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Interns at Facebook, Google Out-Earn the Average American (axios.com)
Alayna Treene, writing for Axios: Long gone are the days of unpaid internships, at least at these 25 companies who are paying interns more than what the average American earns. Tech and finance interns in particular -- including at Google, Bloomberg, BlackRock, and Facebook -- earn more per month than the average American, according to data released by Glassdoor Tuesday.
There are plenty of fields where employees, interns or otherwise, outpace the salaries of the vast majority of Americans; however, put into context, interns at companies based in Silicon Valley are making just about the median income for the area and about 1/3 above the Californian median.
I am not sure what this is supposed to tell us, honestly. Companies wanting to attract top talent need to pay decent wages. Clearly the marketplace is competitive, even pre-graduation, especially for those coming out of top-tier schools with advanced degrees.
I mean, it's very nice that everyone wants to have income equality; however, let's dispel with the notion it's going to happen anytime soon and move along.
and the cost of living in the bay area is very high out there 60K is crap.
Other places 50-60K is good!
And some of these interns have masters degrees or better.
The article's main point seems to be complaining about income inequality in general which is a complaint of equality of outcomes. Focusing on outcomes never seems to work. The war on poverty has killed too many poor people. More focus on opportunity and let people work out their own outcomes.
MANY internships in California are state subsidized as well. "Intern to Learn" is a current program.
So the amount of money they're making has nothing really to do with skills, job market or even what the company pays, as there is often MORE piled on from taxpayer pools/grants/Federal programs, etc.
Many prominent companies offer free housing accommodations for interns. Companies in the Bay Area do the same. Sometimes, you might even get free meals and transportation included in your intern package.
I make $50K+ per year doing IT Support in Silicon Valley by living a modest lifestyle. If you want to live the American Dream of having it all (big house, big cars, big wife and big kids), living here gets expensive in a hurry.
When I did my six month software testing internship at Fujitsu, I got paid $10 per hour on a six-contract because they didn't have enough money in the budget for a full-time staffer.
and the cost of living in the bay area is very high out there 60K is crap.
My company in San Jose rents a five bedroom house for the summer, within walking distance of our offices. Interns bunk two to a room. This free housing makes it much easier to recruit interns from outside the Bay Area, because they save more of their pay and they don't have to look for housing (which is a major time-wasting hassle in SV).
interns there, when you take other things into consideration such as free housing, free food, free laptop, etc. actually get more than many employees of these companies - and I'm saying engineers.
interning there is a great, great deal.
100k usd in SF was considered low incoming recently (thats a little over 8k/mo), according to another slashdot linked article. and it's probably true.
4500usd/mo housing for a small 1 bed room
35%+ taxes
8.75% tax on purchases
so.. 100k-54k = 46k.. - 35% (and thats a low estimate) = 30k left over of utilities, food, car, insurance, etc.
Ah, that helps explain why so many Big Tech websites are slow as molasses on a two-year-old phone. I bet none of the interns is running a $40 SoC Android device from Walmart.
n.b.: lots of your potential customers* are buying those devices right now.
* you may know 'customers' by the more familiar term 'eyeballs' /s
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
The poverty level for a family of 4 in san fran is 100k per year.
This more 'shit on the poor by pretending they are rich' bait.
These are arguably in the top 5 of companies at the center of a massive Second Dotcom Bubble. Of course they're going to pay their interns a lot:
- Cost of living in SV, even temporarily, is more than just about anywhere else in the country
- Google and Facebook do most of their hiring from Stanford and other top 10 private-school computer science and engineering departments. People who can afford to go there on their own will expect at least what an investment bank or management consultancy is willing to pay them for an internship. People who are smart enough to get into a private school on an academic scholarship are also probably worth paying that kind of money for.
Two other industries, law and investment banking, are famous for internships that pay handsomely.
- Big law firms will recruit interns from the top of the class of only the Top 14 law schools in the country. They put them up in New York City, pay them a comparatively large salary, and basically spend the summer shuttling them between parties and events while giving them some token work to do. And if they find they like you, starting salary is $180K nowadays. Too bad you have to be at the top of your class at Harvard, Yale or Stanford to get "drafted" like this.
- Investment banks take on "associates" either while they're getting their MBA or just after. Again, only the top business school grads need apply. The difference is that they work their associates 100-hour weeks doing menial processing tasks for years. If you work out you're in the "cannot fail" club for life, but the route there is quite different from the law firm crowd.
So, I wouldn't get too bent out of shape over this. Plum internships at hot companies aren't the norm. Media and publishing interns often get _nothing_ for a huge amount of very menial work.
Internships are really extended multi-month job interviews. That is how my company sees them, and that is how interns should see them. We never offer an internship to someone that we would not want to hire as a permanent employee. After graduation, we offer jobs to about 60% of our former interns, and most of them accept. We make NO job offers to any other graduates.
So the competition for the best interns is really a competition for the best future employees. The competition is fierce, and the best students usually have multiple internship offers.
Students that don't intern, and expect to just magically find a job after they graduate, are idiots.
"Long gone are the days of unpaid internships"
LOL
check this guy out
"Long gone are the days of unpaid internships"
ROFL
one more time in case you missed it:
"Long gone are the days of unpaid internships"
HAW!
Google it. Which feels iconic in this context.
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Not sure how many people want a big wife
Exactly, I've looked at job offers in big cities and when I do a cost of living comparison I'm better off staying where I am. 95K a year in a town where 1k a month can get you a 3000sq foot home on a half acre of land, or 110k a year in a city where 2k a month gets you a small apartment....
Not sure how many people want a big wife
You can't have big kids without a big wife. There are always exceptions to the rule. My parents were skinny as can be when they had me as a ten-pound bowling ball and brought me home in a bowling bag.
Many degrees require an internship -> Look at education majors. This makes internships very competitive, if you don't get one you don't graduate. That means the employer has all the power in the transaction, oh you want to make minimum wage - we have another applicant that will take the job for free, you want to work for free, we have an applicant that will pay us to train them.
Many degrees require an internship -> Look at education majors. This makes internships very competitive, if you don't get one you don't graduate. That means the employer has all the power in the transaction, oh you want to make minimum wage - we have another applicant that will take the job for free, you want to work for free, we have an applicant that will pay us to train them.
In many other environments, who you have worked for in the past matters more than current skills. Oh you didn't carry coffee for a top magazine, politician, judge... why should we let you work for us? These also tend to be unpaid.
Now really what you want to see out of an internship is the company provides value to them (You interned at Google, cool) and you provide value to the company (Wow, look at the code you produced in 3 months for our project). This leads to an environment that is paid and provides a valid working experience rather than how many unpaid people do you have around to take up empty office space.
Many industries need to look at their intern programs, re-evaluate them and begin to pay at a minimum Minimum Wage. In many other environments, who you have worked for in the past matters more than current skills. Oh you didn't carry coffee for a top magazine, politician, judge... why should we let you work for us? These also tend to be unpaid.
Now really what you want to see out of an internship is the company provides value to them (You interned at Google, cool) and you provide value to the company (Wow, look at the code you produced in 3 months for our project). This leads to an environment that is paid and provides a valid working experience rather than how many unpaid people do you have around to take up empty office space.
Many industries need to look at their intern programs, re-evaluate them and begin to pay at a minimum Minimum Wage.
I have mod points and I am not afraid to use them
If I had mod points, I'd mod your post up. Instead, I'll reply!
Yes, I came here to say exactly this. Also, this story is going to blow up or go viral or whatever, and for no good reason, IMHO. Sure, $8k/mo is pretty good money, but this is an internship. How long do they work? 3-4 months at the most? Keep in mind, that cost of living for those internship months are going to be pretty high, being in San Francisco (-ish).
Students that don't intern, and expect to just magically find a job after they graduate, are idiots.
I wouldn't call them idiots necessarily. Depending upon the circumstances, some students just don't know. I'm old enough to have been from the age when college was still seen as a place for learning rather than a trade school. I had to work crap jobs during college, and was only vaguely aware that well-paying internships even existed. Or at least, they were for kids with better grades than myself.
All that said, I know some college students who are doing much better these days. The pressure seems positively enormous. I really feel for these kids today.
Middle-aged, living by yourself and spending half your income to rent a studio apartment is not "a modest lifestyle". It's pretty much rock-bottom.
Do people actually talk like that?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
college was still seen as a place for learning rather than a trade school.
It should be both. Should you study history and literature in college? Sure. Should you MAJOR in history or English literature? Not unless you have rich parents.
When I was in college, I took a (mandatory) class called "Great Books of Western Literature". It was a good class with a great professor, and I enjoyed it very much. I also took classes in sociology, history, and art. But my major was engineering. So I left college with a broad general education, specific useful skills, and a well paying job.
Look right here in Wilkins County. The #1 employer is Medicaid fraud. Surprising number of people here who have never worked a W-2 job, yet somehow are collecting enough government money to survive. Cash under the table pays for vacations and the like. Of course, our culture, being very different than yours, doesn't worship conspicuous consumption, so we don't need fancy german cars and exotic vacations. A shotgun and a pickup are good enough to go hunting.
That's how law has worked for years. The biggest stress point was where you'd intern while in law school because that largely determined where you'd get a job. Once you have an offer for an internship, you were on easy street. High tech is just now catching up.
Middle-aged, living by yourself and spending half your income to rent a studio apartment is not "a modest lifestyle".
Compared to a lot of other folks in Silicon Valley, this is a modest lifestyle. I know of few people in similar circumstances who still have money left over at the end of each month to save.
It's pretty much rock-bottom.
Rock-bottom is paying half your income on rent for a room in a house and living with roommates. For an extra $200 per month, I could get an extra wall to have a one-bedroom apartment.
I've seen the same thing I make good pay for where I live, I could get better pay if I moved but the difference in the cost of living doesn't make it worth it.
This doesn't take into account the differences in cost-of-living based on location, so it's a bit skewed.
Students that don't intern, and expect to just magically find a job after they graduate, are idiots.
And during the great recession the sources of interships dried up so bad that a lot of fellow engineering students (including myself) took months if not a year to find their first job in their chose field after leaving college. Some never did get into their field as they were out of school for too long and seen as "untouchable." Of course some of us got blamed by professors for being "lazy" but the truth was that there simply were not enough internships and co-ops to go around for all of us during those years as companies were buckling down so much that they didn't want to hire much of anyone, even interns.
I often wonder why Google and other companies pay such high wadges to cover high costs of living when they could hire someone in a cheaper region to do the same job and collaborate using google hangouts? In our modern, globalized and connected world it should matter less where you work and more what skills you have.
fucking cheap scumbags
> High tech is just now catching up.
Microsoft has had its internship program for more than 20 years for this exact reason.
If they have to pay their interns this kind of money to get talent, it speaks volumes to why expanding the H1B program is an absolute necessity going forward to supply this companies with the kind of people they need.
Or they can just share profit appropriately or sink as they should to make way for more agile companies.
>>Students that don't intern, and expect to just magically find a job after they graduate, are idiots.
Depends on your field. Really. C'mon now.
If I had creimer's life, that's exactly what I'd have to do.
you get out of paying unemployment insurance, and my tax dollars make up the difference. Everybody wins (except me and the Intern that doesn't really have unemployment insurance).
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I'm in a big city on the west coast and today got an email from a recruiter who wants me for a job in a random medium sized town in the deep southeast, along with a big PDF showing how I actually keep more money there than I do here. The numbers may speak for themselves, but I just don't see myself living there.
I seem to recall reading that well paid tech people in Bentonville, Arkansas (likely for Wal-Mart) end up getting the biggest bang for their buck.
when poor people had access to health care due to the medicaid expansion they used it.
That "Cycle of Poverty" bullshit you're spouting comes from right wing "Think Tanks" set up to justify abandoning the poor. If you track back who's telling you that and look at who belongs to those tanks you'll find industry lobbyists all the way down.
People moving around out of desperation isn't how you end poverty. It's how you shuffle the poor around. And you have no idea how bad things were before the Great Society. Or you're actively choosing to ignore it. Or those "Think Tanks" are doing it for you. The outcomes the same.
Poverty ends first with food. Women need food while their kids are gestating so those kids don't have mental problems. It goes on to clean, lead free air & water. Again, prevent mental problems. Next is education. Lots of it. All the way to college. That won't stop poverty, since we're running out of work (Automation & productivity increases for the win) but it will create a population smart enough to solve those problems. All that takes money, and if you think the 1% is going to pay for it by choice you haven't been paying attention to the last 1000 years of human civiliazion.
People aren't starving because of food stamps and other welfare programs. Those programs are mostly allowed to exists because agribusiness lobbies for them. But even they've been losing to the "Cut my Taxes" lobby.
At the end of the day everything you wrote is something you're telling yourself to feel better about cutting your taxes while abandoning the poor. I sincerely hope you're better than that, will realize what you're doing and stop it. Keep in mind, when the 1%ers are done with the poor, you're next.
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Since the article is talking about tech companies, we pretty much know the field. But thanks for the pointless pedantics.
you walk 3mph during your workouts - super athlete.
https://twitter.com/cdreimer/status/858405712317210624
a guy making the same as an intro-level college graduate after 20 years of experience in an industry.
I don't have a high school diploma and I don't have university degree. I do have two associate degrees (A.A. in General Education and A.S. in Computer Programming) and no student loans. I deliberately went into IT Support because I enjoy the work. It's not fair to compare me to a recent college graduate with $100K in student loans and no expectations to pay them off in this lifetime.
rock bottom is having to plow through a bowl of prozac just to get through the day without jumping off the overpass because of your shitty life.
As I explained in a previous post, I've never taken anti-depressants. I don't need them because I don't let shitheads like you tear me down.
don't ever leave that prescription at home. you might kill someone driving.
I pay $140 per month to take the express bus to work. Traffic in Palo Alto is insane on the best of days.
good thing this is not a site for shitheads.
Please turn in your geek creds and don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.
If I had creimer's life, that's exactly what I'd have to do.
JUMP! JUMP! JUMP!
Me ex majored in English Literature like her mother but taught at a state university instead of a high school. I studied applied arts but left teaching to work for Ma Bell. I've contracted with 3 of the companies on that list.
Don't jump creamer. We need sad losers to to diss and shit on for relaxation. It keeps us off your antidepressants.
H1Bs can be looked upon as internships only for people with degrees but missing the local cultural context. By the time they get their Greencards they have the cultural context as well. So the lower pay during H1-GC process is just another kind of intern pay
**Life is too short to be serious**
We need sad losers to to diss and shit on for relaxation.
Rorschach (The Watchmen): "I am not locked in here with you. You are locked in with me!"
Internships are really extended multi-month job interviews. That is how my company sees them, and that is how interns should see them. We never offer an internship to someone that we would not want to hire as a permanent employee. After graduation, we offer jobs to about 60% of our former interns, and most of them accept. We make NO job offers to any other graduates.
So the competition for the best interns is really a competition for the best future employees. The competition is fierce, and the best students usually have multiple internship offers.
Students that don't intern, and expect to just magically find a job after they graduate, are idiots.
That is a stupid way of looking at things. Quite a large number of qualified students simply cannot take internships for a variety of reasons. Additionally, that does not preclude them from finding good jobs when they graduate. Evidence from real life says you are wrong on that account.
Should you MAJOR in history or English literature? Not unless you have rich parents.
I graduated with a B.A. in English, and now I'm an enterprise architect. Uninformed comments like this make engineers look foolish.
cost of living in the bay area is high. tax brackets and AMT and benefit qualifications do not take cost of living in to account.
Did you just subtract rent and then tax? Wish the IRS was that generous. Its Tax first and then Rent. 100K is 8K a month = 6 K a month after tax (marginal rate is 25 fed+9 state but not all income is taxed at marginal rate). Noone on a 100K is paying a 4500 apartment. They are probably sharing an apartment or a room so say 2k on rent. 4K. Health Insurance+Car+Car Insurance+utilities = Another 1 K. Leave 3K/pm for food, retirement savings, saving for a Downpayment
**Life is too short to be serious**
Genuine question, what's an enterprise architect?
i make fun of you for walking 3mph, you provide a link with a photo of it. what point are you trying to make?
I'm not ashamed of my workout, as some asshat here made a huge fuss about over the weekend.
you don't take antidepressants (yet?).
Never have, never will.
oh boy is it about to get shitty for you when you relapse off your diet. and you will - all fat losers do.
I've been on a low-carb diet for five years, making changes where necessary.
your comprehension mistakes are exactly the ones mediocre fat somewhat slow it people make.
I'm doing it on purpose, dumbass.
you're not a geek. you are some helpdesk monkey who can maybe write a little script, on a site full of actual geeks.
I haven't done help desk in ten years.
Genuine question, what's an enterprise architect?
They design starships, except during rush hour when they drive for Uber.
low-carb? Is that the diet where you eat Clif bars, Power bars, and Fiber One bars by the box?
Or did you finally "make the necessary changes" when people pointed out to you that eating that shit was just as bad as eating candy bars all day?
low-carb? Is that the diet where you eat Clif bars, Power bars, and Fiber One bars by the box?
From Monday through Friday I eat two energy bars for breakfast to "break fast" 12 hours after my last meal from the previous day. A three-month supply is ~120 bars (11 or 12 boxes) for $100 via Amazon and Walmart.
Or did you finally "make the necessary changes" when people pointed out to you that eating that shit was just as bad as eating candy bars all day?
I make changes based on my data and not someone else's opinion. For example, an asshat told me that TWO Snickers were healthier than two energy bars. When I compared the labels that proved that energy bars were better (except for sodium), the asshat changed his position to ONE Snickers bar. When I called him on that, he claimed it was sarcasm. This isn't the first time that an asshat has deliberately given me bad diet advice to ruin my health.
Students that don't intern, and expect to just magically find a job after they graduate, are idiots.
How about students that study in a city/country in which you don't have offices? Aren't you limiting yourselves to local yokels?
I'd love to intern at Google, but my university is James Cook University, in Townsville, Australia, 2000 km from the nearest Google offices. Sure, I could have gone to a Sydney university, but that's not an option for everyone.
You can live modestly and not settle, too. Why not make 100k in the valley?
I studied applied arts but left teaching to work for Ma Bell.
If I can infer from your invocation of "Ma Bell", you probably got your job back when there wasn't a horde of low-cost H1Bs with STEM degrees competing for jobs at high-tech companies...
Today, studying applied arts probably isn't going to give you the same opportunities as getting a STEM degree. Just say'n...
Full disclosure, I'm of the same vintage and they certainly didn't have a big computer scientist degree-ed hiring pool available back when "Ma Bell" existed. (not zero, but not big either). It probably isn't important technically, but getting past the HR filter w/o at least bootcamp-like credentials isn't as easy anymore....
Why not make 100k in the valley?
Because I'm a virtual ditch digger and virtual ditch diggers don't make $100K. That's why I'm studying for the Security+ and ITIL Foundation certifications this year, and probably the Cisco Security track next year. For my next job, I'll step up to $100K.
Out earns the average hooker at the corner...
big banks have had internships that pay the same as a starting analyst for years (and starting analysts at banks make more than the average american for most of that time).
frankly, when you are getting paid 5-6k a month, if you cant' find monthly accommodations that are sufficient for your needs and well within your budget, you have some pretty severe financial management problems. Our London based internships brought in folks from all across the EU and no one had an issue finding a room to rent, similar in Tokyo, New York,and Sydney.
The harder part of a paid internship is you limit yourself to people allowed to legally work. That is not always the case with students who are doing university abroad depending on the country, and most companies now won't just ignore the employment rules.
Is that what they call Java programmers these days? Because of all the security holes they dig?
yeah.. wtf are you talking about? i'll assume some comic book loser shit an adult is into for some reason, which is not because his kids like it - because honestly, who'd fuck you.
Considering the housing prices in those areas, cost of living is pretty high. Unless they double, quadruple up, is that really a "lot" of money? I live out here in the midwest, where 96K would get you a huge 3,000 sq ft house in a pretty good neighborhood, couple cars, and money left over.
Newsflash - you're diet's not working.
Your just pretending to be stupid? Why would someone pretend to be stupid? How does you pretending to be stupid make someone else a dumbass? Also, I call bs - you actually are stupid. proof:
(1) you're making 50k in the highest paid geographical it market, after 20 years of experience - that's simply a joke. (2) you got kicked out of college. (3) you diet by eating weight gain bars for athletes and you're still a fucking elephant after 5 years. (4) you think walking real slow is working out
I'm going to have to say you're not pretending. You actually are a dumbass. With a natural or artificial chemical imbalance in your brain that removes motivation to strive for accomplishment in your life. Accomplishments as the select crowd on this site defines that. Not as some redneck living in a trailer home defines it.
I am one of 2 IT people at a mid sized business and would do almost anything for that kind of money. I have close to 200 users, 167 desktops, 17 servers, manage epicore, office 365, internal exchange servers, sans, fp servers, sql, etc., support the user base, and physically repair and canabalize systems to keep things going and even repair company cell phones since we are trying to save money. I average about 2600 a month. I'm just not that attractive to prospective employers since I did not go to collage because it was out of my price range and joined the army instead. I have a lot of ojt and went to ameritrain back when it was around and have a few certs but at 46 I seem to be getting too old for the market.
I don't know anyone paying $4500 a month for a one bedroom in SF.
$2700-3200 seems to be about the norm; you can get away with $1900 for half of a 2 bedroom oftentimes.
moox. for a new generation.
alright - i'm not that asshat - i'm the asshat alcoholic who drinks a glass of really good wine. i read that conversation about snickers (and snickered). it was clearly sarcasm and the guy was exaggerating to make a point. i'm going to try to be actually helpful and maybe diss you a little at the end just so this has value for me too. i'm 40, i've been working out all my life. i know a lot about diet, nutrition, and alls that. listen you stupid fat dipshit.
those protein and fat bars you're eating are for skinny people who want to gain muscle mass. they are not for losing weight. to lose weight, you do no need to build muscle mass. you're a heavy mofo, and you have a shitload of muscle from just carrying all that around. unless you lift really heavy weights, you won't get more muscle - don't feed your body with muscle food.
to burn off weight, the only thing you can do is use more calories than you eat, and maintain it. not no carbs, not no fat - just less calories. look at the calories per 100 grams and see what food has 40 or under. that gives you stomach-filled volume so you're not hungry, and no calories.
this means no fruit. no corn (eat baby corn). not peas or beans. zero oil or butter of any kind. zero bread or pasta (eat kelp of shirataki noodles). egg beaters in the morning - no powerbars. fairlife microfiltered no fat low lactose milk. gallons of flavored diet soda like diet dr pepper cherry. caffeine or claritin-D (the one with meth) in the mornings. your desert is now tomatillos sprinkled with sweet and low. deal with it you fat fuck.
do not walk to work out. that does nothing. you need an elliptical or a stationary bike, and you need to pedal for over an hour. right after the workout, load up with "filler" - high volume, low calorie - like carrots. a shitload of vitamins - like 3 centrum per day. that will make your body not get as hungry. get an ems device and sit there on low power half the day with diodes up your ass - you can do this at work or at home. low setting - you'll not even notice it after a while.
the snickers guy was not trying to deliberately ruin your health. don't no one give a fuck about your health - you've ruined it all on your own, and your too stupid of a loser fat fuck to realize what you're doing now is simply retarded. the snickers guy, just like i usually do, are making ourselves entertained by making fun of a stupid fat fuck who is delusional. your diet sucks, you're fucking ugly, you have not skills, and you're a loser. stop making yourself feel better by making peace with being what you are, realize your many problems, and fix it.
or, you know, stay a clown. you're a lot of fun for us all.
(1) you're making 50k in the highest paid geographical it market, after 20 years of experience - that's simply a joke.
Not for the line of work that I do. Remember, virtual ditch digger. Not programmer. Not developer. Not software architect. If you need a miracle worker, I'm the guy to call.
(2) you got kicked out of college.
I spent eight years in Special Ed classes, skipped high school, went to community college for four years (two years of remedial coursework and two years for General Education), transferred to the university, got kicked out of the university, and went back to school a decade later to get my A.S. degree in Computer Programming.
(3) you diet by eating weight gain bars for athletes and you're still a fucking elephant after 5 years.
I've been 350 pounds for last 10+ years. My nickname in school was "Titanic" not "Elephant Man".
(4) you think walking real slow is working out
I walk fast to put my heart rate into the cardio zone. The funny thing is that I have to walk slow when I'm with other people.
You actually are a dumbass.
If that makes you feel better to think that way, be my guest. People have thought much, much worse of me only to be proven wrong time after time.
i'm the asshat alcoholic who drinks a glass of really good wine.
Now that you admitted that you have a problem, what are you gonna do about it? Dropping $3K a night on wine is shameful.
i'll assume some comic book loser shit an adult is into for some reason, which is not because his kids like it
I read the Watchmen when I was in college. This is definitely not a graphic novel for kids to read.
they're not left wing. They're mostly trial lawyers opposed to tort reform that would put them out of business (not that tort reform's a good thing, lawsuits are about the only thing keeping mega-corps in check). Anyway if you want to know more on the difference see here. Also look up a Youtube channel called "Secular Talk".
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
This is how things worked out for me many years ago. I interned at a local tech company that sadly was past their peak and headed downward. After I graduated one of the managers I asked to offer a reference offered a job instead in a new division at another company. I didn't spend long out of college before I landed a job. As an intern I was doing some fairly sophisticated work, working on a lot of MS DOS TSRs as well as BIOS for at the time state of the art hardware. At the time I earned a decent salary, especially for an intern and college student and the overtime helped a lot as well. I graduated college with no debt and a job. Much of that began because I was very involved in programming as far back as grade school. This is long before the Internet was a thing. I was writing assembly language TSRs before I learned C and hacking on a lot of PC hardware at the time. For example, I had my own custom boot sector so I could take advantage of the extra memory in my computer without having to use a DOS TSR that rebooted the computer in order to get around BIOS limitations. We're talking mid-1980s here.
If you want to get ahead, learn some good programming skills early. If you want to be pretty much guaranteed a job, learn how to work closely with hardware as well. Arduinos are great for this now. At the time I was growing up none of these sorts of things were available to hobbyists and information was limited without the Internet.
This post is encrypted twice with ROT-13. Documenting or attempting to crack this encryption is illegal.
I've been 350 pounds for last 10+ years. My nickname in school was "Titanic" not "Elephant Man".
School bullying is looked down upon. Even professional football players who are very tall and very muscular are fucking fat at 350 lbs.
Slashdot: providing anti-social weirdos a soapbox, since 1997.
Serious lack of uneducated/unskilled/service industry people posting about it's not fair
Clearly your extreme minority representation is enough to change the entire paradigm. Guess you didn't take stats.
We never offer an internship to someone that we would not want to hire as a permanent employee. After graduation, we offer jobs to about 60% of our former interns, and most of them accept. We make NO job offers to any other graduates.
In other words you are scamming nubile adults into working for a severely reduced rate. If you would hire someone as a permanent employee, then do so. Don't be immoral scum putting people in limbo at a lower rate.
This is hardly a new thing in the tech industry. It was certainly the case in the late Nineties. We do real work, even as interns, and get paid real money.
It's political (lobbyists, canvassers, whathaveyou...) interneships that were unpaid, and as far as I know still are. They learn vital skills like trading semi-legal favors, selling the common good to the highest bidder, etc. Paying them would be counterproductive - poor people may get in... better keep those open for people who have rich, connected parents, and can spend the Summer without income.
No good deed goes unpunished...
Back when I was in school in the early 1990s, engineering interns with 2 years of college under their belt easily earned more per month than the average American worker.
Nothing new here.
What is this? Is "and" busy?
let's see if it is. your salary vs mine - we have the same years of experience, both in IT, but I am actually smart. the difference in our income is is about 150k per year.
btw, I own a 3 story house. live on one, rent from the other two pay my mortgage, property taxes, repairs, and all my utility bills. I spend about 1k on wine once a week. that leaves me about 100k over what you make, and I have no expenses. I use that for international travel. Monthly. still have bout 50k annual savings that gets invested. oh hey - my leftovers after an actually interesting life is how much your skills are worth.
you know what's wasteful? the sac of useless meat that is you. rock bottom.
What you should so is ask one some of the security contractors/employees how they got their jobs. Then do what they did. For example they might have gone for Cisco security track first and skipped the other certifications. But good idea getting in IT security.
What you should so is ask one some of the security contractors/employees how they got their jobs.
CompTIA Security+ and ITIL Foundation are the baseline certifications at my current job. Beyond that it varies quite a bit. Microsoft Server and Redhat Linux certifications are common. Cisco Security is not that common. Since I previously worked at Cisco and built out a hardware rack (four switches and three routers) at home, I'll continue with that for certification.
Reality check: you're commenting about a specific real person you don't know anything about.
Alexey
you know what's wasteful? the sac of useless meat that is you. rock bottom.
That you keep comparing yourself to a virtual ditch digger is really sad. You must really suck among your peers who are doing much better than you. Must be that insecurity from knowing that you're one paycheck away from losing it all.
No there wasn't and it's not as easy to get your foot in the door anymore unless you have a long good work history. My second wife did key punch before I met her but there really wasn't any call for it by around 95 and she had no idea what she was going to do so she ended up managing a restaurant.
"i'll assume some comic book loser shit an adult is into for some reason"
smth wrong w/ you mate. they tell you you're a fat fuck and you reply you eat candy bars and take super slow walks to shed the pounds. someone calls you a loser for quoting some comic book as an adult - you tell us you read comic books as an adult. someone tells you you're an idiot with no skills - you reply that you got kicked out of college and after 20 years of experience get paid less than the interns in silicon valley.
a gotta honestly ask you mate - are you trolling or is this your real life? if it is your real life - for god's sake - stop bragging about being a loser. what the hell is wrong with you?
True. I thought you were supposed to intern your senior year in college. Turns out, you should start interning as a college sophomore/junior or you'll be left behind.
i don't know what a virtual ditch digger is. I do know that someone in silicone valley who makes 50k after 20 years of experience is mentally retarded compared to my peers, who are most of slashdot. if you think people make fun of you because they're insecure and not because you're clown-funny... great. keep providing us with stress relief. we enjoy shitting on you. why you think we do it, we don't care.
one paycheck from losing it all because I own a house where I don't have to pay the mortgage. gotcha. the conclusions you make from the information you are given explain why you get paid less than the interns, and why you literally weigh 2.5 times as much as I do. wanna hear something funny? I can bench you 8 times. I don't have candy for breakfast though.
anything else to say there flappy chin-chin? seriously - why are you on this site? this site is for smart nerds. you are not one.
some students just don't know.
That excuse didn't work for the Nazis. There is no excuse not to know,
"I've been 350 pounds for last 10+ years"
Since you said you have been trying to lose weight for 5 years, maybe the candy bar diet and the leisurely walk workouts aren't working? Someone should give you a hint. Not me though - you might eat it. I like people who can laugh at themselves in response to my laughing at them. Quick question - was the last time you saw your dick 10+ years ago?
[...] get paid less than the interns in silicon valley.
You mean the overpaid interns at the top five companies in Silicon Valley? When I was an intern in the late 1990's, I got paid $10 per hour at a Fortune 500 company. Having worked at Google and Facebook on contract, I'm not overly impressed by these wasteful expenditures of money.
are you trolling or is this your real life?
Real life. I have a demotivational poster in my home office: "Mistakes - It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others."
https://despair.com/collections/demotivators/products/mistakes
if it is your real life - for god's sake - stop bragging about being a loser.
A loser is someone who have given up. I've never given up. Eight years of Special Ed classes and skipping high school didn't prevent me from getting A.A. degree in General Education and, a decade later, A.S. degree in computer programming. Being out of work for two years and filing for bankruptcy in 2011 didn't prevent me from bouncing back and recovering financially six years later. Being told that I would drop dead at 10-, 20-, 30-, or 40-years-old because I was "morbidly obese" didn't prevent me from living.
what the hell is wrong with you?
These pissing matches generate quite a bit of traffic and ad revenues for my websites. Since I'm already on Slashdot, I might as well beat my own drum all the way to the bank.
EUREKA he's got it!
This is not a site for Sr. Virtual Ditch Diggers. This is a site for nerds (smart people). While your physical ugliness is shared by many of us here, there is a barrier to entry for this site defined by IQ.
I am sure there is a subreddit for virtual ditch dikkers somewhere. This site is for nerds. You have the bad unattractive part of nerdom down, but you are missing the main qualifier. Contributing to smart discussion. 99% of your comments are about your sad life. This site is for people providing technical nerd insight on technical topics. Your comments about yourself do not qualify, and your attempts at nerd comments are simply stupid - showing a complete lack of anything useful in tech. This site is not for video game testers - it's for video game coders. It's not for people administering workstations and administering spreadsheet scripts - it's for people administering servers and huge databases.
Your life is fine for you - you are way lower than average in your industry, but someone has to be. You're better than tractor-trash. But your life, experience, and brains do not qualify you to contribute here. Fun is fun, but unless your purpose is to annoy everyone and spam discussions like the gnaa does, gtfo.
Again, fuck off with your stories, fuck off with details of your life and frugalty and lack of motivation. Your on-topic comments are too stupid for us. Please go to reddit and find your kind there. You are not smart enough to be here, you have nothing to contribute we are interested in, and you are not wanted here. Read the title: site for nerds. You are not one, you are just fat like us.
Sincerely, ugly fat nerds.
i don't know what a virtual ditch digger is.
I'm the guy your company brings in to clean up your mess after you screwed up the project. For example, I was given a blotched printer mitigation because the engineer ran the script without verifying his work and went on vacation. Took me a month to figure out that only half of the ~1,500 printers on the old Win2K3 print servers were for existing printers, find updated drivers, and set up the Win2K12 print servers. It didn't that the engineer came back from his vacation, pulled the old print servers a month ahead of schedule, and generated 100+ help desk tickets because there was no print service for three days. When I got done and the new print servers came online, those 100+ help desk tickets auotmagically disappeared. If I haven't pulled that miracle off, I would have been fired. I'm a $50K virtual ditch digger, not $200K fuck up.
we enjoy shitting on you.
I appreciate the extra traffic and ad revenues to my websites. Keep up the good work, asshats!
I can bench you 8 times.
You probably scream like a pregnant woman when you do. Those guys are so annoying at the gym.
This is a site for nerds (smart people).
Awesome! I made the president's list at my community college for maintaining a 4.0 GPA in Computer Programming while taking two classes, working 60+ hours as a lead video game tester, and teaching Sunday school.
"$100K in student loans and no expectations to pay them off in this lifetime"
Lifetime? What dreamworld do you live in? These graduates come out making ~60-70k/year in silicon valley. There was recently an article about interns making 8k/month. They make 150k within 10 years of working. Their loans are paid off within 3-4 years if they don't live large, and 5-6 years if they are.
source: me and literally everyone I know from college, and literally everyone I work with, besides literally exactly two douchebags who had kids too early.
Quick question - was the last time you saw your dick 10+ years ago?
This morning. I used to do long-distance bike riding (20+ miles). From the waist down, my junk and legs look awesome. The rest of me, meh.
replying to your comments generates extra traffic that you make money from? real world: no. and anyone clicking on any links from you does it to look at the picture, laugh, and close the window. enjoy paying for the xtra traffic.
here's a project i did. migrating about 2k windows/linux server VMs, and about 20 aix boxes from standalone and a flex farm on sharks to a cisco san on ucs and vmax3 tiered. do you even know what I'm talking about? go fix your printer migration - whatever the fuck that entails. no one gives a fuck about your printers - that's not real work for this site. that's what dumb monkeys do. this site is for chefs - you're a busboy who mops the floor. I've never seen what a helpdesk ticket looks like.
i do scream like a pregnant woman. my gym is the top floor of my house, so you don't hear it. sorry, no swimminng pool, but also no credit card payments - being frugal here.
350 lb and your stomach does not block the view of your dick. We do not believe you. I can't see mine and I'm way lighter. I have to lay on my back ass to mirror.
That's exactly the point. We here do not teach at Sunday school, do not test video games, nor do we get an associate's non-degree from clown college.
Once you've taught a physics class, worked as a video game developer, and have at least a BA in computer Science, we'll welcome you back to this site and your comments will be smart and not spam. Until then, kindly fuck off and find yourself a subreddit.
Do you see plumbers who change your water filter trying to contribute to forums on industrial water purification systems? Get it through your fat skull. Your comments are spam, you are too stupid to be on this site, and you are not welcome here. The fat thing no one gives a fuck about - they're just having fun with you. We're all fat. But only you are inadequate intellectually.
We do not believe you.
This picture was taken last year. Cheers and jeers!
https://www.cdreimer.com/images/cdreimer_350.jpg
If you're wondering about the shirt, it can be found here.
http://6dollarshirts.com/viewer-discretion
Do you see plumbers who change your water filter trying to contribute to forums on industrial water purification systems?
My plumber is a woman. She's 100% dyke.
here's a project i did. migrating about 2k windows/linux server VMs, and about 20 aix boxes from standalone and a flex farm on sharks to a cisco san on ucs and vmax3 tiered.
The server team I work with is doing a similar project to set up Win2K12 VMs to replace physical Win2K3 and Win2K8 servers, as the older servers represent a security vulnerability in terms of patching. I don't know the exact numbers buy they're freeing up half the physical space in the data centers around the country.
do you even know what I'm talking about?
Yes, but only because I previously worked for Cisco and my current job is one of Cisco's larger customers.
I've never seen what a helpdesk ticket looks like.
That's the nice thing about my current job: 80,000+ workstations and NO USERS. The only tickets I deal with are the ones I create for the local desktop tech to go find a workstation and turn it on for me.
Reality check: Grow a pair.
"My plumber is a woman. She's 100% dyke."
What does that have to do with what you are replying to? The point stands. This site is for nerds, you are not one. I did read your comment about generating traffic. You are a bottom-iq (for this site) person who wants to make pennies on his not appropriate for you website, so you spam here as advertisement? Get. The. Fuck. Off of here. No one is interested in you, your life, or the short bus you rode in special ed. This is not a site for special ed people. We do not want your spam here. What is it you are not getting. This is a community you don't belong to. You are not welcome here.
This is a community you don't belong to. You are not welcome here.
Complain to management. However, since I'm consistently upvoted than downvoted by the mods on a daily basis, I doubt they will do anything.
i'm going to chime in and say you get the fuck off this site. you literally have no idea what that comment was about, and you are again spamming this site with your lack of knowledge.
the comment was about FCoE and in-array tiering using vRAID. It was not about anything remotely related to what you said.
let me exclaimp, and then please do stop posting your spam. in the back of a server, you have an ethernet card for network traffic, and a host bus adapter which is connected to some disks. This is about using a single card in the server to do all the different types of external IO.
i wish there could be a quiz someone has to take to comment here to block out people like you. i really hate scrolling through pages and pages of a random idiot saying stupid things, then a hundred people explaining to him that he is an idiot. i want to read comments about a compiler optimization and end up having to scroll though an autistic guy advertising a 5 line cron job to update a hosts file, and a special ed adult trying to advertise clicks to some blog no one reads.
stop. just stop. the frist prosts and gay neeger tweekers were better than you low-iq losers trying to earn your pennies. nerds has become 'people who are too stupid to know they are stupid'.
you are above average smartness. be happy with that. but here, you do not understand what people are talking about despite you thinking you do. and that is annoying as shit since you start pages and pages of spam threads just to "draw traffic" to your site.
[...] you have an ethernet card for network traffic [...]
Server motherboards have dual-NIC for redundancy or quad-NIC for channel bonding.
[...] a host bus adapter which is connected to some disks [...]
Those disk arrays are so damn heavy. I actually nicked the center of my palm when installing one.
[...] and a host bus adapter which is connected to some disks [...]
Dual cards for redundancy.
This is about using a single card in the server to do all the different types of external IO.
Uh, no. Single point of failure is reduced with redundant cards. At least, in my work experience at Fortune 500 companies.
Cisco UCS guy here. Umm no, they do not have "NICs" for dedundancy. They do not have NICs at all. There are 8 servers in a module that has a bus. That bus has 2 unified IO cards that to 2 FI switches. There is no such thing as Channel bonding - there are Port Channels. Several ports in one channel, not several channels as one port - the exact opposite of what you said.
A janitor has "work experience" at Fortune 500 companies. That does not qualify them to comment on a topic on slashdot. Every single thing you have said so far shows you are not qualified either.
Cisco UCS guy here. Umm no, they do not have "NICs" for dedundancy. They do not have NICs at all. There are 8 servers in a module that has a bus. That bus has 2 unified IO cards that to 2 FI switches. There is no such thing as Channel bonding - there are Port Channels. Several ports in one channel, not several channels as one port - the exact opposite of what you said.
I stand correct. I thought the discussion was general server hardware.
You have not seen or worked with an IBM Shark (DS series) nor an EMC VMAX array. If you had, you would not claim you installed one. Please stop posting made up bullshit to draw traffic to your blog. People are trying to have a conversation here.
If you had, you would not claim you installed one.
I've installed Dell disk arrays.
Please stop posting made up bullshit to draw traffic to your blog.
The increase traffic comes from the asshats who are complaining about me. People see that, wonder why I get all this shit, and then check out my websites. I don't mind the extra $75 in ad revenues last month.
People are trying to have a conversation here.
That's funny. A bunch of asshats started bitching about my weight yesterday and continued this morning. If you got a complaint, take it up with them.
you just have literally zero idea what the fuck people are talking about on here - do you..
this is not about upgrading the operating system or patches. this is about using vmware evmotion and aix vio to migrate an existing running operating system for two thousand servers from LAN+SAN to Unified IO, then tiering it. Tiering as in virtual RAID - one disk the server sees is on the back end split between spinning and flash storage depending on what types of activity parts of that disk have. It's literally what every company in the world has been doing for a decade. it's about as common knowledge as whatever they taught you in those special ed classes is for you.
thirded/forthed - what the fuck are you doing on this site. is this a special ed college dropout thinking - here's a community smart people decided to create to discuss things important to them. let me advertize on it to get clicks on my blog. what the fuck is wrong with you. are you APK?
are you APK?
Nope. APK and I had our falling out a few months ago. It was epic. We've been keeping our distance since then. Slashdot would not survive we if got into it again.
Just wanted to pop in and say, I don't know why these folks are being a**holes to you. I'm sorry that you're being subject to that, tho I'm not sure why you're engaging them.
Just wanted to pop in and say, I don't know why these folks are being a**holes to you.
If a fat person can be successful, than anyone can be successful. Some asshats have a problem with that. Casey Neistat did a video that summed up the situation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iQ8BGw13So
I'm sorry that you're being subject to that, tho I'm not sure why you're engaging them.
I love trolling the trolls on Slashdot.
When you have 1.9 billion - yes 1,900,000,000 - users, you can pay these kind of salaries, especially in a high cost of living area.
No different than me making $120,000 a year as a bottom of the barrel contractor for a nuclear power plant. Why? Because they hire smart, risk-adverse people who don't do drugs, abuse alcohol, or endanger the safety of the public, their co-workers or themselves... knowing full well that a terrorist attack or nuclear accident or minor slip-up can mean instant death or crippling injury.
then you're at the border/bad area/roommate/etc
this is all possible of course, but, please, link me to that 1900USD 2BR? Any. Please.
As someone who sometimes says mean things to creimer, I'll pop in and say, I don't have Creimer's accounts bookmarked or whatever. I just read slashdot and see incredibly stupid posts, and then at the bottom I happen to see that the post was by creimer. When the guy gets into a a thread he literally will shitpost 20 times.
So you eat a breakfast that's complete garbage. Got it. If you care about low-carbs, you should eliminate those energy bars - substitute a few scrambled eggs, and you'll have a much healthier, much lower-carb breakfast that will leave you full longer than your breakfast of highly processed, sugar-loaded, quickly digested garbage. If you care less about low-carbs, then eat a bowl of oatmeal. It tastes WAY better, and again, the higher fiber content of the oatmeal means its digested slower, so you will be less hungry through the day.
As for the comparison between Snickers bars and your energy bars, it is indisputable fact that Power bars and Clif bars are worse for you in terms of sugar and most other nutritional measures than a Snickers. To compare each one's relative nutritional value:
Power Bar == Clif Bar < Snickers < Fiber One
Claiming proudly that you eat energy bars as part of a diet for weight loss is like claiming that you're fucking for virginity.
Now, let's consider costs:
1) For oatmeal, you'll spend about $90 for a 50 pound bag of dry rolled oats. 1 cup of dry oats (makes ~ 1.5 - 2 cups of cooked oatmeal) weighs about 3 ounces, which means that the single 50 pound bag of oats contains about 250 meals worth of oatmeal, costing you 36 cents per meal, for a total of $43.20 over the course of 3 months.
2) Now, let's consider eggs. You can buy a dozen eggs for $1.88 at Wal-Mart - about 16 cents per egg. Let's assume you eat 3 eggs every morning - that's 48 cents each day. In 3 months, you will spend about $57.60 on eggs.
What to do with the money you save? Buy other healthy food - fresh vegetables, fresh fruit, etc., and mix in some variety to your meals. A few scrambled eggs with some onion, tomato, and spinach? Fucking glorious. A bowl of oatmeal topped with a handful of fresh blueberries? You'll cream your jeans it's so good. Or, if you prefer plain eggs & oatmeal, use the money you save to buy LITERALLY ANYTHING IN THE WORLD EXCEPT those ridiculous garbage energy bars.
But what about Calories, isn't oatmeal or eggs super full of calories!!??
1) 2 cups of oatmeal is about 320 calories.
2) 3 eggs will only total up to around 210 calories.
You claim that you make changes when the data supports it. Well, the data most explicitly does not support eating energy bars for breakfast as an economical, or nutritious, alternative to real food - especially for someone who claims he's on a "low-carb", calorie-restricted diet.
You're welcome, creimer.
Let's assume you eat 3 eggs every morning - that's 48 cents each day.
Why do you continue to give bad dieting advice to fat people? I'm on a low-egg diet (two brown eggs per week). I can't eat 15 eggs per week.
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2016/04/01/eggs-cholesterol-levels.aspx
You're welcome, creimer.
STOP BEFORE YOU GET SOMEONE KILLED WITH YOUR BAD ADVICE!
Did you even READ the link you just shared? Choice quotes: "High-Egg Diet Has No Effect on Cholesterol Levels, Even for People With Type 2 Diabetes"; "Eating Cholesterol Doesn’t Make Your Cholesterol High"; "Eggs Are a Good Source of Vitamins and Antioxidants". Your link does nothing to explain why you're on a "low-egg" diet, and in fact, your link suggests that eating "up to a dozen" eggs per week is perfectly fine, safe, and indeed, a good source of protein & other nutrients. My point in calculating for you the cost of eating 3 eggs a day was not to say, "You should, by all means, stuff your fat fucking face with as many eggs as you can choke down" - it was to point out that even eating THREE eggs a day - a large number, which should satisfy even a fat fuck - is cheaper than your garbage power bar habit.
If you can't eat 15 eggs per week, your link suggests that you can EASILY eat 12 eggs per week - so have 2 per day, and get even FEWER calories, and spend even LESS money. None of your arguments disprove the fundamentally better nutrition and lower cost of eating eggs.
Furthermore, you completely ignored the oatmeal option, which is just as healthy, and also far less expensive than Powerbar / Clif bar garbage.
Your link largely supports my assertions. Furthermore, since you like linking Dr. Mercola for advice, he also suggests that to have a "low-carb" diet, you should probably be eating 40 or less grams of carbs per day:
"Some people can be in a full fat-burning state with full ketosis at a level of non-fiber carbs that's higher than 50 grams; maybe 70 or 80 grams. Others, especially if you're insulin resistant or have type 2 diabetes, may require less than 40 grams or even 30 grams per day." (source: http://articles.mercola.com/si...)
Given your weight, your age, and your health claims, it's likely that you're struggling with Type 2 Diabetes, so your claim that your "150 grams per day" constitutes "low carb" is cherry-picking facts to suit your idiotic preconceptions.
Here's the thing: I'm not a doctor, but I *AM* giving you good nutritional advice. If you choose not to heed it, that's your choice - you won't live to see 60, but you're free to make bad decisions.
Here's the thing: I'm not a doctor, but I *AM* giving you good nutritional advice.
YOU ARE NOT! STOP BEFORE YOU GET SOMEONE KILLED!
And yet, strangely incapable of refuting anything that's been offered up as advice?
Good show, fat-ass.
And yet, strangely incapable of refuting anything that's been offered up as advice?
Why bother? You are obviously determined to give bad diet advice to a fat person. Not to help, but to harm. I deal with guys like you at work all the time. One asshat told me unprompted in the middle of a meeting that I needed lap band surgery — and then wondered why every treated him like douche bag after the meeting.