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Tesla Model 3 Owners Share More Info On Model (arstechnica.com)
Owners at the Model 3 Owners Club compiled a list of over 80 different features of the Model 3 they're curious about, including questions about how the car operates (does the card unlock all the doors, where does the UI show you that your turn signals are active), physical aspects of the car (what does the tow hitch attachment look like, how much stuff can you fit in the front and rear cargo areas), and subjective details (how aggressive is the energy regeneration, does that wood trim cause glare). Ars Technica reports: So far, we've learned a few interesting facts. For instance, the windshield wipers are turned on and off by a stalk like just about every other car on the market, but changing the speed (slow/fast/intermittent) is handled by a menu on the touchscreen. The stalk also does double duty turning on the headlights, and there are no rain sensors for the wipers. The touchscreen UI really is the only way to interact with every other function, according to owners, even the rear air vents are controlled from up front (although there are USB ports in the back). Rear seat passengers also won't get seat heaters from what we gather -- unless Tesla plans to activate them in a later software update -- and the steering wheel is not heated either. The two buttons on the steering wheel do not appear to be user-configurable. Instead, the left button primarily deals with audio functions (scroll up and down for volume, left and right to change track) while the other one is for adjusting the mirrors and steering wheel position while in those menus in the UI. Additionally it appears that as of now, there's no way to tab through a different part of the UI without taking your hands off the steering wheel.
So one of the problems that any car attempting to integrate technology could face is a poor user interface. There's a video on an older Maserati on Youtube where the reviewer comments about flaws in the interface, including issues where some features require use of both the physical button and the on-screen controls, and in a nutshell, too much time has to be taken off paying attention to the road in order to operate these features.
Personally I think that touchscreens are a horrible way to control a car. There's no tactile feedback on a touchscreen. One cannot tell for certain without taking one's eyes from the road what one is doing with the interface. Its bad enough for optional things like the radio and cell phone interaction, but it's a real problem for things that are mandatory when driving. The article summary's comment on the windshield wipers is a case in point, if most of the time I just need a light intermittent wiper setting I probably will leave my wipers set that way. If I drive into a thunderstorm on the highwayay I might immediately need fast-speed wipers. It's bad enough to not have an immediate way to turn up the speed without thinking, but if I have to hunt through menus to find the setting then that could be disastrous.
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
While driving, there are a lot of functions that are needed without taking your eyes off the road. Touch Screens you need your eyes to help target where you are going to press. For adjusting the wiper speed, the Touch Screen will cause you take your eyes off the road, to deal with a low visibility problem is just a bad idea.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
The interior initially smells like Elon's balls.
After a few hours, it will smell like Elon's balls mixed with your own farts. So musky, so smug.
So that was u who got caught licking the seats?
Does it have four wheels and get you from point A to point B? I mean, that's the part I care about most. The second part is if it comes with that sweet wood paneling on the outside and have a large rear hatch. ;)
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
" For instance, the windshield wipers are turned on and off by a stalk like just about every other car on the market, but changing the speed (slow/fast/intermittent) is handled by a menu on the touchscreen. "
So you can't see well because it's suddenly raining harder, so you need to adjust your wiper speed... and now you have to play with a touch screen app, instead of simply pushing the wiper stalk up higher?
That doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
Instead of trying true and tested methods, Tesla pushes the boundaries of what is acceptable; let the gull-wing doors hint at what to expect. Sorry Elon, you're no Steve Jobs when it comes to user interface (or whoever your UI hero may be).
I really wish manufacturers would take UI seriously, and this goes across all industries. If your new and fancy method makes me take 2x as long to do the task with 2X the error vs. the old method, then your method sucks. Microsoft is particularly bad about this too; how many friggin clicks do I have to do perform to do simple tasks in Win 10 (compared to XP)?
I'm on the waiting list for a 3 and will give the car a good test drive and read reviews before deciding to get the car. I don't think touchscreen v. dozens of buttons is necessarily a killer issue, and I expect that UI rough patches will be fixed by software update by the time. And still I'm really discouraged by these articles.
What's most offensive to me is that cars are being released like a video game, where it's put out into the public and then the maker vows to fix it sometime later. The car can't even play music, except through Slacker Radio! Really, Bluetooth doesn't work, there's no AM/FM hardware (eventually it will have TuneIn), there's no audio-in, there's no USB audio...
It's like...WTF? A car which can't even play music is a car that should have had the release delayed a month or two until they got the basics worked out. I don't mind minor adjustments or fixes, but this seems like an unfinished car, released into the wild.
Slashdot: providing anti-social weirdos a soapbox, since 1997.
The interior initially smells like Elon's balls.
After a few hours, it will smell like Elon's balls mixed with your own farts. So musky, so smug.
So that was u who got caught licking the seats?
Ewwww.... That's leather mister...
Having been in a car where the driver had to take their eyes off the road to see what screen the display was on so they can switch to the Radio controls to change the station, it was scary. Now in my 2007, no touch screen UI dash board, I can be blindfolded and operate all functions I need to drive and that is the way the car should be....
If the person who uses the Tesla 3 to tow is on Slashdot, could you please message me? I need to know what the fuck you're thinking.
NOTE: Never mind, I found the guy. He's exactly what I expected, and he's even wearing a fedora.
https://youtu.be/fQFQMaMsXS0
You are welcome on my lawn.
The principle is that any essential and/or frequently performed task should be accessible by a control that does not require drivers to take their eye off the road
No way. Touch screens are the only way of the future. And, the entire road systems should be a solar powered touch screen too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H901KdXgHs4
My 10 year old Mini, for which I paid far less than a Model 3, has automatic headlights and automatic wipers with rain sensors. The only car I own without such things was made in the 20th century and is somewhat a collectible. No way I am going back to playing speed chase with the intermittent wipers especially on a silly touchscreen. Musky FAIL.
The touchscreen UI really is the only way to interact with every other function
Not only just because its a massive single point of failure that sounds like it could even prevent you from operating the vehicle, but also because its more dangerous.
A touch screen is multifunctional so you can't just know what it is currently controlling. Also there is no tactile feedback. So unlike physical buttons (at least once you're used to them) you invariably have to take your eyes off the road for the duration of what may even be a multi-touch operation to get to the right screen first, which is downright dangerous.
Exactly this. I operate all of my vehicles without taking my eyes off the road/dirt/water. Tactile UI work so much better than Touch but they don't look as cool in the sales brochure.
This is just reckless and people are going to get hurt. I hope there are theme options for that.
What I find just as horrifying about the 3 is the complete lack of a driver's dashboard display. I would never want to look to the right at a center console to see my speed/gear/gas and other basic information. "Simplicity" is not compatible with the ages and ages of perfected driver-centric design. They just threw it out the window and said- "Uh, yeah, let's just have one, huge, ugly, protruding, landscape, rectangular display in the center." Not what I would want or expect.
That is IN ADDITION to the lack of physical controls that drivers learn to interact with WITHOUT taking their eyes from the road- things like lights, cruise control adjustments, seat position, mirror adjustments, full audio controls, etc. I mean, if I want to change driving modes (like sport vs. normal vs. eco), reset my trip meter, or even just adjust the damn climate temperature I would have to wade through menus and changing screens?
Even cheap cars have simple array microphones in the headliner that work pretty well for voice recognition. On my car the built-in microphones work better than holding the phone to your face and talking.
My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
This times 1000. The radio in my car doesn't have volume or tuning knobs. Every time I have to adjust the volume I want to punch the touchscreen back into the firewall of the dashboard.
Every radio needs two knobs and, at least, a row of physical buttons along the bottom of the touch screen so I can use the thing without looking at it.
I had a Sunbird in the early 90's and, as lousy a "sports car" as it was, it had one of the greatest dash layouts ever. You could control nearly everything without taking your hands off of the steering wheel. It had two control sticks, one was ONLY for cruise control, and the other was ONLY for the turn signal. Every control did one thing. They all had different ridges and bumps on them so you could tell them apart by feel. The radio was mounted high and just to the right of the steering wheel so you only had to move your hand a few inches to get to it. Also, every button only did one thing, and they were all different shapes so you could find them by touch. Climate control was the furthest away from the steering wheel, but it only had three levers - fan, vent, temperature, so you didn't need to look at it to control it, either. This is what we need more of.
If you need to adjust something every time you drive, then there should be a dedicated control for it. Put it up close to the steering wheel so you don't have to move your hands around to get to it. And don't jam all of them on the steering wheel or on control sticks, you can mount them on the dashboard as well.
My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
Exactly. If I can't turn on the front defroster without looking away from the road, I don't want the car.
It seems like the way to handle a car with a touchscreen is a few tactile but unlabeled knobs for critical functions. Although I don't like the idea of a computer controlling critical functions of a car at all.
(T>t && O(n)--) == sqrt(666)
Seriously, we have a number of obvious astroturfers that are constantly ripping Tesla, SpaceX, solar City, etc and thing that Musk starts.
Now, the current BS in here is about the touch screen vs buttons.
I drive a highlander as my car, and then will drive my wife's car, a Tesla MS.
I regularly have to look at the highlander's buttons on the radio because there are SO many. In addition, the same is true of the heating system. Otherwise, I will hit the wrong ones.
BUT, with the tesla, nearly all of the HVAC controls are on the bottom of the touch screen. The only one that I really have to fiddle with is fan, which happens to be right on my steering wheel as well.
Then across the top, we have a number of buttons, which basically act like a file folder management for the 2 main windows. We have both found that the ONLY 3 that we use are Radio, Rear View Camera, and map. Since we only use the map for long distance driving, it rarely is used. So, the top one is the Rear View Cam, and the bottom view is the radio. My wife has a number of internet stations that she listens to, which she will simply tell Tesla which one to play. Once it is on, she uses the steering wheel to control skipping the song, as well as volume.
All in all, this touch screen and UI is the best AND SAFEST thing going. Buttons? Not only a thing of the 19th century, but also dangerous and wasteful. It is why Tesla has so few accidents vs crappy ICE cars. And once the MY is out, we will give the highlander to my now 13 y.o. and switch to MY.
Now, I have seen many many 'experts' on here who obviously do not have a single fucking clue of what they are talking about. They love to ignore facts and stats. These are the same far right assholes who will push fake news and actually believe some of that shit.
There is very little doubt that more than a few of you are on the kock bros payrolls. Very sad.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Well when you have no friends and no life what else are you going to do except come on /. and bash everything to make yourself feel better about being a loser that has never actually accomplished anything in your pathetic life?
So what you're saying is that the touch screen UI is so fantastic because ... you don't use the touch screen.
Brilliant deduction, Holmes.
You've clearly stated that you mainly use buttons (those 19th century, dangerous, wasteful things) on the steering wheel rather than use the actual touch screen interface.
I grant you minus 4 internet points, and may god have mercy on your soul.
Really? My Volt gets me to and from work just fine. I bought used so no direct tax incentive for me. Cost about the same as any other 2 year old used car of similar size and miles. I spend less than 10 dollars a month charging it, compared to 45 a month for gas for the Accord it replaced. The touch screen controls take a bit of getting used to, but once set up, I can control most stuff from the steering wheel and the control stalks are like 95 percent of any car I have ever driven. Keep saying EV's are not ready for prime time. I'll keep driving mine, laughing at you.
Speak for yourself. Comes with more standard features and better performance than a comparable BMW 3-Series, at a lower price without taking into account energy cost and maintenance savings or tax credits. Now, if you're in the market for an econobox, this is not for you. Econoboxes don't come with 12 cameras, 8 ultrasonic sensors, radar, a 15" touchscreen, massive expanses of glass, automatic emergency braking, a 5,6 second base model 0-60, etc, etc.
Also, don't assume that everyone lives where you do. Where I live, electricity is cheap, but gasoline is almost $8/gallon.
If you mean "they really don't", you're correct, at least in comparison to gasoline cars. They have about 15% higher manufacturing CO2 emissions, but emissions from lifetime operation are much higher than manufacturing emissions, for both gasoline and electric cars - and the latter has far less than gasoline, even on a mixed grid containing fossil fuels as part of the mix. Namely because gasoline engines generally operate at 20-25% average efficiency (peak ~35%, but you have to be in just the right torque / rpm combination for that). A modern combined cycle baseload natural gas plant can approach 60% efficiency.
All we want to do is eat your brains.
1. Immediately accuses other people of being shills
2. Launches into a long defense of megamillion dollar corporation
3. Assumes anyone listens to Slashdot any more, and thus will spend money on shills
4. Too late, realizes that people who buy Teslas do still populate Slashdot and thus this is a good place to spend a few brand management dollars posting positive comments
5. Psychological projection: always look at what people accuse others of doing, to see what they're thinking about themselves.
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
Wow, way to turn a conversation about touch screen versus buttons in cars into a politically charged rant. I'm Left wing and all but you just come off as a troll by the end of your post. Just because some one has a contrary view to you about frick'n buttons in cars doesn't mean they're far right or on any other part of the political spectrum you happen to have issues with.
I ignore Anonymous Coward posts. If you want to discuss something, that's awesome. Log in.
You keep telling yourself that.
actually, all tesla drivers make heavy use of the touch screen. BUT, it is the core, not all of the rest.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
no, From what I am seeing is that a number of far right wingers are coming here bashing on Tesla/spacex/etc. We all see them here over and over. /. posted the story. Yet, later on, the log files would show over and over, that none of them had AP on at that time. Basically, it was bad driving.
Worse, very little of the FUD has any merit. The design on Tesla is obviously well done since Tesla has the highest buyer loyalty of any brand. The fact that there are NO accidents in Tesla related to touch screen issues after 5 years of being on the road should show ANYBODY that the argument against touch screens is just plain STUPID. If touch screens were even CLOSE to being as bad as these idiots claim, then we would see a number of accidents related to it. We just do not.
This is like the ppl that had accidents in Tesla and blamed AP and
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
I just can't get past it. The single screen in the center of the console.
The whole car looks great. Ergnomic, sleek, sexy. Except for the single 15" monitor that looks like it came straight off my 2005-era desktop and got bolted to the car. It doesn't even remotely blend into the design.
I personally mount my phone in that location when I am driving (in my normal car from 2005) and find it not a great location for a information screen. It works well for me since the phone is used for a secondary function (mapping), but I would not want it to be my primary screen. For some reason, looking down and sideways is much more distracting than just looking down over the steering wheel.
It's unfortunate they couldn't have included a smaller screen with a more conventional car instrument set immediately behind the steering wheel, like most cars have had since instrument dials were invented.
I kind of feel like they're just doing it to be petty. Like Apple removing the escape key from their laptops and the headphone jack from their phones. It saves the company a tiny bit of money, but causes the user a lot more frustration.
Sorry but eliminating contrary opinions by marginalizing them to extreme ideologies is in itself both extremist and bigoted. Personally, I've never encountered a touch screen car interface I felt was as safe as physical buttons but yet I'm, as stated before, generally left wing.
Maybe you should consider that your completely unfurnished (maybe don't existent?) safety numbers have more to do with the fact that more affluent people purchase the more expensive cars that feature touch screens and (much like with crime rates) these people are less likely to engage in dangerous / criminal activities.
Honestly, I see you making political issues out of those who disagree with you on a completely non political issue as part of our political problem in the US. There is nothing "left" or "right" about wanting tactile feedback from ones interface.
Basically, you're an extremist exactly like those you rail against. I don't think me telling you that will make a difference though. Your opinions are clearly special and above critique!
I ignore Anonymous Coward posts. If you want to discuss something, that's awesome. Log in.
"EV's just don't have the necessary range yet and with oil being under $60 bbl they cannot make any financial sense."
Oh just fuck off already please, wtf.
I regularly have to look at the highlander's buttons on the radio because there are SO many.
Your inability to learn your car's user interface or remember the relative position of the buttons does not mean that normal functioning people are better off with an interface that specifically prohibits doing so.
You can't control your HVAC without taking your eyes off the road and you have buttons? WTF is wrong with you?
"changing the speed (slow/fast/intermittent) is handled by a menu on the touchscreen."
Idiots, and people will be KILLED because of their stupidity.
I know it's easy to start criticising the touch-screen in the Tesla as "dangerous", "not respecting years of research into UI/UX design", etc.
But don't these cars automatically stop or swerve in case of problems? Is it really such a big deal if you take your eyes off the road for a couple of seconds?
Weren't people criticising the iPhone upon launch, saying that buttons were useful and that a touch-only interface with a single button was ridiculous? And now, every phone is the market is just a touch brick.
I'm excited to see what will come next after this car goes mainstream.
Motorcycle and car industries evolved a standardized way to control various aspects of a vehicle without taking hand of the steering in case of a bike and do a short, simple movement without looking in the case of a car. Ruining most of these reasonable, evolved ways of control *while keep looking ahead* is indeed stupid.
From the summary:
even the rear air vents are controlled from up front (although there are USB ports in the back). Rear seat passengers also won't get seat heaters from what we gather -- unless Tesla plans to activate them in a later software update -- and the steering wheel is not heated either.
I'm sometimes baffled by what people seem to expect. We're talking about a cheap car here, not an expensive sedan that costs around 100k. While I haven't looked at it, I assume many cars on the 30-40k range don't have heated seats or steering wheel, or even rear air vents. Now, I'm not trying to defend Tesla, I own no stock or have a special interest on being among Musk's groupies. But expecting heated back seats or whatever in cheap cars... come on!
Depending on the humidity a given temperature can be comfortable or very uncomfortable. Home thermostats are just beginning to understand that so I'd guess it will be a long time before car thermostats can. On top of that, a car's thermostat can take a few minutes to react when moving from a temperature controlled area such as a garage out into the elements.
I hate sweating while I wait for my car to realize that the AC needs to be on ... I want the AC cooling me off *now*.
I'm fully expecting the same to be true for the model 3. More so because it's built to a reduced price, production is so aggressive and they won't delay even if they discover minor / cosmetic flaws. The people who are down the list will probably benefit because the flaws will be rectified in due course. The people at the front will be the ones complaining about them.
They can. Knobs are still easier to use.
Ever see one of the new, state of the art, "glass cockpits" in airplanes? Giant, all-LCD displays across the entire control console. They still have knobs and physical buttons all over the place. Because some functions are still easier to perform with physical controls.
Every time you're looking down at a screen to fiddle with something you aren't looking at the road. The UI of a car should be designed to keep your eyes on the road as much as humanly possible. Every function you perform regularly should have a dedicated, physical button within easy reach of the steering wheel to keep your eyes on the road as much as possible.
My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
There is very little doubt that more than a few of you are on the kock bros payrolls. Very sad.
Is that you Donald?
Shut the fuck up, you stupid crybaby bitch. You obviously enjoy shoving Musk's flaccid shlong down your throat, but just because someone doesn't feel the same was doesn't make them trolls, you stupid asshole. Some of us are even better educated and have seen every trick South Africans tend to pull.
I've been here for about 10 years, and I have to say I agree with you. In the last couple of years, I have noticed what appears to be a concerted effort by the alt right to take over this site. Anti-science trolls are now common here, spewing the same long-debunked myths and outright nonsense vomited up by Breitbart, Alex Jones, Rush Limbaugh and their ilk.
Even worse, they appear to be dedicated to using moderator points to bury opposing viewpoints. One group doing that forces others to act in a similar way...which undermines a moderating process that has been relatively fair for many years.
I'm not looking back with misty eyes at a time when Slashdot was perfect. It never was. However, it used to offer a mix of geek-oriented information, amusing remarks, and sometimes even insight and interesting perspectives.
Lately, I've noticed the comment sections below just about any story featuring Elon Musk, Climate Change, renewable energy and the like...anything conservatives like to call "liberal"...are immediately swamped by right wing trolls.
The easy thing to do would be to just shrug and walk away. Unfortunately, that simply encourages them, and the next time a site is built up over years as a place where you can find at least an attempt at a balanced perspective on technology, science and the world, the alt right will flood in to poison that one, too.
I've calculated my velocity with such exquisite precision that I have no idea where I am.