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Google Has Made YouTube Slower on Edge and Firefox, Mozilla Alleges (neowin.net)
Usama Jawad, writing for Neowin: Early last year, YouTube received a design refresh with Google's own Polymer library which enabled "quicker feature development" for the platform. Now, a Mozilla executive is claiming that Google has made YouTube slower on Edge and Firefox by using this framework. In a thread on Twitter, Mozilla's Technical Program Manager has stated that YouTube's Polymer redesign relies heavily on the deprecated Shadow DOM v0 API, which is only available in Chrome. This in turn makes the site around five times slower on competing browsers such as Microsoft Edge and Mozilla Firefox. Further reading: Safari Users Unable to Play Newer 4K Video On YouTube in Native Resolution.
Long live IE6
This means that after the page finished loading, any resize that you've done gets reverted.... good job Google.
On Firefox, the video portion loads right away, and all the other shit I don't care about loads later. Sometimes quite a bit later.
But, as I said I don't care about that, so I thought maybe Google was purposely loading the actual content first.
This is what happens when any corporation gets into too many supporting markets. That situation rewards anticompetitive behavior. Google has every incentive to use Youtube to prop up Chrome, and vice versa. They have become Microsoft.
Remember when Google declared that Amazon Fire TV users would no longer be able to use an app to access their site, because rea$ons? Well, that's still the state of affairs. You have to use a browser instead of an App because Amazon won't carry Google's devices in their web store. Well, Google doesn't carry Amazon's devices in their web store, either. How on earth is this not anticompetitive?
While I'd like to see Google held accountable for their anticompetitive behavior, the best solution is still for someone else to spin up a video streaming site. There's enough people who want an alternative to Youtube for it to work out. But it has to be at least as friendly to uploaders as Youtube...
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
and will be broken up
How can I use a hosts file to help bring back my performance?
Shadow DOM is a W3C standard. I don't know why they throw in "v0" there, as far as I know, the version of the Shadow DOM that Chrome supports is the released standard. Firefox flat-out doesn't support it yet.
The Shadow DOM makes various repeated elements load much faster because it allows the same snippet of HTML be reused without being reparsed. It's a very useful feature if you're writing a web UI library where you have effectively the same HTML chunk over and over again. The lack of support in Firefox and Edge is annoying and results in effectively having to manually add the elements to the DOM, which is, not surprisingly, slower than just being able to copy them.
This isn't Google being evil. This is Google using web standards that Firefox is too lazy to adapt.
Pornhub wins every time.
Loading speed, Video smoothness, lack of interruption.
Every time Youtube content gets the spinning circle, I check Pornhub...Yep, smooth as silk, or a freshly shaven...
Then YouTube tries to blame my provider.
Pornhub is the Future of the Internet!
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
I'm going to give Google a taste of their own medicine and make my site slow too. CNN is leading the fight in this; their site is super slow in all the major browsers.
They don't seem to trust anyone unless they're running mainline Chrome. With Waterfox, whatever else, they make me redo the captcha several times and take the sweet time to fade out and in more image tiles. Literally every site within reason uses their shitty captcha and so I end up wasting time to simply respond to a comment in many cases.
Hey, it's not like an out-of-control overgrown ad agency that makes its money in a fundamentally evil way by strip-mining your privacy and selling it to anyone who wants to pay for would have any scruples about underhanded behavior with it's spyware, er, browser.
Add more CPU, RAM and GPU to a desktop computer.
See if that can outpace the software of an ad company.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
So, let me get this right. YouTube uses Shadow DOM v0, which while currently supported by Firefox has slow load-times. Wouldn't the best solution be to have Polymer use Shadow DOM v1, and for Firefox to load this at competitive speeds?
Chrome, one and done with recaptcha. Firefox/Waterfox, it forces you to do 3-4 proper captchas and takes the sweet time to load new tiles by fading them out and in...
Actually the problem is two-fold and not only on Google.
YouTube is coded like shit, while Firefox is littered with Memory Leak problems and also shit interpreter code.
It's been like this for the past almost a decade now.
It's a problem that both the Browser coders and the webcoders are at fault jointly, and the infinite circlejerk between the two parties throwing blame at the other doesn't help.
Until someone consolidates a nice map of how bad webcode in conjunction with bad browser code both result in the consumers having to upgrade their god damn CPU's and RAM to run "modern" webpages which have the same amount of fucking UI elements as over 10 years ago, yet somehow eat 10 times more performance and memory now; this whole shifting the blame ad infinitum game of Catch 22 will never be the answer.
We can start with purging Java and JavaScript from existence just for fucking starters.
Obviously, what this means is that Google would prefer that people make their own front end, and just use youtube-dl to get the videos. That way, you can fully enjoy them without any inconveniences or slowdowns. And as a bonus, also without ads and Google getting revenue.
I, for one, think it's very interesting that they went to the trouble and expense to create this new incentive. But it's not unprecedented: Hollywood adds DRM to encourage people to pirate their media, for example. For whatever reason, the theme of 21st century media business always comes down to pure asceticism and altruism, over selfishness.
I can only conclude that media companies always put in the effort to make themselves unprofitable due to the examples provided by their subject matter, e.g. politicians in the news. (It was so nice, for example, of our president to offer free money to that playmate.) Why don't more types of businesses become charities like how Youtube and Trump's business try so hard to?
Development of Chrome should be sent off to an independent organization (perhaps forced to by anti trust courts). Chrome now has more market share than internet explorer used to and also owns phones and schools with chromebooks. We also need to force Google to code to standards and work on all of the competition’s browsers under interoperability laws. this includes minority browers like waterfox and falkon.
I am APK the great "LORD of HOSTS", a.k.a. AlecStaar or Alexander Peter Kowalski.
See subject & APK Hosts File Engine 2.0++ 64-bit for Linux h t t p : / / I . a m . a . f u c k i n g / a s s h o l e . r e t a r d . z i p (remove spaces between characters & download).
I am the godlike creator of various GUI front-ends for other people's configuration files.
Calling people ne'er-do-wells or Jealous JOWIEs is how I think I win every argument
When people state the truth about me I get really mad and accuse them of projecting which is something I do all the time.
Don't call me out on anything unless you are willing to prove you too can write some strings to a file programmatically
Spamming and being a general pain in the ass is what I do
Listen as I relive my glory days of being a college athlete in the early 80s
You must be conspiring with the Jews and Soros if you disagree with me
Bask in my greatness as I can do a ping as a non root user.
Watch as I whine about my work being flagged as malware by anti-virus software.
Witness my descent into madness
APK
Mobile Firefox has less YT quality than approved Google ways of accessing YT.
Users were dumb enough to be drawn into Chrome and now its come back to haunt everyone just as IE did when it completely dominated the web. Even other browsers like Opera and Brave along with other have all just become more Chrome clone's. You either use Chrome or a clone or face issues with some web sites. Its just that simple and frankly I don't see any light at the end for any other browser including Firefox and Edge. Chrome like IE is it and everything else is a second class browser.
... and if they're not there polyfills them. ... That means it lazy-loads JS libs that emulate those features. This may make some browsers slower if those features need polyfilling.
The goal of Polymer is to offer the cutting edge of web features today and wither away as these features become native in all browsers everywhere.
It's that simple. No rucus required. Move along.
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
From an outsider's perspective with competition, I'm not sure it is important if one browser is currently faster than another with Youtube. What I'd like to know is, has any browser become SLOWER with Youtube's "upgrade"? If so, then that may be an issue.
Could someone more knowledgeable than me clarify this please.
When I made a website my clients ask me if it work fine in the all browsers, they are more exigents than google!
Because Chrome plays videos in VP9 format and it is slower to decode, older hardware has no acceleration either.
Since the 90s my main browser has been Mozilla Firefox. And I must say that I have never noticed performance issues with YouTube.
It won't even load on my edge or IE browsers, but man it loads on Chrome.
This study should be expanded to include streaming devices, like RokuTV and Apple TV, and apps like the youtube app on mobile devices. Certainly youtube performance sux big time, and chrome is never used on my computers to deliver youtube content. I block ad-tracking websites on my computers, which results in instability on youtube. My browsers are constantly crashing on youtube.
The solution: break up Google. The European Parliament has fined Google heavily for anti-competitive practices. Yes, it is time for content providers to be independent of search engines. We need more diversity in the content delivery arena. Google should be aware of what happened to AT&T, when it grew too large.
Obligatory XKCD that you need to read and actually understand.
Inclusivity has gone around the bend. Milk is racist because some people are lactose intolerant? WTLF? I would say it is the ones who are intolerant who are the racists. I tolerate milk fine, and if not for milk, what would I put on cereal? It is half of the product known as Half and Half, so without milk, what would I put in my fucking coffee? More coffee? Without milk there would be no cheese or butter, nor buttermilk, so no buttermilk pancakes, and no cheese on that pizza. So no pizza. Fuck. One hundred percent. Of that shit.
Only a moron or a troll would really assert that because you like, buy, have, drink, or use milk, you are somehow a racist. That stretches the definition of the word well past itâ(TM)s breaking point and I will tell you something. If that somehow makes me a racist, then I guess I no longer care about whether or not I, or anyone else, for that matter, is a racist.
But in reality, I think the people who claim milk is somehow an indicator of the users or drinkers racism are themselves racist. To suggest that because, allegedly, some ethnicities are predisposed to higher incidences of food allergies or intolerances that whatever it is they are intolerant of we cannot eat means no one can eat anything if anyone cannot eat it, and since, I can assure you, there is at least one person out there who is unable to eat anything at all you can think of, and that person belongs to one or more ethnicities, anything at all you eat makes you a racist. And so we are all racists, and suddenly racism does not matter anymore.
We have reached that magical, horrible point where something has gone so far as to become meaningless.
But if milk makes you racist because supposedly neo-nazis drink it, I hear they also wear clothes and breathe air. So I guess if you wear clothes or breathe air, that too makes you a neo-nazi.
Oops, look at that. I am out of milk. Guess I need to put on my SS uniform and goose-step down to my local supermarkkket and buy some more milk.
P.S. If you really think that drinking milk is the new tiki torch... fuck you. And have some milk. It is good for you. We are mammals and drinking milk is part of our shared heritage and the only reason we drink cow milk is because if we drank milk from women we would need a lot more women to have gotten pregnant and live on a dairy farm, and I doubt very much many would put up with it, or that you would be able to find it for only a few dollars a gallon.
I have found just the right combination on Firefox of Adblock and no script that lets me watch almost anything on YouTube with no ads. Long as that works I continue to watch YouTube. When they find a way to break that, I will watch something else. In any case, I existed before the high speed, broadband internet, and remember a mostly text web. I also existed before the internet was something most people had even heard of, and somehow survived that era. (Depending on how you define internet, I existed before it did.). So if it ever goes away, I have these magical things called BOOKS and these days, I spend increasing portions of my time reading and less of it watching tired, stupid bullshit on YouTube so I am not that fucking worried even if YouTube goes tits up. I will survive somehow and YouTube (and Google) need to understand that the fact that they are popular does NOT mean they are essential, and it sure as fuck does not mean they can do whatever they want and people will still use their increasingly tiresome, pain-in-the-ass services.
That feature is already marked for removal: https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=671907
You should investigate on the reasons why polymer is not being updated, perhaps by asking the YouTube developers.
But checking sources is not necessary for clickbait shitty online journalism, amirite?
Change your cookies to use the old youtube https://www.reddit.com/r/youtube/comments/834a9k/want_the_old_youtube_format_back/
The title made it sound like Google intentionally did it. It's more like Google move to early draft tech that's never in the final standard and adopted by other browser.
The article also give work around it.
In this case I would have to tell them then it had been deprecated and is now reprecated.
"Know ain't that too damn bad"
nod to Bloody Mary
NB:Drying paint does not require great speed.
90% of its content is from youtube nowadays anyway!
Who the hell uses Youtube anymore? It's sucks more dick than
More and more I look at Google, more it looks like Microsoft from 2000. What a pity that the once not evil company took this path.
That crappy new interface for GSUITE is also slowing it down. It's optimised for Chrome... I run them side by side on beefy hardware and beefy connection.
Sneaky sons of bitches. This is only the tip of the iceberg.