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The Psychedelic Drug DMT Can Simulate a Near-Death Experience, Study Suggests (vice.com)
dmoberhaus writes: In the first study of its kind, [published this week in the journal Frontiers in Psychology,] researchers dosed 13 people with the potent psychedelic dimethyltryptamine (DMT) to investigate its similarity to near-death experiences. As the researchers found, DMT does in fact induce experiences that are qualitatively similar to NDEs, [but the intensity of these NDEs largely depend on context]. Motherboard spoke with an independent researcher who pioneered DMT research in the 90s to discuss the possible implications of this research. While tricky to define due to their subjective nature, "NDEs tend to share many common elements, such as feelings of inner peace, the experience of traveling through a tunnel, out of body experiences, and encounters with sentient beings," reports Motherboard. A psychiatrist not involved with the study "suggested that the overlap between DMT and NDEs could possibly be explained on a biological level since DMT is naturally produced in small quantities by the human body and has been shown to minimize neuronal damage due to hypoxia (insufficient oxygen) in test tubes," reports Motherboard. "Thus, [the psychiatrist said] 'one could construct a coherent scenario where endogenous DMT rises in response to cardiac arrest/hypoxia in order to protect the brain as long as possible.'"
The article suggests DMT is created by the body when you’re near death.
It claims the sensations experienced during a Near Death Experience are not similar to, but literally caused by DMT.
Near death and actually experiencing death are two very different things...
Let me do analogy for you, if this site is a car, letâ(TM)s just use a Ford Pinto for this site, and if the competitors are all Tesla 3â(TM)s, how would you be getting around the intertubes these days?
The Fort Pinto wouldnâ(TM)t kill you unless hit from behind and the Tesla 3 wonâ(TM)t kill you unless someone stops a Ford Pinto on the side of the road, so either way youâ(TM)re dead. Not simulation, youâ(TM)re really dead and this post is just your imagination gone wild.
I've used DMT many times. Amazing experience. Beings like the Clockwork Elves are very real and sentient, it's not a hallucination.
I for one welcome our sentient test tubes overlords!
This is revolutionary stuff! I wonder what follow up research they could conduct...
The drug LSD can simulate a psychedelic experience?
Alcohol can simulate a drunken experience?
Ketamine can simulate an out of body experience?
Weed can simulate a being stoned experience?
Morons.
So can watching love island
Even more interestingly, out of body experiences can be easily induced with a VR headset. Just show the wearer a human that is being poked with a stick, as an assistant simultaneously pokes the wearer with a stick (in the same manner) in reality. The wearer then feels that the avatar is 'their body' and that their point of view lies outside of their body.
Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
Even better, if you and your lover close your eyes, and as you stroke each other you sync up such that your hands 'slip' into theirs and catch them, you can end up puppeting each other! Fun times 3
'out of body experiences' are delusions
The word you're looking for is 'hallucination', not delusion: the difference between hallucination and psychosis is you can tell the difference between whats imaginary and whats real
""NDEs tend to share many common elements, such as feelings of inner peace, the experience of traveling through a tunnel, out of body experiences, and encounters with sentient beings,""
While the first studies reported those elements, by now it is pretty much clear that 1) NDE depends on cultural backgrounds and 2) there are also negative one which go under reported because most religious folk don't like to report they saw vision of hell on where they think they are going after death. Just sayin'.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
Actually leaving your body and going on some kind of spirit journey is fake, but some psychedelic substances can give the perception of out of body experiences. I've had experiences where I've felt as though I'm floating outside of my body or otherwise no longer anchored to it, even though I really know that I was still physically sitting on the coach.
You don't even need to be high for your brain to experience sensory perceptions that aren't real. Phantom limb, for example, is one such well established and researched phenomenon.
What studies?
I have never understood why these are called NDE. I mean the people who report them are alive, they didn't die. They are just dreams that happen when you are in a sleep state. There is nothing special about them.
Haven't this been suggested for four decades already?
A number of NDEs are known to occur during cardiac arrest, when there is no blood flow to the brain, and effectively no brain function. Whilst producing a mind expanding experience with features in common with NDEs, I have my doubts as to how accurately it simulates the conditions of an NDE.
I have near death experiences on my drive to/from work with all the crazy mother fucker assholes out there that can't drive and won't pay attention. No drugs required. Not a simulation.
Nintendo and Microsoft would love to put BSD to death so they could kill off all Sony's pesky PlayStation sales.
Thanks captain obvious, glad you cleared that up!
You guys were not invited to this discussion. NDEs are in fact real whether they be dreams or whatever. They affect people and are filed under "variety of religious experience." While you douche bags go on whining about your rediculous imperical opinions the rest of the world marches on in thier experiences. Experiences are all real. Perhaps you are taking issue with people who might claim that thier soul or consciousness left the body and viewed the body from above. No one is going to fret over that detail when the net affect of the experience is in fact real. Grow up.
I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
The experience is real. However, when it is used to point or refer to an external (to you) event, then that pointer is faulty. It points to nothing and you claiming it does doesn't make it so.
One of the many side effects of our awful War on Drugs in the US is that this kind of research is essentially banned here, on account of DMT being a Schedule 1 drug. LSD falls into that category as well, along with the well known case of marijuana. Drugs like DMT and LSD offer incredible insight into some of the most mysterious processes in our brain, like the nature of consciousness and perception of reality. It's sickening how much we've let drug agents and drug warrior politicians (both sides, WoD is entirely bipartisan) stand against scientific progress, especially with drugs entirely lacking addictiveness and overdose potential like DMT/LSD/pot. Imagine our state of knowledge had these not been just about impossible to research in humans in the US for the last 50 years, with no change on the horizon.
I had been hoping we'd see the failure in my lifetime, and marijuana reform provided some optimism, until the opioid crisis squelched it with more of 'The War on Drugs has failed!' 'So what should we do about opiates?' 'More police! More laws! More regulation! Longer sentences! Crack down on supply! Fuck how many people have to suffer in agony or kill themselves when they can't get pain relief!' like if we just try prohibition a little harder it will magically start working, because this time it's Really Bad. Oh well, at least we have other countries that can do this great research.
Studies have shown that out of body experiences are fake. Picture were placed on the top of cabinets in emergency rooms, such that they are only visible from above. The people that reported out of body experiences are unable to report even the presence of these picture never mind the content.
how about a link / reference? I'm so tired of people saying studies show this, studies show that, but no one ever shows the studies ...
someone needs to study this ... ;~)
Boy, just wait until the Tinfoil Hat Brigade gets ahold of this story! ;-)
Error: NSE - No Signature Error
Actually leaving your body and going on some kind of spirit journey is fake
If it's happening in your brain, it's not fake, by definition. That the meaning may be difficult to derive is a separate issue but the reality cannot be questioned. This is a novice materialist error which contradicts the central materialist claim.
That so many psychedelics turn off inhibatory centers specifically should give pause to those who claim that experiences are "fake" or "delusions". Anybody who can see an optical illusion should understand that the world isn't precisely what we sense. It takes years of building processing filters for humans to build a stable subset of reality that they can filter.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
And could it be a safer replacement?
It's impossible for a person under the influence of DMT or disassociatives like Ketemine to sense what's real. They break down the line between dreams and reality, so you wind up dreaming while awake with your eyes open. Some people mistake this amazing internal experience for something that happened in the real world.
From what I have read of NDEs, one experience they share is that they feel intensely read. Like, more real and more intense than real life. This quality would not be easily verified by a test subject simply stating, "Real? Yeah, sure, I guess it felt real."
So, I would propose that any serious investigation into how well DMT simulates an NDE would have to include test subjects who have already experienced an NDE, so that the subjective "hyper-real" quality could be evaluated.
Glad we have the forefront scientist on consciousness telling us what is real and what is not.
I've had experiences where I've felt as though I'm floating outside of my body or otherwise no longer anchored to it, even though I really know that I was still physically sitting on the coach.
Yes, many people have reported that riding the Greyhound was similar to death.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
How to Change Your Mind: What the New Science of Psychedelics Teaches Us About Consciousness, Dying, Addiction, Depression, and Transcendence Hardcover
by Michael Pollan
May 15, 2018
difficult to learn about DMT induced NDE due to the NDA the CIA, NSA, and other NGOs make you sign.
Spotted the armchair critic who is magically an "expert" on other people's experience with something they have never even experienced.
/sarcasm Oh look, it is a blind man arguing there is no such thing as color!
> Some studies have shown that out of body experiences is real.
FTFY.
But keep trying to ignore the evidence (Journal of the American Society for Psychical Research, 1968, vol. 62, no. 1, pp. 3-27.) of both OBEs and NDEs.
The shared OBE is proof that you don't know what the fuck you are talking about.
I'll just yell out my ex's name the next time my wife and I have sex.
even though I really know that I was still physically sitting on the coach.
That's pretty dangerous, whether you're under the influence of psychedelic drugs or not.
Wrong. What you meant to say was that anyone who isn't stupid knows it. Plenty of people have a brain but don't know NDEs are bullshit. Remember: slightly over half of Americans believe demonic possession is a real thing. Demonic possession. Real. Seriously. They believe that is part of the real world. These are people who can talk and pass for homo sapiens on the street. Many can read and write. They have jobs. Responsibilities. They're allowed to be parents. Some of them are in positions where if they fuck up, lots of people die (but fortunantely, they rarely fuck up). Some of them have been our former presidents, in post-WW2 times with access to nuclear weapons. They all have second-amendment-guaranteed rights.
And they believe in demonic possession.
Having-a-brain and understanding the most basic things about reality, are two completely different things.
Coincidence is a motherfucker.
Case in point: I was meditating one day, slipped into sleep, and dreamed I was in the car with my at-the-time-girlfriend, her two exchange students and our friend, Melea. Melea and I were in the front passenger seat together, girlfriend was driving, and the exchange ladies were in the back seat. A car swerved toward us from the left, we dodged to the right, hit a concrete abutment, ricochet sideways to the left, spinning back to front, went over some railroad tracks, and the car flipped into the air.
As we were airborne I said goodbye lovingly to the girlfriend and was no longer in the car. Then I was no place that I can recall, quiet, calm, and disconnected. Nothing to see, nothing to do. Then I thought I heard something. Faint, distant, indecipherable, but slowly resolving itself, getting louder. Then I got it, a phone ringing in the distance, quietly. I got up from the bed where I was laying in the guest room and went into my room. No phone ringing now, but I picked up anyways. On the line was my girlfriend. She was out of her head, crying, freaking out, losing her shit.
You know the story, and so did I. She was in an accident. She was driving, Melea was in the passenger seat, the two exchange students were in the back seat. A car swerved toward her and she dodged it, hitting a concrete abutment and spinning the car. Fortunately in this version there were some differences: no railroad tracks, the car didn't flip. Thank God. Everyone was ok.
Then she said "It was weird. I felt like you were right there beside me. Did you feel it to? Were you about to call me? Is that why you answered the phone before it even rang?"
Coincidence is a motherfucker...
When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
Efforts to resuscitate *BSD are one step away from spiritualists wishing to communicate with the dead. As the situation grows more desperate for the adherents of this doomed OS, the sorrow takes hold. An unremitting gloom has settled in. Now is the end time for *BSD.
This made me laugh.
--A FreeBSD user (not joking)
Can you prove that? Illusion maybe, delusion? Not convinced. How do you know it wasn't the correct "you" that was floating outside your body, and that the body you associate with "you" is actually you? If you prove any of this, you'd be up there amongst the likes of U. G. Krishnamurti, Bernadette Roberts etc...
The experience is real in that you really experince it.
The content of the experiences is not real in that it does not reflect reality accurately. So insights into reality gained from the experience are "fake".
Life is an illusion which evolved with complex molecules. Psychedelic drugs can destroy this illusion, leaving the molecules to deal with their death.
I guess I should not be surprised that the delusional affirm their delusion by down voting science into oblivion to affirm their delusion.
It is impossible for a person under the influence of societal, cultural, and self-created inaccurate belief systems to sense what's real. They block the input that disagrees with their expectation of reality, so they wind up only seeing what they expect to see. Some people mistake this myopic filtered viewpoint for reality.
We, as a species, exist in a world in which exist a myriad of
data points.1 Upon these matrices of points we
superimpose a structure2 and the world makes sense to us.
The pattern of the structure originates within our biological
and sociological properties.3
— Persinger and Lafreniere, Space-Time Transients and
Unusual Events
1 In our terminology, these data points are events or actions,
i.e. verbs, not nouns.
2 In our terminology, models or maps, static things; nouns not
verbs.
3 In our terminology, brain hardware and software.
When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
Okay, our next step, is to actually fully describe near death experiences that actually happened before people died. I hope these guys aren't getting any grant money.
I watched Flatliners. Does that count as having a near death experience?
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