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Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ Launched (raspberrypi.org)
New submitter stikves writes: The Raspberry foundation has launched an incremental update to the Raspberry Pi 3 model B: Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ . In addition to slight increase (200MHz) in CPU speed, and upgraded networking (802.11ac and Gigabit, albeit over USB2), one big advantage is the better thermal management which allows sustained performance over longer load periods. Further reading: TechRepublic, and Linux Journal.
Any sign of a 64 bit Raspbian yet ?
Am I the only one that still uses the original Raspberry Pi? CPU speed has never been the selling point of em to me.
"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
I would be more satisfied with doubling the ram than the AC wireless.
I can't believe this was left out of the summary: This board breaks out PoE and they are working on a HAT that will convert 48V PoE to the 5V required for the Pi. Or you can use it for other purposes.
Gigabit ethernet over USB.
broadcom hardware infested with hardware backdoors.
Just
No.
what is the point of gig-e when all io is on 1 usb bus?
I still fail to see the point of the Raspberry Pi at all.. I have an original model but to me the whole point of a piece of kit like this is to be able to tinker with all the h/w at a register level so as to not only encourage entry level programming but a passion for system level development something which is a dying art. Right now the only piece of hardware that really makes this all still accessible is an Amiga or similar retro computer, hopefully the Apollo Vampire V4 will help narrow the gap performance and display wise to make this a more viable platform while still providing full access to all the wonderful pieces of h/w it exposes through it's custom chips.
Starting from Raspberry Pi 3 (can't find any information about Raspberry Pi 2 version 1.2 which use the same CPU as Pi3, not as earlier Pi2s), the U-boot bootloader is UEFI compliant and several Linux distributions's (such as, for example, openSUSE Tumbleweed) AArch64 image can be run in 64bits mode.
source: tumbleweed's wiki entry about Raspberry Pi 3.
So there should be a way to load Debian AArch64 on your Pi.
(But of course it will be less optimized/geared toward Pi than a real Raspbian 64)
From what I've read in forums and interviews, there isn't a plan to do Raspbian64 in the immediate future, due to lots of 32bits (ARM6 or 7) Pis still in the wild, and the Rasberry Pi Foundation wanting not to dilute their resources over too many goals.
(Then I'm sure that the gentoo people have their own flavour completely optimized to the bone for 64bit Pi)
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
Probably din't cost anything/much and still shows a slightly more than 2x speed increase.
what is the point of gig-e when all io is on 1 usb bus?
Marketing bullet points.
The LAN over USB issue was the biggest reason I went with an Odroid C2 to replace my old Pi.
I think it has more to do with keeping the component costs down. Whichever component is more popular is used because they're cheaper, not because they're necessarily an improvement to the overall experience.
For one, gigabit means that you could in theory get nearly half a gigabit, which is still higher than 100 mbit.
For another, and this is rare, there do exist network switches in the world that do not negotiate lower than 1 gigabit. I've only seen one model from one vendor so far that did this, and I think that product flopped in part due to inability to handle 100 mbit, but if I've seen one, there's probably more.
Finally, it may not be possible to get a 100 mbit NIC anymore, or at least do so and get any savings out of it. It's like in embedded you have flash parts that are 80% empty, because the cheapest flash parts are now still 4x the size some of these applications need.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
People wanting to do small tinkering projects, or file servers, or whatever
are probably all happy with the Raspberry 1 (I certainly am).
People wanting to do video processing (which was the initial target of this class of chips by Broadcom anyway) are probably happier with more Mhz giving more power to offload h264 (and partial h265) to the hardware.
People using it as a retro gaming machine are also happier with more Mhz giving faster / more precise emulation.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
Previous model topped off at ~60Mbps, new model can do 330Mbps so even if you're pumping it back out to another I/O device you still could theoretically get ~160Mbps which is a significant improvement.
There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
Would be really nice if they expanded software instead of hardware. For example, port their graphics support from the very limited omxplayer to mplayer, or make omxplayer more configurable. Make alternate browsers work well. Maybe even write a graphical media frontend and they could start selling it as a massmarket mediaplayer.
Android port would also be cool.
what is the point of gig-e when all io is on 1 usb bus?
From the article:
"While the USB 2.0 connection to the application processor limits the available bandwidth, we still see roughly a threefold increase in throughput compared to Raspberry Pi 3B."
You'd have to generate a lot of IO to drop below the original 3B throughput.
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According to the latest ruleset, this post should be modded as Vorpal Flamebait +5.
I just read the slashdot UID and let fly.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Emulated hardware is better anyway. Here you go.
You're welcome.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Nice timing, releasing this on Pi Day
A young man who is going out on a date may need to understand how hardware works.
Speaking seriously, the RPI 3 B+ is a good start to learn hardware and computing of the physical world.
Apparently no one knows the original reason for building the Pi. It was to have the absolute cheapest platform to hack on for students. You need a better CPU or a SATA port? Pony up that extra $20 and buy something better.
Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
This is a question from the 1980's. Let's ask Mr. Owl. He knows everything. (but rephrased from the 1980's)
Mr. Owl: Why do I need 10 Mbps ethernet card for $1,000 when my computer can barely sustain 1 Mbps?
Mr. Owl says: it's not all about your node's sustained throughput. It's about the capacity of the network you are connected to. Higher bits per second means higher capacity and therefore ability to have more packets flowing, although not necessary to and from your node.
I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
If you topped off at 60MBps with the Pi3 you had a bottleneck elsewhere. Maybe a slow SD card?
I get 11MByte/sec when copying stuff via scp to my Pi2.
The biggest improvement in the RPi I've been looking forward to is USB3/GBe. It's nice in the model 3 they added GBe, but it's pretty much pointless if you go and plug it into a USB2 port.
Real World Expected Speeds:
Thus, on the RPi3, GBe @ USB2 speeds means, MAYBE 14MB/s, BUT as others have noted, other IO devices on the RPIs share the same bus, so real-world speeds will be less. UGH.
Um, asynchronous switches with buffers have been a thing since forever, this isn't a tokenring network.
There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
so rasberrypi finally caught up to an i386 of the 1990's era, can i run windows 95 on it?
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
We aren't on broadcasted networking using dumb hubs anymore. That reason makes absolutely no sense today. The PI could have a 10mbps interface connected to a gigabit switch and it wouldn't slow down the rest of the network.
I donâ(TM)t think that in 25 years I worked with a person who considered themself to be âzthe greatestâoe in their profession without being considerd mediocre at best by the rest of the people surrounding them.
All of these upgrades ... AC wireless and gigabit ethernet totally wasted by piping it over USB2
I have a NAS with an Intel Atom CPU from a decade ago that will still run circles around any PI setup.
Good for you, but that's not my use case. Don't need the giant bandwidth. Only need the extreme low power to serve files at video-playing bandwidth. A glorified networked USB stick, if you want.
Combined with printing service (can locally print a file that was updated to it, circumventing limitations of a locked-down windows laptop with no admin account to install printer drivers).
Could also install rtorrent on it, for occasionnal download.
Coupled with a couple of other similar extremely simple services.
Your Atom installation, while porbably awesome, is completely overkill to me.
If you're going to go with a PI setup for a NAS, you might as well just take the router you already have that likely already has a USB port and put something like DDWRT, Tomato, or LEDE on it and attach an external HD to the USB port, then enable Samba on the firmware distro.
That was *exactly* my target. Except that the router is locked, can't be installed with any opensource firmware. (It's the thing I got for free from the provider).
I could have thrown it away and spent decent money on a high quality router.
Or just re-use an old raspberry Pi that I have laying around, basically installing the same kind of software functionality that I would have installed on a router with OpenWRT.
(Also, the router happens to have decent Wifi, so it basically at least works as intended as a router. Though without IPv6).
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
I am pretty sure the limiting factor was that they only have an interconnect option to a cellular modem, or a bunch of gpio pins like they are currently configured.
That was the whole reason for using the USB 2 bus instead of something faster.
Really the chip line the Pi is based on should have been decommissioned long ago, but instead they found new life selling to 'makers' and opening up documentation as they became ever more obsolete.
I do agree that the open documentation is good, just that at the same time they have slacked on ensuring a design which was future compatible (still stuck with 1GB of RAM as an SoC limitation 3 generations later...)
My next build is likely going to be a Rock64. The 4GB of LPDDR3 plus gigabit ethernet plus optional USB 3 and wifi will make it much superior in almost every way I might want to use it, and it supports standardized EMMC adapters, even if they cost 1/4 to 1.5x the cost of the SBC itself. All of this makes it a far better platform than the Pi, except for GPIO or GPU related endeavors, both of which it is slightly lacking in (The latter due to its Mali-400/450 based graphics core, which while having more power than the VC4, isn't as reprogrammable. The VC4 for the record could emulate OpenCL support, as well as 'regular' OGL 2.1 support thanks to its opcode design, albeit at a loss in performance. Mali is built like an old GPU in comparison and cannot.)
Network AND storage over a shared USB 2 bus?
Nah, no thanks.
Kriston
They still don't have gigabit networking on board? The orange pi does I believe at near half the cost.
Very happy with my pi's but using networking over USB is simply not going to happen
Open source, nice horsepower: https://libre.computer/
You are doing it wrong.
There are many alternatives to Pi, some run faster, some have extra features, some are cheaper
Has there been any alternative to Pi that runs faster, comes with more features, and still cheaper?
Depends on your criteria defining better.
One could also consider the opensource friendliness of the chipset :
- Broadcom's VideoCore is one of the few ARM chips where everything running on the ARM core can be opensource upstream code (Raspbian updates its kernel regularily). All the proprietary blobs are restricted to the DSPs handling video. You can even run without them (specially if you aren't interested in processing video, but use the pi as a micro server).
(The Freescale family of chips selected by Purism for their Librem 5 smartphone is another example that can be run 100% of opensource).
(I suspect that the RISC-V will also bring interesting free-software friendliness)
- Lots of other chips limits you to kernel version "whatever happened to be popular on Android back then, now you're stuck with it". You're stuck with antique kernels full of blobs.
One could consider the community :
Raspberry Pis are among the most popular SBC, have gathered a ginormous community of users.
That means you can easily find tons of answers for common questions easily on forums and other web ressources,
lots of add-on products will be specially be designed with raspberries in mind
etc.
In the few case I've researched the subject: the cases of cheaper board with higher-clocked CPUs and more features touted on the bullet list provided by the marketeers, tend to also use much cheaper chips with crappier Linux support and although they tout lots of GPIO pins, those aren't 1:1 compatible with Pi (nor even follow any attempts of standard like HAT).
They're great if you only plan to interface them with extremely generic hardware (basically if you mostly attach your stuff on the USB ports) or if you're making your own hardware (where the only requirement you have regarding the GPIO pins is that they exist).
Raspberry Pi basically has managed to become the IBM PC of the home computer : sure, better things exist elsewhere. But that's what everything is palying with.
And if like me you're not the world's best expert in SBCs, better to stick with the most popular and most widely supported stuff.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
There's a good question. Has anyone done any soldering or other computing magic to actually add more RAM to a Pi?
Even if the method was hacky as fuck like adding it through some other method like a physical RAM drive over USB or some other crazy stuff?
It'd surprise me if someone hasn't tried it.
Some people used to ask "Where were you when Kennedy was assassinated?" Then it was "Where were you when the shuttle blew up?" Later, it was "Where were you when the 9-11 terrorism happened?" The most recent one will be "Where were you at on 3/14/15 at 9:26:53am?" Now it'll be remembered for Stephen Hawking's death. His death comes on Pi day (3.14), the date which Albert Einstein was born. Hawking was also born on the date Galileo Galilei died (January 8th 1642), the year Isaac Newton was born later on Christmas... the day observed for the birthday of Jesus.
I've been accused of being the greatest at what I do, while I'm certain I'm not, because I meet people who are better at it than me at conferences.
When I dissolve into senility, I can rest assured that I was the greatest.