Slashdot Mirror


Microsoft and Facebook Just Built a 4,000-Mile Cable Across the Pacfic Ocean (popularmechanics.com)

An anonymous reader quotes Popular Mechanics: Microsoft, Facebook and global telecommunication infrastructure company Telxius have completed the Marea subsea cable, the world's most technologically advanced undersea cable. The Marea crosses the Atlantic Ocean over 17,000 feet below the ocean's surface, connecting Virginia Beach with Bilbao, Spain. Over 4,000 miles (6,600 kilometers) long and weighing nearly 10.25 million pounds (4.65 million kilograms), the Marea can transmit up to 160 terabits of data per second, which Microsoft notes is "more than 16 million times faster than the average home internet connection, making it capable of streaming 71 million high-definition videos simultaneously."
The undersea cable -- about 1.5 times the diameter of a garden hose -- contains eight pairs of fiber optic cables encircled by copper, a protective layer of hard plastic, and then waterproof coating. Its 4,000-mile route had to avoid everything from earthquake zones to active volcanoes.

Cables under the Atlantic Ocean carry 55% more data than cables under the Pacific, Microsoft writes, adding that "the project highlights the increasing role of private companies in building the infrastructure of the future."

92 of 151 comments (clear)

  1. Atlantic? Pacific? WTF by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    NT

    1. Re:Atlantic? Pacific? WTF by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Cables under the Atlantic Ocean carry 55% more data than cables under the Pacific

      Is this due to water temperature, or ocean currents? I'm planning a trip to Spain soon and looking forward to seeing the Pacific Ocean.

    2. Re:Atlantic? Pacific? WTF by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 2

      EditorDavid needs his GPS fixed

      --
      SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
    3. Re:Atlantic? Pacific? WTF by flopsquad · · Score: 5, Funny

      I think the summary was pretty clear. The Marea cable is a highly advanced undersea cable that connects West Virginia Beach to Billings, Montana, crossing the Indian Ocean at a depth of 16,000mi (7km). It weighs a ton (1.09 nautical tons) and has the capacity to transmit 180 tibibytes of data across the Arctic Ocean—roughly equivalent to 1 billion "likes", 64 million unrequested Windows 10 updates, 14,000 librarians of congress, or infinity SMS messages. Geez RTFS.

      --
      Nothing posted to /. has ever been legal advice, including this.
    4. Re:Atlantic? Pacific? WTF by flopsquad · · Score: 2

      I'm torn between "Whoosh!" and slow clapping the driest delivery since giving birth during Exodus.

      --
      Nothing posted to /. has ever been legal advice, including this.
    5. Re: Atlantic? Pacific? WTF by fullback · · Score: 1

      How many Olympic-size swimming pools does this equal?

    6. Re:Atlantic? Pacific? WTF by Hognoxious · · Score: 4, Funny

      I think it's to do with the Earth's rotation. In the Atlantic the data is moving with the spin, whereas in the Pacific it's against it, or something.

      Obviously this doesn't apply in Australia.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    7. Re: Atlantic? Pacific? WTF by brunes69 · · Score: 1

      It's also because the Atlantic is MUCH smaller than the Pacific and thus cables are MUCH shoter and cheaper.

    8. Re:Atlantic? Pacific? WTF by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      s/GPS fixed/H1B revoked/

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  2. Pacfic or Atlantic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

    I guess the headline needs to be fixed.

    1. Re:Pacfic or Atlantic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      No, the cable needs to be rerouted.

    2. Re:Pacfic or Atlantic by Zemran · · Score: 3, Funny

      Or we could relocate Spain?

      --
      I love stacking my barbecues in the shed at the end of summer - you can't beat a bit of grill on grill action.
    3. Re:Pacfic or Atlantic by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Or we could relocate Spain?

      We already tried that. It led to a lot of complaints.

    4. Re:Pacfic or Atlantic by Tough+Love · · Score: 3, Informative

      It's irritating/embarrassing to see that major blunder just sit there for hours as search engines slurp it up and it embeds itself deeper in the sediment of the internet, to the eternal shame of Slashdot. Either a severe lack of attention by editors, or the code is too broken to allow revising the post? Either way it's a burning issue. Also note the typo in Pacific, as others pointed out. Posted without spell check? Why?

      The article is otherwise fine, and confirms what we suspected all along: the internet is made of garden hose, not tubes.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    5. Re:Pacfic or Atlantic by PolygamousRanchKid+ · · Score: 3, Funny

      It's a Quantum Mechanics type question:

      Schrödinger's Ocean is Atlantic and Pacific at the same time . . .

      --
      Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
  3. Title wrong by gringer · · Score: 4, Informative

    Someone needs to read their own summary: this looks like the Atlantic Ocean, not the Pacific Ocean.

    --
    Ask me about repetitive DNA
    1. Re:Title wrong by nukenerd · · Score: 4, Informative

      Someone needs to read their own summary: this looks like the Atlantic Ocean, not the Pacific Ocean.

      They didn't say it was the Pacific Ocean. They said it was the Pacfic Ocean. Must be a new one - caused by rising sea levels?

  4. WTF? Pacific in the Atlantic??? by OzPeter · · Score: 1

    These certainly are strange days. The Pacific is now in the Atlantic*. Next you'll be telling me that Cats are living with Dogs and that US is actually a reality show a la Truman.

    How the fuck you get the Pacific I don't know. It's as if the last thing in the submission said "Pacific" and that's all the "editors" can remember - the last thing they saw.

    --
    I am Slashdot. Are you Slashdot as well?
  5. Well, which one is it? by tuxkamen · · Score: 1

    Glad I took the time to read TFA. I would have been thoroughly confused given the headline and the summary text. Thanks for that.

    --
    Use a little common sense once in a while. --Book of Mooch Ch. 5 verse 14
  6. Diameter in "garden hose?" by king+neckbeard · · Score: 4, Funny

    What is that in hogsheads?

    --
    This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    1. Re:Diameter in "garden hose?" by thinkwaitfast · · Score: 1
      Incompatible units.hhd is a volume.

      http://www.wolframalpha.com/in...

    2. Re:Diameter in "garden hose?" by Zemran · · Score: 5, Funny

      Is that a metric garden hose or an imperial garden hose?

      --
      I love stacking my barbecues in the shed at the end of summer - you can't beat a bit of grill on grill action.
    3. Re:Diameter in "garden hose?" by charliemerritt03 · · Score: 1

      When they build a big one they use Fire Hose units.

    4. Re:Diameter in "garden hose?" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      African garden hose or a European garden hose?

    5. Re:Diameter in "garden hose?" by BrianMarshall · · Score: 2
      'Bout 0.03 hogshead-head-diameters or, of course, 0.00011 furlongs.

      5/8 inch inside diameter means roughly 7/8 inches or 0.875 inches outside diameter.

      An old-time tobacco Hogshead was apparently 30 inches in diameter at the head, so... 0.875 / 30 = 0.029

      A Google search for "0.875 inches in furlongs" (without the quotes) gives us 0.00011 furlongs.

      --
      "When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro" -- HST
    6. Re:Diameter in "garden hose?" by chipschap · · Score: 1

      'Bout 0.03 hogshead-head-diameters or, of course, 0.00011 furlongs.

      Wonder how many fortnights it took to build it?

    7. Re:Diameter in "garden hose?" by Bearhouse · · Score: 1

      It changes halfway across the ocean...

  7. Re:WTF? Pacific in the Atlantic??? by thinkwaitfast · · Score: 3, Informative

    Complaining about the "editors" is 28% of slashdot traffic. What is the incentive to change?

  8. Slashdot editor confuses Atlantic & Pacific Oc by williamyf · · Score: 1

    News at 11

    --
    *** Suerte a todos y Feliz dia!
  9. Pacific or Atlantic? by therealkevinkretz · · Score: 2

    Headline says Pacific, article says Atlantic

    1. Re:Pacific or Atlantic? by msauve · · Score: 2

      No, worse than that. Headline says "Pacfic".

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    2. Re:Pacific or Atlantic? by wonkey_monkey · · Score: 5, Funny

      Pacfic

      Blinky looked at PacMan, gazing at his wide mouth and unblinking eye. They'd been on opposite sides for so long, but now, as he watched the yellow circle swallowing the pills, he felt a fluttering in his sheet...

      --
      systemd is Roko's Basilisk.
    3. Re:Pacific or Atlantic? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Pacfic

      Blinky looked at PacMan, gazing at his wide mouth and unblinking eye. They'd been on opposite sides for so long, but now, as he watched the yellow circle swallowing the pills, he felt a fluttering in his sheet...

      Your Pacfic interests me, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.

  10. Re:Que? by dgatwood · · Score: 1

    All the oceans are connected together, so arguably if you're crossing the Atlantic, you're also crossing the Pacific. :-D

    --

    Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

  11. Only Approved Traffic by FrankHaynes · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Only approved traffic will be allowed on the new cable. Anyone critical of Microsoft or Facebook will be banned from using it.

    --
    slashdot: A failed experiment.
    1. Re:Only Approved Traffic by lucm · · Score: 1

      Only approved traffic will be allowed on the new cable. Anyone critical of Microsoft or Facebook will be banned from using it.

      Gotta protect the pipe. It will only allow for 71 millions hd streaming at the same time. Just the Facebook and MSN ads take more than that.

      --
      lucm, indeed.
    2. Re:Only Approved Traffic by gweihir · · Score: 1

      So encryption will be banned on it?

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
  12. Re:WTF? Pacific in the Atlantic??? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    #Trump will make the Pacific Atlantic again and make Mexico pay for his ignorance.

  13. Taking the long way round? by MiniMike · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...4,000-Mile Cable Across the Pacfic Ocean ... connecting Virginia Beach with Bilbao, Spain

    Microsoft maps claims another victim!

  14. Allow to me clear things up. by Gravis+Zero · · Score: 2

    Microsoft and Facebook laid a giant cable across The Atlantic to keep them from posting any more mean things about them. This wasn't an accident, they did this pacifically because they heard bad things were going to be in the next issue.

    I'm not sure how you guys got all confused about something so simple. ;)

    --
    Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
  15. Only 16 strands? by aaarrrgggh · · Score: 2

    Seems odd to build new cables with such a low strand count-- is it just a function of the optical amplifiers?

    1. Re:Only 16 strands? by gweihir · · Score: 4, Informative

      For technological reasons, this gives the best value. There are also undersea fiber-optic cables with just 4 strands, and two of them are reserve ones. So the 8 pairs seen here are actually pretty high. And yes, it is mostly the amplifiers needed, they cannot get too large or you cannot just put them in the cable. These amplifiers are pretty tricky with laser-pumped Erbium embedded into the fiber.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
  16. 4.65 million kgs by Viol8 · · Score: 2

    = 4650 tonnes. Which would have been a lot easier for most people to grog straight away. Still, at least they didn't measure it in elephants tho I suppose it won't be long before submitters drop to that dumbed down level.

    1. Re:4.65 million kgs by Motard · · Score: 2

      I don't think I can grog that much.

    2. Re:4.65 million kgs by Viol8 · · Score: 1

      I doubt anyone gives a damn about the slight difference between a ton and a tonne. Also if the submitter wanted to be 100% accurate he should have given its weight down to the nearest kg or lb, not rounded it off.

    3. Re:4.65 million kgs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      4.65 Gigagrams
      4.65 Gg

  17. Re:LOL headline by Killian35 · · Score: 1

    I don't understand this comment.

  18. Goddamn slashdot editors are getting stupid by RightwingNutjob · · Score: 2

    Nevermind the failure at geography. The whole damn headline is wrong. Neither Facebook nor Microsoft did anything other than write a big fat check to the telecom company that runs undersea cables. If Amazon and Apple were to have the driveways of their headquarters repaved, would the slashdot headline breathlessly scream "Amazon and Apple Build New Highway!" or something similarly retarded?

    1. Re:Goddamn slashdot editors are getting stupid by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 2

      Did they build gigantic multi-billion dollar headquarters, or did the construction companies they hired?

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    2. Re:Goddamn slashdot editors are getting stupid by msauve · · Score: 2

      So, it's the Foxconn iPhone?

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    3. Re:Goddamn slashdot editors are getting stupid by RightwingNutjob · · Score: 1

      Depends on their level of involvement in the architecture and design of the buildings, doesn't it?

      But just as the appropriate verbiage for my example would be, "X had their driveways repaved," the correct way to write TFA would be "Facebook and Microsoft commissioned/ordered/payed for/bought a trans-Antarctic cable."

    4. Re:Goddamn slashdot editors are getting stupid by RightwingNutjob · · Score: 1

      If it's Foxconn IP with an Apple sticker on the outside, then sure. If it's not, then no.

    5. Re:Goddamn slashdot editors are getting stupid by msauve · · Score: 1

      Non sequitur, since when Microsoft and Facebook do the design and development, you claim it's different.

      From a MS press release: "Microsoft and Facebook agreed to partner on the development, Spanish telecommunication infrastructure company Telxius, a subsidiary of telecom provider TelefÃnica, joined as the third partner to manage the construction process and operate the cable." From a Facebook press release: "Microsoft and Facebook designed MAREA..."

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
  19. Hint: by DaMattster · · Score: 2

    They did not do this out of altruism. They expect to make a handsome profit over selling access to it. I find it hard to get excited about corporate giants that innovate. I get more excited when the little guy achieves something big.

    1. Re:Hint: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      "corporate giants that innovate" are exceedingly rare. Don't look at them without proper eye-wear.

  20. Bigger feat not mentioned by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 2

    They also moved pacific ocean between USA and Europe.

    --
    sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
  21. Microsoft and Facebook Just Built a 4,000-Mile Cab by rickyslashdot · · Score: 2

    Holy Sh!t, EditorDavid - you either need more coffee, or more beer, or better weed (maybe all 3) - AND a $4.99 globe (with pencil sharpener) - to determine what the difference between PACIFIC and ATLANTIC mean to the REAL WORLD - - - - ooops, guess I forgot where I was posting, since /. does seem to make up it's OWN real world on occasion -lol-

    I really, REALLY hope this was a spoofed sig, and not a post from one of /.'s REAL editors . . . . .

    --
    redneck geek
  22. CALEA Compliant by dave562 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I wonder if the NSA has tapped it yet.

    1. Re:CALEA Compliant by whoever57 · · Score: 1

      I wonder if this cable is a response to the revelations of NSA tapping cables.

      Does this provide Microsoft and Facebook any more protection (legal or technical) against NSA tapping without warrants?

      --
      The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
    2. Re:CALEA Compliant by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      I'm sure the major powers have tapped everything, as well as placed little bombs hidden somewhere along those thousands of miles, for every undersea cable, ready to go in case of a war.

      As with anything cool and complex, the angry men ready to destroy it are prepared, to preserve their power.

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    3. Re:CALEA Compliant by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      I wonder if there's a secret undersea war. The US should build a little machine to regularly go up and down these cables, and cut free anything that's on it that doesn't belong.

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    4. Re:CALEA Compliant by dave562 · · Score: 1

      I forget which one of the first five Defcon's it was, but I remember sitting in on a presentation where the presenter laid out where all the undersea cables terminate and made the case that it would be pretty easy to destroy them. Keep in mind this was about 20 years ago, so they likely have additional connection points. Or maybe not.

  23. FTFY by Cornwallis · · Score: 3, Funny

    Microsoft writes, adding that "the project highlights the increasing role of private companies in hobbling the infrastructure of the future."

  24. Here it is deniers!!! by Vinegar+Joe · · Score: 1, Funny

    More evidence of man-made "continental shift" and "ocean change". Unless the UN quickly acts, 97% of scientists think the Bering Sea will surround Tahiti in 15 years.

    --
    "The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old......They literally know nothing." - Ben Rhodes
  25. Re:Substitute "Government" for "Microsoft/Facebook by DogDude · · Score: 1

    "Private" is better. Always.

    No it isn't, troll.

    --
    I don't respond to AC's.
  26. Specific Ocean by pipingguy · · Score: 2

    Maybe it goes leftwards from the west coast all the way around to Spain?

    1. Re:Specific Ocean by mikael · · Score: 1

      Only during regular office hours. Outside of those it goes in the opposite direction.

      --
      Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
  27. Juicy Target by amiga3D · · Score: 1

    You know the NSA can't wait to tap into that. https://www.wired.com/2016/09/...

    1. Re:Juicy Target by rholtzjr · · Score: 2

      What do you mean wait? Consider it already done.

    2. Re:Juicy Target by Motard · · Score: 1

      What do you mean wait? Consider it already funded.

      Perhaps more accurate.

  28. Re:Substitute "Government" for "Microsoft/Facebook by nukenerd · · Score: 1

    At least you're not forced to pay for Microsoft/Facebook's cable; if you don't like their policies, then build your own damn cable. ... you're forced to pay for that Government cable.

    "Private" is better. Always.

    I've been forced to pay for Microsoft's pre-loaded operating systems several times. That or drop out the the modern world by having no PC. You can avoid paying any government too - by dropping out the the modern world and living on a rock. There are still a number of isolated rocks in the sea that are unclaimed, and if that sounds too barren and windswept you can always build your own damned infrastucture on it.

  29. TELXIUS built the fucking cable by haruchai · · Score: 4, Interesting

    not M$ or FB. They paid for it.
    My neighbor paid a contractor to build an extension to his house.
    But he didn't do so much as lift a fucking brick. It's his house, he paid for it but he did NOT "build" it.

    --
    Pain is merely failure leaving the body
    1. Re: TELXIUS built the fucking cable by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      +1 on this remark. In addition, private companies have been laying communications infrastructure since it could be done. This article reads like a shill advertisement to celebrate deregulated industry. Nice work by the technical folks, but fuck the marketing side.

    2. Re:TELXIUS built the fucking cable by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 1

      My neighbor paid a contractor to build an extension to his house.

      The contractor didn't build the house - his tradesmen did.

      See, this makes no sense.

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
  30. FLAG by sootman · · Score: 4, Interesting

    One of my favorite articles of all time from any source is the piece Neal Stephenson wrote for Wired about the Fiber Optic Link (around the) Globe, or FLAG, in 1996.

    https://www.wired.com/1996/12/...

    It went from England to Japan (about 28,000 km/17,500 miles) and carried "just under 8 Gbps of actual throughput". 21 years later, this new cable has TWENTY THOUSAND times the bandwidth. Nice.

    --
    Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
    1. Re:FLAG by CG_Man · · Score: 1

      Yes!!!! What a great read that was. That's probably the reason for my positive view of Wired all these years since.

  31. Avoiding earthquake zones? by sizzzzlerz · · Score: 1

    How? One of the biggest on the whole planet run south to north smack dab in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean separating the North American Plate from the Eurasian You may even have heard of it. Its called the Mid-Atlantic Ridge. The two plates are continuously pulling apart from each other, generating earthquakes all the time. You lay cable across the Atlantic west to east, you have to cross it

    1. Re:Avoiding earthquake zones? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      How? One of the biggest on the whole planet run south to north smack dab in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean separating the North American Plate from the Eurasian You may even have heard of it. Its called the Mid-Atlantic Ridge. The two plates are continuously pulling apart from each other, generating earthquakes all the time. You lay cable across the Atlantic west to east, you have to cross it

      I worked on the hydrographic survey for the East Asia Crossing back in 2001. We did the deep water multibeam sonar from Hong Kong to Singapore and back up to Taiwan and drew up the preliminary route maps. Also surveyed the landings in Manila using high resolution multibeam and sidescan. There were several geologic features we had to develop around due to excessive slopes, etc. Just northeast of Singapore the projected route went over a previously uncharted subsea volcano. I was running the multibeam and nav when we found it. Woke the cable route survey engineer and asked if the had any magma proof subsea cable. Took 3 days to develop around the volcano.

  32. Re:Substitute "Government" for "Microsoft/Facebook by viperidaenz · · Score: 2

    Have you wondered why it's always more expense to build a PC these days than buy one?
    The crapware they load on the pre-loaded Windows OS more than pays for the OS license.

    That bundled Windows is actually making your PC cheaper.

  33. Have you ever been to Spain by p51d007 · · Score: 2

    Well I never been to Spain But I kinda like the music Say the ladies are insane there And they sure know how to use it They don't abuse it Never gonna lose it I can't refuse it (you either have to be OLD like me, or love that music to know the group)

  34. Re:Que? by scdeimos · · Score: 1

    While you could have a trans-Pacific cable connecting Virginia Beach with Bilbao, Spain why would you go the long way round? In actuality this just shows that /. editors are dead between the ears.

  35. It's all a bunch of pipes, maybe they... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Tunneled it Pacific over or under Atlantic just like ipv6 over ipv4?

  36. Head End? by hduff · · Score: 1

    I live in VB. Where is the facility located?

    --
    "I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it." : Dogbert
    1. Re:Head End? by chipschap · · Score: 1

      I live in VB.

      I prefer to live in Emacs.

  37. Re:Headline by chipschap · · Score: 2

    Journalism has taken a nosedive in the last five-years.

    I wouldn't use "journalism" and "Slashdot" in the same sentence.

  38. The Forgot to tell about... by neoRUR · · Score: 1

    The Top secret 6 strands of Fiber Optic cable in there that is only available to certain agencies.

  39. Fake news for nerds by whoda · · Score: 3, Interesting

    With headlines like this staying uncorrected on a 'smart persons' web site for hours, it is easy to see how just a little fake news could sway an election using the less-informed public.

  40. Measures used by nyri · · Score: 1

    Is the usage of obscure units some kind of inside joke that I'm unaware of. Here are all the units used in the summary:

    * Over 17,000 feet below the ocean's surface [should be in meters]
    * Over 4,000 miles (6,600 kilometers) long [Thank you for having a proper unit. But WTF is with the precision. Weight is given at least with three significant numbers.]
    * weighing nearly 10.25 million pounds (4.65 million kilograms) [Million kilograms. Really? How about tons?]
    * 160 terabits of data per second / more than 16 million times faster than the average home internet connection / streaming 71 million high-definition videos
    * 1.5 times the diameter of a garden hose [Does this even deserve a comment?]

  41. 160 terabits of censorship by aliquis · · Score: 1

    ... then again it's not like our government let us say what's on our mind either anyway ..

  42. Chilling by StormReaver · · Score: 1

    So two of the world's most evil companies now control the largest data pipe between continents. This is very scary for Freedom.

  43. Re:Substitute "Government" for "Microsoft/Facebook by nukenerd · · Score: 1

    I do build my own PCs these days, but I have bought ones too. In the UK you need to go a long way to find a PC not pre-loaded with Windows.

  44. Re:Substitute "Government" for "Microsoft/Facebook by nukenerd · · Score: 1

    The crapware they load on the pre-loaded Windows OS more than pays for the OS license.

    That bundled Windows is actually making your PC cheaper.

    I am well aware of that. But, cheaper or not, MS and Gates still receive some money from me. I prefer to pay more to avoid that, and the crap & spy-ware.