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Apology After Japanese Train Departs 20 Seconds Early (bbc.com)

Posted by msmash on from the setting-an-example dept.

Several readers share a BBC report: A rail company in Japan has apologised after one of its trains departed 20 seconds early. Management on the Tsukuba Express line between Tokyo and the city of Tsukuba say they "sincerely apologise for the inconvenience" caused. In a statement, the company said the train had been scheduled to leave at 9:44:40 local time but left at 9:44:20. Many social media users reacted to the company's apology with surprise. "Tokyo train company's apology for 20-second-early departure is one of the best things about Japan," a user wrote. The mistake happened because staff had not checked the timetable, the company statement said.

58 of 215 comments (clear)

  1. Japanese train departs 20 seconds early by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 4, Funny

    Is it a coincidence it happened only three days after Pocky Day? I think not!

    --
    #DeleteFacebook
  2. Good and bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Tokyo train company's apology for 20-second-early departure is one of the best things about Japan

    And reinforces one of the worst things about Japan.

    This extreme fastidiousness is also why Japan's suicide rate is higher than the US homicide rate and suicide rate combined.

    1. Re:Good and bad by gfxguy · · Score: 4, Funny

      The conductor will now commit hara-kiri after apologizing for shaming his family.

      --
      Stupid sexy Flanders.
    2. Re: Good and bad by vakuona · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Not quite. There are two good reasons why trains need to run on time in Japan.

      1 - They are so many of them that small delays can snowball into major delays across the network.

      2 - Trains leaving early is bad because you make people who are on time miss their train, and then make them late.

    3. Re:Good and bad by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Informative

      This extreme fastidiousness is also why Japan's suicide rate is higher than the US homicide rate and suicide rate combined.

      There is more to it than that. In Japanese culture, suicide is often perceived as honorable. So that makes it a more acceptable way to deal with problems.

      The suicide rate in Hungary, Poland, and Russia is higher than in Japan. Even in America, the suicide rate is nearly twice the homicide rate.

      List of countries by suicide rate

    4. Re:Good and bad by arth1 · · Score: 4, Informative

      The conductor will now commit hara-kiri after apologizing for shaming his family.

      That would be seppuku, not harakiri. The two are closely related, but harakiri is just suicide by disembowelment, while seppuku is the ritualized form done to spare others shame.

    5. Re:Good and bad by PPH · · Score: 2

      So, did the engineer go home and commit Sudoku?

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
    6. Re:Good and bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      More Americans try to kill themselves, its just after a couple of hours lying on the track waiting for the train to show up they give up.

    7. Re:Good and bad by theskipper · · Score: 4, Funny

      Yeah, he wasn't allowed back to work until he completed this.

    8. Re: Good and bad by loufoque · · Score: 5, Informative

      I see that a lot on the Internet, but I don't think that's actually true.
      The two mean the same thing, seppuku is just based on the chinese reading.

      Same as ninja and shinobi and all that jazz.

    9. Re: Good and bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Yes, I second this. My Japanese-Japanese dictionary lists the definition for harakiri as simply "the same as seppuku" (my translation). Not that it's a frequent topic of conversation but for what it's worth I've really only heard the latter used during my years over there. I always assumed harakiri was an older synonym that had fallen out of vogue based on that observation and the fact that harakiri entered into English by at least the late 1800s. You say pharmacist and I say apothecary and all that.

    10. Re:Good and bad by thegarbz · · Score: 2

      This extreme fastidiousness is also why Japan's suicide rate is higher than the US homicide rate and suicide rate combined.

      It's also entirely incorrect unless you're a time traveller from 2013 (in which case welcome but you may not like the world as it is).

      The suicide rate in Japan is not only lower than the combined rate of suicide and homicide in the USA, it's actually not very different from the USA rate by itself.
      Additionally fastidiousness contributes more to the USA suicide rate than Japanese's. The Japanese are a hard working culture which emphasise face and respect. Committing suicide due to stress and overwork is quite a social taboo, committing suicide because you are unable to work on the other hand is quite a different story. The Japanese will sooner work themselves to death for their families than commit suicide.

      Some 2016 figures for you in /10000 figures (combined from Google since wikipedia seems to be have stopped updating 4 years ago):

      Suicide:
      Japan: 17.2
      USA: 13.26

      See not very different.

      Homicide:
      Japan: 1.02
      USA: 5.3

      Very different.

      Combined:
      Japan: 18.22
      USA: 18.56

      Wow that starts painting a very different picture to your argument doesn't it.

    11. Re: Good and bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting
      It's not just based on the Chinese reading, the characters are also reversed. Seppuku is literally Kiri-hara.

      Harakiri is considered more vulgar, as it literally describes the procedure as stomach cutting, while since seppuku is derived from the Chinese reading of the characters it does not evoke the same graphic description on hearing it (even if it does on reading it).

  3. In other news... by ClickOnThis · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...the company announced that the train engineer will commit seppuku.

    [Just kidding ;-P]

    --
    If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
    1. Re:In other news... by TWX · · Score: 4, Funny

      *commit sudoku

      That's a rather puzzling self-punishment...

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
  4. Appology Accepted by Thelasko · · Score: 4, Interesting

    My company received an apology from a Japanese supplier because a shipment of parts were a week late after the 2011 earthquake.

    Meanwhile other suppliers were apologetically late for no good reason.

    --
    One of our competitors trademarked the term "hypothesis". From now on, we will call them "boneheaded ideas".
    1. Re:Appology Accepted by Thelasko · · Score: 2

      Meanwhile other suppliers were apologetically late for no good reason.

      *unapologetically* late. stupid auto-correct...

      --
      One of our competitors trademarked the term "hypothesis". From now on, we will call them "boneheaded ideas".
    2. Re:Appology Accepted by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 5, Funny

      Hello,

      I represent a Canadian supplier which has no contract with you at the moment.

      We apologize for not being one of your suppliers.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    3. Re:Appology Accepted by Mostly+a+lurker · · Score: 2, Funny

      My company received an apology from a Japanese supplier because a shipment of parts were a week late after the 2011 earthquake.

      No doubt, that is what Trump is referring to when he talks about other countries' unfair business practices. How can any US company be expected to compete with that kind of service?

    4. Re:Appology Accepted by boudie2 · · Score: 5, Funny

      As a Canadian I would like to apologize for the previous apology.

  5. Watch the timer, step on the train by jfdavis668 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I've ridden these trains. There are marks on the platform showing where the doors will be. There is a timer counting down until arrival. You can stand at the mark, and when the timer hits zero, step forward onto the train. It will be there with the door open right on that mark. Not even German trains are as punctual as Japanese trains.

    1. Re:Watch the timer, step on the train by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I watched a documentary about the drivers. They calculate there speed to make up for a single second of delay.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    2. Re:Watch the timer, step on the train by Billly+Gates · · Score: 2

      I raved about how great the London Underground is to my wife's cousin when I was there, and she laughed at me.

      "Go to Berlin" she said, "that's a really great train service, cheap fast and clean".

      Japan's must be really awesome if it's better than that.

      Ah just like in America where people praise the New York subway system for it's cleanliness and lack of tardiness my dear sir.

      --
      http://saveie6.com/
    3. Re:Watch the timer, step on the train by interkin3tic · · Score: 4, Funny

      That's nothing! Japanese airlines flying from the US to Japan will go so quick you'll arrive the day before you left!

    4. Re:Watch the timer, step on the train by chill · · Score: 3, Funny

      Washington, DC sees your MTA and challenges you with Metro!

      When was the last time an MTA car caught on fire?

      --
      Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
    5. Re:Watch the timer, step on the train by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      That's why we mostly eat Indian food.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    6. Re:Watch the timer, step on the train by redmasq · · Score: 3, Informative

      Not all of the stations have the timer or the marks. For the "subway" ones in Tokyo, I had humored myself a bit by comparing to a timer. I never saw it more than a second off. There was slightly more variation in the shinkansen, but we left every stop within 5-6 seconds of the schedule time. While impressive, I was more impressed with the number of people that road them versus how ridiculously sparkling clean they were.

    7. Re:Watch the timer, step on the train by Gussington · · Score: 2

      Japan's must be really awesome if it's better than that.

      What wowed me about the first time I used Tokyo network was despite all signs being in Japanese and all staff speaking Japanese, and me not understanding any of it, it was easier to move around the city than my own local system. Hong Kong and Singapore are also world class.
      Out of all the major global cities I've been to, the US is still stuck in the 1970's by comparison.

    8. Re:Watch the timer, step on the train by jrumney · · Score: 2

      In Britain, there are never any delays unless there is some weather conditions causing it, like when its snowing, raining or the rails get too hot because the sun is shining, or the wind has blown leaves onto the track.

  6. Meanwhile in New Zealand by viperidaenz · · Score: 4, Informative

    No trains were running in the capital yesterday due to industrial action. The French and Korean companies that run them have been trying to claw back conditions from employment agreements they agreed to when they won the operating contract, so the workers went on strike after 6 months of failed negotiations.

  7. Totally different model of behavior by ErichTheRed · · Score: 5, Insightful

    During normal operations, I did notice Japanese trains run to the second when I was there a while back. There's no similar sense of urgency here in the US.

    I don't know if a society so focused on punctuality is a good thing though...not being allowed to be late (or early) means that there's no room for error in other parts of one's life either. I imagine it's very difficult to come back from a personal failure in Japanese culture. In the US, it's certainly not impossible...I know tons of people who just weren't ready to grow up when they turned 18, and they either drifted or joined the military and grew up, then got their lives on track. That must be way harder in Japan if you can't even leave 20 seconds early without triggering an apology.

    1. Re:Totally different model of behavior by UnknowingFool · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It really is part of the culture. People rely on things to be on time. Now different parts of Europe have different standards. In Switzerland and Germany, if the train schedule says 15:13 departure, it leaves at 15:13 not 15:12 or 15:15. So you have to be on time to catch the train. In Italy, the trains are on time most of the time. That 15:13 train might be 15:14 or so.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    2. Re:Totally different model of behavior by rogoshen1 · · Score: 2

      Is that a tacit argument for bringing back il duce?

    3. Re:Totally different model of behavior by Gussington · · Score: 5, Interesting

      During normal operations, I did notice Japanese trains run to the second when I was there a while back. There's no similar sense of urgency here in the US.

      In Hong Kong there is no timetable. The trains run so frequently and reliably that you just turn up at a station a train is either there or will be in 2 minutes. That is how public transport should be done.

    4. Re:Totally different model of behavior by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 2

      If it leaves 20 seconds early, that means that I may have to wait on the platform for an hour (or whatever) til the next train, because I was going to be there on time. It's way worse than leaving 20 seconds late (which can be made up in transit).

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    5. Re:Totally different model of behavior by JanneM · · Score: 2

      The Shinkansen typically runs every 15-20 minutes or so. On the busiest lines (Tokyo-Osaka) at peak times there's a new train every five minutes. You just show up, get a ticket atthe vending machine and step on to the next train.

      Flying may be cheaper, but the trains are just so much faster and more convenient. I love them.

      --
      Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
    6. Re:Totally different model of behavior by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 2

      Okay, so 15-20 minutes late. And then that can make you miss another connection or something. My point is that 20 seconds early can be the difference in like 30 minutes in someone's life.

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      Your ad here. Ask me how!
    7. Re:Totally different model of behavior by thegarbz · · Score: 2

      In Hong Kong there is no timetable.

      The entire country also has no train line longer than 40km, and the majority of the lines are a fraction of that length. The train network in HongKong is less complicated than the metro system of many cities, which also have no timetables.

  8. I wish my wife... by Bodhammer · · Score: 4, Funny

    I wish my wife was that forgiving about 20 seconds.and my apology...

    --
    "I say we take off, nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."
    1. Re:I wish my wife... by TWX · · Score: 3, Funny

      What did she do with the other eighteen seconds?

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
  9. Re:Here in Denver by TWX · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'm surprised. I mean, how do you make out what the operator is saying over the static and the noise?

    --
    Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
  10. It's expected by mykepredko · · Score: 2

    As many people note, you can set your watch to arrivals/departures of trains in Japan - but I'm amazed at how much the Japanese take it for granted.

    They don't see it as anything special, this is a service, like always getting a dial tone when you pick up a phone in North America.

    I'm wondering how this could be translated to Canadian culture - I don't think the Toronto subway system (http://www.ttc.ca/) could ever get their collective heads wrapped around the idea that they MUST be on time, ALWAYS & FOREVER.

    --
    Mimetics Inc. Twitter
  11. Amagasaki rail crash by supermachoman · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This is indicative of the kind of mindset that led to the tragic train crash of 2005. A train was running 90 seconds behind, and under tremendous pressure from his superiors, the operator sped the train up and ended up derailing it. If it weren't for the new automatic brake systems installed, this would likely happen again (because I see no change in the culture)

    Amagasaki rail crash

  12. Re:Trump doesn't even apologize for treason! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Look at it this way : the Japanese apologize for trivialities but they NEVER apologize for the real crimes. Such as war crimes and other such niceties. Trump compared to the Japanese is a baby.

  13. Re:Trump doesn't even apologize for treason! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    The Japanese apologize for 'trivialitities' because they are often insults - leaving early is an insult to those who missed the train. Insults are not trivial things in Japan. The Japanese never apologize for the 'real crimes' because they don't believe they have insulted anyone. Commiting war crimes during WWII was not an insult to the American soldiers, those were honorary executions of the enemy.

    Not right or wrong, just a different point of view.

  14. Privately-owned competing railroads by mi · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Privately-owned, competing railroads provide good service. Wow. Who knew...

    Meanwhile, government monopoly NJ Transit would not only can leave 1-2 minutes early sometimes (when they aren't 20 minutes late), they would kick a passenger off the train for pointing it out...

    --
    In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
    1. Re:Privately-owned competing railroads by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Sorry to blow away your whole point, but this railway is owned by a "company" which is actually owned by a number of Japanese governments.

      Metropolitan Intercity Railway Company ownership (all government bodies): Ibaraki Prefecture, Tokyo, Chiba Prefecture, Adachi Ward (Tokyo), City of Tsukuba, Saitama Prefecture

      No competition involved either on this route.

      Seems to be well-managed, in spite of this. But your whole premise is blown away, you don't know what you are talking about.

  15. May favorite aspect of this story by JoeRobe · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...is that the rail company apologized even though nobody actually complained about it - now that's honesty!

    --
    The best way to predict the future is to invent it.
  16. Re:Move to Antigua and Barbuda. Happier life? by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 2

    Well, if you lived on a Caribbean beach, would you want to commit suicide?

  17. Re:Trump doesn't even apologize for treason! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I am sure the "Comfort Girls" would disagree.

  18. Canadian Apology Explained by FeelGood314 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I'm Canadian, but I lived in Atlanta in the early 90s. This was when Atlanta was the violent crime capital of the USA. I found Canadian kids are more violent than their American counter parts. They tease, bully and particularly in sports resort to fighting far more often.

    The Canadian apology is part de-escalation, half social signalling (and part programmed reflex). When I apologies for someone else bumping into me I'm avoiding a fight and I'm showing confidence that I'm big enough not to be offended. Call me an idiot, I'm not going to take the bait and get a penalty. I will let you go first through the door to show I'm organized, and not in a rush. (yes, I'm guilty, I've been in a few Canadian standoffs) .

    In work, if something goes wrong, I'll take the blame and then work on the solution. This is doubly effective in some cultures as I'm remembered as the one who took charge and solved the problem and also saved someone else embarrassment.

    One last note. I did find the people of the American south the most friendly, open and genuine people I've ever met. They will always start a conversation and will tell you anything you want to know.

  19. Re:Trump doesn't even apologize for treason! by Jake+Griffin · · Score: 2

    1. Shielding a Nazi Officer Wanted for War Crimes

    2. The Internment of Japanese Citizens During World War II

    3. The Overthrow of the Kingdom of Hawaii

    4. The Tuskegee Experiment

    5. An Apology for Slavery and the Jim Crow laws

    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/five-times-united-states-officially-apologized-180959254/

    --
    SIG FAULT: Post index out of bounds.
  20. Re:What motivated the apology ? by Harlequin80 · · Score: 2

    You would only say that if you have never been to Japan.

    All trains run on time. From all the different operators. Tokyo itself has an absolute myriad of train operators and the standard level of service is that all trains are on time, always.

  21. In most of the US... by MoarSauce123 · · Score: 2

    ...we can be happy to have a train come to town maybe once or twice a day. I gladly take 20 seconds early any time in exchange for a decent regional train service.

  22. Re:Damn you Japan! by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 2

    Eek, I apologize to all for the use of "you're" when I clearly intended "your".

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    Your ad here. Ask me how!
  23. Re:Move to Antigua and Barbuda. Happier life? by Applehu+Akbar · · Score: 2

    Wow, it says in Antigua and Barbuda the suicide rate is zero.

    Since the last hurricane, the population in Barbuda has fallen to zero:
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/...

  24. Re:Here in Denver by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    That's not a train leaving 2 minutes early; it's a train scheduled 20 minutes ago leaving 18 minutes late.

  25. Re:Trump doesn't even apologize for treason! by hai_Priesty · · Score: 5, Informative

    The Japanese never apologize for the 'real crimes' because they don't believe they have insulted anyone. Commiting war crimes during WWII was not an insult to the American soldiers, those were honorary executions of the enemy.

    (1) To deunk with reality : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

    (2)One of the well-travelled young (still in 30s) Japanese I used to work under had this assessment:

    Not only had they apologized to so many people, everytime the Chinese and Koreans asked for one more apology it is ususally another ruse for Asking compensation yet again

    (3) Disclaimer : I'm an ethnic Chinese and the following said will, in no way, lessen the Japanese atrocities during the war:

    Quite a significant portion of the very organized, politically-backed South Korean Comfort woman (that is still living is strangely large number) protesting in 2017................are also actually not comfort woman from more than 72 years ago, but rather prostitutes (admitedly, "forced" by every tough situations and war and post shoartages. Post-war ones are total frauds) that was allowed to tag on to the grievance seeking team because

    (a) The vastly missing or non-existant records after multiple changes of adminstration within 10 years

    (b) compounded with Korean war around 1951 that turned SK into a rubble (figuratively)

    (c) Anyone whose records are stored north of 38th parallel north being totally inaccessible,

    As a result people just had to take everyone's word for it. when a woman claimed that she was a comfort woman and she's with the team. And despite of previous compensation to the SK administration decades ago ( when it was still military-ruled - seems like money went straight to the army and the victims didn't get them), South Korean comfort woman, who have a significant voice internationally as a humanitarian issue, did a great job in reinforce in people's minds the factually incorrect "Japan never apologizes, Japan never compensate" "common knowledge".