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Ask Slashdot: Some Good Linux Desktop Option For Kids?
New submitter TIWolfman writes: I'm looking to re-purpose some of the older hardware that I've held onto to create something of a starter machine for my kids (both aged below 10). At this point it's still just a few shortcut icons I can setup on the desktop for them, primarily to web tools/sites they use, but I'd like some flexibility; everything I've read suggests options that haven't had any activity since 2015. Is there an option out there or is this just a custom job?
The world in general is still waiting for a good Linux Desktop for adults...
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
Modern app appers know that only apps can app apps, and appy Appdows 10 S lets you app apps while apping other apps, unlike LUDDITE Linux!
Apps!
Your mom
https://www.edubuntu.org/
Last release was in 2015 but it's on a 5-year LTS cycle
Runs great on older hardware. If that isn't GUI or recent enough, there's always ElementaryOS and Mint.
Nice UI, stable, easy to install. Consider launching in VM, so you can easily snapshot/restore or even clone the whole environment.
Sugar is still in active development, and is built with the explicit purpose of "interactive learning for children".
https://www.sugarlabs.org/
If you're looking for an easy to use Linux desktop, have you considered Mint? It's ben two years since I used it, but with the Cinnamon DE it was very Windows-like. Easy enough to put some icons on the desktop.
If you were looking to do something more locked-down and kiosk-like, then I'm no help - have never researched that.
Defending IP by destroying access to it? That makes sense, RIAA/MPAA. Go to the corner until you can play nice!
Gentoo?
Just set up Linux Mint on a Lenovo laptop for my grandson with pygame support. Scratch might be a good place to start for young kids.
My kids are considerably younger, but I installed Doudou Linux on an old netbook for them to learn how to navigate and use the mouse and keyboard. They are 4 and 2 and love using TuxPaint and some of the puzzles in the GCompris Educational Suite.
People who were watching this when they were 10 are old enough to buy alcohol now. Find a newer reference.
Tux Racer, Tux Paint, Super Tux Kart etc.
And none of this modern shit.... give those little snots Version 2.1 on 70 floppy disks! Thatâ(TM)ll showâ(TM)em! If I had to struggle as a youth to learn Linux, so should everyone!!
I really don't have any idea from the submission what it is you're looking for. What is it you want for kids that's different from what you'd want for adult users? Give us some idea of your objectives.
When someone says, "Any fool can see
If you want them to learn I'd let them figure out Arch or any other distro themselves using documentation. Otherwise, if you want ease of use and educational apps... Android or Chrome
Microsoft has ported many Linux distributions to run natively on Windows. Basically, they took the Linux kernel out of Linux.
I recommend to use this to provide exposure to both Windows and Linux.
And none of this modern shit.... give those little snots Version 2.1 on 70 floppy disks! Thatâ(TM)ll showâ(TM)em!
If I had to struggle as a youth to learn Linux, so should everyone!!
Back when I had to struggle with things like that, those were the best times of learning. Configuring hardware gets you into thinking about how it works and how it works with the OS. You learn how the dependencies are interrelated.
Otherwise, if it's a download distro that goes in smoothly and gives you a desktop no issues, I suggest just getting a cheap ass Windows machine and call it a day. Or a System76 machine (not-so-cheap; crapware has upsides)
Edubuntu used to be what you are looking for. However, it seems to be abandoned.
I found the GCompris program to be very good a few years ago. I don't know how well it aged. You should be able to install it on any version of Linux.
One of our competitors trademarked the term "hypothesis". From now on, we will call them "boneheaded ideas".
I hear good things about "Ubermix" http://www.ubermix.org/about.h... The project focuses on a reduced complexity environment and includes educational applications. might be worth looking at
Gentoo
The LXDE desktop came to mind immediately, just because it's simple and constrained enough. Gnome 2 meets Windows 95, that's about it.
This makes it not so different from Windows 7's and Windows 10's explorer.exe either.
It's suitable for adult computer beginners, so it should be easier for children. Just that if you want to add a desktop shortcut other than pasting it from the start menu may be a bit involved, i.e. finding a way to create a legal well formed .desktop file. (there are menu editors like alacarte and lxmed)
Its default text editor is a basic notepad clone. :)
It needs about a 200MHz CPU and 128MB RAM
If you use Lubuntu (I have to try 18.04) the icon theme is ugly and grey in my opinion, change it to a colorful "default" icon theme. That's an advice I offer to grown ups and adults too.
When my nephew was 9, I set up a computer for him. I gave him a MATE desktop, which basically works similar to Windows, and he was able to use it right away.
I didn't give him root on his own machine. However, I gave his user sudo permission to run the Software Manager. I gave him Linux Mint, which is a tweaked version of Ubuntu, so it was basically the Ubuntu Software Manager. This is pretty similar to the app store on mobile devices. So he had no ability to screw up his system, but he could browse the Software Manager, find a game or something, and install it with a click.
My goal was to set his baseline expectations to Linux. I wanted him to see Windows and say "wait, there's no app store thing with free games on Windows? How primitive, give me my Linux please." I wouldn't say my brainwashing attempt succeeded, but he just turned 12 and he still uses the Linux computer for most of what he does on a computer. He also has a Windows laptop that he uses to run some Windows-only stuff he likes. But he chooses which computer to use just based on what he wants to run; he has no particular preference for Windows or for Linux.
P.S. His Linux computer is an all-in-one made by Lenovo, with a really nice and big screen. I got it really inexpensively on eBay; I believe it was off-lease.
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
Us t hat what will give you the most supporty. If you have a friend that used Debian, use that as that will be the person who you ask and that is what he knows.
So for the kid it will be whatever you use. As you post here, I assume you at least know how to change a desktop to look as you want it to look.
Do that and you are done.
I did not even need to know how old the kid is or what its capabilities and/or limits are as you will just know.
Now if you use something that you know will not be possible to be adapted enough, just use one of the three big ones that can be easily installed on your distro of choice. XFCE, KDE or GNOME. Pick one that is easiest for YOU to install and/or maintain.
Remember that you will be the one that has to repair things when it breaks. If the small adult is larger, you could install more than one and have the mini-you make its own choice if it wants to. Could be that the kid has absolutely no interest in it and rather does something else. That is a real option. I know I wanted to do things my dad did not like, just because.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
My kid who's 5 now started using KDE/Mint over a year ago. Plays minetest, does abcmouse, watches Nick Jr on it.
The latest Raspberry Pi model 3's come with Wi-Fi and four USB ports. The OS is on an SD card. You can make up several SD cards for different purposes using any of the many interesting distros available. Raspian is a decent basic Linux OS. As far as using old hardware goes, just retain the mice, keyboards and montors. Give each kid their own Pi and a few distros depending on their interests.
Distrowatch will let you look at distributions based on hardware type: Distro Watch Raspberry Pi
That was the turning point of my life--I went from negative zero to positive zero.
How about Sugar?
It was the UI interface developed by the One Laptop Per Child initiative.
You can get "Sugar on a Stick", which is a Fedora distribution with the Sugar interface.
https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick
It's fast, has 32 and 64 bit processor support, 4 different versions (I installed xfce), intuitive, well supported, can set up parental controls, lots of downloadable kids' stuff... there's more but I'm already boring.
Linux Mint
Kids are much smarter than you might think and if they are really interested they will pick it right up.
Rick B.
if you count Android as being Linux
But it depends, if you are a corporate slashdotter whore, best bet is to just get them a WSJ subscription and FOX News links on an iPad or some shit. If you are a nerd, design it and lock it the fuck down, they are your kids.
Endless OS [1] seems to be a good fit for the job.
[1] https://endlessos.com/
makes your kid a script kid
cons:
- may lead to big head aches for you and/or your child
If you're willing to drop a few bucks on a Raspberry Pi, Kano is an impressive project, acting as both kid-friendly desktop environment and programming education tool. Lots of built-in coding tutorials, a "learn how to use the shell" game, and a code-oriented version of Minecraft, to boot.
http://developers.kano.me/downloads/
Obliteracy: Words with explosions
Linux makes a great desktop option for people who don't value their own time.
Any of the *BSD's would be a better option due to stability plus the fact that Freebsd provides the base for OS-X - Check the Darwin Project for a very Mac style desktop.
Another reason for avoiding Linux now is "SystemD" that's as opaque as Windows with many of the same design errors. It violates the "KISS" keep it simple stupid! principles that Linux started with while FreeBSD has a viabrant community that can be quite helpful.
My two year old took about ten minutes to learn the iPad, or at least it seemed like about 10 minutes. Kids learn fast, so they'll be able to click shortcut icons in any distribution no problem. The only question is how many weeks it will take before they've subverted your parental protections and have full access to the Internet.
Since the district isn't going to matter to the kids, I'd probably pick whatever the parent is most comfortable setting up an maintaining. Something with good automatic security updates that has long term support.
Since it will probably only take them a few minutes, and at most hours, to learn how to click the icons, after that there is an opportunity for them to learn a little bit about how the computer works. Some distributions make that more visible and discoverable than others.
Yes, get your children started early on corporate control of their lives. They don't need to think for themselves, solutions are provided by profit-driven monopolies, the way it should be... Jesus...
When the king heard the words of the Book of the Law he tore his robes.2Kings22:11
If you've already given them a sex talk (definitely do so if you haven't. You should do this before they're interested in it. The earlier the better.), how to handle strangers online, and to not click on ads, then just create user accounts for them and give them normal control of the computer. If you haven't done those things, then the computer shouldn't be connected to the internet.
Before we were 10 we were already making custom boot-up files in order to have enough free memory for sound for our games. Your kids can and will learn how to use the computer. If you baby everything for them, they won't learn. If they ask you to do something for them, walk them through the steps of doing it but make them perform all the actions.
Or KDE.
Personally, I've done stock Lubuntu on old hardware with shortcuts for a browser with PBS kids as homepage, a few local movies, GCompris, Tux Paint, LibreOffice Writer, and when they got a little older, Minecraft, Steam. If they are not yet used to a mouse, I highly recommend a one button kid-sized version like the Chester Mouse, this made a huge difference in usability / frustration [especially since they liked to play with scroll wheel a lot]. Overall, whatever distro you are most comfortable with is probably good enough, they will likely only ever use the shortcuts on the desktop until older*. * Most likely, I claim no liability for whatever random you-tubes they find or terminals they open. Their account will not be on the sudo list, right? :-)
But he chooses which computer to use just based on what he wants to run; he has no particular preference for Windows or for Linux.
What you taught him was that he'll get another piece of hardware that he desires - not needs.
Congratulations! You spoiled him!
I really like Mint with Cinnamon. I setup an old laptop with it for my parents (who had almost no experience with computers) and they picked it up pretty quickly. All drivers worked fine, too!
Hey, BSD is just like Linux, only better.
There are likely to be builds of ChromiumOS that you can install on the computer, and it produces the effect of ChromeOS running on hardware which will almost certainly be much better than some Chromebook.
Okay, do not like the Anonymous Coward label by default... Suggest: https://elementary.io ...from a bootable thumb drive ...on a win7 laptop (avoid BIOS crap)... then kill the MS partition and run elementary os as a solo OS.
A sub-10 year old needs a computer (of any flavour) as much as it needs another lazy, remote, uncaring parent.
Load all the GUIs available. Try each to see which runs acceptably on your older hardware. I suspect that the latest Gnome or KDE versions may be challenged depending on the age of the hardware and graphic card in use. Show them how to select a different one when they login if they want. Report back in a few months to see which one they picked.
I tend to use KDE. Some of the kids use MATE. Some use KDE. Really, what matters are the applications and those will run pretty much on any desktop. Just make sure the GUIs you provide at least work and can do basic things. If they don't, then remove them from the O/S before letting the kids play around.
Your going to administering it anyway, so use what you use - it's what your familiar with.
My son's (11) computer was originally Mint, but it was just different enough from what I'm used to that it was a hassle to install programs for him when they were not in the repositories. Last hardware update I switched him to Arch, with, I think it may have been, kde. He is now running Arch with i3 and Albert as a launcher. He's not very comfortable with the command line, yet, but knows the basics, and can launch what he needs through Albert.
My daughter (8) is running the xfce version of Manjaro. Commonly used applications are either desktop icons or in the quick launcher.
I'm not quite sure what you mean by "desktop options". In the event that you are looking for an application or two for your children then I highly recommend the programming language "Scratch". It is a GUI-based language where you drag-and-drop language elements to construct a program. It incorporates many of the concepts from "turtle graphics", where the goal of the program is to draw pictures on the screen, an objective familiar to children. I've been working with Scratch with my nine-year-old grand daughter for several months both in person and via Skype screen sharing. I'm just amazed at what she has picked up in that period.
If you would like to explore sketching, as opposed to programmatic drawing, then have a look at Inkscape and Krita.
Bill
Making your kids use Linux should be considered child abuse.
I have found the exact opposite to be true.
I helped my son build his first linux computer from a bunch of broken and discarded PCs when he was 11 years old.
When the boy was a sophomore in college, he was hired by NASA Goddard. Then a Washington DC legal software firm hired him away from NASA at a significant pay increase. A year later NASA tried to hire him back, and the law firm gave him a nice big raise to prevent that.
Oh, and also, he can spell "seamlessly".
I gave a laptop with regular Ubuntu (Unity) to a 7 year old (she's 11 now and still loves it - an Asus 201 11" model).
Browsing was restricted by a FF plugin to kid friendly sites.
Installed a bunch of Linux games and education software.
We relaxed the browsing filter after her 11th birthday.
Anybody who argues Linux is too difficult to use git beaten by a 7 year old kid. :)
Making your kids use Linux should be considered child abuse.
You misspelled MS Windows.
I have noticed chosen distro does not really make a difference. First my sons used Linux Mint happily, mostly watching videos on Youtube. Later I installed Ubuntu Gnome and they made no remarks, they found the browser on their own. I went back to Linux Mint because my older son likes to update the OS, and Mint has nice icon showing when updates are available. I like using Mint in computers I've promised to maintain (my 70+ years old aunt and uncle and some friends) because the machines really do not require much effort. Seldom update them with remote connection and twice installed printer drivers remotely. If you want to present your kids some nice games, I recommend Fedora Games distribution https://labs.fedoraproject.org... . It has ~100 games pre-installed, they work off-line and some of them are actually ok.
My kids have been using Ubuntu since they each got computers - about age 8. No problems at all. They've never had Windows and they are now in their late teens. In fact, they sort of make fun of how dumb Windows is designed. My eldest is now in university and reports that Linux experience is a big asset in his Engineering studies. Think scholarships.
Sure, maybe the latest Fortnight game might not work but this might be a good thing (or it might, I play a few modern Windows games on Linux through Wine).
I've also successfully installed Linux for seniors and non-technical users. Each reported that they did not want to go back to a commercial Windows operating system. Mostly the reason given was that the Unity GUI was quite well designed and that Linux ran problem free.
Sold a laptop a while ago, came preinstalled with Endless OS, and the buyer said she and her kids (3yo) prefeers it over Windows. Simple GUI, great kids games preloaded.
https://endlessos.com/
drmad
They have a Fedora based kid environment. Haven't played with in years. I got use this with the laptop I got when I donated to the cause. The unit is cute and has some interesting mesh networking features built in. This circle thing is a bit weird but, kind of works.
Edubuntu.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Can anyone tell me the best CLI text editor for my kid to learn?
Linux mint is a friendly familiar desktop that works well.
Elementary OS - A fast and open replacement for Windows and macOS
https://elementary.io/
There isn't a kid-specific desktop or distro that I'm aware of, and I'm not sure that'd be advisable anyway. Instead of kid-specific, maybe a regular distro and desktop with some unneeded things left out.
I'd start with Mint. It's easy to set up (which means it's easy to re-image if things get too screwed up) easy to maintain, and no more difficult to use than any other desktop.
My "serious work" laptop runs CentOS to maintain compatibility with the RHEL servers at my work. But the casual usage laptop I share with the family runs Mint. (It's a repurposed laptop that doesn't have the grunt to run Windows 10, but with an SSD and maxed out ram, runs Linux just fine.)
Mind you, we have a couple of Winders desktops for things only Winders can do, but the number of Microsoft-only applications we still have to deal with as a family is steadily dwindling. (I've said this before, but the ONLY thing I need in order to be able to dump the Big Two (OSX/Windows) is a native port of Adobe CC to Linux. ANY version of Linux -- I'm not picky.)
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
https://spins.fedoraproject.org/en/soas/
tell them to go outside and play! (important while the physiology is still developing.) turn off the electronics, and if you do turn them on, make sure the computing utilities are in a public area.
Have a look at LXDE with LXlauncher (see https://wiki.lxde.org/en/LXLauncher )
I didn't use it for a while but it is a neat very easy to use starter which you can edit for your kids
http://edubuntu.org/other-educational-systems
I love elementary OS It's very clean simply and easy to use as well as being stabile, you can find it here https://elementary.io/
If you are repurposing some old hardware you may encounter difficulties getting your downloaded Linux images to run.
This is because for a period in history CPUs made use of a mechanism called PAE (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_Address_Extension), but this is no longer used and so the Linux community has stopped supporting it.
You'll be looking for 32-bit Linux releases that have the string 'PAE' or perhaps 'NO-PAE' in their name.
All that having been said, you may find the following Linux releases useful for your older laptops:
- Bodhi Linux
- Bunsen Labs Linux
- CrunchBang++ Linux
- Damn Small Linux (DSL)
- Lubuntu Liniux
- Mint Linux
- Puppy Linux
- Tiny Core Linux
- Vector Linux
I've had good experiences with DSL, Puppy, and Vector Linux releases, on old Thinkpads, for my four daughters.
Personally, I'm a FreeBSD guy, drifting towards OpenBSD. Unemployed, because I have grey hair, you know, and that, along with children, is linked to being not cost-effective.
You're welcome.
~childo
My sister learned linux back in early 2000s as a result of me adopting it in the 90s. If it wasn't for IE only websites and Windows software back then she would have kept using it full time. She eventually migrated through Windows then OSX, then Windows, then Linux, then finally to Windows 10 for DRMed media.
Sell all your old stuff, buy them an iPad. Leashing your kids to an antiquated concept like a laptop or desktop PC is going to stunt their technological growth.
I'm an old guy and am clinging onto my laptop for dear life, but day-to-day I use it less and less for non-software engineering tasks.
it's a computer operating system, if that is the gateway to control of your life and individual thought then choosing which operating system to run is the least of your worries, if i were to hack your OS i would have control of your life and you wouldn't be able to think for yourself, that's some serious power you've entrusted to your computer. really what is it you specifically mean by "corporate control of your life"? because i suspect you're just being a bit of a drama queen.
To give you an idea, it's basically the "Linux Mint" of Debian but with custom tools like ElementaryOS has to make things even easier. So, it's really easy to use but stable as hell. Matter of fact, if something that normally breaks on Debian, the maintainer has repos with fixed versions. An example I've already noticed was with OBS Studio. The interface is kind of like XFCE but the panel is on the left side and a searchable app menu. Uses only 300-400MB of RAM after login and startup. The creator has a few really good YouTube videos on it.
Hi,
If I were you I'd prepare environment for the kids like this:
1) Minimalistic XFCE desktop: One bar on the top of the screen, with workspace switcher plugin, windows list and calendar. That's it. Disable everything else.
2) Custom Cairo-Dock on the bottom, with custom-made launchers for a web browser, file browser, and so on.
You can successfully make custom dock launchers for games that kids may like; for example Thomas Was Alone, Portal, maybe Lovers in a Dangerous Spacetime ( or 2016's DooM ;) ). Kids will have access to the games you'd curated for them, while not being exposed to content and commercials on various games distribution platforms...
Set proper security measures and expose them to the terminal as well. And wait for them to hack the system and make you proud :)
As for the composite manager, I'd choose KWin, as it's simply very good.
It doesn't matter which distribution you choose, as all of this boils down to the configuration - especially when it comes to platform-independent software like a web browser.
Cheers!
give those kids some slack, they're pretty smart (smarter then you think they are, probably) and can use computers just fine. ...)
just create a new user on your linux pc and let them go at it. my youngest (8 now, but she was using it as youndgas 6) has no problems doing all the things that are important to her on the pc (starting a browser, playing some music, writing,
On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.
Cinnamon edition. He likes it. It runs on an ivy bridge i3 I bought second hand for $100
If they're primary age kids, ubuntu. That has a childish interface that's good for them.
Secondary - Fedora with KDE. That's a much more mature look & feel to a desktop.