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Meet The Next Major Operating System: Amazon's Alexa (zdnet.com)

Posted by EditorDavid on from the Alexa-OS dept.

ZDNet's editor-in-chief warns that Amazon has ambitious plans for its new Echo Plus: Amazon is making an explicit play to be the home hub because it can automatically discover and set up lights, locks, plugs, and switches without the need for additional hubs or apps. And the Alexa 'routines' feature will be able to tie all of this together by allowing you to automate a series of actions with a single voice command: saying "Alexa, good night," and having it turn off the lights, lock the door, and turn off the TV, for example. A platform that other apps and devices can connect into? This starts to sound a lot like an operating system for the home to me.

It's not just the home, either; Amazon announced a deal to make Alexa available in BMW and Mini vehicles from the middle of next year, allowing drivers to use the digital assistant to get directions, play music or control smart home devices while travelling, without having to use a separate app. Travellers will also have access to Alexa skills from third-party developers like Starbucks, allowing them to order their coffee while driving and thus skip the line. Back in January, Amazon and Ford said they were working together to allow voice commands to turn on the engine, lock or unlock the doors as well as play music and use other skills...

It's still early days but I think Alexa has a good shot at becoming one of the standard interfaces, certainly for consumers -- an operating system for the home, if not more, if the automotive tie-ups take off too. All of this will make Amazon a serious force to be reckoned with. Windows has the desktop, and Android and iOS can fight it out for the smartphone, but right now Alexa has a lock on the smart home.

110 of 168 comments (clear)

  1. AMZN had *better* emphasize security by sehlat · · Score: 5, Insightful

    1. Add the ability to recognize a specific voice that is authorized to issue commands. (No more South Park incidents. Period.)

    2. Make sure that things like lights, door locks, etc. ALL have manual overrides. This capability will need to be certified, which will give Amazon a lot of control over which companies/devices will work with the system. OTOH, from a security standpoint, if you don't want your home broken into, you'd better have that sort of reassurance built-in.

    Unless the OS security, both internal and external isn't a LOT better than what we're getting from the Internet of Crap, this will be another disaster.

    1. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Unless the OS security, both internal and external isn't a LOT better than what we're getting from the Internet of Crap, this will be another disaster.

      Maybe that's exactly what needs to happen. Thankfully it won't affect anyone with a clue. The rest get to (re)learn a valuable lesson about blind trust and their addiction to convenience.

    2. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by ITRambo · · Score: 1

      All great points. Thanks. I hadn't thought it through that far. I will now.

    3. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      All great points. Thanks. I hadn't thought it through that far. I will now.

      You seriously didn't think that this would be a very tempting target for hackers? Most of them will do it just to be asshats. But some will be much worse. Just wait until the home-invasion types turn into script kiddies. They can download an easy exploit and do things like remotely figure out when you're not home, unlock the doors to avoid all the noise/mess of breaking and entering, all sorts of things like that.

    4. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by geekmux · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Unless the OS security, both internal and external isn't a LOT better than what we're getting from the Internet of Crap, this will be another disaster.

      The Internet of Crap consumer has purchased an always-on listening device buried deep inside the most personal spaces of their life. What in the FUCK makes you think that kind of consumer gives a shit about emphasizing security when privacy was dismissed long ago?

      Oh, and "manual override"? That would assume the consumer A) knows how, or B) wants to learn. The entire point of automating the shit out of every little thing is so they don't have to bother with manual anything anymore.

    5. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by mikael · · Score: 1

      Get those toy parrots you see in the supermarket and get them to issue Alexa commands. Though it would be fun if you could give them Alexa commands.

      --
      Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
    6. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by R3d+M3rcury · · Score: 2

      1. Add the ability to recognize a specific voice that is authorized to issue commands. (No more South Park incidents. Period.)

      I don't own one. So I don't know if this is just marketing...

      But Amazon seems to have a new(?) series of TV Ads that I saw this morning that proclaims that Alexa can recognize different voices. So the idea is that if I say, "Alexa, call Mom" it will call my mother and not, say, my roommate's mother.

      So I assume there's another check-box somewhere that says, "Only listen to known voices."

      Of course, I'd also assume that such things are turned off by default.

    7. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      But Amazon seems to have a new(?) series of TV Ads that I saw this morning that proclaims that Alexa can recognize different voices.

      I have an Echo. If I say "Alexa play some music", she will select something I like, such as Waylon Jennings. If my daughter says the same thing, it will play something she likes, like Bruno Mars. So there is clearly some individual voice recognition.

    8. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by infolation · · Score: 1

      If I say "Alexa play some music", she will select something I like

      There's no 'she'. It's an 'it'.

    9. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      2. Make sure that things like lights, door locks, etc. ALL have manual overrides.

      Whether an IoT device has a manual override should be up to the device manufacturer, not mandated by Amazon.

      I have an Amazon Echo, along with many IoT devices. The door locks, light switches, and even the built-in speaker all have manual overrides. The security cameras do not, but that doesn't matter because there is no reason to ever manually operate a security camera. If you want it off, just unplug it. All of these devices can be operated directly from my cellphone in addition to voice control through Alexa.

    10. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by msauve · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "The Internet of Crap consumer has purchased an always-on listening device buried deep inside the most personal spaces of their life. What in the FUCK makes you think that kind of consumer gives a shit about emphasizing security when privacy was dismissed long ago?"

      Oh, I think they "give a shit." But, the typical consumer doesn't understand either the privacy or the security implications. They can't "dismiss" something they don't understan. They just naively assume that nothing happens other than it listens and reacts to the single sentence beginning with "Alexa" (or Siri, or Hey Google, or ...).

      That there's more is buried deep in legal terms no one reads.

      The recognition of that naivete in your second point should be reflected in the first.

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    11. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 2

      There's no 'she'. It's an 'it'.

      "Alexa, are you a girl?"
      "I am female in character."

    12. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Is a "specific voice" enough?
      The idea of a replay attack is already well known and understood - we solve it with complex mathematics in computing. What's the solution when it's a person?
      Record the victim saying "unlock front door", play it back via a speaker through the letterbox or pressed up against a window.

    13. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by stephanruby · · Score: 1

      Amazon is making an explicit play to be the home hub because it can automatically discover and set up lights, locks, plugs, and switches without the need for additional hubs or apps.

      This is so exciting!

      The editor-in-chief at ZDNET just discovered Network Service Discovery (NDS)

      Please no one tell him that non-Amazon devices can also do the same thing, he will surely have a stroke once he finds this out.

    14. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      What in the FUCK makes you think that kind of consumer gives a shit about emphasizing security when privacy was dismissed long ago?

      Because security and privacy are two very different things.

    15. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by geekmux · · Score: 1

      What in the FUCK makes you think that kind of consumer gives a shit about emphasizing security when privacy was dismissed long ago?

      Because security and privacy are two very different things.

      In the online space, the ignorant masses blur the line. They use the same shitty password they had in high school, and share their entire lives on social media. Privacy is dead, and security has always been considered an annoying inconvenience.

    16. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      You apply an arbitrary black and white label to something with various shades of grey.

      Ask a teen tweeting their lives away on social media if you can watch them having sex in their bedroom. Expect them to say no, because privacy isn't a black and white matter.
      Ask a person who used their same password on their facebook page since primary school why they also have a concealed carry permit. Expect them to take a defensive stance because security isn't a black and white matter either.

      Privacy isn't dismissed. You just value specific parts of your privacy differently to others. Kind of like those people who protect their telephone numbers as some kind of private intrusion and can't come to terms with the fact they used to be published in big books along with their names and addresses.

      I have a Nest. My nest account shares my email and password with my slashdot account. That password hasn't been changed in since I registered the account back in god-knows-when. Given that access to my Nest account would tell you when I'm not home I don't care about security right? Well maybe my "security" is at the building entrance, at my front door, in the trust of our close neighbours, or in the slobbering drooling teeth of my dog.

    17. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by JackieBrown · · Score: 1

      Currently you can only use Alexa to lock doors.

    18. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by R3d+M3rcury · · Score: 1

      What I'm curious about is whether if I come visit you and I say, "Alexa, play some music", will Alexa just ignore me?

      Or even scarier, it'll start playing some MCR because it knows it's me...and I don't even have an Alexa!

    19. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by Cro+Magnon · · Score: 1

      Don't say that! You'll upset her.

      --
      Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
    20. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by geekmux · · Score: 1

      You apply an arbitrary black and white label to something with various shades of grey.

      Ask a teen tweeting their lives away on social media if you can watch them having sex in their bedroom. Expect them to say no, because privacy isn't a black and white matter. Ask a person who used their same password on their facebook page since primary school why they also have a concealed carry permit. Expect them to take a defensive stance because security isn't a black and white matter either.

      I applied an online label to the problem I was describing. You brought the physical world into your examples, which I was not addressing at all. Yes, people naturally value privacy and security in the physical world. My point was people ignorantly dismiss it on the online space, and there is an endless amount of evidence that shows the risk and damage when you dismiss that, which tends to make it rather black and white.

      As far as how you manage your online space and authentication, I have no comment. You already know the risks of recycling passwords. Mitigate as you see fit.

    21. Re:AMZN had *better* emphasize security by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      I applied an online label to the problem I was describing.

      Oooh the "but on a computer" patent claim. Your online world is identical to the physical world. I share and reuse passwords, I already told you that. Now try and get in my bank account. Online off course.

      You place a different level of value on privacy than someone else and then unfairly make some assumptions based on that persons's value of security. It's an asinine conclusion to make. They are different, regardless of how you misconstrue what I said.

  2. I've been slashvertized by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    time to stop following this RSS feed.. too many ads

  3. I'll buy in by rtkluttz · · Score: 5, Insightful

    When and only when this shit is completely autonomous with no need for internet access. I won't have my shit spying on me and I won't ask an external entity to control shit in my own home. I'll drill my own hole in my own firewall and control my devices directly with no 3rd party intervention.

    --
    Digital is, by definition, imperfect. Analog is the way to go.
    1. Re:I'll buy in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I agree! Amazon is already the 3rd marketing powerhouse on web, right after Google and Facebook (probably 1st in 5 years). It seems like a pretty obvious play.

    2. Re:I'll buy in by Mitreya · · Score: 1

      When and only when this shit is completely autonomous with no need for internet access. I won't have my shit spying on me and I won't ask an external entity to control shit in my own home.

      But then how would your data be sold and re-sold?

      Nowdays we can't even get single player games to stop requiring constant internet access. Your "home OS" will absolutely be fully online -- and automatically updating itself every day at the most inopportune moment.

      We can also look forward to discovering that the refrigerator and the toilet are incompatible with AlexaOS and must be replaced before they can be used.

    3. Re:I'll buy in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Not a chance. This garbage is subsidized by invading your privacy.

    4. Re:I'll buy in by geekmux · · Score: 1

      When and only when this shit is completely autonomous with no need for internet access. I won't have my shit spying on me and I won't ask an external entity to control shit in my own home. I'll drill my own hole in my own firewall and control my devices directly with no 3rd party intervention.

      Looks like you better get busy then. DIY is clearly the answer here, especially when the other 99.999% of solutions will continue to be made for the masses who don't give a shit about security, and will sell their privacy for peanuts.

    5. Re:I'll buy in by ceoyoyo · · Score: 2

      Problem is, most of the stuff Amazon sells isn't Alexa stuff. I see the hierarchy this way:

      1. Apple: makes physical products, things like Siri are features of those products. Apple could probably make a bit of extra money spying on you, but it could easily hurt their primary business.

      2. Amazon: sells physical products, but only a few that they could use to spy on you. Amazon can use your information to sell you lots of other stuff. If you don't buy Alexa devices because you don't want to be spied on, it's not really a bit part of their business.

      3. Facebook, Google: revenue is pure advertising. Any information they get from you must be used to support their advertising business.

    6. Re:I'll buy in by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      Nowdays we can't even get single player games to stop requiring constant internet access. Your "home OS" will absolutely be fully online

      Why? I play (when I play) all my games on a non-connected machine. If it won't start, I don't play it, there's plenty more in my backlog I haven't gotten around to. As for the "home OS", why would you allow it online? There's plenty of options out there that are fully controllable by you. Don't buy Alexa/Google/Siri products.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
  4. Interesting story by Kohath · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This is quite the story. But I actually have an Amazon Echo. It turns off my lights ok, but I can’t find much else for it to do.

    I’m not super interested in hearing poorly-curated music played out of a small speaker. News is occasionally semi-interesting at best.

    And Alexa doesn’t do much of anything unless you use the app and go find “skills” for it. The capabilities of the skills are disappointing.

    Does anyone have any stories about Alexa doing useful things? True stories only, not made up stuff about what it might do someday.

    1. Re:Interesting story by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I have a story about Alexa doing something useful.

      The other day I was comparing items on Amazon and I saw a link to Alexa. I clicked on it, decided that even if Amazon were to pay me to send me one for free I wouldn't want a spy in my house. So really, Alexa saved me from wasting USD$99 on a spying device.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    2. Re:Interesting story by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Try plugging it into external speakers via the line-out. Makes all the difference.

      I have my Alexa plugged to a nice pair of speakers (Yamaha HS80M in this case). Also, have it linked with Spotify so I can play it out to them and be controlled from the phone.

      Another nice touch is being able to pair it as a Bluetooth speaker itself, so now I can stream a movie from any device and have it play out on the speakers as well.

      Other things I found useful -

      Shopping lists (i.e when I run out of milk, "Alexa, add milk to shopping list"), never forget anything when I got to the grocery store.

      "Alexa, play bedtime lullaby" - if you have an infant

      "Alexa, set a timer for 45 minutes" - when cooking.

      "Alexa, what's the price of bitcoin/gold/stock" - if you're casually trading

      Haven't tried any IoT stuff yet though.

    3. Re:Interesting story by Kohath · · Score: 1

      Try plugging it into external speakers

      I already have less kludgy ways to experience music.

      Other things I found useful -

      Shopping lists (i.e when I run out of milk, "Alexa, add milk to shopping list"), never forget anything when I got to the grocery store.

      "Alexa, play bedtime lullaby" - if you have an infant

      "Alexa, set a timer for 45 minutes" - when cooking.

      "Alexa, what's the price of bitcoin/gold/stock" - if you're casually trading

      Haven't tried any IoT stuff yet though.

      Sounds like a marketting feature list rather than actual stories about how people happily use their Amazon Echo.

      I tried getting stock info: it does a poor job. The info you get Is only good enough for people who don’t care about trading stocks.

    4. Re:Interesting story by Kohath · · Score: 1

      Obviously yes. Mine is an actual testimonial from someone who tried it. Most people consider those to be useful.

    5. Re: Interesting story by Kohath · · Score: 1

      I can't find value in your question or post.

      That’s ok with me.

      You make a point that you seemed to have wasted your money.

      I spent it so I could find out if I could make Alexa do something useful. I found out.

    6. Re:Interesting story by mentil · · Score: 1

      I'm waiting for the inevitable 'phone sex' skill that lets you talk dirty to Alexa. The responses could be randomized and almost noone would notice.

      --
      Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
    7. Re:Interesting story by Solandri · · Score: 1

      Iâ(TM)m not super interested in hearing poorly-curated music played out of a small speaker.

      I don't have an Echo. But I do have a Logitech Harmony Hub which I hear can be controlled by an Echo or Google Home. I can program the Harmony to turn on my AV system and tune it to a specific radio station. Have it turn on the TV, AV system, and Blu-ray player and start playing the loaded BD movie. Supposedly you can have it control Plex to play stuff on your home media server if you get some sort of USB dongle that acts as a remove control receiver (the Harmony Hub controls devices by issuing remote control signals). Smart lights and wall sockets are also controllable.

      Amazon's idea is pretty much the same as Logitech's Harmony Hub - consolidate all your remote controls and physical switches (for smart devices) and make them all available through a single interface (voice for Amazon, a handheld remove for Logitech). The big difference I can see is that my Harmony Hub still works if my Internet connection goes down. Alexa is useless without an Internet connection. If they can make Alexa's voice recognition to work locally instead of over the Internet, then I think they'll have a winner. But I suspect Alexa phoning home to tell Amazon what devices you have and what you do with them is the whole point of Alexa from Amazon's perspective.

    8. Re:Interesting story by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 1

      What's even more strange is that some people found that comment more interesting than funny:

      Moderation +3
      70% Interesting
      30% Funny

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    9. Re:Interesting story by Kohath · · Score: 1

      Amazon's idea is pretty much the same ...

      Yes, but I’d like someone to post what they actually do with it, not talk about someone’s “idea” of what they might do.

    10. Re:Interesting story by JeffElkins · · Score: 2

      My dot is very useful in conjunction with Alexa Harmony remote skills for my home theater.

      "Alexa, turn on Fire": Starts TV,receiver,Fire TV & Kodi.

      "Alexa, "Turn on Shield": Starts TV,receiver, Nvidia Shield & Kodi.

      "Alexa, turn off Fire/Alexa turn off Shield": reverse the above.

      "Alexa, Connect phone": Starts the receiver, toggles bluetooth and links to phone for streaming.

      "Alexa, drop in on...": The Echo Show makes an excellent home intercom system and link my home office and my wife's sewing room.

      Privacy is an illusion in 2017 anyway.

      --
      Why is all the good stuff already modded 5, when I have mod points?
    11. Re:Interesting story by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      This story paid for by Amazon.

    12. Re:Interesting story by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 2

      "Alexa, turn on Fire"

      Not a good command to give if you keep your Bluetooth-enabled Zippo lighter in your desk drawer.

    13. Re: Interesting story by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Saying "alexa play the white album" is faster than pulling out a phone, opening the spotify app, and typing away. And alexa works far better than siri for the subset of stuff Alexa does.

      For me, it's mostly a better way to control the stereo, and as such I'm fine having it set up permanently attached to my stereo. It isn't a cell phone replacement, and of course it will come up short if judged as such.

      It will be fucking awesome to have in a car. Just a far better way to control music/radio/audiobooks/podcasts, and GPS too I'm sure. It does pretty well with finding local stores and hours for stores, too.

    14. Re: Interesting story by Brockmire · · Score: 1

      People don't like to have to explain super basic shit to people who lack any fucking imagination. For me, I control lights, fans and satellite receivers and ask questions that don't require me to get up and go to the computer or take my phone off the charger. Electrical cables are in hard to access places and require two hands to cycle power. With cheap WiFi power sockets, I reboot these devices much easier. Seriously, these questions are annoying. If you couldn't think of a use case in a split second, just move on and leave us alone.

    15. Re: Interesting story by Brockmire · · Score: 1

      Simple query? There's no fucking Meta data that stores that. Don't be a cunt.

    16. Re: Interesting story by Kohath · · Score: 1

      It’s easy to think of things I’d like Alexa to do for me. But it doesn't do those things.

    17. Re:Interesting story by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Or your pants pocket.

    18. Re:Interesting story by Lord+Ender · · Score: 2

      My understanding is that it doesn't upload ANYTHING unless you say the keyword "Alexa" first. Then it just uploads what it needs to understand the commands. You could probably verify this with any network monitoring tool...

      So it is not a "spying" device; it's a "respond to the commands you give it" device.

      People were afraid of barcodes when they first came out. You're the latest wave of that mindset.

      --
      A slashdotter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber.
    19. Re:Interesting story by Dutch+Gun · · Score: 2

      I got an Echo Dot because I wanted to see if it would be at all useful or interesting, as that hit a price point where I didn't mind experimenting. I thought I might also like to develop software for it as well someday.

      Generally speaking, I use it for two things: the world's most hilariously over-engineered timer and an interface for adding things to my shopping list. So how does that work out? I can't even remove items from my list using Alexa. WTF? And I can't give it a list of items by saying "Alexa, add bread, milk, and eggs to my shopping list." Nope, you have to say "Alexa, add xxx to my shopping list. Alexa, add yyy to my shopping list. Alexa, add zzz to my shopping list." Again, really? Even it's most basic functionality is pretty half-assed.

      Beyond that, I still haven't really found a real use for it, at least not worth the price. It's probably more useful if:
      * You go all in and put them *everywhere* in your house, so you can more easily access it at any time.
      * You're not at your computer all day like I am, rendering it largely pointless, as anything Alexa can do, my computer can do faster and easier.

      --
      Irony: Agile development has too much intertia to be abandoned now.
    20. Re:Interesting story by trybywrench · · Score: 2

      i can say "alexa, order me a pizza" and the delivery person shows up in a few minutes. That's pretty useful when my kid's friends come over. Another thing, it's amazing how useful "Alexa, set a timer for x minutes" is when you have kids. I personally like the news and "Alexa, wikipedia {whatever you want}". Overall I'm pretty happy with it, my dot cost $50 and I've paid a lot more for a lot less many times.

      --
      I came to the datacenter drunk with a fake ID, don't you want to be just like me?
    21. Re:Interesting story by stephanruby · · Score: 1

      This is quite the story. But I actually have an Amazon Echo. It turns off my lights ok, but I can’t find much else for it to do.

      You should have bought yourself a clapper. A clapper can turn lights off and turn lights on.

      The clapper can't be connected to the NSA/FBI 24 hours a day/seven days a week, but unfortunately, no device is perfect. As much as this saddens me to say this, the government will have to find a different way to get into your home.

    22. Re:Interesting story by thegarbz · · Score: 2

      Not Alexa but Google's equivalent.

      I don't have one personally but a friend of mine was showing me what he uses it for. Basically: Anything for which he'd normally get his phone.
      "What's the weather like?"
      "What are my appointments today?"
      "What is the traffic like to work?"
      "Set an alarm for 2minutes" - more useful than it sounds considering the device is sitting in the kitchen area, followed by a lot of other useful kitchen related ones:
      "What's 2 cups in millilieters"

      but the more neat thing come in interfacing it with other devices
      "Play House of Cards on Netflix" - TV turned on and started playing the current house of cards episode.

      I'm sure more uses will come up beyond turning lights on and off. I anticipate people will treat this like Siri. At first it's a novelty, and then when the novelty wears off the die-hard users will find no end of new useful things for it to do.

    23. Re:Interesting story by Gr8Apes · · Score: 1

      My understanding is that it doesn't upload ANYTHING unless you say the keyword "Alexa" first. Then it just uploads what it needs to understand the commands. You could probably verify this with any network monitoring tool...

      Much like those SmartTVs, they'd never spy on you. Wait, not only was Samsung spying, but according to the Snowden leaks, the NSA actively was exploiting those insecure TVs to be able to listen and view selected targets, as verified by network monitoring tools.

      Don't be a tool, anything that's proprietary and has a mike/web cam that you can't control is a potential spy tool. One that's always on is a spy tool, whether you think it's sending data or not.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    24. Re:Interesting story by vanyel · · Score: 1

      The shopping list (which I do on the google version because it's easier to use on my phone) is probably the most useful feature (and worth it by itself). I also use it as my alarm clock. I have it interfaced to my solar panels (how much power was made yesterday?) and weather station (current temperature, rain today, etc), and with my eyes, it's often easier to ask alexa what time it is that try to read a clock in the distance. I explicitly *disabled* being able to order things, and will leave it that way until it can recognize that it's me doing the ordering and not someone else. Maybe not even then, as what I order from amazon generally needs some research first anyhow.

    25. Re:Interesting story by stephanruby · · Score: 1

      GM's OnStar was supposed to work the same way, but that didn't stop the FBI.

      And the only problem the judge had with it was that it prevented the occupants from calling 911 in case of an emergency, which is OnStar's primary purpose. In fact, this is what triggered the original lawsuit. The wife of a Mafia member got into a serious car accident and the OnStar button wouldn't work because the FBI was using the line already.
      https://www.cnet.com/news/cour...

    26. Re:Interesting story by im_thatoneguy · · Score: 1

      Also good for telling you the weather. "Alexa what's the weather" when wandering around the house getting dressed in the morning.

      That being said this "Alexa has won" bullshit is just that, total bullshit. Alexa has decent Harmony and Hue integrations but for native answers and knowledge she's a far distant fourth to GoogleNow, Cortana and Siri.

    27. Re:Interesting story by rthille · · Score: 1

      One of my problems with Alexa is:
      "What's the weather today?" "What's the high today?" and "What's the temperature at 8pm tonight?"
      All give the same summary answer.

      --
      Awesome furniture, accessories and cabinetry in Santa Rosa, CA: http://humanity-home.com/
    28. Re:Interesting story by Cro+Magnon · · Score: 1

      I use Alexa as an alarm clock, but something funny happened this morning. When it went off, I mumbled "Alexa, snooze". She must have thought I said "news", because she gave me a Flash Briefing.

      --
      Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
  5. Automated "Intelligence" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Alexa was fun to play with at a party, but it got about 15-25% of the things we yelled at it wrong or just didn't understand. That is way, way , way too high a failure rate. We stopped barking commands at it at one point because it was confused with three things in a row.

    If I were to say goodnight but my partner was coming home, would I say "Goodnight, but leave the front door unlocked just for Sally?" And it would reliably be able to know which Sally? Or what if it picked a different Sally but confirmed it, and my partner was locked out? Just the fact I have to think about this is more annoying than leaving the door unlocked. Maybe it's improved from earlier this year, but we all were amazed at how popular Alexa was but how unreliably we could actually get it to do what we wanted.

    Alexa's attempt at voice commands is commendable but flawed in many ways. It reminds me of the smartwatch trends: Fun in theory, but the reality is I see everyone with smartwatches Still playing with their phones to get real shit done.

    1. Re:Automated "Intelligence" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Why won't you let Sally have a key?

    2. Re:Automated "Intelligence" by RhettLivingston · · Score: 2

      but it got about 15-25% of the things we yelled at it wrong or just didn't understand

      Because it is Bing based. Bing is Alexa's biggest problem.

      This is why Apple recently switched Siri to Google. They do not want to release their new $300-class Alexa and Home competitor on Bing after seeing the degree of its impact on Alexa's ratings in most head-to-head comparisons of Alexa and Google Home.

  6. no thanks by epyT-R · · Score: 1

    Do not want.

  7. Really? by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So does "operating system" now mean absolutely whatever the author of some tedious think piece wants it to?

    1. Re:Really? by ColdWetDog · · Score: 4, Funny

      No, it really should only apply to Emacs.

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    2. Re:Really? by Pseudonym · · Score: 1

      Or Perl.

      --
      sub f{($f)=@_;print"$f(q{$f});";}f(q{sub f{($f)=@_;print"$f(q{$f});";}f});
    3. Re:Really? by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      I wrote an operating system once. It said "hello world."

    4. Re:Really? by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Or systemd.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    5. Re:Really? by gweihir · · Score: 1

      Apparently. The headline makes no sense at all.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
    6. Re:Really? by Billly+Gates · · Score: 1

      No, it really should only apply to Emacs.

      Yeah too bad it comes with a shitty text editor though

      --
      http://saveie6.com/
  8. YeahNO! by Chas · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I like my tech gadgets and everything.

    But I'll be damned if I'm going to wire my home up to spy on me and send all the data back to Amazon, Google or WHOEVER.

    I don't give a shit HOW useful it is. It's simply TOO intrusive for my liking.

    And if I ever move into a place with this crap pre-installed, I'll have an electrician out first to disconnect it all.

    --


    Chas - The one, the only.
    THANK GOD!!!
    1. Re:YeahNO! by sehlat · · Score: 1

      And if I ever move into a place with this crap pre-installed, I'll have an electrician out first to disconnect it all.

      Disconnection is easy. Just turn power off at the main breaker.

    2. Re:YeahNO! by Chas · · Score: 1

      Yes but that leave the rest of my house without power as well.

      Not an optimal solution.

      --


      Chas - The one, the only.
      THANK GOD!!!
    3. Re:YeahNO! by sehlat · · Score: 1

      I take it my sarcastic humor was not recognized? Maybe the "sarc" character has some use after all.

    4. Re:YeahNO! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I'll tentatively recommend openHAB http://www.openhab.org/ . This is not a voice control system, but aims to connect to all kinds of "smart" devices, be it over local protocols (including serial or other physical wires), or remote, Internet based ones. You run this server on the network and it will provide a control panel and automation scriptiong (in a kind of lame but powerful enough domain specific language). It's not always easy to determine if a product supports a LAN-only mode, and even if it's controlled locally, it could still be phoning home. The LIFX lightbulbs probably don't phone home if not connected to the clould account, but don't take my word for it.Worst case, you can put it on a firewalled subnet.

      I've set up about 1000 lines of automation rules. It's probably never going to be a net time saver, but it's nice to not have to worry about adjusting the dimmer, turning on / off lights, TV, etc. Maybe smart assistants and and things like IFTTT can do more things automatically in the future, but at the moment they seem like toys compared to a real scripting language. It's like half of the things I want can't be cast as simple if..then rules, and talking to a bot every time is not more convenient than pushing a button or a remote.

    5. Re:YeahNO! by Chas · · Score: 1

      You use text!
      Text bad!
      Text no show humor!
      Text bad!
      BAAAAAD!

      --


      Chas - The one, the only.
      THANK GOD!!!
    6. Re:YeahNO! by RhettLivingston · · Score: 1

      A true FOSS AI assistant that I can be trained a small piece at a time and run at home with no cloud assistance should be taking priority over all other FOSS efforts right now. The OS and browser are yesterday's products. It is time to create the long-predicted by sci-fi assistant.

    7. Re:YeahNO! by vlueboy · · Score: 1

      I like my tech gadgets and everything.

      But I'll be damned if I'm going to wire my home up to spy on me and send all the data back to Amazon, Google or WHOEVER.

      I don't give a shit HOW useful it is. It's simply TOO intrusive for my liking.

      And if I ever move into a place with this crap pre-installed, I'll have an electrician out first to disconnect it all.

      Something in your comment triggered my realization that
      10 years down the road, that cable box we all have will be accompanied by a no-choice spying box given by our ISP... and we'll *like* it ;)
      "Simply too intrusive for my liking" applies to many things that are already a reality where we cannot "vote with our wallets" today.

      For instance, if you're posting this from a mobile device. the US governments' claws are already in them. We cannot just assume Windows 10 is the only bad guy --Snowden's revelations precede the outrage over the release of that system by quite a while, so just think what else was it that made the data mining practical.

      But I digress! Everyone and their mother is releasing a voice assistant (Samsung, Google, Windows 10's Cortana, Siri, Alexa, LG) and some of those are achieving a hardware presence. Nothing will forever keep the ISPs from realizing they too can join the bandwagon, putting one more camera and microphone into our houses to taste a piece of the revenue pie. Microsoft's XBox / Kinect camera, Google's defunct Glass and Samsung's always-on SmartTV background audio recording didn't kickstart any pro-privacy legislation, and all remained legal. Thus, they'll keep being remade by other companies.

      Nothing will hold back today's media-laced ISPs in the US from eventually expanding their semi-forced phone/internet/television "triple play" plans into customized hardware. Charter's recent merger with Time Warner forced some new hardware along with channel lineup changes, deprecation of perfectly-working televisions and price increases down my throat... and it is stupid that they would not just let me use existing hardware and conditions that I see with other neighbors who had assistance just 6 months earlier. I had a take-it-or-leave-it situation in my hands and was forced to accept terms because my situation was meant to be an escape to Verizon's own oppression phasing out DSL and forcing their own hardware, prices and changes.

    8. Re:YeahNO! by Chas · · Score: 1

      I don't have cable TV.
      My webcam has a shutter and I disconnect it when not in use.
      My headset's resting place is right next to a system fan and I've done testing, Even sitting 2 feet away talking in a normal tone of voice is incomprehensible.
      What my OS reports about me, I try to control as much as possible. But without the equipment to basically listen in on me and PHYSICALLY track me around my home, the info they get is of low quality.

      --


      Chas - The one, the only.
      THANK GOD!!!
  9. Take away the voice command by rsilvergun · · Score: 2

    and you could get this setup for my Commodore 64 in 1988.

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
  10. That is a really great point by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

    Alexa's attempt at voice commands is commendable but flawed in many ways. It reminds me of the smartwatch trends: Fun in theory

    That seems like a really good analogy, I hadn't thought about it but Alexa kind of seems like the Pebble of voice assistants... very popular at the moment, but with some serious flaws that make you wonder if other competitors will not overtake them...

    On the other hand, Amazon has so many resources behind Alexa it seems improbable it would ever really "fail" because no matter what, I'm sure Alexa will be with us ten years from now - no matter how it does in the market. Amazon seems ready to push it regardless.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re: That is a really great point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Fire phone?

      Windows Mobile?

      Apple Car?

      Being big is Zero guarantee of product implementation with success.

    2. Re:That is a really great point by Hognoxious · · Score: 2

      I was going to say that if it's any good they'll discontinue it - but this is Amazon, not Google.

      I see two possibilities: it'll be shite, but on the "build one to throw away" principle it'll teach the lessons for something better, or it'll be shite and first mover advantage plus the network effect mean we'll be stuck with it.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    3. Re: That is a really great point by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

      Yes I had even thought about the Fire Phone... but this is nothing like any of those, especially the Fire Phone. The Fire Phone had zero traction ever so it was obvious it was not going to work. Alexa not only has traction but momentum, so even if it never works all that well Amazon can simply keep pushing it forward indefinitely with a tidal wave of money and people.

      Windows mobile is a little better example, but I would argue it too never really got traction and even Microsoft was more ambivalent about it than Amazon is about Alexa.

      The Apple Car was never that big, and Apple wisely killed that because it made no sense at the time - I think that has taken on a new direction (or set of directions) though, so I don't think it's fair to say it was big and is now dead. It never even surfaced publicly....

      --
      "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  11. People don't get it by BellyJelly · · Score: 2

    If we install all this shit, you are putting Amazon in control of your home. All you do is send your requests to Amazon and hope they carry them out correctly. Whilst not getting cracked.......

  12. Alexa - unlock the door for the pizza delivery by Alain+Williams · · Score: 3, Funny

    I'm sorry Dave, I cannot do that; the pizza was not ordered from Amazon.

    1. Re:Alexa - unlock the door for the pizza delivery by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      If you pay an extra $99 you can join Amazon Prime and have the pizza delivered in 24 hours or less!

    2. Re:Alexa - unlock the door for the pizza delivery by slickwillie · · Score: 1

      Remember this little gem from a few moths ago?

      Bezos: "Alexa, buy me something from Whole Foods"
      Alexa: "Buying Whole Foods"
      Bezos: "Shit"

  13. Fuck off. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    It's become clear that there will never be a "modern sci-fi home" as imagined in the past, which isn't also a surveillance nightmare. Fuck off.

    1. Re:Fuck off. by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Maybe. Or maybe the cloud craze will come to a screeching halt when people realize the ex-CEO of Equifax is correct: "all companies get breached."

      There's no reason you can't run an Alexa or Google type assistant on a computer of your own. When Alexa's collection of sex tapes gets released on The Pirate Bay the first one to market with such a thing will make a killing.

  14. Proprietary software means insecurity. by jbn-o · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So long as any part of this depends on non-free (proprietary, user subjugating) software, insecurity is to be assumed because untrustworthiness is guaranteed. Manual overrides on proprietary software are an illusion built to placate those who don't think through the process thoroughly.

    It's also worth recognizing that this is entirely unnecessary. People have been quite fine to turn on/off their own house lights, lock/unlock their own door locks (without handing out keys to others such as an unknowable and indeterminably large set of people who want free access without making it look like they broke in), and so on without automation. Principled technologists know when it's a better option to say no to automation and remote control, this is most obviously the correct reaction in the face of a system the user has no permission to fully and exclusively control.

    There's no way of "securing" door locks, for instance, with software one doesn't control and fully have the freedom to own. When dealing with a system a proprietor can augment or replace at any time, manual overrides mean nothing.

    --
    Digital Citizen
    1. Re:Proprietary software means insecurity. by sehlat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yes. cf. Cory Doctorow: Demon-Haunted World

      I think the above article should be mandatory reading.

  15. Re:Interestin by gmb61 · · Score: 2

    Does anyone have any stories about Alexa doing useful things? True stories only, not made up stuff about what it might do someday.

    Well let's see, I use the shopping list, to-do list, reminders, alarm clock, etc. daily and they are all very useful. But by far the most useful thing for me (as somebody who orders A LOT from Amazon) is the ability to say, "Alexa, order more _______" and it will check my order history for the item, tell me the current price, and ask if I want to order it again. I say "yes" and it's on its way.

  16. I don't own a Nest by NEDHead · · Score: 1, Insightful

    And I won't buy Alexa (or similar) where everything I say or do is broadcast to the world

    1. Re:I don't own a Nest by thegarbz · · Score: 2

      Perfect. Only this morning I woke up and was thinking, if only I knew what some random person on the internet didn't want, then my life would be complete.

      You have completed my life. It gave me such a warm feeling inside that I said "Okay Google, please turn my nest down to 20 degrees. It's getting too warm in here."

  17. And then the Four Horsemen began their ride by laurencetux · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Now placing bets on how long before this deploys that

    1 there will be a MASSIVE hack of the system due to folks being framed for multiple felonies driven by voice commands

    2 Amazon Employees are found to have a stash of "exciting" media grabbed via different devices

    3 somebody gets arrested due to something that was saved by one of these devices

    4 a few people get KILLED using one of these devices (example an Amazon controlled car decides to shut the engine down while the car is cruising down the Highway at 20 above the posted speed limit)

    1. Re: And then the Four Horsemen began their ride by Brockmire · · Score: 1

      Number 3 already happened earlier this year. If I'm being murdered, I give Alexa full permission to record and upload the evidence.

    2. Re: And then the Four Horsemen began their ride by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      And what happens when Trump supoena's Amazon for all the threats on his life you mutter under your breath in your own home? Will you turn yourself in or wait for the Secret Service to come and pick you up?

  18. That's not what an Operating System is. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    That's not what an Operating System is. An operating system is software that controls a computer's resources. What he is describing is an application.

    1. Re:That's not what an Operating System is. by gweihir · · Score: 1

      Apparently, this distinction is too difficult for people writing about technology these days.

      --
      Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
  19. So use Mycroft by HalAtWork · · Score: 2

    Mycroft.ai lets you host your own speech-to-text server and do everything locally if you want.

    --
    Twinstiq, game news
  20. Re : "Alexa, Stop spying on me !" by Fantasio · · Score: 1

    "I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that" ( BTW, my dad is "HAL 9000")

  21. Ummm... No, that is just another hub by shaitand · · Score: 1

    "A platform that other apps and devices can connect into? This starts to sound a lot like an operating system for the home to me."

    Seriously, this is just a wifi enabled hub. Everything wants to be a hub for your smart home now from Alex/Google Now to your TV remote.

    Take some tips from someone who has a substantial smart home investment.

    1. If you need perfect, turn-key, ready-to-go, solutions a smart home isn't for you yet there is nothing out there you can simply drop more money on to completely idiot-proof this tech. Even if you pay someone else to do it for you, if you want it to look anything like what companies claim their products can do then you'll have to learn a bit to USE those advanced capabilities. For starters, if you aren't willing to spend 15minutes on youtube and rewire a light switch be ready for having a far less convenient smart home setup or paying a couple hundred per outlet to have an electrician do it for you.

    2. Everything and it's dog wants to be the hub/bridge/controller of your world. You need to think about how these things are going to work together logically and what happens if two of them are telling a device different things.
    3. Wifi, Zigbee, Zwave, Zwave Plus, Wink, Nest, Homekit, WHAT?

    Okay, this comes down to forgetting the terminology anybody else is using for anything (including the vendor) and coming back to actual network terms. Paying careful attention to the following definitions won't just help with smart home things and if you aren't a computer networking professional I recommend reading it because although you are likely familiar with some of these things, your understanding is likely off in small but important ways.

    Bridge, in networking when you combine different physical connection types (wifi/4g/copper/fiber/etc) together to allow communication between them that is called bridging and any device that does that is called a bridge. A device which takes a signal and repeats it is called a repeater, a device which does the same with multiple ports is called a multi-port repeater aka a hub (from the hub and spoke design of a wagon wheel). This has a security implication in that anyone attached to one of the ports can listen to the communication of everyone else and the total reliable speed of communication for all ports combined is the speed of the slowest port. Also, no two devices can talk at the same time. A device which has multiple ports and lets you toggle between them is a switch (think of railways, at any moment the switch allows multiple possible paths but at any moment there is only one isolated path with the others disconnected). A switched path, while isolated, can only be switched one way at a given moment. If you have a six way switch you certainly can send more trains across to more places than if you had a solid line of track or even six fixed lines of track but you also still have the possibility of a collision. Solving that possibility of a collision is where the first logical layer comes in, this is layer 2 in the networking world (Ethernet is the most common and with Ethernet you will have what is called a MAC address for every connected device). Most commonly, bridges create a common layer 2 between different physical mediums. The last piece I'll fill in is layer 3, this is called the network layer and for the internet and your home network and such this will basically be the IP layer, you can just think of it as your IP Address. Assuming IPv4 this is probably something like 192.168.1.15. This really isn't four decimal digits but rather 4 8bit binary values converted to decimal to be easier to read and remember. In reality computers split this up into a network identifier and local address using a bitmask that defines how many bits of the first part are used for the network address. A connected layer 2, subnet, and LAN are often terms used as synonyms, by professionals, even though these are all technically different things. A layer 3 bridge (with ports on at least two different layer 2's) is called a router. Fi

  22. Getting in? by physick · · Score: 1

    And when I come home drunk from a party?

    ME: Alllixxxxooaa, lemme in!
    Alexa: Voice unrecognised.
    ME: Allexxx oh, sod it where's the hammer.

  23. Insurance by bankman · · Score: 3, Interesting

    It's going to be great once insurance providers decline payments after break-ins and other mishaps that can be directly related to "smart" devices. And I am afraid that this is the only way, this kind of stupidity can be stopped. Consumers won't realise the madness they're engaging with until it hits their wallets and vendors will never understand the customer's security requirements until they are forced to pay for it, either directly or through lost sales.

    --
    I feel so sig.
  24. Do you really want to cede control to that extent? by hughbar · · Score: 1

    Well then, welcome to your walled garden (tm). Personally I'm not interested in having the whole of my home, grocery ordering, family interactions observed and controlled by a for-profit organisation, however lovely.

    --
    On y va, qui mal y pense!
  25. Not with my data by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    As long as everything goes over the internet and can possibly be tracked by third parties, I would not allow Alexa or anybody else to control
    anything of importance in my home. No locks, no temperature control, maybe some lights, and maybe for controling stuff that goes via the net anyway, like audible or netflix. Never anything that I consider private. Why can't I have voice control that does not need the internet?

  26. In-car Alexa by coofercat · · Score: 1

    I really hope the 'in car Alexa' is better than the utter shit most cars have in them:

    Me: (presses button) "Call home"
    Car: (pause) "Airconditioning on"

    I'm not sure how it's gonna cope with "Alexa, tell Starbucks on the A3, but the one north of Guildford going towards the M25, not the one you chose last time to make me a soya-milk latte, extra hot with a double shot and one and a half sugars please" is going to work out. Unless it's really, really good, and gets a signal when my phone can't, and preferably works with a coffee shop that sells actual coffee rather than brown water, then maybe, just maybe it could be good. More than likely though, by the time you've got Alexa to order you a coffee successfully, you'd have been better off lining up and getting it the old fashioned way (or, shock horror - going home and making your own).

  27. I like SPST switches just fine, thanks anyway by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 1

    I don't need some voice-activated surveillance device to turn my gods-be-damned lights on and off, the switch on the wall is more than adequate.

  28. Big Brother... by martinfb · · Score: 1

    Cool stuff, yet fears of Big Brother getting even further into our lives is most frightening!

    If we can get corporations totally out of government, and real for-the-people officials into office, then we have a chance.

    --


    Self-importance and self-indulgence is the root of ALL evil.