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Free Movement of EU Citizens To Britain Will End in 2019 (standard.co.uk)
Free movement of EU citizens to Britain will end when the country leaves the EU in March 2019, Theresa May's spokesman said Monday, moving to contain a Cabinet row over immigration after Brexit. From a report: Downing Street (headquarters of the government of the United Kingdom) said on Monday it was "wrong" to suggest free movement would "continue as it is now" once Britain leaves the EU. It comes following days of confusion and rumours of infighting between Cabinet colleagues over the crucial issue of immigration after Brexit.
They're projected to be the majority in GB now within 10 years. The whole point of leaving the EU and it didn't work.
British, but got an Irish passport... Still free to travel and work in europe
of illegal immigrants from Africa, the Middle East, and Eastern Europe.
whatever that other FREE is.
The old saying that "nobody surrenders like the French" should be modified to "nobody is as fucking stupid as the English". After all, new millenium, new saying.
What is the point of having a political body if it abdicates its role ? We have already seen what that is like in the US at the federal level, but man I never thought English members of parliament would be even more bonkers.
My greatest fear at this point is that these fuckers sooner or later will beg to re-enter the EU. I hope the EU gives them the big finger once and for all. De Gaulle was so right all along.
It was going to end on Friday. Then it wasn't. Now it is again. Anyone who responds to anything coming out of Downing Street at the moment with anything other than resigned bemusement is far too trusting. The government is as split as the country was and I'll be astonished if both major parties manage to survive Brexit. Worth bearing in mind that the man who holds the purse strings, Phillip Hammond, is not a fan.
I had a dream, bright and carefree, but now there's doubt and gravity
There are going to be a lot of confused bigots queuing to get through the non-EU passport controls on their way to Magaluf / the Costas etc. "Whaddya mean I need a visa?! I'm British!!"
Query whether Theresa May will still be PM in 2019...
In a world where it's possible for an ordinary person to get on a jet plane and be literally on the other side of the planet in a day (24 hours give or take), restricting people to live out their lives confined to the arbitrary geographical borders of whatever country they happened to be born in is increasingly problematic.
There's a lot of heart breaking suffering in the world and an increasingly viable solution is to allow people to move away from their difficult circumstances to other parts of the planet. But there's a certain aesthetic to world that is mostly segregated by race and ethnicity. There's a certain order to the idea that most Japanese people should live in Japan - sort of like not wanting your peas to touch your mashed potatoes on the dinner plate. And then the rich people also tell the poor people that it's the foreigners, rather than the rich people themselves, who are keeping the poor people poor.
So how do you balance the aesthetic and propaganda of the rich that argues for segregation against the being able to alleviate significant suffering in the world by allowing people to live and work and travel outside of the arbitrary geographical boundaries of the country they happened to be born in?
"Whaddya mean I need a visa?! I'm British!!"
Yo no comprendo, visa per favor.
Too right, all these fuckwits who vote to close the borders did not realise they themselves would be effected.
You can hear the shouts now "Oi Fuck Face, I'm British, let me through this border as I aint no Mulsim"
To feel safe, she needs to know everyone's blood type, DNA, religion, facial recognition data, and the complete removal of free will, unfiltered communication, and minorities; only then will she and all other British politicians feel safe.
what's that, a pint of Guiness?
EU citizens isnt really the problem (apart from Romanians/Albanians) its the deluge of 3rd world simpletons from non EU countries eg. Pakistan/Nigeria/India/Eritrea/Somalia/MiddleEast/Phillipines/Thailand.
bringing their shitty 3rd world culture, highly unskilled lowIQ people who cant even do farm jobs or labouring, nobody in Britain wants them here.
Exactly. Brexiteers either haven't figured this out or are in denials. Want to go to Spain? You'll need a visa. France? Visa. Ireland? Well, if you are travelling overland a visa and an amoured car.
Never email donotemail@WeAreSpammers.com
How did the parent comment get modded to 5, Informative?! Mosques are Muslim temples.
Did you see the idiot Conservative MEP who suggested the solution was simply to have a hard border between the whole British Isles and the EU.
Yeah, that'll go down splendidly.
Next week they will say something different. The only thing that this current UK government has been consistent about is pissing into the wind.
The British joined the EU with special conditions because their economy was in really bad shape. And now they want to leave to improve their economic position? This is really tragic. They seem to have decided that fucking themselves with a wire-brush is a really good idea. And now their moron-in-chief also wants a "hard" exit in addition? Well, we will miss you in the 1st world, that's for sure. And I am well aware that about half of you are _not_ terminally stupid. Makes it even more tragic.
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
Another boring non-story. Not even a smidgen of a connection with tech. Just a "here today, gone tomorrow" politics post.
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
Really, all of those would need a visa? I'm from the US, I've been to most of those countries and I've never needed a visa. And the US isn't part of the EU. We've just had to go through customs.
Not many people from the UK were holidaying in the middle east or sub-saharan Africa. Import these cultures into Europe and nobody will be holidaying there either.
This sounds like it's going to spell big trouble for Northern Ireland. I wonder if this will be the bullet that causes Northern Ireland to leave the UK.
I don't any longer feel for contributing to their economy when they make it difficult to get in.
My Pension date will be January 2018 so I can quit their new society of scare for and fear of their neighbours before it becomes problematic.
Not that I believe they will impose great barriers to EU citizen, even in the Maggie Thatcher days there were no real issues getting in.
The Bexiteers say they want to improve their standards of living by removing the EU rules and workers, well let me say there isn't a single employer in the UK that would hire an EU worker if he couldn't make money that way. Or more money than by employing a British national.
The underlying issue of the Brexit campaign is the same as Trumps Make America Great Again, the portion of the population that has a lack of Self-respect. For some reason they feel (in their own country!) inferior to their foreign born fellow citizen.
Something that has been instilled in parts of the British people by years of reading the tabloids that were full of nonsensical stories about crooked cucumbers and outsiders living of the meagre UK benefits. And other elements of the media that have never bothered much to set right these ridiculous misconceptions.
The bottom line is I feel sorry for the enlightened Brits and the Europeans that had a good commercial relation with them.
"The likes of Facebook and WhatsApp are free to those whose privacy is of zero value."
That the EU became much more than a "Trade Union" to help free trade between nations and became a supernational government acting well beyond the limits of economics.
I believe you have a very one sided view of who exactly screwed themselves with a wire brush. Numerous countries in the EU are taking issue with the Social policies the EU is trying to force on them.
I wonder why people who promote the EU continuously ignore the first Nation to leave, and what a positive impact it has had on them. Hint: the UK was not first, and probably won't be the last without changes in the EU body pushing social reforms on members..
-The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.
Oh bullshit. Before the EU you didn't need visas either. You had to queue up at the border, they looked at your passport and waved you through. There was life before the EU, you know.
It all depends on whether the British keep dragging their feet with regard to the exit "deal". If there is no agreement or it doesn't include a visa waiver treaty with the EU, British people will need visa. US citizens don't need one because of the bilateral visa waiver program.
That was the intent, and the intent was achieved. It's a government of the elites constraining the sovereignty of the plebs. As a result, it is doomed to failure. The peoples constituting it will reject the loss of sovereignty eventually, based upon its lack of a dominating military force. The willy-nilly accession of nations which really weren't comparable to the original EEC members also did them no favors.
It seemed unstoppable as long as the economic forces constrained politics. Then 2008 happened, and that false prosperity was shown to be a lie.
Something akin to true federalism would have been a wiser choice, but no one involved in its creation wanted that kind of weak government. It's too late now to change course. You'd need another WWII type event to set the stage, which is unlikely to happen again in a useful way for pan-Europe enthusiasts.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
Why do you think it will be the same afterwards? The EU won't just give it to us, it will be part of the negotiations which at the moment don't seem to be going too well.
Demographic change can happen much quicker than one expects.
Look at Hamtramck, Michigan and Dearborn, Michigan for examples of this happening recently.
Even as late as the 1970s, the residents of Hamtramck were nearly all (90%) from Poland, or of Polish descent. But by 2000, Poles made up only about 10% of the population. By 2015 it had the first majority Muslim city council in the US.
Dearborn is similar. Once mainly populated by people of European origin or descent, as of 2010 over 40% of its population was of Arab ancestry, with many of them practicing Islam.
A city like Birmingham is moderately large, so it may take longer to see it happen. But when you factor in birth rate differentials, immigration rates, emigration rates, and death rates, a non-Muslim city could easily become a Muslim-majority city within two or three generations.
Depending on how long you live, there's a good chance you'll experience it later in your life, even if you don't see it today. Your children (or hypothetical ones, if you're impotent) will experience it.
Really, all of those would need a visa? I'm from the US, I've been to most of those countries and I've never needed a visa. And the US isn't part of the EU. We've just had to go through customs.
By default, yes.
The UK has very few visa waiver agreements in place, mostly relying on the EU agreements.
On leaving the EU, it's not likely we will have any visa waiver agreements in place with our former partners, and many of our non-EU agreements may well also lapse.
Imagine if your state ceded from the union. Would you still have visa-free travel? No -- it would have to be negotiated.
Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
Visa waiver programmes are not guaranteed.
Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
So what you're saying isn't that there will be a need for visas, but that there might be a need for visas. This is one of my biggest aggravations. When people state some piece of speculation as fact.
Are Northern Irish now less hostile towards being governed by a Catholic Dublin?
'cos the ideas you wrote out were certainly shitty.
Well, two years is a short time under the best of circumstances, but Britain hasn't even decided what they want yet, and we're already four months into the "negotiations" with hardly anything done. There will have to be a real and unlikely change of attitude for there not to be a hard Brexit, so Brits will most likely need visas to visit the EU, at least for a short while.
Demographically, yes, things are going that way. The protestant population is on the decline.
Census figures: NI Protestant population continuing to decline
The EU would not listen about immigration. It would not listen about democratic reforms. The EU is responsible for the decision of the British people to leave. Britain can't sustain immigration in the region of 250000 people every year. There is already a housing crisis here, there are shortages of school places, the health service is under severe pressure (partly also due to the tory attacks on the core values that underpin it), transport infrastructure is grossly inadequate, and there are likely to be future issues with years of under investment in base load for the power grid. It is absurd to continue to allow massive migration under these circumstances. While I'm personally in favour of being part of a European Union, I had to vote against staying in it in its current unreformable state. I don't think leaving will be a good thing, but to stay under these terms is unacceptable. Hopefully once what remains of the EU collapses, we can re-join a new more sensible and democratic union, less focused on pursuit of corporate interests, and right wing schemes to ship cheap labour to the wealthier countries/depress the euro to make exports from wealthier countries more competitive. I have no problem with other European citizens coming here to work, but immigration/migration should occur on a rough parity basis to prevent massive population growth. Clearly the massive inflow of people is just eroding living standards for everyone. I think collapse of the EU is now inevitable, particularly given the integration of completely incompatible economies, regardless of the vicious social cost to the poorest countries. Sooner or later, there will be revolt. Britain may be the first to depart, but it certainly won't be the last.
Exactly. Brexiteers either haven't figured this out or are in denials. Want to go to Spain? You'll need a visa. France? Visa. Ireland? Well, if you are travelling overland a visa and an amoured car.
In theory they don't need to issue visas at all and the English channel is a better wall than Trump could ever make. In practice this is just the kind of scare-mongering that led to the Brexit vote, trying to act like the UK has no choice in the matter or that all hell would rain down on them if they did. I just checked here in Norway and I can go to 127 countries around the world without a visa, at least for vacations shorter than a month. It's a standard courtesy offered by most friendly nations and all that want to encourage tourism.
If the EU refused this to the UK, their neighbor and former union member it would have all the telltale marks of a vindictive divorce that would cast a very long and dark shadow over the EU. While it is the UK that wanted to part ways it's not like they started a war or anything, despite the political positioning I doubt the EU will act like the psycho ex. Obviously the UK won't get to pick and choose the parts of the EU agreement they liked, but to think that the EU wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire is nonsense.
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
You mean the English Channel?
At present, it's totally unknown what the post-exit setup will be. British citizens can currently travel without a visa to many countries (more than almost any other, IIRC), but whether that's because the UK is part of the EU or not varies from country to country. Generally speaking, if a country specifically states that *UK* citizens don't need a visa (like the US does) because of arrangements that predate any made by the EU, then that arrangement should continue regardless of whatever terms are agreed between the UK and the EU.
Post Brexit, it's entirely possible that the EU could require that British citizens acquire a visa for visits to the EU (and presumably visa versa since it's almost certainly going to be a quid pro quo arrangement, whichever way it goes), which would probably negate any arrangements that allow them to travel as citizens of the EU as well. That's likely to be deeply unpopular on both sides however; far too many people are used to making impromptu trips between the UK and mainland Europe via Eurostar or to take advantage of special offers by budget airlines, all of which might be too much trouble if a visa is required. Not that being merely deeply unpopular seems to be a major impediment to how things turn out any more, of course.
UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
I don't think there's going to be any long-term issue on visitor visas, but it's going to be a massive headache for people wanting to work abroad -- as an English teacher, I've got good reason to be concerned. The specific problem for me and thousands like me is that everyone would prefer teachers from the US, but the hassle of sorting out working visas is more than most schools can be bothered with, so they settle for people from the UK and Ireland. But once teachers from the UK need visas... well, it'll be just as easy to recruit an American, and the students will be happier with that.
Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
It seems unlikely that freedom of movement will really end. Maybe in the sense that EU nationals will no longer have the right to work in the UK or use UK services as anything other than tourists, and of course the same for UK citizens living in Europe. But politically they won't be able to close that border, and people will move freely across it.
In practice that means that people will be able to bring family members in via the border, for example. It will create a new underclass of immigrants from the EU who don't have visas, can't work, don't have proper access to government services and the NHS, and which are impossible for the government to track and manage.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Just curious, could the individual countries in the EU agree to wavered visas like a pre-EU that ac was speaking of?
Don't usually say this, but your comment is really astonishingly racist.
Points:
1). We are in some kind of race or contest with Muslims? What do we get for winning, a box of Crackerjacks? There's all kinds of stupid in this notion;
2). Suppose that Muslims make up the majority in Great Britain in 10 years, as you say. This seems unlikely but let's play along for a moment. As long as those are British Muslims I fail to see the problem. The main problem would be if the British (regardless of religious affiliation) were minorities in their own country. Now that would be a problem.
3). The "whole point of leaving the EU" was not to keep Muslims out. It was to assert control of the borders, chart an independent foreign and economic policy, and anti-Brussels sentiment. The anti-foreigner elements of Brexit targeted mainland Europeans every bit as much as migrants from Africa and the Middle East.
Your comment is literally made up of fail.
A two second Google search shows that your stated facts are wrong for 2015. According to the Independent which is quoting the Office for National Statistics which is an official government department and so vastly more reliable than some random website you picked Muhammad was the 14th most popular boys in 2015.
If you go direct to the ONS website you will see that they do not have statistics yet for 2016 but you can also see that 'Oliver' was the top boys name in 2014. So please stop peddling lies and fake news. Mohammad is a boys name which has increased in popularity and in some regions, like London, where there is a large concentration of Muslims it is the top name but overall in the UK it is certainly not number one or even in the top ten!
I agree. In fact, I'm not even entirely sure that Brexit will actually happen anymore. With no idea what they want from the negotiations, it is hard to see how these will succeed and, without that, Northern Ireland will suddenly get a hard border. The DUP is supposedly vehemently against this so I expect that once it becomes clear that this will happen the government will fall and whoever takes over will then have no time left to negotiate and will have to choose between the hardest possible hard Brexit or revoking article 50 (which is legally unclear but the EU has said it would be happy to allow). Either way the UK is in for a hell of a rough ride for the next few years either ending up back where it started or in economically uncharted waters.
Iceland, Greenland, and soon to be the UK all left the EU (UK by vote only). Algeria was a technicality first, but a technicality, as is Saint Barthelemy. There are other strong movements to leave in the Poland and Hungary, gaining support due to the social pushes by the EU. Other movements in the Netherlands, France, Italy, Sweden, and even Germany are gaining momentum.
-The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.
They figure if they can wait long enough, they can replace the will of the people with the will of the Eurocrats.
Apparently Brussels (and the fellow travellers in London) doesn't like it when commoners try to flee the plantation.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
> Maybe in the sense that EU nationals will no longer have the right to work in the UK
Which is exactly what "freedom of movement" means in this context. Thanks for playing.
They figure if they can wait long enough, they can replace the will of the people with the will of the Eurocrats.
What will is that. "the people" voted to leave, but they didn't vote for any specific form of leave.
SJW n. One who posts facts.
So when will the UK financially compensate Europe for starting a destabilizing war leading to these mass migrations into Europe?
Those who do not learn from commit history are doomed to regress it.
If you're thinking of a 90 day vacation within the Schengen Zone, then yes all one would need would be a passport stamped. And I guess the same restrictions apply to US visitors as from my country in terms of re-entry and the number of visits permitted within a 12 month period.
A tourist visit once or twice a year is thus different from current arrangements where EU citizens can come and go as they please, or reside or conduct business. In that case they'd be inhabitants of just another country and require visas like everyone else on the planet outside Europe.
Oh, you were always free to go and even at first to not be part of the EU. There was no plantation, there was a shared garden which needs people to mature. You flee. We are fine with that. One of the major EU principles always was and still is freedom. Nobody will prevent you to leave.
Are you really surprised that when UK leave EU, the partners countries, quite violently, aggressively and patronizingly that the one left are unhappy?
You hoped a divorce where the EU says:
- we are so happy you are leaving, you are so right, UK is so great ;
- we accept that the UK keep the advantages of EU and refuse to share the burden of living with other countries (you know compromises).
It won't happen. You are delusional. Get back down on earth: you flee, you assume. Stop being whining children, grow up.
Keep playing dumb. The 3 states you visited were completely inundated with that shit. No or little abortions, sodomy laws, blue laws, 10 commandments posted in public spaces, censorship laws, constant pushback on evolution education, constant pushback on health education, refusal to pay for birth control, education vouchers (which mainly pay parochial schools), gambling bans, and so much other bullshit I'm tired of typing it all. When you like your caliphate, it doesn't look like one to you.
Most countries in the EU are also part of the Schengen area. Of those who are not most are "legally required" to join and in the meantime are applying rules based on the Schengen rules. The only countries in the EU with opt-outs from Schengen are the UK and Ireland.
AIUI countries in Schengen are not allowed to negotiate visa-free agreements individually, so it's largely all or nothing for the UK getting visa-free access to mainland EU countries.
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
In fact, the Leave campaign and prominent Leave proponents all said we could stay in the single market, which means retaining freedom of movement. This isn't what was voted for at all.
https://youtu.be/0xGt3QmRSZY
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Hello
can someone tell me how there is free movmenet of EU citizens to the UK?
The UK is not in the Schengen area. Not at all. Switzerland is more in Schengen area than the UK, and Switzerland is not even EU member.
Each time I travel to the UK I have to provide an IDcard/passport.
That's not free movement, there is an actual boder to cross. Even if you take the train through the tunnel, there are border controls.
Atari rules... ermm... ruled.
It's just a different way of selecting representatives for the people. One which has built-in limitations in terms of removing said peers, but also has traditional constraints on their actions. I come from the US. I am resistant to the idea of a ruling class, but that doesn't mean I am blind to its existence.
It basically comes down to: would you rather have your ruling class composed of people who made a lot of money (or inherited it!) in the economy, or who just got the position via heredity? I don't see all that much to choose between either.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
Because if they be consistent, they're giving away their bargaining position and letting "them" plan to exploit their discussion limits. But if they don't say anything, they're hiding from "the people's will" to brexit, even though for every thousand people, there are several thousand different ideas of what brexit is (because each one has several, depending on how you phrase it or the context the query is brought up in). And when they vacillate, they're lambasted for being weak and flopping.
It IS the tories' fault for trying this stupid idea to kill UKIP support (which worked, but only by mutually assured destruction), but lets blame them for what they're guilty of, not what situation we put them in.
Thanks.
Free Movement of British Citizens To EU Will End in 2019.
And not than much will change as the EU was never part of The Schengen. Area so free movement was already not possible. They also where not part of the Eurozone.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
It's waaaaay more complicated than you seem to think it is. Like, waaaaaaaaaaay more.
This takes time to arrange, though, and the UK doesn't have the time or negotiators to achieve it in the time available. The UK has relied on the EU for so much of its negotiation that it is simply ill-equipped to strike out on its own without spending a lot of time and effort in replacing these negotiators. It also doesn't help that great swathes of support staff for all national institutions are from the EU, and those workers might just choose to leave, as the guarantees regarding their loved ones' ability to stay with them are non-existent.
And every concession from the EU will come at a price. This is what happens when you take a seat at the negotiating table. The weird thing is Britain decided to change sides of that table from the well-populated side filled to the rafters with seasoned international diplomats to sit alone on the other side, struggling to remember how this whole thing is supposed to work.
Or May Not
Slashdot, fix the reply notifications... You won't get away with it...
See: http://www.migrationobservator...
It was In/Out - okay put in slightly more descriptive terms on the ballot, but the vote was simply polarised.
There was nothing on the ballot about reducing immigration or having tariff free trade with Europe.
- On the point of a deadline, how many Europeans will flood to the UK before they close the door? And if It's so bad to be outside the EU, why do they keep coming in their 100s of 1000s?
ahaha! You call this fair?! :D
Why exactly would anyone want to save up £5 a week specifically for changing nationality 5 years later, if the letter and the spirit of the law is precisely that people can move to other countries without having to acquire citizenship or get a visa?
They figure if they can wait long enough, they can replace the will of the people with the will of the Eurocrats.
Apparently Brussels (and the fellow travellers in London) doesn't like it when commoners try to flee the plantation. Silly modbombers.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.