, steam is adding more and more games for non-windows platform. The only game I'm currently missing, having not booted my computer back to windows for months, is the ability to play a native Linux version of Skyrim. Well, that and having to reboot my computer whenever Microsoft feels that I should be compelled to.

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Tablet with keyboard as laptop substitute by tepples · 2017-02-02 04:24 · Score: 1

iOS is not on desktops quite yet, but it is on a laptop of sorts. Some analysts seem to be under the impression that an iPad with a keyboard cover can replace a laptop for many users.

Re:On a dev mode Chromebook, data loss is the defa by squiggleslash · 2017-02-02 05:26 · Score: 1

It's a little complex, but yeah, your choices are:

- Boot in developer mode, some customization possible but essentially you're stuck in ChromeOS and can easily have your system wiped.
- Boot in dev mode with a modified BIOS, alternative operating system allowed but in a very user unfriendly way (you need to hit CTRL-L, which isn't documented or shown on screen, to boot the alternative OS, for example.)
- Boot with the BIOS replaced completely with an open source alternative. This effectively turns it into a regular Wintel laptop, and you can install a regular GNU/Linux distribution - maybe even Windows, I have no idea, but you can no longer dual boot with ChromeOS (ChromiumOS might be possible, not sure.)

More information here.

It is, to be honest, a horrible process running something other than ChromeOS on a Chromebook. I suspect that's why Crouton is so popular - it's a kludge, and has severe limitations, but it at least means you can stick with ChromeOS handling everything. But obviously, if you do that, there's the huge risk of someone booting up your device and wiping everything out because it boots up in vanilla developer mode.

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Attempts to strangle small biz too imo... apk by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 06:11 · Score: 0

See my subject: FORCING folks to install from "appstore" only - what about guys doing shareware/freeware that's NOT in the 'appstore'? I've NEVER done it that way (nor do I care to - MS 'forces' a LOT of utter bs on devs, like apps MUST from from %Program Files% etc. which does NOT have to be that way, apps still run off their OWN folder off root for example - it's not like they don't OR won't!).

I remember when (circa 1994-1998 or so) when freeware/shareware forums hosted NOTHING BUT that - no "corporate ware" but AFTER THAT? The "big boys" INVADED OUR SPACE competing with us!

I guess "that's ok" if THEY do that but we can't distribute our OWN wares OR HAVE THEM INSTALL & RUN on the NOT SELLING @ ALL forced on users BULLSHIT WARE that has been Windows since VISTA to present!

APK

P.S.=> No, I see this for WHAT IT IS - market control, nothing more per my subject line above: KEEP "SHOOTING YOURSELF IN THE FOOT MS" - you're not doing well doing it, Win10 is the MAIN proof thereof... apk

Re:DO IT! Lock out every other means of install! by pecosdave · 2017-02-02 06:47 · Score: 1

I'm an avid Humble Bundler and I've been a Linux Gamer since my only real option was Quake, Unreal, and whatever Loki ported.

There is a HUGE and awesome selection of Linux compatible games on Steam.

Fine, not every AAA title you want is there, in fact being a AAA title tends to reduce the likelihood that it will be available on Linux AKA Steam OS, but the "shotgun buying" approach of the Humble Bundle has gotten me to try a bunch of titles I probably wouldn't have looked at otherwise and I've loved some of them.

I have got 716 games in my Steam Library - most of which were straight from the Humble Bundle, probably 690ish or so. Of that - I'm not at home so my counts not exact, 415 or so work on Linux, some of those are AAA titles, both Portals, some Star Wars games, Tomb Raider (the remake), Goat Simulator....

Among the 300 or so titles are the ones that annoy me the most. Among those that are in my Steam Library are a couple of games that work great on Linux, but aren't available for Linux on Steam. The original Bittrip Runner for example (we won't talk about how the Bitrip guys completely ignore Steam control settings and do their own thing making anything but an XBOX control useless without 3rd party software), Unreal Tournament 2004, Quake 3 - which I bought the metal tin Linux version of, Unreal Tournament 2004, all work on Linux by means other than Steam but not with Steam. I know Unreal shouldn't be difficult, one of the games I have that works on everything is Brütal Legend, which uses the Unreal Engine.

The ones that annoy me most are emulator/engine based games. Among the games I have that work on everything are a bunch of kids games, Freddy The Fish, Pajama Sam, that sort of thing for my kids, along with Gabriel Knight, Broken Sword and Tex Murphy games that run Scumm or something akin to it. I have Pajama Sam games that work on the the Play Station, Mac OS X, Mac OS 9 and some previous, Win 3.11, Linux, Windows NT platforms, you name it. They work because of the engine underneath. I have the Mortal Kombat arcade collection. I can play the Arcade ROMs on any OS I want if I want to be a pirate, but I bought the games instead. I have to play them on Windows because I bought them. THIS IS WHY PEOPLE PIRATE. You can't tell me that a AAA company doesn't have the budget to make arcade ROMs that already work on just about any OS or type of processor I want using questionable means legal on three different OS's that's pretty close to being just 2 since BSD and Linux are so similar while Freddy the Fish can work on anything I want it to - including Android. (granted the Android version didn't come from Steam - but that should be the next area Valve looks at)

No, some motivation is what is needed, I think Microsoft repeating the "IE Only" style mistake with video games would be a good start.

I'm happy to report some games that I've acquired at earlier dates as part of a bundle eventually became compatible with Steam OS/Linux. I think one or both of the Torchlight games and at least two Star Wars games had this happen. (Still not Giana Sisters despite the promise)

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Gamers on ChromeOS? by Wokan · 2017-02-02 09:49 · Score: 1

Really? Are they hard core candy crushers or something? I get that you can play Quake in a browser these days, but do you see any serious gaming happening on a Chromebook?

Streisand Effect by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-02 10:35 · Score: 0

I am G-D Tim Sweeney! You must listen to me roar! All You Sheeple are in the Extreme Danger!!

Microsoft operates in a competitive marketplace. If they produce good stuff, they will be rewarded. Fail to do so and you get Windows Vista (or 8). This isn't the 90's anymore Tim...

Also, Tim's concern for Steam is lovely and all, but there are more issues in play than for a games marketplace.

Microsoft's Evil Empire reputation doesn't fit anymore, though you'd not notice that from Tim's rants, or from much of the crowd here on /. The entire first generation of MS leaders are long gone. Apple is a formidable competitor again, also unlike the 90's. Microsoft has faceplanted in smartphones. The critics of Microsoft are established and vocal. Microsoft is experimenting with Bash shells, and actively commits to Open Source. Linux is more than a toy and has areas of deep market acceptance.

Really Tim, check the calendar and get some up-to-date news sources. Get outside and get some fresh air and sunshine; I'm concerned for you.

Re:DO IT! Lock out every other means of install! by erapert · 2017-02-03 06:36 · Score: 1

Take a look at the games that already run on Steam on Linux.
There's quite a few AAA titles and many B-list titles and many many indie titles.
Anecdotally, Alien Isolation, Chivalry, XCOM 1 and 2, Total War Empire and Attilla, Rocket League, Metro 2033, and Deus Ex: Human Revolution all run quite well.
I also play about a dozen indie titles.

There's literally more games for Linux now than I have the time to play or money to buy and more coming out every week.
What more could you ask for?

just ignore this edition by Anonymous Coward · 2017-02-03 16:25 · Score: 0

I'll turn folks over to ltsb. I have never even seen the Windows store. Linux for my servers and personal stations.

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Tim Sweeney Dislikes Windows 10 Cloud Rumors, Calls OS 'Crush Steam Edition' (arstechnica.com)

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