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GitHub, Medium Remove Public ICE Employee Data Repository (obsceneworks.com)

owenferguson shares a report from Obscene Works: Medium.com and GitHub have today quashed the release of a set of data comprising of all the ICE employees who openly list themselves on LinkedIn.com. All the data released was gathered from publicly listed LinkedIn profiles. The data was assembled by Sam Lavigne of http://lav.io/ and was published as a repository on GitHub, and announced via an article on Medium.com.

81 of 707 comments (clear)

  1. ICE employees? by Dutch+Gun · · Score: 5, Informative

    Okay, I'll bite. The "article" doesn't even answer the question. What the heck is an ICE employee? A gas-powered employee?

    Answer via Google: U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement.

    --
    Irony: Agile development has too much intertia to be abandoned now.
    1. Re:ICE employees? by whargoul · · Score: 2

      ICE is Immigrations and Customs Enforcement

    2. Re: ICE employees? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Boo boo boo! They are following the fucking law! How terrible! Same law your hero Obama followed.
      How much did you worry about brown kids the ? Zero. Disingenuous prat.

      Hate the law? Change it.

      But that is not your issue. You hate Trump.

      Hillary lost. Move on.

      The law's been on the book a long time, the current administration is interpreting it rather differrently than previous administrations.
      They can change their interpretation/policy in a heartbeat.
      Who currently control the llaw-making institutions and are thus capable of changing the law? (But prefer to use kids as a lever for their political purposes)

    3. Re: ICE employees? by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 2

      There are 3 "tender" facilities with babies taken from their mother's arms in south texas and they are preparing to open a 4th facility. Airline attendents are reporting on flights carrying the toddlers away from the area.

      These are not teens. These are babies and todders. the parents will be "fast tracked" back home and the children will be "slow tracked" and *per* the former head of ICE, they may not be sent to their home countries for months or years and by then there may no way to identify their parents.

      I'm going to volunteer tomorrow and start donating for attorneys. It was reported on the news tonight that some of these 3 and 4 year old are being put in court without a lawyer to defend themselves.

      This is nazi 1934 stuff happening. It's evil.

      --
      She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
    4. Re: ICE employees? by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 2

      I was on the road today. I've already signed up to help at the democratic website.

      I also donated to the puerto rican crisis- where over 5,000 u.s. citizens have died so far and now a new hurricane season is starting.

      And I've been doing volunteer work for the democratic party in Texas (first time in my life-- I was still voting for republicans in 2008.)

      Republicans have left morality and are headed towards authoritarianism and evil behavior.

      Any conservatives like me should leave the party and work to restore sanity to this country. Especially those who are fiscally conservative and socially liberal like me.

      --
      She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
  2. I'm as lefty as they get by rsilvergun · · Score: 5, Interesting

    and I'll grant the story, touching on Github as it does, has some potential validity. But what the hell is up with that headline? "Willfully Destroyed"? They didn't destroy anything. They took it off their servers. Probably because there's a lot of emotions running high and they're rightfully worried some nutjob is going to go off half cocked and hurt somebody.

    I'm grateful to Github for nipping this in the bud. Crap like this is exactly the sort of response that our countries current extreme immigration policies are meant to solicit. We're being trolled; probably as a point of distraction from economic issues that otherwise would dominate the mid-term elections (the economy's doing crap with poor wage growth despite full employment). Now is the time to calm the heck down and apply appropriate and legal pressure. Not dox a bunch of poorly paid gov't employees who most likely took the job out of desperation (and yes, I know folks who work in some of the less upstanding law enforcement jobs and believe me, it's not by choice).

    --
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    1. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by whoever57 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      They may have taken the jobs out of desperation, but they didn't have to announce the fact on LinkedIn.

      They made the information about themselves public.

      --
      The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
    2. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Publishing a LinkedIn search may or may not be moral, but it's not "doxxing." Doxxing would be linking it to non public info like phone number, address, ssn, etc for the purposes of encouraging harassment.

    3. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 2

      They failed to nip it in the bud. It's in the wild now. There are already probably 10's of thousands of copies.

      If I work or worked for ICE and was on the list, I'd move. Especially if I had a family.

      --
      She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
    4. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Euthanasia is a choice made by rational adults about their own end.

      Abortion does not result of the loss of a thinking being that can feel distress.

      What is going on now is involuntary confinement of children who can and who have committed no crime.

    5. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You are not right. Most doxxers defend their actions by saying the information they compiled was publicly accessible. While the data may be publicly available, it is not compiled into an easily searchable database for the purposes of hurting people.

      If you like keeping lists of "undesirablea" so much, just remember... Hitler kept lists too. Yup... Godwin's Law!

    6. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by PopeRatzo · · Score: 3, Informative

      In this case, mom and dad committed a crime and have to be detained until they can be adjudicated.

      Nobody in the US loses their kids over a misdemeanor. If you run a red light, you don't have your kids put in a "Tender Age" prison.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    7. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by phantomfive · · Score: 2

      A reckoning is coming,

      What sort of reckoning do you see coming?

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    8. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by Reverend+Green · · Score: 2

      It's good that people are seeing Surveillance Valley's real attitude toward free speech. Doesn't matter if you are "right" or "left". If you say something that offends the oligarchy, VC-controlled companies will censor you.

    9. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      The monkey who managed to double our countries debt in 8 fu*king years!!

      Sadly, you have no understanding of how the US government works. Spending is controlled by congress, not the president, and congress was controlled by Republicans for 6 out of those 8 years. In fact, despite all their ranting about "tax and spend Democrats", Republicans have controlled congress, and therefore controlled spending, for 20 out of the last 26 years.

    10. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by DaHat · · Score: 2

      Nobody in the US loses their kids over a misdemeanor.

      No? If you are arrested for something and cannot make bail, either because you cannot afford it, or perhaps because you are denied it because you are deemed a flight risk... then yes, you are not going to have physical custody of your kids for a while. In the case of someone who is unlawfully in a country and has residency (and presumably other ties elsewhere), the odds of being a flight risk are increased.

      If you run a red light, you don't have your kids put in a "Tender Age" prison.

      Most runnings of red lights aren't misdemeanors, they are civil infractions. Granted if you blow through the light, while drunk and/or being chased by the cops... then yes, your kids will be taken from you as well.

    11. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by PopeRatzo · · Score: 2

      What sort of reckoning do you see coming?

      The kind we should have had after the first Civil War, if we'd only let General Sherman do what needed to be done.

      The fact that the traitors received a general pardon was a travesty. Sherman was right.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    12. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by rworne · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Sure. This is why my kid had on their history final that Reagan ran up the national debt and turned the US from the #1 creditor to a debtor nation.

      The difference from Obama was the political parties running congress and the executive were swapped. So - the blame got swapped too.

      --
      I tried every decent and legal way I could think of to resolve the issue w/the business before I rented the chicken suit
    13. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by fafalone · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Unless you live in one of the few places that eliminated cash bail for misdemeanors, then you're wrong. You could challenge being held on bail because of childcare obligations, but scheduling that hearing takes a while, first appearance judges don't want to hear it. There's no law that sets misdemeanor bail to zero for parents, nor for people who can't post.

    14. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by dwillden · · Score: 2

      Yes for misdemeanors. If you are arrested. You go to jail and for at least a few hours you are separated from your children. If over a weekend and they can't get ahold of a family member then DCFS (or what ever they are called in your state) will place them in short term foster care.

      In the US as a citizen the court system should have you at least eligible for bail and back out on the street with a court date within a few hours to days tops. But for a time you are in jail and your children are not in there with you.

      For illegal entry it's the same, except that the courts are overwhelmed by the never-ending flood. And if the detainee claims asylum that kicks in an entirely new process with a series of interviews and investigations to validate the claim. That takes time, and while it is going on the children will be separated.

      They tried to keep families together using special detention centers years ago and your beloved liberal courts blocked them. The kids can't go to jail, so they have to be taken care of and this is how it happens. It's how it happened under every president since 1997 when the courts forced the separation. Obama had four times as many children separated in 2013 and 2014 until he initiated his foolish catch and release program that is a total failure. Over 80% of those caught and released with a court date never showed up.

      So yes a misdemeanor will result in your separation.

      A traffic infraction gets you a written citation as you darn well know.

      --
      I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
    15. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Doxing often involves just collecting publicly available information. Most people don't realize how various little bits here and there can be collated and cross-referenced to build up a profile of them, kinda like what Facebook does.

      Just because something is public doesn't mean it can't be used for doxing. Merely collecting it for the purposes of harassment or shaming is enough.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    16. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by AmiMoJo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Why throw the parents in one cage and the children in a different cage? Why not keep them together?

      Even if you ignore the humanitarian grounds, it surely costs more to provide free childcare that the parents would otherwise have given.

      Let's drop the pretence. This is being done to put pressure on the Democrats and to discourage migrants. It's not a legal requirement or procedural issue, it's a deliberate decision to separate children from their parents for political reasons.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    17. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by Curunir_wolf · · Score: 4, Informative

      Why throw the parents in one cage and the children in a different cage? Why not keep them together?

      They tried that, but the courts have ruled they cannot house children in the same facilities with adult detainees.

      --
      "Somebody has to do something. It's just incredibly pathetic it has to be us."
      --- Jerry Garcia
    18. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by aquacrayfish · · Score: 4, Informative

      Okay, we got *a* shutdown, not shutdowns, under Obama because Ted Cruz and the Tea Party wing pushed for one. The rationale was they wanted to tie the budget to the debt ceiling and they wanted, again, to muck with the ACA. They bragged about getting what they wanted afterwards because of the resulting unilateral cuts.

      So, surprise, Obama didn't want to sign that. I'm not aware of a rational argument on why he would want to. You can argue about whether you like(d) the ACA, whether budget cuts were a good idea, the fallout of our loss on credit rating or furloughed jobs was worth it, or whatever all you like. Obama had no interest in gutting his own health care bill. Duh. I'd also like to think we agree that the concept of the debt ceiling isn't relevant right now how much Congress spends (regardless of where they spend).

    19. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by AmiMoJo · · Score: 4, Informative

      In Europe we have detention facilities for families. They are secure but also provide conditions suitable for families, at least in theory.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    20. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2

      Are we more likely to have actual immigration reform come through Congress?

      A better question is if using the lives and mental health of children as a tool to force Democrats to agree to these reforms a reasonable thing to do? Is that how democracy is supposed to work?

      Are migrants going to stop coming to the US illegally for fear of their family being split apart?

      Doubtful, considering what the alternative for many is. But in any case, you are begging the question. Is the number of migrants really such a huge problem, and is stopping them coming the best way to deal with it as opposed to, say, managing immigration better?

      People are always going to migrate. The US was built on migration. There are no short term fixes.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    21. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by Gr8Apes · · Score: 2

      Sure. This is why my kid had on their history final that Reagan ran up the national debt and turned the US from the #1 creditor to a debtor nation.

      The difference from Obama was the political parties running congress and the executive were swapped. So - the blame got swapped too.

      Historical fact: Reagan and his Republican wave did run up the debt. Check your history, as in go to various gov sites and see what the historical budgets were and who voted on them. Note that the Senate was controlled by Republicans for 6 out of his 8 years. Dems controlled the house during that time so they aren't entirely clean of the debt runup.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    22. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You guys all seem to forget that Reagan ran up the debt because it was the way to end the Cold War. We outspent the USSR on military expansion/upgrades and they broke their fragile command economy trying to keep up, leading to the fall of the Soviet Union.

      So yeah, he spent billions short term to save trillions long term - and liberated Eastern Europe. Compared to our return on the 8 Trillion in increased debt from the Obama years with no real benefit to be shown for it - yeah, totally a bargain.

    23. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by Altus · · Score: 4, Informative

      collecting? Its on a god damn list on linked in and they all put themselves on that list.

      https://www.linkedin.com/searc...

      --

      "In America, first you get the sugar, then you get the power, then you get the women..." -H. Simpson

    24. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by comodoro · · Score: 2

      And the benefit from the fall of USSR was...?

    25. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by pots · · Score: 2
      I'm surprised that your kid would have that on a final, so I went looking for an explanation and found this. I'll quote:

      The key vote, 238 to 195, gave Mr. Reagan a third upset victory over the Democratic House majority on fiscal issues. The President won by virtue of the same coalition of Republicans and Southern Democrats that brought him victory in May on the budget resolution and in June on the budget reconciliation bill.

      You're right that the blame should not be placed solely on the president, but it doesn't seem as though the blame was swapped. This was a joint effort between the president and congress, with the president championing the cause.

    26. Re:I'm as lefty as they get by Shotgun · · Score: 2

      We're being trolled; probably as a point of distraction from economic issues that otherwise would dominate the mid-term elections .

      Let's see. What could the Democrats possibly want to distract us from? Maybe a report that has uncovered their "deep state" actors and put their obstruction of justice on clear display?

      --
      Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
      Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
    27. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by rworne · · Score: 4, Informative

      Seriously?

      The game of nuclear brinksmanship pretty much ended. The iron curtain fell as Eastern Bloc puppet states broke away from Soviet control. Millions of people gained freedom. The Berlin Wall fell. The Solidarity Union in Poland. Relations between the US and Russia improved considerably - yeah, relations with Russia now are not all that good, but it is far better than it was in the 1950's - 1980's.

      If people want to lay the blame on Reagan for the debt he rang up bankrupting the USSR, it was worth it.

      --
      I tried every decent and legal way I could think of to resolve the issue w/the business before I rented the chicken suit
    28. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by Gr8Apes · · Score: 2

      It wasn't just debt but also a virtual destruction of our economy. If you doubt this, go back and look at what the economy did post 1987, when the cracks became apparent in the USSR and then 1989, after the wall fell. This was especially felt in the manufacturing and high tech industries of the time. It also set the ground work for the rise of China's explosive economic growth, although that was going to happen sooner or later. I'm not saying the dissolution of the USSR was a bad thing. I do believe how relations were handled post 1990 might have resulted in a different and safer world, but we allowed the current situation to develop. And now we're stuck with some new expensive problems and dangers that a few different policies could likely have muted greatly. But that's a benefit of hindsight, where you can see where you should have done 'A' even though it would have hurt then to prevent 'B' from occurring. Without the certainty of 'B' the price of 'A' seemed too high.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    29. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by Gr8Apes · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Compared to our return on the 8 Trillion in increased debt from the Obama years with no real benefit to be shown for it - yeah, totally a bargain.

      Let's see - roughly 6T of that was directly related to saving our economy from the crash of 2008, and whose fault was that again? Oh yeah, the Republican led rollback of Democratic originated regulations on the banking industry allowed that to develop. Hmm. The remainder of the deficits were the result of Republican majority Congress, so what, exactly, did Obama do to the debt? What did we get? Obamacare. A half-assed form of universal coverage, but at least they tried, which the Republicans apparently find so abhorrent they're doing everything in their power to sabotage it so it "fails". Why? Because they're incapable of replacing it, as their concept of "healthcare", short version: pay or suffer and die (restated as it's god's will)

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    30. Re: I'm as lefty as they get by Gr8Apes · · Score: 3, Insightful
      You are incorrect on that as well:

      the five largest investment banks at the core of the crisis (including Bear Stearns and Lehman Brothers) were not subject to the CRA or other depository banking regulations, and they did not originate mortgages

      (From wikipedia, because it was easiest)

      Thus, the CRA wasn't in play for these investment banks, nor were they regulated. Yet they were the root cause of the recession.

      You can read more about it - yes, there was a housing bubble, it wasn't caused by government policy, and the GSEs (Fannie and Freddie) weren't drivers with their directives. When you can offload your risk for cash to loan more, there's no incentive to strengthen your requirements, because your base risk is still low. Someone else took the risk off your hands that you had. If you recall, several of those investment banks wound up being guilty of repackaging low-quality mortgage loans as high quality investments. All of that lead to an environment where lower quality loans being less costly and risky to originators and thus more and more were written and passed into the system. That increase in demand caused, you guessed it, increased prices. Thus the bubble grew and grew and finally popped at the slightest poke.

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
  3. And if it were an ANTIFA supporter database ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Lets create a database of all people on facebook who made a post supportive of the pro-violence wing of antifa. Would there be a different reaction to its deletion?

    1. Re:And if it were an ANTIFA supporter database ? by x0ra · · Score: 3, Funny

      No need to look them up on Facebook, just list all the student in gender studies, heck, just list all the student in any liberal arts curriculum...

    2. Re:And if it were an ANTIFA supporter database ? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It would be just as bad. As is the list of "SJWs".

      Lists of people you dislike are almost always a bad idea.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    3. Re:And if it were an ANTIFA supporter database ? by drnb · · Score: 2

      Someone legally compiled *publicly available* information. Started a small project to make said publicly available information accessible.

      Someone did the same thing for doctors that provided abortions. How did that turn out?

  4. Re:I don't get it. by whargoul · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why would anyone want this information?

    The only reason for a list like this is to encourage harassment of these individuals just for working somewhere that asshole doesn't agree with.

  5. Re:I don't get it. by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Without enforcers, the policy makers would be powerless. Without foot soldiers, there would be no war.

  6. What a creep by piojo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    What a creep.

    I find it helpful to remember that as much as internet companies use data to spy on and exploit their users, we can at times reverse the story, and leverage those very same online platforms as a means to investigate or even undermine entrenched power structures.

    This is some serious confusion, or just a severe "us against the world" mindset. Yes, internet companies sometimes spy on their customers. No, the people in his stalker notebook do not spy on ISP customers. No, the spying ISPs engage in is not the same as encouraging stalking.

    I've seen a certain (few) progressives justify bad behavior as "sticking it to the man", "speaking truth to power", or "punching up". Invariably, this was an excuse to be rude or make accusations about a person who wasn't in a position to defend themselves. This data dump goes beyond rudeness.

    --
    A cat can't teach a dog to bark.
    1. Re:What a creep by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 2, Insightful

      No one forced them to make a Linkedin account. This is just data that anyone can get from Linkedin or an appropriate Google search. Work for an entity that's being heinous? Don't brag about it online.

    2. Re: What a creep by c6gunner · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Absolutely. Can't wait for some Christian fundie to publish a comprehensive list of abortion doctors. With a wink and a "now I'm not telling you what to do with your guns" preface.

    3. Re: What a creep by evil_aaronm · · Score: 4, Informative
      Isn't that pretty much what Trump did during the campaign with this:

      “Hillary wants to abolish, essentially abolish the Second Amendment,” Trump said to boos from the crowd.
      “By the way, if she gets to pick her judges, nothing you can do folks,” he then added.
      “Though the Second Amendment people, maybe there is, I don't know.”

    4. Re:What a creep by piojo · · Score: 2

      By (few) you mean every Antifa supporter, all the trolls harassing prop 8 donors including Mozilla co-founder Brendan Eich, and all the college students who threaten violence if a speaker they disagree with comes to their college. Yeah, just a "few" progressives.

      Indeed there are a lot of bad apples. But aren't there even more people who stand for progressive ideals but don't make accusations, don't call for people to get fired, and don't encourage violence? These people don't make the news, and denouncing the whole group is nearly the same sin I'm criticizing. Some, not all.

      --
      A cat can't teach a dog to bark.
    5. Re: What a creep by GrimSavant · · Score: 4, Informative

      Uh, you do realize that the "Christian fundies" have been tracking abortion doctors already, right? Here's a story about them using license plate tracking. And there have already been multiple assassination attempts (and successful assassinations) on abortion doctors previously, so the violent innuendo has already been breached.

      I'm not going to speak to the efficacy or wisdom of doxxing ICE agents, but you seem to be behind the times on the willingness and capability of the radical right wing to resort to political violence. It's going to get extremely ugly very quickly if both sides start regularly using violence for political ends.

  7. They also probably weren't expecting threats by rsilvergun · · Score: 5, Insightful

    for doing a job. I don't think there's many that would argue that we don't want and need some level of border security (there's a few extreme libertarians who do). If we're going to have that then _somebody_ is going to enforce that security.

    We can argue that they should quit their jobs if they're asked to do something immoral, but a lot of them _aren't_ doing anything immoral. I'm going to Godwin this thread right now, not every German helped kill jews. There's boarder patrol agents who help people they find in the desert.

    I understand wanting to do something to help Mexican and South American immigrants. But if that's our goal then there's a _lot_ more to do than immigration. We can start by legalizing drugs. The drug war fuels their violence. We can also stop meddling in their politics. "Banana Republic" has a sinister meaning and our CIA has helped run death squads in South America. Start voting for the kinds of politicians who oppose torture and unnecessary military build up. Drop food instead of Bombs, it's cheaper and more humane.

    There's a lot we can do to stem the tide of illegal immigrants. But that said, we don't necessarily _want_ to do that. We're addicted to their cheap, cheap labor. Always have been.

    --
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    1. Re:They also probably weren't expecting threats by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I agree that we should end the drug war.

      It has gone worse than Prohibition.

      If we want to stop immigration, we simply need a national employment database and fine the hell out of any employer employing people not approved to work.

      But many of the people losing their children are not coming here simply for work. They are facing being murdered in their home country.

      And Sessions is quoting the bible while ignoring Jesus and all the tales relating to being a good samaritan, kind to strangers, etc. And he's using the same verse used to justify slavery and many other heinous crimes.

      --
      She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
    2. Re:They also probably weren't expecting threats by monkease · · Score: 4, Informative

      Funny you should mention Godwin...

      He weighed in.

    3. Re:They also probably weren't expecting threats by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I was born within walking distance to a concentration camp in which people were raped and tortured to death, those people had received training from the US, and that dictatorship was supported by the US.

      The US has had a hand in a lot of the world's problems, doing a little to make up for the millions that have suffered and died under US imperialism is not too much to ask.

      I pay more taxes than most americans, too. But it's not about money, it's about being decent human beings.

    4. Re: They also probably weren't expecting threats by Teun · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You don't seem to appreciate the difference between a common criminal and someone who attempts to give his children a better life by going to the USofA.
      The first tries to make a life at the expense of others, the latter tries to find a paying job and a safe place to live.

      Trump's administration can, awaiting their deportation, keep the families together, absolutely no need to separate them at this difficult time.

      --
      "The likes of Facebook and WhatsApp are free to those whose privacy is of zero value."
    5. Re: They also probably weren't expecting threats by bohmt · · Score: 2

      America is at fault for the state of Latin America. You know, overthrowing governments, arming rebels, being a huge market for drugs.

    6. Re: They also probably weren't expecting threats by dwillden · · Score: 3, Insightful

      They both have broken the Law. Even someone who is innocent but is accused of and arrested for breaking a law will be separated from their children for at least a short time while their case is being processed.

      The difference is that in the normal operation of the criminal justice system, the system isn't overwhelmed on a daily basis with a never ending flood and criminal cases process quicker, The arrestee is booked, sits a few hours (maybe a weekend) and then is arraigned and usually a bail amount is set and they can be bailed out to a future court date.

      If the border crosser has just crossed illegally it should be nearly that quick assuming we have enough judges to handle all the cases. But when the crosser claims asylum that throws a big wrench into the situation. Now there are a series of interviews and investigations of their claims that have to be processed and this takes time. Meanwhile thousands more enter the system every day.

      It's a matter of logistics and scale. Not even our biggest cities have to handle this size of load every single day, seven days a week.

      So what do we now do with the children. the 9th circuit ruled years ago they couldn't go to jail with their parents. Not even special family detention centers that were designed to be as non-jail like as possible and still do the job. So the parents are separated from their children. The parents go to jail for either criminal processing and deportation or asylum claim review. Meanwhile the children are handed over to HHS by the thousands, they have 20 days to find and place the children with relatives or other trusted responsible adults known to the parents or into foster care.

      No it's not pleasant, no it's not ideal. But the courts have prevented keeping the families together. The Obama Catch and release program is a failure with over 80% of those caught and released failing to show up for their court dates. (Catch and release was they were caught, briefly processed and released into the US with a court date). It's a viable system to deal with the logistics of such large scale detention and arrests.

      And ICE is required by law to separate the children from their parents, the courts blocked an attempt to do otherwise.

      --
      I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
    7. Re: They also probably weren't expecting threats by AmiMoJo · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Also, asylum seekers are not illegal immigrants. They are following the legal process of claiming asylum from danger. Even if their case is not accepted, they are not breaking the law.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    8. Re: They also probably weren't expecting threats by radarskiy · · Score: 5, Informative

      You can't apply for asylum in your country of origin. You first have to enter US territory, which may be an embassy in a third country or the US proper. Valid immigration status is not a prerequisite for applying for asylum. You may apply for asylum to an immigration judge during removal proceedings.

    9. Re: They also probably weren't expecting threats by danbert8 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Do they have an asylum case? Do they know what the classifications and definitions of asylum are? Or were they told "just say asylum when you get there"? These asylum seekers not only don't have a case or evidence, they are often illiterate. They come across the border, not at a designated crossing, don't voluntarily seek legal officials, and have no prepared case for asylum. They just either know when they come in that asylum claims will allow them to stay longer or they get legal council that tells them asylum is their only option for legally staying.

      Did they flee a country that sucks? Yes. Is their case special and meeting the three criteria for asylum (from Wikipedia)? First, an asylum applicant must establish that he or she fears persecution in their home country.[3] Second, the applicant must prove that he or she would be persecuted on account of one of five protected grounds: race, religion, nationality, political opinion, or particular social group. Third, an applicant must establish that the government is either involved in the persecution, or unable to control the conduct of private actors.

      If someone comes across the border illegally, doesn't immediately seek legal means of declaring asylum, and doesn't have a prepared case for the three criteria, then how are they asylum seekers? Sounds to me like they are using legal language to ride the legal bureaucracy as long as they can because the USA has a reputation for a broken immigration system that is overwhelmed with people. Throwing children into the mix adds to the complication and the difficulty in caring for the people caught.

      --
      Yes it's an anecdote! Were you expecting original research in a Slashdot comment?
    10. Re: They also probably weren't expecting threats by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 4, Informative

      They are breaking the law if they enter the US before obtaining asylum.

      As far as I understand the situation, that statement is false thanks to certain international treaties the US is a signatory to.

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    11. Re: They also probably weren't expecting threats by Curunir_wolf · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Also, asylum seekers are not illegal immigrants. They are following the legal process of claiming asylum from danger. Even if their case is not accepted, they are not breaking the law.

      But the asylum seekers are not the ones being arrested. There is a huge backlog of folks seeking asylum, so many are told they need to wait. But instead of doing that, they go try to cross the border between the ports of entry, illegally. That's when they get arrested.

      --
      "Somebody has to do something. It's just incredibly pathetic it has to be us."
      --- Jerry Garcia
    12. Re: They also probably weren't expecting threats by Smidge204 · · Score: 4, Informative

      > They both have broken the Law.

      Seeking asylum is not against the law. And yet, if you come to the US-Mexico boarder seeking asylum, you will be arrested and your children, if any, will be confiscated.

      And I say "confiscated" because there is a nonzero chance that separation will be permanent.

      > No it's not pleasant, no it's not ideal.

      It's un-American, it's illegal, it's racist, and it's completely unnecessary. It's throwing gasoline on what is already a dumpster fire of a humanitarian crisis.
      =Smidge=

    13. Re:They also probably weren't expecting threats by TFloore · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I agree that we should end the drug war. It has gone worse than Prohibition.

      Prohibition was, at least nominally, a moral stance that alcohol was bad and should be totally banned. The War on Drugs (also called "The War on (Some) Drugs" if you are trying to smear the pharmaceutical industry) was a law enforcement and social control program, really. You can make the argument that it, like criminalization of maurijuana, was to allow the government to lock up black people easier. There's a great conspiracy theory that maurijuana is illegal because FBI Director Hoover wanted to lock up the Black Panthers, and they weren't otherwise actually breaking laws that he could pin on them (not to say they were innocent, just the drug dealing was a lot easier to prove and convict). There's also a great conspiracy theory that maurijuana is illegal because Dow Chemical's new miracle nylon ropes couldn't compete against hemp ropes, so they got maurijuana (and hemp) made illegal.

      If we want to stop immigration, we simply need a national employment database and fine the hell out of any employer employing people not approved to work.

      Look up the E-Verify system. Employers can already verify citizenship/immigration status, but it is not currently required, and businesses don't want to do it, because it loses them access to cheap labor. It will especially impact small farms, and lots of agricultural and meat processing facilities. Also lawn services, construction, and plenty of other businesses where people work hard physical labor, usually outside. You know, the kind of jobs that most Americans want their kids to get good educations so they won't have to do, but that still need to be done.

      But many of the people losing their children are not coming here simply for work. They are facing being murdered in their home country.

      This is where I show I don't fit well into either Democrat or Republican columns. Coming to America for a better life, or a life where you can live the way you want with less government control, is a big part of how this country grew over the last 200 years. I'm a big believer in that. And that's what we have our normal legal immigration laws to cover. We also have the asylum immigration laws, and I don't know as much about that as I feel I should, but I've never agreed that "There is a high violent crime rate in my home country" is a good enough reason for an asylum claim. Government persecution, yes, organized crime, maybe, my spouse beats me, no, I don't think that should qualify. Bear in mind, I've always considered "asylum" to really be more about "political asylum" which is obvious in my thinking there, isn't it? Can you tell I don't acutally know the law there?

      And Sessions is quoting the bible while ignoring Jesus and all the tales relating to being a good samaritan, kind to strangers, etc. And he's using the same verse used to justify slavery and many other heinous crimes.

      If you look at the history for Paul's letters to the Romans, he wrote several of them while IN JAIL. You know, being imprisoned for breaking the law. He was a big believer in obeying a government's laws that represented the will of God, but not so much a government that did not represent God's will.

      There's a saying that goes with this... "The Devil quotes scripture too". Simply finding a line in the Bible that seems to support your position is not enough to claim the moral high ground. You still have to make the case that what you are doing is right, and I don't think they've done that successfully yet. Half the Trump administration isn't even trying to do that, because they don't think what they are doing *is* right. They *may* believe it is the least bad of several very bad options, but that is not at all the same statement as "is good and right".

      --
      This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is... Oops. Frank, I've got your sig again! Where's mine?
    14. Re:They also probably weren't expecting threats by king+neckbeard · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Cry me a fucking river over spending money helping immigrants. We back 3/4 of the world's dictactors, we're bombing 8 countries (I think, I've lost count at this point). We spend more money on a military than many of the world's other major powers combined.

      If it's about the money, we've got a lot more high priorities to cut.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
  8. Re: Do not take your children overseas right now by Bing+Tsher+E · · Score: 2

    You're being ridiculous. Please cut it out.

  9. Re: I don't get it. by c6gunner · · Score: 2

    Calling this "heinous action" is the most recent version of calling anyone to the right of Stalin a Nazi.

  10. I've been hre longer than you by OrangeTide · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Slashdot, you are better than this.

    No, we're not. This site is about weird racist memes, goatse and penis bird. There may nothing beneath us.

    --
    “Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
  11. Re: Didn't take MS to start fucking up github by Reverend+Green · · Score: 5, Informative

    GitHub's decline started long before the Microsoft acquisition. When they forced out the founder and declared meritocracy, and by extension merit, unwelcome.

    Venture capital turns everything it touches into evil shit. Not just evil, not just shitty - evil & shitty.

  12. Re: Do not take your children overseas right now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The parents could always, you know, not violate US immigration law. I know, crazy idea!

  13. Re:Github? Really? by Cinnamon+Beige · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Yeah, to me its deletion from GitHub is pretty obvious--it's not a program or data for a program, of course it ought to go--and I'm a bit disgusted by the double-standards of a lot of the people here. Would the people here be as offended if the list deleted was, say, "LGBT employees of Google"? How about "Non-White Health Care Workers in Random City"? These kinds of lists are a problem because they invite harassment of the people on the list--and it's disturbing to see people thinking it's somehow okay to do this when it's the 'right' people getting harassed, because that basically means that you will have to be careful about expressing any ideas which might risk you at some point (now or in the future) finding yourself on one of those lists...and that won't protect you against being included by accident or because somebody wanting revenge or a petty power play.

  14. Re: I don't get it. by DaHat · · Score: 2

    There's no way Jesus would be okay with this.

    I'm not a religious person... and I'm guessing you aren't either. The difference, is I'm not trying to use my out of date and incomplete understanding of other peoples religions to try to guilt trip them into things which I want.

    Your facts are wrong though, you may want to look up, remember:

    Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's

    I do, I did pay some attention in CCD. Unlike say... Islam, most of the original teachings of Christianity are not based around political ideas, instead recognizing the authority of a secular government.

  15. Re:Manufactured outrage by redmid17 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Most of those are actually false (1,4,6) or at best distorted. This is not surprising as Breitbart is an awful source of any news and Steve Bannon basically helped dictate this immigration policy.

    1. He's enforcing the most draconian option. They claim the kids are unaccompanied but by prosecuting the adults criminally instead of civilly -- they obviously have that right -- they can isolate both the parents and the kids. This is even happening to people trying to claim asylum at ports of entry.
    2. Many do. The vast majority arrive with an adult. The trafickers posing as a family account for .61% of kids.
    3. Many, if not all, of these children have been apart from their parents for more than 20 days. Even a cursory google shows this is heinously out of context.
    4. This is just unmitigated bullshit. It's child abuse (per pediatricians AND psychiatrists) and nothing DHS says has been independently verified. Either way being separated from family and put in a detention center is certainly not GOOD treatment
    5. People are generally not jailed for misdemeanors. Children certainly aren't seized and they get preference in their bail hearing if they are the sole caregiver.
    6. This is just unmitigated bullshit. He kept families together.
    7. Ignoring the fact that DHS has started turning people away from ports of entry, yes they are actively being turned away and sometimes seized. This is, once again, easily findable via basic google. Some actual sources WITH SOURCES!
    https://www.texasmonthly.com/p...
    https://www.npr.org/2018/06/19...
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/0...
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/0...

    Even if you don't like NYT or NPR, there are other outlets that report it as well, even websites like Snopes and politifact. Basically that was a shit post for covering an awful practice and an even bigger shit post because it was so laughably bad and fake,.

  16. Re:Manufactured outrage by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 2, Insightful

    No.. you are either mistaken or lying.

    1) Trump is only enforcing the law : Nope, it's a new policy. And it's a decision by Miller, Sessions, and Trump to do so. Presidents Bush and Obama saw no need to enforce the law this way.

    2) Many children arrive unaccompanied
    We are talking about babies and toddlers being taken from their parents-- we have audio of them crying for their parents.

    3) Children can only be separated for 20 days
    No. per former ICE head on the news tonight at 9pm, there is no procedure in place to return the children. The Parents will be "fast tracked" back to their home countries and the toddlers and babies will be returned months to *years* later. And there is no documentation being taken to tie the parents to the children. And there are already documented cases where the child has been missing longer than 20 days.

    4) Their conditions are actually pretty good, better than most poor American children get, and better than where they came from.
    Living in tents in near 100 degree temperatures is not "pretty" good. That's the conditions which male toddlers and children are being kept under. Babies and females we barely know about-- reporters are not being allowed in the facllities. The government (which lies constantly) is the only source saying the conditions are good.

    5) We separate citizen children from their parents, when we put parents in jail
    Not for minor crimes.

    6) Obama did it
    Obama's not president and at the least did not do it on this scale (if it did it at all- you are going to provide a cite for that because all I find when I google that is right wing sites.)

    --
    She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
  17. Over a dozen republicans opposed now. by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 2

    And multiple Republican governors have withdrawn their national guards.

    Republicans control the presidency, house, and senate. They could fix this tomorrow.

    Meanwhile children are being put in cages and crying.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    --
    She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
  18. So, scraping is supposed to be OK by jtara · · Score: 3, Interesting

    They scraped content from LinkedIn (or used an API?) to compile a directory, almost certainly in violation of TOS.

    How was that OK?

    Microsoft owns LinkedIn. Microsoft owns Github. Put two and two together. They are enforcing their TOS, and happen to have the ability to do so in this case without having to convince another site to take down the illegally-obtained material.

  19. Re:Didn't take MS to start fucking up github by The+Cynical+Critic · · Score: 5, Interesting

    If you've been paying attention to what's been going on over there since they decided their "In Meritocracy We Trust" parody of the oval office carpet in the CEO's office was offensive and had to be removed you'd know the place has let the lunatics run the asylum for years already. The only surprise here is that they decided to remove this particular doxxing case as it conforms really well to their particular bent so some semblance sanity may actually be returning to the madhouse.

    The far left lunatics they've let run the company have removed projects and banned people on purely political grounds, made it very easy to add extremely broad codes of conduct with a focus on "If someone claims they've felt slighted the guilty one must be punished reality and plain sense be damned" types and implemented loads of asinine "diversity" policies like restricting certain positions based on race and putting an end to mentoring new hires because of how their diversity drive has lead to to many cases of minorities and women being mentored by white men.

    --
    "Why should I want to make anything up? Life's bad enough as it is without wanting to invent any more of it."
  20. Re: I don't get it. by dargaud · · Score: 2

    I've lived in France on and off for decades and let me tell you that those 10% with the power to grind everything to a halt are always the same ones: truck drivers (the worst of all), train conductors (currently in their 3rd month of strike with no end in sight, this over trifles), students (and screw the others who just want to pass their exams), airplanes (always at the time of vacations), etc... All the others don't matter, only those get their voices heard by pissing in everybody's broth.

    --
    Non-Linux Penguins ?
  21. Re: I don't get it. by GrimSavant · · Score: 4, Insightful
    The big one Sessions referenced was Romans 13:1-7, which is a New Testament Pauline epistle. It argues for submitting to governing authorities.

    Generally, if government officials are using that passage to defend themselves or justify their actions they tend to be in a bad way. It was used as one of the scriptural bases for the Divine Right of Kings, opposition to the American Revolution, and by pro-slavery forces to justify adherence to the Fugitive Slave Act of 1850. More recently it has been used as a support by the apartheid government of South Africa.

    When Romans 13:1-7 is cited while ignoring the next couple of passages (Romans 13:8-10) it's pretty obvious that it is being used for dubious ends, as that goes:

    8 Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for whoever loves others has fulfilled the law. 9 The commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not covet,”and whatever other command there may be, are summed up in this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.

    I'm not a biblical scholar, nor am I a well-versed adherent to the Pauline epistles, but I do have a hard time seeing any love in this.

  22. Re:Do not take your children overseas right now by halivar · · Score: 2

    I will endeavor not to smuggle my child across another nation's border illegally. Thanks for the tip.

  23. Re:Yeah, don't dox random civil servants by johnsie · · Score: 2

    The posted their private info on a public directory, it's their own fault. People need to learn who to use the Internet better.

  24. One more time by TVmisGuided · · Score: 2

    For those who may have missed the memo:

    There is not, and never has been, any such thing as "privacy" on the Internet.

    If you make your profile public anywhere, someone unexpected WILL read it..and use the information that you post in a way that you probably won't like.

    We now return to our regularly-scheduled flamethrowing, already in progress...

    --
    All the world's an analog stage, and digital circuits play only bit parts.
  25. Re: Sick that this is posted as a story here by bestweasel · · Score: 2

    That's unfair. Look, you should have more compassion; some of them have no option but to take jobs with ICE because they would be unemployable elsewhere.
      Most don't have the transferable skills or intellect for farming - shouting at a field of peas to be quiet and stop resisting rarely improves yields.